On July 1st, 2014, the pharmaceutical Actavis completed the acquisition of Forest Laboratories, the makers of Armour which is the oldest desiccated thyroid product on the market today. They then changed their name to Allergan.
And the poop hit the fan
By early 2015 and onward, more and more patients were reporting being quite unhappy with Armour. The price has risen substantially and often, and patients were also reporting a return of hypothyroid symptoms. It’s not all patients, but a substantial amount.
And this is not the first time we’ve been unhappy about Armour!
First, in 2007, patients were reporting that the two grain size tablet seemed to not be working at all. Then in 2008, patients had to endure seeing Armour disappear on the shelves. When they finally returned by 2009, all heck broke loose. Hypothyroid symptoms were returning with a vengeance. Turns out they “reformulated” it, increasing the cellulose and decreasing the sucrose. Not only could we not do it sublingually anymore–a method we preferred and which did in fact work—it also was causing a return of our hypothyroid symptoms in the worst way. We had to move to other brands. By 2012, the tablets were now softer, and complaints were down. But here we are in 2015 with a new pharmaceutical maker…and complaints have risen all over again.
The price has risen!
In September 2015, I sought out patient feedback in a few groups from those who had been on Armour before the July 1st, 2014 final acquisition, but were still on it in 2015. The first exasperation was about price. Here are some of the comments I got when I asked about a price change:
- $20 before/$78 now. (forced to change insurance from my low copay to a high deductible plan)
- Last year was paying £52 pounds x100 now paying £74.00
- With co-pay, from $5 to $25-30 now
- Over $20 increase for 90 mcg, 30 pills
- With co-pay, $20 for 90 day supply in February 2015, $25 for 30 day supply in August 2015.
- Last year cost $7-9, getting refill now-$33
- $5 up to $24
- Went up to $55 for a month’s dose of 120s (with insurance)
- Went up about $15 dollars
- Since last year, went from $5.80 to $10.80 to $12.80 and now $18.60.
- For 180 tablets, from $22 to $160
- I paid $47.30 before. When I ordered last week, its $71.91, same quantity and mcg.
- $20 increase in cost.
- $10 to $32
- From 43.00 to 63.00
- From $25 to $60
- My armour started off at $23/mo, in July 2014 and it just started climbing every month. In November 2014 it was $47/mo. Naturethroid is $39 for 90 days.
- $29 to $44 for 30 of the 90mg.
- Went from about $20/month to $92/month.
- $6 in 2007/$30 now
- From $15 to $55 per month (with insurance)
- From 70.00 to 118.00
- 3-month supply 57.00 a year ago to 85.00 now out of my own pocket at Costco!
- Went up $20
- Went up $30
- Up $25
There were more answers, but you get the drift. Note that the differences in cost represent different insurance coverages and different amounts. But it’s clear: Activas/Allergan substantially raised the price! Patients are NOT pleased.
The change in the pill itself
Though a small minority felt the pill hadn’t changed, and a couple said it was softer, 80% said it was definitely harder–exactly what went on in 2008.
One gal stated: “Not as uniform. Some softer than others; some harder to dissolve ; some seem to contain more filler”. That makes one wonder if her bottle had a mix of the 2014 and 2015 pills. Another gal stated: “Harder, different taste, smell and texture. Breaks clean.”
Most who responded either tried an increase or moved to a different brand
The answers broke out like this:
- A very small percentage have stayed with the same amount as 2014 and feel they are doing fine
- Another very small percentage raised and are doing fine.
- A larger percentage are still on the same amount as 2014, or have tried a raise, but state they are not doing well and/or their labs are now wonky.
- A large percentage have or are moving over to a different brand.
Symptoms reported as returning
For those who noticed their symptoms of hypothyroidism have returned since Activas bought out Forest, some are described as follows:
- I now get tireder
- Feels like symptoms are slowly returning…fatigue and intolerance to heat/cold particularly
- Severe itching on sides of bridge of nose, hair falling out has worsened, feet have severely dried out-tops and bottoms, more unexplained weight gain 80%
- My hair has started falling out all over again. Very unhappy.
- Feel worse, more tired, but could be because of new baby
- Have felt worse. It seems less effective.
- Felt worse. Free T3 and free T4 plummeted.
- My TSH has climbed!
- Problems and raising didn’t help.
- Labs changed quite a bit.
- Eye sight problems, loss of energy sooner in day; dr will not increase dosage..
- My weight has gone up since January. Not happy.
- I now have depression that I didn’t have before.
- My weight has been creeping up and I have no changed my diet.
- I don’t feel as well.
- More tired. Have to nap now.
Comments by patients
- I started on it for the first time in my life Feb. 2014. By May I had lost 20#. By Jan. I gained my weight back and wondered what in the world is going on.
- Started on Armour in March of 2014 but was also being treated for breast cancer so my results were probably a little skewed. Now on a higher dose and feeling better but not happy about the tremendous price hike!
- Just got back from Endo. My labs are awful. Have been on same dose of Armour for a year. Even increase it a tad. T3 and T4 dropped. TSH went from 0.53 to 2.9. No wonder I feel like crap. She switched me to Naturethroid.
- I’ve been on Armour for 3 years after my thyroid was removed and have done well until April or May of 2015. My hair started falling out, my body ached, I’ve put on weight, I started feeling depression and I’m more fatigued. I have no doubt that changes in the negative have been made to Armour and I’m ticked. I am changing brands.
- I have felt fine all this time, but I’m not happy with the swift price increase.
Bottom line is up to you
It’s a fact that Armour has gone up substantially since 2014’s acquisition of Forest by Actavis/Allergan. And it’s a fact that many other brands are much cheaper. So that would be up to each individual as to what they want to pay–more for Armour, less for other brands. The Options page on STTM lists all your brands.
As far as problems on the current Armour, it does appear that for too many, hypothyroid symptoms have returned and/or labs are now off. So even though there are definitely some that still remain happy, you will have to decide.
** You can read how Janie felt about Armour in 2009 here.
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** Have you read the STTM II book? All chapters written by doctors from their unique perspectives. The patient-to-patient revised STTM book here. Hashimoto’s: Taming the Beast is also available!
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385 Responses to “Armour and a lot of unhappy thyroid patients…all over again!”
Cómo puedo conseguir esta medicina?ðŸ™ðŸ» Gracias
No sé de qué paÃs eres. Pero si estás en México, tienes una forma de T3 que puedes agregar a t4, llamada Cynomel.
Are there any updates on the RLC labs recall and who is behind it? With Armour and NP (competitors) going up 3-4 times it appears to be something shady to me and many of us. WP and Nature-Throid from RLC are no longer available again and were superior to most thryoid Rx including NP and Armour.
The FDA is behind recalls. But also behind the recall were two years of a growing body of patients noticing problems on Naturethroid first, later WP, and reporting those problems here, in groups, and they also went to the FDA. The latter may have alerted the FDA to instigate the recall. So really nothing shady. And not everyone thought Naturethroid was superior to NP. Some thought NP was superior as it could be done sublingually and had a sweet taste. But it’s all just patient choice. Finally, raises in pricing simply happens in the market, and some higher prices just seem plain greedy, like what happened when Armour was bought out by another company a few years ago.
As a new member of the Hashimotos/hypothyroid club, I’m trying to research as much as possible. I’m new to this site and am devouring everything – just bought the books too! That said, I have a quick/timely question. I recently started Armour. Can I dissolve it whole, under my tongue (which I did this morning relatively easily) or should I crush it first? Just trying to get it into my system as efficiently and effectively as possible. Any insight/experiences/opinions are welcome. Thank you!
Yes, you can dissolved it under the tongue, or crush it, or swallow it. Just avoid at the same time with calcium, iron, high fiber.
Loved NDT. Took W.P and got great results back in 2017 but then it disappeared. I had to back on awful levo until I found an endo that prescribed Armour in 2018 and this probably saved my life as felt awful on levo as if I was just existing. Unfortunately my hospital in the UK decided not to prescribebit any more and I had to go back on levo. I decided to spend several hundred pounds on several months worth of W.P when it returned but what a joke that was. I decided to then buy Armour even though it is nearly twice as much as W.P. Both are now useless, both ferl like I am completely unmedicated. I would be surprised if these medications actually consist anywhere near the amount if thyroid hormone they say particilarly T3.
Paul, the majority are doing wonderful on Armour today. Probably need to understand what being optimal is https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Loved NDT. Took W.P and got great results back in 2017 but then it disappeared. I had to back on awful levo until I found an endo that prescribed Armour in 2018 and this probably saved my life as felt awful on levo as if I was just existing. Unfortunately my hospital in the UK decided not to prescribe it any more and I had to go back on levo. I decided to spend several hundred pounds on several months worth of W.P when it returned but what a joke that was. I decided to then buy Armour even though it is nearly twice as much as W.P. Both are now useless, both feel like I am completely unmedicated. I would be surprised if these medications actually consist anywhere near the amount if thyroid hormone they say particilarly T3. Despite writing to both companies I received the stock answer (nothing has changed). I even went as far as challenging W.Ps claims legally but this time without response. These companies appear to be defrauding people as we are paying for something that simply doesn’t work. It can’t really be about money because many users will stop buying which would have huge financial implications for these companies. I have asked the FDA to look into these claims.
I love armour 2018 – 2020 user!
I started on Armour 2 months ago to see if it would be an improvement on the NP Thyroid by Acella which seemed to change radically for me in May or June of 2019. I am doing terribly on Armour- I agree with what a nurse wrote below about the new Armour: that my symptoms are all over the place: hyper, hypo. Rashes on my hands and scalp. Sleeping and not sleeping. Unable to think straight. Depressed and I have been doing well. Unable to get going in the morning and I am a morning person. Heart palpitations, stiffness, anxiety..I have done well on the natural thyroid for 9 years… I switched when Armour got bought out in the fall of 2015, I switched when Naturthyroid seemed to change for me in the spring of 2018 and I went onto NP in the Spring of 2018 for the last 15 months and then it changed- and I am now on Armour. I really don’t know what to do… I am wondering if the synthetic T3 and T4 are my only choice now? I called several compounding pharmacies and one said we have not been able to get the natural pig thyroid for over 2 years, so all they have is synthetic.
Taking the two synthetics can work as long as you get optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Thank you Janie- this is a wonderful website… glad it’s here!
I’ve been on Armour since 2007. Have done fine on it until now. I’ve had 2 A-fib bouts in 10 days, where my heart beat extra beats but did not quiver like the ones in the past. Went to my HMO Urgent care both times and with some extra Metoprolol got my heart back to normal. My Mom broke her arm about 4 weeks ago and I’m not sure if the added stress is the trigger.
I have not changed my dose, last labs in June this year showed good levels on FT3&FT4. Now I am below ranges on Free T3, Total T3 (mix up in lab instead of Free T4) and my TSH was within the normal ranges. THAT concerns me as it’s usually very, very low. Anyone else on Armour right now having these issues? I did change to a emergency supply of NDT that is not Armour. Any others in the same boat as of October and November 2019.
Armour Thyroid: They provide 38 mcg levothyroxine (T4) and 9 mcg liothyronine (T3) per grain of thyroid. The inactive ingredients are calcium stearate, dextrose, microcrystalline cellulose, sodium starch glycolate and opadry white.
OpadryÂ® II white contains polyvinyl alcohol, titanium dioxide, talc, polyethylene glycol 3350, and lecithin (soya).
PVA, PEG are not meant for long term use. TALC is a KNOWN CARCINOGEN and POISON! Look up the systems and side effects. I’ve have all but a few for over 3 years, luckily, no COMA or DEATH! Hopefully no CANCER. I stopped 2 days ago and on a detox mission!
All your symptoms I had when they obviously changed the formula As US pharma prices tripled I went to Candian Pharma they sent 205 tabs for $80 I took one it tasted sweet went on FDA site found they had banned the seet ones years ago So screwed again.I then went back but doubled the dose on a useless idiot doctors advice. I might as well not taken them so doctors visit another $80 plus tabs $35 at WINNDIXIE screwed again
So I stopped taking anything the pharmacist was shocked!
I didnt get screwed ever again as I live with HYPO and my hubby loves me more now than when the idiot Endochronologist Dr METCHICK of Edgewater Florida told me to have my thyroid removed costing $1000 screwed again I wonder when all our money has been stolen from us what these evil greedy sick bastards will do for living costs. I hope they starve My only wish is that we get together hire an assassin like they do us and get these nasty buggers concrete boots.
I have been on synthroid for ten years. Decided to switch to armour Sept. 2018 to help with a little extra energy issues. In Nov of this year I started to ha be short of breath. I have had a ton of testing on my lungs and heart. Everything is normal. On Sunday I was rushed to the hospital with out if control heart rate and sky high blood pressure with pain in chest. Checked everything and they suspect a fib. I have always been complimented on my strong and healthy heart by every Dr I have ever seen. This is a totally new issue. I am 36. I can’t believe that this isn’t related to the armour. I was doing ok on synthroid, just still having some energy lag and hashimotos flair ups. I took a half dose of the armour today and am dizzy and high heart rate. Will be switching back to synthroid at next appointment, I can’t live like this anymore!!
I lost my thyroid to papillary thyroid cancer. I am on Armor 123 and after my August refill I ended up hypo. I had an increase of adding armor 5mcg 4 times a week. My hair is falling out at the roots, i have joint pain and awful brain fog and prediabetes.thinking its not working well and I may change from NDT which is too bad because i really liked it.
I am from Germany and I order US or Canadian natural thyroid via a German international pharmacy.
Yep, I can confirm the price hikes and the long shipping times.
Before the price hikes I used Erfa (until 2016) but that price nearly doubled (because 2 Grain tablets are no longer available… and because 500 tablets not either, at least not over here).
So I switched to WP Nature Throid but that price did increase generously, too, by about 60%. 100 tablets each 1 Grain is about Euros 36 and it takes 8 weeks to deliver that stuff. Two years ago a 500 tablets package was delivered in 2 weeks despite the fact that it had to be imported!!!
But nowadays there are no packages with 500 tablets available. Which is very annoying because I need 3 Grain /day.
I am absolutely miffed.
It isn’t that difficult to produce that stuff. As a matter of fact it has been produced since the middle of the last century. So why these difficulties?
Let me guess.
Greedy pharma companies?
I don’t want to switch back to synthetic throid. I need both T3 and T4 and the synthetic stuff is very difficult with respect to dosage. Also I feel like sweating plastic literally whenever I go on synthetics only. I lose all concentration and I sleep really bad. I suspect that that is the case because natural thyroid contains T1 in a very small amount and synthetic thyroid doesn’t. And I bet it is these very small amounts that make all the difference.
I came here looking to find out if anyone else has been having hypo symptoms on Armour 120 mgs. I just called CVS and asked if anyone else has complain or if there has been a recall. I was told no. I had been having some symptoms since Fall 2027, but my symptoms really went into overdrive around Christmas 2017. I picked up my last script on 12/20/17.
I came down with a bad cold right after Christmas and never fully recovered. My hair also began to fall out in clumps. In addition, I turned 50 in December and have skipped my period. It’s looking like I’ll be skipping it this month too.
At first I thought that I am experiencing perimenopause, which is possible, but now I’m convinced it is more likely my thyroid because my symptoms came on suddenly.
I have major brain fog, fatigue, body aches, major hair loss, constant headaches, dizziness, insomnia, lack pain of concentration and just sick all over!!!!
I am having my blood work checked tomorrow morning and seeing my doctor next week. Something is very wrong with me, and cannot go like this!!
Michelle, your problem is not directly the Armour. Your problem is being underdosed! Study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101 Learn what optimal is (which you’ve probably never been), and the importance of iron and cortisol.
I have been on Armour for five weeks after not being able to get Nature throid. I feel absolutely awful. The muscle weakness is off the charts. Can hardly do anything. Have to sit down constantly. Every time I move around, severe fatigue and muscle weakness. Sleeping awful. Some nights I don’t even sleep at all but usually awake at around 230 am and then wide awake. Also feeling down and hopeless. I can’t take it anymore. Switching to Levoxyl. Was previously on it many years back.
Betsy, you are using Armour incorrectly! So of course you have had these problems. It’s all about raising it to find your optimal dose, which it sounds like you have failed to do. Study the page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101 P.S. Also note what the latter page says about having optimal iron and cortisol.
That is really interesting. I have been on Armour and was doing well until December 2017. My period suddenly went from very regular 28 day cycle (even when I was hypo) to now being 50+ days. I am only 41 but was thinking it was perimenopause. I just increased my dosecond to see if that helps.
This is why we all have to be “optimal” on NDT, not just “on it”. Study this page, which will explain what optimal is: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
I know it’s been awhile since your post, but I was having hypo symptoms on Armour 120mcg. By any chance, do you know what lot number you had problems with? I was doing great on this dose for about 6 months and definitely think there is something wrong with a particular batch. I used to have a taste in my mouth when it was working (kind of gross), and these pills didn’t produce that effect.
Yes, problems aplenty! I gained 15 pounds of pure fat (and I train at 85% of my MHR & weight train at 75-85% of my 1RM), and lost SO much hair my ponytail is as thin as a pencil! I formerly had a blanket of hair and was lean for all my hard training. I couldn’t understand what was happening until I checked here. It’s got to be the Armour. I just switched this week to Nature-throid.
Sherry, switching to Naturethroid may have been the worst thing you can do. It’s changed and an awful lot of people are reporting it’s far weaker. And as far as Armour, is it possible that you just held onto too low a dose all this time? That will make your hypo come back with a vengeance. You need to study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
Janie, it’s so lovey to hear your response! I have used your books as bibles in my thyca journey. I had a total thyroidectomy in 2013. Now I’m at my wits end-that’s why I switched to NT (WP is nowhere to be found).
My labs on 180mg Armour:
TPOab=8.4IU/ml, FT4=1.2ng/dL (top range=1.5), FT3=3.4pg/mL (top range 4.2), Ferritin 70, saliva cortisol perfect. Over the last year I’ve been trying to figure out what happened because I gained a ton of fat & my hair loss is profuse and diffuse. I’m exhausted by 6:30pm & not feeling my sparky self. It’s been awful. I’ve had my female hormones tested, GI tests to rule out parasites, bloodwork to rule out Lyme disease, & more. It just made sense that it was the Armour. I was so desperate I considered going backwards onto Tirosint but wanted to give the NatureThroid (NT) a try because I don’t know what else I can do. I am both a Master Trainer & Nutrition Manager so I balance and watch my diet and training very closely but I still blew up. I’m lost & desperate so I began the NT yesterday. I just can’t continue to lose my hair and gain this unhealthy fat. I’m only 5’2” & I know the health risks. Thank you for all of your wisdom. Without your books and experience I’d be another T4 only user worse off for sure. I hope to get to the bottom of this puzzling detour and back on my way to flourishing once again. -S
Hi. If your free T3 was only 3.4, you weren’t where you should be and that can explain your issues. Optimal puts it closer to the top part of range. Even free T4 was a tad low. All in all, it looks like 3 grains hasn’t been optimal for you. So you see, it’s not about the Armour. It can be about not being optimal.
And it’s important to get your RT3 tested to see if that’s part of the problem i.e being too high.
And it’s not about just ferritin. It’s always more about your serum iron. That’s why we have to do all four iron labs and treat the serum iron, not the ferritin.
And Naturethroid has been too problematic since it was re-done by RLC Labs. Far weaker.
Hope that helps. 🙂
Hey i switched 3 days ago. I slept the first 2 nights fine now im getting palpitations and insomnia as we speak. I was on 150 mcg synthroid removed thyroid 14 years ago bc graves. I want to be all natural now. I might have to tweak it . On 90 mg of armour. 1.5 grains
Hi Megan. Your answer here, and possibly #2 on the page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
I know this is an old thread and no one will probably see this. 🙂
My doctor was OK with me staying on Nature-Throid (prescribed by a previous physician) for the past 5yrs but now that NT is nowhere to be found, she is writing a scrip for Armour and I will need to try it before she agrees to something else. I am scared after reading through this whole page and the comments….. good luck and happy new year, everyone!!! :-/
Well, some people say they are doing okay on it, so you may, too. Just retest your free’s after being on a few weeks to see if you need tweak.
I came to this site this morning to read up because I am having problems with armour. There was a shortage of both Naturethroid and WP Thyroid (actually, there still is a shortage of the WP – they are by the same manufacturer). I was supposed to go to the doctor’s today, but it seems the whole state of Texas is closed due to the winter storm, so they had to reschedule.
I was doing GREAT on Naturethroid, But about six weeks ago, I went on armour as a replacement due to the shortage. My weight is going up despite me exercising more and doing Weight Watchers. My hair is falling out. Not handfuls, but I am finding a LOT more in my brush and in the shower drain cover. My body temp, which has always run low, is back down in the mid 96 degree (F) range. Brain fog.
A couple other symptoms that may or may not be related to Armour: My skin is crepey. That could be more related to the dry weather, though. It does seem that my eyesight is changing,but my Lasik surgery was over three years ago, so it could be that.
Well, I had to switch to WPthyroid because my CVS said they no longer carried naturethroid. But I must report I absolutely LOVE the WPthyroid, better than naturethroid , and is purer. I also lost another 5 pounds.! I am getting closer to my high school weight, since getting off that armour.
I would also like information about the Thai brands of NDT and the names of reliable suppliers.
I would like to put a question to those of you having tried Thai brands of NDT: if anyone has tried all three of them (Thyroid-S, Thiroyd, TR), which one would you recommend? They all seem to work, reviews are mostly positive, and I know it’s highly individual, but would still appreciate input from anyone having tried them. Even if you’ve only tried one of them and that worked well, I’d like to hear it!
I use Thyroid s and it works fine for me. It is actual the only one I have taken so I have no comparison. I take it because no Dr would prescribe me any Thyroid pills because my numbers were normal so when I found I could legally buy it I got it. It totally worked for me. Now the Drs day they will give me pills from here since I sold treasured and proved I needed them but I haven’t changed over and might never.
Someone please check this with me, (math is not a talent for me). In November getting ready to start Nature-Throid I had labs drawn, my FT3 was 2.4 and my RT3 was 19.4 my calculations tell me that I have too much RT3. Am I correct or miscalculated?
You didn’t supply ranges, but if your RT3 range starts at 8 or 9, yes, that’s too high and usually points to having inadequate iron and/or a cortisol problem. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/iron-and-cortisol
Some have claimed that the “new” Erfa will work better if chewed up prior to swallowing. Can anyone confirm that? The company denies any reformulation, but only admits to moving production from one country to another…only Armour and Erfa are available where I live (Belgium), and there is no way in h— I would be willing to pay +/- 150 USD for a bottle of Armour that is not even working…
I’ve been on Armour 1.5 grain 90mg twice a day for over two years and doing OK. Just got my prescription filled and to my surprise, the pharmacy substituted Acella 90mg (AP 331). I decided to try it, despite the barnyard stench when I opened the bottle. After one day of Acella at the same time and apparent dose, I now have all the old symptoms of high RT3; jittery, nervous, out of sorts. No other major changes to my diet, routine or general health.
Does the acella have more T3 than the Armour? Anyone else have issues making a transition from Armour to Acella?
Artie, it sounds like the Acella was actually revealing that you may now have an iron or cortisol issues. Study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me Or you just may have needed less.
Thank you, Janie.
Is anyone taking Thyroid by Erfa Canada 2017 and is it like old Armour.
Terri, sadly, Erfa had a change somewhere in how their NDT was made, and a lot of patients have had issues over the last two or so years, too. Not all though. There is a long string about Erfa on this STTM blog if you want to search for it. But the one that IS like the old Armour is NP Thyroid. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/options-for-thyroid-treatment
I have been on Armour since 1999. Total thyroidectomy. Started gaining weight in late 2014. By Sept 2016, I put on 40 pounds!!
Found out armour was sold, I do believe they messed with formula, because I was NEVER this overweight, never gained this much so fast. As an experiment, I switched to nature-throid (same company owns westthroid. Both formulas SAME). only 7 ingredients, NOT 14 like someone posted. Do your research.
Anyway, I lost 10 pounds so far since switching November 2016, without even increasing exercise. Have more energy, less brain fog. My affair with Armour is OVER.
Hi.Just following up: I’m still on naturethroid. Lost another 10 pounds, without dieting.
Does anyone know if a class action lawsuit was started on armour thyroid?
It should be.
I started on armour and now transitioned to Np Thyroid went all the way up to 4 grains. My tsh was suppressed but my t4 and t3 levels stayed at the very bottom of the range no matter if I was on 1 grain or 4 grains. Dr ran all tests I don’t have hashi and my reverse t3 was normal , we even tried sublingual no change at all
Any suggestions as to why this would happen , would I be better trying a synthetic ?
Karrie, sounds like you have thyroid hormone resistance, which is a genetic issue. In that case, patients just keep going up, because it takes a lot more grains for those people with that resistance to finally get the same effect others do without it. I’ve seen someone at 8 grains and up to 12 grains before they get relief.
Thank you very much for the response, I have one more question. My dr prescribed me t4 and t3 if I take it will taking the equivalent dose to the ndt I was on be too much because my t4 and t3 never changed on ndt
Honestly, we haven’t found changing to two synthetics to be the answer. And it’s far more expensive to do it that way. It’s more about raising NDT until you find an amount that FINALLY starts being effective for you. Again, that may end up being 8 grains, or 12 grains, or whatever it ends up for YOU. Some, when they get way up there, then add some T3 to whatever amount of NDT they are on, to get the free T3 up. Others with Thyroid Hormone Resistant are just on NDT, but of course, in much higher amounts that other people who don’t have this issue.
I have been taking USP Thyroid for over 6 years. It is compounded and placed into capsules by my pharmacist. My pharmacist describes it as Armour without the fillers and indicated that Armour and Nature Thyroid etc use it as the base ingredient for their product. Today, he told me that the supplier has increased the price by 500%. Because it is a core ingredient, he expects Amour, Nature, West etc to also increase in price. I currently pay about $40/month. The price will go up to about $200/month. Seems reminiscent of Mylan and the Epi pens.
The supplier for compounding pharmacies is different than the supplier for prescription NDT. But we’ll see.
This blog is so helpful! I just realized my pharmacy is giving me a generic form of Armour, which might be why it hasn’t been working for me the past few months. Thank you all for your information. Hopefully I can get this sorted and start feeling better!
Charisse, if you mean NP Thyroid, it’s been a great product for many!
Well, obviously it’s not working for me.
True!! What I was trying to say is that when something as successful as NP Thyroid doesn’t seem to work, you’ve got to explore why. Because you’ll start having similar problems, or just other problems, with other NDTs. For example, you may not be on enough. Very common mistake patients make. Or, it can be revealing either inadequate iron or a cortisol issue, which any NDT will do to you. Start here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Thank you so much for posting this. The past few months, all of my hypothyroid symptoms have returned and I feel like crap! I’ve increased my dose of Armour with very little changes. I’m gaining upwards of 3-5 pounds a day, suddenly need to sleep over 12 hours a night, have zero energy, and feel cold all the time. I thought my thyroid levels had tanked, but maybe it’s just the Armour.
I have been on naturethroid for 3 months and my tsh keeps going up. I have no thyroid.
Sounds like you aren’t optimal. Study this page…it explains how folks have reported finding their optimal dose: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101. Also note it’s not about the TSH.
I am freaked out. I have been on synthroid for almost 18 years and finally saw a doctor this morning who prescribes Armour and I got a script filled which happens to be Actavis. Now I was excited to try this as I am tired, hair falling out etc.and I am in menopause. Now, after reading all these posts, I am scared to take the Actavis 60 mg as I am worried I have a reformulated version and will end up with MORE problems-not better. I called the pharmacy and their supplier won’t get in the WP which seems to be my best option. Should I just take the Actavis, or call my doctor, or WHAT?
I don’t blame you for being concerned. But here’s something to know: WP is not the only good NDT. So is NP (that’s what I’m on and love it) plus Naturethroid. And whatever you get on, learn this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
I purchase my thyroid directly from Thailand from T.Man Pharma. They only make the 60mg or one grain tablet, but it is great and very inexpensive. I called them and asked for someone who speaks English. They sent me an invoice which I paid on Paypal, and they shipped me a 3 year supply. Now I don’t have to worry about fluctuations in manufacturing because for the next 3 years I’ll be taking the same batch. I read on another website that dessicated thyroid is very stable over time, especially when it’s coated with T. Man thyroid is (it’s pink).
Do you know if it’s potency will decline over 3 years?
Got to web site using google for firefox translator ordered 60 mg my dose armour thyroid
If it works you are my dearest angel.
Thanks so much my life will be normal had so many falls nearly broken my hip and nose NOW I KNOW WHY Oh the relief
Cant get any reply back from Thailand I have called no answer and emailed been on their web site and ordered but nothing doing please contact me on firstname.lastname@example.org uk for info
Why do I get heat flashes on 60 armour thyroid?
Check out this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
PS – I’ve been on Armour – one grain, 5x/week, and two grains, 2x/week – for a year and a half and feeling great. I’ve read the page you gave me and found some things to try, in general – I’d like to try the 2x/day dosage, but it’s hard to split the dose each day b/c it’s one tablet and they’re tiny. My iron levels are very good and my cortisol levels are normal. As a side note, in 2014 I was able to significantly reduce my stress (lots of activities I did to ‘turn off’ my fight/flight system by engaging the rest/digest system), which improved my stomach’s production of acid and healed my adrenals – that is what improved my iron levels and reduced my cortisol levels. At the end of that year, my thyroid meds were too high for the first time in 10 years, so I reduced my Armour and have been fine since. Until 10 days ago when taking this new NDT med.
My pharmacy filled my 60 mg Armour with NP thyroid. I’ve been feeling awful and my intuition told me to go online and I found this blog. I’ve been on Armour since 2004 and haven’t had any issues. I’ve been on NP now for 10 days and am very tired and put on weight. The Armour website says they are no longer on back order, so I’m going to call my pharmacy to see if I can switch back.
Hey, you are actually on a better NDt, which means it’s probably suppressing your feedback loop more, which means you probably just need to raise! Study this page:https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
Thanks for your comment. I’m confused why you gave that page as a reference? I got moved from NDT to NDT, not from synthetic to NDT. Why would I need to raise my dosage a ‘like for like’ substitute? I’ve been on Armour with no issues, up until 10 days ago when switching to NP. Maybe I’m not understanding something?
Hi Chris. Because NP is actually a better NDT than Armour for many. Thus, as stated, it can be suppressing your feedback loop more since it’s better, and thus, you may need to consider a raise. The link explains what we look for when optimal.
I do appreciate your time and patience responding to me. But I still don’t completely understand how it’s ‘better’ if it is suppressing a feedback loop – I’ve looked up feedback loops but it’s beyond my level of comprehension. Plus, I don’t understand why it is ‘better’ if I was feeling fine before on Armour. I’ve shared your site on Facebook and in a private group, so I’m thankful you’ve brought so much info here for us to make our own decisions. I’ll likely go back on the Armour anyway and I’ll have the supply of NP on hand in case I want to switch back and play with upping the dosage.
Hi there. Not sure how else to help you understand. But do know that NP is a great product and patients have soared on it. So raising is clearly the answer to find an optimal dose, we’ve found.
There have been a return of hypo with Armour for some folks (not all) since it was bought out by Activas apparently, so hopefully you’ll be within the group of those still doing great. Do read the link I sent to see what patients report “optimal” has meant with temps, loss of symptoms, free T3 and free T4, etc.
I have adrenal fatigue and have been on 120 mg Armour thyroid. My numbers were borderline and the doctor increased my dose to 150 mg. It threw me into a tailspin. I felt so weak that I couldn’t get out of a chair. I stopped and it has taken me a couple of weeks to feel somewhat better. I have had this reaction every time I have increased the dose and it lasted for 2-3 months. I ended up in the hospital with TIA symptoms after this last attempt to raise it and my diastolic blood pressure was 46. It may have caused the symptoms due to not enough blood to the brain. Is this an adrenal crash? What should I do to figure this out? I am at my wits end.
Hi Jeanne. Your answer is under #2 here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Thanks for the info. I received a shot of depo provera in error when I was in the hospital. Why that happened is crazy; however, I am in my fifties, menopausal. I heard it can raise your cortisol levels. Could that be my problem?
We know that high amounts of progesterone used day after day can convert to cortisol and cause higher levels, but not sure that one depo provera shot could do that. Might want to consider ordering a 24 hour adrenal saliva test and see what’s up if you feel cortisol issues could be causing problems. My Med Lab on this page is an example of what one can be ordered: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/recommended-labwork
What is RT3? Thank you for responding! I never heard of RT3. Can you explain?
Here you go: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/reverse-t3
I thought you were recently saying that many people are having trouble on their natural meds? My mistake I guess, but that is what it sounded like. Any how, I am having a problem. Will be seeing my doctor in September. Maybe I just need a higher dosage. I have been taking up to 3 pills / day. Seems my thyroid is swollen, which is what happens to me when I am not on enough medication or when I am on synthroid. If I take synthroid, my thyroid swells.
I hope we are not leading to that crisis again. It seems that are trying to make the pills with the least amount of potency they possibly can to cut costs.
Oh no…it wasn’t about many people having trouble with their natural meds. It was many people starting to report problems with Armour in particular after Forest was bought out by Activas. Even with those people having problems, there are still others on Armour doing well. So each person has to figure out whether Armour is working for them or not. Otherwise, the other brands are working great for folks if they are optimal and still have good iron and cortisol. i.e. there is no crisis going on with “natural thyroid” as a whole!
I have information that not many people have. I was told by American labs Owner that he changed the way he processes the natural thyroid powders. They supply all the active ingredients to Armour, naturethroid, ERFA and ALL companies that make the pills in America. They now freeze dry the hormone, which makes it less potent. They are the ones who are causing a tremendous amount of problems along with the pharmaceutical companies changing the bi-products.
AMerican Laboratories explained that the demand was too much for his company to handle and that is why they made changes. They use to heat it to process the powder; however, it was a complicated procedure. That is why it changed in 2005. That is when I spoke with him.
The people need to know. This is a big problem for many, many patients. Something needs to be done. The government should be involved in this in my opinion. Obviously, American Laboratories needs help in handling the volume of powder they need to process. The government should step in and make regulations on how this is processed. The quality of the hormone is not the same and never will be the same if they continue to freeze dry it. Obviously, they are having problems in their company.
If you call them, they won’t speak to you. They completely shut off everybody unless it involves Sales. What do we do with this thyroid crisis?
Jean, I and most have done well on NDT since 2005 so there isn’t a crisis as you describe.
I am on Naturethorid and have been for a couple of years now. Just recently, like the past 2 weeks, it is not working hardly at all. I have awful symptoms. Anybody else on naturethroid np and feeling really bad?
Janie, what is going on? Why are they making so many changes? I don’t get it. If they are still prescribing it, why doesn’t it work?
Jean, perhaps you got a bad batch? Also, have you been under a lot of stress? That can increase cortisol, promoting a rise in RT3.
I have been on NP for a year and never could get my levels up..my doctor switched me to Armour 2 weeks ago and I’m having a terrible time…lots of indigestion and gall bladder type pain, funny feeling in my chest…etc. Not like I’m hyper at all though..my palpitations have actually gone away thank goodness…but I can’t take how I’m feeling now…does Armour by Actavis have gluten in it by chance? I can’t seem to find an up to date ingredients list! I have Celiac disease so this is scary!
Jen, NP is a great product, so if you couldn’t make it work, the answer why is probably here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me i.e. it was fixable!
I was one of them who switched due to Armour no longer working by September of 2015. Thanks to my new GP not understanding the TSH thing, he cut my dose when he switched me to Nature throid. Then referred me to an endo. when I started complaining of feeling worse and gaining weight because of lowered dosage. Endo. raised my dose with concerns over TSH. When I hit the dosage of Nature throid 1/ 1/2 gr. that made me euthyroid on Armour I still felt lousy. I asked him to switch me to WP thyroid and am now feeling euthyroid again. I think I had a problem with all the fillers on Nature Throid, there are 10! My problem now is getting him to keep me on this dose because of the TSH. I even offered to sign a release! I’m waiting for new prescription refill and have been informed WP is on backorder as of two weeks ago according to Walgreens! Sometimes I think you just can’t win on this thyroid issue, if it’s not the Dr. against you it’s the supplier of your meds!
Hi Terry. Call different pharmacies. Where one will say it’s backordered, others will have it. 🙂 And keep fighting against that TSH! Good for you.
I’ve been on armour for a year now and my hair is completely falling out. I’m so terrified and discouraged. Should I go off cold turkey?? Is armour causing this???
Megan, two things to tell you: Yes, Armour changed a year ago when Activas bought out Forest, causing some to report their symptoms came back. But that was only occurring for some. Others still do fine on it. So that could be it. BUT, it can also happenbecause you have been underdosing yourself a long time. I would take the time to study this page on how we find our optimal dose, even if you change to another brand of NDT: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
there have been many changes in Armour. I will look for the articles and let you know where they were that I have been researching.
no, please talk with your doctor and if not satisfied with him. Get another opinion. Get all of the tests they require so you can get to the bottom of this. Please always talk with a doc before going off of any med….not generally good to cold turkey any medication.
Does your scalp tingle burn or ache off and on from the armour??
Yes. I thought I was crazy. I was on Armour from Jan-June of this year and had scalp pain and severe itchiness/burning on the back of my scalp near my neckline. Doctor switched me to Tirosint thinking it was an allergy but I’m still miserable and now that I’ve read up on NDT I realize that consistently being on only 60mg could’ve been the issue and I am thinking of trying it again at higher dose. I’m very seriously considering switching endos as well, but that’s a whole other issue.
BINGO!! 60 mg is simply a starting dose from which we raise in search of our optimal dose. It’s very rare for that starting dose to make most optimal. This page explains all patients look for to know they are optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
I’ve been on Armour thyroid for years, but now it is causing the same symptoms that the synthetic thyroid meds. Racing heart and I feel bad, really don’t think I can take this changed Armour meds,
I used Armour for years with no issues. I noticed my copay went up then suddenly my insurance stopped paying for it saying it was a “brand name”. So switched to Westhroid, since neither Walgreens or CVS here in TX seem to be able to get NP Throid. Westhroid’s dosages seem to contain slightly more T4 per grain which seemed to help initially but now getting symptoms of hyperthyroid such as hair loss and heat sensitivity. It is a never ending struggle with Thyroid meds.
Diane, those symptoms may have nothing to do with the different brand. Instead, the new brand may be revealing that you have either inadequate iron or a cortisol issue…either which need discovery and treatment. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
so true….it is a complex system that is why anyone making Armour is so risky. Maybe the control of synthetic is better. At least I know I felt the same all of the time and not like a yo-yo!
I am just reading this info for the first time. I am very concerned as I have been taking Armour for over 20 years with changing the dosage as my Thyroid was destroyed due to Hashimoto’s disease. I have never thought about who made my drug until reading this. I looked and it is made by Actavis. My concerns had only been about price since the drug has been going up every time I renew now for over a year. My blood levels never stay the same so my doctor is always changing the dosage, now I wonder if it is the drug not my own body causing the problem. I hate to change to something else and start the process of finding the right dose again. Thanks for the info which I will read more via your links.
I have been taking Thyroid meds for over 20 years too. I started with Synthroid, continued to take it and adjust my dose for several years….well, it never did stabilize completely, however, I learned how to read my symptoms and got to know when I was taking too much or too little. My sister started with Armour about 12 years ago. She kept trying to talk me into trying it and I finally gave up my Synthroid for Armour. There are charts that give the docs dosage equivalents so they know how much of a dosage to give you when trading one for the other. About a year, year and a half ago, I started getting my hypo signs and symptoms all over again. So tired that I started sleeping more and more until lately I’ve been sleeping 12 hours a day and I am a 5-6 hours a night sleeper, well….used to be that is. I just started back on Synthroid (generic this time…Levothyroxine). If you start with Synthroid, you need to stay on Synthroid, and same with Levothyroxine, as well as some of the others. The problem with ARMOUR is now anyone can make it and believe me….everyone and their brother is making ARMOUR. Some of the Armour’s offered – have 17 ingredients in them, while others might only have 8. You will not get the same exact dosage each time, unless you receive it from the same lot (bunch made all at the same time, together). This, I believe, is why so many of us are having so many issues with ARMOUR. Our thyroid needs free T4 and T4 converts to T3 as it is needed…..unless our thyroid is not functioning correctly to do this. If that is the case, I would imagine that after taking Levothyroxine after a few months, I would be able to find out by the way I feel….as the blood tests aren’t accurate either. If I feel that I need T3, I will ask my doc to add it to my agenda; trying to feel like a human again and not a hibernating, all year long, bear! The bear part includes my moods too. Irregular heart beat, from time to time, losing hair, mood swings (sometimes terrible mood swings), from crying to laughing to being angry and sometimes even vicious….ever feel any of those? Tired all of they time, painful, diagnosed with fibromyalgia, constipation, dry skin, irregular periods, headaches, feeling just overall yuky! Other Medications, including vitamins will accumulate in your system when your thyroid is not working right, because it controls your metabolism, so what you eat, vitamins you may take & script drugs; you can end up toxic, as your body is not using a lot of this, so it just runs around your system and your cells are not getting fed..nor are they getting rid of what they need to take out of our system….there are so many body functions that our thyroid controls and they keep finding more all of the time. Do some research for yourself, it really is good to get as educated as you can about anything that your doc diagnosis you with, or with anything that you believe you are having the symptoms of. The Chlorine and Fluoride in our water (not well water), takes up markers on our Thyroid that are meant for thyroid hormones and so does ‘bromine’, which is what they use now in breads to preserve it instead of iodine, which was once used. Bromine also takes up the thyroid markers, leaving even less markers for the real thyroid hormones that NEED to be there. No wonder there is an epidemic of Thyroid problems. Especially ‘Hashimoto’s Hypothyroidism’ – which I also have. The levels of thyroid hormones are up, down, sideways…you name it and how is it supposed to get regulated when medications are out of control? No way to control thyroid hormones if no control over meds to help us with thyroid problems…and YOU MUST HAVE EITHER A FUNCTIONING THYROID OR MEDICATION TO TAKE PLACE OF THE THYROID FUNCTIONING…..OR THE END RESULT IS NOT GOOD…NOT GOOD AT ALL!
Bug your docs until you get answers and get the correct med for you; until you feel good again, continue to bug him/her! PLEASE KEEP A DIARY, of how you feel, any signs or symptoms you are exhibiting We do pay our docs wages….I am a nurse, I know where their income comes from…all of us!! It is an extremely complex system in our bodies, but we can feel good again, even if you’ve been taking thyroid replacements before. We just need it controlled in our bodies and the meds need a stricter better control! The DIARY is crucial! Write what you eat, how many hours you sleep, it’s ok if you’re not eating a healthy diet right now…you need to concentrate on getting better, then worry about that. However, try to eat somewhat healthy, for that will help with the way you are feeling to a point. Diary everything….give it to your doc, tell him verbally when you go in, any good or bad about how your are feeling, and anything new going on.
We can get better, or at feel much, much better. I know we can, because at one time I did. Until they started playing with our medications….without warning or even asking how we are doing…the don’t care and it is time we looked out for one another and show them how much we care!
God Bless you all!
There is so much more about the thyroid I would love to share with you, but I know I’m already boring you to sleep….zzzzzz….I am me. **smile**
Thank you for all your knowledge, it has been very helpful!
Linda, so how are you doing back on Synthroid? I was on it years ago, switched to Armour with mixed results. Then jumped to NATURE-THROID. WOW! I have gone from what was bad to much worse. Weight ballooned up, severe aches, mood in the toilet, hybernating is exactly the correct description… I am considering going back to Synthroid/Cytomel Combo from many yrs ago..This is a NIGHTMARE… Have started researching ACELLA too….
Sue, there are explanable and **correctible** reasons why that happens. 🙂 Study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Dr started me on Armour of 15 mg by Forest for one month. Tablet was hard
After taking it one month I was suppose to have my blood work repeated.
Since it was July 4th weekend, I wanted to wait until July 6 to be tested. Started taking my refill of 15 mg by Actavis that weekend.
It dissolved in my mouth and I have had a horrible headache and nausea. Did not go for blood work.
What to do?
I contacted my Dr and the pharmacy. Now waiting for a response.
I have a cousin that has taken Armour from Forest for years and she said her pill was hard.
What is with the dissolving pill? It even made my tongue burn.
Tessie, you need to study this page because your doctor has no clue how to dose NDT: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
After the latest Armour reformulation, I am wanting to try Erfa or Acella. Can any one tell me, who have made a change, if just substituting the same gr. will work. Another words I take 3 gr of Armour, would I start out with 3 gr of Erfa or Acella?
Erfa has had issues,too. The other is more reliable. Yes, it’s basically an even swap, then after several weeks, we do labs to tweak up or down…or not.
What is up with Actavis pharmaceuticals? Many of my previously standard acceptable medications are now owned by Actavis. I am noticing a distinct reduction in quality, efficacy, taste and a rise in price. I’d appreciate any information. For now I am avoiding products from that company.
Our guess is extreme greed, plus different tablet making processes.
I have been on Armour for a few years after finally finding a Dr to prescribe it in Sydney Australia. The only options here seem to be Armour and compounded desicated extract.Would anyone know of other brands to try available in Australia? Where and how do I obtain these such as Natureroid?
Join the FTPO Australia group listed on this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/talk-to-others They will help.
I was on Armour thyroid 180 for Hashimoto’s disease for 2 years and I had a lot of quality of life. But the first refill of the ACTAVIS Armour thyroid November 2014 and I went straight down hill. I have tried everything since, including Naturethroid, and still I am at rock bottom. I have had every test including the 24 hr saliva, nothing is pointing to the reason why I cannot get out of the toilet. I’m so sick, I can barely imagine another year of this. I am disgusted with big pharma, and now I see there is a petition to save Armour thyroid because big pharma wants to force the synthetic on all of us. I nearly died twice as a result of doctors insisting the NDT was not safe. Synthroid is my 2nd worst nightmare, the reformulation of Armour thyroid by Actavis is my #1 worst nightmare and it came true.
I have had my doctor try everything this site suggest, and still no change in my labs or symptoms.
Why can’t we just have a compounding pharmacy copy our old Armour thyroid medicine? I still have a few pills left over from the Forrest labs Armour thyroid, isn’t it possible for a lab to copy the ingredients and remake the same pill?
I am currently on a compounded form of NDT with minimal fillers, but like all thyroid since Forrest labs Armour, it isn’t working.
I’m at the bottom with no more hope, I stay so sick I literally cannot keep the fight up much longer.
Does anyone know how we can get the few remaining FORREST LABS Armour thyroid medicine pills in my possession copied by a compounding pharmacy? They could make a fortune in profits from those of us who are ONLY helped by the Forrest labs Armour.
Terrie, Naturethroid has been working fabulously for folks, so I’m thinking you may not understand how to read the saliva results?? It’s about “where” they fall in those ranges, not the fact that they fall in them. This page explains: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/lab-values And iron can cause problems, too, which also is about “where” the results fall.
Your answer with not feeling well on Naturethyroid may be right here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
UPDATE: it’s been reported to me of two people who lately found that their current batch of Naturethroid wasn’t working as well. So…just in case…if that’s you, the first thing patients are doing is going to another brand like NP Thyroid. Only if THAT doesn’t work do people know it’s probably from not raising high enough, or an iron or cortisol issue.
Read your post and know how you feel. Just called in my prescription for the month of Desiccated thyroid (they use only one filler)
the Pharmacy informed me it’s gone up from 35.00/month to $80.00. shocked! This is the only type of medication that has worked.
Believe me, i’ve tried them all. I too have Hashimoto’s and do not wish this on anyone. It was only when I went gluten free that my body
started to respond and go back to normal. I feel wonderful. However, the price increase really hits hard. $45.00 additional each month
is a lot.
There is a difference with the new company ACTAVis it agrees with me but I need to take less than before-but I am going to have the COMPOUND Pharmacy make my thyroid using the same formula as FOREST did. When Armourthyroid was not on the market for a while my COMPOUND PHARMACY made it. Hope this will help those that find ACTIVES thyroid reacts differently in their body!
I have been dealing with this for at least 10 years,ever since the buy out of armour, and all the changes to these medicines. I have tried the armour and the nature thyroid, and they have either changed formula’s or cheapened up the medicines, or both. I have just recently changed to erfa,so will try this. I know one thing,this changing back and forth with these medicines are not good on ones system.The stress,and finding out after all this time that they don’t work,and have to start all over again. These people need to be held accountable,,,,,I hope they go broke,that may sound harsh, but what they have done to everyone, I would have no simpathy for them,doctors included.
Sharon, Naturethroid has been working fabulously for folks, so when someone says it hasn’t, that’s usually due to what is explained here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
This site is a wonderful resource.
I have a question and would love feedback. I’m on day 15 of armour. The only 2 side effects are heavier menses and some itching in my right foot. I can switch to np thyroid as a generic option through my pharmacy.
Should I? All this armour not working talk has me nervous. Thanks!
Leonie, we can’t tell u what to do as to which NDT..but we can tell u that we always need to raise NDT to find our optimal dose, which being on Armour only 15 days would probably mean u aren’t. I would study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
Some are still fine on Armour; some definitely aren’t and moved to other brands….but the above link still applies.
I’vebeen onArmour for about five months, I feel great. The myth about it being not as good as the synthetic isjust that. a myth. Everyone reacts differently to medicine and the big pharm would rather have you buy theyre product, this is why you see all the ads $$ cha ching. Anyway Im happy as long as all of those hypo ts are too. Sweats, yes but not all the time – I did get itchy for a week or so but its since subsided. I thought my symptoms were all menopausal and anxiety, so the dr. treated me for the symptoms not the disease.I was taking prozac and I was miserable, but a bit better than how I was so I thought, well, this must be it.I went to another dr, they tested my Thyroid, when I returned, I was told my numbers were very high and i had a Vitamin D issue – the bloodwork was more concentrated than the standards and I was not surprized since my Nana and Sister both have issues with Thyroid. Armour has made me remember things, no more fuzzy brain, no more anxiety and that, with the Vitamin D, I am reminded how I used to feel, energized, no aches in the morning it’s been amazing, plus i’ve lost weight. Granted the dr said due to the issues my efforts to lose weight werelikely much harder and slower than most so I had two points against me. I have lost (with sensible dieting!) about 43 lbs and Im almost at where I shoulld be for 5’5 56 Years old. I take a suppliment every day as well as get vitaminn B12 shots every otherweek, I am no longer on prozac and… call me crazy but my desire for intimacy came back, my husband is happy as am I… this is due partially to the weight loss but, I started feeling frisky a few weeks after starting the Armour…Im fairly sure this has contributed and Im curious if anyone else has experienced this? For56, the gifts we get suck – hot flash, gravity lol and lower or zero sex drive. Not any more! even smooching is great. TMI? Sorry but you’ve got to know to ask for a comprehensive test, go to a specialist. I feel bad about where it comes from and I know that the rest of the source is used for food etc.. so im guilty from the start. Im happiest that I have my self back and I have interest in doing things again, Health is such a gift and I intend on keeping that way and no longer consume diet foods, low fat, sugar free etc, either. Its off topic but everything youve heard about low fat, diet this, sugar free… is worse for you, makes you crave more and can be counter effective andcause you to gain.
I did not have hair loss, it is not $74 or whatever dollars, it’s inexpensive and the reason it became expensive at one time was due to production , it practically stopped due to health concerns over animals, mad cow etc.,, so they needed to insure all was good. Production is back as are the lower prices. Im not an expert, I can only share my experiences with hopes they may answer questions. Here’s to everyone’s good health, sending positive energies to all.
“Anticipate something amazing willl happen each day and it does!”
My doctor mentioned that the doses were different between the two medications. I think he must have screwed up. My Armour dose is 2 grain, and the Nature-throid dose he prescribed was 97.5mg. It seems to me that he should have prescribed a dose equal to at least 120mg, or maybe even in the 125-135 mg range for Nature-throid. No wonder his patients do not like it when he switches them off Armour to something else! He must not be familiar with how to convert the doses. Is there a listing of doctors on your website that prescribe NDT? I may need to go to someone else. Thank you so much for solving this mystery!!
Here u go, Joyce: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/how-to-find-a-good-doc
I switched from Armour (due to increasing price), to Naturethryoid for 4 months or so. I felt terrible with hypo symptoms returning. A blood test confirmed my TSH went up quite a bit, higher than it had been in many years. I switched back to Armour and feel much better now. I have not had a blood test yet but will have a followup visit to check my numbers again in August or September. I would like to try a cheaper NDT but after this experience I am in no hurry, and will just pay the higher price for Armour. Is this a common thing? My doctor told me when I asked to switch that some of his patients did not feel well on Naturethyroid and asked to go back on Armour.
Joyce, Naturethroid works fabulously for the vast majority, so what may have happened is that you should have raised it, or it was revealing that you have a cortisol or iron problem. Your doctor may not be familiar enough with what we know on this. Study this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Yes! I switched to Naturethroid due to the price increase. Felt worse immediately, so doctor increased my dose a tad. I just got my labs back, I’m below the range in both FT3 and FT4. I’m going back to Armoir too! I’ve been good for 5 years, and Naturethroid messed it up!!
Was on Armour then NP heart rate went to 142 per min resting and BP 180/100 back on Levo
Marge, that’s not about going back to an inadequate treatment. It’s about what’s under #2 here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
I also switched from Synthroid to Armour in 2013. Felt great, had energy, lost weight until Armour sold out to another company and everything went downhill. I was put back on Synthroid which caused me to go into severe Fibro. I am not on Nature Throid but still having the Fibro pain. My TSH is too low and I just think my medicine needs to be lowered and my doctor wants me to wait 4 more week and be tested again. I’m not sure I can wait that long with this pain. My TSH has never been this low . 0.11 I’m even thinking about switching to WP since I seen Kay’s post and I know it doesn’t have any fillers in it. It’s a shame the FDA is letting them put all the fillers in the Amour and Synthroid and does not notify us. Good Luck to everyone.
Pam, patients who find their optimal dose of any NDT usually always see a low TSH like that…and many even lower!! Check this page out to see what patients note when they are optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
I recently switched from 1 grain of Armour to 1 grain of Naturethroid. I have since have been dizzy, lightheaded or feeling wobbly, high heart rate, anxiety attacks and slight insomnia. Is this the med itself or do I need to get labs for iron?? I am so sad because this is also the first time I have had a ton of energy. Any advice would be helpful. Thanks for your time!
Kari, when we see this, it means it’s probably revealing an iron or cortisol problem. Study this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Thank you for this site and the information about the changes in Armour!! I went to my Dr. in late March with my complaints of how terrible I was feeling on Armour, not losing weight despite increased working out, and constipation. He was hesitant to change prescriptions. I then told him about Armour being sold and the changes in the pills. Armour now has a chemical smell, and the pills are very difficult to break in half. I told him that there has been a change in fillers and the pills are not the same. He then agreed to write a prescription for WPThyroid. Oh my, what a difference! The pills smell like Armour used to, they have a slightly sweet taste on the tongue as I swallow them. The biggest difference is my head is clearer and in a few weeks I have lost 6 pounds. Keep advocating for us thyroid patients! Shame on Armour for changing the formula and not informing patients.
Melissa – would you mind telling me where your doctor is located? I am in NJ, my primary care physician told me he’s not going to modify my dosages anymore, so I need to find another doctor.
Judy, I am in Virginia. I hope you are able to find a new doctor soon!
Thank you for the quick response – I hope I find someone soon!
I was for more than 15 years with SINTROYD and I was pretty good but a T3 was low so the Dr recommend me Armour. I started Armour and I started painful urination, weight gain and also I feel tired. I have everyday hot flashes and I need nap everyday. My legs have more cellulites than ever and I went to my gynecologist and saId that now I’m EStrogen dominant and I thiNk that Armour is the reason of this. I feel TERRIBLE… PLEASE HELP
Mar, with any NDT, you have to raise to find your optimal dose: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101 Armour, though, has become lousy for many, so they are switching to other NDT brands.
Thank you for this site. After reading on your site and knowing something was not right with me. I wondered why as a cash price my Armour had jump from about $9.00 to $35.99 also noticed they were crumbling in my med bottle, so I called Activis and complained about everything and that the formula had not been change, yeah right…….I was told by them that the customer was now paying the price for the acquiring Armour from Forest, they asked me to send them one of my older Forest pills, which I did but never heard a word back from them. When I saw my doctor just 3 weeks ago I explained to her and asked her to change me off Armour because weight gain, depressed, mind foggy,insomnia, no energy, price jump etc.(which tick me off because why should a customer be forced to pay a higher price because of there purchasing out Forest.
I now have been on WP Thyroid for 3 weeks price of $7.00 and what a difference in myself even my family and friends have noticed, I am regaining my energy, sleeping again, lost about 5lbs, my mind not foggy, off depression medication, my hair not coming out and I do not feel like I am in a daze all day long……..oh so happy!!!! I have Low Free T3 and am sure when my doctor checks my levels next time they will be very good. My doctor went with WP Thyroid because I have some problems with things in medication and WP only has 2 ingredients.
Thank you again for this website
Very strong testimony on how Armour has changed in a clear negative fashion, and how much better you are doing on WP. Good for you!
Thank you for this site! My Doc was on vacation but physican assistant switched me off Armour after reading this page..she did it over the phone the same day I called them. I am on day 3 of Naturethroid. My panicky feeling has already gone away and I was able to motivate myself to clean the house and go for a bike ride, bloating is not as bad. I hope I am on my way back to normal. Armour has definitely changed something and I know my body very well. I go into a dark place quickly when my levels are off. I went from 105mcg on armour to 113mcg Naturethroid. I will update if this does not end up working. Thank you 🙂
You have provided another strong example of something gone wrong with Armour, and we’re glad you made the switch to another brand. Remember that we all raise it to find our unique optimal dose! Congrats!
Anyone out there doing OKAY on Armour? Please inform – as I get my AT
via the VA. I’ve been stable but the head
pharmacist’s supply is low and she has to order more for me. I am concerned if
I might incur difficulty on this newer supply.
Of course this is where people voice complaints, but it’s not like an overwhwlming consensus as during the 2009 reformulation. So again, please chime in IF… you are on Armour and still doing well. My sincere thanks!
Yes, there are still some who say they are doing okay, but it may be because they were still using the pre-Activas batch. Not sure.
Need guidance. Been on Armour since 2010.
Symptoms have returned. Increased meds in October after blood work confirmed my symptoms. Not better. My pharmacists said generics are still unreliable any my endo ordered more blood work. I feel like my heart rate is high but symptoms remain. I feel like I should try another bio identical option. Which one is best option for me. I have hypo, low vitamin D and several thyroid nodules under watch.
The three favorites: NP Thyroid, WP Thyroid and Naturethroid.
Rachel, what they are calling generic may be NP Thyroid, and it’s extremely reliable and has changed lives.
Rachel – may I ask where your endo is located?
I switched from Armour to NatureThroid to NP Thyroid – that’s what I’ve been on for the past month. Symptoms are not improving, getting slightly worse in fact. Fatigue is becoming debilitating. New symptom is dry skin on my hands – no amount of lotions or creams alleviates the dry, cracked skin – it’s painful and burns.
So….back to my primary physician who will tell me to go see an endocrinologist as he won’t play around with dosages anymore.
Need to find an endo that prescribes NDT soon!
Judy, it’s about raising to find your optimal dose. Study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101 And honestly, the majority of Endos are clueless about all this. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/how-to-find-a-good-doc
Totally agree with you – but my issue right now is finding a doctor willing to look at other labs beyond TSH and be willing to prescribe based on symptoms.
My PCP told me last month this is the last dose change he’s making – after that I need to find an endo – or another doctor willing to test adrenals and other factors contributing to my symptoms.
So far I can’t find a doctor that accepts my insurance and I can’t afford to pay out of pocket.
I always used to say “at least I have health insurance, thank God!” but now I’m not sure that even matters.
It’s really sad what our healthcare system has become.
Sure understand your sentiment about the healthcare system. I find it to be awful, worse than before. As far your situation, this is why so many patients report self-treating. They feel they have no choice.
Unfortunately, the new saying for those of us who understand what’s happening in medicine, is that, “everyone has insurance, but no one is getting any care.”
I have recently stopped Tirosint 112 and switched to Naturethroid 2 1/2 tabs and have hot flashes , bad headaches and foggy around 2 hours after taking it and last 7 hours and then I feel clearer. Is this normal for just converting over to natural thyroid? I’ve been on synthroid for 25 years and tirosint for 5. Could it be allergy to fillers? Thx for helping me
Vienna, you mentioned tabs, but there are many different milligrams, such as 32.5, 65, and up. So not sure how much you are talking about. But your answer may be here: http:/www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Oh sorry I’m taking 65 mg each tablet. I now changed to 1 1/2 tablet in am and adding 1 afternoon. I’ll see if it helps. So far my head was clear in the am yesterday but it felt blurred and hard to comprehend in the afternoon after I took 1/2 tablet. Today I will take the whole tablet after 1:00. My body feels ok it’s this head stuff also a lot of sneezing and I wonder if I may be allergic to the fillers. Is np a good replacement of this?
It’s rare to be allergic to the fillers, especially with NP when there are so few. But who knows. Here’s the list of ingredients in all thyroid meds: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/armour-vs-other-brands But you are also potentially describing problems with iron and/or cortisol by your other symptoms. Hopefully you read the link I posted.
Wow, what a long thread, all of the sharing is amazing. I have Hashis and have been on Armour since mid 2014, big improvements generally. I get 3 months supply at a time to reduce cost but since renewing in Jan 2016 I experience a very high level of daily muscle and joint pain and raging facial flushes (my facial skin feels raw). Two very experienced massage therapists (Amatsu and NMT massage) comment that muscular skeletal wise I am doing great (compared to the bulk of clients they see) which makes me think this is to do with Armour . I will muster up the courage to request a change to Nature Thyroid, in Ireland it is close to impossible to find a Dr with any deep understanding of ndt or Hashis. Lucky to have this resource. Good luck all ….
Dr Lori Sweat
I’m a functional medicine physician and treat hundreds of thyroid patients. Recently I’ve been seeing patients on Armour CONSISTENTLY having unexplained rises in TSH and drops in T4/T3. For about 3 years I’ve been more apt to start patients on Nature-throid and have found it to have good consistency. This is a tragic situation and only adds credence to the argument by traditional endocrinologists that natural dessicated thyroid is not a good option over levothyroxine preparations. The manufacture should publish a formal, public acknowledgement and apology.
Are you located in the USA? I fear I might need to switch doctors and am starting the quest to find one in the NJ/NY/PA area that treats with NDT.
Dr. Sweat, would love to have you write a Guest Blog Post for this blog about your observations.
IHaveNoAppendix. Do I get itchy bridge of nose, and dry skin because I have no appendix? The purpose of an appendix was to digest grass and twigs. Microcrystalline cellulose, now added, is from wood pulp.
Perhaps people who have had this problem could let us know whether they have had an appendectomy?
Pipa, cellulose has been in it for a long time without what has suddenly occurred to many folks on Armour.
Though there can be other causes for dry skin, it’s often related to either undiagnosed or poorly treated hypothyroidism on T4-only for thyroid patients, all based on years of observations and reports, and which goes away for most when on NDT or optimally treated.
Have been an Armour user for 3-4 years, was really happy until fairly recently, when weight control began to slip. Shortly after, I changed jobs and lost insurance, making it quite difficult to get to a doctor. Even when I do, they won’t re-prescribe me this Rx that I’ll clearly have to be on a lifetime.
Been reading this website deeply and feel good about trying Thyroid-S or Thiroyd, but see lack of job for my hesitancy on buying from a supplier and getting scammed. Are there multiple good reports on any one supplier? Very much appreciate your direction, and this website!!
Anyone knows of a doctor anywhere in Malaysia or Thailand who is prepared to prescribe natural thyroxine? Suffering for ten years with synthetic and things symptoms are getting worse. Tks.
Hi Gin. The irony of your question is that there are great non-prescription natural desiccated thyroid products right there in Thailand. 🙂 Thyroid-S, Thiroyd and one more.
CT: Yes! I had been on Nature-throid successfully for 4 years, but a year ago, I started getting symptoms again. Insomnia, hair loss, headaches, temperatures in the 97-97.6 degree range, weight gain. I thought maybe it was due to expired drug or a bad batch. I got a new prescription filled at a completely different pharmacy. Took it for a month, same thing. I was taking 4 grains and didn’t want to go higher. Finally, I started Westhroid P. The first day, my temperature went up to 98-98.6 degrees and I was able to sleep at night. My hair is still falling out, but I know that is going to take time. Why, oh why, do they have to keep changing formulas? Westhroid P is much nicer. Slightly sweet and no chalky taste.
Has anyone had any problems with NatureThroid changing? I have a LONG Hashimoto’s thyroid history and had been successfully taking NatureThroid for about 10 months until I got a refill in November. Within a few days, I felt absolutely awful! Fatigue, vision problems, weight gain, terrible edema esp in my legs, and even depression which I’d never had before. I had a few pills of my old prescription left so I started taking those and felt better. Got another prescription of NT filled at another pharmacy just to see if perhaps I had a bad batch and the same thing happened. I tried Armour and NP and felt better than the new NT but still very hypo. NP was better than Armour. Could it be I just needed a higher dose of NP than NatureThroid? I thought they would be the same. I ended up taking some old NT pills that I had at a lower dose to get me through the holidays and I felt great. When I ran out of those pills, I refilled that prescription and again within days I felt awful on the new NT pills!! I haven’t seen much about NT changing. Could it be so? I am currently taking synthroid and cytomel which is not great. My doctor wants to prescribe compounded T4/T3. I am wondering if I should ask for compounded desiccated thyroid? I know its expensive but would that eliminate the problems with all the fillers etc? Thanks for any advice. I’m feeling really bad right now!
It’s rare to hear this about Naturethroid, but it does come up here or there, and we’re never sure if there was a bad batch or someone like yourself just needs to raise higher. Sorry you’ve had to go through this. Perhaps you can raise and see. I can only speak for me, but I personally would avoid compounded as it’s expensive, there’s no need to slow-release it, and the other brands do fine, which include NP Thyroid or WP Thyroid.
was taken off levothyroid 125 and cytomel 15 because my TSH was 0.006. started back on it 4 days ago but i am having a very high blood pressure, headaches and vomiting. any help would be greatly appreciated
Kathy, the hardest challenge we face is convincing doctors to STOP treating based on the TSH. It..does…not…work. Read this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/tsh-why-its-useless Granted, you “may” have been on too much T4, but you find that out with the free T4, NOT the TSH, we have learned as patients over and over. Sorry about your vomiting. Not sure what that is about.
A British long term follow-up of 16 thousand patients found TSH 0.03 and below to be a risk. Anyhow I think patients prefer to have a RISK instead of DAILY “having a very high blood pressure, headaches and vomiting”. Or other severe symptoms.
Yes, TSH is pretty useless. 24h-urine-T3 is reliable and somehow practical (compared to basic metabolism measurements)
Just returned from my annual physical.
Recent ‘new’ symptoms are the return of fatigue (but not bone-crushing like before), itchy head and joint pain.
Joint pain (left thumb, right ring finger) is a new symptom…..has anyone experienced this?
I also started experiencing hot flashes again (I’m post-menopause 5 years), and my hands (left mostly) get “clammy”. Not something I’ve ever experienced.
My TSH is down to .33, so my doctor wanted to lower my AT dose. I asked him to switch to Naturethroid because of all the issues I’ve read about from Armour Thyroid users (me included) and he was OK with that (love my doctor!) but instead of 130mg (I was on 120mg of AT) he prescribed Naturethroid 113mg which is the next lower dose.
Has anyone experienced these symptoms when their TSH has fallen below 1? And when their dosage was lowered (and presumably TSH level went up) did this help with symptoms? My doctor thinks the symptoms I’ve experienced recently are because my TSH is actually too low now.
I am hoping that by switching to Naturethroid my symptoms will subside, but was wondering what a good TSH level is.
Is it possible that the low TSH level is why I’ve lost weight too? (this made me happy, don’t want to start gaining again!).
I’ve attributed these new symptoms to changes in Armour Thyroid, but is it possible that my TSH has fallen too low and that’s caused these symptoms to start?
Thanks for reading,
We know that it’s a HUGE mistake for doctors to dose by the TSH, so you’re going to have to fight that. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/tsh-why-its-useless Because no, what you are experiencing has nothing to do with a low TSH. My TSH on my optimal dose, which for me is 3 1/2 grains, is always .009 or .004.
It will be really difficult to challenge his decision.
I’m hoping that changing from AT to NatureThroid will alleviate my symptoms, especially the joint pain.
Thought I’d provide everyone with an update on my switch from Armour to NatureThroid.
At my January 2016 physical, my TSH was at .30 so my doctor, while he was OK switching me from Armour to NatureThroid – he wouldn’t put me on 130mg of it. I was on 120mg of Armour. He wanted to raise my TSH to above 1.0, so he put me on 113mg of NatureThroid.
The NatureThroid was not a good option for me. Maybe because it’s the wrong dose, but whatever the case…..I’m sleeping 11 hours each night and waking up exhausted. No weight gain yet. Really bad muscle cramps. My face is puffy again. Hands swollen but not as bad as one year ago.
The joint pain in my hands was treated with a cortizone shot. It’s been about one month now and that pain has not returned.
My latest TSH is .78, went for bloodwork earlier this week. Went back to my doctor and I asked him to switch me NP Thyroid which he agreed to do and he also increased the dosage to 120mg.
My T3 and T4 levels are normal.
So now I try out the NP Thyroid for 3 months to see if this does the trick. I hate being on this roller coaster. We all know the routine….in 3 months I’ll get labs redone and adjust meds if values are off again. Fingers crossed this time I’ve found the magic sauce!
In the meantime….sleep sleep sleep….
I appreciate the fact that my doctor is willing to switch up my meds to find what works but he told me yesterday this is the last change he’s making — if this new med and dosage doesn’t work he’s sending me to an endocrinologist.
Anyone know a good endocrinologist in PA/NJ/NY that accepts United Healthcare that’s willing to prescribe NDT? Needle in a haystack.
I really wish Armour had not changed its formulation and had not tripled in price! I was doing so well on it for all of last year.
Judy, you have to stop your doctor from dosing you by the TSH on any brand of NDT. Study this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/tsh-why-its-useless For example, my TSH on an optimal amount is always around .004 or so without any hyper. They don’t understand this. There’s even a chapter about this in the STTM II book written by one of his fellow practitioners. And being sent to an Endo is often even worse.
Judy how are you doing on NP?
Intersting reading all this. I’ve been on Armour for several years and recently – apart from being annoyed at the price rise – I’ve had a return of my symptoms – tired, brain fog, migraines etc and itching bridge of nose which I’ve seen reports of here on this blog. This despite almost doubling my dose. I wondered what was causing it. I’m going to switch to NP Thyroid I think.
Are you kidding!!! That is a symptom!? “itching bridge of nose”! Oh my gosh I have been losing my mind. I had know idea. I just checked back and I have only been on NT since Dec. 31. So maybe it will start working better or I can get the doc to up it.
I will be going on medicare shortly and it seems that none of these medicare drug plans cover armour thyroid. I live in Florida so anyone have any ideas on discount drug plans, cards or any other place that I can purchase this for a reasonable price. What a waste to have to buy a medicare drug plan that I can’t use as this is the only thing that I take! Thank you.
All the other brands are cheaper than Armour anyway! https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/options-for-thyroid-treatment (But yes, it’s crazy what Medicare is doing)
Cheryl Are you still doing well on NP? Have you noticed any changes to the pills? Chalky tasting more recently?
Just read about the Armour thyroid. Like others, I was doing fine til this past summer. Same doseage, got all my hypo symptoms back. Blood pressure did a real nose-dive got me worried. Doc did another panel, it was off. He added 2 drops of Atomadine, no dosage change in thyroid meds. Still didn’t feel my normal self until my pharmacy told me about NP thyroid. Started it in mid-Dec. I have already noticed a big difference in how I feel. Been able to drop Atomodine to 1 drop. Blood pressure is back up to normal also. This info on Armour really explains a lot. Large cost increase and a reformulation resulting in an inferior non-effective product. Very glad there are other companies producing so we have a choice. Thanks so much for the info. Will have to remember that it may not be me, but the medication.
What were the changes? I can not find what the actual ingredients are now.
As is typical, they are denying any changes.
Next time we pick up a prescription, let’s get our package insert. THey must be required, I would think, to list the ingredients (the formulation).
The ingredients may still be the same. What we can never know is any changes to the way the tablet is made, which appears to be a big problem and a cause for at least some of the problems.
I am a 47 year old female who feels so sick. My hypothyroidism symptoms are back again despite increasing my Armour Thyroid (AT 120 mg in the morning plus liothyronine 5mcg and AT 60 mg early afternoon). Gauging how I feel now given the AT formula change makes sense or I am taking too much now or both. I took AT from 2012-2014and felt great. Since then my symptoms have worsened (feel exhausted all the time, weight gain, insomnia, depression, loss of drive and motivation, dry skin, puffy face, intermittent tooth sensitivity, cold hands and feet, night sweats, muscle and joint aches, night sweats). I have so many symptoms that I am overwhelmed as to what is causing what (hypothyroid, stress, depression, sex hormone imbalance despite taking bioidentical progesterone 50 mg, low vitamin D, GERD, rosacea, low sodium and chloride). When I spoke to the endo about all the symptoms in July 2015, he agreed to increase AT. Increased again in September 2015. However, I don’t want to go back to him because he can’t seem to explain my array of worsening symptoms and has no sound advice. To add to the complexity, my husband died last year and grief over the holidays was awful. I just moved too. My diet and exercise have not been as strict because I crave bad carbs, comfort food. I don’t know where to start to get well. Should I check in to the Mayo Clinic until someone figures out my thyroid and other symptom madness? I don’t know who to trust. My most recent labs are listed below. Thank you! Aurora
Free T3 3.2 pg/mL
Reverse T3 13ng/dL
T3 total 1.22 ng/mL
Free T4 1.1 ng/dL
Thyroid peroxidase <1 IU/mL
Thyroglobulin antibody <1 IU/mL
TSH 0.02 uIU/mL (low)
Vitamin D, 1,25 dihydroxy 35 (previously stopped supplementation because was in high normal range)
Vitamin B12 1334 pg/mL (high now when previously low, maybe due to multivitamin)
Magnesium 1.8 mg/dL (low normal)
Ferritin 32 ng/mL
Folate serum 12.1 ng/mL
Estradiol 278 pg/mL (high)
Progesterone 3.7 ng/mL (low normal)
Total testosterone 39 ng/dL
Hi Aurora. I’m so sorry for your loss and resultant grief you must feel.
Only a guess and based on patient reports, but the first thing patients who get worse on Armour explore is getting on a different brand. Too many patients on Armour reported a terrible return of their hypothyroid symptoms since Activas bought out Forest, only to see themselves improve greatly by being on a different brand. They are listed here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/options-for-thyroid-treatment. Second, with that kind of stress from the loss you have experienced, I know if it was me, I’d do an adrenal saliva test to see how my adrenals are faring. Third, we learned repeatedly that we can’t just go by Ferritin. Yes, low ferritin “could be” low iron all around, but it also could be from having high heavy metals, and usually from the MTHFR mutation, we’ve noticed. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/mthfr So we also do serum iron, % saturation and TIBC. If serum iron is low with the low ferritin then we knew it was simply low iron that needs correction. But if serum iron is good or high with the low ferritin, it’s an MTHFR problem that needs discovery and treatment. We’re thankful for what we’ve observed plus what all the MTHFR information on the net has given us!
Janie, thank you for your prompt reply. I had already checked out your Armour alternatives page and now need to find a doc to help me get things right. Of course, a recent blood cortisol came back within normal limits. I haven’t done a saliva adrenal test or MTHFR test since 2012, so it’s on my to do list. Thank you for the iron testing info as well. Your website is very informative as are the people whose comments help me consider new options. I also liked your 10 Rockin’ Thyroid Patient New Year Resolutions just for you.
Aurora, we can’t go by blood. It’s measuring both bound and unbound cortisol and doesn’t tell us what is available for us like saliva does. Glad you liked the 10 Rockin’ Thyroid Patient Resolutions. 🙂 Comes from the heart….always.
Will anyone in the UK prescribe Armour, Nature Throid or similar?
Nicolas, find others to talk to: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/talk-to-others
Hi, like many of you, I am really concerned about the issues surrounding Armour. I’ve been through hell in the last year and a half, trying to find my way back to good thyroid health;
My thyroid journey has been a little complicated in the last 18 mnths.
In short; I’m 35. Diagnosed hypo 1999 when I was 19 (family have it on both sides) Levo was prescribed and dose levelled at 175mcg. I’d considered all symptoms over the years to be ‘just me’ not knowing which, if any, related to hypo; Issues with anxiety, sweating, weight, fatigue, mood, libido, low pulse, digestive issues, brain fog etc for as long as I can remember.
it was suggested by my partner in 2014 that I seek an alternative approach.
I tried ndt, initially with adrenal support. Didn’t work for me. Possibly in retrospect dose kept too low, or adrenal support not needed, as recent tests suggest adrenal function fine (cortisol could however have been elevated due to Citalopram which I’ve since reduced from 40 — 30 — 20mg (20 since 20/11/15).
Back to GP I reverted to T4 reluctantly in Dec 2014 and built the dose up. I also started taking Citalopram in Dec 2014 following break up, with major life changes and the prolonged poor thyroid health. I’ve not been right ever since.
Major tremmors, shaking and sweating resulted when reaching >150/175mcg T4 (first time I’d experienced this), suggesting something wasn’t right. Problems each time I tried to reintroduce T4.
Back in August; T4 conversion issue determined by Dr P and co. I always felt better when coming off T4 for a bit.
I stopped T4 in Aug 2015 based on symptoms and blood results (Antibodies extremely high) and began T3 in Sept after nearly 3 weeks off T4 following guidance from Paul Robinson’s ‘Recovering with T3’ book.
Trial and error had me pinballing back and forth with a few hurdles and I didn’t manage to get a foothold.
Initial foray into taking T3 was positive, possibly whilst I still had T4 in my system.
Trying CT3M didn’t seem to work, no doubt unnecessary given adrenal function at the time? Morning sweats on the tube were the worst.
Most recent T3 dose was 20 at 8am, 15 at midday and 10 at 5pm.
Whilst it was not all bad, I could not bare the frequent almost debilitating and life/work limiting fatigue I would experience regularly on T3, so I have taken the decision, with a bit of private practitioner guidance, to try Armour again, as I have a stash of this (branded Forest Pharmaceuticals, LOT 1129091 EXP 02/16).
I started taking this yesterday 1st Jan. Awful palpitations and anxiety within a few hours of taking.
Is this likely to subside? Should I persevere?
I understand 2 key things to consider; cortisol and Iron levels. Both of which I am waiting to order from Genova when they reopen.
My concern is starting on a journey with something that does not seem to be getting a lot of love right now. As you can appreciate my confidence in this is low, I don’t want to trial something with foreseeable issues ahead.
Any advice for me at this stage would be hugely appreciated. Thank you and happy new year to you all.
When any of us have palps and/or anxiety on NDT, it’s been shown to be a sign we have either a cortisol or iron issue, yes, that needs discovery and treatment. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
This explains a lot! Ive been on Armour since 2008 and suddenly the last 3 months I feel like I’m not even on it because all my hypo symptoms have come back. I feel horrible! Extremely fatigued, Migraines, muscle aches, depression, insomnia and anxiety. Not to mention I’ve been putting on weight Rapidly without changing my diet. I haven’t felt this bad in 10 years. Something is wrong. I will have to switch to Np. Anything is better than feeling sick everyday!
Brandie, glad you are switching to NP Thyroid. People report feeling much better.
Has anyone experienced hot flashes since the change in the Armour formulation?
I’m 5 years post menopause and over the past month hot flashes are back with a vengeance along with leg cramps and joint pain.
Annual physical is in a few weeks, can’t wait to switch to NatureThroid.
OH MY YES!!!! I was on Armour for years and feeling pretty good, and then it all went bad I guess around last spring. Weight, tiredness, and the hot flashes that I had never had!! Course it may be time for them at 52 year old, but I think the med was changed and messed me up. Went to compounded which I had no hot flashes at all, but it was still 60 dollars a month. Just changed to NT. Not feeling a difference yet. Been on it about 3 weeks….but, it may be I need it upped. I still have hot flashes some though with the NT. Soooo I split it up into two doses. Someone suggested that on the compounded that was slow released that I was converting my T3 well when I would take my med all at once in the morning. So that is what I am doing. As I have another hot flash. uggg I really think Armour has changed and have read it has really messed some people up. I have only been off it I think like 3 months if that. Hopefully with the Naturethroid I will get better soon.
It’s too bad about Armour. FYI: splitting NDT into two doses has worked well for patients, but you just may need to explore upping the total daily amount when you switch. Learn from the section on this page on how we find our optimal dose and it means to be optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
For me, being 63 years old and post menopausal, I find that when I have hot flashes that they are due to adrenal issues. Today I took my first dose of Naturethoid and I do not feel good at all. I feel much better while on Armour. I am also taking cytomel and I must say that the armour/cytomel combo works like a charm for me.
Marge, your feel bads on Naturethroid may not be due to the Naturethroid at all. It can be due to what it’s revealing, which is usually a cortisol problem or inadequate iron. This explains: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Thought I’d provide everyone with an update on my switch from Armour to NatureThroid.
At my January 2016 physical, my TSH was at .30 so my doctor, while he was OK switching me from Armour to NatureThroid — he wouldn’t put me on 130mg of it. I was on 120mg of Armour. He wanted to raise my TSH to above 1.0, so he put me on 113mg of NatureThroid.
The NatureThroid was not a good option for me. Maybe because it’s the wrong dose, but whatever the case…..I’m sleeping 11 hours each night and waking up exhausted. No weight gain yet. Really bad muscle cramps. My face is puffy again. Hands swollen but not as bad as one year ago.
My latest TSH is .78, went for bloodwork earlier this week. Went back to my doctor and I asked him to switch me NP Thyroid which he agreed to do and he also increased the dosage to 120mg.
My T3 and T4 levels are normal.
So now I try out the NP Thyroid for 3 months to see if this does the trick. I hate being on this roller coaster. We all know the routine….in 3 months I’ll get labs redone and adjust meds if values are off again. Fingers crossed this time I’ve found the magic sauce!
In the meantime….sleep sleep sleep….
I appreciate the fact that my doctor is willing to switch up my meds to find what works but he told me yesterday this is the last change he’s making – if this new med and dosage doesn’t work he’s sending me to an endocrinologist.
Anyone know a good endocrinologist in PA/NJ/NY that accepts United Healthcare that’s willing to prescribe NDT? Needle in a haystack.
I really wish Armour had not changed its formulation and had not tripled in price! I was doing so well on it for all of last year.
I started on NatureThroid and have been very pleased with the results – better energy – more consistent energy -no spikes. It’s been a lifesaver for me.
How long ago did you make the switch?
It’s been about 4 months now.
Did you switch because Armour wasn’t working well for you? I stumbled upon this site and that’s how I discovered that Armour changed its formulation.
Was doing SO WELL on Armour after many years on synthroid and levo with terrible side effects. My doctor was OK trying the Armour when my TSH swelled to 38 on the levo.
But now, after just 11 months, symptoms are back – no weight gain, yet. Fatigue, swelling of my face and hands now too. Just don’t feel good once again.
NatureThroid is offered by my insurance company as an alternative to Armour, hoping my doctor won’t mind switching me again to another NDT.
Thanks for the feedback!
I loved Armour for years since switching off Synthroid in 2007. But recently my dosages needed to be increased (per labs & symptoms), and with my last refill, now I’m gaining weight very quickly, fatigue is back, and having daily headaches (some rather severe), joint pains, chest pains and sleep interruptions. I tend to tough it out with most things, but when they raised me to 2 grains of Armour, I honestly expected (finally!) to see major improvements. Instead, I feel like I’m sliding backwards. I’ve been an STTM follower since about 2007 so I knew Janie would have some answers. I’ve emailed my doctor and asked to switch immediately to NP by Acella or WP by RLC labs.
Would you mind if I use your exact words for a new graphic on the STTM Facebook page??
I’d be honored. Thanks Janie!
I’m happy to report my nurse practitioner switched me from Armour to WP (formerly Westhroid) by RLC Labs. This is only the 5th day and I can tell a big difference in energy already. I have hope again!
Stephanie are you still doing well with WP?
Same here Stephanie!! Looking forward to seeing if the naturethroid is as good for me as all the reviews I have read for other people!! Hope you get everything worked out quickly!!
I am still doing very well on WP, thank you for asking, Gina. I’ve lost 8 lbs since that last posting. Not a bunch, but as I’m sure many will agree, it’s at least in the right direction. I am also following AIP (about 75% of it, anyway, avoiding nightshades) and that’s helping. Also 100% gluten free since last summer. I don’t diet, and I don’t work out, so 8 lbs is good for me.
Yes it was a blood cortisol. They want me to do some sort of urine cortisol test. But someone else told me the saliva is best also. I just hope this new med works and she will up it as needed. This was the first time to see her. (My doctor retired.) But just found out about 2 doctors that are thyroid docs in my area (Memphis, TN) that take insurance. I may go to one of them if she doesn’t work with me on this. I will say, they are easy to get a hold of though…Which is awesome!!!
That also makes me think too….with the compounded medicine, my hot flashes pretty much went away. It was getting sooo bad! But I was taking my armour all at once in the morning. They said that since the compounded was time released it helped with my T3 conversion….and just take the naturethroid 2 imes a day….hmmmmm
What patients discovered is that the typical urine test given is simply an average of a 24 hour period. Might be a good analysis to rule out Addisons or Cushings, we have learned, but for the type of low cortisol we as thyroid patients tend to get, we saw repeatedly that saliva testing gave us better information since it gives a peek at what is going on at four key times in a 24 hour period.
We also found that simply taking prescription NDT twice a day (usually morning and early afternoon) worked great. We didn’t need the so-called time release and it comes across more as a promotion to get expensive compounded sales. T4 is a natural time release anyway!!!
Thanks Janie for the info! I didn’t know that about T4. Getting my naturethriod today! Hope it starts working quickly!!
When I go back to the doctor, I will ask her about the saliva test instead…. 🙂
Happy New Year!
Know that you aren’t dependent on your doctor to get a saliva test. It’s legal to order your own! https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/recommended-labwork shows several places where you can.
But doesn’t the doctor have to understand and recognize the diagnosis and what to do? The more I read about this the more confused I get. I saw the treatments, but don’t really understand….. uggg But I may order it and see, if she will not do it.
We would LOVE it if our doctors were caught up with our knowledge, or open-minded about it. But there are too many right now that aren’t. That’s why you have to become informed and hope you can teach your doctor what patients have learned to get well. It’s also why some have to order their own labs.
Have been on compounded for 2 months and my hot flashes are gone, but it is still $60 a month. Haven’t had another thyroid panel done, but was looking at my last one 2 months ago and my numbers looked like this….
TT3 1.02 ng/ml range .60- 1.81
FT4 .54ng/dl range .66 – 1.65
TSH 7.375 uTU/ML range .340 – 5.6 (Used to be 1 or lower til Armour changed…uggg)
D3 – Low 26.9 ng/ml
Cortisol – low2.8 ug/dl
Just can’t believe this happened. Had been fine for so long!! But the good news is that Target in my area sells naturethroid and I am going to start that tomorrow! I sure hope it works!! My armour was horrible and got up to $200 and something dollars for 3 months. The compounded was $180 for three months. The Naturethroid is $25…I guess for a month….They just called it in for me. Next month go back for test. I really need to now, but I am hoping the new med works….
Not advice, but here’s good information to consider: many patients report loving Naturethroid and do well on it, just as they do on WP Thyroid and NP Thyroid. As long as each person works to find their optimal dose, they soar. But..if you have low cortisol, it can impede the T3 getting to your cells. I think you did blood cortisol, and we found that it’s not as accurate as saliva cortisol at all. See https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
ps ~ forgot to mention that I have numerous MTHFR issues also. So, I do various detox methods routinely.
I’ve been on Armour thyroid since 2011. Prior to being diagnosed and starting Armour, I was getting eyelid styes quite frequently. Once on Armour, the styes went away and never returned… until this past October (2015). The first stye took over a month to open and drain, by which time it got to the size of a pencil eraser. Two MD’s and an eye doctor refused to lance it but, offered antibiotics which I can’t take due to critically severe allergic reactions to antibiotics.
When stye #1 finally opened and drained, I realized there were two more styes underneath / beside that first one. Those remaining styes are still there two months later (three months total). I can’t help but wonder if this is related to the reformulated Armour not working as well. Does anyone else have this happen?
And yes, I know that styes are a staph infection, thus my wondering about the Armour thyroid since thyroid function is involved in the immune system. And yes, I do wash my hands frequently throughout the day, in case someone thinks I may have transferred bacteria from my hand to my eye.
Based on what patients have been reporting, I know I’d personally be suspicious of the Armour and would move to a different brand if your situation were mine.
Thanks Janie…! 🙂
On two different occasions over the past month, I tried a one grain dose (65mg) of Westhroid from a bottle that I had left over from a long time ago. By the second dose, I had a severe headache, rapid heart rate, tremors, etc. Symptoms of an allergic response… but, I checked the label and there’s practically nothing in Westhroid to be allergic to ! Weird, right? So, I went back to the Armour. I did notice later that the expiration date on the Westhroid bottle was 9/13. Do NDT supplements “go bad” over time? Could that have caused the weird reaction ?
I can’t pin all of the symptoms on the Westhroid though. I’m also in the middle of an acute exposure to VOC’s (volatile organic compounds) in the house… new tile flooring and it’s adhesive, plus a new mattress were moved in the week before Thanksgiving and have been causing the same symptoms ever since. I think the Westhroid just compounded them. But, it could’ve been the long ago expiration date also.
I had an appt last week with an MD who was recommended by a friend as being a good thyroid doc. But, he turned out to be pretty worthless. Didn’t listen at all. So, now I’m looking at ordering a full thyroid panel from zrt labs and paying out of pocket for it. Then, since I learned how to read lab numbers here on your website, I can go see about finding Armour (or maybe Westhroid) without a prescription online. *wink, wink*
Instead of an allergic reaction, it may have been revealing low iron or that your adrenals are stressed causing high or low cortisol. See #2 on this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
i triend wp after armour and felt awful too. I talked to the pharmacist and was asked if i was allergic to ragweed and yes ofcourse i am .. wp has ragweed and ofcourse im allergic to it…armour gives me chest pain since last year. so on to the next i guess
I have been taking Armour since 2009 and the favorable changes to my mood and my general outlook on life were dramatic. I decided to start on nutrisystem, which is a very controlled diet plan, in 2012. The weight loss was steady and continuous, particularly in the fair-weather seasons, but not so much in the winter when bad weather would curtail my outdoor exercise. The weight loss seemed to pick up again in the spring, at least at first, when my exercise program became more consistent again.
Then last summer, in 2014, I noticed the weight loss stalled even after restarting the outdoor exercise when fair weather returned. I started having problems with my knee, so the daily brisk walks were a little more challenging. I starting sticking to flat surfaces more rather than inclines but still found I needed to take more “off” days in between. My weight started to slowly creep back but I felt good on the days my knee was not too painful, so I stepped up the exercise. When autumn came, I began to engage in more vigorous yard work than I had in a very long time, which turned out to be a mistake. It resulted in an injury to my knee that required medical attention plus six or seven months of physical therapy.
The worst result, by the middle of 2015 I had gained back probably 75% of the weight I had lost and I had stayed on the same tightly controlled diet plan the entire time!!!
I attributed almost all of the weight gain to my reduced activity due to the knee injury. I also found that I had to increase my Armour dose in mid-2014, not only because of the weight gain but because my thyroid had become enlarged. I thought that would help with the weight gain, but no such luck. While I was having trouble losing and my weight was beginning to creep up at that time, it shot up this past year.
Do you think this all was because of the changes to the Armour Thyroid? Could the skeletal-muscular problems also been associated with the changes in the medicine’s efficacy?
I’ve read some of the chapters of the new STTMii book but I’m still working on the others. It seemed to me from what I read that I should stay on Armour because it also contains calcitonin – something new I found I needed when I was diagnosed with osteoporosis in late 2014. I don’t think the others have that.
Sheesh! The more I am writing, the more I believe I am beginning to see a trend! Do think all these “new” issues, particularly the ones that revealed themselves in 2014, coincide with the changes in the Armour Thyroid formulation? My health insurance company presents NP as an “equivalent generic,” but I have always been skeptical of such claims.
I’m just beginning my journey with hypothyroid currently taking levothyroxine wanting to try armour Just changed doctors however new doctor seems to be hesitent wants to see previous records which i understand and encourage however my tsh scores show “normal” but i am still suffering everyday of so many symtoms. How am I to convince the doctor to consider the armour in hopes that it may help me to feel better? Please if anyone may have a suggestion i would truly appreciate the input. This is a madness its krAyzee! its impeding my progress of daily living it takes from my eight year old son because i rarely have enough energy to keep up with him or just the simple fact that i rarely FeeL GooD. And when I begin mentioning these simple reasons to the new doctor I begin crying out of frustration and he immediantly asked if I were depressed, wtf?!My reply was No i don’t feel depressed like i’m sad but rather due to circumstance and how i feel in general physically and mentally (cognitive and memory) its taking a toll. He suggested therapy. counseling. I am not interested in talking about it I am interested in addressing the reasons why of my continuing symptoms i suffer. This is as of dec.8 2015 he suggested i make a return appt to have a full physical and to have my records transfered to him to look at. So basically its a “snafu” as more time passes. I am so frustrated and at times so close to just wanting to give up
Hi Kim. Well, first of all, you may want to look at other brands besides Armour: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2015/09/19/armour-and-unhappy-thyroid-patients/
Second, here’s good knowledge you should learn about the TSH: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/tsh-why-its-useless
Finally, it sounds like the doctor you’ve been seeing is so far behind in good knowledge that you may have to do what it takes to find a better doc: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/how-to-find-a-good-doc I especially like the Pharmacy suggestion. 🙂 Hang in there. This WILL work out for the better.
thank you, janie
Kim, you mention MD says your TSH was “normal.” Did he do a Free T3 & T4 – those should be done. Also, finally, the Big Lab Corp finally lowered the upper end of TSH to 4.5 from 5.5, though endocrinologists wanted it to be 3.5. Took years to get that much. A range is nothing more than majority of the population falls between these two numbers. Period. One can be “normal” – but still symptomatic. Too many doctors are quite happy to practice medicine by a lab result vs the patient’s actual symptoms – whereas they should be used together. It’s going to get worse as healthcare gets turned into tech care – numbers vs real people.
After that awful turn with Erfa Thyroid almost two years ago I’ve been taking AT for about a year. First it worked nicely, not as good as ET used to do, but still. Then in the summer of -15 I started getting hypo symptoms again. Tired, weight gain, sluggish brain, a bit of brain fog, sad, rapid hair loss, very very dry skin… I saw here on STTM I wasn’t alone experiencing that.
I get 400 1 grain pills every third month, and for close to two months, since I got a new batch, I’ve been getting more and more “speeded”, shaking hands, “stuffed brain”, a bit absent with remaining hypo symptoms. Almost as if I’m getting too high doseage (I’m on 3 1/2). I had my bloodworks done two weeks ago, they were pretty good. Very close the the STTM recommendations, T3, T4 and TSH. I had a high pulse but very good blood pressure. My doc (I got a good one, there are some – keep looking 🙂 ) couldn’t wrap his head around this, but thinks I probably should change to NP Thyroid Acella. The “sluggish” ones had LOT NR 1141101, EXP 01/17 and the “speedy” ones has LOT NR 1148577, EXP 03/17. Unfortunately I don’t have the lot nr I got during the first half of 2015.
Has anyone else experienced the same thing?
Early new years wishes to all of us – May we all get a lot better and may Forest, Erfa and that gang stop messing up good formulas.
People have reported all sorts of problems on Armour this year. Maybe you can move to NP and see.:)
Lisa Launius (@lisaindfw)
Allergan is now merging with Pfizer so it can be a Ireland based company and get out of US corporate taxes. I also saw that Allergan is in talks to sell their generics business to Teva. No clue how all of this will affect Armour thyroid. My husband just started NatureThroid but I still have a month or more of Armour.
Hi Lisa – how does your husband feel taking Naturethroid? I might have to switch from Armour to a different NDT due to insurance costs and am debating the benefits of all the alternatives.
Any advice is greatly appreciated.
Hi Judy. They all work! i.e. many love Naturethroid, many love WP Thyroid, many love NP Thyroid, etc. It’s just personal favorites, or someone preferring the fillers of one, or whatever. 🙂 https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/options-for-thyroid-treatment
Thanks for responding. It’s such a stressful decision to make….Armour has been good to me over the past year, but I must admit that my last (recent) refill seems different somehow. I’m starting to feel sluggish, tired, joints ache, stomach ache with referred pain to my back, head really itches….grumpy too. All the symptoms I had before starting on the Armour.
So I’m thinking a switch might be in order….want to make sure I’m choosing the best alternative!
I highly recommend NP Thyroid.
Lisa Launius (@lisaindfw)
It’s been less than a week but I guess no news is good news.
Lisa, teach him the section on what we’ve learned in raising NDT to find our optimal dose: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
I was put on a thyroid med from a compounding pharmacy several years ago. Got a new doc, and he put me on Armour about 3 years ago. Also to note, I was never diagnosed with hypo, he put me on it because my thyroid was slightly enlarged and he said practically everyone is low. I was in range, but in the lower range (not off the charts by any stretch). I had no symptoms that I knew of. Lately – past several months – I have been having terrible joint pains, headaches and insomnia. When I think back, I honestly don’t think I’ve been as “fine” as I was since starting on Armour. Granted, I also had a baby at the same time I switched (and i’m in my 40’s)……….so I’m worn out anyway. I’ve started weaning myself OFF the meds period – my doc appt. is scheduled in January so I want bloodwork done with no meds to see where I truly am. Question – has anyone else experienced joint pains or these symptoms on Armour lately?? I have noticed the price increase too, but my main concern is how terrible I’ve been feeling.
I have the same symptoms as your self aching all over can’t sleep and terrible fatigue , I am also on Adrenal tablets for low Adrenal have put my Armour up to 2grains and felt worse ,have been on Armour for 12 years and been fine am waiting for nature Thyroid coming to try that as Armour is so expensive and having trouble with it now . hope you feel better soon I have had the Adrenal test and my adrenals were all over the place Anne x
Anne, what key thing we learned in treating low cortisol is that we have to start out on enough, and do Daily Average Temperature taking to find the right amount. It’s extremely important to read Chapter 6 in the revised STTM to understand what we learned in each other. Hard won lessons.
Thanks – hope you get well also! I slowly backed myself off of armour in Dec. and have had zero thyroid med since before xmas. Other than being a bit more tired in the afternoons, I don’t notice any difference. The joint pains/headaches have decreased so far, and I’m starting to sleep a little better. I think the joint/muscle aches have been partially why I couldn’t sleep – discomfort kept me turning all night. That’s only happened a couple of times in the past month so thankful for that! I’m not sure how or if the armour had anything to do with how I’ve been feeling, but my doc appt. is next week, and I’ll be requesting all the recommended tests. Then go from there………………….I really hope I can stay off any meds, and just find something I can buy over the counter to help if necessary! But I’m not holding my breath yet…..
Actavis website says it’s now Allergan
I want to call them and FDA as I like many others having same problems, extreme tiredness, weight gain (no change in eating habits) insomnia, hair loss, depression, dry skin and itching on nose, plus price hike in one month to 15.00 increase for 30 tablets.
I have some old Armour Thyroid’s from 2012 and new ones from December, 2015 and I can really see the difference in the medication Color is totally different and in 2012 I paid $8.00 in December $36.00.
Thanks for all help, from an unhappy Armour Thyroid person.
I am so glad that I found this article. I went on Armour Aug 2014. I felt great, was losing weight, and all that jazz. Around March, I started gaining weight, my thyroid started going hypo and I ended up needed a higher dose around June or July. I have steadily gained weight over this year, from 145lbs to 160lbs. My hair comes out by large amounts every day still. I am going to be switching to WP at the end of this bottle of Armour. I pay $21 more a month for a less effective medication.
I had to switch to NP from Armour due to the cost increase last week. I had raised my Armour a couple months ago due to returning symptoms. I have been taking the same dose of NP as I was of Armour, and have been feeling awful. Nonstop headache, body aches, anxious. Anyone have experience with switching and running into issues?
Val, the better strength of NP Thyroid may be revealing inadequate iron or cortisol issues. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
val, in november 2015 i switched from Armour to Nature Throid – the first 2-3 weeks were awful, horrible headaches every day. They went away and i thought i was doing great, but 3 months in i’ve gained at least 15lbs and my doctor said my labs look good (she wasn’t very familiar with Nature Throid and wasn’t thrilled with perscribing it, but she did). i just processed my last existing refill of armour – i hate to pay $80 instead of the $20 (for 3 mo) that nature throid costs, but i can’t afford to buy bigger clothes!! best of luck.
Christina, we have to raise NDT to find our optimal dose. If we don’t, we stay hypo, and weight gain is one side effect. It’s a common mistake people make–not raising high enough! This page explains: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
Different Laura – wanted to address the Laura in above comments. Jeff gave me the information that he talked about above and I am waiting on my first order. My doctor had Armour prescribed but we were both shocked at how expensive it was ($40 for 60 each 1grain tablets). I am going this route because I am at the beginning of my journey and this could become unaffordable for me as I go higher in dosage. The price I paid was with insurance coverage.
Here are the other brands which are much cheaper: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/options-for-thyroid-treatment
I am another person that just tried to refill Armour and the increase is huge. What are the lower priced substitutes in order of popularity and effectiveness? I look forward to your suggestions and thank you for your time –Jeff
Hi Jeff. They are all lower priced and they all work according to those on them. Erfa had some bad batches last year, but there are folks who don’t seem to have problems. See https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/options-for-thyroid-treatment
Thanks for your response Janie.
I have ordered from Zwebmedia prior to taking Armour.
They were good to deal with, so i will probably continue with them.
They appear to be a distributor for Great Pharma.
Jeff, do you have an Rx to order from this place or online? I am having a devil of a time getting an Rx from a Doctor.
Laura, please email me and I will be happy to email you the info. You don’t need an Rx and the manufacturer has a long history of producing NDT. It works for me and now that the new owners of Armour have become greedy I am going back to ordering my medication oversears. –Jeff email@example.com
Jeff are you located in the US? If so look into downloading an android phone app called “Good RX”, its a discount app and can save you a lot on prescriptions. Its showing Amour 65mg 30 pills $20. Im not sure if the app works world wide or just in the US. Hope it helps.
I have been on Armour for several years now. Recently started going hypo again for no apparent reason at about the same time the company was acquired and the price jacked up all to hell- I suspect the new company tinkered with the formula.
Anyway, I just switched to NP Thyroid and I strongly recommend it. You can dissolve it under your tongue and literally feel it go into your system.
How have you been doing with the switch? Did you take the same dosage or are you slowly raising? I just switched from 60 of Armour to 65 of Naturethroid. Not sure how I feel about it yet. I would appreciate any info you may have! 🙂
GG – am wondering how your doing now with the NP? Do you still like it?
Well, CVS came thru and I now own 200 60mg tabs of NP thyroid and working off 200 65mg tabs of NT, so I’m in good shape for some months. I really like the NP thyroid.
Janie, thanks and while I have your attention. I’m on a health forum where MANY are dealing with neuropathy and some don’t know WHY. It goes on diabetes, drugs, surgery which I ended up with nerve damage from hip replacement. Talk about a nightmare on this hip job.
Anyway, I got to thinking yesterday and did some google search and found a lot of information on neuropathy and HypoT. Do you have any comments to share on
this nerve issue and HypoT. thanks Joy
As with anything, there can be multiple causes, such as poorly-managed diabetes causing Neuropathy or your issue after hip replacement. But it can also be a symptom of poorly treated hypothyroidism, as well, for some. See http://jnnp.bmj.com/content/68/6/750.full
I finally got on Armour in 2002 and then went thru all the changes, shortages, etc. And now the change in companies and the INCREASE in price. It got to be too much for me to deal with. I have no drug insurance….so it’s my pocket.
I found NP and CVS was able to fill a script for me in July 2015 and now trying to get NP again with a refill, there is a shortage. Acella told me product was being released, there was a pig shortage….CVS has been trying to get me product and they can’t. I had to buy NT from my integrative MD’s office. I really liked NP and now can’t seem to get it.
Anyone have comments for me. Thanks.
They will eventually carch up. 🙂 Here are other options: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/options-for-thyroid-treatment
I went from Armour (March 2015) to NP (late July 2015) back to Armour (October 2015) because of moving and what the different pharmacies in my towns had available. I felt good on Armour in June-July but it uncovered an underlying adrenal weakness that I am still treating. Now I am back on it and raising slowly. I’m still not sure, based on my tests, which medication is better for me. I think it’s a wash. I believe that overall I have been undermedicated so am working to address this. As I search for a way to help myself get better, I really want to take into account everyone’s comments and would find it so helpful if those who have had a change in their symptoms would say if their FT3 and FT4 levels or antibody levels have changed or not. For example, this past summer my hair loss fluctuated a lot (it started last summer when I had a hyper episode bc of Hashi’s) but my thyroid levels did not change.
I really really LIKE the NP Thyroid and Walgreens has given me the lowest price. I will taking my new script to walgreens.
Janie, when did thyroid labs begin? Was it around the same timeframe that Syntrhoid entered the marketplace? Was that in the 70’s? thanks
My Armour almost tripled in price this year.
I just received a new batch last week and this new Armour pill is definitely harder and within a couple days all my prior hypo thyroid symptoms are coming back with a vengence. I called the company and they said to call your doctor. What?!? How about fix the pill? It appears I cannot take any US prescription NDT anymore, no more choices for dairy free options. NP thyroid did not agree with me either, I think it was the mineral oil. Frustrated.
So I went with the coumpouded pharmacy….but my prescription was $60…:(
I had just gotten sl excited thinking it would be better. That is not quite as bad as what my issurance wants. I have to pay $210 for three months….and every three months it goes up.
I think I am going to switch to Naturethroid, sinceit is cheaper. There are no pharmacies that have it here so I would have to buy online. $32 for three months…a lot better. Hopefully my doctor will go for that. only problem is that they are 65 mg pills instead of 60mg like my Armour…..so I don’t know if that extra 15mg would be ok or not.
I hope somone gets to the bottom of all this. They are ripping people off and the med doesn’t work…..
I just tried to get a one month supply of Armour through Walgreens and they wanted to charge me $62.89. I was told my insurance Blue Cross and Blue Shield State Health Plan (NC) will not cover any of the charges, so everything is out of pocket. I am supposed to take 3 30mg tablets a day (90mg total) in case anyone wondered what the charge was for in relation to dosage. If anyone knows of a cheap Canadian pharmacy to order through, or any cheap pharmacy for this drug specifically, I’d much appreciate it. I am currently unemployed and have no income and cannot afford to continue the Armour at this price. I’m calling my doctor in the morning to seek guidance. As an aside, the Armour is not lowering my TSH, so maybe a switch is warranted anyway. My TSH is higher than when I started Armour 10 months ago, and my doctor is puzzled as to why that is. So I was initially taking one 30mg, raised to 60mg and am now on 90. I go back in January to see where my TSH is, and hopefully it will go down… but only if I can find a way to afford this drug! Anyone else have their TSH rise with increasing dosages of Armour? It makes me think people are correct about the medication in the US maybe not being as consistent as that made elsewhere (no idea if this theory has merit). I’m also having substantial hair loss and this only just started when I filled the last bottle of my prescription. I don’t think it is working properly. Anyways, I am thankful for this site and the great information it provides. I am glad to hear that others are noticing Armour not currently working for them. I’d much rather be on a natural treatment, but it has to work!
My TSH initially doubled when I started on Armour. It showed suppressed by 6 months. The difference between Armour and NatureThroid is only 5 mgs….rather than 15. Just be patient….its not my strong suit. I am on 2 grains of Armour and my supply is made by Forrest. When that goes away, I will switch brands.
Soooo I have felt horrible and I knew the first pill of my last prescription,, three months ago, that Armour had changed! I have constanty been tired and all my symtoms have some back. My tsh has gone from 1 to 7.5!! Ugg, the stuff even taste more gross.
Anyway, I am going to pick up a prescription today from a compounding pharmacy called Benevere. Apparently their meds are gluten, soy, dairy….ect free. Don’t know if that helps me or not, but I hope so.
The doc gave me the same strength that I was using with armour. Since it is different from the new yucky Armour, I would figure I will feel much better. What do yall think?
Will check back.
That is awful for your TSH to go from 1 to 7.5 (and they say it hasn’t changed?? Not). Yes, using a compounding pharmacy works as long as you know it’s desiccated thyroid powder they are using, not synthetic T3 and synthetic T4. Also, it’s a lot more expensive and there are many other good brands of NDT that could be used. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/options-for-thyroid-treatment
I just changed from Armour Thyroid (120 mg) to Nature-throid (130mg) last week, (because of price went from $28 to $48/month).
I have been taking it now for 4 days. But I am feeling the symptoms come back, shakiness, nausea, hot flashes and aches. Should I stick with Nature-Throid a few more days to see if it levels out?
or switch back to Armour Thyroid.
I felt good while on Armour Thyroid.
Cindy, you have to evaluate what you mean by “felt good” on Armour. Did that mean you didn’t have “shakiness, nausea, hot flashes and aches”? Or did it mean that on Armour, you had a complete resolution of all hypothyroid symptoms with great energy? Because if it’s the former, Naturethroid is good enough to reveal that you have an adrenal problem or low iron or both. See this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
I feel the same way. I switched to naturethroid 130mg 6 weeks ago and have felt horrible ever since. I’m going back to Armour 120 mg.
I started Armour 1 grain in June 2015 and LDN 1.5 at the same time. I had some transitions in the last 4-5 months but lately feel as though the Armour is not doing the job..The price has gone up 2 times as I have no insurance and I’m wondering for someone Gluten Free Dairy Free and Soy Free what other brand would be the best to transition to. I’m looking at NatureThyroid and WP Thyroid, any recommendations. Both are much cheaper than Armour…
Donna, for ANY natural desiccated thyroid product, patients learned that one grain is simply a starting dose from which we raise every two weeks. So no matter what brand you choose, we found we have to do it correctly to get the results we need. This page explains: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
I’ve been on Armour Thyroid since 2013. Felt better than levothyroxine. levothyroxine was making me foggy. Armour made me feel back to normal, but I could never lose the weight I gained. I run 3 times a week with one of those days being long miles anywhere from 6 miles to a marathon. Even training for a marathon didn’t allow me to lose weight. Since March I haven’t been feeling the same, so my doctor upped my dosage to 1.5 grains (90 mcg). Still not feeling good, but my levels are just fine (maybe even better than what it used to be). So my question is can levels be good and the medication may not be good for me? Should I switch to NP Thyroid or Naturethroid?
Well let me tell you what happened to me since Actavis bought out Forrest Pharmaceuticals, I went into a severe thyroid storm. I gained massive weight, hair fell out, skin became like leather, my memory went and my heart was racing 40 miles an hour. I have been taking 90 mcg of Armour for about 4 years now and never had any issues or problems, so I researched and found that Forrest was bought out by Actavis, so I called the company and complained to them that something had changed. They were adament with me that the formulation had not changed since 2009. Bull Poopies is what I told them. I told them that I have been a nurse for over 20 years and have suffered with hypothyroidism since the age of 15 and I am now 55. They have lied to the public and I told them, they were darn lucky I was not a sue happy person, but I was going to blog on every website I could find, to tell everyone. DO NOT USE ANYTHING MADE BY ACTAVIS, they use fillers and additives that will hurt you. I now have found a compounding pharmacy, which is using only porcine and nothing else in the tablet, my life has changed dramatically, and I just want to spread the word out there, PLEASE check all your bottles you get from the pharmacy and DO NOT, take them if they have Actavis on the bottle. Thank you so much for letting me get this out to the public.
This is really a pathetic situation! Like dominos. One NDT falling after the other.
WHAT is the future for those who depend on it to LIVE! And no, Synthroid (or any generics thereof) is not the answer – or is it a substitute.
We sit here like sheep at the slaughter
wIting for the next bombshell. And I’ll tell you what else is part of the problem (I believe) is that the vast majority of those requiring NDT are women! If more men’s lives were on the line_____. there would be an uproar! And yes, our lives ARE in the line! Just infuriating!
I have been on armour thyroid med. For about 9 years, it is about as worthless as you can get.i have gained 50 pounds,my nose is constantly running, I have heart palpation that are very high, now iam on blood pressure med for afib,benicar, metotoporial, Januvia for diabetes,to top it all off I have to take,war far in L need off all this junk that making things worse.
I’ve been on synthetic, compounded synthetic, compounded ndt, and now armour….best I’ve felt is on armour. Everyone is different. Try whatever you can to find what works for you.
Claire, it is mostly individual as to what NDT someone will like. But….there is now what appears to be a growing body of folks (unlike yourself!) who are noticing worsening symptoms on Armour….and the same has been true with different batches of Erfa the past year. So I can only say for myself, I will personally avoid Armour or Erfa until these issues are fully straightened out…and for others, I’m going to explain those issues with Armour and Erfa and let them decide.
Hi Janie, can you let me know what the issues with Erfa have been? After my hypo symptoms returned using Armour I switched to Erfa about a month ago. I have been in a downward spiral ever since. I wasn’t quite sure where to start my starting dose. I was on 2.25 of Armour but since it didn’t seem to be more than a placebo pill I thought I would play it safe and started on .5 and raised to 2 grains over the period of about 2 weeks. Well even though I was on 2.25 of Armour the Erfa was just so much stronger it sent me into massive hyperthyroid. I went back down to .25 even skipping some days because I am so shaky and anxious. My period also came after just two weeks. That has never happened before. It’s possible I have adrenal fatigue now since I had been on Armour and it was likely affecting my adrenals. But if you have any information about the issues with Erfa it might really help me figure out what to do right now. Thanks!
Andrea, the following is still an active blog post about problems some patients have had with certain batches of Erfa: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2014/06/12/part-ii-erfa-canada-says-new-thyroid-pills-are-fine-thyroid-patients-worldwide-exclaim-hog-wash/
But your issue could be adrenals, as well, so you might want to order a 24 hour adrenal saliva test: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/recommended-labwork
I’m convinced that the Actavis reformulated Armour has caused my hypo symptoms to come back with a vengeance and then some. I have an appointment with my doctor set up and I’d like to be able to suggest an NDT alternative but am confused as to what is best.
Naturethroid? Efra? Acella? Others? Any advice is greatly appreciated!
We are convinced too, Rose. Patients are even reporting the tablets are now different in appearance. But as far as which brand, it’s up to you. We know that there have been a lot of patients reporting problems with certain Erfa batches the past year (even though others say they are fine), and it’s hard to know how to dodge the good ones vs the bad ones. Same with Armour now, sadly. So what you have left is WP Thyroid, Naturethroid and NP Thyroid….though the latter has been on back-ordered in many pharmacies. There are also a few good over-the-counter brands you can consider–Thyroid-S, Thiroyd and ThyroGold i.e. patients have good reports about them. But that’s up to you and I’d sure consider making sure your doctor knows about your use of them if you feel they will be open-minded about it.
I was diagnosed with either Hashimoto’s or Graves (depending on whether you talked to my family Dr or the endo) about 15 years ago. I was diagnosed after gaining 20# in 3 months and having it dismissed by my ob as ‘an age thing’. I wasn’t satisfied with that, so I found a family dr and they ran all sorts of blood tests as I was a new patient. Hyper was the result, was medicated, then hypo, then hyper, then hypo and when my eyes started bulging and my prescription radically changed, RIA was recommended by an endocrinologist. Post RIA, my family Dr. treated me based on TSH, T3 and T4 as well as how I was feeling.
I found this site as I have been quite stable on Synthroid (according to my current dr who purged my past history and no longer has these records) until the past couple of years. He is treating me without any recognition of the RIA and simply says I am hypo and runs TSH and maybe frees every 6 months. For about a year I went to an endocrinologist who didn’t ever explore whether my current symptoms could be related to my thyroid and also treated me based on TSH and an occasional free. I’m 44 and have been diagnosed with early onset osteoarthritis, am continually tired, no motivation, am unable to lose weight, my hair is thinning and falling out, I have exzema and generally feel lousy.
In the past two years I have also switched from very little dairy to almond or soy milk as I am lactose intolerant. No one has ever mentioned soy can interact with Synthroid although my Dr. is aware I’m using both. This has just been brought to my attention by a friend dealing with auto immune issues and I have adjusted the time of day I use soy. Its also gotten me thinking about what other medications might be out there that will be more effective for me.
I’m feeling stuck, wondering how to even find a dr. that doesn’t go just by the tests (my previous was the only accepting my insurance, so I lucked out there!) and am not sure where to find additional information on the post-RIA aspect of things. Are my symptoms to be correlated to hypo, or are there different concerns at play because I am RIA? Any ideas of where I can go to find more to educate myself and take a step in the right direction?
Hi Tricia. Patients think that it’s less about being post-RAI and more about being on the right thyroid meds, which for all too many, isn’t Synthroid. Instead, there are a just a growing body of patients who report doing much better on Natural Desiccated Thyroid since it gives us all five thyroid hormones. In the meantime, you might try the FTPO Without a Thyroid group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/FTPOWithoutAThyroid/
Found my way here as I was Googling for differences between Armour and Erfa as my insurance will be changing – AND have been having issues since about July of last year while on Armour.
Was on 60mg Armour then (and had been doing well), up to 90mg now, and symptoms still here. Glad to have found this info (NOT glad that this is a widespread issue), and sounds like Erfa may not be the way to go right now either. Acella?
Just purchased both books, interested to see what they say about temperature (which I’ve been taking for years on my own, and which has been decreasing since last July). Thanks for being a repository of information.
Your symptoms are clearly that if hypothyroidism. Get OFF the Synthroid,
switch to a NDT and give yourself a new lease on life! It’s a no brainer in all likelihood; Synthroid NIT working for you.
Spend time on STTM, learn, connect the dots, and take ACTION! Don’t defer to ANY doctor who won’t listen to you!
You can also try some natural bioidentical Progestetone to perhaps help your headaches. Search around for one with excellent reviews! Oh and 44 is YOUNG – NOT due to aging! Good luck.
I am new to this site and found it as I was researching my recent symptoms (and relationship to hypothyroidism). I have been taking Synthroid since my diagnosis about 15 yrs ago. Do not believe I have Hashimoto’s. I have been dealing with chronic headache/migraine for about 10 years as well. Recently I have developed symptoms (worsening constipation, daily joint aches/pains, stiffness, worsening fatigue) that I have been dismissing to aging (I’m 44) but am starting to question if a change in thyroid replacement wouldn’t improve my quality of life. I have been dealing with sleep disturbances, constipation, dry skin/hair, cold intolerance, and migraines for many years. I have always thought that my thyroid played a part in all these symptoms but as you can guess, my thyroid panel is normal on my current dose of Synthroid. I can’t get an appointment with my endocrinologist for another month and a half but I’d like to be armed with information on what changes I’d like to make.
Any advice is appreciated.
After being on Synthroid for too many years to count, in March, 2015 I went on Armour. I was doing wonderful and symptoms were falling away….very fast and then….after two months (my first RX was for 60 days), I crashed again. I have increased Armour with worse symptoms…..just like before….immense fatigue, sadness, aches, dry skin, hair issues and I cant hardly get out of bed! Please tell us what is going on with Armour….do I go back to Synthroid or another NDT?
Hi Abby. What patients report they are doing is definitely not going back to an inferior treatment with only one of five thyroid hormones, but moving to a different brand. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/options-for-thyroid-treatment
Thank you Janie. I did call Activis and complained to them. The med tech I talked to said….No we have made no changes but I just know better. Would you suggest West thyroid or Nature thyroid? I think there is a concern about propalene glycol in nature thyroid?
Abby, with the exception of some batches of Erfa, they all appear to work. Westhroid has mostly been replaced by WP Thyroid.
Abby, this is getting to be me. A couple of months doing better and now I have been suffering today and miserable. Feeling better now. But it always comes and goes. M6 appointment is Dec 2,with an endo 60 miles away. His reviews were so good I thought I would try him. Hoping he is as good a listener as he claims in,his bio. Meanwhile i will be experiencing these ups and downs, hit flashes, waking up at night……. my restless leg is back as is my fibromyalgia. Yes, I know hypothyroidism is connected to fibro and rls. I wish you lots of luck and please let post whats happening..
Thank you…I will. Good luck to you and maybe you could get on a cancellation list??
I am on both Armour & testosterone. To go down to “half” your thyroid dose may be too drastic. Also, testosterone can lower one’s thyroid levels, so bear that in mind accordingly; NOT as bad as estrogen though which can drop it even more. I suggest IF you think your thyroid is too low to take it down 2-3 days and see then, & a few days later IF you feel better. There’s a bit of a delay till it catches up in your body so you have to be vigilant. Meanwhile, IF your adrenals are impaired, you’re going to be hard pressed to feel or get optimal. Are you on Iodine? I believe it is the Iodine that largely cured my adrenal fatigue.
Meanwhile can after going on Iodine, I thought I might be one of those people who could get off NDT – but I now know that will never happen. I was on wayyyy tooooo low of a thyroid dose, and could NOT even function or work. It took a long time to get well. Keep a log on things and be vigilant. One variable / change at a time to isolate affects, results and progress, or lack thereof. T
I started going down hill late Dec 2014 and in 10 months I have gained 35 lbs. My labs are all over the place (up/down and sideways) my hair is getting so thin that I had to cut off 10″. Now here is the funny thing about the hair; I have been taking biotin 5000-10000 mgs for about 4 years now. My eyebrows have filled in, my eyelashes grew longer, same for the hair on my arms and underarms but the hair on my head keep coming out at a steady pace. My hair is really thin in the temple and bang area and in the past year I’ve lost a lot of fullness in the crown area. My stylist (who has been cutting my hair for 29 years) asked my thyroid meds were off. I had to face reality when he said that. I can’t figure out why other hair is growing while the head hair continues to fall out?
Linda K are you on any other kind of HRT? Female pattern hairloss also has alot to do with shifting estrogen and testosterone levels. I have been on Armour for a year and it seemed to have stalled my hair loss but then about two months ago it started falling out again and this time worse than ever. My blood panel showed my TSH lower than it had been a year before (0.7) and my testosterone levels were low too. My dr. started me on transdermal testosterone three weeks ago.
Testosterone can cause hair loss too (like thryoid) if too high or too low so I’m giving it a shot. However, I think Testosterone affects insulin resistance in women and also affects thryoid levels. As a result I’ve now started having night sweats, am losing weight, sometimes get chills, tired (all hyper symptoms). I’m going to try cutting back to half on my thryoid med but is anyone else here on testoserone therapy and thyoid??
I would love to be able to get off the thyroid – I feel like my adrenal system is shot.
I’m wondering if anyone can give me some much needed insight… I had a TSH that has been slowly climbing the last 2 years and reached 4.8 a few months ago so was out on low dose of armour (30 mg daily) to see if it helped symptoms. The first couple weeks I noticed a decrease in puffiness in my face and increased clarity and energy. Within 2 months at same dose, I had gained 10 lbs and noticed hair started to fall out. So I stopped medication, wasn’t put on a different brand until a month later. Then was put on WP thyroid (60 mg daily) and within 4 days my hair was coming out by the handfuls. It has been 3 weeks and the hair loss has not slowed down… I have lost so much hair it is crazy. I can see my scalp in my front hairline. Since I wasn’t really bad to begin with, can I stop medication and supplement with natural roasted kelp? I cannot afford to lose anymore hair and the pharmacist said I shouldnt be losing the amount I am (I showed him a picture of the hair I had lost so far). Any help would be greatly appreciated, I’m scared and I don’t know what to do.
Hi Nicole. What a lot of people new to NDT don’t understand is that you have to raise…and raise…and raise again and find your optimal dose. It never works to stay on those lower doses. That’s why your hair was falling out. Read this carefully: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101
So happy to read all these helpful comments! My labs have been way off as of late after having much stability w. Armour for the past year. I have noticed that the pills no longer are stinky and have no taste (they used to taste like bacon to me). I’m on the Iodine protocol mainly for breast health and have had great response w. cutting out my fibrocystic tissue, but I was afraid it raised my TSH for a bit (this could be a side affect according to Dr. Brownstein) but should normalize after 6 months. I want to continue w. the Iodine as I believe it has great health value, but think I’ll be switching to Nature Thyroid or have a compounding pharmacy make me up a batch as I still have some hypo symptoms (mainly fatigue) Thanks, everyone, and Janie for this great site!
We agree with you about iodine, Shazza. Others are switching to NP Thyroid, as well.
Thanks, Janie. I got very good info on your website on other supplements to take on the Iodine protocol (selenium, magnesium, Vit C/Vit B, etc.) My breast thermograms changed so dramatically from 3 months on Iodine, that I fell it is good for me to stay on it. I also benefitted from having a phone call consult with someone on your team which was very helpful! I’m so happy to have access to the STTM website and your books as resources!
I was on Armour from September 2014 until around March or April of this year. It was doing the job my doctor thought, so she switched me to Nature-Throid. She has increased my dosage twice since that time (now on 91.25?), and even though my brain fog has improved (but not entirely gone), my thyroid levels continue to plummet–it’s burned out and nearly dead anyway, no thanks to the ‘endocrinologist’ I saw for 6 years.
I just find it all so frustrating. I want the life back I used to have, but that’s no longer possible, Due to Hashimoto’s and Fibromyalgia w/Chronic Fatigue (brought on by the Hashi’s, IMNSHO), I’ve been unable to hold a full-time job in five years. It gets quite depressing, as I’m sure a lot of you know.
Anyway, just throwing my short-lived Armour NDT experience in.
Thank you Janie!
Forgot to add, my daughter’s Ferritin is high at 201, while TIBC, UIBC, serum iron and saturation are normal. Thanks.
Radhe, my first recommendation is to read this….really take the time: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/t4-only-meds-dont-work
Then tell that backwards Endo that u want your daughter to have some direct T3 with that Synthroid, period.
The high ferritin means she has inflammation which needs treatment.
And finally, we as patients found out that lab results have nothing to do with just falling in the normal range. They have to do with where they fall in those ridiculous ranges. Always compare your results to this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/lab-values
My daughter is 19, autistic and minimally verbal. Her TSH is 6.1, antibodies normal, and DHEA, cortisol and prolactin are very high. The endocrinologist has prescribed levothyroxine 25mg which does not make sense to me since her free T4 is normal at 1.2. He did not check her free T3 though in the past they have always been low or borderline normal. The main reason we tested her is because she has had five periods in the last six weeks. He has also prescribed Metformin for the hormones since he suspects that is PCOS. I am very concerned because my daughter will not be able to adequately communicate any discomfort with the meds. I have an appointment tomorrow, and I appreciate any recommendations. Thank you all.
Hi, I have just changed from armour to WP and feel quite nervous about it. I wanted to move to something with less fillers. I feel pretty tired, its day two of the change, is this normal? Should I be taking the same as the armour amount? Has anyone any experience with WP? Thank you
Hi Bethany. Did you switch to the same amount you used to be on with Armour? That’s how most patients report doing it. Then in a week or two, they evaluate if another raise is needed….
Sorry for late reply! yes, I started on the same dose and 4 weeks later I have now upped it by 1/2 grain. I will get my bloods done in 2 weeks again. I am feeling pretty okay, energy seems stable, etc. Do you think WP is as good as Nature Thyroid? I feel a little nervous about it as not many people seem to have tried it. thanks x
Erika, may I encourage you to do two things: 1) spend some time (whatever it takes) on the STTM site learning about NDT versus Synthroid, and more. You will note that the vast majority of women
do much better on NDT versus the synthetics for countless reasons. 2)
Consider finding a new doctor who will listen to your concerns, and ACKNOWLEDGE them, not dismiss them. You may never feel right on Synthroid and until you try NDT, you will not know. IF your hypothyroidism isn’t
managed right – you will never feel good.
Too much is at stake. As for concerns about Armour, it’s too early to tell, the consensus is still out at this point, and there are other options, Nature Throid &
others. It’s all there on the site. Study
up and take charge of your own body.
Don’t defer to any doctor if it doesn’t feel right inside. Good luck!
Thank you, Trisha i am looking forward to seeing my doctor on Sunday and explaining to her what i want to do. im hoping she will listen to me.
I am new to the blog. I have read the book. I am currently on synthroid. I originally was diagnosed border grave I was hyperthyroidism. I was treated with iodine radiation. I have been on synthroid for almost 2 years. In the course I have lost most of my hair. I have been diagnosed from my dermatologist to have telegon effluvium. Also he stated i have an autoimmune disease he said my Ana levels are high. I have been sent see a rhemotologist. There are times when I feel like I have massive inflammation in my body I don’t eat much have gained alot of weight. I feel like I’m moving bowels like a baby. I’m so tired don’t know what to do anymore. I don’t feel like myself. And I asked my doctor she told me that my medication is fine and I know something is wrong. I feel okay but I have all these crazy reactions happening.
I was intrested to know about armour but many are mentioning is not working well.
Someone please help don’t know where to start?
Hi Erika. We’re sorry you are having those struggles. We”ve been there before so do know you are not alone. A huge part of your problem is being on Synthroid, which we as patients realized was definitely not doing the job. Perhaps you need to reread Chapter 1 about what we learned about T4-only meds and how it causes a lot of your problems and really let it soak in. Chapter 2 explains why NDT has given our lives back. And it sure sounds like the Hashimotos chapter needs to soak in better, which you appear to have. This page on STTM will steer you to patient groups which can help, too: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/talk-to-others
Thank you so much for responding. I have scheduled myself to see my endocrinologist next sunday. I’m hoping to hear what she will say when I tell her I want to switch to N desiccated thyroid.
So confused prices up on armour an somethings just not right, feeling weak hair thinning out itching on body an hairline ! Smells very different an when I went back for yearly checkup thyroid was way off again , been on armour for several years , what in the world is going on, just got back my 2 month repeated thyroid test tsh .016 what are we to do??? Had Graves Disease an went through the radio active iodine treatment twice to bring it under control, So her I am upset an confused Lord help us all,
Has anyone experienced any difference in switching from Armour to Nature-Throid? I’ve been on Armour since the mid 80’s and getting ready to switch because of Greed. Thanks, TL
Poppa, look at the post before this by Anna. 🙂 And by the way, the same good results have occurred with NP Thyroid.
Horrible experience. Just came off Armour after first noticing that this new formulation has absolutely no porcine taste just dusty. Have sent it to my brother’s lab for testing as am not sure what the heck is even in it. Started Naturethroid today and day one fog has just lifted. My eyesight was impaired on AT and weight gain 40 lbs over a year…no joke! Just horrible and glad to be shot of it.
Anna, now that you switched, how do you feel? Just got a refill of my Armour at the end of September and I fill awful after feeling really good for multiple years. Thinking of calling my doctor and switching to a new med.
Oh my Annie, I just came off Armour after being on it for 5 years. Many terrible hypo symptoms crept back up since Dec 2014. Along with all the other standard hypo issues, I felt like I was going blind. I am 46 so I was chalking it off to my progressing need for reading glasses. OMG, a week off Armour and switch to Nature Throid, I HAVE LASER BEAM 20/20 vision. I am appalled at what Armour was doing to me now that I am back on an effective NDT. My hair had started falling out in clumps again this spring, I started getting horrible painful ovarian cysts and my menses were so out of the ordinary and painful I started to panic knowing it was coming. I developed terrible ammonia smelling body odor, dermatitis on my back and scalp and my plantar fasciitis that was all but gone for years came back with such a vengeance, I could not walk barefoot even from my bed to the rest room over carpet. I was gaining weight uncontrollably. It was all rather insidious and creeping until I switched from 30 mg tabs to 60 mg tabs (to get my daily 120 mg dose) to try and save money from the Activas price hike. I picked up a 60 mg script in August 2015, immediately noticed these pills were rock hard, had no odor or taste.I have always chewed mine up and taken sub-lingual. Within 2 days I thought I was going to die from the brain fog, muscle spasms/aches, dry skin, extreme vision impairment, the list goes on. I knew something was very very wrong for sure at this point. I switched back to my old bottle of 30 mg I still had left, and I felt much better, but not great, within a couple hours. I called the pharmacy and got my 30 mg Armour script refilled, thinking the tablet size was the issue, but low and behold, I got a bottle full of 30 mg tabs that were hard, tasteless and chalky just like the 60 mg ones. They were just as awful in terms of hypo symptoms, possibly worse. At this point I was out close to $300 just trying to figure out what was wrong, about to run out of the old Rx that was the lesser of the problems. I called my Doc and had her switch me to Nature Throid. The difference was astounding in just a couple days. I was pretty upset about not only the defective meds, but having shelled out the money that I did for this garbage product that that was ruined and the nerve of this company to not only bait and switch without informing the consumer, but price gouge us for it too. I called Activas and the rep was actually very helpful. She said they cannot do anything about me “feeling bad”, but they can offer me a refund for “quality issues” on the 3 scripts in question. I’m sure this is their lawyers trying to straddle addressing customer satisfaction without admitting they have done any wrong. She said my refund for the 3 prescriptions in question is in the mail in 4-6 weeks and she asked if I would be interested in sending them the leftover pills. I said ok if they covered shipping. She said she was “not allowed to discuss anything about the formulation”, but could transfer me to someone in their R&D who could. I’m guessing I got transferred to an attorney at this point. A VERY SMUG woman answered, hummed and hawed and patronized me like a child “I’m sorry to hear you are feeling bad, but we have not had a formulation change since 2008”. I very bluntly told her, “I don’t know why you keep feeling sorry for me feeling bad, I feel just fine right now, now that I am no longer taking Armour.” That got crickets out of her pretty quick, as they are trained to fixate on you complaining about “not feeling good”, because no one with a chronic health condition can win a law suit over the symptoms of their health condition. Sorry folks at Activas, I’m a nurse and worked in big pharma around a lot of lawyers, I know exactly what they were up to. Needless to say, I am happy to be just getting the small reimbursement at this point and thrilled to be on an NDT that is 1/3 cost and 1000% more effective from a company that is truthful about what is actually in the product, and not trying to price gouge us, just because they can.
Thank you, now I know WHY I’ve been itching since this last bottle of doubled priced Armour. Itching along hairline, different spot on scalp, places on face, nose very itchy AND constantly runny nose.
I am getting more T4 with Armour than I was while on a Synthroid/Cytomel combo, and my numbers are worse than when I wasn’t supplementing at all! I am so relieved to read this, because my doc and I decided today that it may be time to try another T3 only stint. I’ve had a conversion problem for a long time, and the best I ever felt was while taking no T4, but taking 30 of Cytomel. I’ve taken Cytomel for 2 days now and the amount of excess fluid that has come off of me, mainly in my face, is unreal.
My bottle of Armour still says Forest on it, not Activas. I assume it is the new, lousy formulation though. Am I assuming incorrectly?
I’d love to try the Acella after the T3 only period. I have issues with pork, so I had hesitated to try Armour in the first place, but NDT is obviously the way to go, so the benefits have outweighed the risks until now. My understanding is that Acella is bovine in nature. We shall see….
PJ, Acella is porcine. Lot of happy customers, too, if one raises high enough to find the optimal dose. 🙂
I got on NP in July 2015 and now CVS can’t get it. There has been a shortage per Acella but they tell me product is being released….I’ve been waiting. Any comments. I really like NP.
Started with Armour in 2002 and now can’t afford it. Price has gone out of sight.
I’m so happy to have found this thread. I have been on Armour for three years, and was doing well initially. Last year my numbers indicated that I was not converting well, so my doctor added cytomel. Unfortunately, during the last 8 months or so, I have definitely noticed a difference in the way I feel (exhausted, hair loss, extreme sensitivity to temperature) and have gained a ton of weight. Recently I came across something about issues with Actavis, so I actually stopped taking the Armour about a week ago and am only taking cytomel. I definitely need to get in for labs! Also wondering if anyone has experienced any back pain as one of the symptoms of the reformulated Actavis.
Rose , yes I have back pain with Activis Armour and headache. I feel like my blood pressure is really high on the new Activis hate it. I’ve tried everything but Erfa in process of getting it if it don’t work don’t know what I can do. Scary because off medications I end up in ER with very high Blood pressure.
Terri, if other brands are also causing high blood pressure, that’s a sure sign they are “revealing” the real cause, which is either inadequate iron or a cortisol issue, not the fault of NDT. Or you simply are staying on too low dose, which makes us more hypo and thus, BP can rise. Study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Now granted, Armour itself can cause continued hypothyroid in many due to something that went wrong after it was bought out, and some batches of Erfa are problematic, but NP Thyroid, Naturethyroid and WP Thyroid have been successful for most if iron and cortisol are good.
thanks janie and linda.
i hope tissue regeneration works, great that it appears to have with yours . i agree i think the body heals itself far better than all these other things .linda i agree maybe maybe i could cut down on starches and sugar but not if anyone tells me to! but no way could i cut them out and i see no reason to. moderation is the key they always used to say. until the gluten free dairy free no eggs no soy no fruit no fun came along.
yes janie my friends who got better was caused by stress thgouh i bet mine was also caused by stress but i stupidly listened to the drs unlike her and took the synthroid .
I was on Thiroyd for a month (8 months ago) and I could NOT function! It was terrible. I also don’t do well on Nature-Throid, having tried it now three different times. II hear the Thiroid-S has fillers and also aluminum as well I believe. Albeit, maybe a trace amount, but WHY put alumni into one ‘a body needlessly! And WHY is such a comment even in there in the first place! Stupid companies ~ just infuriating!
Any more good reports on Acella?
And are you finding it easy to find, or difficult? Any feedback much appreciated!
I started on NDT last December 2014. For a couple years prior I was up and down on Synthroid and then became Hashi and asked to be switched to Armour. I didn’t seem to be showing any improvement on the armour until one refill the pills were different and wow ! gave me a kick like I couldn’t believe. So I started looking in to, why? I discovered my pharmacy had given me a generic on that refill, i.e NP Thyroid by Acella. When I went back for another refill I got the reg armour and immediately could tell the difference. I have asked my pharmacy to only give me the generic because it works a million times better than the Armour. Armour is like eating wood. Can’t split or put under the tounge, but what’s the point it doesn’t work anyway. No Thanks Armour!! You can have your worthless, expensive pills. I love love love the Np Thyroid by Acella. Works like a charm! It can be split, dissolved under the tounge or chewed of which I do all three. Thanks Acella!! Please don’t change!!
so glad i read to the end to your post. i was just recently (day 3 today) switched to armour after years of up and down on synthroid. i was getting a little discouraged by the previous posts about how disappointing the armour is. when i saw that you got the generic, i quickly went to check mine: acella!! that must be why i’m paying $14… i REALLY hope this works for me too. 🙂
I stopped taking Armour years ago. I take a compounded dessicated pig thyroid capsule (from a local compounding pharmacy) instead of Armour. I learned some of the fillers in Armour could contain gluten-like substances, which are counter-productive for a thyroid disorder. Been on the compounded capsule version for years, and I feel much better than when I was on Armour — even though Armour was still WAY better than Synthroid – LOL!!
Yup I couldn’t figure out why I’ve put on 10-15lbs I can’t budge this spring. A lot symptoms back like increased fatigue, hair falling out, my cycles are all messed up. Gotten my period every two weeks past month… finally getting my labs from summer and my thyroid levels are all way off!! When I researched two weeks ago and saw they were bought out.. I KNEW IT WAS THE ARMOUR!! Time to try something new. Urgh I’m so tired of this struggle fir balance! But glad I can see here I’m not the only one
Thank you for this letter today bc it proves I’m not crazy!!!!!
I gave up on Arrmour a while ago and now I buy my thyroid pills from Thailand (no script) . I can use sublingual and they break clean with pill cutter. I bought 1,000 1 gr. pills (which I keep in freezer airtight) for a little over 100. dollars.
Where can I get pills with no script. I haVing trouble and doctor won’t increase.v
search Thyroid-s on Amazon. There’s a seller on there , they come from Thailand and take a couple of weeks to arrive here in the UK.
I have been through the mill for six years now starting with Armour’s initial reformulation. This is NO way to live, DAILY, constantly impaired! So WHAT is the scoop on ERFA. Last post I saw on IT was August 2014 – that’s over a year ago. Does ANYONE have an update of ERFA’s efficacy or prevailing lack thereof since reported problems with IT. Would like to know if IT is a viable option again, or shot down the tubes for good?
2. Also, can anyone report on the availability of Acella from state to state across the U.S. Is hard to come by??
3. Lastly, many people doing well – or NOT well in WP? I know we all respond uniquely, but any feedback or consensus thereof, would be appreciated! Thanks.
I switched to Erfa about a year ago due to my pharmacy having trouble importing Armour. I have been doing fine on it.
I have had problems since February 2014. I had a stay in the hospital. Nothing found of course. Then the hair fell out. Alopecia. Huge patches all over my head. Then fatigue. Then brain fog. Labs all over the place! Then the pain and muscle spasms. Depression. Diagnosed with osteoarthritis. I am 46. No answers. I didn’t know that Armour had been bought. Time for a new strategy!!
Have you have you had your calcium tested as part of a normal blood test? If one is over 30, calcium should be in the 9s not 10s. Hyperparathyroidism can cause fatigue, general feeling of not feeling well, poor sleep, and a host of other symptoms. Check out parathyroid.com.
CHANGES IN ARMOUR????? Not since 2008 according to a medical advisor at Activas Pharmaceutical. I called on September 14, 2015 after reading Janie’s post on Facebook and reported adverse reactions. They took all of my information, including how much my TSH had increased in 4 months and how my free T3 and free T4 had dropped. A medical advisor (they said medical pharmacist) called back and said there had been no changes to the way the product was being manufactured or formula. They will send me a followup letter.
I received a phone call from Activus just yesterday! My sister had called them to double-check that Armour is still gluten-free. She also mentioned to Activus that I was complaining about how hard the tablets were and wondering if the recipe had changed. So the complaints department called me for my thoughts. I also talked about the price hike, but was told that that was a customer service issue and that I would need to talk to that department separately. The agent did seem overly interested when I mentioned that I hadn’t felt quite right for about a year. Now I know why! I was already considering a change in medications; now, I will definitely do it!
The Actavis (the correct spelling) rep also wanted the lot/batch numbers on my Armour. Since it was not listed on the pharmacy label, she took the info so that she could call my pharmacy. Actavis is being quite thorough and seems interested in customer concerns. You can contact their Medical Communications team at (800) 272-5525.
Did they tell you if it is still gluten free?
TIRED of the nonsense, instability and futility of thyroid therapy where negatives exceed benefits.
Only 2-3 of the past 18yrs has thyroid therapy gotten me to 80-95% of normal (various scenarios and/or combos of NDT and synthetic). Utterly fed up, I started the transition from thyroid meds to iodoral/lugo and am feeling like my old self, no longer agitated, no longer wired-n-tired. My adrenals are healing because they are being less fatigued w/decreasing amounts of thyroid med. I still have my entire left lobe of my thyroid and a small part of the right lobe, so I’m willing to see if this strategy works. I hope to be FREE of the madness in a couple of yrs …
linda i would like to not take thyroid anything too.i bought lugols iodine but was afraid to try it becuase have read differing things about it whether that its good for thyroid or makes it worse . wish knew how,havent found a dr or naturpath that like yet . taking thryogold now for 5 years, at first lost 9 pounds but then have gained it all back plus a few more pounds over the last 3 years . before that synthroid for 5 years[ only made things worse,gained weight ,very bad fatigue , ended up with adrenal fatigue ]
Karen – I still have some/all of a healthy thyroid gland and do NOT have Hashi’s, so getting off thyroid medicine and all the pills, supplements I need to take because of all the disruptive, negative affects thyroid med (regardless if NDT or synthetic) does to one’s body (including daily fatiguing the adrenals, decreasing potassium, etc.), was a viable & reasonable strategy for me – heck, in 18yrs I’ve tried about everything else. Find a good Dr, educate yourself and keep track of labs, symptoms, changes. I’m currently taking 12.5mg Iodoral tablet upon rising, waiting 1 hr, then taking 37.5mcg Unithroid, waiting another 1hr before breakfast. On alt days, 1hr before lunch, I take 6.25mg Lugo tablet (NOT lugols), which according to the mfr Hakala Labs, is same as Iodoral tablet but ‘cleaner’. As I slowly decrease thryoid med, I need to increase Iodoral/lugo to compensate (at least so far). As my adrenals are now healing, I’m decreasing the HC. God willing, I’ll be off thyroid med and most adrenal support, however I will likely need to maintain Iodoral/lugo perhaps pulsing 3-4x/wk or daily, but my labs so far indicate Iodoral/lugo is NOT fatiguing my adrenals like thyroid med does.
thank you linda, look forward to your blog.havent found a dr like.almost all only prescribe synthroid, the naturpaths
want you to not eat any sugar or starches theres no way i can do that .might have hashimotos although once didnt have antibodies ,first time did.have friends who had high tsh , but never took any thyroid medicne and it went back to normal on its own. wish id never started on synthroid and maybe mine would have gotten better on its own too.a m confused about iordoral and lugols so will wait and not try it. think rest [ plus daily exercise and organic diet ]has helped somewhat but still have fatigue and weight gain. very annoying !
Karen, we’ve seen people with high TSH not due to a thyroid disease, but due to high stress. Then there’s the rest of us whose high TSH was due to Hashi’s or hypothyroidism. And sadly not everyone has been able to get off meds due to iodine, but it’s worth a try if one’s cause was low iodine levels.
Iodoral is pill form; Lugols is liquid.
hey Karen, I’m w/you re: naturopaths prescribing intolerable elimination diets that overwhelming majority of people would not be able to comply with. I tried, didn’t see much benefit. However, I have reduced my bread and dairy intake – but not eliminate it.
With millions suffering, we all need far better alternatives for thyroid therapy than synthetic or NDT meds that sooner or later, cause adrenal fatigue and subsequent ‘death sprial’ requiring ever-increasing amounts of thyroid med & HC. I wish I had never let the surgeon remove my right thyroid lobe, or put me on thyroid meds afterward or believe the thyroid therapy lie of ‘you just take a pill in the morning and everything will go back to normal’
… so it’s now REWIND, get my thyroid and glands healthy and allow my body to take over instead of the meds because current medicine cannot even come close to replicating what the body does, making ‘balance’ or ‘stability’ and your ‘good ole self’ a perpetual, elusive target. Good news, I just got my u/s results and it appears the surgeon did not remove the entire rt lobe AND some tissue regeneration has occurred!
I pray for all of us that someday soon we’ll be able to replace our lost/non-working thyroid tissue with healthy tissue – from research I’ve read, perhaps this will happen within the next 2 decades. In the interim, a collection of signatures may get the NIH moving in the right direction ;-D
Linda, STTM is about years and years of what we’ve observed in each other, and that means it’s about an incredibly huge body of patients worldwide. And I have to state that we have not seen NDT cause adrenal fatigue in the least..and definitely not a “death spiral”, Linda. If it does cause adrenal issues…it’s because someone didn’t raise high enough to find their optimal dose (often due to being under the care of a doctor who doses by the TSH–big mistake), or they stayed on a non-optimal dose far too long. We have seen that. And those who found their optimal dose did NOT have to keep raising…and raising…and raising afterwards, Linda. If someone keeps raising, they have find out it’s not about the NDT being bad, but about something else being wrong. A
And with HC, anyone who has to be on it needs to be doing their Daily Average Temps to find the right amount, not simply raising and raising. If someone keeps raising because the DATS never stay optimal, that’s about having low aldosterone.
Now I don’t doubt that you believe what you stated, but patient experiences have not seen that at all. And again, we’re talking about a vast amount of people for years, and STTM is solid being based on those huge amount of reported experiences. In fact, I’ve been contacted over the years by several lucky people who managed to stay on NDT for decades! And not a single one has adrenal fatigue and are definitely not in a death spiral. lol.
So to the contrary, Natural Desiccated Thyroid…IF A PERSON FINDS THEIR OPTIMAL DOSE…has done miracles for people. They are not “suffering”. And they do find that balance, that stability. The ones who end up suffering are on T4-only, or didn’t raise their NDT high enough, or have other issues like Lyme, or high heavy metals, etc.
But yes, we would agree that it would be a great thing if there was another treatment like replacing tissue that didn’t hold us hostage to those pills every day, even if NDT does, in fact, work fabulously for many, many people if they find their optimal amount, don’t go by the TSH, and correct all other issues.
P.S. I’m not going to get into a debate with you after posting this. STTM is about a vast amount of solid experiences, not about opinion vs opinion vs opinion. Being optimal has been key, as well as treating any other issues. So we’ll let my response stand as the last response.
Linda where can I find out more about that therapy??? I really would like to get off Armour – I am thin, but hair loss is getting worse, wired and tired, and often depressed mostly because I think my adrenals are shot.
I have been on Armour for about 18 months & to start with was really well on 3 grains per day then earlier this year the tablets did not seem to be working very well & the characteristic smell was gone.I thought that maybe it was a bad batch but the next one I sent for was the same.I commented on this on several Thyroid groups I belong to in the UK but no one else seemed to be having the same problems so I have changed to Westroid about 2 weeks ago so early days yet.Also because the price has doubled I can no longer afford to buy Armour should they improve it.
Been living on Armour for 47 years since complete thyroid removal when I was 35 years old. Never blamed thyroid on situations of life as I aged. Seemed to do pretty well healthwise. Currently taking 2.5 grains/day for past 10 or so years. Was on 3 grains for much of adult life after first five years after cancer surgery on 5 grains to cause any residual thyroid tissue to atrophy. Main problems were unavailability back in 2008 or so and now a five fold increase in price in a little over a year. That really got my attention and started me on this quest to find an alternate brand. I was paying less than $10/month, now it’s over $50/month with my latest purchase. Armour is not covered by Medicare and therefore not covered by the Medicare “Advantage” plans out their like United Healthcare.
Now after reading so many posts about awful symptoms , blamed on thyroid function, I do wonder about my 10 pound weight loss a couple of years ago for no apparent reason, and then the weight recovery and now weight gain over past 6 to 9 months or so..a 16 pound swing. I won’t bother getting into my numbers which were done only about annually.
If I was you I would get my blood tested more often. I had my thyroid removed in 1999 due to cancer. My thyroid has gotten high twice in the past year on Synthroid and I finally got the doctor to put me back on Armour. I get my blood tested regularly because since 2008 when the problem with Armour started, I have been on Synthroid and they were constantly changing my doses. I am currently on 3 grains but I think they will need to increase it because I am not feeling any better. I try to listen to my body as far as if I am tired or unusually cold. I hope this helps.
With advice received on STTM several years ago, I have been taking Acella NP Thyroid. I take two 1.5 grain (90 mg) tablets per day, chewed slightly and absorbed under my tongue. Their quality has always been consistent, and there was a shortage or availability problem only one time. I pay approx $58.65 for a bottle of 100 tablets.
Acella NP thyroid and Acyclovir (3x 800 mg tablets) are the two medications I can’t live without.
Acella was cheaper at Walgreen’s pharmacy-it was cheaper when I paid in cash than when I used insurance and cheaper than what you are paying.
Where do you get acella
Hi Pauline. It’s a prescription NDT, called NP Thyroid.
Thank you Janie.
i have been on optimal amounts of Armour – 3 grains – for just under a year. I had been feeling great until recently and now I feel agitated, tired sometimes during the day, depression and some jitteriness. It has also gone up in price a lot!!! I’m thinking of trying a different NDT and see how I feel and how my pocketbook feels.
I was on Armour early on and it helped. Then I went through the delays in 2009. I noticed the pill didn’t smell as stinky. When it was stinky it worked. Over the next couple years my tsh, ft3 ave ft4 was all over the place. Sometimes it was hard, sometimes it was soft but it was full of fillers. Then I stopped converting t4. I hired a great specialist and I’m on Naturethroid and cytomel. NP thyroid seemed to mess with my antibodies but some do great on it.
Since you’ve been on Naturethroid for a few months now, I was wondering if you could give me an update? Have your symptoms improved? And, is it necessary to add cytomel if using Naturethroid or is this something that only applies to your situation?
I’ve been taking Armour Thyroid since March and have been doing really well on it – HOWEVER, the company I work for switched insurance plans and now a 30-day supply of Armour costs me $35…..if I switch to Naturethroid, a 30-day supply will cost less than $10.
I’m wary of switching due to cost alone, so was hoping you’d give me some advice since you did the switch from Armour to Naturethroid.
Look forward to your response.
Hi Judy. Most people do not need to add anything to NDT. The exception is if someone has a cortisol or iron problem. For the latter, patients learned to stay low on NDT (to prevent rising RT3) and add in some T3…but have to watch for pooling with T3 due to the cortisol or iron problem. And you don’t have to just consider Naturethroid. There is WP Thyroid and NP Thyroid, as well–both fine products. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/options-for-thyroid-treatment
Thank you so much for the quick response!
All 3 alternatives to armour are offered by my new insurance company and they’re all at a fraction of the cost.
I have no idea which one I should choose.
After reading through this entire thread, I decided to smell my armour…and….it no longer has that porcine snell! It actually smells chemically for lack of a better description.
Maybe it’s a good thing I’m switching to an alternative.
Any suggestions on which one to go with would be greatly appreciated!
One person will say this one; another will say that one. i.e. they all work. 🙂