Uh oh–we need to talk about NP Thyroid by Acella

Thanks to patient Emily who took this photo. Former NP
pill on left; changed NP pill on right.

Comments have been coming in by some patients who are using NP Thyroid by Acella. And by those comments, it appears that NP has changed as of this summer 2019…as reported by patients who picked up a new bottle refill and started it. There are three common comments:

  1. It now smells and tastes horrible, worse then before.
  2. The tablets look different from previous ones
  3. I’m feeling much worse now on the same dose that made me feel great. Symptoms are back.

And it’s #3 that is especially concerning. .

This now makes FOUR natural desiccated thyroid products over the last few years that have changed visually and symptomatically. Why??

  • Canada’s version of NDT made by Erfa and called just Thyroid. That was followed by widespread reports of a return of hypo symptoms.
  • Armour after it was bought out from Forest and acquired by Activas Pharmaceuticals–many reported a huge return of their hypo
  • RLC’s Naturethroid, and it frankly went WAY downhill in effect in 2018 as expressed widespread by disappointed patients. We’re still not sure about WP.
  • NP Thyroid by Acella

And you know what else is common with all four pharmaceuticals?? They state “We changed nothing”. So what is going on?

ANALYZING THE COMPLAINTS ABOUT NP

THE SMELL, THE TASTE:

Ugh.

Yes, most NDT’s can smell. lol. It’s pork! But the reaction of patients, when they have started to take the “changed” NP Thyroid, is profound. “It tastes horrible!” “It smells far worse!” “It tastes like cat pee!” Other descriptions: “It tastes like insecticide.” “It tastes rancid.” “It makes me want to gag.”

Now we do know that a batch of NDT is made up of many pigs. And it’s possible that different mixes of pigs could produce different strength of smell. So is Acella using a particularly “stinky” batch of pigs now?? Maybe. Just the change in smell and taste is not indicative of a problem…

THE TABLET:

Boy, here we go again. The visual change is very similar to what we saw with Armour. It’s also similar with what we saw with Naturethroid. There are now specks on the newer current version, and some patients say the edges are rougher. Definitely a different color, too.

Former NP Thyroid tablet on left. Changed NP tablet on right.

In a way, these visual changes would be no big deal. But they could become a big deal when some patients, (who were optimal) are reporting a return of their hypothyroid symptoms and/or feeling awful since being on the changed NP Thyroid. And why is this not the first time that we started seeing specks in different pharmaceutical versions over recent few years?

FEELING WORSE SINCE BEING ON THE NEW TABLET:

This represents the most alarming of comments. We are seeing some people who were OPTIMAL and had been for a long while, only to comment that they now feel much worse since starting on the new tablets. Symptoms range from migraines, feeling tired, sluggish, feeling awful, depression, late afternoon fatigue, feeling like the flu, nausea, hair loss, napping again…etc. Again, we are saying some. Others report still feeling good. But are they on the “changed” tablets? Looks like they are. So we are continuing to try and learn what is going on in the face of pharmaceutical secrecy and the inane need to CHANGE what was already good enough.

Here is one of many examples of how patients are now going downhill on NP. It’s provided by permission from Liz: I take 4 60 mg tabs a day, no thyroid, treated iron and adrenals and finally was doing good and steadily weight was coming off. I have been taking my last refill for about a month now, and when I first opened it noticed the horrid smell, tasted different too. Anyway, the last couple of weeks I’ve felt really fatigued, low energy, hungry all the time, weight creeping back up and bloated.

And here is how one patient sees all this, closely resembling how many are feeling: I’ve had it with all the mystery, secrecy, deception, and lack of transparency that are ultimately badly damaging many, many people’s (mostly women’s) health and lives. And then that affects the lives of all those people’s families in a trickle-down domino effect. Those pharma companies and their associates are obviously not in it for any type of benevolent reason. They obviously don’t care about us. All they care about is money and their own interests. That’s sick (no pun intended), unethical, immoral, inhumane, and lacking in conscience.

In the meantime, for those who have gone downhill, this blog post gives alternatives to NP Thyroid or any NDT that has gone downhill, as many have sadly.

The differences between the former tablets and new tablets. Thanks to thyroid patient Sara for allowing me to post this!!

UPDATE #1 on August 24th: So far, it appears that negative changes may have started in May, 2019 for some. But we don’t yet have proof that the changed tablets were coming out in May. We will continue watching for comments.

UPDATE #2 on August 26th: There are many reports about swine fever (not swine flu) killing plenty of pigs in China and into neighboring countries. Here is one. But that can end up being more about price increases. We still don’t have a definitive answer why the size of the NP pill changed, why the smell and taste is far worse, and why so many are seeing a return of their symptoms.

UPDATE #3 August 27th: A request has been made from Acella for the LOT NUMBERS of the CHANGED tablets…NOT the ones that are working. (And as of 2020, nothing has changed. Patients feel the requests were a fake concern from Acella).

UPDATE #4 September 13th: There is so much speculation and rumor out there as to why this has happened to NP Thyroid that it’s crazy. No matter what you hear, we do NOT know why this happened and NOTHING is concrete.

Important note: STTM is an information-only site based on what many patients worldwide have reported in their treatment and wisdom over the years. This is not to be taken as personal medical advice, nor to replace a relationship with your doctor. By reading this information-only website, you take full responsibility for what you choose to do with this website's information or outcomes. See the Disclaimer and Terms of Use.

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1,653 Responses to “Uh oh–we need to talk about NP Thyroid by Acella”

  1. Ash

    I had one of the stinky bottles mentioned earlier but refilled my script on 04/03/2020 and the pills do not smell anymore! Hopefully, this means they have made some adjustments for the better this time.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Unfortunately, no. It means they have been trying to cover up the crap inside. Lots of patients still having the same problem. NP Thyroid is just not worth it anymore, say patients.

      Reply
  2. Lynn

    Thank you Janie fior all you are doing for everyone. I have been trying Armour with cytomel and can’t seem to make head way. Here are my latest labs on Armour 30:
    T4 – 1.0 (.8-1.8)
    T3 – 3.1 (2.3 – 4.2)
    T3 reverse – 12 (8-25)
    And I am also showing EBV antigen if that makes a difference.
    When I try and raise, I get more joint pain, fatigue and hair loss. I understand I may have a cortisol problem from the bad naturethroid and then the bad NP but I don’t seem to be able to tolerate adrenal cortex or holy basil. I tried t3 only and couldn’t raise because it made me dizzy. So now I am back trying t3- 5 mcg/t4 19 mcg synthetic combo and I have a terrible headache, can barely see and my body feels like it’s weighed down. This has been going on for 9 months now and I’ve lost hope. I think my doctor is frustrated with me and thinks I am almost optimal so maybe it is EBV. I have been researching and trying to get myself out of this mess but I get nowhere. I was on NT 1 grain for 6 years without a problem and she can’t explain why I would now be closer to 1/2 grain as a curative dose. Can some people lose the ability to tolerate any medicine and if yes, what do they do? Would it hurt me to stop everything and see what happens? It can’t be worse than this.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Did you test reactivated EBV? You can show EBV exposure in the past, but that doesn’t mean it’s activated now. So if you did the right one, what active EBV can do is raise that RT3. And yours is trending upwards. RT3 can also go up from inadequate iron or high cortisol.

      We all have to do a saliva test to see exactly what is going on. Guessing doesn’t work. And that may be why you felt you didn’t do well on ACE, not because you don’t tolerate it, but you used it wrong, or needed something different. And only saliva testing will show what is wrong, thus what to treat.

      Reply
      • Lynn

        Thanks Janie! I have done two saliva tests thru ZRT. The last one being 1/26/20:
        DHEA 1.6L
        Morning 8.8
        Noon 3.4
        Evening 1.2
        Night 1.5

        The EBV was Early Antigen D result >150.00 H
        My last iron test was 11/23/19:
        Iron 130 ug
        Transferrin saturation 43%
        TIBC 301.ug
        Ferritin 84 ng

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Hi. You didn’t put ranges. Always need them. I’m guessing your morning is slightly low i.e not at the top area. Can’t tell about noon without the range. Is it high? Evening, which is afternoon (hate that they call it evening. lol) looks just a tad under midrangewhere it should be. Night looks high. Am I close?? If so, that is a seesaw pattern, meaning a stress pattern, and needs adaptogens like ashwaghanda, l-theanine, lemon balm etc three times a day to help even them out, and holy basil before bedtime for just a few weeks.

          Iron was high. Were you on iron supps?

          Reply
          • Lynn

            Sorry about the ranges.
            Morning 8.8 (3.7-9.5) was 7.6 on 9/22/19
            Noon 3.4 (1.2 -3.0) was 1.8
            Evening 1.2 (.6 – 1.9) was 1.2
            Night 1.5 (.4 – 1.0) was 1.5

            I did not feel while when I tried holy basil last year so want to avoid that one if possible.
            I was not on iron supplements.

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            L, H, L, H. Adaptogens 3 times a day.

            One of what’s here one hour before bedtime: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ps Only for a few weeks.

            Treat whatever is stressing you.

  3. Amy the Anomaly

    HELP!!! Here we go again! I have been deeply, adversely affected by the changes in Armour and Naturethroid over the past few years, and now it’s happening again with NP Thyroid. Got a new batch on March 12, 2020 and now two weeks later, all of my hypo symptoms have returned and I can barely walk! One of the most obvious places on my body that reveals a thyroid medication problem is my legs. My calf muscles lock up, have sharp pains running through them, and feel as though I have rigor mortis. There is a sense that the muscles have absolutely no elasticity and will tear if I use them. I can barely walk. This is unbearable and has stopped my life, yet again. I also have weight gain, severe bloating, insomnia, racing heart, hip, knee, and joint pain…the works! Can someone please suggest alternative medicine(s)? I know what works for one may not work for another, but I truly need suggestions. I don’t know what to even consider. I can’t live like this. I can’t believe this has happened AGAIN and the company behaves like nothing has changed. Obviously the outsourcing to Europe has changed some critical component(s) of NP, and the company won’t admit it. Please be specific with possible suggestions. I live in Maryland. Thank you!!

    Reply
  4. Jeni

    So I commented back in the fall when I had a major crisis and figured out it was due to the Acella NP issue (I had been taking it for years and was doing pretty well on it). I had switched to Armour just to rule out the Acella NP and that’s how i figured it out. I decided the Armour was obviously better than the horrible things that were happening to me on the latest NP garbage, but I had many hypo symptoms happening. So I went to my dr and she agreed that after looking at my current bloodwork (below) I could switch to a synthetic combo T4/T3 and suggested I do a compounded. So that’s what I did. Here’s what it was on Armour:
    TSH 1.09
    FreeT4 .8 (.68-1.51)
    FreeT3 2.4 (1.7-3.7)

    A little over a month into the compounded synthetic and I was literally falling asleep at my teaching desk every day and could not get through the day without caffeine. It was bad. I also felt as if I was gaining a pound a day. I returned to my dr and she said lets do some blood work.
    Well bloodwork came back and TSH lowered, FT4 is the same, and FT3 actually increased. Here are numbers on Compounded Synthetic T4/T3(below)
    TSH .75
    FreeT4 .8 (.68-1.51)
    Free T3 3.5(1.7-3.7)
    So why the heck did I feel like such crap? So tired, no energy and gaining weight if FT3 had increased?
    She won’t increase it, just said the compounded synthetic must not be agreeing with me, so I could go back to Armour, wait a few weeks, recheck bloodwork then go from there.
    Help-I just don’t know what to do ! Ugh..

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      When you were on Armour, you were underdosed!!! So of course you still had symptoms of hypo.

      And because of having been on the bad NP for a certain length of time, followed by being underdosed on Armour for another certain length of time, your compounded labs now reveal you are pooling that free T3 due to a cortisol problem.

      Read about pooling here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/pooling

      And read where you should have had those labs went on armour here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      But because you now have stressed adrenals, you’re going to have to correct that: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-imfo

      Reply
      • Jeni

        That’s what I figured…pooling because of stressed adrenals-thank you for confirming that. I’m not surprised that’s the issue..being on that NP and not sleeping or eating for months and having major anxiety and depression due to that horrible med I’m SURE stressed my adrenals to the max on top of being under dosed afterwards. Not going to be easy to deal with this when I can’t really get to the doctor or lab due to this pandemic and quarantine…ugh. I’m back on Armour, so obviously still under dosed, but probably need to stay that way until I can get my adrenals the help they need, correct? Then increase my dose?
        My adrenals were tested a year ago and were in good shape (before the NP mess), do you think a high quality adrenal supplement will help during the time being until getting to a dr. and doing lab work etc. is a possibility? It could be weeks or months and I want to do something to be proactive and help give my adrenals some support. Thank you SO much for your help!

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          You don’t treat adrenals from a test that’s a year old. Your adrenals can be very different now. We have to redo and only saliva: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/saliva-cortisol

          Reply
          • Jeni

            Completely agree.. but getting to my doctor to get evaluated and get a test ordered is not happening right now with all that is going on. Do you know of a company where I can order my own online and they will send me thekit and later the test results?
            Otherwise I’m going to need to get on some herbal supplements to support my adrenals, because staying this way is just no good :(.

    • Jay

      I will be switching from NP to Armour soon and am concerned…………..can I ask how much Armour you were taking per day?

      Reply
  5. Gail

    Is anyone on compounded NDT? How are you doing? Something seems different with my last refill and I confirmed they are using a new lot of the thyroid USP powder. Just wondering if it’s me or if others are having problems with compounded now too.

    Reply
  6. Yemi

    Thank you for this article! I’ve been on Acella since the spring of 2018. It worked great for me. I got pregnant March 2019 and was about 4 or 5 months pregnant when the shortage occurred and everything had been going well. Thankfully two different friends of mine who had also tried Acella had extra bottles of it and gave me their medication to see me through. When I finally received the new medication I started taking it the last 4 weeks of my pregnancy, two weeks into it my doctors saw my baby’s stomach had stopped growing and told me they needed to take her out early. There’s no way to prove this is because the medication changed but until I saw this article I couldn’t figure out why all of a sudden my baby had stopped growing. Thankfully even though she was born small and early she was healthy. I have a feeling because of my friends, I could continue the old medication long just enough to get me to that point. I can’t imagine what could have happened had I changed to the newer version earlier, perhaps things would have had a different ending. I’m grateful that it all turned out ok. I’m just sharing my experience here in case it can help anyone. Thank you Janie for your work!!!

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Whoa. I know it’s true that correlation doesn’t always imply causation, but that does make one wonder…. So glad your dear one turned out ok.

      Reply
  7. Mary

    I’ve also had worsening hypo symptoms since being changed to np thyroid last year. Last week I was prescribed Cytomel & had nausea & vomiting. I was hopeful that it would help as even the 1st day felt a slight improvement in symptoms. Any suggestions on dealing with the nausea would be appreciated. Thank you

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Not sure why Cytomel would cause nausea and vomiting? Maybe it’s a lingering effect from how bad NP was for you, and others?

      Reply
      • Mary

        The pharmacist said he has heard of this happening at 1st until the body acclimates to actually having enough t3. He suggested asking for a prescription for Zofran, which my dr sent in today. I took 1/2 of a 5 mcg with the Zofran & did okay this afternoon. I read about the t3 pooling & think I may have had this previously (currently just low t3, but fairly certain I have a cortisol issue due to stress & early morning migraines) Do you know if rt3 just clears out on it’s own if the cortisol issue is resolved? Thank you so much for this wonderful website – it is helping me so much better understand the thyroid symptoms I’ve been living with, & gives me hope that perhaps I will one day be “optimal” too.

        Reply
      • Mary

        I read that there was an fda recall for a supplier of ndt in September 2018, & then an np thyroid recall in July 2019. My insurance stopped covering Armour around July 2019 & so I was changed to np Thyroid. I noticed extreme fatigue, muscle & joint aches, weight gain, etc. worsened late last summer but thought it was related to ongoing stress. Over the holidays I had a few infections & was so exhausted I stayed home from planned holiday outings. Finally last month a doctor ordered thyroid blood work & my numbers were a lot worse, so I was changed about a week & a half ago to other medicines. Thank you for posting about this so we know this is a possible factor
        I don’t recall exact dates but recall there was a shortage of some of the other ndt’s in 2017/2018 because the pharmacies were sometimes out of the medications & I’d sometimes have to go a short time with no medicine.

        Reply
  8. Jenny

    I’m possibly a little late to this particular ‘party’ but reading comments feel less that I may be going mad at least ! I discovered NP around 1 1/2 to 2 years ago after ERFA no longer worked for me and doubled in price anyway….I’ve been doing so well, started running again, writing etc etc. Interestingly, they DID smell awful but still worked well….I felt great. Then I started a new batch that’d cost me hugely to import into the UK, but had to me previously been worth it and within around 4 or 5 days all my hypo symptoms returned including extreme menopausal flushing that’d been apparently helped previously. Annoyingly I have several bottles in reserve all bearing the same expiry dates and batch numbers so I am, as they say….scr***d. I am going to ask the pharmacy for a refund but doubt they will give it to me, but more importantly I am now very very worried about what to do next. I cant take synthetic stuff and dont like the look of most of the available NDT for the number of scary sounding excipients they contain and why I preferred firstly ERFA and then NP…. So I’m wondering if anyone can recommend anything that is currently still easing symptoms successfully. I’m at the beginning of the decline at the moment but not sure for how much longer I’ll be able to function atall. I would be very grateful for any advice, from anyone atall..I should add I never involve doctors and only observe my symptoms or absence of and energy levels and feeling of wellness or otherwise, as a determinant of what to take or not and how much….thankyou so much.

    Reply
  9. Shantel Brooks

    I have been on the same ndt/cytomel dose for 5 years since getting optimal. I had to switch to NP early 2018 after the shortage with Naturethroid. Things were going well for 2018 labs. Oddly, when I had my labs pulled Dec 2019, my FT4 and FT3 had both dropped, which they had not done in over 5 years. I was not aware there had been an issue with NP Thyroid that started in the fall of 2019. I have a lot of health/pain issues so plenty to blame changes on beyond my thyroid. But i was shocked about my labs changing bc they literally have been the same the last 5 years. I do now wonder if it is bc of the NP change? Also, in 2014, I did not do great on Armour. Is there a chance I could do better on it now? I am only on 1 grain ndt and then T3 meds.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      NP has definitely changed for the worst. Patient experiences prove is now sucks. So everyone is moving over to Armour a working compounded NDT, or T4/T3, and getting optimal. But you need to be sure you get truly optimal on anything you change to. Too many fail to read, say they are optimal, and they aren’t. So it backfires. This: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
  10. Frank Moore

    I noticed last year 2019 that the NP Thyroid had a strong chemical smell. My wife and I both take it and all the different strengths have the same smell. I upped mine to 120mg my wife takes 2 90’s and one 30 . We both feel hypo. This is very disturbing to us as not only does it affect us but we have been activists for NP Thyroid and told everyone that we meet that had thyroid problems how good it did for us. This should be criminal deception.

    Reply
  11. Jo W Nutt

    Discontinuing my NP after return of Hypo symptoms and 15 lb weight gain since December 6, 2019. Trying to figure out whether to go on Synthetic T4/T3 or Armour. My two question are:
    1. Has any one been able to lose the weight gained from bad NP by switching to synthetic T4/T3?
    2, Have you been able to get rid of the hypo symptoms when optimized on the synthetic T4/T3?

    Reply
  12. Sven

    Hi I‘m new with NDT and my Batch from 2019 has NO smell. Is this a good or bad sign?

    Thanks
    Sven

    Reply
  13. queen K

    I have used NP thyroid by Acella for one full year -2019. My labs either came out on the lower end or on the higher end of normal range, never optimal. I decided on trying it after reading good reviews for Acella but something definitely went wrong with the medicine composition.
    This year I have started taking Bovine Thyroid with brand name – Priority One’s Thyroid 65 (1 cap=65mg). I started with a low dosage and now have doubled the dose as required by my lab results. I am hoping to get my labs done again by the end of this month to see the difference. Has anyone tried this brand or any other Bovine brands after having tried porcine thyroid, please do share your experience.

    Reply
  14. Karen SF

    Update on my prior message. I contacted CVS about the chemical smell from my 90-day supply of NP Thyroid. The rep let me speak to a Pharmacist who told me they can talked to Acella in Oct 2019 about the smell complaints but were told they have a new supplier. I explained that with the irregular smell of chemicals and not “pig” I would not ingest them. I also talked with David from Acella and received the same “company marketing speech” that everyone else received. However, we did have a 3-way conversation with CVS Pharmacist, myself, and David who agreed to send me a new 90day supply thru CVS which I am receiving today. I did explain that if it had the same chemical smell I would not take them.

    I then called my Dr (who I’ve used for 10 yrs, always works with me, and specializes in Thyroid and uses NDT for patients.) She said she has had no patient issues using Nature-Throid and is getting me a 30day supply and in 4 wks I’ll get labs. I did explain that I heard that all NDT was not working, but agreed to try (smell) the Nature-throid product. Otherwise, she will write me a script for synthetic T4 & T3.

    My question – is anyone doing well with Nature-throid? If not, what are your issues. are they the same as the NP Thyroid or different? Is is just weaker, not consistent, etc? Not sure whether to waste my time on it. I do trust my Dr but feedback from this group is definitely appreciated.

    Reply
  15. TAI

    I filled a prescription for thyroid NP on 11/12/2019 for 360 tablets; 0.5gr. I’ve been steadily taking 3 tabs a day ignoring horrendous cat pee smell and awful taste. I’ve had a return of hypothyroid symptoms as well as new heartburn, heart racing and overall feeling poor since this latest batch. I have labs due 3/6 and am looking forward to my results but after all the research I’ve just read, I am anticipating poor lab results due to Thyroid NP being contaminated or compromised.

    Reply
  16. Karen SF

    I received a new 90 day supply of NP Thyroid 30mg size and they smell very chemically – not pig smell as my good batches have been. I take about 3grains per day and have been doing very well on NP Thyroid over the last year (was on WP Thyroid until their downfall.) After reading this blog, I am not willing to even try these tablets. My health is very important and I’m not willing to risk taking these. I did run across a website (https://sign.moveon.org/petitions/np-thyroid-by-acella) which offer to sign a petition to the CEO at Acella Labs – I signed it. Maybe all of us should sign and show our force in numbers. It the meantime, I’m planning to get my Dr to give me a script for T4 and cytomel that gives me the same T4/T3 as my current NP and tweak until I get optimal. I prefer NDT, but won’t go back until they fix this contaminated mess!

    Reply
  17. Jey

    Hoping someone can help as I’m at a loss on where to go from here. I did wonderfully on WP thyroid + Cytomel until the shortage. Switched to NP (plus Cytomel) over a year ago and did fine on that too. I even thought I was doing okay on the newer, stinky version of NP. In October 2019, my doctor took me off Cytomel because I was having a heart arrhythmia. However, when I quit the Cytomel, I also began taking magnesium and my heart seems better. So, not sure if it actually was the Cytomel. Fast forward 4 months and I am alarmed at how thin my hair is looking, I’ve been completely unmotivated and depressed, feel somewhat of a brain fog in that I can’t seem to figure out what I’m supposed to be doing or if I do, can’t seem to actually do it (symptoms similar to the pooling I had a few years back). I was in denial about the NP but am beginning to really wonder if it IS the NP, or just the lack of Cytomel. I’m not sure exactly when the hair loss started. It seems like I have been trying to brush it a certain way to cover areas for longer than just these last 4 months, but even if that’s so, it is definitely much thinner now. As of October, when I was still on NP and Cytomel, my TSH was .002 (I am without a thyroid so this SHOULD be low), T4 at 1.0 and T3 at 6.5 BUT I had labs done after taking meds, so T3 was probably higher due to that. I can have my doctor order new labs with fasting, but I’m unsure whether to ask for Armour, Synthroid, or just my Cytomel back. The hair loss is really bothering me, but I know the lack of motivation needs to be fixed too. I was miserable on Synthroid-only for years, then had pooling issues with Armour, so not really sure what to do.

    Reply
  18. Starr D.

    For those of you who are lost regarding what to take if the NP thyroid failed you (as it did me), you might give the real Armour a shot, even if you’ve been on it before and not done well. NP really started making me sicker last August through September, and I’ve pretty much been on just about everything over the years. In more recent years, though, the natural
    meds did try to help me with some symptoms the synthetic thyroid drugs just could not help. I really wanted to stay on something natural if possible, so my endocrinologist and I talked it over, and agreed I should give Armour a try, even though I’ve had bad results with it about five different times since around 1987. Haven’t taken it for about ten years, though, so was just hoping it was made better this time.

    Maybe it is. I’m not well by any means, yet, (I have a complicated case), but
    I do think it’s trying to help me as well as NP did when it was better, and maybethe Armour is actually somewhat better than that (for me, anyway, at the moment.) There was an especially bad side-effect I used to get from Armour (seeing weird spots to the side of my visual field, even when my eyes were closed, sometimes.) I’ve not gotten that sort of thing, so far. I think Armour has a different owner than the last time I took it 10 years ago, and maybe it’s possible they’re doing a better job with it, and maybe getting better ingredients, etc. That’s one reason
    I was sort of open to trying it again….a different owner can sometimes make a product better or worse…..I was hoping for “better.” Maybe it actually is, at least for some. We’re still not done adjusting my dose, so we’ll see.

    Also want to add that the other times I was on Armour, I didn’t always have a
    doctor who also tried to work with other things that help the thyroid, like iron,
    Vitamin D3, magnesium, etc. My current endo does, so I’m sure that helps.
    I don’t have much of my own thyroid gland left that works due to RAI for
    Grave’s Disease (hyperthyroid) in the mid 1970s when I was eleven & twelve
    years old. So, I’m really dependent on these thyroid drugs to work right.
    I’m not where I need to be yet, but at least the Armour is going in the right
    direction for now. Wanted to share in case this might help someone Starr D.

    Reply
    • jay

      How long have you been on Armour (this time)?

      Also how much Armour are you taking per day?

      I am going to be making the switch from NP to Armour soon and was wondering whether I might need a higher dose of Armour than what I was taking with the old NP to get to feeling good. (In other words was the old NP a little stronger than the new Armour?)

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        Just in case, we favor starting on a slightly lower dose of Armour, wait a few weeks, the test the frees to see if you need to tweak to get optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

        Reply
      • Starr D.

        Hi. I’ve been on Armour since mid-September, 2019 to present day. Janie
        is right when she advises anyone to start on a lower dose than they might
        eventually need. I think I started on 1 and 1/2 grains for awhile (1 grain or
        60 mg, in the morning), the rest in the afternoon. We then raised it to
        a little under 1 and 3/4 grains based on labs and my symptoms–keeping
        the one grain in the AM and the rest in the afternoon (around 4 pm is when
        my doctor advises taking the afternoon dose, although I don’t always
        hit it at exactly that time. He says it works better, splitting it up like that.)

        I just had a new thyroid appointment today…I have still a lot of obvious
        low thyroid symptoms, and he said I could raise the dose to 1 and 3/4
        grain of Armours daily, without even looking at the labs (they haven’t
        come in yet because I was unable to get them a week earlier, like I was
        supposed to.) 1 and 3/4 grain is the dose I took most often on NP thyroid
        when it was working better and helping me better. But when NP started
        making me sicker, I could barely take any of it for a few weeks, and then
        I had to stop it, completely. Whenever I’ve had a bad experience on any
        thyroid drug and change to another, I’ve learned the hard way that it’s
        always better to start on some dose that’s lower than you may really need.

        On me, it takes some time for the bad, old medicine to dump out, and
        the new medicine to start working. For a few weeks on me when I’m
        changing meds, it’s sort of like a battlefield going on–older drug is kinda
        fighting with the newer drug, until the older one finally fizzles out (could
        take a few weeks, on me). Then, the newer drug can have a chance to
        build up and actually start to help (if it’s going to.) I would definitely NOT
        go higher on Armour than NP…..go lower, if anything, just to make sure
        it agrees with you ok. Like if you’re on 2 grains of NP, ask for 1 3/4 Armour,
        or 1 1/2 armour, or alternate between the two doses. Just my thoughts
        on this. Good luck with it, Jay. You’ve got a shot at it, I think, with the
        Armour–at least how they’re making it, this time around. Starr D.

        Reply
  19. Beth

    So I have been taking the new NPThyroid for about 2 weeks. I can already tell there is a problem. How long should I wait to get accurate labs?
    Thank you.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      It’s always, always up to you, but there are simply too many reports of bad results from NP.

      Reply
      • Alan

        I have been taking the new NP for a few months, it seems to be working fine for me. I alternate doses, 95mg for two days, then 100 mg for one day, then 95mg for two days, etc. My TSH jumped up about three months ago to 2.98, I knew I was under dosed. My doctor raised my meds for three weeks and then I did blood work, my TSH had dropped down to the proper (suppressed) levels. All appears very good, and I feel good. I am holding my breath after reading all of these comments, I hope I continue to feel good, and I hope the new NP is stable.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Alan, it’s not working. Too many reports from people that prove it. And the low amount you are taking has never made anyone optimal with their frees. It’s also never about the TSH. It’s common to think we are doing well on a bad med due to the rising cortisol and adrenaline it’s been causing. See this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

          Reply
  20. PeggyPillTaker

    I feel like I should post this to help others….. My dose of NP thyroid is ____ mg. However, I always ask my doctor to write my script for the 15 mg tablets (1/4 grain) and I insist that my pharmacy give me the sealed bottles except what they can’t give me sealed. The manufacturer sealed bottles of 100 tablets. The opened bottle they give me in the amber colored prescription bottle is always speckled and when used (ingested) does not actually work too well. I open my sealed 100 tablets, add 3-4 desiccant packets to the opened bottle and that works fine for the month. I accidently lost almost a whole 100 tablet bottle (just got misplaced) found it again, opened, tried to use it, although far from expiry date, it did not work. Had hypo symptoms. All those tablets speckled too from air etc. Oh, with the 15 mg tablets, yes, I do take my tablets throughout the day at different times to equal my total dose of thyroid medication needed. Nothing wrong with that – don’t know if anyone else tries this. It works okay for me…..

    Reply
    • Terry Jackson

      I had a thyroidectomy about 10 years ago and took Armour for a number of years and then learned of NP Thyroid which was close to half the cost… so I started taking it. About a month ago I started feeling horrible and tired and went online and learned how NP Thyroid had changed their supplier and there may be issues with the new pills. My wife takes Armour so for the past three days I have taken that and I now feel great. The results of my Thyroid bloodwork came back today and my TSH was 75! Remember, I do not have a thyroid so I rely 100% on the pills. My creatinine was also high and I believe that is caused by the incorrect NP Thyroid. Having bad thyroid medication can be very scary stuff. I want to send my pills back to the manufacturer for a refund.

      Reply
  21. Mike R

    This is interesting. Since December, I have been on a steady decline. Gained 15 pounds, felt tired, unmotivated. I chalked it up to winter in a northern climate. But, I finally had enough, I knew something wasn’t right. I made an appointment with my dr. to have my levels checked. Haven’t gotten the results back yet. But, I checked my prescription and noted that my scrip was filled in early December. Right when my symptoms started coming back…

    That’s what prompted me to do a search on NP Thyroid changes and saw this article. What is someone supposed to do now? This was the one thing that seemed to give me results. I have a feeling that when my doctor gets back to me, my TSH levels will be high again. He already said that he will likely just increase my dosage. But, taking more of something that isn’t working doesn’t seem like a great solution.

    Reply
  22. Thalia

    WHEW! That explains it. I actually threw out one whole bottle cuz I thought SOMEHOW, SOME WAY my cat had peed on it! Gross tasting!!!!

    Reply
  23. Victoria N.

    I was doing good on 2 1/2 grains NP Thyroid plus 100mcg levothyroxine to balance everything out. My Frees were good and I felt good. After the change my Frees have both dropped to 25% of the range. My doctor (a DO) won’t up the dose to get my Frees back to where they were before (I was under a different doctor in a different state, but then we moved 1800 miles). I guess I will try crushing/chewing the tablet to see if that helps. I try taking Vitamin C with my tablets to increase absorbtion, but I forget most of the time. I will also try taking my anti-depressant at night instead of with my thyroid pills.

    Reply
  24. christin poeschl

    Hello,
    I am writing you from Austria/Europe. I have Hashimoto, for the last 25 years (probably longer) and the only medication that works is natural thyroid. Ever since the reformulation of Armour I have been taking Erfa Thyroid (3 Gr.).
    I was rather happy with this medication – as it is one of the few ones that get to Europe regularly – but I just opened a new box of 1 grain, 60 mg Lot 19F03, Exp: 06/2022 and the pills have a horrible taste, a rather chemical taste, which they never had. They smell entirely different compared to the older ones. It is a pungent stench but not porcine.
    The appearance definitely changed as I compared two 60mg tablets from different lots with different expiry dates (different color and texture). The newer ones are whiter and the cover is much smoother, shinier, not as yellowish and does not have these speckles.
    I made a picture that I am unable to attach here, but it looks exactly the same as the picture of one of your readers for the NP thyroid ( if you want I can send it via e-mail).
    My question is if any of your readers reported changes on Erfa recently ( I could not find anything on your blog)?
    This is all very strange and for years I have been thinking that users of natural dissicated thyroid are being deprived of any control. I wrote to Erfa and the response was the same as ever: nothing changed, just different raw material. I wonder if we all get the same pills just under different labels. The ERFA pills also lack any information on the ingredients, something that is impossible with Austrian medicine, all the ingredients need to be on the box or bottle.
    Anyway, keep up your good work, your blog is like a democracy for thyroid patients all over the world!
    All the best from Europe! Thank you!
    Kind regards,
    Christin

    Reply
    • Jay

      Have you tried the German Version of Natural Thyroid?
      I have heard about it on this site and others for many years.
      I have never seen any actual reviews on how it works but If you try it please let us know how it works for you.

      Reply
      • christin poeschl

        They all worked well – depending on the fillers the different pharmacies use – but as they use the same raw material as the American brands they will probably have the same problems. Most of these natural thyroid medications come in capsules, for ex. in combination with olive oil, so the smell is not noticeable and it will take time till people notice the changes. Some of these medications even use grounded Armour as raw material. As far as I could find out the raw material that most of the US. brands now use does not come from Europe – the pharmacists say there is no European business producing thyroid – but originally from South America, guess Brazil, are bought by European firms in Spain or Italy and then exported to the US under the label of European thyroid. If this holds true, then this would be the explanation why all the brands have the same problem. And it is also a fact that they all smell very much like cat urine and the chemical stench is just the coating. I took a new Erfa pill, washed the coating off and immediately the urine smell is there. the old ones do not smell the same. It is very difficult to get any information on the raw material, in the US or in Europe. This is also a kind of lobby and nobody wants educated patients. Only Ms. Bowthorpe and we, the patients!

        Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Sadly, the terrible stench has become common for most of the pharmaceuticals, which makes patients wonder what they are swallowing. And they have always stated “we changed nothing”, which patients find to be insincere and insulting. Plus, there’s been a widespread return of hypo on the now-stink pills.

      Reply
  25. Dina Ciccone

    OK I’ve received a few phone calls and I just got this email I am off of work on Monday so I plan on calling. Please load this up with questions you want me to ask.

    Hello,

    Thank you for contacting Acella Pharmaceuticals, LLC. We would like to speak with you further regarding the issues you experienced while on Acella’s product. Please contact the Medical Information Department at (678) 581-4436 (Monday through Friday, 9:00am – 5:00pm EDT), to speak further regarding your experience.
    .

    Kind regards,
    Medical Information Specialist

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Good luck. The same thing has been going on for months, and nothing has changed, other than seemingly coating the tablets to hide the awful smell (and thus the continued awful results from whatever is inside). Patients state they are still doing lousy on NP Thyroid..

      Reply
      • Dina

        I talked to them today and it was just them asking me a bunch of questions. At the end the guy asked if I would ship my pills back to them if they sent me packaging. I might stick a couple in there but I would like to hold onto them on the off chance someone needs them to figure out what’s actually going on with them.

        Reply
  26. rich

    I too have noticed the negative change. Weight gain and tiredness requiring naps that have been gone for years.

    I contacted Acella 2/6/20 and was told the vendor was changed from a USA pig supplier to a European supply.

    On 2/11/20 a different department called and asked a series of questions. They are replacing the last 90 supply, bought 12/1/19, of the 60mg+60mg+30mg pills I take every day (150mg/day). They hope for my local CVS to fill the new order and take back the old product.

    If CVS does not want the product, then Acella will send a mailer to me to have the product shipped back so they can analyze it.

    Reply
    • JustMe

      Rich, I have been following this since it started. I really hope they may listen, but what you’re describing is exactly what hundreds of others have done…and no response after the initial “we’ll replace it.” They’re appeasing a disgruntled patient base and lying. I don’t understand why, but it’s getting harder and harder to truly trust anyone to help. STTM is a great resource and if you haven’t, read all around the website, get the books and find their Facebook page. I don’t know where I would be without Janie and STTM. I’m not affiliated and I don’t know Ms. Bowthorpe personally, but I have seen her work tirelessly to be a patient advocate and help everyone. I follow some other places and people too, but STTM is by far my most heavily relied on source for information and understanding.

      Reply
  27. Jason

    I’ve been on 90 mg of NP Thyroid for several years now. My TSH was 2.22 back in January of last year. Had it retested in November and it had climbed to 3.21. Coincidence?

    Reply
  28. Jill Walters

    I have been taking NP thyroid for several years. I switched when Armour went south. I was taking 150 mg NP you until I had a medical event and it was discovered that I was way over-replacing. My dose was lowered to 120mg in July. Last week my doctor told me that my TSH was undetectable and lowered my dose to 97.5 mg and switched it to “Nature-throid” by accident because she’d never heard of NDT.

    Reply
  29. JoLene

    I’m relatively new to this (again) after originally being prescribed NDT for out-of-whack thyroid lab values + severe hypo symptoms back in 2015. My doc had 1st prescribed Armour and then Naturethroid when I couldn’t get Armour Rx filled due to supply availability. I took the Rx for a year or so and felt better (at least I was not *as* horrifically fatigued + was finally able to have some activity and lose weight, etc). But foolishly, after about 9 months or so of taking the NDT Rx, I stopped taking, as I thought I’d gotten things fixed and could just coast. I know – absolutely foolish! I was able to manage somewhat but as of Oct 2019, some major stressful life events ultimately left me back in absolute exhaustion-mode + I gained 20 lbs in 3 months. I finally woke up and thought maybe I needed to go to my doc, and she started me on pellet bio-identical hormone replacement therapy — but she also suggested I have labs drawn to see where I was at with my thyroid levels. My TSH was 3.9, and my T3 & T4 numbers were all sub-optimal, so in addition to the BHRT, she suggested I start back up on thyroid Rx. So on Dec 2, I got the BHRT pellets (estradiol/testosterone) implanted, but was also prescribed NP Thyroid Rx at 15 mg. [I had advised my OBGYN that I wished to go with NDT Rx (vs synthetic) and she agreed. She started me out at 15 mg NP Thyroid but as I’d felt so much better when I was on 60 Naturethoid (similar dose in Armour) + I wanted to feel better ASAP vs. struggling along for weeks/months slowly going up from 15 mg to 30 mg etc. …. in January, I asked her if we could increase my dose, she agreed after doing a 2nd set of labs and increased me to 60 mg NP Thyroid.

    But now after reading this blog and seeing that there are so many terrible reviews of patients’ hypo symptoms returning when being on NP Thyroid, I’m now not sure what to do ! FYI: I have both samples of 60 mg NP Thyroid as well as a 90 day filled Rx of NP Thyroid – and neither of them have the terrible cat pee/ ammonia odor that is described. Does that mean that I should feel safe in going ahead and taking the NP Thyroid ? Or should I ask my doc to switch me to Armour Rx? I know that will be harder to get (and I don’t believe my insurance covers Armour) but at this point, I don’t care [I’m willing to pay out of pocket if I have to!] just so I can be on the right Rx to help me feel better [vs. going for weeks and weeks and not seeing any change and/or feeling worse]. I know that ultimately we must watch our labs to ensure we are working towards getting to the “optimal” levels but as I’ve not yet noticed a difference in feeling any better (where my hypo symptoms have gotten any better), I don’t want to keep taking the NP Thyroid if it isn’t helping?
    FYI: Despite taking the NP Thyroid since December 2, I don’t feel that I’m seeing any abatement of hypo symptoms, and what’s worse (I don’t know if it’s related or not) but I’m still gaining weight (despite doing my best to try to lessen caloric intake – but appetite still ramped up) and my fatigue symptoms aren’t better – PLUS I’m started to lose sleep due to restless leg syndrome symptoms!!! I told my doc aout this and she suggested taking magnesium supplements + a CALM drink powder or gummy. I am doing that now but it’s not helping hardly at all with the RLS symptoms at night.
    HELP?
    Janie, can you please advise?
    And I want to thank you so much for all the time and research you dedicate to the STTM site and helping us get the information we need, as smart individuals who are trying to advocate on our own behalf to get the best quality of life we can get! I thank you so very much in advance!

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi JoLene. You are very welcome.

      There are recent remarks by patients that Acella has been coating the NP to hide the smell. Yet hiding the smell, if it’s true, doesn’t change that NP went south for patients. So who knows. The only hope is that your pharmacy still has a strong stock of the pre-changed NP. And by the way, if they do, you are far from optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
  30. Dawn

    Hi,
    My doctor wrote a script for Low Dose Naltrexone for 0.5 mg. The compounding pharmacist said this dose is too low to receive any benefit. Is anyone taking this? What dose were you started at? Can you take this with NP (the old stuff)? Have you noticed hypo symptoms decreasing while taking LDN? Insurance doesn’t cover it, so this will be oop. Thank you for any insight.

    Reply
  31. Susanne Bengtsson

    I am so grateful for all this information and do not expect a response to my questions as I can only imagine the time and energy it takes to keep this website running – and yet I will still ask 🙂
    I’ve been on NP since 11/2018 – for a while taking 120 per day but since 7/2019 taking 90. I developed bacterial pnemonia fall of 2019 and then reactivated epstein barr 11/2019 – current symptoms are nausea, fatigue, tremors, insomnia, brainfog. My labs have been fairly consistently as follows TSH 0.040, FT4 0.88, FT3 2.92 however my Thyroid antibodies went from 1.3 in 3/2019 to 8.7 just recently (range 1-9). Liver enzymes ALT jumped from 35 in 7/2019 to 60 most recently. I just started Tirosint Levothyroxine 50 MCG and 5mcg Liothyronine (working slowly up to 15mcg).
    Is this the correct dosage in your opinion and also can epstein barr cause elevated liver enzymes and thyroid antibodies??
    Any thoughts would be deeply appreciated.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Yes, it takes a lot of time and energy and this is all volunteer. Your labs show you are seriously underdosed: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal And it looks like you now have an adrenal problem (nausea, tremors, insomnia etc) from being so underdosed. To find out what seems obvious, patients order this: https://sttm.mymedlab.com/sttm-profiles/zrt-saliva-adrenal-4-sample–2 Read all about it here–promise you will read it all: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/saliva-cortisol

      Reply
      • Susanne Bengtsson

        Yes, I have had high cortisol 24/7 since I started testing through saliva 12 years ago however finally managed to get levels normal for the first time in September 2019 after trying phosphatidylserine. Now as I think back this is when my nausea, tremors and dizziness started. Is it possible that the sudden change in cortisol output affected the thyroid and caused these symptoms? But then how come the thyroid labs didn’t change? I am due to retest my cortisol to make sure it’s still holding and will also retest thyroid after having switched from NP thyroid to Levothyroxine 50 MCG and 15mcg Liothyronine. One last question if you have time – is it ok to take all thyroid meds together first thing in the morning or do you have to split them up? My functional doctor states it is less stressful on the adrenals when you split them in two. Thank you again.

        Reply
  32. Belle

    Question for those switching from NDT to synthetic T4/T3: Is it necessary to replace the T1 and T2 that are found in the NDT? If so, how can that be replaced? Thanks in advance for any information anyone can provide on this.

    Reply
  33. Mary

    I had been taking Naturethroid for a few years before I couldn’t get it anymore this past September. The pharmacist switched me to Acella (Lot #M328G19-2). I did notice the small etc. that others are writing about but I felt okay. Now I couldn’t get Acella so they gave me Armour and my chiropractor said she hasn’t seen my body this depleted since I’ve been coming to her for the past few years. I guess I’ll go on synthetic T4 and T3. I don’t know why it has to be this way after doing so well for years on Naturethroid.

    Reply
  34. Karoline

    How long, once stopping NP Thyroid, does it take to get the medicine out of your system? I feel AWEFUL on this stuff! I have crazy reflux, tight chest, upper back pain, fatigue, headache, bloating, crazy anxiety and hurt all over! I take 60 mg. Is it possible to not take meds and just improve levels through diet?

    Reply
    • Lori

      One grain is rather small, it might be possible with a herb and vitamin routine along with an organic diet free of soy and endocrine disrupting chemicals, you can always try it and see how you it works for you. Feel free to PM me if you would like a copy of my entire herb and vitamin routine geared towards thyroid. I am on medication however but my problem is severe and I’ve had it for along time so I developed a herb and vitamin routine to help me feel better.

      Reply
  35. Edie

    I have been on NP for several years now, and my labs were always really good (I didn’t do so well on synthetics (Synthroid and Cytomel combo), Armour, or Nature-Throid). Last month, I got a bottle of the new NP, and while my hypo symptoms didn’t return, the taste was ABSOLUTELY awful, made me nauseous. This month, the smell and taste is not nearly as bad. It still doesn’t smell or taste nice, but not quite as disgusting. My symptoms are still at bay, so all is good there. I just wanted to report about the new batch that I have received, and the fact that things might be improving.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      There is suspicion they are trying to cover up the smell and taste. If that’s the case, the interior is still the same i.e. may still cause problems.

      Reply
      • Edie

        Well, this batch isn’t making me nauseous, so that is a plus. None of my symptoms have recurred, despite the last bottle tasting horrible. As long as I am feeling good, and am not getting nauseous, I will continue taking the NP.

        Reply
    • Janet

      Edie, do you have an expiration date or lot number from the new batch? I’m curious if it was manufactured after all our complaints.

      Reply
      • Edie

        Hi, sorry I hadn’t seen this earlier, but I have been crazy busy with tax season. I get my NP from CVS and I don’t see a lot number, but the expiration on my latest bottle is 3/2/21. They tell me that they special order my NP every time I order a refill (I live in a very rural area, and apparently I am the only one around here who takes it). I had some of the horribly stinky/nasty tasting ones, these still look the same as the bad ones, but don’t smell very bad, and I slightly chew mine when I take them, and they don’t really taste that bad. They don’t taste as good as they used to, back in the day, but also totally not horrible. Also, none of my symptoms have returned.

        Reply
  36. Jeni Megge

    I have recently switched from Acella NP to Armour because as I wrote here months ago, I felt absolutely horrible on NP-I got severely anxious and depressed and lost my appetite and could barely function. It all seemed to go away once I switched to Armour.
    Sadly, on Armour I have many hypo symptoms and just do not feel my best (constant headaches, hair falling out more than ever, and some anxiety returning).
    My Dr. offered switching to a synthetic which I am more than fine with at this point. I really don’t trust any of the NDT’s anymore.
    Here are my options-I just want to get this right, any thoughts on which is better?
    Here are the results of your recent blood work:

    TSH (0.4-4.5) N current level is 1.09
    Free T3 (1.7-3.7) N current level is 2.4
    Free T4 (0.7-1.5) N current level is 0.8

    N = Normal + = Abnormal

    Your thyroid labs on the Armour are okay – a slight adjustment of the T4 would be optimal.

    Using a T3 / T4 combo we’d have to compound it and use University Compounding Pharmacy in Troy.
    The benefit would be a near exact match of what you would need.
    According to their 2019 pricing sheet they charge about $45 for a one month supply but $96 for a 3 month which is quite a savings.
    Your T3/T4 compound would be T3 15 mg / T4 65 mg

    If we changed to a Synthroid product (T4) and used cytomel (liothyronine) (T3) we’d use Synthroid 150 mcg and Cytomel 5 mcg 2 in the am and 1 in the afternoon.
    So one Synthroid per day and 3 cytomel per day.
    Synthroid and cytomel DO come in generic form so it’s cheaper and I’d recommend staying with the same pharmacy for generic brand consistency.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Jeni, if those were your labs on armour, your problem is that you were severely underdosed. Study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
      • Jeni Megge

        Ugh….
        So I need my dose increased in order to fall in the top part of Free T3 and the midrange of Free T4?
        Now just to figure out how to get her to agree to that since she apparently just follows traditional ranges.

        Reply
    • Janet

      Jeni, I’ve had to raise my Armour by dose by 40% to get it comparable to NP Thyroid, but it is working for me. We watch my body temperature and heart rate to help adjust so I don’t get hyper, but I’m feeling much better. I would love to do the Synthroid/Cytomel but I can’t tolerate the calcium sulfate in the name brand and generic T3s. I feel good as far as thyroid function, but get awful stomach pains from it. I may go to a compounded formula like yours since I could choose the fillers.

      Reply
  37. Emily Jane Smith

    If the reformulated NP Thyroid does not work for you, is there any way you can be refunded either by the pharmacy or by Acella for the price of the medicine if you paid out of pocket?

    Reply
  38. Amberc

    Hello there, been following a while

    Switched from synthetics to armor and felt good for two months or so, now having increased anxiety and hair falling out triple the amount than normal.

    So I call the local compounding pharmacy which compounds t3/t4 ask them to tell me when the porcine powder they use was manufactured and what was in their compounding.

    I also asked them if they can make armor and np compounded with a doctors conversion (of what I’m on) and prescription.

    They flat out refused and were rude enough for me to almost cuss them. They won’t; call me back with the info, text me, email me, write it in a formal letter, write it on a scratch pad, send me a web link…. nothing. I asked them to do any option of these to communicate back to me what I’m asking of them!

    A simple:

    1. What porcine powder do you use and when was it manufactured?

    2. What ingredients are in the compounds you make for thyroid meds/compounds?

    They say I have to come in and they won’t help me on the phone and they can look at a bottle. They want me to look at the bottle they use for information. Which obviously the bottle will not include the information I’m asking. He’s telling me that is “the only information he can give me… is what is on the bottle”. That is crazy and untrue! There is lots of specific info he can give me about compounded products!

    What in the world is happening here? I get compounded progesterone here and they have no problems shouting from the rooftops what they put in that compound.

    I said: “I perceive your getting irritated with my questions and I want you to know, I’m just trying to make the right choices for my health and I want this information so I can keep myself well along side my doctors care. I want to ask you: are you not telling me because:

    A. You don’t want to

    B. You don’t know and don’t want to look it up

    C. You know, but can’t tell me because you will get in trouble

    Or

    D. You know that it is a batch of porcine powder that has been reported is bad and is causing the return of symptoms in people that need thyroid supplementation and are willing to make and sell bad stuff because you don’t want to lose money”

    And he was rude and got off the phone quickly with the understanding that my husband will be coming tonight to ask for the exact same information.

    This is a pharmacist at medicine man compounding pharmacy in Hayden, Idaho on prairie ave

    1.208.762.9355

    Can you help me to see why he won’t give the info and what choices you would recommend from staff that won’t help you to know if their product is safe?

    Help!

    Thanks for all the research and work you do

    Reply
  39. Tricia O'Connell

    Hi Gang,
    I just got off the phone with a Pharmacist from Acella. He did admit that the supplier for the active ingredient was changed but could not comment on if (with all our negative results) they intend to change back or make any other adjustments. He documented my issues (return of Hashi symptoms, burning chest and throat, nausea, acid male cat pee smell and taste). He is contacting my Pharmacy to get refill info and may have me send back some tabs to Acella. So it’s probably all just PR and won’t go anywhere but I had my say. I told him how disgusting it is that after so many years Acella joined the moneygrubbers and discounted patient care and safety. I’m looking into changing to synthetics and truly dreading the process and expense. Hang in there folks! We are all in this together.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      It has never gone anywhere, and so far, patient expressions about Acella range from denial, gaslighting, disgusting, insulting and on and on.

      Reply
  40. Dina Ciccone

    I switched to Armour Thyroid in December. I ended up going to the ER on New Year’s Day thinking I was having a heart attack because I was burping and I couldn’t breathe. The doctor at the ER thought I had GERD and maybe I do but I’ve never had it before. I got my results back from my thyroid results and my TSH was very low. I cut the dose in half ASAP and the GERD subsided. However, last week I believe I started having atrial fibrillation and I see a cardiologist next month. I started on WP until they stopped making it, then I went to NP and it was wonderful until it wasn’t and now on Armour I’m having all of these more severe issues. I am very upset and stressed over all of it.

    Reply
  41. Ann

    Hi All,
    After 6 weeks being on Amour my results are as follows
    Free t3-2.8 pg/ml
    Free t4- 1.1ng/dl
    Tsh- 0.01
    My question is if my freet3 seems low would I just supplement with t3 or go up a dose in Amour? I switched over from NP at the same dosage and my t3 did go down from 3.1. Thanks

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Patients with informed doctors have always moved up by 1/2 grain every two weeks until in the 2-3 grain area, then they get labs done to see their progress. If not optimal yet, they continue raises while checking labs. Sometimes only 1/4 grain raises if getting close. optimal. We have to have the right amount of iron and cortisol to avoid problems when raising. It’s all in the updated revision STTM book. Get the book and refer. Ignore the part about NP Thyroid…that was before it went bad. https://laughinggrapepublishing.com/product/sttm/

      Reply
      • Ann

        Hi Janie,
        Thanks for your response. I do have your book and have optimal iron and cortisol levels. Im just wondering if my t4 is where it should be and I’m low on t3 if I should just take the t3? I have noticed where other people are saying they are supplementing with straight t3 to get optimal on Amour. Currently I am on 2.50 grains of Amour. My doctor is pretty willing to do whatever I suggest to help me…I’m just not sure if its raising a 1/4 grain or just adding t3. Any help you could offer would be most appreciated.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Compare your results to what it talked about on this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal It will help.

          No, there are many who just raised Armour and got optimal. Right now, it’s the minority who felt the need to add T3.

          Reply
          • Ann

            Thank you. I just wasn’t sure if I added more t4 into the equation whether it would cause that to go higher too. You have been much help to me and many others. I can’t thank you enough.

    • Jay

      How many grains of Armour do you take per day? How many hours after you took your last dose was your blood drawn?

      Reply
      • Ann

        JAY,
        I wasn’t sure your question was directed to me and I didn’t want t be rude and not respond. I am currently on 2.5 grains and my blood was drawn 27 hours after my last dose of amour. Sorry if your question wasn’t directed to me:)

        Reply
  42. Karen

    I just read an interesting review on np. She said after taking np it effected her liver function . After being back on nature throid for five weeks her levels are normal. As in a earlier post I just had an MRI because something showed up growing on my liver. I no you keep saying that nature throid is bad but it is working for some people. So this could explain why some people are having stomach issues. I had liver issues on thyro gold as did other people so there is a connection some how.I would not put np in my body ever again.she also said something about bacteria in np.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      What was the date of that review? Understand that we have yet to see any evidence that Naturethroid is now working. All we know is that when it came back in 2018, a huge body of people were reporting a major return of hypothyroid symptoms after going back on Naturethroid. That continued throughout all of 2019. We’ve also seen people say it’s working, but then they discover it never was and they were being fooled by the excess release of adrenaline and cortisol because it wasn’t working. And labs proved that it wasn’t working.

      If the day comes that we see the evidence that Naturethroid is now working again, plus labs to prove it…and there are a good body of people reporting that it’s now working with labs to prove it, I will for sure report it.

      Reply
  43. Sally

    I posted while ago echoing the same problems about the change in the pills, but the more I reviewed 2019, I determined it was changing even before the obvious change in appearance/smell. Hypo symptoms started showing up in the early summer – only to get drastically worse in the fall (with the arrival of the changed pills).

    Go out and buy/checkout the book Bottle of Lies by Katherine Eban (details the fraud going on with generic drugs). I’m fairly certain something similar is going on here. After reading her book, I’m not getting my hopes up that FDA will come to the rescue.

    I find it interesting that Acella keeps saying it’s coming from a European country, but never says which one. I’d have much more trust in something coming from Germany than somewhere like Ukraine.

    Still trying to get things back to where they were – not much success at this point (sleeping is really a challenge). Tried a generic T4, but that gave me a nasty rash.

    Trust no one and everybody lies…

    Reply
  44. Kelly

    I have been on Armour for 3 years, and over the last year I have been in a Hashimoto’s flare. During this time I have gained over 25 lbs. I just changed from Armour to Nature throid. Should I go back to Armour?

    Reply
  45. Lauren Blowers

    Two days on those simply HORRIBLE NP Thyroid pills (2 60mg per day), and my chin broke out in a rash not to mention the tingling sensation right after I took them!! Seriously. I actually begged my doctor to call in Armour. What kind of CRAP is Acella putting in those pills? Acella’s website claims that the pills are exactly the same, but they are using a new manufacturer overseas which adheres to FDA standards. Total BS!! I don’t know how sick I would have become had I continued usage!

    Reply
  46. Kate

    I was placed on NP Thyroid about 3 weeks ago and I’ve notice an itch that started in my scalp and is now all over my body. It can be a tingling sensation as well. My doctor keeps telling me to take the medication, however, I feel as if I’m going crazy with this sensation. Benadryl helps stop it. Anyone else experience this?

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Since NP now sucks and leaves what appears to be practically everyone with hypothyroidism, itching can be a symptom. This is why people are leaving NP Thyroid and Acella in the dust.

      Reply
    • Nicole

      I’m wondering the same thing. I have old Nature Throid from when it was good in 2017 but I was told by the pharmacy and manufacturer that since I kept it in the refrigerator it may have lost potency

      Reply
  47. Jennifer Riedel

    I’m posting here to see if anyone shares the same symptoms I’ve been experiencing since switching from Nature-Throid to NP Thyroid to the “unchanged” NP Thyroid. I switched to NP Thyroid in 2018 when I couldn’t get my Nature-Throid refilled due to the shortage. No biggie – I took the NP Thyroid with no issues, I actually liked it better. In August of 2019, I refilled my prescription – the pills that normally were essentially odorless and tasteless (I used to chew them before I swallowed – but I can’t anymore), now had a horrible taste and smell about them. A few weeks after starting the new “unchanged” NP Thyroid pills, I feel hungover without having had anything to drink, I feel as if I have a pill stuck in my throat (I even had a swallowing X-ray done – neg results), I can’t take a deep breath, I have no energy, and I experience quite a bit of nausea. I’ve been banging my head against the wall trying to to figure out what is causing this. I never imagined it might have something to do with the “unchanged” NP Thyroid. Is it possible?? Has anyone else experienced any of these symptoms since the change – specifically, the shortness of breath? All labs have come back as normal.

    Best Regards,

    Jennifer

    Reply
  48. Ann

    Hi Janie,
    I switched to Amour 5 weeks ago and am feeling better than when I was on NP. I will test numbers at the end of the week and work from there. My question is on the optimal iron levels you have listed. Do these numbers reflect being off iron for the stated 12 hours or after being off 5 days? I’m not sure there would be a big difference between the two but I am curious. Thanks for all you do!

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      They reflect “close to” where people fall who don’t have an iron problem…what we kept seeing repeatedly in labs over the years.

      Reply
      • Ann

        Thank you….I understand that….I’m just wondering if the optimal numbers are after being off iron for 12 hours or for 5 days?

        Reply
  49. Rachel

    What’s left in NDT? I luckily still have about a years supply of thiroyd but due to the swine fever outbreak have no idea when more will become available. My body isn’t able to use synthetic t4 and I only recently got these new ones that made me sick just trying to take them.

    Reply
  50. Paulina

    I started on NP in June and by November, I was barely functioning. Swelling in my hand and feet, due to the swelling it was difficult to walk, muscle soreness, fog, hair loss, weight gain (30lbs) this cause me sever hardship. Dosage 60 mcg with the 330 embossed on the pill. I did report this to the CDC. Two of my other friends experience the same issue.

    Reply
  51. Chrissy

    I’m ready to make the switch from NP NDT to T3/T4 synthetics but not sure the best way to make the switch. Do I do it slowly over time or just take my NDT one day and then switch entirely to synthetics the next day? Thanks so much.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      One grain of NDT equals 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3. That should help based on what you were on. Yes, some are switching over in one day. But we also found it’s important to test the free T3 and free T4 within a few weeks to see if it was a good switch, or if tweaking up or down is needed.

      Reply
      • Chrissy

        Perfect, that’s what I’ll try. My doc and I had figured out the ratios we just couldn’t decide the best way to actually make the switch. Thanks for everything.

        Reply
  52. Eneida

    Hi Janie, after 5 months of brain fog I was lucky to find out this blog saying there was something wrong with NP so now have been on 19 mcg of T4 and 9 mcg T3 roughly equivalent to 1 grain. I used to be on 2 1/2 grains of NP. My free t3 is only 2.7 and t4 1.1 and I still feel cold and brain fogged, but I’ve tried raising by the equivalent of a 1/4 grain and my heart speeds up at night to about 75 from 58 normal waking me up often. Should I just raise any way and will the heart beating fast go away in a few days? My cortisol is a bit low but but not too bad. My ferritin is 52. Thank you so much for any guidance you can provide. Eneida

    Reply
  53. Karen

    Ok just got a phone call from Acella months later inquiring about my problems after talking np. He said it was a follow up from FDA report I made. Wanted to know if I had any new health issues and I said yes I just had to have an MRI because they found something growing on my liver in a CT in the ER. I still am unable to eat without pain and reflux. Keep on reporting to the FDA I think something is happening but don’t know what. I told him I don’t think they are doing anything.so why bother . I still would like to know what caused me to be so sick months after stopping np.

    Reply
    • Lynn

      So sorry! I feel like I haven’t been the same since I took it and can’t seem to get back to normal. What are you taking now for your hypothyroidism?

      Reply
      • Karen

        I am back to using nature throid. Still having a hard time raising my dose.I cannot use synthetic t4 allergic to all of them.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Naturethroid went south, Karen. We find it’s far better to go to T3-only if there is issue with fillers.

          And what do you mean by allergic to T4? Overall, doesn’t exist as an allergy. May be fillers instead.

          Reply
        • Lynn

          Naturethroid is where my problems began. After taking it for 6 years with no problems I was switched to WP when it was on back order. When I was switched back to it in June I started having all sorts of problems and that’s how I ended up on NP. Right using Armour but not optimal yet. Going slow.

          Reply
    • Janet

      Did he say anything about whether they’re making changes? I’m sure for legal reasons they won’t admit to any fault in the product. I haven’t heard from them yet and I also filed a MedWatch report with the FDA. Hang on to your old bottle in case we can find a lab to do contaminant testing. I’ve put in a few inquiries.

      Reply
  54. Lynn

    Hi Janie,

    I know I am under dosed on Armour but am slowly increasing because I have been so sensitive to medication since the NDT debacle. It seems that I am losing hair the more I increase it. Shouldn’t that be getting better? That was my first symptom when Naturethroid went bad. My hair got softer and frizzy and started to fall out. I’m scared to increase more if it is the Armour causing it.

    Reply
    • Janet

      Lynn, because the hair loss occurs several weeks after the stress on the system, you may still be losing hair from the bad NP period. I kept losing some hair after I started Armour, but I also had some thyroid swelling. Like you I was concerned it might be the new medication but decided to keep with it for a while. The swelling went down (probably was a goiter from the NP and then weeks on Synthroid) and today I noticed new little hair sprouts all along my hairline. That was so exciting! In the past that’s always been the sign that I’m getting the correct mix of T4 and T3 and starting to stabilize.

      Reply
      • Lynn

        Thanks for your reply. The weird thing is that the bad Naturethroid really made it shed and two weeks after I started the good NP it slowed down significantly and then the month I started the urine NP it started to shed again. I stopped and tried a synthetic t4/t3 combo and a couple of week later it stopped completely and I had new growth but it gave me a bad headache so now trying Armour and no headache but the hair shredding is increasing with each new dose increase to get optimal. I feel more tired as well so worried that Armour may not be working for me or that to take enough for my labs to be optimal will make my hair loss worse?

        Reply
  55. Jennifer

    Janie,

    I am taking compounded thyroid and the last time I got it re-filled, the expiration date was only three months out. It had no odor whatsoever (not the characteristic “piggy” odor or anything). I had been given that same lot# before so I know the medication is getting older. Before, it had 5 or 6 months out before expiration and had the characteristic odor. What I’m wondering is if it is still potent enough to keep my thyroid at the same level or could I possibly start going hypo on it since it appears to be losing its strength? – (or I assume it’s losing its strength since it has become odorless).

    Thank you. I don’t want to get messed up on it; it’s always a long ways back to normal.

    Jennifer

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Our experiences say that it’s probably fine since porcine powder has a long lifespan. Maybe you can see what happens.

      Reply
      • Michele

        Janie, what is the life of NDT? I have some really old stuff that “expires in 2016” that I have been using. It’s the reformulated Erfa, but is better than the NP stuff, and then I also have Armour that was reformulated and it turns to “paste” sublingually, so don’t know if it’s any good or not…and I think the situation with that was they used talc instead of dextrose in the reformulation. Any thoughts? Thanks. Also (sorry for all the questions), how long does T3 last? I bought lots and have it in the freezer, but it’s really old, wrapped 2 times in foil and then ziplock baggies and then frozen…someone said to do that ages ago).

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          NDT has a long life, apparently. But that was before they were all changed, so no telling about the changed ones.

          Not sure which reformulated Armour you are mentioning. If it was 2009 or 2015, Armour became bad.

          Reply
          • Michele

            Thanks Janie. My Armour expired in 2016, that’s all it says on the bottle. The Cytomel and Cynomel are all in the freezer and since they are synthetic, I am hoping that if I were to need them, they will work okay.

  56. Kay Hargis

    Since my thyroidectomy in 2005, I have tried the synthetic and the various NDT replacement thyroid products. Palpitations have been the worse side effect of all of them, but some nausea and flu like symptoms have come in varying degree as well. But nothing like the miserable symptoms that came along with the NDT changes in late 2018 and all of 2019, apparently as a result of outsourcing the pig raising and processing to overseas sites. One really begins to lose heart when we see there is no hope for any other options. We who depend on these meds to stay alive despair that there seem to be no businessmen anywhere who have the integrity to care enough for their fellow human beings to produce high quality products in the USA where they know they can control the safety and quality of their product and thereby relieve the suffering of millions of others.

    Reply
  57. C DeBrun

    Yes I’ve noticed a massive difference in the NP Thyroid since April-May and i regularly get my bloods checked which are all over the place. My TSH is currently .864 Free t3 2.6 Free t4 7.5 and cortisol is decreasing and is now at 51. If I encounter any kind of stress my throat closes up to the point where i really strain to talk. I cant sleep at night brcause I wake every twenty minutes. Lately I’ve been picking up any ailments such as flu etc but getting it really bad. Also the lympocytes in my bloods recently said 4.1. I feel awful and unfortunately my GP doesn’t seem to know what to do. I went to see a ‘specislist’ and he said my bloods were fine….and recommended LDN… can anyone help me?

    Reply
  58. C DeBrun

    Yes I’ve really noticed a change in the NP thyroid since April and I’ve been getting bloods regularly. My TSH is .864 and free t3 is 2.6 and free t4 is 7.5 also my cortisol is continually dropping and I feel awful. My throat feels like there is a large lump in it and if I encounter any kind of stress it gets to the point where my voice weakens. I can’t get a full nights sleep because I wake every twenty minutes…..can anyone help as GP doesn’t seem to know and ‘apparent specialist’ reckons I need LDN.

    Reply
  59. Sue R

    Lab results 7 weeks after switching from NP Thyroid, to Synthetic T4 (Levoxyl) and Synthetic T3 (Sigma Pharm). I had a total thyroidectomy in 2011. I take 4.5 mg LDN (low dose naltrexone) at bedtime along with my Thyroid meds. Hair loss has improved greatly, heart palpitations have stopped. One negative I have noticed is that I have a lump in the throat sensation since starting the synthetic, but not sure if it is the meds or due to tight neck muscles. I have always been in the low range of FT4, even when on NDT. I am thinking about increasing my T4 med slightly to see if I can get more optimal. The current dose is a 4 to 1 ratio. I do not have a cortisol issue. Overall I feel better than when I was on NP, but I don’t feel optimal yet.
    TSH – 1.49
    FT3 – 3.4
    FT4 – .7

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi Sue. You’re still very underdosed, thus still very hypothyroid. That’s why the lump in the throat, lots of time. See this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
      • Sue R

        Thank you Janie. I feel like I am underdosed, but not sure how I should adjust. I am currently taking 50mg Levoxyl and 12.5mg Cytomel (4 to 1 ratio). I am not getting compounded meds due to cost, so am limited to tablet dosages available. I was thinking of increasing to 75mg Levoxyl and 25 Cytomel (3 to 1 ratio), or 75 mg Levoxyl and 17.5 Cytomel (4.28 to 1 ratio). Do either of those choices sound like a reasonable change? With past experience I know I become hyper very easy with too much of a change.

        Reply
      • Lynn

        Is a lump in the throat a symptom of hypothyroidism? What about acid reflux? It has just started for me n the last two weeks and I can’t figure out why.

        Reply
      • Sue R

        New labs after 7 weeks on new dosage of synthetic T4 & T3. Lump in throat sensation has resolved, in general feeling better. So glad I made the switch from NP Thyroid to synthetic. It feels good to know that I am on a stable medication that hopefully won’t change. Glad to be off the wild ride of NDT.
        TSH: 1.12 – previous lab 1.49
        FT4: .7 (range .6-1.1) – previous lab .7
        FT3: 3.5 (range 2.5-3.9) – previous lab 3.4
        Current dosage 50mg T4 (Levoxyl) plus 1 extra 50mg tab per week; 12.5mg T3 (Sigma Pharm generic)
        Doctor increased T4 by 50mg/week (1 additional tab per week), kept T3 the same.

        I will retest again in 4-6 months to make sure things stay stable. I only had to adjust the synthetic once to get to this point, so I’m pretty happy about that.

        Reply
  60. Janet

    Just got my labs back from several weeks on Armour.

    Free T3 5.1
    Free T4 0.78
    TSH 0.703

    That’s way better than my last tests on Synthroid alone. I still have some swelling of my thyroid gland but hopefully that will go down if numbers stay optimal.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Those aren’t optimal. You are pooling. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/pooling

      Reply
      • Janet

        These have always been typical levels for me when I’m feeling good. We check cortisol, iron, etc and everything is in normal range. I have an immune deficiency that causes abnormal cytokines so it affects diurnal cortisol levels somewhat (high normal morning, low normal night), but nothing that needs treating. My doctor said if the swelling doesn’t go down I can get an ultrasound, but I’ve never had nodules, antibodies or even abnormal RT3 so he thinks it was a reaction to the weeks that I was on Synthroid alone and will go away.

        Reply
  61. Susan

    Hi. Just wanted fo chime in. Ive been on armour for a few months and dont feel well. Im always so tired, yet cant sleep. No physical energy whatsoever. I just don’t feel good or positive yet im not depressed. I didnt do well on armour in the past either. I take hc, 20 mg. I do take ativan but have for years. In the past i never had this exhaustion. Ive also had bad heartburn since np and now armour. I never needed prilosec. I was at one point taking pepsin hcl and felt much better. I was wondering about compounded time released t3? I did ok on cytomel for a long time, then it felt like it hit me fast and was gone in like 2-3 hours. Im hesitant to go compounded t3 cause of the cost, cause of the pita to get to an optimal dose, simce i dont feel optimal now. I feel like im taking more than i should, more than i have in the past-90 mg armour(thats 1.5 grains), then 25 cytomel, then another 45 mg armour. Ive been doing this for 10 years now and in the beginning when i was really “on” it tracking temps, taking notes, my optimal was 2.25 grains-2.5 or equalivalent cytomel. I dont have the money for a pay out of pocket doc. I just think trying to get to optimal with compounding would be a lot of hassle and expense. How would they do it? If the dose was too high, could i cut the pill and adjust ? Im sick of this bs. Is anyone on compounded t3? Also the massive weight gain that will not budge. Is like to finally get optimal so i can finally wean hc!

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Susan, when we are tired on an NDT that is still working like Armour, it means we aren’t optimal. Study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Also, if you did a saliva cortisol test and your results were super low, 20 mg has never been enough of HC. It underdoses us. Thus the adrenals continue to be stressed. Read Chapter 6 in the updated revision STTM book. This one: https://laughinggrapepublishing.com/product/sttm/ It’s very important to learn from years of our successful experiences, both for you and to teach your doctor.

      Reply
      • Lynn

        I’m and on month two of armour and not sure if I am getting better. Not as tired as on NP but am pretty sure I am under dosed but going slow. Question about being underdosed. Since everyone has varying needs isn’t it possible for someone to be optimal at say 1 grain of Naturethroid which I took for years and feel fine? If I was underdosed did it take 4 years to burn out my adrenals? Also in regards to hair loss, mine started about three weeks after switching from WP back to Naturethroid in 6/19. Does that means the hair loss was due to the 5 months I was on WP (1/19-5/19) or the reformulated Naturethroid. I assumed it was the Naturethroid because at the same time as the hair loss I also developed joint pain, fatigue and brain fog pretty badly. Right now I am still tired, some hair loss and a little reflux which is new. Joint pain is gone but brain fog is still there but a little better.

        Reply
  62. Karen

    Can anyone tell me if armour pills are speckled also. The last time I tried it I couldn’t breathe good.the nature throid are speckled but they say they are getting the powder from the us and Canada

    Reply
    • Janet

      Karen, they’re not speckled. I rinse the outer coating off and then you can see some darker spots once it’s wet, but nothing like the NP.

      Reply
  63. Lynn

    I was just wishful thinking about if any of the NDT’s find there way back to their old formulas. How will we know? They have scared us so badly no one will want to try them. I’m still slowly working my way up to optimal on Armour. I know that I am having a little more hair fall than usual and have had reflux the last two days since I increased. My doctor said that your hair reflects what happened two to three months ago. Naturethroid is what started massive hair fall I believe and it started about three weeks after starting the new back in stock one. Anyone know if my doctor is right about hair fall timing?

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      The problem might be that the old formula used pig powder that was quite better than what they are getting now. And no telling what other crap was put into NP Thyroid for whatever reason…but of course, secrecy and denial abounds.

      Reply
    • Janet

      Lynn, that’s called telogen effluvium when it’s related to some kind of stressful event or trauma to the body (and the bad tablets were definitely trauma for many of us). And the doctor is correct:

      “Telogen effluvium is a common cause of temporary hair loss. It is characterized by an abrupt onset of hair shedding usually seen several months after a triggering event.”

      This is a really good article about it. You’ll notice that iron deficiency will make it worse so like Janie always says, it’s really important to keep an eye on your iron status. I’ve had it happen several times and fortunately my hair always grows back to normal thickness after my health improves.

      https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/321590.php

      Reply
  64. Janet

    I’ve been on Armour alone now for a few weeks and seem to be fine with it. I wasn’t sure it was going to be as effective but the heating system was malfunctioning in our building this week and my apartment has been in the 60s which normally would do me in. My hands were a bit cold but my body temperature is staying normal. (When I am optimal my temperature is exactly 98.6 and when I had trouble with the bad NatureThroid and NP it dropped significantly.) So I’m taking that as a good sign. I also have been able to get back to my normal exercise routine and I can only do that when T3 is in a good range.

    Reply
  65. Renee

    I have an observation that I wanted to share with everyone here. I have been taking 120mg of NP thyroid since 2018. I was taking one 120mg pill per day, but when I had to get a refill this month, the distributor sent LOT# G, with the speckled pills, to my pharmacy in the 120mg tablet. I said I didn’t want it, so my pharmacist called my doctor and got my prescription changed. I now take two 60mg pills per day. My big concern was that I didn’t want to take the speckled cat pee pills.
    I kept about 6 of my old “good” 120mg tablets so I could compare them to the new 60mg tablets when I got them. I wanted to determine if they looked or smelled different to me.
    Let me say this….the new 60mg tablets appear fine visually. I personally don’t see any speckles. BUT, they really smell like ammonia/cat pee and/or chemicals to me. I stuck my nose in my old bottle, with the old pills, and sniffed and then immediately stuck my nose in the new bottle and sniffed the new pills. I noticed a DISTINCT difference in smell. My old 120mg pills have the normal “piggy” smell to me. The new tablets smell nasty and chemically.
    I have been taking the smelly new ones for over a week now, and I seem okay for the most part. My hair isn’t falling out. I AM gaining weight and I’m tired, but I will attribute that to the holidays since I ate stuff I shouldn’t eat, and the stress of the holidays often exhaust me. I will be doing a round of the HCG diet in January. If I don’t lose any weight on it, then I will know that there is a problem with my thyroid for sure.
    I’m not having any bad reactions that I can definitively attribute to the smelly pills, but I will say that i have to hold my breath to take them. The smell of ammonia, or whatever it is, makes me want to gag. It’s so gross.
    I didn’t get the lot number on my new 60mg tablets, but I can call my pharmacy and get it if anyone thinks it is important.
    So yeah…there’s that. *sigh*

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      You can lose weight with the HCG diet even while hypothyroid though. But you need to be very careful assuming you’re going to be okay on the new smelly tablets. They have caused several to see their adrenals become stressed, their iron go down, and all sorts of other problems. It’s up to you, but most have gotten to the point where they say it’s not worth it to try them.

      By the way, most HCG for weight loss is super hard to get now. The FDA claimed they were not safe, even though many have successfully used them. Hope you find a good one somehow.

      Reply
      • Renee

        Hi Janie. thanks for your input! I get my HCG through my functional medicine doctor, who orders from a compounding pharmacy in Florida. I am hoping and praying it is just as good as it has always been before. Even with that said, I will be vigilant in listening to my body, and if I start feeling really poorly, I will go for blood work. I will not hesitate. I’m not going to mess around. I had a really awful experience after the WP debacle and I got really sick on Naturethroid. I don’t want to go back there again as it took me MONTHS to get sorted out again.
        I’m just so terrified of synthroid. I was on it for years and my body slowly broke down to the point where I actually thought I might die. I HATE being tied to big Pharma for the rest of my life. Ugh.
        Janie, thank you so much for this website. I come here every single day to read and to see the latest updates. This site keeps me informed and it keeps me sane. You have my eternal gratitude.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          You’re welcome! And do know that Synthroid as Synthroid is and was not the problem. The problem was being on Synthroid or any other T4 “all by itself” which was the problem. It is not a problem by adding synthetic T3 to synthetic T4 and getting optimal.

          Reply
      • Laura

        Thanks for all you do, Janie. In August, I became aware of the issues with NP, but kept the faith that Acella would fix these problems. In my experience, I definitely noticed a difference in NP since spring 2019, and I am concerned that it has caused my cortisol to lower again. Sounds like others are having the same issues, so if anyone is dealing with this successfully (or not), I would like to hear from you. I was diagnosed with Hashi’s about two years ago, and found out I had adrenal exhaustion because my free T3 was pooling when I raised NDT. I have been taking adrenal cortex since my diagnosis, and have had optimal frees for over a year. Everything was perfect, and I was feeling wonderful up until Spring 2019. I had my labs done in April 2019, and my free T3 was a little over the range, which was probably the first sign, then came sleep issues, aches, appetite, fatigue, etc. The next labs were scheduled for August. My doc had switched practices, 1.5 hours away. When I saw her in August for labs, unfortunately the nurse did not request the proper thyroid panel, so I had nothing to compare to April. My next labs were scheduled for March 2020. By December 2019, I was crashing at 3 in the afternoon, and could hardly keep my eyes open. I was then convinced that NP had to go, so last week, I decided to request a full thyroid panel and make the switch to Armour. Still waiting for the lab results, but happy to say that after 5 days on Armour, I am having a bit of improvement in fatigue, the aches have almost completely gone away, and sleep is much better. What kind of poison is Acella putting in NP!!?? I will NEVER go back to taking NP! As it turns out, Armour is much cheaper than NP with my insurance, so I am very happy about that, too. I’ve been taking my temps which are fluctuating from day to day with a difference of 0.4F. I feel like I should do another saliva test, to see exactly where I’m at, but scared to go off of adrenal cortex right now. So I guess I will just have to monitor my temps and wait until my next labs in March and see if Armour gets me back to optimal and my symptoms subside. What a scary disappointing mess!

        Reply
  66. housemaid

    If anyone would like to leave a review of the new stinky NP thyroid pills on WebMD, please do so. It might at least save some people from wasting money and damaging their health by buying these bad pills. https://www.webmd.com/drugs/drugreview-154794-NP+Thyroid

    Reply
  67. Amy

    I just spoke with fda . People need to fill at the medwatch report online on fdas website . If they get a lot of complaints Re NP thyroid , they will investigate .

    Reply
  68. Helen McKinley

    I’m wondering if I’m having an allergic reaction to the new NP? My thyroid levels (although not optimal) haven’t changed significantly, but I’ve had a chronic cough, chest congestion and post-nasal issues for three months. I’ve been trying to figure out what’s up since I didn’t have a cold or flu and usually my allergies don’t cause these symptoms. I suddenly realized it started around the time or shortly after I started the new NP. I’m going to use some of my stash of good NDT to see if it clears up. Wondering now how long that will take and what I should ask my doctor to prescribe next….

    Reply
    • Michele

      Helen, I had the same symptoms several weeks after starting on the latest RX of NP thyroid. Mine didn’t look different and didn’t have spots like the photos, but they did smell strange and I took them anyway. When someone else commented on the chronic cough that would come out of nowhere I really took notice as I’d been having that. Went to my NP and she said I had post nasal drip and it was from something in my throat…I stopped the NP and went back to really old (expired 2016) Erfa and Armour and started taking those reformulated ones that I left behind in the cabinet. After 2 weeks the throat/cough stuff stopped, but now I’m tired all the time and my hair is falling out once again. Like others, I have no clue what to do next. I can’t take Synthroid, but do fine with Cytomel…although my FT4 is low even with NDT, and so I want to get that in my system…how?

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        It may not be that you “can’t take Synthroid”. It’s more about that you “can’t take Synthroid without T3”. We need to take them together if we are going to switch.

        Reply
        • Michele

          Janie, thank you for the response. You are correct. The 2 endos I went to both tried me on Synthroid alone, which was a nightmare for me (nearly burned down my house!) I might try the Synthroid with the Cytomel after I finish up with my expired Erfa and see how that works. Boy will it be expensive (no insurance for either!) My hair is starting to fall out again and I’m really tired and fall asleep in the afternoons. Not my normal at all.

          Reply
  69. housemaid

    I was checking out the price of Armour since it seems to be working for several people. I also checked out the price of NP just from curiosity, Late last summer I paid about $115 for a 90 day supply of stinky 2 grain tablets of NP at Walgreen’s with Good Rx. Now that same 90 tablets prescription is selling at Walgreen’s for $54.51 with Good Rx, and Walmart has it for only $38.21. Sounds like a fire sale. Acella is finding it hard to sell these rotten pills! The FDA, the pharmacies, and the manufacturers don’t care about us, but Acella (and RLC Labs) do care about making money. I hope they’ve discovered they can’t make money selling a bad product.

    Reply
  70. Jennifer

    Janie,

    I take 90MG of compounded porcine thyroid daily. (I was previously taking Acella’s NP Thyroid.) If I have to switch over to synthetic hormone, how much Synthroid and Cytomel should I take? I’m also seeing in these posts where many folks do better with the SygmaPharma Cytomel than others for some reason. When you first start on synthetic T3, do you start out slowly and build up to the dosage that feels right? And then test? Are there any at-home thyroid testing kits that are available and dependable?

    I used to take Synthroid and there were times I would have panic-attack-like episodes and it would take a week for it to get out of my system. It was horrible! I don’t have that problem with the NDT, so I really hate to get back on the synthetic stuff.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi. One grain is equal to 25 mcg T3 in effect. Yes, many do quite well on the Sigma Pharm version of T3. 90 mg compounded procine is quite small and you wouldn’t be optimal on that. So moving over the equivalent amount of T4 and T3 is probably workable, we would guess. This will be different than just being on Synthroid alone. You’ll have direct T3 in your treatment. Remember to get optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
      • Jennifer

        Thank you, Janie. Then it sounds like I would take 1 1/2 tablets of the 25 mcg Cytomel, correct? Can these be taken sublingually? I searched for generic brands of Cytomel. I came up with SigmaPharm, Mayne, Mylan, Sun Pharma (from overseas market), Greenstone, and King (the info for King was from April 2013). It seems the only one with microcrystalline cellulose and hypromellose was Mayne so I know I couldn’t take that one.

        What about my dosage of Synthroid? Would I take 90mg Synthroid since I was taking 90mg Acella NP Thyroid – or would I cut it back because I’m getting the T3 of Cytomel? I’m confused about switching from one to the other.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Jennifer, I made a mistake just referring to T3. I’m with my sons for the holidays and distracted. One grain of any version of NDT is equal to 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3. So by that, you can figure it out if you move to the two synthetics. And do remember that you’ll be underdosed, even if you initially feel better.

          Reply
          • Lynn

            Janie,

            Because of adrenal stress I am moving slow with getting to my optimal dose of armour to avoid the weird headache I was getting with synthetic t3/t4. Can you move too slow and cause problems with being underdosed? I’m moving up after 30 days instead of two weeks.

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            You need to treat the adrenal stress, not move up slow with Armour.

  71. Karen

    Can anyone on here tell me if they have added talc to nature throid. They say it would be in the paper insert that the pharmacy gets with the pills.I cannot take synthetic I am allergic. So I am going to try nature throid again I have no thyroid function because of rai.just hoping someone can clear this up.Just got done trying tirosint and synthroid bad reaction again. Thanks

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      You really don’t want to go over to naturethroid. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/

      Reply
      • Karen

        Well I have to take something armour makes me wheez, I have read where other people went back to it after the bad np and are feeling better. Just wanted to know if they added talc.so if anyone knows please post I am pretty sick right now and can barely function.

        Reply
    • Janet

      I’m really sensitive to talc and several other fillers (especially calcium sulfate). So far I’m doing okay with Armour. I had severe reactions to the two generic T3 meds I tried. I have had some trouble with Armour’s formulation in the past but it seems to be a bit different now. I do rinse off the tablet to remove the coating before taking it sublingually. This is from the product insert:

      “The inactive ingredients are calcium stearate, dextrose, microcrystalline cellulose, sodium starch glycolate and opadry white.”

      Reply
      • Lynn

        I started Armor a month ago and just did labs. They are getting slightly better than when I did the synthetic t3/t4 combo which was making the top of my head hurt. I am still not optimal but am going slow due to the weird reactions and sensitivity I have remaining from the Naturethroid/Np thyroid debacle of last summer.
        Free t4 – 1.13 (.82-1.77)
        Free t3 – 2.7 (2.0 – 4.4)
        Rev t3 – 17.30 (9.2 – 24.1)
        TSH 2.89 (.45 – 4.5)
        My Armour still smells good.

        Reply
  72. Jackie

    Just an update, folks. After I contacted Acella last weekend and left a message, I got a voicemail from David from Acella who asked me to send him an email documenting my experience. So it seems like they are taking this issue seriously. I’ve sent him and email and will report back what he says.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Jackie, I think we all have to be careful assuming they are taking this seriously. Many many many have documented their experiences all while many more are innocently trying NP and report horrible reactions. This has been going on since summer even BEFORE the obvious changes.

      Reply
    • Mimi McClurg

      I talked to David from Acella over a month ago and I don’t believe they’ve done anything except change out my meds. These are a bit better. No smell and look and taste like old *Good* pills. I am still having issues from the *Tainted* pills making me sick, everyday gets a bit better. My labs were still off this week.

      I am going to need to refill next week. I am worried wondering if anyone has found a better solution?

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        People have gotten very unimpressed with their request to send them back. They feel fooled by Acella as stated in many groups.

        Watch your frees. There were non-changed ones in the summer which were bringing back hypo, including fatigue in the late afternoon. My husband was one and there are others who reported it.

        Reply
  73. Di

    OH NO!! I had finally made peace with a good compounded porcine powder from an AZ compounding pharmacy…and the latest batch is nothing more
    than rotten NP–smell, taste, stomach pains, nausea, etc!!! It is definitely in the supply chain now, probably worldwide.
    It is the porcine powder. (My filler is lactose. period.) What a nightmare. Been sick since August, and trying to keep
    both my jobs and take care of my family—not to mention, just enjoy life again!

    Reply
    • Karen

      Di yes it is. Every time I see a new comment all I think is report this to the FDA so they will have no choice but to test this crap. I still have my bad pills just by chance they move forward I have a case but not enough official complaints came in to do anything.So instead of telling it only on here file an FDA complaint they need to be stopped from selling this bad porcine powder. I still cannot eat without pain three months after stopping np.

      Reply
      • Di

        I will do that right away.

        Reply
      • Janet

        I think we have all hesitated to file a complaint with the FDA in the past because we felt the remaining NDT manufacturers would be harassed. But there’s really no one left to protect except the manufacturers of Armour and that brand has been around so long I don’t think it’s in jeopardy.

        I filed a MedWatch complaint (FDA’s program) several weeks ago and finally got something in the mail last week saying they had received my complaint. But there was no other contact or follow-up. I have a feeling they wait until they get several on the same product before investigating to be sure it wasn’t just a coincidence someone reacted.

        So perhaps if enough of us do that they will collect some samples for testing. I’m not sure if we’ll ever see the results…that’s all usually handled internally. I’ve been checking out various pharmaceutical testing labs to see if any are affordable enough to check my two lots. I sure would like to know what made me so sick.

        Reply
    • Catherine

      That is alarming! The enamel on my front teeth wore off rapidly after starting NP thyroid in April due to low stomach acid from the bad pills starting in June. This is serious and causes me extreme emotional and psychological stress. I switched to compounded porcine powder cut with glycine 2 and a half months ago. I have been doing better.

      I had resigned myself to paying $100 a month out of pocket for the compounded porcine powder. To hear that you got a bad batch is scary. I actually got a batch last month that I about to start that smelled slightly off. I asked the pharmacist about it and he swore that it was from the same batch as the month before. I am not sure if I believe him. I will provide updates.

      Last thing for me to do is go to Tirosint and cytomel. This has been a tortuous experience with side effects that are life long.

      Reply
      • Di

        The compounding pharmacy says “Nothing has changed.”
        And maybe their supplier really is the same one they were using.
        This is going to be hard to trace.

        Reply
  74. Dana

    I am on Naturethroid 65 and I can’t get out of bed. Exhausted, living on high doses of caffiene.
    Bloodwork shows TSH normal, free T4 lower end, and T3 definitely low!
    I don’t know what to change to. Hair thinning slightly and weight gain!
    Was on T3 alone for about a year but would crash after 4 hrs and need more. After that tried synthroid but had horrible joint pains and couldn’t do it.
    I eat a high fiber diet and green tea.
    I prefer bioidentical if possible or whatever NDT will really work. My NP thyroid 60 before, were white tablets.
    If I were to try a generic T4 and T3 together, which generic do you recommend that won’t cause joint pains? (The Rx plan that gave me generic Synthroid comes from CVS network supplier and I couldn’t bear it.)
    Please help.

    Reply
  75. Gill

    Hi I have been on NP Thyroid for approximately two years since there was the problem with the WP Thyroid. All has been really good until the last 3 or 4 months. I am now on my 2nd lot of NP thyroid and it is one of the batches which have been listed. I am now hypo again, feel drained and tired and have had a number of migraines in a short space of time.

    Has anyone swapped over to WP thyroid now it is available again? If so, how are you feeling? I know Armour has had issues too but know that WP worked for me. I’ve seen my GP this morning in the UK and even if I went back onto thyroxine (which I’m loathed to do) she can’t prescribe the liothyronine as I don’t convert T4 to T3. Follow up blood test done this morning and waiting to hear back from my endocrinologist but know it won’t be good news.

    Any light anyone an shed on changing tablets would be great.

    Thanks

    Gill

    Reply
    • terry

      My IFM DR switched me over to WP Thyroid back at the beginning of September and I started feeling better. The only dose available is 1 grain (i’m taking 2 atm). I’m not optimal though, still working on that. She actually just dropped my dose a few weeks back because my rt3 was up again. We’ll see how it goes. If my labs aren’t better the next time we check I’m asking for t4 and t3.

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        It’s probably a good idea to switch to T4 and T3. Seeing a growing body of people doing awful on WP. And having RT3 is also about treating the cause.
        Janie

        Reply
        • Gill

          Thank you for your replies. Just waiting to hear back from my endo with blood results ….don’t want to end up wasting more money on something that is making me ill. Just hope I can get the T3 too as GP’s can no longer prescribe it apparently. Good luck to all. Gill

          Reply
        • Terry

          Janine, I’m working with two IFM Drs. Slowly ‘peeling the onion’ we’re currently working on mold/mycotxins. We still haven’t been able to get my TgAb antibodies down or figure out what’s causing them to be super high.

          Reply
  76. Jackie

    Since picking up my latest bottle of NP in October I’ve become a complete wreck. Unbearable fatigue like I’ve never felt before; wrenching, burning stomach pain; constant flu-like symptoms; and wonky labs. I checked my lot number and it appears to correspond with bad lots listed elsewhere on this site.

    I’ll be switching to Armour this week.

    This debacle has cost me over a thousand dollars as I’ve gone to several doctors and have had multiple tests, including an MRI, to find out what’s wrong with me. I wonder if there’s some sort of class action lawsuit that can by filed against Acella for this.

    Reply
    • Karen

      This sounds just like me I am scheduled for an MRI because they found a lump on my liver with a CT scan.I have not been able to recover from taking the np thyroid for four and half months at eight pills a day. I find it interesting about the post after you about the amimes . I looked it up and it said they use chlorine to sanitize the product which will give off an amonia odor. Bingo cat pee smell . If used in high concentration it is toxic. So I think they got bad glands and our using them. Like trying to clean rotten meat. As for a law suit against them not going anywhere. Not enough reports to the FDA to proceed. This I know for a fact my report went nowhere because people are not reporting the bad reaction to np.God help us who are physically sick from this.

      Reply
  77. R.C. Mandeville

    Hi Janie,

    I also noticed that my latest rx of NP Thyroid (120 mg, received October 2019) seemed to have a very different appearance, odor, and taste than previous rx’s. After taking it for a couple of weeks, I had digestive upset daily, heart palpitations, felt weepy and down (I’m a psychotherapist, so this surprised and concerned me as nothing had changed in my life to warrant this) and also started to have sudden acid reflux symptoms – severe. I have notified my MD and just picked up Armour and started that today. Crossing fingers I do okay on it.

    The reason I am writing is that my partner is a Chemist in the pharmaceutical / drug discovery industry. I asked him to smell this latest rx of NP Thyroid. He sniffed it, and immediately said, “It smells like you have free amines in there.” He went on to say that “free amines are not good drug practice, and is indicative of *possible* compound decomposition; i.e., possibly indicative of protein decomposition from the pigs.”

    I hadn’t noticed anyone else mentioning amines and possible protein decomposition here in your comments so thought I would add that into the mix. Thank you for all you do for us – I have learned much from your site here over the years and it has been very helpful.

    Best,
    R.C.

    Reply
    • Jeni

      This is exactly how I was feeling for the past couple months. Heart palpitations, insomnia, horrible anxiety and debilitating depression (I’ve never experienced this in my life). I was crying nonstop. I was put on Xanax and an antidepressant. On a whim, I decided to look into my thyroid med, and low and behold things started after I picked up my latest NP script. I switched back to Armour and within 24 hours I am myself again. No Xanax needed, sleeping through the night without palpitations waking me again. I cannot believe this. I almost went out on medical leave from teaching because I could barely get in the shower much less through a day with 30 nine-year olds, and here i am a week on Armour instead of NP and those symptoms are gone..this is bananas.

      Reply
      • Ann

        Hi Jeni,
        I am happy you are feeling better! Did you use the same dosage of Armour that you were using on the NP? Thanks.

        Reply
        • Jeni Megge

          I am taking the same amount of Armour, yes. Years ago, I had switched from Armour to NP back when Armour was getting hard to find and they added fillers. I just went back to Armour because I didn’t know what else to do.
          I don’t know if I am optimal yet-and am guessing I probably won’t be…but just getting that NP thyroid out of my system was what got me feeling better. Whatever they put in there WAS and IS making us VERY sick! Within 48 hours my nausea was gone and my appetite returned. I had been taking at least 2 Xanax a day (which I had NEVER had in my life), and I haven’t needed ONE since I stopped the NP. Within a week and a half I have also stopped the antidepressant (which again had never taken in all my years) and am perfectly myself again. I couldn’t get out of bed and could barely get in the shower or take care of my boys. Now I am right back to myself. I am sleeping through the night again and not waking with heart palpitations and anxiety. The more I think about it the more I am absolutely ENRAGED. As a teacher, I had people covering my class for me, thinking I was somehow having a nervous breakdown. I could have lost my job. This is not okay, and it scares me to think there are people that have no idea and are continuing to ingest this POISON. I keep thinking what could have happened to me had I continued to take this. I spent tons of money on therapy, doctors appointments, prescriptions, even thousands of dollars on a GeneSight test to find an antidepressant and anxiety medication that would work-All for NOTHING. Something needs to be done-they are making people EXTREMELY sick!!

          Reply
          • RC Mandalay

            Hi Jeni,

            I had the same exact experience as you after switching to Armour. As mentioned in my original comment, above, I was experiencing anxiety, heart palpitations, weepiness, acid reflux, digestive upset / diarrhea daily, etc, on the last couple of batches of NP Thyroid but did not connect it with the NP Thyroid until checking in here on STTM.

            As mentioned, my drug chemist boyfriend said that the NP Thyroid smelled like free amines (that’s the cat pee smell) suggesting something is very wrong with these NP Thyroid pills. After switching to Armour (which I have never taken before) I felt completely fine within two days. Able to sleep; heart rate went from 110-beats BPM to 65 BPM; no more digestive upset, acid reflux, anxiety, depression, or weepiness (thank goodness for that, given I’m a therapist – I also could have become unable to work had this continued were I to have remained on the NP Thyroid).

            At this point, I feel strongly that something is very, very wrong with the NP Thyroid pills and they need to be recalled immediately. This needs to be taken very seriously. In the meantime, I’ll know in four weeks when I get my labs done how my levels are and if Armour will work for me – Of course, even if it does, we never know when we will have something happen that results in our being unable to take it and/or access it. I can’t take synthetics and I have no compounding rx available where I live. This is getting scary and I feel angry that we are put in this position. To have our concerns dismissed or to be viewed as ‘histrionic’ is unacceptable and simply victimizes us twice. Enough is enough.

    • Angie F.

      Free amines…Could “ractopamine” be one? Beta adrenergic agonist used in beef, pork, and large fowl feed as a “pro-lean” and weight gain additive?

      Reply
    • Teresa

      Hello R.C., Thanks for telling us about this. I was researching something different and came across this brief description on a website devoted to probiotics: “When protein-rich foods are fermented, they can produce biogenic amines like antihistamine and tryptamine. Some studies suggest that these amines can affect your central nervous system and either increase or decrease blood flow, which can cause headaches or migraines.” Could the pig meat used in China be old or allowed to ferment? Headaches are one of the constellation of symptoms experienced by many NP users. Let’s dig around into this subject.

      Reply
    • housemaid

      Well, the FDA letter about the Sitchuan Friendly porcine powder said that the Chinese factory was not using good manufacturing practices and was unsanitary. I picture big vats of rotting pig thyroids in that factory. I only took one bad batch NP pill and would not take another. If I’d gotten rotten meat at the grocery I would have returned it and gotten my money back, but Acella is offering no refunds.

      I am worried about Thyroid-S, Janie. I recently chewed one made July 2019 and it reminded me of the bad taste that the new NP has, only milder. I didn’t smell anything but had just opened the bottle. The bad NP didn’t smell at first but 3 months later it reeked. Is the Thailand thyroid powder from Thailand or China? My 2016 Nature-throid has no smell or taste. The WP I used to take only tasted sweet. Did Thyroid-S always have a somewhat unpleasant taste?

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        As far as the taste, we have to be careful, as even some of the former good NP’s tasted different or “bad”. I have some old NP left, and it doesn’t taste great—I chewed it again to see. And that’s always been common. But with the changed NP, the taste is worse than bad. It’s horrific.

        As far as Thyroid-S, I only rarely used it. I’ve always had plenty of the former good prescription NDTs. And when I did use Thyroid-S, I never chewed it to taste it.

        I am frankly worried about being on any NDT. Even if Thyroid-S is working…and even if Armour is working for some (though not all), and even if compounding pharmacies still have a working source of thyroid powder via the PCCA…..the haunting question lingers all around us i.e. when are THEY going to change to the crap NDT we are seeing with so many and we only find out with a new bottle?

        Something verrry fishy is going on…and no, people need to get away from stating it’s a conspiracy to get us all off NDT. There is no proof whatsoever. But something is very fishy with how porcine powder has changed for so many pharmaceuticals…and with NP, on top of CLEAR other changes—the smell, the taste, the burning, the nausea.

        The FDA goes around reporting all the bad things going on with other medications…(For example, Metformin, especially outside the US, having a carcinogen in it.) So where is the FDA about all this TOTAL AND COMPLETE CRAP going on with the very NDT that once changed our lives??

        Reply
        • Janet

          I agree, I think it probably comes down to trying to save money on raw materials and increase the supply to meet the demand. First it happened with Nature-Throid last year and you’d think Acella would have learned from that debacle. But then they did the same thing. So we jump ship to find the next safe thing and then the demand goes up and it starts all over again.

          People seem to think Europe as a supplier is better than China, but it all depends on the quality of the handling and processing. Russia, Ukraine, Croatia, Serbia, Turkey, Albania, etc are all European countries. We have no idea what kind of oversight there would be.

          They know what suppliers and formulations worked well for us before the changes. If they would emulate those conditions then maybe we’d get back to decent meds again. What concerns me is that no one is required to provide proof of purity and lack of contamination or degradation.

          Reply
    • Person

      This is what’s been going on with me, too… oh, the heart palpitations! I’ve been on NP thyroid since 2012, and until recently, this medicine’s been great. In my mid thirties, have never had palpitations before, and suddenly with this new batch of NP I’m a wreck. What in the world have they done to the medicine…? Something is very different and wrong with this new batch.

      Reply
  78. Kendra Bauser

    Update: Switched from the new NP Thyroid which I had been taking for a week to compounded thyroid in a sublingual form.
    Three days on the compounded and I am feeling back to normal.

    The first night I took the new NP I hardly slept and contiued to sleep badly while taking it. Digestion slowed down significantly. Adrenals totally malfunctioned and I felt adrenaline rushes constantly (I am also on Cortisol 20mg day). Other symptoms were very itchy skin, dry skin, foot tendon injury that wouldnt heal properly.

    Three days on new compounded formula, slept normally on the third day. Felt great at the gym but maybe a little hyper. Didnt crash in the afternoon during the second day. Hunger is way back, digestion is much better. Skin feels better. Mood is more positive. Foot pain is gone as of today (3rd day) But I have been resting it.

    I never took the new NP long enough to do labs but I was in really bad shape after a week. Ill get my labs done after a few weeks on this compounded formula. Getting it through Pavillion Pharmacy in Atlanta GA. The Pharmasist was very knowledgable about thyroid and takes it herself. She’s a body builder as well and she was very sympathetic and familiar with my (and other patients) situation.

    Reply
    • Antoinette

      Hi ive heard of compounded thyroid…but only in caps..you can get it made to take sublingually?im very interested in this what pharmacy does that?thanks

      Reply
    • Amy Lynn

      @Kendra are you doing compounded porcine, or synthetic t3 & t4 compounded? If porcine, do you know the source? (PCCA porcine is what I’m on from another local compounding pharmacy, but thinking of switching pharmacies because mine doesn’t appear to be accredited in any way.)

      Reply
      • Kendra

        It’s not the pcca porcine. And I’m back to feeling horribly. Migrane for two days. Fatigued. Seeing my doc tomorrow and may switch to armour even tho I did horribly on it before. Not fun

        Reply
        • Amy

          Thank you for the response, Kendra. I didn’t do well on reformulated Armour either, & probably won’t go with Pavilion for compounding for myself now based on your experience. I’m sorry you’re feeling bad again before the holidays, you’re right, not fun! Hope you find a good source/thyroid med combination that helps you feel better soon!

          Reply
    • Kate

      Hi Kendra,
      I too have extremely itch skin since taking NP. Did yours stop right away one you got off the NP? When I google itching it keeps leading me to other issues (like lymphoma) and can’t seem to find much about itching and NP. However, none of this started till I got on NP Thyroid. Thanks!

      Reply
  79. Frankie Beckwith

    And yet, I see no relevant information regarding WP, which also has changed. I was doing fine on it, but when my refill arrived the new pills are darker in color than previously and my TSH tripled! So what is going on with WP???

    Reply
  80. Megan

    Thanks for this. Noticed everything mentioned and have been feeling so much worse since at least Summer) which explains why. Switching to synthetic t3/t4 but am confused b/c I did the math of how much of the synthetics I would need, but doctor is givine me MUCH less saying that Cytomel and Tirosint are much stronger than the generic versions (ie i am currently on 150 t4 and 55 T3 with NP, but they are perscribing 50 t4, and 10 t3). Have you heard of this before? I’m worried to make the switch b/c this seems very low to me. Anyone have advice or heard of the same? Thank you!

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Yes, in some cases, they can be better than generics version. BUT NOT ALWAYS! This is why everyone who switches needs to keep track of their labs and get optimal by them. And if they prove to be too low, you have to be FIRM with your doctor where your frees need to be to feel your best and maintain it! https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
  81. Janet

    This is my first week using the combination of Synthroid and Armour. I didn’t tolerate any of the T3 products because of an allergic reaction to the calcium sulfate filler. Compounded is still an option but I will have to pay cash for it.

    I haven’t used Armour in many years, but am doing fine with it. There’s just a very slight piggy taste like NP before the change. I scrape the very thin polymer coating off the tablet with a sharp knife (it’s called opadry white) and then it dissolves fine on my tongue. It doesn’t contain any sugar so it’s not sweet but no unpleasant taste.

    My symptoms are under control, body temperature normal and I feel okay energy wise. The depression I had experienced on the newer NP lots is gone. I think there is a contaminant causing brain swelling. That happened to me once years ago with NatureThroid but only with one lot number. I reported it to the FDA and the lot numbers I got after that were okay (the bottle I had was apparently tested but I wasn’t given the results).

    I’ll get my bloodwork redone in a couple of weeks and see where I’m at with the T3. When I was on Synthroid alone (which my doctor asked me to try) my muscles were so stiff I tore a lot of ligaments and tendons. I think that convinced him I needed the NDT as well.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Did you try getting optimal on Armour alone?? Some say they have been able to. This is what I mean why optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal It’s important to get the free T3 optimal especially.

      You have to be careful adding T4 to what is already 80% T4. Otherwise, RT3 can go up. So watch that.

      Reply
    • Antoinette

      Hi when you made the switch from np to armour..did you have to take more or same dosage?thanks

      Reply
      • Janet

        Antoinette, I’m completely on Armour now and am using the same dose as I was on for NP. So far I’m doing okay but the real test for me is how I feel when I’m exercising and it’s been too cold to really push that to see how my muscles are affected. I’ll be getting new labs soon and might be adding T3 like Janie suggested if those levels aren’t optimal.

        Reply
  82. fliss peck

    Janie I need some advice if possible please.
    I switched over from NP thyroid which was making me really ill to synthetics 4 weeks ago. I was on 4.5 NDT happily for years always optimal bloods. I had my bloods done last week so 3 weeks on T4 150mcg and t3 35mcg which you advised. im gutted as my bloods are awful worst ive ever had and im so tired all the time. hair still falling-out lost so much now nails breaking….
    its UK reference so ive added the range;
    FT3; 3.1 (3.1-6.8) so right at bottom and always used to be near the top. TSH: 0.02 (0.2-4.2)
    FT4; 10.8 (12-22) so under range and always used to be near top.
    so what do I do now? does this mean that synthetics aren’t going to work for me in case what do I do? or do they need more time? but the FT4 being under range must mean I need way more t4 is that right? if so how much? and the t3 is com ing from the conversion which looks like it isn’t happen ing is that right? so I need way more t3 and if so how much? should I just stop the t4 and do t3 only? although I know my dr won’t fund that he only agreed to a trial if I took t4 and t3…. please help me interpret these and advice how much more of each I should take and if you think they will start working soon? I see dr tomorrow so if you have time to comment today would be really helpful.. probably could persuade him to let me try armour which is one NDT I haven’t tried and many in the UK say it works if you crunch it? but feel I should give synthetics more time and increase if that’s what’s needed? the strange thing is that my basal body temp is always good now at 36.7-36.8 each morning and pulse and BP are perfect too…whats going on? I took my T4 24 hours before blood test and my last dose of t3 at 5pm then blood test next morn ing at 10am….was that ok? thanks . fliss

    Reply
    • fliss peck

      hi Janie did you see my results I posted ? I would really appreciate your advice and comments in reply to my questions as im so confused as to what’s going on and why my free t3 and t4 are so low. I am seeing dr today was hoping to take what you advise to him …I will wait for your reply
      thanks
      fliss

      Reply
    • fliss peck

      hi Janie ..you asked me to keep you posted when I had any results which I have done and I was wondering why you hadn’t replied to my post? I hope you’re ok …..please when you get a moment would you give me your valued advice as I am confused why values are so low and what to do , was it means as per questions in my post.
      thanks
      fliss

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        Hi there Fliss. 🙂 Please know that in addition to running this by myself, I have my hands in many pies of my activism, not just here. I also have an active private life, too, just like anyone else. 🙂 Because of all that, I may be delayed in answering posts at times.

        Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi Fliss. When the frees aren’t where we need them to be, we just raise. I won’t be able to say how much as we are all learning together on this. You just have to keep track of your labs. Yes, what you did with labs was fine.

      Reply
  83. Alex

    To all who still has energy to fight! As Acella claims that “…the Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient (API) is now sourced from an FDA-inspected facility in Europe”, but refuses to appoint the country and producer of the NDT powder, perhaps should we try to write there and ask whats going on:

    https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/partners-networks/international-activities/bilateral-interactions-non-eu-regulators/united-states

    Reply
  84. S. Hack

    Can someone please message me with a trusted place to get Thyroid-S? Anyone switched to that and doing good? I’m about out of my good NP and refuse to ingest anything that smells of cat pee (I have 60 of the bad tablets). I can’t switch to the synthetic’s due to allergic reactions. It give me panic attacks every time a company reformulates and about kills us and then we have to use all our energy searching for a replacement. We’ve run out of good NDT replacement’s now. I’m a pre 2009 Armour lover. Oh how I wish we could have the good stuff back.

    Reply
  85. Jeni

    I have started having major anxiety and depression…crying spells. Doctor put me on Xanax and an antidepressant. I asked to have my thyroid labs checked since the only time in my life I have every experienced depressive feelings was 20 years ago when I first was diagnosed with hypothyroidism.
    My labs all came back in the normal range, and I have not been able to figure out what in the heck happened to me in the past 2 months. I even started dealing with major insomnia which I have never experienced either.
    Something told me to look up my thyroid medication and sure enough I found others reporting the same thing in the past 2 months! I ran and checked my bottle to see when I had it filled-August 27th-and the last 2 1/2 months have been complete hell filled with anxiety, constant tears, and depression. I am also extremely nauseous in the AM. I found an old pill compared to the new one and its exactly like your pictures above!
    Now I just have to figure out what to do-what in the world do we change to??? I only ever took Armour before NP.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Armour with T3 until optimal.
      Or, T3 and T4 until optimal.

      https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
      • Jeni

        Janie..
        Armour by itself…
        Or do you mean Armour with added T3?
        And when you say T3 and T4, are you referring to synthetic? I know our options are lessening….

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          You can try armour by itself but work to get optimal if you can. Or you can try armour with T3 and work to get optimal. Or you can do the two synthetics and get optimal. 🙂

          Reply
    • Kendra

      Ugh, that may explain my horrible insomnia as well. I literally havent slept much since my first dose. I am having air hunger at they gym and itchy. I just got a script for pcca thyroid compounded into a sublingual tablet, Ill probably be starting today. Ill post my labs. Dont have any from the new NP because Ive only been on it for a week. My first symptoms with the cat pee ones were slow digestion and no hunger.

      Reply
    • Janet

      Jeni, I have never been treated for depression but late summer and fall started having severe depression for no obvious reason. When I got of NP it immediately went away. That really makes me think there is some sort of contaminant in the product cause brain inflammation.

      Reply
      • Angie F.

        Janet, that’s interesting. I did not have depression on the new NP. In fact, except for BP and cardiac (PACs and potentially paroxysmal A-fibbing) issues, I felt pretty good. I did have some nausea occasionally and the stuff did taste like a cross between rotten pineapple and cat pee. I’ve posted here several times that I believe (and I believe it even more given the ear ringing/ototoxic related comments) that we may be dealing with a contamination issue..Could be solvents a/o other meds involved, incidentally two of the things that Sichuan was called out for by the FDA. I don’t know if these meds contain raw product from Sichuan. Also, I’ve posted about the ractopamine issue (Feed additive in pork, beef, and large fowl). If interested, you can Google that as well.

        I’ve managed to get my hands on a few of the old Naturethroid (not yet expired, but from a batch that I either didn’t have problems with, or didn’t notice that I did). I’m trying that for a couple of weeks to see how I do.

        Right now, I’ve had to, to avoid the serious cardiac issues and very high BPs, cut back to about 1 1/8 gr of N-T. Can’t seem to raise beyond that on NP, N-T or Armour and not going to until I’ve gotten cortisol checked out (I’ve done iron and I’m now a bit on the low side again).

        Reply
      • Jeni

        Janet-
        I switched to Armour, within a week I cannot believe how different I feel. I am back to myself-no need for Xanax, and am almost scaled off the antidepressant completely. This is unacceptable. I could barely get through a day, I literally lost the last two months of my life. My therapist wanted me out on medical, but as a teacher I would not have gotten paid. I am fuming mad. I had no appetite, couldn’t eat, couldn’t sleep. They even gave me a sleep medication-and that barely worked. Now I am right back to myself. This is NOT okay.

        Reply
  86. Jernye Swin-Dell

    I did a search looking for answers about some of the problems I’ve been having and wondered if they were NP related. I’ve just up my dosage of NP thyroid for 30mg to about 45mg. I’ve been o30 mg for about 1 yr. I too have noticed that the NP smells really fishy for quite some time now. In the last 2 days since I’ve up the dosage to 45mg my skin is really itchy and very dry. Also for the last 30 days I’ve been dealing with continual bouts of pseudogout (gout in the knees) and in the heel and in the hip and perhaps Rheumatoid Arthritis. After I’ve read about 1/3 of the comments and wanted to ask has anyone else had flaris of any kind of arthritis and does your pea smell like a cat’s pea when a cat is ill? Oddly mine does and that’s never happened before and I don’t have any animals…I’m alergic to dogs and cats.

    Reply
    • Selene

      My experience is that when my thyroid meds are close to being optimal my adjustments from the DO (OMM = Osteopathic Manual Manipulation) hold and if not there’s a lot of joint pain and subluxations. Also skin very itchy +++.

      Reply
      • ate

        Hi Selene, did your itchiness stop once off the NP? I am going CRAZY with the itch. Only thing that calms it is Benadryl.

        Reply
    • Angela F

      I have had what may have been gout or gout-like symptoms in my elbow, particularly right. Also, right now, even on old N-T (Not NP), my urine smells really foul…I wouldn’t call it “cat pee” smell, just really like something isn’t right. I have had that before all these problems, though, and typically would happen at about the same time every month.

      I also had some itchiness on/off with one of the post March 2019 fills of NP.

      Reply
  87. Kendra

    I have recieved the cat pee NP thyroid as well. Only been on it for 4 days but looking for an alternative. Seeing my doc on monday but trying to formulate a plan in the meantime.
    Synthetics are looking good even tho I tanked on synthroid years ago. I never tried it with t3 as well so may be my answer. Has anyone done well on synthetics? I guess they wont be on this forum if they are!! ha

    How does the PCCA natural thyroid look? I may try a compound, and if i do the compound of PCCA natural, do I need to take more since I have to swallow it?

    Thank you!

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      PCCA is still providing a working porcine powder for compounders. Their source is different than what pharmaceuticals have even using, apparently.

      Reply
      • Julie

        Do you know where their porcine powder comes from? Is it a trustworthy source? Is there any type of bovine source thyroid med?

        Reply
      • Selene

        I spoke to my compounding pharmacist recently who has quality/consistency/future availability concerns about porcine powder for compounders…

        Over 2 decades on NDT and did well, then all the issues reported below. Naturethroid> Westroid Pure> Naturethroid> Acella. Now working to find my way through compounded synthetic T4/T3. 1st labs were in range but not optimal – still felt off. Continual fine tuning. Will continue to report.

        Reply
  88. Iva

    I’ve been taking armor for years summer of 2017 all of a sudden they switched me to Acella The smell and the taste was horrendous. For me my hair started falling out which is never happened before I didn’t know why. And then I related it to Kaiser Pharmacy switching me from armour to Acella. I tried taking my bottles in and insisting that the pharmacy smells my pills but they wouldn’t do it. It was a dark time in my life. I wrote my doctor and told her look they gave me Acella formula 6 months ago and I’m losing my hair who knows what else is going wrong. So I need you to prescribe only Armour brand. She did and things got back to normal eventually. Then they started charging me an arm and a leg and I told them look I’ve tried your other stuff and I can’t use it so I did pay the bigger price. But eventually I change the tablet milligram and ended up getting it for $35 instead of $132. It’s a constant battle trying to get it for $35 sometimes I can sometimes I can’t

    Reply
    • Kendra Bauser

      Im thinking about Armour again even after It made me hypo before. How do you take the armour pill? chew? swallow? also do you need more medication to get an optimal result?

      Reply
  89. Rebecca

    I have been taking Accella NP thyroid for approximately 5 years always 60mg and three a day.. Never had a problem. Sometime around May of this year I noticed a smell difference, then after dosing with my 3 pills I got nauseous, then later I got so sick I would throw up. I had always popped 3 pills under my tongue before I ate, now I have to take one pill at a time and make sure that I eat something beforehand, if I don’t then it’s back to upset stomach and throwing up. I really don’t know what to do but this has got to stop.

    Reply
  90. Rae Miller

    I switched to Armour 60 mg twice a day about 3 weeks ago (same dose as I was on before), and have been doing fine; maybe even better than on NP Thyroid. No lab tests/results yet. I’ll wait to get labs until after the Thanksgiving holiday. So far, so good. I’m taking it sublingually, even though it doesn’t dissolve— it just turns into a paste, but at least it’s not chunky or smelly in any way.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi Rae, Remember that most everyone will feel good on doses that aren’t yet optimal, thus it eventually backfires, we have noted for years. So it’s a good thing you are checking the free T3 and free T4 after the holidays. This page explains where you want to be to prevent an eventual backfire: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
      • Rae Miller

        My results from MedLab 11/29: T3 REVERSE 14 (8-25); T4FREE 1.0 (0.8-1.8) ng/dL; T3 FREE 3.1 (2.3-4.2) pg/mL. i can’t remember what calculation you do with the RT3… Do I need this test? I didn’t do a TSH because that’s always low.
        This is with Armour only 60mg 2x day. What do you think so far? I’ve been using Armour instead of NP. Previous post Nov 10 has some previous labs. Thank you.

        Reply
  91. Michelle

    Anyone else experience a burning (almost like reflux feeling) when taking the new NP sublingually? The taste on these new pills was the first clue something was wrong but I’ve been getting a burning pain in my throat too each time I take them. I haven’t experienced any other side effects yet since I had some good pills until just recently so am waiting to see what happens. I was on armour for years until they reformulated back in ’09 and then my numbers went all screwy so was switched to Erfa which was wonderful until ‘14 and then started getting hives when they reformulated. WP didn’t work for me (broke out my skin horribly and gave me stomach pains I think from the lactose?) NP has given me no problems and now to find out they screwed it up is so upsetting. I recently learned I was very deficient in iodine so began the iodine protocol (starting slowly). Has this improved anyone’s hypo symptoms to lessen the need for thyroid? I’m hoping it might so even with the change I can stay afloat. I’m allergic to synthetic thyroid (tried several brands of both t3 and t4 and they all cause me massive air hunger with difficulty breathing). I’m considering thyro-gold if there’s no other option!?!

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Yes, many have experienced that burning with NP Thyroid—and it’s a symptom that Acella has so far avoided addressing (which patients find to be a concern). It’s one of many reasons patients are moving to other alternatives, like T4 and T3 and getting optimal.

      Reply
      • Michelle

        Thank you for responding and all the time you spend in researching, informing and helping patients! It’s sad that we now don’t have a single NDT that hasn’t been messed with. I really do wonder if the swine fever that has destroyed so much of the pig population is playing a role in the issues with NP. The news reports show is has spread well beyond China and is in areas of Europe. If it’s in Europe where NP is located I wonder if the “clean up” process is what is contaminating the porcine powder? I’m thinking of trying armour again (along with cellulase) or having it compounded but wondering if this is in fact a contamination issue with the porcine powder that the same issues could develop with other brands if they get the same supply? If I try armour again using cellulase do people take the cellulase enzyme at the same time? Can compounded be taken sublingually by opening the capsules (wondering the same with thyro-gold if I decide to not chance another porcine based option)? When I swallow it my hypo symptoms get way worse and my free Ts drop much lower so I have to take it sublingually.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Armour is the only one that still may work. Others are adding T3 to it. Either way, get those frees optimal. Yes about pouring the contents of compounded under tongue. Might taste funky though unless they add a sweetener.

          Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          I replied to this but not seeing it. So if I’m wrong and I did post, some of this will be a repeat.

          Yes, it’s terribly sad. As I saw each of them tumble downward, I was at least glad that NP was still around being so excellent. But when even NP changed, and changed WORSE than all the others with its burning when swallowing, burning in the stomach, nausea, horrible smell, horrible taste…and the bad return of hypo in so many…it was now anger-producing. The icing on the cake has been how Acella has responded about it all…

          Yes, I think it might be a great idea to take cellulase with Armour. Yes, compounded can be opened and poured into the mouth, but it might taste bad….

          Reply
          • Michelle

            Thank you! I think I’ll talk to my compounding pharmacy and see if they can do a compounded without a cellulose filler using NDT and if not then try the armour/cellulase combo. Wish I could take synthetic t3 to help my t3 but I’ve got an allergy to every synthetic I’ve tried (both t4 & t3 caused me to daily gasp for air- worst year of my life!). I hope something works!

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Hi. Is is possible that you were gasping for air (sounds awfu!) on synthetics because you were underdosed? Air hunger is common for some when they take too little, which will make them even more hypo.

          • Michelle

            I have experienced exercise induced asthma from my thyroid being low but this was very different. I had been on Armour for 3 years without any issues until I got Lyme (but didn’t know it was that at the time) and my thyroid went screwy. I was referred to a different endo who switched me to levo and within the first week I had 4 panic attacks and felt like I had someone sitting on my chest and couldn’t breathe. Tried another brand with the same experience and even though my numbers and other hypo symptoms were still bad on the armour I never had that before or after switching back. About a year later they tried adding some t3 to my armour because upping my dose just increases my reverse t3 and from the first small addition of only 2.5mcg the breathing issues started again. Gradually made my way up to 30mcg while remaining on the armour and even though my free t3 got to over 4 (I tend to hover around 2.3-2.6 normally) the air hunger got worse and worse and not a single one of my hypo symptoms improved. I had to gradually lower it to get off and once I was back to armour only the breathing issues disappeared. We couldn’t figure out a common denominator as far as fillers other than my body must just reject synthetic entirely. It was a terrible experience!

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            If upping your dose increases RT3, you need to treat the cause. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/reverse-t3

            If your free T3 goes up like that on a small amount, you need to see if you have cortisol issues, which is likely: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info

          • Michelle

            Thank you! Yes I have a couple different things contributing to the rT3 problem so it’s been tricky trying to control them all. Undiagnosed Lyme started everything (just thought I had an allergic reaction to some mosquito bites). Then very high estrogen causing extremely heavy periods that kills my iron (ferritin got down to 5 and iron serum to 18 before doctors stepped in). It’s been difficult trying to get my estrogen down/balanced but I’m continuing to try to work on that- unfortunately being hypo can also increase estrogen and since the two feed off each other that’s why this NP issue is so terrible! I can’t afford to get more hypo. My adrenals are also playing a role not only from the Lyme but also some personal stress I’m under currently so I just started taking ashwagandha to see if that can help calm my stress to more manageable levels. Hopefully one day I can get it all sorted- lots of trial and error but at least I know the sources now so that’s one battle down.

  92. Nancy Jo Carter

    Please help. My endocrinologist is totally clueless. Levothyroxin was not converting for me, so switched to NP thyroid 90mg ONCE A DAY. When I requested testing for free t4 and T3 along with reverse T3, they sent me 8 pigs telling me why I did not need these tests. Especially reverse T3! They have no concept of grains or twice daily dosing. They are dosing in a m just like when on levothyroxin. I am literally dying here. ME/ CFS. Bedbound, strange bumps over arms and legs, almost cyst like. Endocrinologist is also my PCP. Any help or advice appreciated. They are very dismissive and arrogant when questioned.

    Reply
    • Renee

      Hi Nancy Jo. I’m so sorry for what you are going through. I have definitely been right where you are. I can tell you my story and how I got the help I needed. Also, Janie has a page on this site about how to find a doctor to help you. I know it’s difficult to even think straight when you feel so bad, but check out the page where Janie gives you tips about how to find a good doctor. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/how-to-find-a-good-doc/
      I also had issues converting the t4 in synthroid and had doctors that dismissed me, shamed me, upped my dosage and sent me into hyper mode giving me panic attacks and heart problems. On January 10, 2016, I woke up in the morning, opened my eyes, and my adrenaline immediately shot up to the point where I started screaming and thought I was going to die alone, right there in my bed. I called my dismissive doctor in hysterical tears, who told me to come in right away. She did an EKG and told me I was just having PVCs and prescribed 5 pills of xanax, patted me on my head and shooed me out of her office. I left feeling scared AND furious. I went home, got into bed, and started doing tons of research. Fear was a huge catalyst for me. I spent many many hours reading, researching and writing. I found Janie’s website and read everything. I found out that I was likely having an adrenal problem and probably a hormone imbalance. So, armed with a ton of information I started searching for a doctor. That wasn’t easy. I had one Naturopath tell me to just stop ALL my thyroid meds and all vitamins and supplements and soak in an epsom salts bath and just “breathe”. I went to a chiropractor, had acupuncture and every other sort of alternative treatment I could find, They were great, but none of them addressed my underlying problem. I finally found a nurse practitioner in my state who said she specialized in hormone imbalance and thyroid. I called her and made an appointment. I went to see her, sat across from her in her office and told her my story. She was the FIRST health practitioner who actually listened to me. She didn’t interrupt me, poo poo me, shame me or tell me to take epsom salt baths. She didn’t tell me to eat less and exercise more or drink more water. She didn’t tell me that PVCs and the mental and physical pain I had was just part of getting old and I should just accept it. She LISTENED to me, and at the end she told me that I was NOT crazy. She said it was clear to her that I was in real distress. She ordered the saliva adrenal sufficiency test, a hormone panel, the extensive thyroid panel and a bunch of other tests. I got my blood drawn and did the saliva test. Then one day her office called and asked me to come right away. I did. I got there and was sitting in the waiting room. I had my head down and she personally came out to greet me. She took me back to her office, sat me down and told me that I was very sick. My TSH was 95 (yep…95…not .95) and she said she was amazed that I was functioning at all. I also found out am homozygous for MTHFR C677T. I also have the Vitamin D genetic mutation. I ALSO found out that my body was making no progesterone, my estrogen with SKY HIGH, and I had almost no testosterone. She said my Vitamin D level was something like 20 when it should be much higher. I also found out that I had an adrenal sufficiency problem. My cortisol was high at night and low during the day. Everything was out of whack. The first thing she did was immediately put me on WP thyroid and 10,000 iu Vitamin D per day to start. About 20 minutes after I took my first dose of WP thyroid, that T3 hit my receptors and I FREAKED out. I called her screaming because my insides were zooming and I felt like my hair was on fire! I had no idea what was happening to me. She explained that I was getting NO T3 in the synthroid and the WP had t3 in it. She said it “woke up” those receptors and my body was just responding to it. LOL…so, she had me cut the pill into many tiny pieces to take throughout the day until my body could become accustomed to the T3. Within 2 weeks I had lost 12 pounds of fluid, the inflammation started going down in my body, my blood pressure came down, the adrenaline rushes stopped. Panic attacks eventually subsided. Once I was feeling a little better, she had me start on compounded natural progesterone and a low dose compounded topical testosterone cream to help with my hormonal imbalance, and I also started a methylated b-12 supplement and she had me go on the HCG diet, followed by a paleo type diet to help me lose more weight.. Over the span of 18 months, I lost over 60 pounds and went into remission. My body pain and all my symptoms went away. I felt better than I had in almost 2 decades. Then, unfortunately we all know what happened with WP thyroid and I ended up having to start all over again because I got really sick on Naturethroid. But, with NP, I am pretty much back to where I was with WP. I do have some problems with NP, but I can tolerate them pretty well. I haven’t been faced with having to take any of the speckled pills yet, so if and when that happens, I may have to reevaluate again.
      Bottom line, my advice to you, while you’re lying in bed or on the couch, is to start with Janie’s website. Read everything. Take notes. Arm yourself with information. Write down questions that you have. We just have GOT to become our own advocates. That is one thing I have learned through this process. Then start looking in your area for functional medicine doctors. Look at the other options that Janie mentions. I found that traditional endocrinologists are not helpful when dealing with difficult thyroid cases. And many of them are just stubborn and won’t listen. I found for myself that I did best with a doctor who listens and allows me to be a part of my own healing process. I wish you all the best and I hope this helps a little. Janie is a wealth of knowledge. Take advantage of the information she has so graciously put together here for all of us. I know it helped me tremendously. All my best!

      Reply
  93. Tania

    Hi All
    On the new batch of NP….smell getting worse on opened bottles, anyone else notice that ?
    I have added in 50 micrograms of Levothyroxine into my three grains of NP. I actually feel pretty good !!! I have had my TSH and T4 done , waiting for results. I will get a full panel done sone privately . But I wanted to say with the T4 added in, which mine was low, probably due to Cortisol, I am feeling back to virtually how I was feeling before the recipe change .
    I will report back with what Labs I get . I bought the Cytomel, but I will carry on on the NP, with the added in Levo if I feel back to feeling good. I’m not sure I want to go the whole nine yards of Synthetics.
    BP, pulse everything good.
    Maybe it is not as potent ? But is it worth a full on over haul…I’m not too sure now /. AFTER I bought the Cytomel. Time will tell with Labs

    Reply
    • Janet

      Tania, I’m doing basically the same thing right now. I had about two weeks’ worth of older NP and after reacting to the generic Cytomel decided to use 1/2 dose Synthroid with 1/2 dose NP. I feel better than I have in ages. My Armour thyroid just came in so I’m going to do the same thing with that since my NP is running out. I’d like to try name brand Cytomel but it has the same filler ingredient (calcium sulfate) that I think I’m reacting to in the generics. For now if I can do half and half with synthetic and NDT I’ll be happy. I’ll get retested in a couple of weeks but I can definitely feel the difference.

      Oddly adding the Synthroid has really helped me with brain symptoms, but if I take it by itself I get a lot of muscle pain because T3 is so important for muscle function and repair.

      Reply
      • tania

        Hi Janet
        Thank you for the response. Can I ask were your lab results for T4 low on just the NDT ?
        I have an unopened bottle of Cytomel sat here …cost me an arm and a leg to buy it and get it to the UK, but….I feel good on the NP, at 3 Grains with the top up of Levo at 50Micros. It is a hard call, but if you feel good, you are loath to change it all up completely.
        Maybe, the NP will go back to how it was. But I have a lot of energy, my hair is good, no fluid retention. Brain fog??? Well…it’s always been a bit foggy. lol. Good luck in your journey. xx

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Tania, you most likely received a batch of the former NP.

          Reply
        • Janet

          Tania, my free T4 was always in the lower normal range on NDT even though TSH and T3 were optimal. It will be interesting to see if that changes with the Synthroid added (name brand). I do feel that the Synthroid really helped with brain symptoms, just not muscles. I have a muscle condition that requires optimal T3 or I get torn ligaments and tendons because my muscles seize up (it has to do with the sodium-potassium pump). So I kind of have a built-in test.

          Reply
  94. Lynn

    I ended up testing iron myself at home and got these result that seem normal based on what I interpreted from your wonderful sttm book. Just want to double check!

    iron 130 ug/dL. (30-160 ug/dL)
    Transferrin Saturation 43% (14-50%)
    TIBC 301.00 (220-430 ug/dL)
    Ferritin 84.00 ng/mL (15-150 ng/mL)

    I also am giving Armour a try.

    Reply
  95. Janet C.

    Very interesting article. I’ve been taking Canadian desiccated thyroid by Erfa – the tablet is marked ECI 30. Since the spring of this year (2019), I’ve been feeling so much worse on this medication. I’ve been feeling extremely exhausted and sluggish and most worrisome of all is I now experience tinnitus after taking 1/2 pill. I was diagnosed as being in the beginning stages of meniere’s disease one week ago. My symptoms started at the end of April and I’m now wondering if the DT is to blame? I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism in the spring of 2018 and have been taking the Erfa desiccated thyroid for 1.5 years. Any suggestions? I’d like to wean myself off of this medication and see if my meniere’s symptoms subside. Has anyone else experienced tinnitus after taking this medication?

    Reply
    • Angie F.

      I’ve noticed a ringing in the ears also..on ALL of the current dessicateds…And accompanying rise in BPs (about 20 pts systolic, about 15 points diastolic)…

      Reply
    • dorothy

      I wish we could go back to the old desiccated thyroid days before all these reformulations started. I lost my hearing suddenly in 2009 when armour reformulated. My hearing rebounded on WP thyroid. My vestibular symptoms returned on NP thyroid (when WP thyroid stopped production) and I’ve now switched to compounded synthetic. I’ve not been on it long enough to know if it will stabilize the tinnitus, dizziness, sweating, and disequilibrium. I’ve had ringing for years off and on for years also, and BP is higher when more hypo. Meniere’s can resolve itself when the thyroid is adequately treated. Hang in there…these are tough symptoms to manage.

      Reply
    • Beth Franke

      (Janie: I have two LOT#’s filled 7/3/19) I’m quite alarmed reading these comments about tinnitis. I’ve noticed this over a long time, and never would have connected these two things. I’m sitting in a silent house, and can notice the subtle high-pitched ringing in both ears as I type this. Within the past week, I had a very odd thing happen in my right ear after I added air to a Select Comfort/Sleep Number mattress, activating the compressor pump under the bed. When I released the compressor pump, which makes a considerable noise at a certain frequency & put my head on the pillow, I had a very strange buzzing vibration & sound in the right inner ear which continued for a couple minutes intermittently. I have never achieved ‘optimal FT3’ in 5 years… never above a 3.1 FT3 and always been under-dosed in my opinion regardless of product over 5-6 years: Levo 25mcg > 50mcg > 75 mcg > Synthroid 75mcg > NatureThroid 48mcg (right when it was bad that is what Dr. put me on & it took me 1 yr. of fighting for dosage increases to find out on STTM about all the problems) > 60mcg > 75mcg > NP Thyroid 90 mg (got my FT3 to a 2.9 on Quest ranges taking a 60 + a 15 — these were before the “smelly pill change” in July & were flat & oblong shape 60’s & I think round 15’s) > added Iodoral 12.5mg for 4.5 mos (too long) at same time I > NP Thyroid 120mg for 7 weeks, then reduced to 90mg for 3 mos. before testing again: recent labs dropped FT3 from 2.8 (June 2019) to 2.5 (Nov 2019) (FT3 range 2.3-4.2) on 90mg dose NP (taking 3x 30mg “cat pee” pellets which I filled in July 2019 (NOTE: they dispensed in original bottles, and I still have 2 empty ones! Filled 7/3/19 Walgreens 30mg NP Thyroid -round thick “cat pee” pellets- Exp. 12/2020 LOT M329A19-2 S/N 893087036441 GTIN 00342192329010 ). (bottle 2: Exp. 11/2020 LOT M329M18-1 S/N 463471262223 GTIN 00342192329010. Now I’m off the Iodoral / i-Throid (my iodine count went from 48 to 359 (range 52-109), although I took one pill the night before the labs…. & going back on 120mcg NP Thyroid (4x 30mg “cat pee” pellets filled in Nov 2019 and I just happened to think to check in on the thyroid forums and found all this… so upsetting, but if not for this & AFandTC FB pages, I would not know!!!! (So, THANK YOU!!) LABS: (6/21/19 when on what I feel was ‘older’ NP Thyroid 60mg +15mg) TSH .60 (.40-4.5) FT4 .9 (.8-1.8) FT3 2.8 (2.3-4.2) RT3 12 (8-25) iodine 48 (52-109) //// (11/24/19) TSH .92 (.4-4.5) FT4 .9 (.8-1.8) FT3 2.5 (2.3-4.2) RT3 11(8-25) iodine 359 (52-109) – possible skewed results, but laying off Iodoral for a while! (It did help though; at 4 weeks I felt my energy increase — should have tested sooner. At 7 weeks I got heart palpitations, so I cut back on the NP Thyroid from 120 > 90 & palpitations resolved). Walgreens does not keep Lot# or other data, and they said Acella will report it to FDA if there is a problem/no patient recourse on meds unless there is a known issue (“none reported yet” -per pharmacist) but here are the dates of my NP fills: NP Thyroid 60mg (1/13/19) // NP Thyroid 15mg (1/13/19) // NP Thyroid 30mg (5/1/19), {7/3/19} {10/7/19} – changes are subtle, but I’ve recently felt sluggish/brain foggy/fatigue again. The tinnitus has been going on a long time though -many many months- I just did not connect it to the meds.// ( ) = okay { } = “cat pee” smell/taste My Walgreens Pharmacist said he would report what I gave him (per above 2 bottles).

      Reply
  96. Julie

    My new refill was purchased Oct 17, 2019. The lot number is M331G19-5. I have felt horrible since starting! And it tastes/smells horrible. I currently have a terrible cough and feel very rough (I rarely rarely get sick and no one else in my family has this). I’m definitely switching!

    Reply
    • Tonia

      I have a cough as well and got sick almost immediately after starting my Oct 10th refill. Actually, I think I was already exposed to something while traveling and didn’t start my new bottle until I got back. Within a few days, I was experiencing symptoms of a cold. By that weekend, it was even worse. I didn’t start the new stuff until 10/23 and was sick by Monday, 10/25. This past Monday, I had my appointment with my hormone doc and told her what was going on. They switched me to WP Thyroid (my request, as I did well on it before the shortage), I started those pills on Wednesday, and by Thursday I was already feeling better. Brain fog was gone, and I could focus again.

      Reply
      • Julie

        That’s interesting that you had a cough too! When did that stop? I switched back to levoxyl only bc I don’t know what else to take! It’s been about 48hours and cough is still there but I’m feeling a little better.

        Reply
        • Rachel

          I just tried my new bottle and god the smell and taste!! Put them side by side and saw the broad mottled change. I just went through this last year with Naturethroid and I can’t metabolize the synthetics!! What am I going to do???? Also just went through this with klinopin being bought out and they claim it’s the same but everyone has return of symptoms

          I also have vertigo and tinnitus!!

          Reply
  97. Christine

    I am taking the cat pee smelling NP thyroid now since early September and although they smell disgusting my most recent labs are consistent and have been great. No change in lab values and I still feel great.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Post your lab results with ranges. That is not enough information.

      And I think many of us would be worried as to what we’re swallowing if it smells or tastes that bad.

      Reply
      • christine

        FT3 3.9 (2.2 – 4.2), Ft 4 1.4 (0.8-1.8) , TSH 0.05 on 120 mg I am sorry if this is a positive comment.. i just thought it would help some to know not all is lost in some cases…and yes I know very well what I am swallowing !

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Why in the world would you apologize for a positive comment? lol.

          But no, you really don’t know what you are swallowing. They seem to dodge explaining that. What is exactly causing the horrid taste? What is exactly causing the horrid smell? And you are swallowing it. On and on.

          The bottom line is that for what appears to be the majority, the changed NP is not doing the job, besides causing problems for too many. And the second bottom line is that NDT’s used to not be like this.

          Reply
          • Lynn

            Glad for you! Are you taking any supplements that might be helping?

        • Lynn

          I know that not everyone will go with this but my chiropractor did blind muscle testing with me on a bunch of medicines and supplements. The non smelly old NP was positive but the new smelly NP and strangely progesterone were not. The synthetic T3/T4 and synthroid were also positive for me.

          Reply
        • Tania

          Hi Christine
          Thanks for your input, they are perfect labs !!
          I have to say, My T4 on the NP has never been great, always low. So I have added in 50 Micrograms of Levo, and I am back to feeling great again. TBH, the taste does not bother me at all, so long as it works. Maybe we just have to stick with it ?? But if I had those Labs i wouldn’t change anything if I were you . x

          Reply
          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Do understand that we don’t know what we are swallowing with NP. It taste horrible, it smells horrible. NDT never, ever used to have either. And a large body are seeing a return of hypo. That alone is causing patients to avoid its

      • bcostigan

        Interesting to see that posters values are doing great on NP Thyroid. I have a bit of a different tale…I’m in the early stages my hypothyroid. I started 1.5 grains of Armour in March. I wasn’t feeling relieve so I did blood work early October. Blood results from 1.5 grains of Armour in the AM on an empty stomach:

        FT3 – 3.4 (2.3 – 4.2 pg/ml)
        FT4 – 1.1 (0.8 – 1.8 ng/dl)
        RT3 – 15 (8 – 25 ng/dl)
        TSH – 0.90 (0.40 – 4.5 mIU/L)

        The doc agreed to up my dose to 1.5 grains in the AM and 1 grain in the afternoon. This is where things get funky. They called in Armour to the pharmacy. There was a back order for Armour, so the pharmacy thought NP Thyroid was an equivalent fill, so they gave me that. I immediately read all this stuff here and had some pee smelling pills too…either way, I took 2.5 grains of NP for 2 months and felt no different. I just ran blood work – RT3 is pending, but here are the others on 2.5 grains of NP:

        FT3 – 3.5 (2.3 – 4.2 pg/ml)
        FT4 – 1.0 (0.8 – 1.8 ng/dl)
        RT3 – Pending
        TSH – 0.37 (0.40 – 4.5 mIU/L)

        Unless my RT3 has shot way up, it appears the new NP Thyroid is way under-dosed…the other thing I find interesting is my TSH dropped quite a bit, but nothing else really improved.

        I requested to have my script re-filled as Armour and the pharmacy obliged and didn’t even charge me for the re-fill.

        I’m following this thread to see if there are improvements in NP since it is cheaper than Armour, it would be nice to have that option.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          So far, patient reports show nothing seems to have changed with the new, less effective NP Thyroid. And the path seems to be going the same direction that it has gone with the other, now less effective NDTs from other pharmaceuticals…a complete failure to acknowledge the high percentage of patients who have gone south on what used to do them well. NDT is simply not the quality and consistent product it used to be, and it appears that pharmaceuticals could care less, say patients.

          Reply
  98. Pam

    I was doing well on the NP Thyroid until 3 month ago when i noticed the terrible smell.
    I noticed every time I took the pill my stomach got so upset first I thought i had a stomach virus but soon I figured it out that it was related to the NP thyroid. My labs went down even increasing the dose did not help. I switched to Armour and my stomach pain went away already feeling better again.
    Not sure what the did to the NP thyroid but whatever it is it made me feel awful

    Reply
  99. Catherine

    I was previously on NP thyroid and got very sick from it. I switched to compounded pcca United States sources porcine powder with glycine for the last two and a half months on 3 and a half grains and have been doing ok. I just received a refill and the smell is very different. Normally there is little smell and it is slightly sweet. This time it smells slightly like cat litter. It is a fishy sort of rotten smell. I called the pharmacist and he denied getting a new batch of powder and said it was from the same batch as last time. I am not sure if I believe him.Has anyone else who made the switch to Compunded NDT powder experienced this? I am seriously thinking about switching to a Tirosint and Cytomel combination as I cannot live like this.

    Reply
    • Janet

      I think there is something that has changed in the extraction process for the raw materials. I left a message with Acella yesterday asking if they had done a full toxicology test to be sure there were no contaminants making us sick, but no one has responded.

      I was doing well with name brand Synthroid and SigmaPharm generic Cytomel combination, but then started reacting to the filler in the Cytomel (calcium sulfate). My reactions got too severe to continue, so now we’re going to try half Synthroid and half Armour and see if I tolerate that. My husband uses Armour and it’s not too bad as far as the smell yet. But I am allergic to the opadry white which is a BPA based coating on the surface so I have to scrape it off with a knife. This is such a pain!

      Reply
  100. Tania

    Hi
    I’ve been adding Levothyoxine 50MCG’s to my three grains of NP now for a week, I still feel hypo, but not as much. Waiting to see my Doctor Tuesday, to let them know I want to go back on Levo, and I will be adding in T3 myself, as I doubt they will fund this on the NHS . Before I take the plunge back to the Levothyroxine nightmare , which was TSH of 6, a Free T4 of 27, Free T3 below the bottom of the range on 185MCG’s of Levo….and huge Thyroid dumps, and never feeling great tbh. I have heard a few people mention Thyroid-s on here recently from Thailand.
    I’m thinking that would be a much easier route for me than the whole switch to synthetics again . Can anyone tell me if you are on Thyroid-s how you are doing on it ? Where you buy it from, if you do? And….did you switch from another NDT ? And did you have to up the dose ?
    Thanks in advance

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Thyroid-S has worked well for years. Remember to understand optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
      • Tania

        Janie, thank you !!
        I was put on Hydrocortisone by Dr Hertoghe years ago along with NDT and some other hormones.
        I slowly swapped from Levo onto Erfra. I had very high T4…Well, you can imagine what happened with my first dose of Hydrocortisone !!!! HUGE Hyperthyroid reaction….I will remember it all my God given days !! Now, my Saliva Cortisol was low. I had a blood draw at AM at the doctors, and it was below the bottom of the range. They thought Addisons and did the short Synachtin test. said i had adrenal function. I think years of being Hypo Thyroid had exhausted my Adrenals . But I am very Autto immune so they said the Addisons would go with the Hashis and the Type 1 Diabetes , which I have had since childhood.
        Dr Hertoghe’s bloods showed very low Cortisol, and he said I would be on Cortisol for the rest of my life . I spent a year on it…i did well at first, but I did start to feel over cooked on all of it. I gradually weaned myself off Prednisone as i thoight with fixing my Throid and giving my Adrenals a rest I would manage without it .
        After reading your very good link. I realise that my labs on NDT, off prednisone, I always had the low T4, and the high T3, well, optimal T3. Maybe with being Hypo Thyroid for ten years, I got used to feeling suboptimal, and optimal I just felt too over cooked ??? I had very high Testosterone on the Prednisone, over the very top of the range for a woman .They said I had “sudo” polycystic ovary syndrome , with no cysts. I think it was making anti bodies to long acting insulin, and locking it up in my blood .
        One thing that has always puzzled me that Hertoghe said, is….I had no antibodies to show Hashis, but he said that was because my body had already destroyed my Thyroid ?? But before treatment my TSH was only 7 , with bottom of the range T3 and T4…i was not well, but I was certainly not ill, ill. With a complete destruction of the Thyroid, would a TSH not be in big double figures ?
        I think the Cortisol will be my problem once more Janie . i have had a very rapid and sudden weight loss again, since the change in NP… 8 KG in a few weeks . So not exactly a hypo symptoms, but when my adrenals crashed before, i lost huge amounts of weight .
        I will do a saliva Cortisol, and decide from there whether to go the Levo/Cytomel route, or the Thyroid-S route . Maybe neither will be right until I address the underlying Adrenal problem, and maybe I do need to be on predisone for the rest of my life. Thank you so much for helping to piece stuff together . You are a very good person.

        Reply
      • Mimi

        I posted a couple of weeks ago regarding NP by Acella My pharmacist switched out for a newer version and it doesn’t smell as bad but I am not feeling any better. I have labs tomorrow so we will see. Can you tell me what meds everyone has had good results with if they have switched from NP???
        It was working great for me before these tainted batches. Thanks

        Reply
    • Jean

      I switched to natural compound d and it’s working g well.

      Reply
    • Jean

      I switched to natural compound d and it’s working g well. I know I won’t feel good on synthetic, so this works better for me. I feel better than when I was on ACELLA np when it was good.

      Reply
      • Di

        I finally did that as well, Jean. After Naturethroid and Armour, with no luck in the
        balancing act (since August!), I finally went to compounded porcine powder. Thanks to
        a wonderful doctor who works with me. I had to say NO to the Avicel, and there are
        plenty of other options for fillers. It seems to me what originally worked well 100 years
        ago is still the best treatment. If only doctors would listen, and remember….

        Reply
      • Mimi

        What is natural compounded? How do I get that?

        Reply
  101. Kathleen S Fisher

    I do believe this is a HUGE clue as to why (my pills have an ammonia/cat pee taste): https://abcnews.go.com/Health/smell-pork-genetic-component-study/story?id=16261564

    Reply
    • Jenny T

      Kathleen, that is very interesting. Do your NP pills work for you despite the smell? I also have a batch of the bad pills and have not tried them. I ordered Thyroid-S from Thailand instead, and they seem fine.

      Reply
      • Tania

        Hi Jenny T
        That is interesting about the Thyroid-S from Thailand . I remember people being happy on that from years ago. Can you let me know how you carry on on them ? And where you bought them from ? a reliable source. Anyone else switched to Thyroid-S and had good results ????

        Reply
  102. fliss

    HI Janie is it ok to start a new thread or should I go down to my original comments and write?
    will try this way for now. so ive been on synthetic T4 and T3 for 10 days now. swopped straight over from old batch of NP I had found. I had been on 4.5 grains NP for years and optimal until problems. you suggested iu start at equivalent to 4 grains which was 150mcg t4 and 35mcg t3. all went ok for first few days , my t basal temp went from 36.4 to 36.6 then 36.7 which was great, my BP was perfect and pulse ranged between 65 and 80. then my afternoon temp started to be quite high 37.4 then 37.6 and pulse resting was around 100. I got terrible leg cramps which I always get when on too high a dose, also anxiety. so I stopped the t3 yesterday and just took the t4 as a test. no more pain leg cramps went although bp and pulse were ok temp was 37.3. I don t want to stop t3 so today I added back the t3 but at 30mcg. this morning basal temp was perfect ay 36.7 as were BP and pulse. afternoon temp is; 37.3 so lower, and bp 132/81 pulse; 81 which is where they normally are …my question is should I also lower the t4? and why do you think I got the cramps and high afternoon temps when all others were ok? I dont understand how long it takes for t4 to start to convert to t3…is it maybe already doing so and therefore the t3 dose became too high for my body? was I right to lower it? im not so worried. about high afternoon temp if all others are ok its just the painful cramps and anxiety I cant bear and tell me im on too high a dose. will it eventually level out and is this normal in early days of switching? I have bloods in 2 weeks time and apt with DR to discuss im going to print off your optimal levels page for him. I suppose I won’t know till then whether im optimal on whatever dose im on? or will it maybe take another test 3 weeks after that to be sure? please let me know if you think im doing the right thing , am on correct dose for now or if you think I need to lower the t4 and if so what to? I suppose my main way of knowing apart form temperature pulse etc is if those leg cramps and anxiety come back, then I would need to lower the t3 to 25mcg and maybe lower the t4?…but I dont understand why im needing less synthetic than NDT? will my body eventually need more and is it the t4 or t3 dose that’s the problem or both? what does happen to the t4 as it converts to t3 does it disappear so you only have t3? then do we all have to lower direct t3? im slightly confused as only ever been on NDT and got used to it…assumed it just gave right amount of t4 and t3 as all in one tablet..its difficult to balance taking the 2 separately and understanding the process… I look forward to your helpful advice as always.
    fliss

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi Fliss. When changing to the two synthetics from the changed NDTs, we all have to keep an eye our frees to tweak either way. And you wouldn’t have to worry about conversion time to T3 as you went on less T4/T3 than you used to be on with on 4 1/2 grains. Your T4 conversion to T3 would drop a lot in just a week as would T3.

      And I would personally get back on T3 after being off a few days, but a little less. It has a short half life and goes down fairly quickly if you get off. Then we would get those labs done after a week on the T3 and see what’s going on. Then we think again after another few weeks in the tweaking goal.

      And we’re all in this learning curve!!! We’ll learn together. 🙂

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        By the way, if you were on a changed NDT that was negatively affecting you, it may have also negatively stressed your adrenals. This page will give clues: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info

        Reply
        • fliss peck

          thanks for this helpful advice Janie. yes im back on the t3 only stopped for one day. I was on 35 mcg but today I changed down to 30mcg do you think that’s ok? its equivalent to almost 3.5 grains NDT and I was on 4.5 grains but started as you suggested at 4 grain equivalent.
          so is the 150mcg t4 ok to stay the same ? that’s equivalent to 4 grains NDT so im on 4 grains t4 and 3.5 grains t3. do I need to worry about high afternoon temps or just if I get the cramps? I have adrenal insufficiency and have been on 30mg HC daily for 6 years now. I had to increase it to 35mg while negative NDT issues but seem ok back on 30 now. do you think that’s ok or should I be raising it slightly?

          Reply
          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Labs will tell the most for you. And the right amount that’s not too high or low will help remove the high afternoon temp. Not sure about the cramps.

          • fliss peck

            ok thanks Janie so shall I just stay on 30mcg t3 (EQ: 3.5 grains NDT) and 150mcg t4 (EQ: 4 grains NDT) or shall I adjust the T4 down as I have the t3? my bloods cant be done for 2 more weeks so just wanting to know what to do during that time… I always used to get cramps when I tried to raise my NDT too much.. so for me its always a sign im too high, obviously with NDT its simple just adjust down a bit but when on t4 and t3 im still unsure if I should lower the t4 as well as t3. although staying off the t3 and just being on the t4 yesterday got rid of cramps….

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            I wish I knew! Trust your gut.

        • Lynn

          I have been having challenges with t3/t4 synthetic compound as well. I feel better when I don’t take it but after a couple of days my hair loss starts – that seems to be my first symptom of hypo. When I do take it, even at half dose, I get a headache on the crow of my head, feel disconnected from my body and fatigue. I’m wondering if ndt’s are not as potent? I understand that the ndt could have revealed a cortisol problem but does that mean you only feel the cortisol problem when on medication? My cortisol is low all day and high before bed. I tried holy basil before bed and felt horrible in the morning. Trying liquid zinc before bed and that seems to help with sleep. I have adrenal cortex but feel to wired when on t3/t4 to take it. My dose is only 1 grain.

          Reply
        • Kim

          I say we keep the bad pills, and start a go fund me account and all contribute to it. Then, once enough funds are raised, send the pills to a lab for independent testing, that way we ALL will know the truth as to EXACTLY what are in these pills that is making us sick. There is power in numbers, and if there is toxic ingredients we can take legal action.

          Reply
      • Tania

        Hi Fliss
        I was always under the understanding that T3 from synthetics was more potent than T3 from NDT. I will be doing the same as you as soon as my Cytomel arrives. I will be on 120 mcg of levo Thyroxine and either 25, or 30 mcg split daily of Cytomel . do you split your daily dose of synthetic T3 ? Maybe you need to do this ? You could be converting a lot of the T4 in the afternoon, maybe when deiodinases are more active with you ? We are all very different . Did you used to split your NDT dose? and if so into how many ?
        It’s all very scary changing when we have been so steady for so long, as the hyper symptoms are not nice. I think if I were you, and it’s only guess work until you get labs as you really get into this. I would cut down on the T4 slightly, as it may be pooling . I used to get pooling with Levo Thyroxine , and the huge thyroid dumps . i have had none of these on the NDT’s I have been on .
        Anyway, keep us updated and informed. Good luck.

        Reply
        • Lynn

          How do you know if t3 or t4 is pooling? Synthetic t3/t4 has been a challenge for me. For the first two weeks I felt much better after the Naturethroid/NP debacle and then it plateaued and my doctor raised it and that resulted in headaches and sleep problems plus feeling “heavy” is the best way to describe it but not weight wise. So my doctor dropped it back down and I still feel that way on days I take it but better on days I don’t. If it was an iron or cortisol problem wouldn’t I feel it all the time? If I go a few days without taking it my eyes get puffy and my hair starts to shed. I feel stuck. My guess is the Naturethroid, that I was put back on in June 19, was like a sugar pill. The the NP I had in Sept 19 was the old NP and was working. The NP refill in Oct 19 was the smelly version and things went bad again and now I am messed up. Maybe the synthetic is too strong or wrong ratio? Can I take 2013 Naturethroid to at least get back to normal for a few weeks? Armour? Not sure what to do but I have been feeling crappy for 6 months except for the first two weeks on good NP and the first two weeks on synthetic t3/t4.

          Reply
          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Lynn, pooling only refers to the Free T3 going high due to a cortisol problem. But the Free T3 can look high if you do labs after taking T3. We don’t take T3 before labs

            But by what you are describing, the raises are revealing a cortisol problem. So you need to order a saliva cortisol test, not blood. This page explains plus has a link to a cortisol test you can order: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/saliva-cortisol

          • Lynn

            I did take a cortisol test about a month ago and it should lows all day and high right before bed. Can I feel these lows and highs? I feel the opposite – highs all day and low at night. Could the thyroid medicine affect whether I feel it or not? Should I take the adrenal cortex even when I feel more hyper? I guess I’m trying to figure out if my dose is not correct or the synthetic isn’t agreeing with me – can that interfere with the adrenals or can you treat them separately? I would hate to be treating an adrenal problem that is caused by thyroid medicine and not what the medicine revealed if that makes sense.

        • fliss peck

          Hi Tania
          thanks for this…yes I split my T3..ive now gone down to 20mcg a day to see if that helps .split 10mcg 8am , 5mcg m midday and 5mcg 4pm…is that what you will do? ive already taken my Levo today but will try and split 50mcg tablet which is tiny, in half and go down to 125mcg tomorrow. what does pooling mean? I was so happy on NDT, yes I split 3 times a day….so sad about all these problems.. good luck too, I will let you know if lower Levo does and lower t3 dose helps ..I had such bad c ramps Saturday night was in agony couldnt sleep so took no t3 yesterday and was fine just on the Levo so was thinking its the t3 I cant handle or the t3 dose? every time I take it now I get these horrendous cramps , every time I just take Levo im fine,
          fliss

          Reply
      • fliss peck

        Janie I had horrendous cramps again Saturday night after restarting g t3 at 30mcg. stopped it again yesterday and just took Levo…felt fine.. am trying again today just taking 20mcg t3 …is that too low? was planning to split 10. at 8am, 5 at midday and 5 at 4pm or should I just split twice a day and take another 10 around 4pm ? any idea why this is happening when I take the t3? im so worried I won’t be able to be on t3 and just have to be on Levo..I was fine on NDT for 10 years except when the problems with ERFA and then Np started..wish I could go back to NDT…why could I handle 4.5 grains of NDT but dont seem to be Abel to handle t3? 20mcg t3 is equivalent to just over 2 grains so way too low for me really…maybe my body needs to start low and get used to it? also this morning my basal temp was 36.3 the lowest its ever been…wheras yesterday it was perfect t at 36.7..whats going on? my afternoon temp is now around 37.3 whether im taking the t3 that day or just the Levo, and my BP and p[ulse are good every day…im so confused.. ive noticed my morning temp is low the day after I’ve just taken Levo..and its normal on day after ive taken t3…but as I say so far any dose of t3 is giving me unbearable leg cramps and no sleep…just hope I can handle the 20mcg today..
        fliss

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Your potassium and magnesium may be too low, which can cause cramps.

          Reply
          • fliss peck

            but it only ever happens when I take the synthetic t3 and disappears when I cut it out for a day and take just t4… and as I say used to happen when I tried to raise my NDT too high, then went away when I lowered….its definitely connected to either the dose or timing or something else t3 related and I take good strength magnesium powder, use magnesium spray and potassium powder and all are ok whine I get tested……
            is just taking 20mcg t3 today enough ?
            should I just split twice a day instead of 3 ?
            should I lower my t4 dose too and ion so how much , im on 150mcg equivalent to 4 grains NDT, so t3 20mcg is equivalent to 2 grains NDT
            fliss

      • fliss peck

        hi Janie just to let you know I dropped down to 20mcg t3, 3 days ago, taking 10 at 8am and 10 at 4pm. thankfully this seems to have worked, no more cramps my body can take this dose. still with 150mcg t4.
        im going to add in another 5mcg t3 =25mcg in total tomorrow at the 8am dose and see if im ok with that and if so just slowly increase if possible to 35mcg that I should be on. then blood tests in 10 days time.

        Reply
  103. Tonia

    I ran out of my last 90 day supply of NP Thyroid last month, and since the new (more) nasty tasting, smelling, etc. batch was picked up, my symptoms have begun to return. It’s definitely a thing. Before going to NP Thyroid last year (I think it was last year…shortly after the WP and NatureThroid shortages), I was doing very well on WP. Now that the 1 grain is available again in the WP, I think I’m going to give it a try again. I have a Dr appt on Monday and will ask to switch then. Hopefully, the doc won’t give me any issues.

    On a different note, I just read the article about “Seronegative Hashimoto’s: aka negative antibodies” and wanted to add something…my particular form of Hashimoto’s is negative for antibodies, but it also was not found via an US. The only reason I was finally DX with Hashimoto’s was because my very thorough doc at the time finally did a fine needle aspiration (“FNA” aka biopsy), which came back saying it was consistent with Hashimoto’s. According to an article I read a while back, apparently, FNA is the gold-standard for DX’ing Hashimoto’s…while all the other tests can confirm it, the only thing that can rule it out is an FNA/biopsy.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi. It may be more like this: the majority of Seronegative Hashimoto’s can be discerned via an ultrasound, but there can be a small body that need an FNA like you did. Glad you finally got your diagnosis to help you proceed.

      We have yet to see anyone get optimal on WP since all these changes. Do if you do go that route, it might be better to add T3 to it and get your free T3 optimal.

      Reply
  104. edison

    So I’ve been back on Armour for about 2 months now, switched from NP. I seem to be doing ok. It’s crazy that Armour literally costs 4x the amount that NP did, though. Ugh.

    In case it hasn’t already been posted, the Acella site seems to have more info on it, but it’s still not really explaining why the pills are nastier smelling/tasting, other than their primary ingredient is coming from Europe.

    https://npthyroid.com/product-updates/

    Reply
  105. Ellen weir

    Question: what if my labs are okay, but I feel sick taking the NP? I’m comparing labs from last 8 years. If the NP is bad, could my labs look okay? If my labs look okay, then why do I feel totally hypo? And my cortisol looks good comparatively.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      NP has changed so drastically that you need to listen to how you feel, in spite of the labs. It’s why so many are moving over to T4 and T3 and getting optimal. Or Thyroid-S is an option from Thailand. Another is compounded NDT. Compounders have a different source of their porcine powder that is still working.

      Reply
  106. Ana

    I’ve been taking Armour since September and thought you might be interested in my experience with it. I had been optimal on 135 mg. of NP Thyroid and decided to try 150 mg. of Armour. It’s been working really well for me. I finally went in for lab tests. Here are my results with the reference ranges (taken on Mon., Nov. 11):

    Free T3: 4.3 (2 – 4.4)
    Free T4: 1.5 (.9 – 1.8)
    TSH: 0

    My free T3 and Free T4 are slightly higher than they’ve been on 135 mg of NP Thyroid, and my TSH is slightly lower. I feel a bit better when my T4 is lower so am going to try 135 mg. of Armour to see how that goes. My main complaint is that I can’t get it to work sublingually. It dissolves under my tongue, but I don’t feel as if I’m absorbing much. I’ve been chewing it, then swallowing with a large glass of water. That’s been effective. The price is also absurdly high.

    Abbott/AbbVie acquired Allergan (including Forest Labs/Armour) last spring, and it bothers me that they now seem to have an NDT monopoly. Based on my experience, they are getting very good porcine thyroid powder. This certainly raises more questions. I’m also concerned about the fact that Armour is now owned by the manufacturer of Synthroid. I’m wondering what the consequences of that might be.

    Reply
  107. housemaid

    I got an email from Acella today. They sent an ad with recipes and a couple of articles on hypothyroidism! No mention of the huge problems with their product, of course. First time I have ever gotten anything like that from them. Maybe their business is slowing down? I know I am not going to be buying another refill for NP as long as it remains bad.

    I also saw a Nov. 11th update by RLC Labs, but they still are producing WP in just the 1 grain size. I loved the old WP. It was the only one that made me lose weight. I wouldn’t trust WP right now, though, since it seems all the NDT manufacturers (and probably the compounders) have used the same tainted porcine thyroid powder.

    Reply
    • Wyline

      I got that email too. I only signed on to hopefully receive some kind of acknowledgement that their meds had changed and were compromised, they were sorry for the problems etc. Instead it’s just business as usual. Very frustrating!

      Reply
  108. Sally

    Everyone posting here needs to fill out an adverse reaction event to the FDA (https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/medwatch/index.cfm). Download the Consumer/Patient form (Form 3500B – right hand side of web page) and explain what happened to you. Unfortunately, their online reporting isn’t working – so the form needs to be mailed or faxed.

    They aren’t as quick to pull medications as they once were, but if enough people report the problem – they have to pay attention. You can’t just complain to the company – sometimes you need to call the “police”.

    And if anyone knows an investigative journalist…

    Reply
    • Angie F.

      Have done so…and let me also add that a report or complaint with the CPSC (Consumer Products Safety Commission) should also be done…And please make sure to sign both the petitions to RLC and Acella at MoveOn.org.

      Reply
      • Kathleen S Fisher

        I just picked up my refill of NP Thyroid a week ago, and immediately noticed the nasty taste and smell…..reminds me of skunk. So far I have nothing to report on my numbers changing, but will be on the lookout for that! What a disappointment to be reading all of this….Also, to the comment above: the CPSC does not handle pharma complaints.

        Reply
        • Angie F.

          Yes..a cross between rotten pineapple and skunk was a closer description than “cat pee” to me. With regard to the CPSC comment. I was referred to CPSC by the drug safety testing lab I contacted (they only do commercial testing) about the problems we’ve all experienced. CPSC absolutely DID review my complaint and respond..It may be they forward the comment onto FDA (who I’ve received no comment from at all) but won’t hurt a bit to complain to both agencies. The more noise made, the better…

          Reply
  109. Mimi

    Update :

    Just got off the phone with David at Acella. He said they have made a change to their source for the porcine and took my lot number. Then he asked for my pharmacy number He is calling my pharmacist to let her know he is sending out overnight a new bottle from a different Lot Number and then is having Acella’s Medical Affairs Department call me to document my reactions and get further information. I hope this information helps Here is the number to Acella : tel:678.325.5189

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      And as usual, that fails to mention there are other changes, such as a horrific smell, such as the removal of sweetness, such as a tablet we can’t let dissolve well anymore, such as a horrendous taste–all mentioned by many patients.

      Do know that they have sent out tablets before, and they have all continued to cause problems, report patients.

      Reply
      • Ellen weir

        Hi I have pills that look like old pills, taste a little sweeter for the last couple of months, but I have all negative symptoms of hypo, and biting in stomach and headache, total fatigue. On hc also

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          …which is what I keep warning people about …..

          Reply
          • Ellen weir

            Hi yes I just wanted to point out that the pills can be bad without the smell. Without the splotches, and be the same size as before. These also dissolve in my mouth but are sweeter than months ago. I think I’ve been going hypo for about a year. Yup they won

          • Tania

            Ellen
            Mine are much sweeter too . The batches I bought a;; have a much sweeter taste . They seem drier and bigger too, but I don’t get the cay pee smell that much, but having aid that, I have had a bottle open a good few weeks now, and the taste is changing bit. But it was the sweetness of them that first alerted me to a change, then the texture, then feeling Cr@p !

    • Janet

      I took my two “cat pee” bottles and set them out with the lid tipped so some air could get to the tablets. After a couple of days the smell was gone, but when I put one in my mouth I immediately started gagging. So it makes me wonder if they’re airing out the tablets before packaging to get rid of some of the smell since that’s what people were complaining about. That would get rid of the volatile compounds but could still leave impurities causing a problem.

      I would like to see a full toxicology analysis done on the tablets to see if there is any contaminant that could be harmful. Look how long people used Zantac before it was finally noticed that the ranitidine could be contaminated. Maybe we can start a campaign to raise money to test a few bottles. Eurofins in the US can do impurities testing.

      Reply
  110. Mimi

    I picked up a refill from Walgreens Palm Desert on 11/07/19. I thought I was coming down with the flu until I realized my symptoms would appear about an hour after taking NP Thyroid 1 grain. It has gotten worse everyday since including dizziness and weepiness I called the pharmacist and she gave me the lot number it matched one listed on your site. I am calling Acella next. What is a Comparable alternative ? Any advice would be greatly appreciated Thank you for this site

    Reply
  111. Wyline

    Like most here I was successfully on Nature Throid until the crash and then even better NP Thyroid until present. The recent comments about how great some are doing on the synthetics makes me think that Big Pharma has succeeded in eliminating the competition of any natural desiccated choices.

    Reply
    • Tania

      I have been on a similar journey and absolutely agree with you . I am a Type 1 Diabetic, who started out on Porcine Insulin. Then Big Pharma stepped into the socialist trojan Horse , metered out health care !! And we really started PAYING . They brought out synthetic “human” insulin first…there was nothing human about it .
      This was when Type 1’s really started to realise dead in the bed syndrome was real. Hypos were horrendous on it, and I and many others started living half lives , as big pharma invented more and more long acting synthetic insulins…mainly to take care of the flourishing Type 2 market looking back in hindsight , that is where the real money lays for them . So Type 1’s had to be carried along on this gravy train, getting more and more ill.
      There is now one tiny independent drug company in the UK actually that produces Porcine Insulin for those who make vicious anti bodies to the synthetics ….and tbh, I bet that has gone now . Money trumps health every time !!! And keeping us ill is big business for them, treating all the bolt ons.
      Tin Hat firmly on !!

      Reply
    • Renee

      Hi Wyline, I was literally thinking that same thought as I drove to work this morning. I thought, “well, big pharma finally did it. Now everyone is going to be forced to go to synthetic, which is exactly what they want”. I, personally, do NOT want to do synthroid again. I know now that I can add T3 to it, but the last time I was on Synthroid, I felt like it was slowly killing me. And, every doctor I complained to just told me I was getting older and should expect body pain and joint pain and weight gain and hair loss and feeling tired and foggy brain, blah blah blah. I was given antidepressants and synthetic b-12 shots (which I should have never been given because I am homozygous for MTHFR C677T) and told to drink more water, eat more veggies and exercise more. I had doctors just increase my synthroid dose which sent me into hyper mode and I was plagued with PVCs and full blown panic attacks and adrenaline rushes that actually made me scream in fright. Doctor said PVCs are normal and harmless at my age and I just need to lower my stress levels. I was told to do yoga and meditation for the panic attacks. I was sent to psychotherapy. One therapist even told me to go to church and pray. It was only through studying this site, doing my own research and becoming my own advocate, did I FINALLY find the ABSOLUTE AMAZING nurse practitioner who listened to me and helped me. She ran the right thyroid tests, had me do the saliva adrenal sufficiency test, and got me on WP and the right supplements. She saved my life. At the end of 18 months, I was in remission, all body and joint pain gone, weight went down, inflammation came down and I had energy that I never had before. My antibodies came down and I became optimal. Switching to NP was a little more difficult, but I am doing okay on it. Thankfully I have a pharmacist who works with me and has kept the bad batches away from me so far. But, what happens when the good batches are gone and we are only stuck with the speckled smelly batches? I’m afraid to risk it, but I also DREAD going back to Synthroid. Just the thought alone makes me panicky. But, I really feel that this was big pharma’s goal all along. They want EVERYONE on their product. This is so depressing. And now, when people start doing poorly again on Synthroid, doctors will once again pull out the antidepressants and the dance will start all over again. What a racket. Seriously.

      Reply
  112. Sue R

    I am making the switch from NP Thyroid to synthetic starting tomorrow – Levoxyl and Sigma Pharm generic Cytomel. My last fill of NP Thyroid in October had less smell, but the smell is getting stronger over time. I’ve gone through the pain like everyone else – WP Thyroid to Naturethroid to NP Thyroid, all with their problems, which have caused my labs to be good and then bad. I’m tired of the game. I will have labs 6-8 weeks after the switch and will report back on how it is going. Fingers crossed this is the last time I have to switch brands! I am so thankful that my PCP was on board with this change and didn’t try to push T4 only. I am also grateful for Janie @ STTM who provides such valuable information and insight to all of us.

    Reply
  113. Tessa Osborne

    Just had a new supply of ERFA thyroid and which I have been on since 2011, and for the first time it smells funny and the tablets taste disgusting and, as I usually chew the tablets before swallowing, the taste really lingers. I’ve only just started taking them so haven’t noticed any change in symptoms yet. Last night I swallowed them whole as I couldn’t face the taste and the oily lingering flavour. Has anyone else noticed/reported this with ERFA . Its clearly been happening a while with NP.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi. Did they for sure send you Erfa tablets and not NP Thyroid tablets? Because yes, what you are describing is exactly what is going on with NP. There are photos of each brand’s tablet on the net.

      Reply
      • marianne conlin

        On Np Thyroid 90mg, last Rx had a terrible smell and gave me a headache after 1 dose. I have switched back to Armour. Reported my experience to pharmacy and drug co.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Since Armour changed as well in its own way, some doing far better on it by adding T3 to it and seeking to be optimal with their frees.

          Reply
          • Di

            Just for some hope: I was struggling with Armour for about a month here–and amazingly,
            my body seems to have adjusted. Will let you know the labs in about a month more.
            It works differently from the REAL Armour (pre-2009), in that it seems to build up
            slowly, and doesn’t give an immediate relief of hypo symptoms. With the REAL Armour, I used to feel better
            about 20 minutes after ingesting.
            I chew it at 4 a.m. on an empty stomach. A little bit of T3 would make me feel normal again, though. THANK YOU
            JANIE!! What would we do without you.

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Yes, please keep us informed. And yes, some are adding T3 to the changed Armour and doing a lot better!

    • Angie F.

      Many patient complaints similar to yours at ERFA Canada Facebook page. This problem, across the board, appears to originate with the raw material. https://www.facebook.com/erfacanada2012/

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        Which is a scary thought as to what is in the current porcine powder causing so many problems….

        Reply
      • Tessa Osborne

        Thank you for that Angie. I have left a comment on their page too – I did not know it existed.

        Reply
        • Angie F.

          Yes..it is scary. I did well on one or another of these meds with only brief blips or problems for over 20 years. Now I’m trying to figure out a potential cardiac (PACs and possible other) arrythmia issue. It’s a huge mess..I keep thinking of potential ways to get a meaningful response out of these manufacturers…report them, class action suit (which would require disclosure), inviting the CEOs to a social media “webinar” or conference for the purpose of answering our questions. Not sure what to do…but I think if we fail to organize and continue to just issue individual complaints and responses, we’ll likely not get much more of a response than we’ve gotten thus far.

          Reply
  114. Sandie

    I had tachycardia in May and started reducing my NP Thyroid from 120mg down to 90mg. Then I was still having palpitations and read here about the change and I had noticed the stink. Sooo frustrating to finally have my thyroid issues addressed a few years ago with NatureThroid and all of these changes. I kept reducing the NP until stopping at 75mg which seemed to halt the palpitations and I felt good. My labs were perfect – best they have ever been! I picked up my refill the other day a 60mg and 15mg and guess what? NO SMELL at all! So now I wonder if i will plummet into hypothyroid coma in a week or two?

    Reply
    • Sandie

      As an update. I continued with 75mg of NP and had tachycardia again the other day. I’ve now stopped NP. I’m awaiting a new prescription from my Dr for Armour as she said she had seen more stability with Armour. I suspect I will be completely hypo in another day or two (it’s been 2 days with no thyroid med).

      Reply
  115. Jacque

    How many hours should I not eat before and after my second dose of T3? I am also going to synthetic T4 and T3 from NP Thyroid. Thank you!

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      You can eat with T3. It’s mostly calcium, iron, and estrogen….or even high fiber, that you want to avoid at the same time. So you could eat eggs, fruit, veggies, for example.

      Reply
  116. Rae Miller

    Picked up a partial order of NP Thyroid 60 at CVS (I take 2 per day), Bedford IN USA. Cat urine smell and taste. They don’t dissolve under the tongue– hard chunky pieces. After swallowing, the awful taste lingers in my throat and exudes into my breath when exhaling. Submitted lot number and exp date on the other thread here. I’m thinking of getting Armour instead; at least they aren’t disgusting. I have had to substitute one NP and one Armour per day for the past 3 weeks anyway, because of the difficulty in refilling my Rx locally. But this has always been a problem. The pharmacies never order it in a timely manner, even if I call early—so I always run out. I don’t know yet if I’ll have a bad effect from taking part Armour/all Armour. I don’t have much choice here of doctors who would be willing or knowledgeable to go with synthetic T4 and T3, so I’ll just hope for the best. This sucks!

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      We’ve not seen people get optimal on Armour alone so far. And optimal has to do with what’s on they page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal So you can try, and if not, it’s successfully to add T3 to Armour.

      Reply
      • Rae Miller

        My Oct labs didn’t test T3 Free. My May labs TSH (low .02 mcU/mL) T3 Free SerPlQN 4.5 pg/mL (1.5 -3.5 pg/mL), T4 Free Direct SerPl QN .7 ng/dL (.6 – 1.5 ng/dL) – (Oct labs this was .9 ng/dL). I feel OK energy wise but usually have afternoon sleepiness. I haven’t had access to DirectLabs for RT3 testing since I moved. Hashi’s, Sjogren’s since 2007. I have paroxysmal aFib once a month and sometimes more if my thyroid/ electrolyte levels are out of balance.

        Reply
  117. Tania

    Hi All
    Right Day ten on the new batch of bigger, super sweet NP Thyroid, after 6 happy years of brilliant, optimal labs, great BMI, and feeling good. i have a heart condition, pure FH which has led to CAD . Heart and lipids have been optimal too . and I’m Type 1 Diabetic. Great BS control.
    I’ve had ten days on the new batch and I now feel horrendous. Nauseous, migraine type headache, freezing, back to sleeping all night with electric blanket on full. Rapid weight LOSS….which is weird . Some adrenalin symptoms , which were a blast from the past …and TIRED !!!
    So, i have just been online and ordered Cytomel from the US. I have some Levothyroxine in. I was on 3 grains of NP, split into two doses. I have worked out my dose of Levothyroxine daily to be 120mcg…and 25 mcg of Cytomel, to match my dose of NP which i was optimal on. Now the big gun questions !!!!
    I feel crap now. I have a lowish/mid range T4 on NP anyway, totally suppressed TSH, and a near top of the range T3. Can I take the 120 MCG of Levothyroxine straightaway? Shall I take it tomorrow? I am a poor converter.

    Should I carry on taking the NP until the Cytomel comes from the US, which will take around ten days ? Should I carry on taking the crap NP along with the Levothyroxine, or may i over do things ?

    Is there a protocol to transition from NDT to synthetic T4 and T3 ? As it had to be done gradually the other way around . Or can I just take the equivalent dose of Synthetic T3 to that I have taken on NDT from the day it arrives?

    With having significant CAD, i don’t want to start any heart problems. I am in the UK, so have no Doctor to guide me with this, but to be honest I have been used to dealing with all this on my own for years now . Though i did have Dr Thierry Hertoghe all those years ago transition me originally onto Erfra, gradually. Since then I have changed doses etc on my own, and done my own blood work .

    I feel so lousy, i am tempted to at least start topping up with the Levothyroxine I have here, until the Cytomel arrives .
    Please, any advice.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      If T4 is low, might not hurt to top a little with Levo in my mind. Hope it all keeps you going until that cytomel arrives. It’s just too bad that a once excellent NDT has changed so badly.

      Reply
      • Tania

        Thank you Janie
        I’m starting to wonder if there is some Globalist conspiracy theory with all this . Why ??? Why ruin every avenue of treatment for so many of us who don’t convert the T4 to T3 endogenously . This morning I could hardly open my hands …they used to do tests for Capel Tunnel, Frozen Shoulder……all of these things went on NDT . So when I start to go Hypo, it makes my hands seize up over night. I think it’s fluid I accumulate. I slept through for 14 hours and could not get up !!
        I have a very physical job, i don’t know how I’ll cope ….anyway. Sorry for ranting I know many others are suffering too.
        So when the Cytomel comes I can switch straight over to those doses ? I will split the Cytomel into two doses . i used to take my full dose of Levo Thyroxine at 6 am to help my adrenals ….and no food.
        Do I have to leave a space between taking Cytomel and eating like with NDT ?
        Thanks for all your help people. x

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          If you are going to straight T3, we general do it three times a day, approximately four hours apart due to it’s short half life. You can even add a very small amount at bedtime.

          If you are also on T4 for one dose, then twice a day for the T3.

          Find your right amount: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

          Reply
          • tania

            I’ll be doing the Levo and T3 combo. so I’ll split the T3 dose, I’ll do bloods and see how i am. Trouble is in the UK now they only test TSH…No T4 or T3. But they always used to test my T4 at the lad because of my suppressed TSH on NDT. That used to blow their minds, thinking they had a Hyperhyroid patient, and then my T4 used to come back low/normal range. lol

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            You may have to self-order your FT3.

  118. Di

    Has anyone had experience with Woodland Hills Pharmacy compounded NDT?

    Reply
  119. Janet

    Just wanted to encourage those of you who are nervous about making the change to synthetic. I’m on 50 mcg name brand Synthroid and 5 mcg SigmaPharm generic Cytomel morning and afternoon (I was taking 1 1/4 grain NP Thyroid). The Mayne generic T3 was awful for me but I’m doing really well on this combination.

    I was able to ride my bike almost 15 miles today with no heart issues and good muscle endurance. That’s pretty amazing…in fact better than I was doing on the NP. Because I had done well on Thyrolar years ago I knew that a combination of synthetics would probably work, but finding the fillers I tolerated was a bit challenging. It’s hard to accept that likely our future options for NDT are going to be very limited, but I guess in a way I’m relieved to have made the switch just so I don’t have to go through this again and again when they mess with the manufacturing. I feel like every time there’s a black hole in my life until I get stabilized.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      That’s wonderful, Janet!! Really happy for you and glad you posted this.

      For others reading this, the small amount of T3 that Janet is taking wouldn’t do the trick for the vast majority. You might feel better at first, but it would backfire. So we dose to get optimal. Read this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
    • Angie F.

      Janet..can you refresh my currently very hypo memory with regard to what your cardiac issues were? Thank you.

      Reply
      • Janet

        Angie, I have what is considered a progressive lung disease called Pulmonary Hypertension. The arteries in the lungs become constricted and sometimes scarred, in my case from a viral infection years ago. Because there is so much back pressure on the heart it eventually causes heart failure. Both hypo and hyperthyroid states are considered serious risk factors for worsening, so I have to be very careful to maintain the right dose.

        Reply
    • Ryan

      So you’re on 100mcgs of Synthroid, and 10mcgs of cytomel currently split into two doses? How pricing vs NP’s?

      Reply
      • Janet

        Ryan, my insurance is covering it for now so I’m not sure how much more it would cost. I do seem to be starting to react to the fillers in the SigmaPharm T3. That’s not unusual for me to develop an allergy to things like the other ingredients (in this case calcium sulfate dihydrate, corn starch, gelatin, magnesium stearate and mannitol), but I was hoping I’d be okay with it. So far still good with the name brand Synthroid ingredients. I may have to try the name brand Cytomel or get it compounded without any fillers and that won’t be covered by insurance.

        Reply
    • starsweet

      Thanks so much for this information Janet! I am wondering whether you are taking both the Synthroid and liothyronine sublingually or just orally?

      Reply
  120. Diane

    I am on 270 NP in a split dose. So far, so good.

    If I change to Armour, how much T3 should I ask my doctor to add?

    Thank you!!!

    Reply
  121. Teresa

    I was reading Mara’s list of ingredients in her digestive aid and noted that Ammonium Chloride is present. I wonder whether that could be the cause of the cat pee smell in NP’s disastrous pills. In checking the uses of Ammonium chloride, I came across this side effects list from rx list.com:
    “Rash, EEG abnormalities, Seizures, Mental confusion, Irritability, Drowsiness, Ammonia Toxicity symptoms (sweating, altered breathing, slow heart rate, irregular heartbeats, and coma), Calcium-deficient leading to tetany,
    Low blood potassium (hypokalemia), High chloride levels in the blood (hyperchloremia), Abdominal pain, Nausea/vomiting, Hyperventilation, Encephalopathy” Apparently it’s also used in cattle feed. Included in smelling salts because of the strong ammonia odor it emits, although some sources state that it’s odorless. Can’t determine why it would be used as an excipient in either Mara’s pills or the NP Thyroid pills. Of course these side effects might be caused by any number of other agents, but
    It would be useful to know whether Mara’s digestive pills have had Ammonium Chloride in them before this new batch….

    Reply
    • Mara

      I just got off the phone with Standard Process. They are going to test the batch that my digestive enzymes came from They say that the oder of Zypan changes from batch to batch and people often describe it as “foul”. The representative did tell me that the formula has changed. What was interested about that is the way the formula changed: they removed the lactose and substituted cellulose. However, I can’t imagine that the cellulose would be responsible for the cat pee odor. So perhaps it is the Ammonium Chloride. But my older bottle which does not smell like cat pee, also has ammonium chloride. The mystery continues…

      Reply
      • Teresa

        Thanks Mara! It’s probably not the Ammonium Chloride…it’s interesting that your bottle of digestive aid exhibits the familiar smell after a removal of lactose and substitution with MCC…I can’t imagine either that it would be responsible for the smell, unless it’s subject to interaction or decay.

        Reply
    • Karen

      When i looked up class two solvents amoniom chloride was listed in manufacturing of medicine. There is another comment on here about the FDA finding this as a violation in this plant making ndt. Very caustic agent.

      Reply
      • Jan P.

        Hi Janie,

        I take the 90 + 15 of the NP to equal 105mg daily. I Normally get 3 months worth, but this last August they had trouble getting the 90mg, so they gave me 60mg +30mg. I do have a few of the 90 left from May. My Doc also tried bumping me up to the 120mg in April, but I couldn’t tolerate it, so I do have about 20 days worth of that. In inspection of all these, I found that the 60mg is as described as being darker, and I let my husband do the unbiased smell test, he says it smells like cat pee as well.
        My question is, how do I find the lot numbers on all of these? Do I contact the pharmacy?

        My history is long and I really can’t compare like for like with others on this blog. I’ve been dealing with hypoactive Thyroid for 30 years now and went through hell of Synthroid and Levothyroxine, switched to Armour by a Jewish Doctor 😉about 24 years ago and was doing fantastic until the Armour change. Ended up with a different doctor, I finally found your website and was following everything closely. Went through having replacement compounded, where I sweared it was poisoning me. In 2014 had to change to an Endocrinologist and she was agreeable after a couple of weeks to let me try NP Thyroid, I went back and forth between Westhyroid and NP as the Pharmacist had problems getting it. So here’s the rub! 2016 I was diagnosed with Acute Myeloid Leukemia, and went through the hell of that. Went to Bone Marrow Transplant in March of 2017, however I’m now left with Graft vs Host Disease. Some of the side effects of the Thyroid being off mimic GvHD. I’ve been on some pretty rough stuff between the chemo and the anti rejection medicines. While going through all the treatments, I’ve fought to stay on the same dose of NP Thyroid. They’ve had me on Prednisone amongst other drugs. In the last year I’ve gained weight and have not been able to take it off. The Oncologist thinks that my metabolism has been permanently changed. My Endocrinologist talked me into adding 13 mg of Tirosint in August with hopes that the weight would come off. Hasn’t happened! I’ve had some issues that are mimicking menopause, but had a hysterectomy 16 years ago and been on .025 Estradiol ever since. My labs are all coming back good, so now I’m wondering if this has to do with the change in the NP, or truly my metabolism changes.

        Let me know how I can get the lot numbers and if I can help in anyway.

        Best,

        Jan

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          It could very well be because NP went greatly downhill from what it used to be, report many patients.

          Also, it’s practically impossible to be optimal one only 105 mg, even when NP used to be a better product. And now, NP appears to be greatly compromised, report patients. This is why so many are now switching to synthetic T4 with synthetic T3 to avoid the NDT mess, and making sure they get optimal. One gal switched to Armour, but added in T3, got both her frees optimal, and seems well. Read what optimal really is here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

          Reply
          • Jan P.

            Read your post on being optimal, thank you! I’ve been fine on the 105mg for years. I have always needed only small doses of any medications that I’ve taken, so I’m not concerned with not getting enough. When I do get bumped up the feeling of being overdosed is to overwhelming and I come down pretty quick. After going through all the cancer and GvHD, I would rather feel just ok, than overdosed. For me at this point it’s a matter of quality of life! If I’m home not being able to control my feelings or heart rate, and feeling ultimately like I’m hitting a wall at periods of time in the day; than I’m not living the life that was graciously extended due to the bone marrow transplant. I except I will never get into the box everyone wants me in.

            My question to you is: do you want the lot numbers from my NP, and if so, how do I get it.

            Thank you,

            Jan

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Hi there. It sounds like you need to be doing what’s on this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info

            Oh and we’ve got a many lot numbers doing. So no need. 🙂

  122. Ann

    Hi Janie,
    I am wondering if you have ever seen antibodies go down on Synthetic t4/t3 combo? The reason I ask is I recently went in to my doctor to switch after this whole issue with NP. My antibodies had recently started going down on NP after being steady for over a year. My doctor said she hated to switch at this point because she has never seen antibodies come down while on synthetic t4/t3 combo. I have been at this for over 3 years and just really confused as to where to turn at this point. I don’t want to give up the gains I’ve made but don’t want to be putting poison in my body either. Thanks so much for your help.

    Reply
  123. Lynn

    So, the synthetic t3/t4 doesn’t seem to be doing me any favors. I have stopped and started a couple of times now and once I get to day 2 I get a headache on the top of my head, fatigue, feel warm with no fever and very sad. Also feels like someone is sitting on my chest. Not sure what to do now. Maybe stop taking everything? I haven’t felt good since Naturethroid failed me in June 2019. Had a couple of good weeks – once starting with the decent Np and once starting the t3/t4.

    Reply
  124. Susan

    I’ve decided to go back to Synthroid and Cytomel until Acella works their problems out. Is there a reference I can share with my doc re: raw materials coming from China? Also, Can you please point me to information on converting my NDT dose?
    My pharmacist says 95 mg. NDT=158 mcg. Synthroid but I’d like to know how much Cytomel. Thank you!

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Your pharmacist’s comment is why we’ve learned to take what pharmacists say with a grain of salt, if even a grain. What you start on, or close to, is what you were on with NP. One grain equals 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3, so by that, you can figure out an equivalency with both T4 and T3. After a few weeks, do the frees. This is your goal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
  125. Susan Hannum

    I’ve decided to go back to Synthroid and Cytomel until Acella works their problems out. Is there a reference I can share with my doc re: raw materials coming from China? Also, Can you please point me to information on converting my NDT dose?
    My pharmacist says 95 mg. NDT=158 mcg. Synthroid but I’d like to know how much Cytomel. Thank you!

    Reply
  126. Mara

    I take a digestive aid made by Standard Process called Zypan. It contains hcl, bovine pancreas Cytosol extract, pepsin, ammonium chloride, bovine spleen and ovine spleen. I just opened a new bottle and this bottle has the SAME cat pee smell as my most recent NP thyroid refill!! I have no idea if this has anything to do with what is going on with NP, but Zypan has NEVER smelled like this!

    Reply
  127. Angie F.

    Another reminder to sign the petition to Acella’s CEO, Harold Deas, at MoveOn.org. Here’s the link: https://petitions.moveon.org/sign/np-thyroid-by-acella/?source=search

    Reply
  128. Ryan

    I just realized that after I talked to Steve at Acella around a month ago, I never received the fetch bottle they were supposed to send me in order to test my failing pills. I guess that line was another shot of bs to help sooth the burn they’ve dealt us. I guess Steve can cozy up with the notion that if we all jump ship, he’s out of a job.

    Reply
  129. joseph

    does lithium carb. and seroquel affect thyroid conversion?

    Reply
  130. Janet

    I’ve only seen this conversion chart in one place online…it may be something Acella provided to healthcare professionals. I started with a lower comparable dose of Synthroid just because it’s better to undershoot at first if you have any cardiac issues. It doesn’t give T3 so you have to use the 4:1 ratio to approximate the dose for that. But it might be useful as a guideline.

    https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/vvYKgmaFdNY5IbwBDnHTnVHoplRpb_s2Kesu6lfbTxZlO_cfigtUzrrG1bpjRjMeBghrCfaezJiT7c5172D930nVmV3NcvZArJYRuZ4LlFoXxi00LzDjse6e1RNd6l_6_y_YVIBj

    Reply
  131. Janet

    Update on switch to synthetic T4/T3:

    I’ve been on the name brand Synthroid and generic T3 for two weeks now. My doctor felt it was too early to see any changes, but I politely disagreed so he let me do the testing. Free T4 was 1.02 which is pretty normal for me. Free T3 was 4.4 (usually about 5). But TSH had climbed 3 points which I had suspected because my thyroid gland was swelling and my resting heart rate had dropped to the 40s along with a lower body temperature. So my body is definitely feeling the change. NDT is about a 4:1 ratio of T4 to T3, but I started with a 15:1 ratio to show my doctor the T3 really is necessary (75 mcg T4 and 5 mcg T3 in a split dose). I’m going to increase T3 now to get it closer to the NDT ratio and we’ll retest in a couple of weeks. Because of a muscle disease I have which is affected by low thyroid, an endocrinologist I saw several years ago said to keep TSH in the .5 range, so that’s my goal for now.

    I’m so thankful I have a doctor who is willing to work with me and responds immediately to messages on the portal. He will make any adjustments needed to make me feel better even if it kind of goes against traditional protocols. I wish the same for all of you!

    Reply
  132. Sue R

    Has anyone tried the brand Levo-T for synthetic T4? Synthroid is way too expensive in my area to consider. I would add generic (Sigma Pharm) brand Cytomel with this for the T3.

    Reply
  133. Ryan

    Just updating, almost completed my month dosage. I have bad days and really bad days. The non-stinky pills eventually became stinky, so obviously there’s some sort of decay. Guess I’m gonna have to jump back to naturthroid or jump ship to something else. For those taking Cytomel and Synthroid simultaneously, is this a cheaper option than our NDT choices?

    Reply
  134. Tania Cully

    I meant my nightmare with Erfra, and Armour…I’m on Acella now. Sorry brain fog already lol

    Reply
  135. Tania Cully

    I am in the UK and have been taking NP Thyroid for five years . buying it from a great source in the USA. I changed from Acella when that went down hill, after hypo symptoms returned . I am on 3 grains of NP split into two does and was OPTIMAL. I have had great labs, near the top T3…mid range T4….sometime low to mid range. And suppressed TSH. But i have felt great on NP. Never had to think about my Thyroid for years. Roll on last week when I got the new batch . Bearing in mind I have taken this for years. I tasted it …SO, so SWEET !!! Tablet looks a bit bigger . But the taste was SO different. Alarm bells went off. I opened another new bottle out of the three I bought, they tasted the same out of that bottle too. I have today googled a change in taste in NP Thyroid and was GUTTED to read this, as I went down this road of misery with Armour and Acella . Oh God…Not NP too. !!! I may just go the synthetic route if my GP will prescribe it, but I cannot imagine life without T3 now . Can I buy synthetic T3 from somewhere ?? I think this new batch will send me down. I will report back . But the taste change must be for a reason.

    Reply
    • fliss

      tania i am in UK too and had same nightmare as you with Erfa did so well for 5 years never felt so good then that changed and switched to NP now cant use that, I got really ill on last batch couldn’t take….. I am going to be trying synthetics for first time later this week . I managed to get GP to prescribe t3 by doing a hand written prescription for a brand that is £100 for 100 , 20mcg tablets as opposed top £250 for 28 tablets that came up on his screen! that’s how they stop `GP’s prescribing t3 they make it too expensive. the brand is THYBON HENNINGS ….you can get it from chemist 4 u its on the thyroid uk website under pharmacies. I am going to take it with a ~T4 brand called `ACTIVA and see if hopefully I will be ok….theres not much left to try and im really hypo now. good luck and let me know if you manage to get GP to prescribe and how it goes . if he won’t you may be able to get him to do a p[rivate prescription for them, they are definitely the cheapest t3 ive found anywhere..but others here may know more ..im just looking at UK market.. I will post on here once started and done bloods.
      fliss

      Reply
      • Tania

        Hi Fliss
        Thank you so much for getting back in touch with me . A life line. i have been on the New batch of NP for two weeks now. I know this may sound daft, but the first thing for me to notice that goes, before I start the journey of hell to hypo is my hair goes flat and chewy!!! It hasn’t started to come out as of yet, but I have not had this for years . I have coasted along happily for years on the NP and obviously when everything is working well, you stop looking for any problems. Labs good, and felt great . Your information has been so helpful. If you would be happy to share emails, or have a chat about this I would certainly appreciate your help . Of course, I’m happy to chat on here . I will have to start this journey ….again….from scratch . So sorry you have too, but what you have written is a great help and starting point . xxxxx

        Reply
        • fliss peck

          HI Tania im so glad my info helped you…have you started t3/ t4 yet? itv so how’s it going? ive been on 9t almost 2 weeks and have had some problems which ive documented on here cant seem to cope with too much t3 for now so only on equivalent to 2 grains instead of 4. hoping to raise it slowly. I dont check my emails that much and often have weeks off as find it too stressful but can chat on here…let me know how you are . take care . xxx

          Reply
  136. Vernon Miller

    Started taking the new formulation of NP Thyroid on October 20, by October 28 hypo symptoms were returning. Now Nov 4, symptoms are worse. Blood work scheduled for tomorrow. No lot number or expiration date available.

    Reply
    • Tania Cully

      Good luck with the bloods!! I will be very interested in results.

      Reply
      • Vernon

        Blood test came back unchanged. So it is something else in the tablet making me sick. My doctor gave me a 2 week supply of the old formulation. Almost immediately I started feeling better. Checking into an online pharmacy that tests every batch they sell. My local pharmacy told me they had no way of telling me what batch number my last prescription came from. Done with them.

        Reply
  137. Dina L Ciccone

    I need to get on something, anything stat… they ran out of WP, now NP is literally harming me. How to do I switch to synthetic without losing weeks or months of my life? I need advice on what to do so when I call my Dr. she will know what to order for me.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      One grain of NDT is 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3. So whatever you were on can be figured out accordingly. For example, 2 grains if 76 mcg T4 and 18 mcg T3, etc. Then after a few weeks of whatever you were on, redo labs and tweak as needed until optimal.

      Reply
      • Dina Ciccone

        I started on Armour yesterday. I took 135 mg which is what I was on with NP. Last night I had a hard time breathing as I was going to sleep so I am going to reduce the dose today. Has anyone heard from Acella to see exactly what they did? I am 100% annoyed (as are we all) about having to start all over again.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          The replies from Acella are still the same…that they get their porcine powder from Europe. No mention of what is burning people’s throats. No mention of what is making some nauseous. No mention of why the terrible smell. No mention of why the sweetness was removed. No mention of why the horrid taste that so many comment on. No mention of why so many see their hypothyroid symptoms come back. No followup on all those pills they ask people to send back. No explanation why they think that sending some people a new bottle of the same crap pills are going to help. On and on and on….

          Reply
  138. Janet H.

    Hello! My NP experience is a sad and disappointing one as well. I was optimal for about the past 6 months finally after starting NP a year ago. I was finally getting out and enjoying life. I got the smelly batch about a month ago but wonder if NP was taking a nose dive before that because my numbers were already dropping on my bloodwork a few weeks prior to noticing a difference in the pills. When I tasted them the first thing I did was check this site (thank you STTM!!) and braced myself for a return in symptoms. With my numbers already declining, sure enough within about 3 days I became a weepy mess for about 4-5 days. I was able to switch to Armour and within a day was feeling better, however I’m back to living in the couch again when I’m not working. I hope to be able to get back to feeling energetic again. I’m so disappointed in NP thyroid for taking chances with others health and singlehandedly forcing me back into a hole that took so long for me to dig my way out of 🙁

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      You said it very well about NP and Acella, Janet.

      Reply
      • Janet H.

        Thank you Janie! Something else I forgot to mention is that I had 2 strange symptoms over the last couple months that I never guessed came from NP thyroid but have disappeared since switching. One was dizziness when I bent over to pick something up. My head would spin for a second when I stood back up. The other was waking up in the morning feeling like dust had gotten into my lungs, I felt like I had to cough it out and assumed it was because of the weather or dirty air filters. One week off of NP and realizing both symptoms are gone. Could be coincidence but seems very odd!

        Reply
        • Rita W

          Janet, I’m experiencing the same dizziness. I don’t know what is causing it. Now I’ll add NP Thyroid to the list of possibilities.

          Thanks for sharing this.

          Reply
  139. Janet

    Since several have asked, this is the conversion chart I’m using, not the ones that you would use going from synthetic to natural.

    https://www.rxlist.com/thyrolar-drug.htm

    I started taking Thyrolar back when Armour changed their formulation. It was synthetic T4/T3 and worked great for me for many years until it was discontinued. On this chart, Thyrolar 1 would be the same as 1 grain of NatureThroid or NP Thyroid, so you can calculate the equivalent for your dose. Maybe showing that to your doctors would help.

    Reply
    • Sue R

      Jamie, could you provide some insight on converting from NP Thyroid to Synthetic T4 & T3? When NP Thyroid was good, I was taking a total of 75mcg (60 plus 15). Amount of T4 in 75 mcg is 47.5, and amount of T3 in 75 mcg is 11.25 So the closest to that in Synthetic would be a 50 mcg Synthroid and 1/2 of 25 mcg tablet (12.5 mcg) of Cytomel. Would that be a good starting point?

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        I’m on my phone and can’t get to my calculator, but if you took into account that one grain has 38 mg T4 and 9 mcg T3, them compared that to what you were on…you may be close enough to the approximate amount of T4 and T3. It will take doing the frees every few weeks and getting optimal.

        Reply
        • Lynn

          Is there any benefit for using a compounded t3/t4 vs synthroid and Cytomel? I am doing the compounded route and am having a challenge with a headache on the top of my head, hair pulled sensation and feet tingling once they raised me to the equivalent of 1.5 in NP from 1. I took a couple of days and those symptoms went away and yesterday tried again with lower dose and they were back again. I miss the old NDT’s.

          Reply
          • Janie Bowthorpe

            We’re with you about missing the old NDT.

            Do you know what the filler is they used?

          • Lynn

            They are using microcrystalline cellulose.

          • Di

            Janie, do you know if MCC or Avicel can cause these headaches? Since the NP fiasco, I was
            given Naturethroid and then Armour. They both produce awful headaches as Lynn describes, about
            an hour or so after ingesting. I cannot even drive, they are so bad.

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            That must be awful for you. Naturethroid is far from the great product it used to be, so I’m never surprised about problems. Armour can be better for some if T3 is added and one gets optimal. So not sure why they would do that to you. Why not move to T4 and T3 and get optimal?

        • Lynn

          Janie – what do you think about the filler in my synthetic compound t3/t4? it is microcrystalline cellulose.

          Reply
          • Janie Bowthorpe

            The cellulose can bind the thyroid hormones a bit. Just tell you compounder that for refills, you want acidophilus or olive oil, for example, rather than cellulose.

  140. Janet

    I’m doing really well on the brand name Synthroid and SigmaPharm generic Cytomel. What a relief…I was concerned that my holidays were going to be wrecked trying to adjust doses.

    Something that has been very unexpected is that I am sleeping so soundly. I can fall asleep easily even lying down to take a nap. It’s not fatigue…my energy level overall is much better. But it’s a deep, restful sleep that I haven’t had in many months. This really makes me wonder about some sort of neurotoxin in the new source material Acella is using. I think it’s deceptive that our labs may look normal and yet something is obviously interfering with thyroid utilization.

    Reply
    • Sue R

      Janet, when you switched to Synthroid and Sigma Pharm Cytomel, did you just match the amount of T3 and T4 that you were taking of NP for the conversion?

      Reply
      • Janet

        Sue, my prescription is for the equivalents on the conversion charts. However I took Thyrolar (liotrix) for many years and did fine, so I decided to start with that equivalent for the T4 and just a little lower on T3 and I’ll adjust that upward as needed according to tests. I’m getting a little bit of thyroid swelling today, so I’ll get my tests on Monday and make the first adjustment based on that. I feel fine, but don’t want to get a goiter. I’m just amazed at how much difference there is in the mental symptoms after switching…that’s why I think something was affecting my central nervous system.

        Reply
    • Angie F.

      I agree, Janet. One person mentioned ractopamine a feed additive to promote leanness in hogs/pigs for consumption as a possibility, and there were potential contamination issues with Sichuan Friendly. I haven’t made the switch to synthetics as yet and am unfortunately having to undergo a cardio workup Monday, but look forward to trying.

      Reply
      • Teresa Palmer

        Angie, forgive me if you described your cardiac symptoms before, but are you having PVC’s or SVT? I wish you the very best on Monday.

        Reply
        • Angie F.

          Hey Teresa…no problem. Until the cardio workup, all is pure speculation of course except for the definite PAC’s on the monitor at the hospital in the ER. The ER doc thought perhaps also paroxysmal A-Fib, but as yet that’s unconfirmed. Since you’ve missed what I’ve posted before, I’ll add that what brought me to the ER was palps, high HR and soaring BP (I’m a low BP person)..but EKG was normal (they consider PACs “normal”) and BP stabilized to high for me (135 over something) in the ER without meds. I began having problems simultaneously with an NP batch that I picked up in March from my local pharmacy. On/off from that time on..Palps and high HR got bad mid-summer, then improved briefly, then back again. My labs taken at my normal am time were a little lower than they had been…But ER labs one day after showed me with VERY high FT3, low-normal T4..like I’d been getting a quick T3 “dump” that didn’t stay with me. We shall see. Thank you for the best wishes. I’m doing okay..not great..but, with a nod to Jill Clayburgh, “semi-tough”. :):):).

          Reply
  141. Christine M Birkett

    Once again this website has saved me. I was certain I was going insane. NP was a lifesaver when Armour changed their formula. I have been struggling for months with return of symptoms including severe depression (depression was never an issue pre-thyroid), hair loss, sleeplessness, itching skin, forgetfulness & the worst FOG BRAIN ever. My job is complicated and very stressful this is so frustrating. Don’t they understand how much these changes impact our lives?

    Thank you for posting the updates. Thank you for your website. You guys saved my life.

    Reply
    • Terri

      I just took a dose from a new batch of armor….omg tastes like cat pee! I put a search in and came across this info. Thank you!!! The new tabs are grainy looking. Now to keep reading as to what to do…..

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        Some pharmacies switch out different brands, such as switching Armour to NP. Are you sure you got Armour? Is it possible you got NP Thyroid? It’s happened to others and it’s irritating to only find out when you get home/

        Reply
        • Renee

          Oh boy! I can attest to that Janie. When WP originally went on back order, my pharmacy substituted naturethroid and didn’t inform me. I never looked at the bottle and never even noticed that I was taking a different pill. About a month later I was super sick. That’s when I happened to look at the bottle and learned that it wasn’t WP that I had been taking for the last month. I then had to call my doctor, get blood work done and switch to NP. It literally took me months to get back to almost where I was with the WP. Now I always verify before I leave the pharmacy. Lesson learned the hard way.

          Reply
        • Kay R

          Janie, people are complaining on ERFA FB about new ERFA …..change in color and smell. I won’t run out of old stock for a year, along with my T4 synthetic. They say they get porcine from Europe as well. I was looking to change to NP when I saw all of the posts. Thanks for being an advocate for all of us.

          Reply
      • Terri

        Im’ sorry. No, I had NP and had to have my doc change it to Armor. There went 3 months of NP down the drain and not even sure if Armor is working these days. I just know i’ve been feeling like hell. Visual changes, exhaustion, the whole nine yards on the previous 3 months of NP…if I hadn’t smelled and tasted the new one, I’ve been so foggy I wouldn’t have thought of it being the culprit…..

        Reply
  142. BarbN

    I just read the the NP Thyroid website FAQS several times…very tricky and deceitful wording.
    -One question asks about their quality control process and if anything changed with the update.
    They say they continue to use the same exacting quality control process and rigorous testing that they always have to ensure delivery of the appropriate amount of T4 and T3…
    Then they continue to say that every batch released to the market must meet the same quality and testing standards whether it was produced using ingredients from their former supplier or their current one – and that will never change.

    Whaaaaat?????? So it seems they are telling us not to worry because they test the final product whether it was made with either the old or new sourced API…are they kidding? What we the consumer are concerned about in addition to the T3 and T4 is any difference in what is in the new API compared with the old…of course it is different or it wouldn’t taste different…

    -Another FAQ is really tricky in that it asks if their new European supplier sources thyroid API from China or India?
    Then they answer saying no, the API is manufactured in Europe using porcine thyroid glands sourced entirely from European countries.
    What they imply is that they are no longer using any API from China or India but they are only telling us about their new API supplier…leaving out that they are still using the API from the old supplier also…

    -Another FAQ asks why the new looking pills taste different…they then avoid answering the question by stating that the product shouldn’t be chewed…how could pills taste different without being made with different ingredients?????

    I think we need to request Acella add a few questions to their FAQS such as:
    1. Are you still using material sourced from your old supplier? Where was the old supplier material sourced from?
    2. What are the exacting standards for your API that you claim to meet? Measuring T3 and T4 only? What else are you measuring to ensure the API hasn’t been contaminated, changed, cut with another material, etc?
    3. Is the manufacturer testing the batches that are produced? Do you or a 3rd party test the final product to ensure the product meets specifications or do you rely solely on the manufacturer who has an inherent conflict of interest if specs aren’t met?
    4. Was any of the product being sold now manufactured by Izeen Pharma or another manufacturer using the API material sourced from Sichuan Friendly?

    I’m sure I could come up with a lot more that might actually give us some actual information…I’m going to see if I can send these questions to Acella and get any substantive response…I’ll post again if I get any response

    Also found Acella in a lawsuit with Izeen Pharma (the same manufacturer that made the lots that Westminster voluntarily recalled) on docketbird.com
    Federal Court Cases Civil Cases Northern District of Georgia 2018 2018-cv-00000 through 2018-cv-00499 Acella Pharmaceuticals, LLC v. Izeen Pharma, Inc.

    This just seems to get worse as more information is uncovered…

    Reply
    • Elle

      Great digg, BarbN!

      Reply
    • Angie F.

      Interesting…I’ll look at today. One of the things that concerns me, and not just with Acella, is the Sichuan cross-contamination possibility from Class II solvents AND other medications…So..it’s pointedly NOT ENOUGH for Acella to test for T4 and T3 levels which we already know (potency variation also a possibility given Sichuan’s lack of GMP), and which are substantiated by labs, are inconsistent. Encourage everybody to do their FDA Medwatch reporting AND also to report to Consumer Product Safety Commission…Report an unsafe product form can be found at this link. Let’s make some noise…https://www.saferproducts.gov/CPSRMSPublic/Incidents/ReportIncident.aspx

      Reply
  143. Kellie

    My dr put me on NP thyroid back in July. My levels were normal..but DR was helping me with symptoms of hypo. I had a complete hysterectomy 4 years ago and was hoping for some relief. I was advised not to take HRT..this was my only hope. My symptoms since then…(had no idea it was the meds, until I researched)
    Bloated..headaches…burning pain in my stomach…3 times my lip swelled..(since Sept & October refill) itchy scalp…exhaustion…feel like my entire body is tingling.
    I actually tested this out. I stopped for two days and started back yesterday. Woke up this morning with dark circles under my eyes and hives on my face.
    Went to urgent care and currently waiting for meds…prednisone, zantac, benadryl and levothyroxine. (will wait till I speak with my endo before I take another thyroid med) If anyone out there has switched to Levo…please let me know.

    Reply
  144. Janet

    An update on my quest for a replacement…

    I’m doing really well with the name brand Synthroid…no reaction to the fillers. I’m not using the full conversion dose that I’ve seen on charts, but rather the dose I used when I was on Thyrolar which was 75 mcg. I want to use the least amount needed to maintain optimal levels and will adjust as we check free T4.

    The T3 was proving to be more of a challenge. I started with the Mayne brand generic Cytomel. I had a mild reaction to the first dose and took it two more times, each time getting a worse reaction including throat swelling. I talked to the pharmacy and they said their other option was SigmaPharm’s brand so they ordered that for me. My insurance declined payment and told the pharmacist they needed me to confirm I’d had a reaction. I spent 1/2 hour on the phone going over it and then they said my doctor had to call instead. This was on a Friday afternoon. I called back and said I was taping the conversation, and if I experienced heart failure over the weekend because they refused to approve the switch then I made sure my family knew they had denied coverage. They changed their tune and overrode the declined submission.

    So I’ve now tried the SigmaPharm T3 and seem to be fine with it. It’s great to have readily available options that hopefully won’t change over time. I have more energy and clearer thinking than I’ve had in months. It makes me wonder if even before the litter box tablets there were changes in the formulation altering the effectiveness.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Glad you found out about the magic of having direct T3 in your treatment!

      Reply
    • Angie F.

      Thanks so much for posting…Gives me hope for T4/T3 therapy for myself and perhaps a brand, besides Cytomel, with which to start. Kudos on the insurance company a$$-kicking…so tired of their crap on top of all the other crap patients have to deal with. It’s as if they want us to pay huge premiums, co-pays, and deductibles…for, wait for it, n-o-t-h-i-n-g. Great work if you can get it.

      Reply
      • Janet

        Angie, the name brand Synthroid works great sublingually. The Mayne T3 tasted very metallic, didn’t split well and was not good sublingually. The SigmaPharm brand is completely different…tastes fine and splits cleanly even though it’s not scored.

        Reply
        • Angie F.

          Janet…How did you convert? As closely as possible to mcgs of T4/T3 you were getting in porcine or other method? Thanks.

          Reply
          • Janet

            Angie, I am using Thyrolar’s old chart (it’s no longer manufactured). It was an ideal ratio for me back when I took it. I think the conversion charts for natural vs synthetic are maybe a little too high on the synthetic side. The assumption is that natural is more bioavailable, but that was not true for me. Thyrolar 1 on the chart would be equivalent to 1 grain NDT, etc.

            https://www.rxlist.com/thyrolar-drug.htm

    • Karen

      Hi Janet had you tried synthroid before. I had used it many years ago but started having reaction to it. Not doing well on tirosint sol. I need to take Something my Dr won’t prescribe t3. Just asking if you you had bad reaction to it previous. Thanks

      Reply
  145. Patricia

    My email to Acella today:
    To Whom It May Concern …
    I spoke with Steve twice back in August 2019 about taking a huge turn for the worse after a refill I picked up on 7/22/19. Within 3 days of taking this refill I knew there was something terribly wrong with NP Thyroid. I have been thru this before with Armour, ERFA, WP Thyroid & now NP. When I spoke to Steve, he stated someone would call me back about replacing my refills but no calls were ever received??? I saw my doctor on Thursday 10/24/19 & my blood levels are thru the roof compared to 6 months ago. Current dosage was 75mg x 5 & 90mg x 2 for an average of approx. 80mg a day. Although I have not been optimal, I was getting close & felt really good for several months, up to the end of July. Then I started on the new refill & all my symptoms came back with a vengeance.

    My doctor decided to renew my NP (what other choice do we have now other than synthetic?) but increase the dosage to 90mg for now. I picked up my refill at Sam’s Club in Glendora, CA today & what I got was 12 tan pills (like the old, good pills) & 18 grey pills that smell like cat pee. I asked the pharmacist to see the original bottle & the Lot # & Exp Date are M331G19-1 & 12/2020 according to the actual NP bottle but my script label says the exp date is 02/21? I showed him the difference in pills & asked if they combined lots into one bottle? Unfortunately, he is only 1 day a week at this pharmacy & I will have to go back on Monday to talk with the head pharmacist. According to your Prescribing info “NP Thyroid tablets are light tan, round tablets, debossed on one side with “AP” and a 3-digit code on the other side.” NP Thyroid tablets are NOT GREY. In the pictures below, you can clearly see the 12 on the bottom are “Light Tan” & the 18 on top are grey. 1st pic taken indoors, 2nd pic taken outside in the sunlight.

    In prior “Prescribing Information” documents you listed Maltodextrin as one of the Inactive ingredients but the current revision 0719-01 on your website has this ingredient removed? Sounds like a formula change to me, but what do I know? In your product update you state NP should be swallow not chewed. However under “Pharmacokinetics – Animal studies have shown that T4 is only partially absorbed from the gastrointestinal tract. The degree of absorption is dependent on the vehicle used for its administration and by the character of the intestinal contents, the intestinal flora, including plasma protein, and soluble dietary factors, all of which bind thyroid and thereby make it unavailable for diffusion. Only 41 percent is absorbed when given in a gelatin capsule as opposed to a 74 percent absorption when given with an albumin carrier. Depending on other factors, absorption has varied from 48 to 79 percent of the administered dose. Fasting increases absorption. Malabsorption syndromes, as well as dietary factors, (children’s soybean formula, concomitant use of anionic exchange resins such as cholestyramine) cause excessive fecal loss. T3 is almost totally absorbed, 95 percent in 4 hours.” It is common known fact that 90% of patients with Hypothyroidism and/or Hashimotos also have gut issues, therefor it is most practical for us to take NDT’s sublingually (not necessarily chewed, I don’t chew, I sublingual under my tongue).

    Over 1100 comments regarding the ineffectiveness of NP Thyroid today. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/08/22/uh-oh-np-thyroid/#respond
    I realize this email will fall on deaf ears as it has with all the other NDT manufacturers over the years but I feel better, sort of …

    Reply
    • Starr D.

      I know what you mean about having been through this with different
      thyroid manufacturers over the years–for me, it’s been with both synthetic
      and natural thyroid. Complaining after getting ill when they change it,
      but getting nowhere. Just wanted to say that my last batches of NP
      were also gotten from Sam’s Club (Long Beach, CA), and they also
      seemed “mixed” to me. Some pills seemed good & helpful, and some
      were horrible and made me sicker soon after taking them. No weird
      odor on mine, though–just a lot of the pills were fatter than they’d
      been, previously. The 60 mg (one grain) ones seemed more mixed with
      good & bad pills than the 30 mg. ones. The 30 mg. ones just seemed
      BAD and really got to me after I’d taken a few weeks worth.

      Reply
  146. housemaid

    I agree with those who think there is a whole lot of Sichuan Friendly porcine powder floating around and for some reason only Westminster recalled their pills. Were they more honest or did they just get caught? They have not yet returned to making NDT. I think RLC Labs, Acella, & others used their Sichuan Friendly powder, either knowingly or because it was not labeled. I think that the “European” source Acella claims they are sourcing from is an eastern European middleman. I think Acella knows exactly what is wrong but is not going to admit it and lose money.

    Most likely any pharmacy that compounds NDT is going to be using the same Sichuan Friendly powder until it is all sold. I was sorry to hear that someone called about Thyroid-S and was told the porcine powder used in it is likely from China. I had hoped it was from Thailand.

    Here is something interesting that I found: https://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb=y&IndexArea=product_en&CatId=&SearchText=porcine+thyroid+powder Porcine thyroid powder for sale, all from China, but not Sichuan Friendly unless they changed their name.

    Reply
    • Angie F.

      Yes…I posted about this a few days ago and I’m glad we’re all starting to pay attention. In all of the shared negative experience (and I’ve had issues with ALL meds (Naturethroid, Armour, and especially NP since spring of this year, perhaps even prior), this certainly sticks out like a sore thumb.

      In my post below, I posted a link to the FDA Alert on Sichuan which stops short of any mandatory action to companies potentially utilizing the powder (Sept 2018). Westminster issued their VOLUNTARY recall prior to the FDA Alert..so it looks to me as if Westminster may have had adverse reporting, connected the dots and did their due diligence to protect patients. However, any company potentially using Sichuan’s API would have gotten a March 2018 “Import Alert”, including Westminster. And also would have received the FDA Alert.

      The following is a link to the FDA letter on June 22, 2018 to Sichuan which discusses several major points that they felt had failed to have been addressed from an audit in October of 2017; note Sichuan was placed on “Import Alert” in March of 2018. (1) Solvent contamination..(2) Failure to adequately document cleaning and maintenance of equipment (3) Failure to demonstrate or correct cross-contamination of solvents a/o API carryover from solvents or other drugs (4)Failure to document or demonstrate stability of API [e.g.,potency] (5) Failure to demonstrate, document or prove “shelf life” of API (6) Failure to demonstrate that computer systems could not be tampered with to “change results” on testing. The FDA recommended that Sichuan obtain a consultant to figure all this out, which seems to signal that the FDA officials involved sensed some level of incompetency and ineptitude. Yet, the FDA did not issue any mandatory recall direction nor put the kebash on import until and unless Sichuan got their problems worked out.

      Link to FDA Letter to Sichuan..https://www.fda.gov/inspections-compliance-enforcement-and-criminal-investigations/warning-letters/sichuan-friendly-pharmaceutical-co-ltd-546990-06222018

      LInk to FDA Alert https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safety-and-availability/fda-alerts-drug-makers-recall-porcine-thyroid-api-sichuan-friendly-pharmaceutical-co-limited-china

      Just let me say again that I appear to have retained from all this a potentially PERMANENT cardiac arrhythmia issue. I am in the midst of figuring all that out as well as what thyroid replacement meds I will be able to take in future. Unbelievable.

      Reply
  147. Mara Miles

    I just picked up my refill for NP Thyroid. I had printed out the list of the “bad” batches and the expiration dates. The pharmacist was open to talking with me. We looked at my “good” pills and then looked at the last batch I had received which had the strong cat pee order. She smelled them and was quite surprised. She looked through her NP supplies and found a bottle that was not on the list (although it did have one of the expiration dates on it). It did not smell badly. I took it home and my husband and I tasted it. The cat pee essence was definitely there but very low odor. I have decided to go onto compounded synthetic T3/T4. My husband is still deciding if he wants to try the new NP batch. We see his doctor in December and he can ask then about doing synthetic T4/T3 if he decides to try that.

    Reply
    • Michele Nelson

      Where Can I find the list of bad batches? I’ve been scrolling through and can’t seem to locate it????

      Reply
  148. Christa

    What is the best way to find where to order Thiroyd or Thyroid-S? The few websites I found Thiroyd was sold out. My husband was on this about 5 years ago (I have a bottle still, will it be bad if it is that old? Could I still use?) and did okay. He is currently on WP and is doing horrible now. Has been doing great but is now starting to crash – he says it feels like he is taking sugar pills. He reacted horribly on NP previously, but prior to WP going out of production he did wonderful on it. I am at a loss, I don’t want the midnight trips to the ER again….

    Reply
  149. Scott

    I heard Janie on the Primal Blueprint pod on Monday 21 Oct, and finally got around to looking at the STTM site today. After reading this article, WOW JUST WOW. I started to feel off in June, and have been progressively getting worse and worse since. I have gone over the symptoms and had labs with my prescribing doctor, and have had other tests/blood work done to rule out other problems, but nothing else has come back as positive.

    Me = diagnosed with non Hashimoto’s hypothyroid in 12/2016. I am on my 2nd doctor for this, and am currently taking T3 20 mcg AM, Acella NDT 1-1/2 gr AM, T3 15 mcg PM, and Acella NDT 1 gr PM.

    I can’t remember exactly when the smell changed, but it was definitely over the summer. I noticed the pills looked different too; although I never thought to take pics or measure them. I get a weird feeling in my stomach. I have so many symptoms since summer it would take forever to list, but the Cliffs Notes version is that I feel as if I have the worst hypo symptoms you could ever imagine combined with the feeling of being poisoned + a hangover like feel 24/7 even though I don’t drink alcohol. Plus I get up multiple times throughout the night and can sleep for half the day and still feel terrible.

    The strange thing though is that my lab values for FT3, FT4, RT3, etc… really haven’t changed that much since the summer; it’s just the symptoms that got worse and worse over time.

    My next appointment is on Tuesday; I will print out and bring this article and see if he will agree to take me off of NDT for the time being and either use another med or compounding pharmacy for the NDT in addition to the generic cytomel I am already taking.

    I will try to read all of the comments on here. It is really hard to focus if anyone has any thoughts or has gone through similar I would be grateful for your feedback.

    Reply
  150. Teresa

    Greetings all,
    I think that I may have some insight into what may be happening. My husband and I had been receiving compounded NDT since 2009 and doing very well. In January of 2018, our bottles of caps sported a helpful label stating that although the product looked different, it was the same medication. I questioned the pharmacist, who had no other info for me. These caps had powder that was markedly grainier and dark, with large black flecks in it. The smell and taste (taken sublingually) was what I imagine it might be like to chew on cow or pig innards. The product though was much much stronger, and we had to reduce our dosages slightly. Then late in 2018 our compounder told us that he could no longer obtain the raw thyroid powder needed to fill our prescriptions. It turns out that the manufacturer of the raw powder was Sichuan Friendly. We switched to NP and have been doing well on it. And then I opened my new bottle. Friends, it appears to be the SAME stuff that the Chinese firm was shipping out! Same smell, same taste. The odd thing is that this med is much much weaker. I think that two things might be occurring at once. They’ve sourced some of the Chinese powder (perhaps without realizing) but they have also added a very strong filler that has rendered the med completely ineffective for those who cannot assimilate fillers. Sichuan had been using faulty formulas to calculate their dosages, and I think that they had an adulterated product on their hands. How much of this re-labeled product has gone out into the marketplace we can’t know. I am quite ill with palpitations. If any know a mail order pharmacy that compounds NDT and ships to VA, please let me know. Contacted Woodland Hills and was told they can’t ship to us in VA. I wish you all wellness and a resolution to this crisis, but beyond that, let’s fight for our health.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      That is incredibly interesting, Teresa.

      Reply
    • BarbN

      Teresa,
      All that you have put together is really interesting…I have suspected for some time now that there is still some if not a really large amount of the Sichuan Friendly porcine powder still circulating and being used in pills that are being manufactured now and/or pills that were manufactured and never recalled from other companies. While scouring the internet and FDA website I found a Warning Letter by pure luck and chance that was sent to a contract manufacturer, Izeen Pharma. This warning letter to Izeen Pharma lists several lot numbers that were recalled by Westminster and gives detailed information of the violations that were found. Very eye opening to say the least. Not sure if Izeen Pharma is still a contract manufacturer for other NDT brands. The letter is on the FDA website: Izeen Pharma Inc, MARCS-CMS 565311 — MAY 16, 2019

      Janie,
      Do you know if Acella actually manufactures the NP Thyroid? Most of the Acella labels say “Manufactured for: Acella Pharmaceuticals LLC” which makes it seem that Acella may not manufacture the pills but contracts this out and the Acella label is applied after they are bottled. This might explain why it is so difficult and time consuming (and probably expensive due to manpower and time required) for Acella to actually find and correct issues that the contractors are having with the raw material, quality control, manufacturing consistency, etc. And more importantly, why they really don’t want to acknowledge any problems and provide any answers.

      It is really concerning that it is so difficult to find out what violations are related to the NDT we are taking and ultimately what is being done about it if anything. Was Westminster the only one that issued a Recall for the the bad lots…how many more contractors/manufacturers received the Sichuan Friendly API and knowingly or unknowingly used it in the NDT being dispensed today? From their website it doesn’t seem that Westminster supplies NDT anymore.
      The timeline is really concerning considering a large majority of us probably refill every month or 3 months…
      -October 23 to 27, 2017 FDA inspected Sichuan Friendly facility (Sichuan Friendly responded to violations on Nov 17, 2017)
      -March 22, 2018 FDA placed Sichuan Friendly on Import Alert
      -June 22, 2018 Warning Letter 320-18-59 sent to Sichuan Friendly
      -Aug 8, 2018 Westminster Issues Voluntary Nationwide Recall of Levothyroxine and Liothyronine (Thyroid Tablets, USP) Due to Risk of Adulteration
      It took over 9 months after the Sichuan Friendly facility was inspected for the Recall to be issued by Westminster…(and this was a voluntary recall which I guess means many others did not volunteer to recall their NDTs?)
      It took about 5 months for Sichuan Friendly to be put on import alert after the inspection so I guess the unacceptable API continued to be supplied to the NDT manufacturers during those months????
      I saw my doctor yesterday and made the decision to start taking synthetic T3 and synthetic T4 this morning and hope to be able to optimize using them. I am frightened by the consistent lack of transparency about what is really happening to these once wonderful NDTs and so upset that these companies continue to discount our concerns, symptoms, and ultimately our lives.
      Sorry for the super long comment…I am still in shock about how absolutely unbelievable all this is.

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        Your sentence towards the end starting with “I am frightened…” hit it right on the nail. It’s been nothing but secrecy, lack of transparency, gaslighting, discounting, minimizing…

        Reply
      • Lynn

        I thought I read that the recall was due to bad practices. Was it actually proven to be bad?

        Reply
    • Sharon

      Teresa, I spoke to Murray Ave Apothecary here in Pittsburgh PA on Friday. I am switching to compounded Desiccated thyroid. My original plan was to go with compounded synthetics instead. The pharmacist told me they have Dessicated thyroid powder and they send it out to a lab for additional testing. I’m going to try and hope for the best. You could call them and see if they ship to Va. I trust the owner Susan Merenstein she is also a pharmacist. They are also a PCCA pharmacy. Since NP’s debacle I’ve been very ill due to not refilling my script after reading about it here. I’ve been using thyro gold 300mg for 4 weeks now and my levels really plummeted. My doctor said I’m not getting anything. I have just increased it to 450 mg as per the owner I need something for now till I get my compounded meds. Hope this helps,

      Reply
      • Teresa

        Sharon,
        Thanks so much for the info on Murray Ave. I’ll contact them on Monday. I hope that you’re able to bring your levels to optimal as quickly as is safe. BarbN, thanks for the most helpful timeline and the info about the letter to Izeen Pharma. I feel as though we’re putting together a clearer picture of events. Someone mentioned this much earlier in the thread, but the African Pig Fever has decimated perhaps 5 million pigs in China, who are the world’s largest consumers of pork. US is a distant second. This occurrence will likely have long term effects on the availability of raw porcine powder worldwide.
        Regarding the T3/T4 synthetic combination, does anyone have any knowledge of the lack of T1/T2 with respect to T1’s effect on the electrical charge of the brain? I found one source that indicated that the absence of T1 could lead to ALS. Alarming—but I haven’t been able to verify. If anyone has found info on this, would love to see. Janie, many many thanks.

        Reply
  151. Rita

    I wanted to update my older comment. I went back to Naturethroid after tasting the new NP. At 1.5 grains my T3 was low, so I was raised to 2 grains. Now I feel horrible 2 months in. My pulse and heart rate are higher and I feel nervous, stimulated like I am on coffee, and can’t sleep well. I had 2 panic attacks where I had afib for several hours. I have never had this issue before. I haven’t got my labs back, but I dropped my dose to 1 grain right now and will ask to be changed.

    Should I try Armour or just start on synthetics? i am so tired of this. I haven’t been optimal for almost 2 years thanks to Nature-throid. But this hyper feeling is the worst. I actually felt better hypo, other than my hair falling out…

    Reply
    • Angela Frye

      Rita, I am so with you on your comments. I started feeling “hyper” on an NP dose that was the same as I have been taking for about 5 years now, in July. Have had palps, high BPs, an ER visit and problems ever since. I went back to Armour for a few days…still problems…trying some old Naturethroid right now…still feeling overmedicated. Something is just not right. I’m in the midst of investigating problems from my end…cardiac workup..autoimmune flare evaluation, RBC magnesium and potassium levels, and if all that proves okay, iron and cortisol checks. I did have a VERY high end FT3 about 2 hours post med (never happened before), but a lowish FT3 the day before and both times LN FT4…Almost as if I’m getting nothing but a quick hit of T3 after meds and then nothing. I’ve put up two petitions at MoveOn to both RLC and Acella, so I’m not sitting on my hands about involving myself in a solution, but resolving this problem will take the entire dessicated thyroid pt. community. Please let us know if you get to any reasonable findings or solutions.

      Reply
      • Starr D.

        Angela, have you tried mentioning something about your petition on
        Facebook pages like Hypothyroid Mom and Thyroid Sexy? Those
        are two of the better ones, I think (of course, Janie’s STTM is GREAT),
        but I didn’t know if you’d like to message them about maybe posting about
        your latest petition (the one with 69 signatures)….or? You did a really
        good job with this petition, and I’d like to see it get even more names on it.

        Reply
        • Angela Frye

          Starr…please feel free to share and circulate the link to BOTH petitions anywhere you frequent. And that goes for everybody. I can’t be everywhere and resolving this nightmare requires community effort.

          Reply
    • Jenny T

      Rita, have you checked your cortisol levels? Your symptoms sound like cortisol levels that are off. I’m on hydrocortisone for low cortisol, and when I tried raising NDT from 1.5 grains to 2 grains, I got similar symptoms. So now I’ve had my aldosterone tested, and may need to take Florinef as well so I can handle raising my NDT. Janie says if you can’t tolerate a raise to 2 grains or above, you need to check your cortisol and/or iron levels.

      Reply
      • Rita

        Jenny T, you have a great point.

        So I went in and talked about my labs with my doctor, they are perfect on 2 grains. High T3, midrange T4, 24 hrs since I took the last dose. Never looked better. All my hypo symptoms are gone. Hair staying in my head, no more weight gain or tiredness, regular periods and a little lighter, etc.

        I talked to my doctor about my concerns of recent raising blood pressure, fast pulse, nervousness, not sleeping as well, panic attacks, etc and she thinks I am having bad anxieties, and I think she might be right. After reading all of the negative things on Naturethroid here and on other sites, it made me convinced that I was having issues from Naturethroid. Every little pain/feeling I immediately assumed was caused by my 0.5 grain raise in Naturethroid. I was 100% convinced I was hyper. I have struggled with anxieties at times over my life, and we had some stressful events the last month, so it might make sense that I am just stressing myself out. Anxiety and hyper symptoms are very similar. But my lab numbers say I am not anywhere near hyper…

        I will research the cortisol. That would make sense. She also suggested taking a low dose beta blocker for a while until I get calmed down. I hate taking prescription meds (I only take Naturethroid and I am 50) , but I broke down and took one last night and felt so much better today. Lower pulse, healthy blood pressure, not stressed, more relaxed. I even slept better. Basically like my old self on Naturethroid 2 years ago.

        She was willing to change me to any thyroid I want, but pointed out my numbers are excellent and I have a history of anxiety. I sometimes felt this way when I was hypo… Stupid anxiety disorder.

        So it was either change thyroid (which can have a huge adjustment time) or take a beta blocker for a while and work on reducing stress. Both methods aren’t perfect, but since my numbers are great and I have had a history of being nervous, this way makes sense for me.

        My iron is fine, just need to check my cortisol. But I already feel 95% better one day on a low dose beta blocker.

        I do know that people are more likely to post negative reviews on drugs rather than positive. My doctor has many patients on Naturethroid that she claims are doing great. My mom has been on T4 only for decades and has perfect numbers and feels good. So there is hope for all of us. Just need to find out if Naturethroid is giving me problems or I am just a nervous wreck making myself sick. 😂

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Naturethroid has been giving a lot of people problems since last year. We have definitely not seen anyone who is really doing great. They may feel better, but they certainly aren’t optimal. and they appear to have problems that they don’t realize are because of the naturethroid. And it’s destined to backfire eventually.

          Reply
          • Rita

            I know, I am worried about taking Naturethroid. But my labs are excellent. My doctor will change me to synthetic T4, test me, then add T3 as needed. But I hate to change when I already have perfect labs. And I have felt anxious before even when hypo, I have an anxiety disorder. I am just beyond frustrated right now… She already has switched me to NP then back to Naturethroid when NP went south, so she thinks it is all in my head.

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            That sounds nuts for your doctor to just switch you to just T4, then test. it sounds like your doctor is refusing to believe that T4 only is the wrong way to go. We already know that forcing the body to live for conversion alone is ridiculous. You need to be switched to both T4 and T3 then test. Fight for yourself.

    • Rita

      Update: So I stopped taking the beta blocker after 3 days, I started getting depressed! But I have been taking the AdrenaVive supplement my doctor gave me and I am feeling better. Apparently my adrenals are wack. No wonder my anxiety was sky high. So feeling more calm, sleeping better, and still on 2 grains Naturethroid. Pulse my normal high pulse (80-90) and blood pressure good. I am also exercising, meditating, and trying to reduce my stress. I have energy and am starting to feel like my old healthy self!

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        Glad you are feeling better! Though AdrenaVive won’t work for low cortisol (years of experiences on that since it’s only adaptogens), it can work for someone with stress and rising cortisol with its ashwagandha and other adaptogens.

        P.S. Naturethroid just isn’t what it used to be and has caused a lot of problems. Just an FYI. See if you can get optimal on it: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal No one has been able to, but it may be worth trying as long as you don’t get worse by raising.

        Reply
  152. Angela Frye

    Also…has anybody thought to contact Westminster, the company that DID issue the voluntary recall after the Sichuan Pharma issue? They might be able to shed some light on the subject. I read at least one post on this blog thread that had previously gotten their meds compounded from Women’s Int’l who told them they had no raw product available and didn’t know when they would. My question is, that if that is the case, who does? Forest/Allergan? And what is being put into the meds we’re currently being given? Synthetics? My labs look almost as if I’m only getting T3…and it’s dumping and then clearing out of my system rapidly…with high Free T3 one day post med and lowish Free T3 prior on the same dose as I’ve been taking for years now which has my levels usually pretty good (recent problems experienced aside).

    Reply
  153. Sharon

    Can anyone please help. I’m going to try compounded synthetics t3 and t4. I started Thyro gold 4 weeks ago got labs back today and my levels have plummeted. I feel blooming awful! I would love to keep increasing this but just can’t afford to be feeling this bad. I’ve only ever tried
    over 25 yrs ago when first diagnosed and had life
    threatening reaction. So, is there any specific brand of synthetics that the compounding pharmacy needs to use? I really don’t know much about them. Also, beginning to realize I’ve probably never been optimal in all these years. Thanks to Janie I’m really pushing for this now. No wonder my hair never grew back and I’ve never been able to lose all the weight I’ve gained no matter how hard I’ve tried. I really would appreciate any feedback on this.

    Reply
    • Eneida

      Hi Sharon, I was taking NP thyroid and feeling pretty bad, gaining weight, brain fog etc. I decided to do compounded T4 and T3 as Janie suggested and I feel so much better, you can’t imagine. Have only been taking it for a couple of weeks but it’s already made a huge difference, I take T4 38mcg and T3 9mcg 2 times per day. Hope this helps, Eneida

      Reply
      • Sharon

        Thanks Eneida! Do you take synthetics now? Do you mind me asking what fillers they use? And, what pharmacy? I’m going to see doctor today who is willing to work with me on whatever I would like to try.

        Reply
  154. Angela Frye

    Reminder to everybody to sign the petition regarding NP Thyroid by Acella…Also, for some reason, MoveOn has removed the “deliver to” name which is, for everybody’s edification, “Harold Deas -CEO”…Let’s keep up the pressure. Please circulate and share widely. I’ve just come from the hairdresser’s where I was told that I had some hairloss also in addition to my hyPER issues and problems. Great..just great. Petition link. STTM, I’d like to renew my request to share the petition on your social media pages as a thread. Both the RLC and the NP petitions. https://petitions.moveon.org/sign/np-thyroid-by-acella/?source=search

    Reply
  155. edison carter

    Had been getting my NP Thyroid, which was working better than any other NDT formula I’ve had for years! (120’s) from Express Scripts through the mail, for about a year+. After I got the bottle in August 2019, I thought maybe it had spoiled in transit due to summer heat here in TX, so I had them resend me another bottle. Same deal. So I went to Costco to check it out there. It was only slightly less bad. I decided to switch back to Armour, but after a few weeks I can already tell it is not as good at the same dose of previously excellent NP Thyroid. Argg.

    I called Acella and spoke to customer service there; they did not mention anything different than what is posted on the Acella website regarding the formulation.

    Reply
  156. De

    I have been taking 90mg of NP Thyroid for over a year but the past month or so (with receipt of my three month refill), I’ve been dealing with extreme fatigue again. Now I know why! Has anyone switched to another natural desiccated thyroid and had good results? I’m not going to keep taking NP if it has clearly been reformulated and no longer working for me.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      De, that’s also a paltry amount that was destined to backfire like this, even if the changed NP would do it, too. 🙁

      Reply
      • De

        Janie,

        So you’re saying that the dosage is too low? I’ve been fighting with my endo to keep me on the desiccated thyroid (I don’t want to go to synthetic) and although I’ve asked her to increase my dosage, she won’t due to my blood work (which I think she is relying too heavily on and not interpreting correctly).

        Reply
        • Di

          Same problem with Naturethroid/Armour. I am thinking of stopping the medicine
          altogether for a few days, and suffering, to get a lower TSH reading–so the dr.
          will prescribe more! Desperate.

          Reply
          • De

            Di,

            I can empathize. I did the same thing a year ago. Pathetic we have to alter our meds so we can ‘play the game’ with our doctors. I actually ordered some OTC desiccated (bovine) thyroid to supplement with my NP Thyroid. Started with 25mg/day on Monday (taken with my NP) and will see how I feel in a couple weeks. Fingers crossed.

  157. Janet

    I just got an unopened replacement bottle sent directly from Acella to my pharmacy because of reactions to my most recent prescription. It was just as bad and I actually got an anaphylactic reaction this time. I’m definitely filing a report with the FDA. I talked to Steve at Acella and he said he only takes down the adverse event reporting and doesn’t know anything about current status of testing, supplier, etc.

    I’m starting to go into panic mode now. I’ve never done well on any synthetic except Thyrolar and it’s not in stock. I don’t tolerate Armour, NatureThroid or Erfa. I was fine with NP until I got a prescription filled in September. If I don’t get at least 1 grain a day (my script is for 2) I will get heart failure quickly. Labs were fine before, now low free T4 (TSH is always low because of pituitary damage so we don’t use that – doctor didn’t order T3 this time). All iron parameters look good.

    Can anyone suggest a dye-free synthetic they have tolerated? I’m thinking about asking for Synthroid 50 mcg tablets but they are crazy expensive since my insurance won’t cover.

    Since everyone seems to agree on the cat urine smell and taste, I’m wondering if there new supplier is using ammonia in the extraction process that is not being removed in the final product.

    Reply
    • Karen

      Janet you could try tirosint sol
      It is a liquid version of levothyroxine
      But if you’re insurance doesn’t cover it very expensive.

      Reply
      • Terry

        With the Tirosint their website has coupons to lower the price. Also, Good RX gets the price lower as well.

        Reply
    • Starr D.

      Janet, just wanted to say if you do try Tirosint as Karen
      suggested (it came it soft gelcaps when I took it), you might want
      to take a little less than your normally do, and take it in two servings
      at least (two gelcaps or more to make your daily dose) and spread
      it out during the day–morning, afternoon—because Tirosint can
      hit people more strongly because of the liquidy gelcap form–it’s
      supposedly absorbed more quickly. When I started it, it helped
      with some symptoms the other drugs weren’t helping with, but I
      had to get off it after a few years because it seemed to give me
      some new symptoms I couldn’t deal with. Everyone is different,
      so read some current reviews on it, if you can (I’ve been off it for
      about four years) Web MD or wherever might have some more
      current opinions on it. Lowest dose it came in was 13 mcg, then 25
      and 50, etc. Split it up into at least two doses–that’s your best shot,
      if you’re sensitive….and start a bit lower than your normal final dose.
      Or take the white 50 mcg. of whatever brand to make your dose–I’ve
      gone that route in the past, too (not sure how much it helped, though.)

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        But try to have T3 with it.

        Reply
        • Janet

          Thanks! My insurance wouldn’t cover it, so we’re starting with Synthroid (name brand) and generic Cytomel (Paddock brand). If that doesn’t seem to be working I’ll look into that.

          Reply
          • Janet

            Found out the generic Cytomel they ordered was made by Mayne. I had a mild reaction the first day I tried it and a much more severe reaction the second day. So they said they’d get in a bottle from SigmaPharm and see if I tolerate that one better.

            The good news is that I’m doing really well on the name brand Synthroid. I feel so much better already, both physically and mentally. Lots more energy and clear thinking after several weeks of depression and fatigue on the new “litter box” NP Thyroid batch.

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Yes some people do better on T4 only than others. But a body is never meant to be forced to live on conversion alone from T4 to T3. There’s too many issues which can negatively affect that conversion. Far better to have some direct T3 in your treatment and get optimal.

  158. Angela Frye

    I’ve put up a petition to the CEO of Acella asking him to respond to our questions and concerns. Please sign, share, and otherwise circulate. https://petitions.moveon.org/sign/np-thyroid-by-acella

    Reply
    • Allyson Williams

      Thanks Angela. Signed!

      Reply
    • Starr D.

      Just signed it, and left a big, long comment–couldn’t help myself, sorry!
      I’ve been through too many of these thyroid drug changes over the years,
      and they have messed up my health so badly. I really hope you can
      get something going with this. Good luck.

      Reply
    • Jennifer M

      I signed the petition! I took this new formulation for 6 days and my hypo symptoms came back. I also started getting bad anxiety attacks by day 6. I called my doctor and luckily she had a couple months worth of samples that she sent me. Working on figuring out a plan after these pills are gone.

      Reply
    • Angela Frye

      Thanks to all for signing. Please don’t just sign. Share and circulate and encourage as many signatures as possible. Starr, I read your long comment. Please don’t apologize. Heartbreaking experience for you..And for all of us.

      Reply
  159. Angela Frye

    Below comment was posted to this week’s blog also, so 2nd time posting to ensure visibility. If not allowed, please feel free to delete… I did occasionally, if I remember correctly, have palps (as did another person responding to your “new WP” blog) on NP…Did not have on the good N-T..So at that point, don’t think it was adrenals. However, with the roller coaster ride that dessicated has been since the Naturethroid debacle, and an inordinate amount of personal stress, adrenals may well be a factor now.

    Unlike most of the people reporting feeling hyPO..I’ve felt hyPER.. First order of business is a cardio workup. One thing that I do want to bring to attention, though, is the FDA drugmaker alert on Sichuan Friendly API. Westminster voluntarily recalled their product, but according to the FDA alert, “However, FDA confirmed Sichuan Friendly’s thyroid API remains in the U.S. supply chain. This API and the drug products made from it, present a safety risk to patients. Sichuan Friendly API may be repackaged and/or relabeled before it is further distributed, and not all of the repackaged/relabeled API identifies Sichuan Friendly as the original API manufacturer. Therefore, manufacturers and compounders who make levothyroxine and liothyronine drug products should contact their API supplier to verify the actual manufacturer of the thyroid API they received before using it. Sichuan Friendly’s products may be labeled as “Thyroid Powder” or “Thyroid Powder USP.”

    Here’s the link to the entire alert…https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safety-and-availability/fda-alerts-drug-makers-recall-porcine-thyroid-api-sichuan-friendly-pharmaceutical-co-limited-china

    If I read the alert correctly…the FDA alerted and advised manufacturers but did not force their hand on a recall, which Westminster voluntarily did. So..we don’t know where or in what meds this particular API ended up. Or what the response of the individual manufacturers was, IF they utilized API from this source, again with the exception of Westminster, who appeared to care enough about their patients to issue a recall. And, interestingly enough have not, at least as far as I know, put product back out on the market leading me to wonder whether there is even another API source.

    Trying to open the actual Import Alert, also link to follow, but the link is not responsiv Important note, only actually published 10/17, over a year after the initial alert to manufacturers. https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/cms_ia/importalert_189.html

    Reply
  160. Sharon

    I have been reading about the outbreak of African swine fever killing millions of pigs in China and other countries. There is a story on The Compounder pharmacists website about this too and how it might affect the difficulty in obtaining the raw porcine. I’m also wondering about the effect this has had on obtaining the raw porcine material for NDT. Also, the ash content some are talking about. These pigs are being burned. So makes me think maybe it’s contaminated some of the raw porcine. Just a thought!

    Reply
  161. Maria

    This post is about the burning esophagus. I too had to switch from Naturethroid after the changes last year and went to Armour instead of NP. Doing well on 2.5 grains until this week I picked up a refill and within one day my esophagus and chest are burning. The pills look the same as my last Armour and still name brand with the Armour logo but slightly more shiny and hard.I’m seeing these postings about NP causing a burn and I’m wondering if anyone else is also having it on Armour and do they get their raw ingredients from the sameness source and if so I’m really worried.

    Reply
    • Anna

      I also have that burning, and really fear I have long-term damage, and frankly quite scared. I TOOK the pills all September and a few days in Oct, they switched me back to Nature-throid, and basically, IT is no better! Just did labs, but still need to have T3 and 4 done, I think something is clearly wrong with the pills now

      Reply
      • Laura

        I am also have burning but it’s in my stomach. This just started after I got my refill of NP!

        Reply
        • Karen

          Laura I have been off np since September 8 and still have burning and pain in my stomach throat and intestines.Their was an interesting story on the news this morning. They found a new enterovirus in the feces of pigs in China they said effects the DNA they don’t know how it attaches itself to the host and will be studying to find out more. I think all thyroid powder is contaminated right now read the post above about her reaction to armour this is not good.

          Reply
  162. Ashen

    I have the labs to prove that NP is no longer working, but it is still working better than Naturthroid did. In July 2019, I got labs that said my Free T3 was 2.9 pg/mL, and my free T4 was 1.05 pg/mL. I was feeling good and my hair was thickening up from the Naturthroid disaster. Then I got a new bottle of NP thyroid in August 2019. I definitely noticed the terrible smell and taste. My hair started thinning a bit again in September, but I hadn’t put things together yet. My new labs from October 2019 show a huge difference. My Free T3 dropped down to 2.3 and my T4 dropped to 0.92. This sucks! I don’t know if I should try Westminster, Armour, or up my dose. The bad taste makes me want to switch.

    Reply
    • Russ

      Sadly, My recent tests are about the same.
      TSH was .12. Now 2.48
      FT3 was 3.3. Now 3.1
      FT4 stayed the same at .8
      TPO Antibodies rose from 802 to 837. They were 1,239 when I was diagnosed. Spoke with my Dr. about going on LDN to try and bring them down.
      And gained 6lbs in 2 months.
      I started noticing hypo symptoms about a week after my new prescription but didn’t realize so many were having a problem until I read it here.
      My Dr. started me on a bio-identical T4/T3 med today. I hope this nagging muscle ache in the middle of my back isn’t already a side effect.

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        You’ll do very well on the two synthetics, but it’s very important to get optimal, which you weren’t and aren’t. See this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

        Reply
        • Russ

          No, defititely not optimal. And sadly, even though my new Doctor practices integrative medicine, and is willing to prescribe other meds, she is showing signs of using the TSH as the gold standard.
          If anybody near Orange County or LA County has found a good Doctor, please give their name and location.

          Reply
          • Beth

            Just taking thyroid hormone replacement might not be enough. I was diagnosed with Hashimoto’s 20 years ago and have always been on Armour and recently NP. It was not until I was diagnosed with celiac disease (anemia was my only symptom) and treated with a GF diet that my thyroid nodules and enlargement resolved. You can have more than one autoimmune disorder. Unless you treat them all, just taking thyroid replacement helps, but it is not enough.

            By the way, Type 1 diabetes (which you can develop at any age and celiac disease) are the two autoimmune disorders most commonly related to celiac disease (they share the same gene types).

            Easy to get tested for celiac disease. Simple blood test. I urge everyone to get tested before going gluten free because all celiac testing required you to be on a full gluten diet. Celiacs can be asymptomatic and it is systemic affecting fertility, the brain, joints, bones, etc.

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Correct, just taking the right thyroid hormones is one of many strategies those with Hashi’s and other autoimmune issues need to do, including avoiding gluten.

            There’s also now a good patient-to-patient Hashi’s book called Hashimoto’s: Taming the Beast with a great deal of good information, including a chapter on 96 short testimonies of what patients are doing to get antibodies down for Hashi’s, for one. There is also info on what autoimmune diseases can combine. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/hashimotos-taming-the-beast

        • Ann

          When starting on synthetics like Synthroid my current script would be for 100mcg. and 25mcg. of cytomel. I understand to multi dose the cytomel but would I ask my doctor to split up the dose of the Synthroid? Thanks for your help.

          Reply
          • Janie Bowthorpe

            You can cut them or ask for smaller amount pills.

          • Janet

            Ann, I just got my new prescriptions for the synthetic T4 and T3. I checked with a lot of people first to see which seems to be the least allergenic brands, and they all agreed the 50 mcg Synthroid with no dye is the best. So I’m taking two a day plus two to three spread out doses of 5 mcg of a generic Cytomel which also does not have any dyes. I reacted just a little to the Cytomel but hopefully will tolerate it. I did fine with the Synthroid. I was concerned the name brand Synthroid wouldn’t be covered by my insurance, but my copay was only $2. Same for the generic Cytomel.

            I’m so fortunate to have a doctor and pharmacist who will work with me but it sure gets scary when you have to change something so essential to our health as thyroid replacement. I have standing orders for free T4 and T3 to make sure I’m getting proper doses. I did great with Thyrolar years ago so I’m hoping this will work.

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            If you react to the T3, time to do this page://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info

  163. Wyline

    I switched to NP thyroid after I had the same terrible problems as everyone else this past summer when I refilled my NatureThroid. I didn’t realize how bad I was doing until I read about others similar symptoms and connected the dots. The switch to NP has been great for me – until I ran across this thread and immediately tried to get a new batch. The lot marked M that I was able to sniff reeked of cat pee and my pharmacist agreed with me. He is able to do compounding but told me that it will be very expensive. Fortunately he had various amounts and strengths of non-contaminated lots so I was able to combine and purchase enough to get me through early next year. I’m hoping things will be better after that but if you read the above article things look pretty grim to me.

    Reply
  164. Kelly

    I switched to a compounding pharmacy after the NP smelled and tasted awful (cat pee). I showed them the old NP and the new smelly ones and they could smell the difference. They get their thyroid powder from PCCA. They filled my order with a new batch of thyroid powder and it ALSO smelled like cat pee. They had an older thyroid jar of powder and compared them and they look and smell different. They let me take pictures of them with their chemical analysis. The old and new batch have a very different color and smell. The new batch has lactose and twice as much ash. I would like to send pictures to you but I don’t know how.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Wait, the “compounded” thyroid powder smelled like cat pee??

      Reply
      • Karen

        Omg why is there ash in this at all. I also tried compounded this spring and reacted bad tried three fillers same reaction after hundreds of dollars said can’t do it. Was told they get thier stuff from pccp also.google the toxic effects of ash to humans this has alot of symptoms people are getting. You and this pharmacy need to report these findings to the FDA. I will never trust ndt again.never mind the smell just finding the ash and lactose is very alarming in itself. I am still so sick and said many times I feel like am being poisoned. Ash contains many heavy metals. What f nightmare.

        Reply
        • Catherine

          I am not following. What is Ash? Thanks.

          Reply
          • Ryan

            Soot, burnt/expressed carbon. It’s garbage filler. Could explain the gray discolorations in the pills.

      • Patricia

        I had a feeling this was an issue. No one knows whats in this new “Thyroid USP” which all the manufacturers are using now to make NDT’s. Obviously, it’s not just freeze dried pig glandular. https://www.pccarx.com/products/THYROID-USP-POWDER-(PORCINE)/30-1467/APIS-EXCIPIENTS

        Reply
    • Patricia

      Kelly, Can you post the pictures on the STTM Facebook page?

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        Is Kelly allows me, I’m going to start a brand new blog post about this and will include the pictures.

        Reply
        • Karen

          Janie don’t you find this very concerning to know they found these ingredients in the porcine powder nothing should be in it but dried pig gland. Never mind twice the amount of ash or lactose. That pharmacist should know this and is mandated to report these findings. And to answer the person who said what is ash? Well it is either wood ash or coal ash. Both toxic to humans. I think this has been going on for a while. I would encourage her to report it instead of blogging because nothing is going get done just talking about it.

          Reply
  165. Patricia

    Janie …
    I Watched your videos from end of August. Just wondering how YOU are feeling? Have you run out of the old formula NP? Have you figured out what you are going to do now? I have tried Thyrovanz & Thyrogold but not having much luck. Tried going back to NP but it just makes me so sick. Getting blood tests in the AM & then seeing the doctor next week. I found an old supply of NP last night & took one & feel a tiny bit better today, only 6 pills though. Looks like we are in for a long rough road ahead. I hope you are doing well …

    PS: Someone posted on one of the Thyroid groups the strengths of T4 & T3 in Thyro-Gold – She said she called them & they gave her this info. The 300 mg pill = 100mcg T4 & 25mcg T3. So the 150mg would be half. Looks like the 300mg would be close to 150mg of NP or 2.5grs?

    Reply
  166. Lorie

    I’m thrilled to hear later batches are improving. I’ll have to talk with my pharmacist. Still dealing with the skin rash and a few other minor hypo symptoms. Had a crazy thought, it might be what the pigs are getting fed causing reactions in people. I’m allergic mainly to wheat, dairy, and nightshade. If the pigs eat a lot of potatoes that would explain my rash, increasing edema, headaches, etc. Seems like those with thyroid issues also have food issues with wheat, corn, nightshades, basically inflammatories coming through from the pigs to us. Any way to test how much solanine is ending up in the pills?

    Reply
  167. Jenny T

    Regarding Nutrameds desiccated thyroid, the tablets come in 130mg. Would these compare to the same amount of ThyroGold desiccated thyroid? I know the ThyroGold comes in 150mg and 300mg, and the 150mg size is equivalent to one grain of prescription desiccated thyroid (according to ThyroGold website). I know it is thought that the Nutrameds is weaker, but I don’t understand why, given that they are both dried thyroid gland, with some additives.

    Has anyone ever compared the efficacy of both of them, and what do you think?

    I am thinking about replacing my NP Thyroid due to the current issues. I have ordered Thyroid-S from Thailand, but it won’t be here for a month. I don’t want to renew my script for NP because I’m not even sure it works well, even though I have gotten “good” batches of it. So I’ll need a replacement while waiting for Thyroid-S to arrive. I already have a bottle of the Nutrameds desiccated thyroid. Thanks for any insight.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Nutri-meds has always been a little weaker, so you end up needing more. No matter what you switch to just keep track of your free T3 and free T4 and get optimal.
      https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
    • Elle

      Do I need a script to purchase Thyroid-S, and is it OK to name reliable purveyors of Thyroid-S? Where does everybody buy it?

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        No script. And no, we can’t post purveyors of Thyroid-S, as there’s nothing more that the FDA wants but to close them down. It’s happened before.

        Reply
        • Elle

          Thanks, Janie. I thought that may be the case. What an awful conundrum for those of us without a thyroid. In my dreams I would love to see thousands of Thyroid Patients storm Capitol Hill and demand 1) steady supply of meds that keep us alive, and 2) an investigation into why this isn’t happening.

          Reply
  168. Karen

    Has anyone considered a possible mold contaminated extract? Because I remember back in July saying these pills have a mildue taste to them.Believe me I know about mold highly allergic to many strains.

    Reply
  169. Ryan

    Started a fresh batch of 60mg tablets this morning coupled with my current 15mg tablet from the original fill as a trade in for the stinky cat pee pills that weren’t working for me. After having swallowed my dose this morning, within 5 minutes, I was already feeling better. I was juiced with energy seemingly and got up to start my day at 7am instead of my alarm time at 8am. Absolutely not groggy, nor am I feeling lethargic, no headaches (thyroid migraine-type) and the only remaining effect is a slight numbness or tingle in my middle, ring and pinky finger on both hands. Feet are a little cold, but I’m not getting that flushing feeling like I have a fever or anything at all. Brain fog appears to be gone.

    I don’t want to cash my chips in on the new supply, but I definitely feel a little better, if not back to somewhat normalcy. If that changes, I’ll reply to this.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Those are the mysteries we have to figure out i.e. did you get an old batch or have they made some changes secretly.

      Reply
      • Ryan

        Doesn’t appear to be an older batch, as there’s speckles or discoloration. The smell and taste are definitely gone and I certainly “feel better” but I wouldn’t claim it to be near as good as I was on the old stuff.

        Reply
    • Ryan

      As promised, I’m following up with the end of the day. Most of today was pretty good. Still some tingling in the finger tips and toes, but the hypo-headaches that I normally feel on the back of my head and neck, towards the top of my head are mostly gone. So some symptoms persist but are much less nagging than the dosage before, and I assume my body might be trying to get back into optimal range so this might be part of that. As I stated before, it was a trial getting off of naturethroid and getting onto NP, so some of these symptoms are very familiar. I’m hoping things improve from here, but I still feel a little run down toward the middle to end of the day. Hoping my experiences help, might be worth trying to swap out your stinky meds for ones that don’t stink. My pharmacist called me today and seemed heavily invested in my well-being and how I was doing today after starting the new fill. She agreed that there might be some soft hurdles to get back into adjustment, and it probably didn’t help that I was throwing additional dosages into my day with the stinky fill to try and balance myself out. Keeping my fingers crossed for myself and the rest of you. Hopefully there’s some light at the end of this crappy tunnel.

      Reply
      • Di

        This is hopeful; anyone else get a “good” refill? I am suffering on Naturethroid!

        Reply
        • Ryan

          As an update, symptoms come and go throughout the day. Mostly grogginess, tingling or numb/cold fingers and feet, occasional ocular headache, or back of neck which is a thyroid related migraine. I feel better than I was last week, still, but definitely not 100%. Someone posted that they were trying to get compounded thyroid powder but found out the new batch had more ash and lactose in it. Lactose inhibits thyroid absorption, which seems like a stupid move when you consider the purpose of these pills, unless they want their patients on higher doses to get their required thyroid hormone, thus generating a higher revenue due to the slight increase in price when adjusting dose. Seems farfetched, but pharma is so sketchy these days.

          Reply
          • Di

            I think you have hit the nail on the head! More fillers, weaker product means we spend more $ to get the same amount of pure medicine. Cheaper fillers or cheaper methods of production may account for the poor quality (and in my case, allergic reaction) to the new NP. It seems to be that way with everything! Clothes at the stores now are paper thin. Bacon (as just an example) used to be 16 oz., now 12 oz. packages for same price or higher. Everything is cheaper, smaller, thinner, and costs more. ‘nuf said.

  170. Angela Frye

    Yes, I do think there were problems with NP prior to July/August. I began to notice issues with a tachycardia incident while gardening toward the end of March and I’d noticed not so much fatigue in the latter part of the day, but a puny/blah apathetic feeling. I’d like to take the opportunity also to point out, that for one reason or another, certain fills seemed to coincide with higher RT3 on same or even lower dose. My single biggest complaint with NP, though, has been erratic BP and HR. I’d like to take the opportunity to repost here at the blog two comments that I have up at STTM’s Facebook page below.

    The hospital monitor Wed night during below described incident showed both PACs and PVCs in my case, with high BP (I’ve NEVER had…always lowish to low). I could feel these and doc/husband could see them on the monitor immediately after I felt. (PVCs reported by a former Naturethroid or WP user in response to a blog post about RLC problems, also with NP that resulted in a trip by him to the ER. Scary stuff. My posts below:

    STTM/Janie…I had a little trip to the emergency room Wednesday night on this med; with soaring BPs , erratic HR, and chest pain. . I’m waiting on some labs from Tuesday morning to report my findings more fully and I see my primary on Wednesday to discuss what happened and strategy going forward.
    Also..I’ve noticed that NP has stopped me and perhaps others from commenting on their Facebook page. In addition, many of the comments of concern have been hidden or outrightly removed. IMHO, that is not representative of a company that wants to do anything but damage control.

    So, I did finally get my labs back. I also had labs at the hospital (would have been about 2-3 hours after my PM dose). Tuesday labs; TSH .023L (.45-4.5), FT3 3.1 (2.0-4.4), FT4 .94 (.82-1.77):RT3 14.6 (9.2-24.1) so, look “normal”, if suboptimal w/ high RT3, but bear with me. Hospital labs; TSH.03L (no range given), FT3 4.7H! (2.3-3.9), FT4 .7 (.6-1.1). Would expect that different labs, esp at different times would be slightly different, but here is what it almost looks like to me…Like there is “uneven” distribution of hormone amongst pills a/o batches a/o added T3 which is very quickly in and out of the system. Irony is except for the soaring BPs and palps, I felt reasonably good. Sleep good except waking a little early. No to little edema, but easy weight gain/harder to keep off. . A comment on the STTM blog on this issue pointed to ractopamine as a potential feed additive contaminant. While I think it’s a little early to latch onto that as an explanation, my symptoms certainly seem (feeling hyper while LN) to fit. Not sure what I’m going to do. I have some Naturethroid fills from one of RLC’s mail-order pharmacies that I didn’t do well on either. I’ve gone back to some older Armour fills at a slightly lower dose until I see my PCP tomorrow and palps have lessened, but not disappeared. Think I’m going to ask for ‘scripts for both Armour and T4/T3 combo. I share everyone’s frustration, to say the least. Did well on Armour before change..Then BEST on ERFA before change..Then reasonably well on Naturethroid before change. Then just okay on NP, and now the current debacle. I DO plan to file FDA complaints, but wondering if a direct confrontation from the thyroid community with our leader:Janie, Mary, Elaine and a few hand-picked patients might be in order. Have included a ractopamine Wikipedia treatise link for those interested. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ractopamine

    Reply
    • Amy

      I was sick on NP from Feb & Apr of this year. I still have some of the pills and they reek. My RT3 went up on the NP as well and then came down again when I switched back to Nature-throid. Other than feeling really ill like I had a severe flu, tired, upset stomach I started getting debilitating headaches and severe leg edema. All of it went away when I stopped the NP – both times. I tried it 2x.

      Reply
    • Lori

      Angela, don’t you think your free T3 was probably high because you were at 2-3 hours post dose? T3 spikes in the blood and is hard to ‘measure’ unlike the more stable t4. Not saying you don’t need t3 but maybe you need to reduce it or spread it out more. Sorry about the hospital visit 🙁

      Reply
      • Angie F.

        Lori, I have considered that the hospital Free T3 measure was post evening med. However, post med measurements in the past have NEVER been that high (upper end of hospital range was 3.9, mine was 4.7). Somehow or another, I’m getting a T3 “dump” a/o something else in the NP that’s causing the BP and HR spikes and palps, and perhaps also contributing to the high RT3. Am wondering if the active ingredient has changed a/o is unevenly distributed. I have switched back to Armour on a lower dose (1 1/2 grain as opposed to 1 3/4-2 grain) and will talk to my doc about what to do in today’s appointment.

        Reply
  171. Erica

    I just started taking a new batch from express scripts. It doesn’t smell as bad as the previous batch from this summer(90 day supply). This batch taste a little sweet. I noticed the last batch smelling stronger, but just thought it was different pigs?! I’m also pregnant and have had to up my dose, so I didn’t realize people were having issues until I started this new batch. I was curious about the obvious change and searched the internet to see what was going on.

    Reply
  172. Jenny T

    I am wondering if the new formulations of NP Thyroid contain thyroid glands from dead pigs that died due to the African Swine Flu that is wiping out herds of pigs in Asia, and now in Australia too. I wouldn’t doubt if unscrupulous herd owners are selling body parts from sick animals.

    Reply
  173. Beth

    On NP Thyroid’s Facebook Page they posted on September 26th that they had in fact had a product update. They now get the active ingredient from Europe. https://npthyroid.com/product-updates/?fbclid=IwAR1XfdewX0Z3U7fuinKFMfomIQYiQgJXWxwyw6cgR9n-kyMTwMtnckgELQw

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Yes, a lot of people saw that. But that’s not admitting other clear changes. Specks, horrid smell, different taste, and a slow of bad symptoms reporting by many.

      Reply
  174. Amy

    I am glad to see this is coming out! I suffered on NP and was told it couldn’t be the NP. I experienced severe edema and it literally made me sick and caused debilitating headaches. Basically I was going hypo but the upset stomach was new. My labs supported how I was feeling. I was optimal before and after NP.

    I tried NP Acella 2x (2019 Feb & May) to confirm it was cause of my symptoms.

    Reply
    • Kris

      Did you report this? What are you taking now?

      Reply
      • Amy

        I reported to Acella 2x and they never responded. My doc was concerned especially after I took a break and tried a 2nd time with a different batch of NP but same result and it comes on quick. I stuck it out on the second round for 6 weeks and I got increasingly sick, the edema was getting scary.

        I had an old stash of Nature-throid which I restarted. I have since filled a new script for Nature-throid and I’m doing fine. My labs improved (Free’s & RT3). Notably I suffered a round of hair loss and the timing seems likely it was during my NP trial(s). It was frustrating as I kept telling folks even here that something is wrong with the NP so I’m glad to see this has come out so if someone has an issue they know it may be the NP.

        I still have some of the NP pills and they reek. I am not expecting odor less meds but these smell bad, something isn’t right with them.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          I think many would agree with you that something’s not right. The STTM Facebook page also did a post about burning in the esophagus and burning in the stomach after swallowing these pills for some.

          Reply
    • Kelia

      Janie, have you seen anyone produce labs to prove they’ve gotten optimal on something like Thyro-Gold? If faced with a choice of using the Thyro-Gold (or similar) or synthetic T3 & T4, which would be your first choice?

      Reply
  175. Christina K

    Yeah I was trying WP thyroid out for a while back in March 2019, and April too. That was reformulated too, quite a while ago. I didn’t do well with it at all, so I thought I’d try NP again. Well, first off, I tried out a compounded NDT which seemed okay, but my muscular pain was amplified on it, so I asked for NP again. The doctor gave me some free samples, and they were good. My new script of NP was filled last month, and it’s HORRID. It tastes like gasoline fumes, or bug spray. Disgusting. My hands are swollen, itchy, and I’m really tired too, and my throat hurts, my stomach gets upset more too. What a nightmare. I’ve been through old Armour, Erfa, NatureThroid, and now this. VERY upset.

    Reply
  176. Sharon Hagen

    I was frightened to refill my NPThyroid 120 mg. but could not get into see my doctor before I was going to run out. I did check with the pharmacist (at Costco) to make sure that what they had to give me was not from the batch numbers that have already been noted as bad and they said not. The pharmacist also checked and said he didn’t think the tablets had a strong smell so I…having no other option anyway….went ahead and ordered. I opened the sealed manufacturer’s bottle of 100 at the counter and there was no noticeable smell, smelled the same as my previous order filled last July. I still had a few pills from my previous order and when I compared the pills from the old and the new bottles there was no discernable difference in size, colour, or texture, no flecks in the new pills. I decided to keep the old pills and took the new pill that night. It dissolved under my tongue with no particular bad taste though it did very faintly have what others have described as an “insecticide” taste. It was so faint that it could have been my imagination, since I was afraid I would have the same experience as others with the new pills and might have been imagining it. I’ve been taking the new pills for a week now and haven’t noticed a difference in how I feel but I guess I’ll have new labs in 6 weeks and then I’ll know….or sooner if I start to have symptoms again. Is it possible that all our patient complaints have swayed Acella to fix what they broke ? Has anyone else made a recent purchase and had OK results ? I will post the batch number if someone can tell me where it’s found.

    Reply
    • Jeri

      Would you mind posting the batch number and exp date of your (hopefully) good new tablets?? I live in UK and get my prescription from the States. I am terrified of being sent the bad ones!!

      Reply
    • Ryan

      The lot number and expiration date will appear on the pharmacist fill-order bottle. If that’s what you have, it’ll start with an M and likely a 3xxxx-x number.

      Reply
    • Erin

      Hi Sharon, I just picked up a new 120 and 30 mg. They don’t have as strong of a smell and they still taste bad, though not quite as bad as they did before (not gag inducing anyway). Though I wonder if I have somehow become accustomed to the terrible taste? My pharmacist would’t help with batch numbers, so I’m unable to help with that. I’m not having hypo symptoms, though I am having the same strange head pain I had before I knew I had Hashimoto’s and before being treated with NDT. Now it’s back. It sounds strange, but my scalp hurts, almost like my hair hurts. I don’t know if anyone else has had this kind of pain. I’ve always thought it was connected to my thyroid or some kind of hormonal issue. I’m thinking of switching to Armour just to see if it helps with this pain.

      Reply
      • Valency

        I just picked up a new batch this weekend and the horrid smell is gone. I’m reallly hoping that they’ve fixed it.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          We’re hoping with you. Keep an eye on your symptoms, as my own husband was on the “normal”, non-changed tablets and his hypothyroidism came back on the same amount that he had soared on for a few years. That happened around mid-or-later summer.

          Reply
          • Julie

            Oh my gosh! I had the exact same experience as your husband over the summer! Ive been on NP Thyroid successfully for a year or more. Afternoon fatigue crept in and all get-er-done motivation was gone! Didn’t occur to me (because I was back in that fog) that it was my meds until end of summer because I have been stable for so long. Doctor switched me to tirosint with added T3 and I am back going again, however still trying to get optimal. I lost my whole summer and as a homeschooling mom that really SUCKS!

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Yup, he went through the exact same thing…on the NP tablets that looked and smelled the same BEFORE the obvious changes with specks, etc. So something was going on then….

        • Ryan

          My pharmacist replaced my 60mg tabs today for a non-smelly version of them. The color blotches appear to still be there, but there’s no questionable smell anymore. I start them tomorrow, but to be fair, I’ve noticed a slight decrease in hypo symptoms since being on these stinky pills. Not sure if the body is getting used to it and processing them better or what. Pharmacist told me she literally had a phone call complaining of the same issues as I did right after I asked for mine to be swapped out.

          Reply
  177. fliss

    also my labs were optimal in April 2019 and in sept 2019 they were much lower below range. have muscular aches and pains and constipastion too so same as many on here. really scared about the future now desperate to find a solution.

    ps. Janie my first post seems to have disappeared have I down something wrong? wanted to add this to it. can I get it back or do I have to re write? sorry]

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      I have only recently discovered that some comments were going into spam.

      Reply
      • Fliss

        Thanks Janie do you have any advice for me? I’m thinking maybe I should try and persuade gp to give me t3 and t4 but I know t3 costs loads here in uk and they don’t like to give it scared he may give me t4 alone which I reacted badly to years ago. Really want another ndt brand but confused as to which ones work still? Do you know of anyone here in the Uk ? Are you aware of the differences between problems in USA and Europe or are we all having same problem ?

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          All I can say is that none of the prescription US NDTS are the consistently good products they used to be. That observation comes from many of us who have been on NDT a long time and know what they used to be, and also saw all the changes.

          Can you make the NDT’s today work? We’re still not sure. Armour, even with its changes, is the only one we wonder about, but we have yet to see someone get optimal on it. And being optimal is important.

          So your choices are taking T4 and T3 and getting optimal. Or ordering the Thai brand thyroid-s, or the over-the-counter brands like thyro gold or thyrovanz…or just be on T3. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

          Reply
          • Fliss

            Thanks Janie I don’t think we have over the counter thyro good in the Uk. I will look into thyroid s is it easy to find ? And is it still working ? Or will try to get dr to try me on t4 and t3 . Do I just convert the t4 and t3 in 4.5 grains of np thyroid that I take into t4 and t3 and start stop np one day start t4/t3 next day ? Is taking t3 alone better than mixing t4 abc t3? I know it would cost more as t3 is very expensive here.

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            You send off for it. Check out natural thyroid solutions. com Or just T4 with T3 and getting optimal. One grain of NP is equal to 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3 for conversion purposes. Taking just T3 is fine, too, but you’ll have nothing converting to T3 for you in the background.

          • fliss

            thanks for the info Janie. are we sure thyroid S works as ive looked to up and can afford it I think, its cheaper than thyro gold. which is best? do they Bothe work well? are they both similar in strength to Np thyroid? I was on 4.5 grains of NP so would i take 4.5 grains of thyroid s or is it stronger or weaker? it only seems to come in 60mg tabs so that’s 1 grain am I correct? so I would have to take 4 tabs a day = 4 grains then cut tablet in a half to get half a grain..is that possible?

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Patients have been happy with either, honestly. Thyroid-S may be similar to prescription brands, but no matter what, we’ve learned to always retest our free T3 and free T4 after a few weeks of using a different med or supplement. Yes, 60 mg is one grain. A pill cutter can help, if needed.

          • Yesi

            I emailed Thyroid S , they stated that thier porcine was more than likely from China, is this worrisome?

          • fliss

            I cant keep taking the NP as feel really bad. is it safe to stay off thyroid medication when your thyroid is destroyed? if so how long for as I cant see. my dr for 3 weeks..will I be ok without for that long? i plan to ask if he can. try me on t4 and t3. I have found some old WP thyroid, they are out of date end; may 2019. no idea when i got them as date of prescription not on it, maybe 2017. they are brown and hard and dont smell like other NDTs..is this ok or do you think they are off? I could try them and see..but just bit worried . was WP ok in 2017 ? are they sublingual? ive never taken a non sublingual NDT…do you have to take away from food? can you crush and chew?

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            No, it will not be a good idea to be off that long. You can just switch to the wp as they last a long time. And you don’t have to do them sublingual. You can just swallow them too or chew them. Being able to do NDT sublingually was just a bonus (which Acella also ruined as reported by patients)

          • fliuss

            thanks Janie that’s helpful i will try old WP from tomorrow. they dont have the same smell as Erfa and Np and are dark brown is that how they should be? also is it worth, if they help, asking dr to try me on new WP…are people doing well on them or have they changed too? would you always recommend NDT over t4 and t3 together?

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Not anymore would I recommend NDT over T4/T3. Understand that I’ve been around NDT for 17 years, and there are others who have been around NDT a long time, too. And we’ve all seen how they are not the consistently good and effective NDT’s they used to be at all.

            Now we still have some people saying they feel fine on them, yet they don’t produce labs to prove they are fine. Fine is only when your frees are optimal, which used to be easy to do: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal Otherwise, that fine will eventually backfire!! So just saying one is fine on them doesn’t give confidence in recommending them to others.

            I do like the OTC natural thyroid supplements like Thyrogold, et al. Can someone get optimal? Maybe. Even adding T3 to them would be fine.

          • fliss

            thanks for your insight Janie I really appreciate it. I have been optimal, my labs were always right on point on Erfa and then. again on NP until April 2019. I tried the WP thyroid and feel absolutely awful, nauseous.. aches and pains , felt better yesterday when I didn’t take anything. both those are making me ill. I think I need to try and get dr to try me on t4 and t3. I was on. 4.5 grains so how much t4 would I take and how much t3 if so? and do I just start on the equivalent to 4.5 grains or have to work up to it? I currently split does 3 times a day…does one do that with t4/t3 combo? I am also on HC 30mg split 3 times a day for past 6 years now under too much stress to come off.

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Hi Fliss. One grain equals 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3. Yes, might want to continue splitting, morning and early afternoon.

    • fliss

      so if im on 4.5 grains ndt and switch to synthetics I should take 170 mcg t4 and 40mcg t3 split across the day. would I dose 3 times a day as I do now or just 2 times a day? so twice a day would be 85mcg t4 and 20mcg t3 morning and afternoon? how many hours apart? or 3 times a day its more complicated maths ..not sure what size they both come in? do I go straight onto this dose of 170 and 40 or do I have to raise slowly?

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        Twice a day works, like morning and early afternoon. We don’t have to be hung up on a certain amount of hours. I would personally just go to the equivalent of 4 grains and retest in 3-4 weeks.

        Reply
        • fliss

          thanks Janie have I got my maths right am I converting the correct way? 4 grains would mean 75mcg t4 twice a day and 18mcg t3 twice a day. I dont know what sizes they come in, not sure how I will get 18mcg of t3 as I think it comes in 20mcg so would it be ok to do 20 mcg t3 a day and 75mcg t4? if dr agrees to a trial I will do as suggested and post what happens. I went through all my bottles of NP thyroid and discovered some old ones from last year and 2017. I compared the colour , look and smell and the old ones are definitely more yellow in colour and no specks and smell better. I have about enough for a month so to keep me going until I see dr I am am starting on those today. I will post how I feel am hoping they will get me out of hypo state I am in, then hopefully try t4/t3.

          Reply
          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Hi. I’m not where I can do the math, but just multiply 38 x 4 to get the T4 amount, and 9 x 4 to get the T3 amount.

          • fliss

            thanks Janie. one question; im. having bloods done before I see dr as he wants a baseline. ive never been clear as to whether I take my NDT that morning . I have bloods at 1pm and take NDT at 8am. otherwise I worry that last dose day before ate 2pm there won’t be any t3 left in my system by 1pm the next day and will give false low? also if/when I switch to t4/t3 what does one do re bloods and last dose before ? I always have bloods around 1pm as that’s how surgery does it. also if dr won’t prescribe t4/t3 I will have to try thyroid s as seems no other options left> does that one work well , how strong is it compared to NP? do we know its sourced safely?

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Take your thyroid meds as normal one day, then do labs the next morning before taking meds.

            You just try to switch to an amount of T4 and T3 that is somewhat equivalent to what you’ve been on with NDT. One grain of NDT is equal to 38 MCG of T4 and 9 mcgs of T3. Then in a few weeks, we redo the free T3, free T4 and rt3, and tweak as needed until optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

        • fliss

          thanks Janie so it doesn’t matter if there’s been 24 hours between having taken any meds and blood test? how can there be any t3 left in my system? is this the same advise if on synthetics?
          and is thyroid s a good substitute for NP if I cant get synthetics?

          Reply
          • Janie Bowthorpe

            This is about taking T3-containing meds twice a day like NDT or 3 times a day like T3. That way, it’s not 24 hours.

          • fliss

            I cant get my bloods done till the afternoon at my surgery that’s what was worrying me. what I will do is take either not or t4/43 afternoon dose later than normal day before bloods , something like 6pm.would that be ok with a 1pm blood test following day? if we are on t4/t3 is it best to take 3 times a day?

        • fliss

          hi Janie I managed to persuade my GP to prescribe t4 and t3 to try. im just waiting for them to be delivered tomorrow so will start Thursday. as you suggested even though I was on 4.5 grains NP when optimal I will start at equivalent to 4 grains which is about 150 msg t4 and 35mcg t3.
          just to be clear can you let me know im correct: I take my NDT ( old bottle of NP that I luckily found ) tomorrow as normal 3 x a day. ( I split it 2 grains 8am, 1.5 grains 12.30 and 1 grain 5pm. ) then the following day I can switch straight over to t4 and t3 and stop NDT?
          I want to continue to take t3 split 3 times a day as my body is used to getting the t3 in NDT at those times. I will keep to same time scale and do 15mcg t3 8am, then 10mcg 12.30 and 10mcg 5pm. ( the tablets are 20mcg so I will have to quarter them , hoping I can) but do I need to split t4 or can I just take it all 150mcg at 8am? also should I raise it all slightly to equivalent of 4.5 grains NDT ive been used to and if so when? I am booked in for bloods in 4 weeks then seeing GP to asses. I will post my results but i presume it may take more than 4 weeks to be optimal?
          do we have to take synthetics before food and if so how long before? is that t3 and t4 if so? do we avoid certain supplements if so what and how long between? im used to sublingual so never worried about food or supplements …
          I will post how I do on synthetics and really hope they work for me. is anyone else on here switching to t4 and t3 ? would be great to know how you are going if so?
          thanks for all your help and advice . fliss

          Reply
          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Hi. You really don’t need to take NDT more than twice a day, such as taking it morning and early-to mid afternoon, by the way. But since NP has now been so problematic, and you need to switch to T4 and T3, you could also try just twice a day as mentioned. The T4 will be converting to some T3 for you.

            Since it’s close to what you were taking, you might be able to recheck your labs in 2-3 weeks or so.

            No, many take with food, but they avoid iron, calcium (like milk products) and estrogen at the same time. Some even drink with coffee and cream and are fine. But it’s up to you. 🙂

          • flkss

            thanks for answering my questions Janie… but do I also need to split the t4 twice a day? or can I take the 150mcg of t4 just once a day at 8am?
            when would you suggest I try to raise to equivalent of 4.5 grains from 4 grains you suggest I start on? and why do you suggest that is it to see how I go by starting lower or are synthetics stronger?
            I presume its ok to just swop one day from NDT to synthetics the next day?
            and does it take longer than 4 weeks to see optimal blood results ? sorry to keep checking I just want to be sure im doing it right

          • fliss

            posting again as no reply: hi Janie but do I also need to split the t4 twice a day? or can I take the 150mcg of t4 just once a day at 8am?
            when would you suggest I try to raise to equivalent of 4.5 grains from 4 grains you suggest I start on or do I wait till bloods and then raise the extra equivalent to half a grain?
            why do you suggest that I start on equivalent to 4 grains when ive been on 4.5 grains for years is it to see how I go at first by starting lower or are synthetics stronger?
            I presume its ok to just swop one day from NDT to synthetics the next day?
            and does it take longer than 4 weeks to see optimal blood results ? sorry to keep checking I just want to be sure im doing it right

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Moving to the T4/T3 equivalent of 4 grains is just to be safe, then test in a few weeks to see if you need to tweak and how much. Yes, a one day swap.

  178. fliss

    is anyone on here in the UK having this problem? I am in UK and starting having hypo symptoms and hair falling out nails cracking put on weight didn’t know why until I saw this. was doing great on ERFA for years until that changed swopped to NP did well until a few months ago. don’t know what to do as in uk I don’t think we can get compounded NDT? I am one of the lucky ones whose GP prescribes for me so I don’t pay as am unable to work and cant afford it. any suggestions on what to do as going to GP in a few weeks to ask him to prescribe something else and show him this? should I ask him to prescribe armour and crush it? if so do you crush in your teeth or before you put in mouth? or try t3 and t4. I take 4.5 grains NP have tried going up to 5 but temp is up at 37.3 and feel awful..should I lower until I get a replacement? thanks for any suggestions .

    Reply
    • Waveylines

      Feel for you Fliss. An on nhs script for np too. So far I seem to be still getting the original tablet & have felt fine. Ive been optimally dosed for 10years on ndt apart form the blips for Armour, Erfa changing knocking me sideways..lol.
      For once am at a loss of ehat to do….lol.

      Reply
      • fliss

        hi waveylines I am the same as you really happy on Erfa till change and then np till recently. its a nightmare working out what to do. what are you currently taking? im at a loss too as feel better when not taking any NDT now but know I will go downhill quickly . im going to see if ~GP will prescribe t4 and t3. what are you going to do? are you in the uk?

        Reply
        • fliss

          waveylines can you tell me the date you got the ones you’re doing fine on and the batch number and exp date please? so I can compare to mine
          thanks

          Reply
  179. Tina

    I knew it had to be the new NP when I started having flu symptoms, muscle aches, nausea, stomach ache, breaking out into hives and feeling foggy/depressed. I was perfectly fine until taking the new disgusting NP. It’s scary the effect the new formula was having on me.

    Thankfully, I have a couple months supply left of the good formulation to take until I figure out what to do next.

    My question is this… If I wanted to get back on synthetics how would I go about doing that? Would I take my last NP dose and the very next day start on the synthetics? Or would I need to wait a day or two before starting them?

    My other question is how long does it take to start feeling somewhat normal on synthetics?
    I ask because in the past I have tried getting back on synthroid and I felt very ill with severe anxiety and depression and sinking feeling in my stomach.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi. Yes, we move to the equivalent amount of both synthetics. The way to figure that out is by this formula: one grain equals 38 mcg of T4 and 9 mcg of T3. So if one is on two grains right now (which is rarely optimal), they would move to double of each. Etc. Just remember to do labs along the way get optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal

      Reply
      • Tina

        Thank you so much for your reply, I really appreciate it. I have so much respect for you and what you do for the thyroid community! Your knowledge on this topic is truly invaluable.

        May I ask what your preferred treatment is now that NDT has become completely unreliable? Would synthetic t4/t3 be your first go to, or Thyro-gold? Is Armour any good at this point?

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Hi Tina. I’m still pondering. Have my husband on Thyroid-S and he’s doing so much better on it. I might even go that route as I don’t have issues with fillers. Or I’ll do Thyrogold, or T4/T3. I could even add T3 to Thyrogold. Lots of options to ponder as I use my formerly good NP up. As far as Armour, it’s the only one we wonder about. But again, seem to see too many having problems getting up to optimal. It’s a hard call honestly about Armour.

          Reply
          • Tina

            Ok I see. Where do you get thyroid-s from? As far as thyrogold goes how would you dose that?

    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Oh and remember: this is not about just being on T4. We always do better on both T4 and T3…then getting optimal.

      Reply
  180. Darlene

    It was so difficult getting Naturethroid that I switched to NP Thyroid last year. I didn’t notice a change in how I felt, although it was an awfully stressful year so would I have been able to tell if it was that anyway. The last refill I got had that awful smell but the one I picked up today does not seem as bad. The pills say 330.

    Reply
    • Ryan

      Do the pills look discolored, or are they a solid color?

      Reply
    • Darlene

      Reply from Acella:

      Good afternoon Darlene,

      Thank you for contacting us! As you know with a natural product such as NP Thyroid, there will be slight variations from batch to batch. We did change API suppliers so that we can ensure that all of our consumers who rely on our product, are able to receive it. Even changing suppliers, we continue to use the same exacting quality control process and rigorous testing that we always have so that we can ensure the product delivers the appropriate amount of T3 and T4. We have received feedback from some patients, on the smell, and again being that the product is a natural product there will be slight variations.

      I hope this helps!
      Thank you!!!
      Quality Assurance Specialist

      Reply
  181. Ryan

    I was thriving off NP thyroid 1x 15MG 1x 60MG daily, and was able to skip a day between doses without feeling like garbage. I can’t even avoid feeling like garbage on the day I dose. I do recall feeling this way when I converted from Naturethroid to NP Thyroid against my will, but I have little hopes for the same outcome. I also spoke to Steve from Acella after I left a complaint through their website, and while his demeanor was polite, his questions and directness were cold and calculated. I’m sure he’s doing several of these calls a day but wouldn’t admit to that being the case. In any event, I gave him my info, and he wants to collect some of the pills for testing purposes, which sucks since I don’t even like stomaching the idea of dropping one of these suckers in the sink by mistake to avoid shelling out $37 for a full refill. Literally more expensive than viagra at this point. My 15MG tabs appear to be the old version, oblong shape, no speckles or blotches, no fishy or rancid smell, and I’m not feeling entirely like I’m without my dosage. I’m hoping Naturethroid magically jumps back to life here so I can go back on my single dose 81.25MG and stop with this circus act going on in the NDT world.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      So far, RLC seems to be doing the same thing Erfa did after their pills went south…nothing.

      Reply
      • Ryan

        I guess we’ll have to wait and see. Naturethroid is almost back in full swing according to their site and even with the introduction to their reformulated pill during their amateur-pharmaceutical-meltdown, I did ok. I switched to NP purely because it was a crapshoot whether I’d be able to get NT at any given refill, but I did enjoy the reduced cost (at the time) and the ability to skip a day somehow while on NP. Hoping they change things back or fix whatever mistake(s) they’ve created here. Not being a backed FDA drug means they can sink or swim, and there’s nothing they can fallback on if their customer base picks up and moves elsewhere. Speaking of the FDA, they e-mailed me back saying NP is out of their control since they aren’t approved by the FDA. So their hands are tied.

        Here’s their reply:
        Thank you for writing to the Division of Drug Information in the FDA’s Center for Drug Evaluation and Research (CDER).

        We are so sorry to learn of your experience, and we appreciate that you chose to share your concerns with us.

        It is important to note that NP Thyroid does not appear to be an FDA-approved drug. To see the marketing status of a drug product, visit http://labels.fda.gov, search for the product and view the Marketing Category in the last column to the right.

        Since 1962, drugs marketed in the United States have been required to demonstrate both safety and efficacy in order to be legally marketed. Don’t assume a drug is FDA-approved because your doctor prescribed it or your pharmacist dispensed it. Many unapproved drugs are marketed illegally without brand names and have been available for many years, so health care professionals and patients assume they are approved drugs. This is not correct. FDA-approved drugs have been evaluated and approved while unapproved drugs have not been reviewed nor approved so neither their safety nor their effectiveness can be assured.

        At any time, a company may choose to submit an application to the FDA for the review and possible approval of NP Thyroid. The FDA can only approve those products for which applications are submitted demonstrating that a product is safe and effective for its intended use.

        To learn more visit the page Unapproved Drugs Initiative and/or view our Unapproved Drugs Video.

        Despite the information provided above, we recommend that you report your experience with NP Thyroid through the MedWatch program, a voluntary system of reporting to FDA any product problems and/or adverse effects. You may fill out the MedWatch form online or download a form and follow the instructions on page 4 to send it to us.

        Your report, along with others, is an important element in our continued surveillance of the effects human healthcare products. Thank you for making us aware of your situation.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          And THAT is what has been so concerning about reporting it to the FDA. But…with all of them now having gone south, what choice do we have but to report what has happened to Acella….

          Reply
  182. Stephi

    Hello 👋
    I take NP Thyroid since 5 years and order it here from Germany. I was always very satisfied with it and felt very good.
    Now I got my blood results and the first time my ft3 is very high 7,8 (2,0-4,4)
    ft4 is normal 1,36 (0,9-1,8)

    So what can I do now ?
    Wait or lower it directly ?

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      That may be about your adrenals. Read this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/pooling

      FT4 is ok. It shouldn’t go higher than 1.4ish, by the way, with that range.

      Reply
      • Teri

        You cannot should blindly guess 1.4 FT4 is acceptable when we know T4 always has the risk of converting into RT3 if it doesn’t convert to T3. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE trst your Reverse T3 BEFORE you accept ANY T4 level # to acceptable. Many of us got very very sick accepting FT4 in midrange. This is an individual disease and NO # if T4 is acceptable across the board. Do yourself and your body the favor of testing RT3!!

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Teri, STTM is now about 17 years of repeated patient experiences, observations, and wisdom. And on NDT or T4/T3, no one gets into trouble if FT4 is no higher than 1.4 with a range that stops at 1.7. So why would someone see RT3 to up?? Not because of 1.4 or less. It’s because of low iron, high cortisol or inflammation. And it’s also why we stress to test RT3 and treat the cause. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/reverse-t3

          Reply
  183. Lorie

    I’ve had a rash/hives, that tends to happen when I eat wheat, for the last couple weeks or so. I haven’t changed my diet or added a new food. Wondering if