UPDATE: in 2020, we now have a recall from Acella implying too much T3. Seems a bit off when hypothyroid symptoms were reported coming back. And no mention here of the burning down the throat, burning and/or nausea in the stomch. https://www.fda.gov/safety/recalls-market-withdrawals-safety-alerts/acella-pharmaceuticals-llc-issues-voluntary-nationwide-recall-certain-lots-np-thyroidr-thyroid
pill on left; changed NP pill on right.
From 2019:
Comments have been coming in by some patients who are using NP Thyroid by Acella. And by those comments, it appears that NP has changed as of this summer 2019…as reported by patients who picked up a new bottle refill and started it. There are three common comments:
- It now smells and tastes horrible, worse then before.
- The tablets look different from previous ones
- I’m feeling much worse now on the same dose that made me feel great. Symptoms are back.
And it’s #3 that is especially concerning. .
This now makes FOUR natural desiccated thyroid products over the last few years that have changed visually and symptomatically. Why??
- Canada’s version of NDT made by Erfa and called just Thyroid. That was followed by widespread reports of a return of hypo symptoms.
- Armour after it was bought out from Forest and acquired by Activas Pharmaceuticals–many reported a huge return of their hypo
- RLC’s Naturethroid, and it frankly went WAY downhill in effect in 2018 as expressed widespread by disappointed patients. We’re still not sure about WP.
- NP Thyroid by Acella
And you know what else is common with all four pharmaceuticals?? They state “We changed nothing”. So what is going on?
ANALYZING THE COMPLAINTS ABOUT NP
THE SMELL, THE TASTE:
Yes, most NDT’s can smell. lol. It’s pork! But the reaction of patients, when they have started to take the “changed” NP Thyroid, is profound. “It tastes horrible!” “It smells far worse!” “It tastes like cat pee!” Other descriptions: “It tastes like insecticide.” “It tastes rancid.” “It makes me want to gag.” “
Now we do know that a batch of NDT is made up of many pigs. And it’s possible that different mixes of pigs could produce different strength of smell. So is Acella using a particularly “stinky” batch of pigs now?? Maybe. Just the change in smell and taste is not indicative of a problem…
THE TABLET:
Boy, here we go again. The visual change is very similar to what we saw with Armour. It’s also similar with what we saw with Naturethroid. There are now specks on the newer current version, and some patients say the edges are rougher. Definitely a different color, too.
In a way, these visual changes would be no big deal. But they could become a big deal when some patients, (who were optimal) are reporting a return of their hypothyroid symptoms and/or feeling awful since being on the changed NP Thyroid. And why is this not the first time that we started seeing specks in different pharmaceutical versions over recent few years?
FEELING WORSE SINCE BEING ON THE NEW TABLET:
This represents the most alarming of comments. We are seeing some people who were OPTIMAL and had been for a long while, only to comment that they now feel much worse since starting on the new tablets. Symptoms range from migraines, feeling tired, sluggish, feeling awful, depression, late afternoon fatigue, feeling like the flu, nausea, hair loss, napping again…etc. Again, we are saying some. Others report still feeling good. But are they on the “changed” tablets? Looks like they are. So we are continuing to try and learn what is going on in the face of pharmaceutical secrecy and the inane need to CHANGE what was already good enough.
Here is one of many examples of how patients are now going downhill on NP. It’s provided by permission from Liz: I take 4 60 mg tabs a day, no thyroid, treated iron and adrenals and finally was doing good and steadily weight was coming off. I have been taking my last refill for about a month now, and when I first opened it noticed the horrid smell, tasted different too. Anyway, the last couple of weeks I’ve felt really fatigued, low energy, hungry all the time, weight creeping back up and bloated.
And here is how one patient sees all this, closely resembling how many are feeling: I’ve had it with all the mystery, secrecy, deception, and lack of transparency that are ultimately badly damaging many, many people’s (mostly women’s) health and lives. And then that affects the lives of all those people’s families in a trickle-down domino effect. Those pharma companies and their associates are obviously not in it for any type of benevolent reason. They obviously don’t care about us. All they care about is money and their own interests. That’s sick (no pun intended), unethical, immoral, inhumane, and lacking in conscience.
In the meantime, for those who have gone downhill, this blog post gives alternatives to NP Thyroid or any NDT that has gone downhill, as many have sadly.
UPDATE #1 on August 24th: So far, it appears that negative changes may have started in May, 2019 for some. But we don’t yet have proof that the changed tablets were coming out in May. We will continue watching for comments.
UPDATE #2 on August 26th: There are many reports about swine fever (not swine flu) killing plenty of pigs in China and into neighboring countries. Here is one. But that can end up being more about price increases. We still don’t have a definitive answer why the size of the NP pill changed, why the smell and taste is far worse, and why so many are seeing a return of their symptoms.
UPDATE #3 August 27th: A request has been made from Acella for the LOT NUMBERS of the CHANGED tablets…NOT the ones that are working. (And as of 2020, nothing has changed. Patients feel the requests were a fake concern from Acella).
UPDATE #4 September 13th: There is so much speculation and rumor out there as to why this has happened to NP Thyroid that it’s crazy. No matter what you hear, we do NOT know why this happened and NOTHING is concrete.
Important note: STTM is an information-only site based on what many patients worldwide have reported in their treatment and wisdom over the years. This is not to be taken as personal medical advice, nor to replace a relationship with your doctor. By reading this information-only website, you take full responsibility for what you choose to do with this website's information or outcomes. See the Disclaimer and Terms of Use.
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1,958 Responses to “Uh oh–we need to talk about NP Thyroid by Acella”
Theresa
Hi – I’m wondering if there has been any new developments with any of the thyroid meds. I’m taking Armour and not feeling well. Besides, it’s so expensive. I’d like to go back to NP Thyroid (Acella) but unsure if the issues with it have been addressed. Any news?
Janie Bowthorpe
Theresa, Armour works. But you have to understand this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal/ Read every word. Don’t skim. Read it all.
Christina G
Hello, I am taking NP thyroid 120. I have been on it for a year and a half after having my thyroid removed. Everything was great until January when my pills started looking different and I feel really awful. I am new to this site I found it when I was searching for answers.. I was considering going back to Armor Thyroid but then I see posts like yours so….what in the world will we do. Gosh!!
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Christina. You may feel awful because you are underdosed. Hardly anyone achieves optimal on only 120 mg / 2 grains. That would even be true with Armour. Read all of this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal/. Don’t just skim. All of it. 🙂
Denine
I don’t know if you aware NDT medications are regulated by the FDA but none are approved. I could not find a single one that was approved by the FDA
Janie Bowthorpe
That has been true for years, Denine.
Aaron
How long has it been taking others to heal their stomachs after the burning/gastritis from the NP thyroid?
Janie Bowthorpe
OMG, so you still suffering from what the pre-recalled/later recalled NP did to you?? That is just too bad. I remember that there was a seriously strong volume of people that felt burning as they swallowed, burning in their stomachs, in 2019 and I think into 2020.
j.annz77
Is there a reference where all the thyroid meds T4 and/or T3 amounts are listed to compare ??
My T4 is always way low on NP Thyroid. Would like to be able to compare the amounts of T4 & T3 to other brands.
Janie Bowthorpe
The problem with NP is that it was recalled by the FDA. There are some who are surmising it’s better now, but you’d have to figure out if you are on the bad batch or a good one. And this is our goal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Susan
I had Stroke ! NP Thyroid , Loss speech , Fib, neuropathy nerve pain. In hospital! Jan. 2023
Off market!!!!!!!!!
Jennifer
Hi Janie,
Could you recommend a reputable direct lab for thyroid testing (or are any of them okay)?
Also, when your adrenals aren’t up to par and your thyroid med isn’t getting into the cells properly and you get jittery, where does all that T3 finally go or how does it get used up? Do you slowly adsorb it with the adrenals working much slower or what exactly happens? And if you take any iron, calcium or magnesium supplementation in the meantime, does this cause the T3 to hang around in your system even longer?
Thanks.
Anna
I have been in touch with Thai sellers as I have been on Thyroid-S for years. It`s the only Thai brand left on the market as Thiroyd and TR were discontinued in 2019. Thyroid-S is now almost as expensive as Armour ;-(There is one new Vietnamese brand (prescription-strength) called Real Thyroid. However, it contains seaweed and potassium iodide…not sure that is good for hypos, especially those of us with Hashimotos….?
Karen Ofsthus
There has been much discussion and issues over the years regarding NP by various companies. I used to take it years ago, but wasn’t doing that much better than without it. Until I found a Naturopath that knew what she was doing. Now I take T3 and T4 directly: 50 mcg daily L-Thyroxine (Synthroid=T4) and 25 mcg spread throughout day of Liothyronine (generic for Cytomel=T3). Within a week of taking Liothyronine, all of my symptoms abated. All of them. This is after a few decades of struggle, 6 years on Family Medical Leave working only 28 hrs/week, as my fatigue was crushing. It’s over 3 years now and I have a life. I can work full time. I do activities. I’m active and energetic. My naturopath was the first one to say that I don’t do well on T4, and wanted me to try T3. She’s a genius if you ask me! If you haven’t tried T3 directly (rather than in a combination with other NP meds), I urge you to try it. The meds are cheap, you can titrate the amount you need and be treated symptomatically. Natural thyroid isn’t the only option. Give T3 alone a try and see what happens. Cheers!
Elaine
could you please give me the name of your naturopath, and what state you are in. I need help. Thank you so much
Esther Roberts
Thank you. After years on various NDT’s the new doc put me on Synthroid & a little bit of T3. The Synthroid as always made me very ill, but I noticed that taking T3 alone did not. Asked her if I could try a fuller dose of T3 alone. She said no one should do that bc would be so bad for their heart. But I have Afib and my heart struggles without the T3. The doc is very nice but adamant. I don’t want to change docs again but this is months gone out of my life and I’m not getting any younger.
Mary
Both reformulated Armour & NP Thyroid have given me hives! I got huge welts on Armour, not as bad on NP Thyroid. I’m told it’s a corn filler but I’m not sensitive to corn byproducts. Why can’t they leave it like it was?
Margaret Self
I appreciate the heads up given earlier about the new recall and went on line to get the affected lot numbers. When i looked at my Rx bottle and the paperwork it came with, there was no lot number to compare. So I naturally called the pharmacist who informed me they had no record or the lot number any more. Next step, I ordered a refill and when I went to pick it up the next day, asked for the lot number. This time they claimed that the manufacturer never gives them the lot numbers, but they were sure it wasn’t on the recall list.
This is the second pharmacy that couldn’t or wouldn’t reveal lot numbers on their prescriptions. I believe it is their way of shirking responsibility for the products they sell. Their reply is always “ask your doctor” and that is never helpful.
Shouldn’t there be an oversight agency department at the FDA to report these actions?
Michelle
Another NP recall! As many others, I had a mix of hyper and hypo symptoms while on NP, regardless of whether recalls were due to super or deficient potency. I believe Acella is hiding something and making people dangerously ill. If you’re not feeling well stop taking them! After all the recalls and my own suffering, I finally switched back to synthetics. Within a couple of weeks on tirosint and cytomel, my hair stopped falling out in clumps, my heart rate decrease significantly, and body aches stopped. Unfortunately, I’m still hypo, having to wait until my levels stabilize before I can retest and hopefully get optimal for the first time since 2019. Also, I recently learned biotin can affect lab results unless you stop taking it a few days before. I’m afraid both NP and biotin skewed my labs, causing my Dr to drop my dose way too low. Has anyone experienced issues with NP or biotin causing inaccurate labs and issues with getting optimal?
Janie Bowthorpe
Here you go: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2021/04/30/np-thyroid-by-acella-has-once-again-been-recalled/
Sherri
Did you know that NP Thyroid, 60 mg dose is NOT approved by the FDA? I just found that out today while looking on Drugs.com. I too had been putting on weight, having severe swelling of my legs, feet and hands, sore throat, severe headaches, sweats, cravings for sugar, anxiety (which I never have) and a horrible chemical smell from my urine. Basically, to your point Michelle, I am experiencing both hyper and hypo symptoms.
I told my husband two weeks ago that something was wrong with my thyroid medicine and made an appointment with my physician. Yesterday, I got a recall robo-call from my pharmacy telling me my script was being recalled. Then today, when I called, they said, “Oh, well your lot number of script is okay. That lot number isn’t being recalled.” I guarantee that something is terribly wrong with my lot number! I have always had Armour. For some reason, the pharmacy filled my script with NP and I didn’t realize it until I started feeling bad. The fact that it isn’t FDA approved is extremely concerning too. NO MORE NP by ACELLA!!!
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Sherri. You need to sign up to be notified for the STTM blog posts. I posted this almost a week ago: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2021/04/30/np-thyroid-by-acella-has-once-again-been-recalled/ And pharmacies have always sneakily refilled with NP because they make a better profit. It’s irritating beyond belief when they do that.
Bj Cobb
So you are saying pharmacies fill your Armour prescription wtih NP on purpose. How do we know which one we are getting? I moved 5 months ago and my symptoms got really bad about 4 months ago, Maybe using CVS as a new pharmacy they are filling it wrong. If this is what is making me feel so bad it more than irritating.
I wonder if getting your prescription compounded would assure you that you are getting the correct dose?
Janie Bowthorpe
Pharmacies will always choose to refill with the brand that makes them the most money, as we understand it. So to find out what you are getting, you look at the last line on the label which shows what you got, plus the mg or mcg, then look at the abbreviation after that. For example, if they substituted Armour with a generic from Sun Pharmaceuticals, you will see SUNP. This doesn’t mean that a generic from a different pharmaceutical is lacking or not the correct dose. That is wrong to assume the latter. But I personally don’t appreciate a substitution that I didn’t ask for. So no, it is not the answer to assume you will get what is right with compounded.
Phil
I was on NP 60mg for 2 years and at first it was ok but I felt like crap. Doc raised it 2 60’s a day then 2 1/2 and every time I felt worse so bad that all I wanted to do was sleep all of the time. Went back to 1 grain felt better but the fatigue was horrible on this stuff and never had this with Nature throid. 2 weeks ago I stopped all of my NP and my doctor switched me to 25mg of Synthroid and 5mg of T-3 twice a day. It was like I had come to life again and felt like I did on the good Nature throid, so good in fact that I have lost 5 lbs. My thinking here is that Accela is still cheating people on the amount of T-3 in their pills. Will never go back to NP again
Jill
I have been taking 90 mg NP thyroid for quite a while. I received a letter at some point from my pharmacy about a recall on it. I am convinced I had a batch of super potent NP thyroid back in 2019. A few months ago I was switched to a lower dose. 60. That was too low. My TSH was 15.7 so about 5 weeks ago I was switched back up to 90. Now my TSH is barely detectable. I’m having heart palpitations and sweats so I started breaking the 90s in half. I think I have another super potent batch on my hands. What do I do?
Janie Bowthorpe
The answer: move to Armour or T4/T3. And here’s why we react to T3 in our treatment: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
Shelly
I’m on NDT and want to switch to synthetic T4 and T3 but I can’t find out what the equivalent dose would be. Is there a conversion chart or standard conversion to convert NDT to synthetic T4 and T3?
Thank you!
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Shelly. One grain of NDT equals 38mcg of T4 and 9mcg of T3. Two grains equal 76 of T4 and 18 of T3. Etc. 🙂
Ryan
I’m just curious here, so I don’t expect exact figures, but I couldn’t really find prices anywhere else. What is the current average cost of synthetic T4/T3 at those lower end doses. I’m around a grain and quarter for my current NDT, and I pay close to $50 for a 30 day supply of NP. I’m thinking it’d be much cheaper on the synthetics if I were to switch.
Jill
I have been taking 90 mg NP thyroid for q while. I received a letter at some point from my pharmacy about a recall on it. I am convinced I had a batch of super potent NP thyroid back in 2019. A few months ago I was switched to a lower dose. 60. That was too low. My TSH was 15.7 so about 5 weeks ago I was switched back up to 90. Now my TSH is barely detectable. I’m having heart palpitations and sweats so I started breaking the 90s in half. I think I have another super potent batch on my hands. What do I do?
Linda Osmond
Hi, all. I am just curious if anyone is on a 4 grain Armour (240mg). I’m trying to figure out if this is just something that happened with me, or if there is a medication issue. I am determining a dose between 180-240mg with my doctor’s permission. I was on 180 that I had filled a while ago and doing fine. In Dec, I started a new bottle and switched to 240 unknowingly for about a week or less. I wasn’t doing well and realized I had put some 240s in an old 180 bottle. I then started splitting the 240 into 3/4ths and taking that, what should be equivalent to 180. I still didn’t feel the best, so I got out the remainder of my 180s and started back on those. So, I thought it would be good to ask: 1) If anyone else is on 240s with a recent fill and doing ok, just in case anything changed. And 2) Can I assume that the active thyroid component is distributed equally throughout an Armour tablet so that splitting it into 1/4s and taking 3 of the 1/4s (equal to 3/4 of 240) should give me the equivalent of taking a 180 tab? The 4 grain tablets are not scored, so I am guessing a little on what is half and a fourth on these. Thank you for your feedback!
Janie Bowthorpe
As far as being on 240mg of NDT in general, yes, there are some folks who report needing that much to achieve optimal frees. It’s very individual out there.
As far as Armour in particular, we do occasionally see someone wondering if Armour changed. Sometimes just the way they press their pills makes us eonder. But we’re not sure yet overall. So we find the best thing is keep an eye on the free T4 and free T3 in case something has changed. Also watching the RT3 is helpful, because what can appear to be a change might actually be the rising RT3 due to stress or inflammation.
Linda Osmond .
Thanks, Janie. I seem to be doing better after switching back to my old batch of med. So I guess I’m still wondering if there could have been a change to the newest batch of 240mg. I’m due for labs. However, I am going to test after being on my old tabs, not the new ones. I appreciate knowing if anyone else has complaints about possible changes to Armour recently I sure hope that doesn’t happen again.
Janie Bowthorpe
Keep me informed!
Jey
I am so lost!
Will try to make this 12 year saga as short as possible:
After TT – Synthroid 125 for 4 years, gained 50 lbs, felt miserable (No T3)
Changed to naturopath and NDT
Have been on all the major brand NDTs
Currently on NP Thyroid 90 mg twice per day, plus 20 mcg Cytomel T3
SO MUCH HAIR LOSS that I am depressed, self-conscious
Have been on NP for 2 1/2 years, but suspect hair loss began years ago and is just now really bad.
What I don’t understand:
Over the years, my doses have gone up and down, generally around the 90 mg twice per day range on main T4 drug, but I’ve gone up and down on Cytomel, sometimes even without. No matter what I’m on, my RT3 is ALWAYS around 15 or 16, in a range of roughly 8-25. Why wouldn’t the RT3 change when I was completely off T3?
T3 is almost always mid point or slightly higher
T4 is almost always just under mid point
but RT3 remains right in the middle of range no matter what
Anyway, I don’t know if the high-ish RT3 is affecting me or not.
My main concerns now are:
bad hair loss
big gaps in memory
can focus on some things, but if there is a long page of text to read, I find myself skipping it
no long term goals (lack of motivation?)
The hair loss is what prompted me to write this, but memory is a concern too.
I know NP and many NDTs have been reported to be bad now, but I am terrified to go back on Synthroid. It took me 9 years after switching to NDTs to lose 45 lbs and feel better. I am terrified of worse brain fog, weight gain, and even that some still report hair loss on Synthroid. The years on Synthroid were the last time I had decent hair, but I was younger then and also, I don’t want to trade off good hair for a giant weight gain again. I don’t know if adding T3 to Synthroid would make the difference I didn’t see back then or not.
I’ve always been confused as to whether I’m still hypo and what to do about it. More T4? More T3? I try to research but my lack of focus keeps me from getting anywhere.
For reference, I am 51, through menopause, have had copper, iron and sex hormone levels checked and all are at good levels. I already take vitamin D, zinc, magnesium, selenium, and a supplement that contains Saw Palmetto (for hair loss) and B vitamins, plus have put various oils in my hair, but nothing is helping.
Janie Bowthorpe
We all have to find the cause of the rising RT3 and treat it: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/reverse-t3
And yes, NP was recalled for good reason and same with Naturethroid and WP: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2020/09/20/2020-the-year-of-desiccated-thyroid-recalls/
Once you get the RT3 down, you can be on Armour or T4/T3 and get optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Jey
The problem is, I can’t figure out what is causing the RT3 to always stay mid range. I do have a somewhat restricted diet, but I don’t think it’s extreme. I do have stress, but again, I don’t feel like it’s extreme because I’ve had times in my life that were way worse. Otherwise, I don’t believe I have any health issues with liver, Diabetes, infections, etc. and my iron levels are good. Even when I reduced my T4 down to 1 1/2 90mg pills, the RT3 stayed the same. Granted, I wasn’t taking any T3 at the time. So, perhaps if I lowered the T3 to just one 90mg pill and added more T3 (increasing the 20 mcg to perhaps 30), would this be a good way to break the cycle? Or should I even be worrying about the RT3 since T3 stays at mid range too? Is the hair loss/memory loss even an RT3 issue (since T3 also stays mid range) or is it just that I need a different dosage?
Janie Bowthorpe
Common causes of too high RT3: high cortisol (have you done the ZRT saliva test? https://saliva-cortisol.squarespace.com/), iron that’s not optimal, which is at or close to 110 and not even in the 90s for women, chronic inflammation (ferritin will reveal that it’s in the 90’s or higher). It can also be caused by breathing in mold (causes inflammation), having any kind of infection, even Lyme, etc.
Jey
The last time I did a cortisol saliva test was 2015. Everything looked good at that time. My lifestyle has not changed since then (feeling kind of stagnant, actually).
In March of 2020, iron was as follows:
IRON, TOTAL 124 range 45-160
IRON BINDING CAPACITY 329 range 250-450
% SATURATION 38 range 16-45
FERRITIN 71 range 16-232
The last few days, as a temporary fix until I can talk to my doctor, I went ahead and reduced my NP thyroid from two 90 mg pills to just one. And, I upped my generic Cytomel from 20 mcg to 30 mcg. I just don’t know if I need even more T3.
And, I’m not sure if I should go back to Armour (which caused very high RT3 in the past, even with T3), or should try a T3-only approach. I want to have some idea of what to do before I call my doctor.
Janie Bowthorpe
You might want to find out why you had that high RT3 and correct it: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/reverse-t3
And 124 for iron is too high for a woman. You might have the beginning of a methylation problem. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/mthfr
Ryan P
Hey just popping in. I noticed my NP started tasting semi-sweet again, and I can be lumped in with those who did not get notice of the second recall. Earlier in the year, there was a recall involving the potency being too high or doubled, but now I’m reading that it was under-potent? What’s the full story there? Is there a link? Has anything been done to rectify this problem? I see Naturthroid is once again selling no lots. Armour doesn’t come in 81.25mg and I refuse to pay so much for it when it may or may not be the solution. I used to pay $8 a script for a 30 day fill back in 2014 without insurance for NT. This price gouging is ridiculous. For reference I pay $36~ for a combined 2 script to make my dosage for NP. I can barely stomach that having no health insurance and no job right now due to this pandemic.
Janie Bowthorpe
Ryan, here’s the full story as we know it, and also click on and read the links under NP thyroid: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2020/09/20/2020-the-year-of-desiccated-thyroid-recalls/
Kim (Male)
It’s been a least a year since I’ve felt optimal on NP. Used to cycle 5 miles. Now I struggle to do two. NP is my only choice being affordable ($63/90dys) on fixed income and medicare which only pays for synthroid. In the last six months I dropped from 130 to 115, higher morning bp’s, mouth dries out overnight and last tsh was 0.02. I’m hungry an hour after eating. Blood draw due after Christmas. I was taking 2-60ms. We’re limited in Doc choice so the Dr had me skipping to 60mg two times a week. Didn’t seem to help so I just told her I’m going from from 1-3/4 to 1,5 and down. I’m at 1-60 but palpitations still there. Next appt, in Jan. Probably the worse I have even been on NDT. Tempted to try Synthroid as my sis does well on it with regular Hypo but I have hashi’s. God Bless.
Janie Bowthorpe
Kim, low income or not, the worst thing to be on is NP Thyroid. It was recalled and for good reason: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2020/09/20/2020-the-year-of-desiccated-thyroid-recalls/
And the worst thing to be on is also Synthroid or just T4-only of any brand, in spite of your sister. We aren’t meant to be forced to get T3 from conversion alone. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/t4-only-meds-dont-work Your sister may already have issues that she doesn’t realize are from being on nothing but T4, and definitely will see them creep the longer she stays on. We as patients have seen the latter in ourselves, and others, for years.
Instead, look into using T4 and T3, and getting optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Kim
Thanks for the comments. Learning ALOT from this website. Turns out I’ve been stressed easily for the last 6 months or so. My bp prone was 119/69 and 117/70 upon standing. This shines a new light on my ndt issues. Also living in Fl and working outside in the heat was hard unless I stating drinking electrolytes with breakfast. One good thing is with my income level I can get patient assistance with Armour. The testing for cortisol/adrenal look interesting but expensive. Now at least I can do more research.
Michelle Harrington
Has anyone had experiences with thyroid meds spiking blood sugar? My endo switched me from armour to a slow absorbing compounded med and significantly dropped the dose. She thinks the higher dose and fast absorption were causing blood sugar spikes leading to pre-diabetes despite a low-card diet and exercise. I was willing to try it with all the NDT problems and worry about diabetes, but now I’m so hypo I can’t function (exhausted, brain fog, body aches, weight gain). Before the switch my TSH was low, T4 was normal, T3 was high, iron was normal, and cortisol was on the high end of normal in the a.m. and slightly low in the p.m. I just want to be healthy, loose the extra weight I’ve put on since the NTDs went to crap, and feel “normal”!
Janie Bowthorpe
Michelle, that’s not caused by the Armour. It’s caused by what Armour can “reveal”, which is a cortisol issue. And since you said your free T3 was high (and labs are not about just being “normal”, as you described your free T4. Labs are about “where’ we fall in a range), I suspect your high free T3 represents pooling and that happens from a cortisol problem that you need to discover and treat. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/pooling
Michelle
Thank you, Janie! I’ve read your info about pooling before and just looked at it again. I’m taking Thorne to support my low pm cortisol and will ask my doctor to slowly up my thyroid dose. I agree that so few doctors really know know this information and am grateful for this site!
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. You can still pool on ACE if you aren’t on enough ACE.
Jennifer
Janie, I’m aware that Isocort is no longer made and you left a statement that patients now use straight adrenal cortex if needed. I did very well on the Isocort. Could you give me some info on how low of a dosage one can get of the straight adrenal cortex? Would it come from a compound pharmacy in a capsule with acidophilus like my compounded thyroid? Thank You.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Jennifer. Adrenal Cortex is obtained from Amazon, iHerb, etc. The ones you would want are 50 mg.
Jennifer
Janie, I’ve been searching for the 50 mg, very very hard to find. I finally found one called Seeking Health but it has MCC in it which I can’t take. Would you or anyone happen to know one just off the top of your head? If I can’t find one, is it something the compound pharmacy could put together? Thanks again.
Janie Bowthorpe
Check out the Thorne brand, too.
Bridget Blair
I had to w to np thyroid and the smell is like cat pee! It’s horrible !! Is this bad for me
Janie Bowthorpe
NP Thyroid was recalled so most people are off of it and on Armour. For me personally, I will never put something in my body everyday that smells like cat piss.
Nomes
Any suggestions on how I can get a prescription for this? I have Hashimotos thyroiditis and lost my health insurance this year. The levothyroxine only pills I was taking are no longer working. Im not sure how to get a new prescription without paying way more than I can afford for a series of Drs. visits. Definitely open to suggestions at this point.
Jennifer
Hi Janie, I’m on compounded NDT now since the Acella mishap. Therefore, I now take a capsule instead of a pill. I’ve read not to take iron, calcium, or magnesium within 4 hours of taking my thyroid med. Sometimes I drink some salt water using salt that is high in trace minerals. Should I also space it out from when I take my NDT capsule (or would the mineral content be low enough not to affect my med anyway)? Thanks!
Janie Bowthorpe
Jennifer, honestly, we have made it work with a 2 hour spread, too. 🙂 Not sure about you salt water—seems like the mineral content would be quite small.
Rebecca
After receiving the STTM Email concerning the NP recall I contacted my pharmacy. One of the strengths was 120 mg and I had those. They tried to argue with me about there being no recall…then she looked on her computer and said “Oh! I will switch out your pills right away!” Seriously?? She didn’t even know about the recall?? She had to hear from a customer?? I have been taking the new batch (with Aug 2021 expiration) for 18 days and I am noticing some improvements as the days go on. The tablets actually dissolve in my mouth and taste slightly sweet. I have an appointment with a new physician tomorrow (I have moved to a new State). I am interested to see what my levels are after this sham.
Andra Bosiljevac
My new NP prescription tastes and smells like stinky gourds, cucurbita foetidissima. This is a plant that I was raised around in CA and which had this unmistakable, horrible smell. I’ll never forget it.. The fruit is poisonous, too. Can someone check this out?
Stefanie Hill
Anyone have any new, unexplained reproductive issues? I’ve very recently developed a fast paced PCOS and have been instructed the likelihood of getting pregnant is low.
My levels were off the charts with my t3 and low t4. I was having the worst of hypo and hyper symptoms all at once. Suddenly now I have a new lump growing in my throat and all of these new ovarian issues.
Migraines are nearly weekly now, palpitation at an all time high. Even had a rupture put me in the hospital a couple weeks ago.
I didn’t get the notice on the recall till September 22nd.
Wondering if anyone has experienced something similar? I’ve been on NP since late 2017
Janie Bowthorpe
Are you not aware that NP has been recalled for problems? https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2020/09/20/2020-the-year-of-desiccated-thyroid-recalls/
Jill
I went to the pharmacy on Tuesday to pick up Nature Throid, which I’ve been on for over a year. The pharmacist greeted me letting me know they switched my meds to armour because NT was recalled months ago and they just found out. She said NT had 90% less than the required active ingredient. WHAT!? Explains why my levels were soo bad that the dr called me wanting to know of i was alive. This is absolutely wrong. How do they not know it was recalled? In 3 days of being on armour I lost 5#.
housemaid
Nature-throid didn’t have 90% less of the required active ingredient. It had less than 90% of the active ingredient. Those are two different things. Nature-throid may have had 89% of the active ingredient. But it has never been about a little too much or too little active ingredient. If that was the problem, then we could just adjust our dose up or down and be fine. The FDA is only testing the amount of active ingredient. They are not testing for contaminants and spoilage, which is where I believe the real problem lies. And this applies to WP and NP, too.
Lynn
I agree and I think in many cases 11% less active ingredient wouldn’t cause all the symptoms people have related to hypothyroidism and the stomach issues. When NP first went wrong in October 2019 it sounded like people were having independent testing done on their old and new NP. Did anyone ever come back with results? If that testing never actually happened can we find away to test now?
Teresa
Hi everyone,
Has anyone seen the warning letter that the FDA sent to Acella? They are warned that they have failed to deal properly with their CMO (contract manufacturing organization) for their new API supplier–this based on an inspection at their facilities that went on from Dec 2019 into Jan 2020. Stability ascertainment seems to have been an issue–here is the link. https://www.raps.org/news-and-articles/news-articles/2020/9/fda-warns-mylan-acella-pharmaceuticals-over-gmp-vi
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2020/09/20/2020-the-year-of-desiccated-thyroid-recalls/
Teresa
Hello all, Thanks for the info on the very recent recalls. I feel compelled to write to you all about the disturbing experience that i’ve had with compounded NDT. As we discussed at length In many previous posts, it had become apparent that the raw thyroid powder perhaps coming from China through Europe was tainted or adulterated in some fashion. I had hoped that once this bad batch which was still clearly in the supply chain in America was fully depleted, new and better supplies would make their way into our meds. I am devastated to report that, although compounded NDT had been stable for me since the compounding pharmacies began to receive new supplies of raw thyroid powder, at the end of June 2020 that did not hold true any longer. My medication is simply composed of thyroid powder with no filler at all. The pharmacy gave me a mixed bottle of old and new supply–- and afternoon taking the first capsule (sublingually) I was unable to get a deep breath. I was heaving and gasping simply to get a little bit of oxygen into my system. I am fit and exercise but was completely unable. I noticed that the powder in the capsules looked different–-some were smooth and whiter and some were brownish and coarse looking– I separated them and determined that The smoother were fine so I took those and tried to eke them out until time for my next refill. I reasoned that the “bad” ones were left over from Sichuan Friendly’s disastrous supply and that the next batch would be great. I took the first capsule this evening and within 45 minutes I couldn’t breathe. These caps look like the other brown and coarse ones. I haven’t been able to speak with the pharmacist but I wonder whether there has been another general recall of all supplies–they said that they didn’t have enough powder to fill my 90 day scrip….I had to take an inhaled corticosteroid to make it through the last batch, and I fear for all NDT at this moment. It would be good to know whether anyone has had similar symptoms. My husband just told me that RLC labs has recalled all lots and all strengths of both Naturethroid and WP due to low T4 concentration––87% of labeled amount– NP too. It’s got to be the raw thyroid powder that every company is using. Please take care.
Lynn
Thanks for posting this. I’ve been trying to make USP thyroid extract powder work, either with no filler or with, and it has the same ammonia smell as NP did after the reformulation. I’m inclined to believe that the porcine on the market has something wrong with it that is related to the smell and has affected all NDT’s including Armour. Does anyone have a clue what could be wrong? I think it may be something other than lowered effectiveness.
Lynn
I forgot to answer your question about side effects. I get a heaviness in my chest that results in a small cough so mine is not as extreme as yours but I have only been taking 1/2 grain. I had the same problem with Armour in the winter. I wonder if there are some people that aren’t effected by this. I also know that my pharmacist could not smell the ammonia smell of NP that I could so maybe that has made it harder to pinpoint for everyone.
Lynn
Just tried Armour again because I am desperate and don’t know what to do and same result. Hard to take a deep breath and my husband asked why I was coughing all day. I can’t imagine that this is because it is a good NDT that is revealing a cortisol or iron problem. I took nothing this morning and it feels 90% better in terms of breathing.
Janie Bowthorpe
We have noticed repeatedly over the years, and specifically with a working NDT, that those kind of reactions are revealing an iron or cortisol problem, yes. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Lynn
Is it possible to take any Armour while fixing cortisol and iron? The breathing thing seems scary and possibly dangerous.
Janie Bowthorpe
In small amounts, yes for some. Raising Armour with low iron will cause the T4 in Armour to convert to RT3, the inactive hormone. Raising Armour with a cortisol issue can cause rising T3 (https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/pooling) and possible hyper-like symptoms. So we stay on low amounts like one grain or so, possibly adding in some T3, and focus on correcting either. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/iron-and-cortisol
If we already have high RT3, many of us just move to straight T3 while correcting the cause. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/reverse-t3
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2020/09/20/2020-the-year-of-desiccated-thyroid-recalls/
ELAINE ARONOFF
Just a heads up in case you had not seen this yet. New NP recall on 9/17/20…lots of 15mg and 120 mg. WP Thyroid also issued recall of all lots/all strengths on 9/3/20.
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2020/09/20/2020-the-year-of-desiccated-thyroid-recalls/
Mimi
I haven’t posted for a while, but I am not the same since the NP debacle I was on my way to being Optimal my weight and inflammation were down and then I started feeling terrible, flu like, then my symptoms came back with the inflammation and weight. My doctor switched me to Armor thyroid when Acella was recalled and I’ve never really bounced back. I’m wondering if anyone has had this same experience ? I have labs again this Monday we shall see but I’m sure I’m very hypo. I have Hashis Anyway I’m wondering what are the other options beside Armor ?? Thank you 😊
Danielle Stiles
Besides all the side effects all the people are mentioning, but there is much more suffering with people with fibromyalgia…which is constant pain all over the body EVERYDAY with brain fog on top of that sleeping 12 or 13 hrs a day. There should be a law suit on a company’s cheating the public on a product that does not work.
Mimi
I have severe joint pain as well.
Jenny
I have had terrible joint pain as well! It’s really bad in my hands and feet, but I feel it in my legs, back, and neck too!
Jennifer Megge
Any chance at all, after the recall, that new batches of Acella NP is back to some sort of good? I saw some reviews posted this summer that the smell was gone and it seems to be working like it used to. I had to go on Armour and it just doesn’t work for me (never did for years before going on NP either). NP worked wonders before it got tainted with something. I keep hoping that after that recall they have put a good product back out there. Armour had a few bouts of not working in 2009 and again in 2015 and now this site is saying it is working again (unfortunately not for me) so after reading reviews some people put out about new batches, I’m hoping there might be a chance!
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s really that patients are saying it’s working again, and STTM just reports on patient reports. There are a few who feel Armour hasn’t worked again, but we can’t tell if they have just been underdosing or not. Some have been, it appears. It would just be nice if we could return to what NDT used to be–fairly consistent year after year after year.
Rachel
I have been on NP for a couple of years now after failed trials of levothyroxine. At first, I felt great on it, had tons of energy, lost all the extra weight and cleared the brain fog. Now, I feel like it is no longer working for me at all. I thought that means I need a higher dose because my t4 was low and my t3 was at the lower range of normal. I asked my doctor for a higher dose, but that caused insomnia and heart palpitations and seems to have worsened my fatigue to the point that I became non-functional. I asked my doctor to switch to armor, but now I am seeing that it has not been working for a lot of patients as well. I will see another doctor and see if they can prescribe combination synthetic t3 and t4. Any opinions or experiences will be highly appreciated. Wish me luck 🙂
Janie Bowthorpe
T4/T3 has been reported as working great for patients if they get optimal.
By the way, because so many patients went hypothyroid again on NP, and because of the symptoms you described, check this out to see if you have an adrenal problem now: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
Mariea Caruthers
When naturethroid was recalled this week I was started on 120 NP.
What is the sweet coating made from?
I have been eliminating a lot of foods, meds, etc because of itching. I finally was itch free.
Then I started NP. I’m itching again.
Janie Bowthorpe
NP was also recalled. Even before it was, there seemed to be a growing body of patients in groups who have reported problems with it.
Dolly Wood
Anyone have problems with ear ringing since being on NP?
Lynn
Yes. I’m not sure if it is due to the lack of effectiveness or a side effect of medicine that has a bad ingredient. As I have been trying different medicines to get back on track it gets better or worse but can’t see the pattern yet.
Dawn
Yes, I had it with the new NP and Armour. It was terrible.
Lynn
Mine started with new NP but got worse with Armour.
Connie
I was on Nature Throid and I switched to Armour and had the same results. Not sure which way to go now. What happened to Armour.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Connie. Here’s what many of us have noticed: if you feel bad on an NDT like Armour, which patients are still reporting doing quite well on, it’s important to look at your frees i.e. Free T4 and free T3. They need to be optimal. Check out this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Or, we can feel bad when on Armour due to rising RT3, and the latter due to low iron, inflammation and/or high cortisol. Cheehttps://stopthethyroidmadness.com/reverse-t3
Dolly Wood
Has anyone had serious ear ringing being on NP thyroid?!
Janie Bowthorpe
There sure have been patient reports on a lot of negative symptoms on NP since last Summer and especially since last Fall. It’s why so many are moving over to Armour or T4/T3, and getting optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Peggy
In March, returned from living for 2 years in Europe, where I had been stuck for 5 months with some NP I had gotten during a US trip in October. My numbers, esp T3 (high) and TSH (7-9) were off. Was exhausted, mood swings. I returned to live in the US again in March, and got a new batch of NP then, and wow the numbers really got out of whack. I know Janie dismisses TSH, but when I see it jump from about 1 to 17, I got concerned. So I decided to try Armour, and in 10 days (!), with serious heart palpitations, my TSH literally dropped down to 0.2 from 17, and blood pressure rose from 108 to 145. So 3-4 weeks ago, i went back to the pharmacy and re-upped with the NP, and added the herbal formula Thyro Choice. I also remembered a hack someone here had written years ago… about chewing the pills to break up the binder. And somehow in a month, on both the new NP and Thyro Choice together, ALL of my T numbers are in the middle of their ranges. And I am beginning to feel normal again for the first time in months! That said, hair is gently falling out so I am still in watch mode. NP doesnt smell badly now, and the use by date is two years out, so maybe FDA probing and their new sourcing has begun to turn things around. I am hopeful for the moment. And going to test every 3 weeks for the coming months.
Janie Bowthorpe
Patients have repeatedly reported that it is not worth it to be on NP anymore. But with your blood pressure going up on armour, the only NDT that has been working right, you might want to see if you have an adrenal problem, which NP will only make worse—the latter as reported by many patient experiences as well. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
Melissa
I just got mine about 2 weeks ago & they reek like cat urine. Is there an alternative option at this point?
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Elaine
Hi Janie:
I got my thyroid results back as follows:
TSH .19 Re. Range .45-4.5
T4 Free 1.02 Ref. Range .82-1.77
T3 Free 2.9 Ref. Range 2.0-4.4
T3 Reverse- 23.7 Ref Range-9.2-24.1 NOTE: My reverse T3 was about 14 in February
THYROGLOBULIN AB, SERUM 10.3 Ref Range .0-.9 HIGH Hashimotos
THYROID PEROXIDASE (TPO) AB, SERUM 14 Ref. Range 0-34
Planning to do a saliva cortisol test. Should I include the DHEA as well?
Trying to figure out the cause of my sudden hair loss.
Been on 2 grains of NP Thyroid for the last couple of years with no issues until now.
Due to rapid hair loss over the past month, I don’t think it is just female pattern hair loss due to ageing (I am 58). My hair was fine in March.
Thoughts?
Thanks!
Janie Bowthorpe
Elaine, NP Thyroid totally sucks. This is what you need to read: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/ NP could have contributed to your hair loss. For the labs, this is your go-to page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/lab-values 🙂
Stacy
I’ve been taking Naturethroid 32.5 mg and have been experiencing recent heart palps, sweating, unintended weight loss. This started about 4 months ago. In light of what is going on with NDT, I want to switch back to levothyroxine and then add T3. Should I ask my doctor to move me over to 50 mcg or start lower at 25 mcg?
Edie Foss
I posted my levels earlier and have been on NP exclusively. I would like to send some pics of the tablets, they seem to have changed since the really stinky ones as well.
Edie
OK, so I have had my most recent labs….I am pretty much optimal for me. My free T3, range 2.0 to 4.4, I am at 4.13. T4 range .082 to 1.77. My number is 1.63. My cortisol is all good. Can’t seem to find that report. The NP tablets seem to have changed. No nasty smell or taste now. Full on, new ones still have speckles, but new compared to old, there is a lot less difference. If I could add pics here, I would, but it seems I can’t.
Janie Bowthorpe
Your free T4 is way too high.
Edie
Thank you Janie. I appreciate what you do. My doctor is fine with my numbers, and this is the level where I feel best.
Dawn
Hi Janie,
Thank you for posting about the new NDT from Spain. Do you have any information on when this will start to be manufactured?
I can say, this is hopeful.
Janie Bowthorpe
All I know is what they stated on that page. It caught me by surprise.
Karen
In early March I started losing large amounts of hair, started having heart palpitations, and my blood pressure shot up. At the end of that 3month refill I received a notice that the Drug was being recalled. Since May I’ve been trying to get information on whether I got one f the tainted batch. The recalled drugs had as much as 115% over the usual potency. The drug company says it can’t trace the batches because it goes to wholesaler. The pharmacy, Walmart, insists it did not have any recalled batches. It seems extremely suspicious that my problems began shortly after taking the new refill in March. I’m now n mds for my heart, which I may not even need.
Janie Bowthorpe
The recalled NP was about what occurred in late 2018 and early 2019. No one has had a problem with that. Instead, you probably have been having problems because of what started in Summer of 2019, and especially Fall. It sucks royally since then. And most of us find it totally NUTs that it was THAT batch that wasn’t recalled. It’s made many people sick.
Elaine
Just came across this website tonight as I was searching online to see if there had been any issues with NP Thyroid. In the past few months everything has gone downhill, and I have lost a huge amount of my beautiful thick hair. I was chalking it up to stress from the current COVID situation. Before the WP issue a couple years ago, I had used it for many years with good success, but then had to switch to NP since WP was no longer available. Was planning to switch back to WP since I noticed that my dose was now available again, but after reading comments here, I am not sure what to do. Has anyone found that the new product works? I thought that the issues were supposedly fixed, and that none of their ingredients are sourced from China.
Any other options? It seems that all of the natural options have had issues.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Elaine. It’s almost getting to the point that your best bet is to be on T4 with T3. But equally important is to raise until the free T4 and free T3 are optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal. Read the entire page.
If one is transitioning from NDT to T4 and T3, one grain of NDT is 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3. So two grains is 76/18, and so forth. It depends on what you were on before. But it may be wiser to at first move over to less than you were on because of what I am going to explain below.
If you’ve been on the negatively-changed and ineffective NP awhile now, it’s possible you now have stressed adrenals. Because if you do, that can cause problems with the T3 causing hyper-like symptoms until you correct the problem, and the T3 can also pool in your blood and not make it well to your cells. This is where you check for stressed adrenals: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
Or the now bad NP could have also caused your iron to fall, and that can cause rising RT3 as you raise T4. RT3 is an inactive hormone. See https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/iron
All the above are correctable if you do it correctly.
Janie Bowthorpe
You can also move over to Armour. But we have no guarantee that it could someday meet the same fate.
Elaine
I just picked up a few days worth of WP until I can get some test results back. The WP didn’t have the same awful smell as the NP, so I am hopeful that it might help at least in the interim. I was taking WP for years before the NP. At this point, I don’t think I can get my dr to prescribe Synthroid/Cytomel combo until test results come back, so that is why I asked for the WP. I saw that posts here also said that WP was problematic.
I noticed that you do consults. How does that work?
Thanks!
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. Just pay close attention. We’ve seen many who have experienced that WP went downhill too in it’s own way, even if you think you feel ok. Here you go: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/coaching-call
Janna R
Bad Batch? In June I began noticing and complaining about heart palpitations, a feeling of being in a bubble, balance seemed off, and feeling like I’m about to pass out. Naturally, I wondered if I had Covid, though I did not have a cough.
I Googled to check for news on NP Thyroid and saw the recall. I checked with pharmacy and they claimed that my pills were NOT in the recall lots. I’m wondering what caused them to find the problem in the first place? Were there patients questioning and reporting something was wrong? Or do they perform quality and control tests AFTER product is shipped???? Shouldn’t that be done before ANY product is shipped?
If they don’t check unless someone complains then that maybe WHY my batch was not on list.
I’ve been taking thyroid replacement since 1993 when I was diagnosed with Graves Disease. My thyroid was completely eradicated by radiation iodine therapy. I’m 57 yrs. old.
I’ve been watching my body’s response to food, drink and the ONE medication I take – NP Thyroid. I eat healthy for the most part and something is/was definitely OFF with MY NP Thyroid medication.
It definitely has CAT Spray smell which started in 2019. I couldn’t identify at first. So why Cat Pee? Are we taking Cat Thyroid supplements now?
I just got a NEW 90 day supply but I won’t be finishing this batch IF my symptoms persist.
Janie Bowthorpe
What was recalled has absolutely nothing to do with, and proceeded the NP crap that started to come out in September of 2019, smelled like cat piss, and has caused a crapload of problems in patients…all which Acella denied, scooted around, swept under the rug, and gaslighted every single person who called Acella. It’s all been the biggest carnival shitshow I’ve ever seen…
Starr D.
I don’t think every batch that should’ve been on there made the list. I was using both the 60 mg.
and the 30 mg. pills, and I got the same bad symptoms from each of them, around 20 minutes after
I took either one of them when things really started getting bad for me. Only my 30 mg. ones made
the list….those 60s were horrible, though, at least for me. Yes, their expiration dates were a few
months off from one another–but I still say both strengths weren’t right, even though Acella doesn’t
agree. And I still say that both batches of my pills should’ve been on the recall list.
Jamie Lehman
In case this is helpful documentation to anyone.
FDA alerts drug makers of a recall of porcine thyroid API from Sichuan Friendly Pharmaceutical Co., Limited, China
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FDA testing confirms inconsistent potency in the active ingredient
Update [9/5/2018] FDA is alerting active pharmaceutical ingredient (API) repackagers and distributors, finished drug manufacturers, and compounders that Sichuan Friendly Pharmaceutical Co. Limited, China, has recalled all unexpired lots of porcine thyroid API due to inconsistent quality. FDA recommends that companies check their supply and quarantine any API from Sichuan Friendly.
FDA reminds manufactures and compounders that Sichuan Friendly API may not be identified as the API manufacturer. The API may also be labeled as Sichuan Beisheng T, Sichuan Beisheng Trading, Sichuan Beisheng Technology or another API supplier.
[8/17/2018] FDA is alerting active pharmaceutical ingredient (API) repackagers and distributors, finished drug manufacturers, and compounders that Sichuan Friendly Pharmaceutical Co. Limited, China, is recalling certain lots of porcine thyroid API due to inconsistent quality of the API. FDA recommends that manufacturers and compounders not use Sichuan Friendly’s porcine thyroid API received since August 2015. This thyroid API comes from porcine (pig) thyroid glands and is used to make a non-FDA approved drug product, composed of levothyroxine and liothyronine, to treat hypothyroidism (underactive thyroid).
FDA laboratory testing confirmed the Sichuan Friendly API has inconsistent levels of the active ingredients — levothyroxine and liothyronine — and should not be used to manufacture or compound drugs for patient use. Risks associated with over or under treatment of hypothyroidism could result in permanent or life-threatening adverse health consequences.
FDA placed Sichuan Friendly on import alert 66-40 on March 22, 2018, based on current good manufacturing practice (CGMP) deviations observed during an FDA inspection.
However, FDA confirmed Sichuan Friendly’s thyroid API remains in the U.S. supply chain. This API and the drug products made from it, present a safety risk to patients. Sichuan Friendly API may be repackaged and/or relabeled before it is further distributed, and not all of the repackaged/relabeled API identifies Sichuan Friendly as the original API manufacturer. Therefore, manufacturers and compounders who make levothyroxine and liothyronine drug products should contact their API supplier to verify the actual manufacturer of the thyroid API they received before using it. Sichuan Friendly’s products may be labeled as “Thyroid Powder” or “Thyroid Powder USP.”
Additionally, manufacturers and compounders who have received API made by Sichuan Friendly should quarantine the API and associated drug products. If manufacturers and compounders have API or drug products made from Sichuan Friendly API, FDA requests these companies contact FDA’s regional offices.
FDA recommends patients talk to their health care professional before they stop taking their combination levothyroxine and liothyronine thyroid medicine. FDA also recommends that patients discuss FDA-approved hypothyroidism treatment options with their doctors, as combination levothyroxine and liothyronine products are not FDA-approved.
FDA advises patients not to use porcine thyroid medicine labeled as Westminster
Additionally, on August 9, 2018, Westminster Pharmaceuticals LLC voluntarily recalled all unexpired lots of levothyroxine and liothyronine (thyroid tablets) 15mg, 30mg, 60mg, 90mg, and 120mg. These products were made using API from Sichuan Friendly. FDA laboratory testing confirmed inconsistent levels of levothyroxine and liothyronine. Therefore, FDA recommends patients not use porcine thyroid drug products made by Westminster.
FDA inspection and adverse event reporting
FDA inspected the Sichuan Friendly’s facility in 2017 and discovered serious quality deficiencies, including:
use of an incorrect formula to calculate the potency of the API, which means there may be inconsistent levels of levothyroxine and liothyronine present in the API, and
multiple batches of API released with certificates of analysis containing inaccurate potency and stability data, and
no stability data to support the claimed shelf-life of the API.
Health care professionals and patients are encouraged to report any adverse events associated with porcine thyroid medications to the FDA’s MedWatch Adverse Event Reporting program:
Complete and submit the report online at http://www.fda.gov/medwatch/report.htm; or
Download and complete the form, then submit it via fax at 1-800-FDA-0178.
FDA will continue to provide additional information as it becomes available.
For more information
Sichuan Friendly Pharmaceutical Co. Limited warning letter, June 22, 2018
See Guidance for Industry: ICHQ7 Good Manufacturing Practice Guidance for Active Pharmaceutical Ingredients for more information on how API, from original manufacturers as well as API repackagers and relabelers, should be labeled and clearly identify the original API manufacturer as the API moves through the supply chain.
Jamie Lehman
NP Thyroid Recall:
I am leaving a paper trail in case it’s helpful to anyone else in the forum.
It was some time in mid-December 2019 when I started contacting the FDA regarding NP Thyroid from Acella. My newest prescription smelled like cat or rat urine, tasted horrible, and made me feel sick. I found STTM and gave the information listed by everyone about NP problems as a reference to support my claim. I had been given the same runaround as everyone else from Dave Margolis at Acella. I spoke to Shanay at Acella on November 21, 2019 and she told me that Acella had a lot of complaints coming in regarding NP Thyroid. Anyway, because of all of the documentation submitted on this site, I was able to file a second and more meaningful complaint at a higher level at the FDA. For the record, I spoke with a Mr. Giddeon Esuzor (not sure of the exact spelling) at the Atlanta office. Phone number (404) 669-4466.
As I recall, I had filed the second complaint online and recall no action being taken. So, I started the entire complaint over again. Anyway, Mr. Esuzor sensed that I was not going away and I told him I was taking the tainted pills to a private lab to see what was in them. He seemed uncomfortable with that. He subsequently shared with me that an investigation was taking place at Acella in Georgia based on my complaint. He asked for my confidentiality during the process and I obliged. Soon after, repeated messages from Acella were left on my phone wanting to talk to me. I ignored all. Mr. Esuzor at the FDA took one more phone call from me and indicated that the investigation was still ongoing but then he never would answer or return another phone call. I had told him previously that I wanted all publicly available documents from the investigation. He seemed uncomfortable with my enthusiasm. I received the Voluntary Recall letter from my pharmacy dated June 6, 2020. I was very surprised to see the reason for the recall to be excess T3 and nothing else mentioned.
In my gut and my observations from other sources, I feel that there is a possibility that the animals, pigs or cows, were poisoned. It’s possible that we were even experimented on with viruses. People who have no thyroid are a captive audience for experimentation I would think.
As an aside, I’m pretty sure that in my research I had found something online indicating a company in Tampa that was importing thyroid medication was given an official letter from the FDA, I think, warning them that there were problems with the factory in China where the drugs came from and suggested that they did not sell the drugs. I don’t recall the timing of it but it might explain why Acella switched to a European source. But did they ditch the tainted pills or try to shove them down our throats?
I think we should demand all documents from the FDA investigation.
Jamie
Karla
Hi Jamie, do you have any updates on your experience, research regarding NP thyroid? I’ve been taking NP for years, and I know I noticed the changes with the smell, but it has taken a while to notice issues with the meds because I was dealing with mold exposure/toxicity beginning last summer. I haven’t been on this site for quite some time, so I am just learning of all the issues with NP. I’ve been through this history of changes to both Armour and Erfa before…heavy sigh that we have to deal with this when all we need is thyroid replacement! Thank you and all the best! ~Karla
Janie Bowthorpe
Everything I state is based on reported patient experiences and observations. And there sure have been a lot who’ve reported problems cropping up with NP, besides the terrible smell (like “cat pee”). And it’s now been recalled anyway. And yes, it does seem to catch up to patients like yourself who felt they were doing well…then they were not. So most are switching to Armour (which works again) or T4/T3 and getting optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Patricia
I started with NP Thyroid in Dec 2018. In Oct 2019 I started having daily hives. In Dec 2019 The weekly angio edema began and in Feb 2020 I ended up with anaphylaxis. I stopped taking NP thyroid in June 2020 when the pharmacy sent me a recall notice. Now I’ve been diagnosed with hypogammaglobulinemia. I know that can be caused by medications that suppress the immune system. Never had this before and I have to think there’s a connection.
Marg
WOW! “Immune system”??? Timed for the release of Covid-19? My several phone conversations with Dave at NP were frustrating. Why would a GA company move their source to Europe? Not tell us, not name the country of origin? Before the NP had the “cat pee” smell, it was clearly failing me. I called Dave, and of course found out in a roundabout way the fillers were changed. NP was 100% good; is this why they messed with it? To weaken a large population? Your diagnosis is tragic, but it now makes sense as to why all of us were sick on NP. Now I’m on Armour, it’s not great, and it’s expensive. Will the price come down, or will they stop production? Thyroid meds seem to be the key to most issues. Keep fighting, there will be justice, we must believe. Thanks, Janie!
Janie Bowthorpe
My husband started going downhill on NP before the cat pee smell too i.e. the summer of 2019. We had no idea what was going on. But when the cat pee smell and all the problems started by Fall, it was clear.
No, I don’t think they were trying to weaken all of us. Instead, they were going elsewhere for both porcine powder and fillers. But the DENIAL and gaslighting from Acella was HUGE. I lost totally respect for Acella.
As far as Armour, work to get optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal Read the latter carefully.
Marg
I read the link for optimal on NDT: it makes sense. (Please go to med school!) My Armour has not been price-reduced per PTrump’s working with pharmaceutical companies. My insurance will not pay unless I try their other Tier I first. I have, but via other docs many years ago, who could hunt down, prove that they didn’t work? I sent Armour an email asking when they will reduce the price. I’ll let you know if they respond. As for porcine, uh..it’s the animal they use to experiment on. Why wouldn’t they take lab animals for themselves first, and leave us with non-viable? NP changed their tune overnight, not apologizing, not caring. Of course they knew it was putting us in jeopardy. HCQ was promoted in 2005, now it’s not. See how FDA is messing with us? This NP/NDT is one example. And I have been known to get results. We all know how to contact the White House, politics aside. This is our lives, not politics! We’re way stronger than we realize. Be blessed today!
Marg
Allergan/Armour has a patient form on their website that enables them to work with your doctor to allow 3 months of free pills, sent to your doctor. It’s not perfect, but it may help defray some costs.
Jennifer
I am having daily hives now too! Even after discounting use. They started in October 2019, never had a issue like this before. I have to take Zrytec almost every single day or I break out in huge whelps. I know to take Zrytec because my fingers and toes start itching. The onset of symptoms is the same time as when I first started Np Thyroid.
Michele
I just wanted to take this opportunity to again thank Janie for all that she gives to us. She’s right there to help, answer questions and keep us all as sane as possible. We’ve all been through the ringer “again” with all the changes in NDT, but she’s still right here to help us all. Thank you Janie!
Dawn
Agreed, Michele! I have a wonderful thyroid doctor, but no comparison to Janie as far as finding resources, understanding labs, and always what the next step should be.
So please add me to the loads of gratitude for you, to you. We would be on our own lost islands without you Janie. 🙂 Thank you for everything!
Janie Bowthorpe
That means a lot to me. Thank u. 🙂
housemaid
I have a big bottle of the cat urine NP from last summer. I took one pill of that and quit because it tasted rotten. I did not want to get permanent damage that I have read other people have gotten from NP. However, I found an old good bottle of NP from 2016 and have been using that for a long time with no problem. Now I am soon going to run out. Early last fall I picked up 2 bottles of Thyroid-S, but I am leery of that because it also has a lighter smell of cat pee and taste. I have been on natural thyroid for years and never smelled cat pee in my pills until last summer with NP. WP was really my favorite due to lack of fillers. Has it gotten any better? Should I risk taking Thyroid-S?
I have thought about buying Armour since it has a different source of the porcine powder. I checked on GoodRx and found some weird price differences. I use Walgreen’s, but the other pharmacies had the same strange price differences. My dose of 120 mg a day costs $61.46 for 30 pills at Walgreen’s. However, the 180 mg dose drops to $45.60 for 30 pills. And the 240 mg dose is $51.26 for 30 pills. If I bought the 240 mg dose and split it in half, the price would be just $25.63 for 30 days. I don’t understand this pricing, but I would like to know if the Armour pills can be split in a pill cutter. I have never used Armour before but have heard that it has a hard coating.
Janie Bowthorpe
At first, we weren’t sure that WP had gone downhill like Naturethroid. But it eventually became clear it did, in fact, go downhill.
Armour does have a hard coating compared to what it used to be, but I think it can be cut with a good pill cutter.
Marg
Volume drives prices down. What sounds logical to get 240 and split it, won’t work. Your doctor cannot write over your prescribed amount per your labwork. As for price, I also pay out-of-pocket at Walgreens. With the news regarding price cuts on generic, NP is the generic for Armour, and they’ve twisted this so badly, all to their advantage. They should answer to this debacle since the White House is pushing for US-based drugs. What has happened to their US porcine? It’s sad to recall how well I felt on NP prior to their downfall. We can get answers, but it takes time and commitment. Be blessed!
Janet H.
Hi Janie! I Was doing great on NP but switched to Armour back in oct/nov. because of the yucky changes 🙁 I have been doing ok on Armour and pretty close to optimal but gained weight and not feeling as great as I once was. I’m on 3 grains a day and read that others have had to add T3. I’ve never used T3 only with NDT so wondering if it has in fact helped and how much is recommended? And do I drop the amount of Armour if I do add in T3?
Janie Bowthorpe
Can you post your frees with ranges?
Janet H
Thank you! I’ll post my labs since I started Armour in sept. I thought I was doing ok on 4 grains but my numbers climbed above range. So I dropped to 3.5 then to 3 and couldn’t get labs due to COVID situations. Like I said, I was ok but not great. Since COVID I went even lower to 2.5 to see if it would help me feel better because I have a history of rising RT3 as my frees increase. Got labs done and realized that wasn’t a good idea. So I asked my dr for some T3 and I’m going to do a saliva adrenal test soon. I’m back to 3 grains. I think I felt overall better on less but I really hope it’s because it sounds like I’m pooling and hope that T3 can maybe help. Haven’t taken any yet, just picked it up today. I really appreciate your wisdom!
Recently- 2.5 grains
11.7 RT3 (9.2-24.1)
.78 T4 (.82-1.77)
2.6 T3 (2-4.4)
January- 4 grains
6.5 T3 (2-4.4)
December- 4 grains
1 T4 (.7-2.5)
4.0 T3 (2-4.4)
November – 4 grains
3.7 T3 (2-4.4)
September – 4 grains
12.9 RT3 (9-27)
.7 T4 (.7-2.5)
3.3 T3 (3-2.4)
Janie Bowthorpe
Hard to say if you were pooling in January because you have to compare it to the free T4. But it’s possible. https://saliva-cortisol.squarespace.com/
Janet H
Yeah, I’ll be getting an adrenal test done as soon as I can. I’ve been working out of state for 4 months due to COVID So everything takes longer than usual for me now. In the meantime, do you have a recommendation on if I should use the T3?
Janie Bowthorpe
A recommendation of a T3?? Cytomel.
And here’s one of the best saliva cortisol tests: https://saliva-cortisol.squarespace.com/
Janet H
No, I was referring to my initial question. I switched from NP to Armour but gained weight and not feeling as great as I once was. I’ve read that others have had to add T3. I’ve never used T3 only with NDT so wondering if it has in fact helped and how much is recommended? And do I drop the amount of Armour if I do add in T3?
Janie Bowthorpe
But is it possible you are underdosed and not achieving an optimal free T4 and free T3, thus not feeling as great as before? Have you checked your frees on the amount you are currently on?
Of course, you can still add T3 to the Armour you are on and at least achieve an optimal free T3. But it’s an added expense you’d have to accept. Does that make sense?
Janet H
I guess I’m confused by the difference between pooling and RT3. Regardless, I read somewhere on this site that patients on Armour find it helpful to add T3 too. So I’m wondering why and should I too.
Also, I’ve been optimal with my T3 with T4 kind of lower in the range and a rising RT3. I read that T3 is helpful with RT3. My RT3 seems to go up every time I increase NDT.
Janie Bowthorpe
POOLING: when T3 goes high in the blood because it doesn’t have the right amount of cortisol to get it to the cells. Cortisol helps shuttle T3 to the cells when things are right. When things aren’t right, T3 just hangs out like pooled water when sticks and branches prevent it from going down the pipe.
RT3: what rises too high in the face of low iron, inflammation, or high cortisol–the latter three the most common causes. Rising RT3 is just rising RT3…just as falling snow on the ground gets higher and higher the more it snows. It’s not about “not getting to the cells.”
Not everyone needs to add T3 to Armour. You just need to raise it until the frees are optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Linda Osmond
Hi, all. I recently switched from NP thyroid to Armour. I was hesitant knowing that Armour had changed years back but was my last desicated option. It was also my first thyroid Rx when I started this journey. I felt great with mood the first week on the Armour, but I’ve had stomach upset for the entire 3+ weeks that I’ve been on it….loose bowels for a good portion of the morning and afternoon. I decided to try using some remaining old NP Thyroid (it’s like gold, right?) for a day or two, just to see if the stomach upset would go away. Basically, after my first morning (1/2 dose) of NP Thyroid, the GI problems resolved. So, what could this mean? Could it be that my body doesn’t tolerate the fillers? I am gluten-free, and I hear some Celiacs online (I am not Celiac, to my knowledge, but have some genetics related to gluten issues) express that they’ve had problems on Armour. Looking for insight. I’ll try going back on the Armour and stick it out a few more weeks until I can test, but perhaps someone has some thoughts on the gut issues. Having consistent loose bowels is new for me. So, I’d love to hear others’ thoughts. Thank you!!!
Janie Bowthorpe
We can never guarantee that Armour is gluten free. It will depend on what source they use for a filler, which they could go back and forth with. But it’s a VERY tiny amount as far as the filler. If you continue to have those issues, going with T4 and T3 can help and getting optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Linda Osmond
Thank you, Janie. I’m curious, if I do decide to go with compounded T4 & T3 (not made from desiccated hormone), it seems that one larger local pharmacy compounds with lactose as an option. Is this supposed to increase absorption of the hormones, or why would one choose lactose as a filler, I wonder? I know lactose is used in homeopathy, so there must be a good reason, and that is taken sublingually. Just trying to think of what a good option of fillers might be to consider with compounded hormones. If I try the capsules, I plan to open them and try to take them sublingually. Not sure if it will work, but I don’t think it could hurt. I was used to taking all of my NDT sublingually. I chew the Armour and let it sit there before washing down with water, but it’s not the same as sublingual.
This conversation is also triggering another thought about my GI issues on Armour. I wonder if this could be from swallowing the hormones and fillers vs absorbing them sublingually. Bypassing the gut would be a great benefit with any hormones consumed, as well as some undesirable fillers. And I think the liver would not have as much processing to do.
Janie Bowthorpe
I want to personally state here that I would never do compounded T4 and T3. You are stuck to a certain amount. It can be far better to get just a T4 product, and just a T3 product, and raise each to achieve optimal frees, which is a free T3 at the top part of the range and a free T4 around or just slightly above midrange.
Do also you know that it takes longer to see the conversion results of T4 to T3. So you go slower with the raises of T4 to see those results in labs as far as what it contributes to your free T3 lab result.
Armours ability to be done sublingually changed years ago sadly. It’s hard and doesn’t have the tiny bit of sucrose to help the process.
Linda Osmond
Thanks, Janie. Your comments and thoughts are helpful.
Lynn
I believe that Armour was causing reflux for me. I had not had it before but it started when I was taking it and stopped when I tried compounded t3/t4 (I had other stuff with that) and started up again when I started Armour again. I’m pretty sure it also causes tightness in my chest and my hair gets frizzy and then falls out. Super weird I know. Now I am trying both compounded porcine and compounded t3/t4 to see if that helps. Still thinking there could be something wrong with the porcine but that seems to help the hair.
Janie Bowthorpe
You may have been underdosing yourself.
Lynn
I guess but I am taking the equivalent amount in both the Armour and the porcine/t3-t4 combo.
Jay
I have also made the switch from NP to Armour……………I had a BRIEF bout for several days of loose stools so I make an effort to increase my FIBER intake mainly with more beans and bananas and I am back to normal.
NOT sure if loose stools had anything to do with Armour.
Michele
I’m here to report my testing and feeling on Synthroid and Cynomel for the last 8 weeks. Just got the results of my tests and my FT4 is right at the lowest reading, my FT3 is right in the middle. My TSH as you would suspect is at a 0.02 range and so the NP wants me to back off what I was taking. I have to go off Synthroid as I am apparently the 1 in 50 or so who have a reaction to it/fillers. I had 24/7 low grade headaches and felt “unwell”. I have a bottle of Armour that expired in 2016 and started taking it. As I recall, they changed from dextrose in it to cellulose, so I am taking it with a little bit of a xylitol candy and hoping for the best. After 2 days, the headache is barely there. The other aspect of synthroid for me is that I can’t remember where I am going and what I was doing. Memory issues. The NP said that was the other complaint/side effect. I asked to return to discuss the Rx and the dose since I have issues with lowering the dose (50 mcg Synthoid and 25 mcg of Cynomel). I had been on 75 of Synthroid,but the headaches and memory issues were just too much so I dropped it back to 50….better. So, my questions to Janie and the group. What is the general opinion of having FT4 below range and just not taking any T4 at all and just sticking with Cynomel only…sort of the “Wilson Syndrome” or “RT3” repair theory. Or going back to my previous 2 grains of Armour even thought it’s from when they reformulated it and its’ expired in 2016. And the other thing is that they are now apparently coming clean about Swine Flu in China…and I read somewhere that Europe sourced their desiccated thyroid from China. Do you think that’s what is happening to our NDT??? A conspiracy theory that could be correct? I don’t mean to offend anyone, but the timing is pretty “suspicious”. Thanks everyone, especially Janie. I know Janie feels that people should be able to tolerate Synthroid, but not me….typical.
Janie Bowthorpe
Janie doesn’t feel everyone should be able to tolerate Synthroid. Janie knows that there will always be that rare individual who reacts to fillers. And it’s far, far more rare than 1 out of 50 to react to filler, but it happens.
Yes, we can do T3 alone, but it’s about multi-dosing it approximately every four hours, three times a day, and getting your Free T3 optimal. Midrange isn’t. Read this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Michele
Thanks. I don’t think it’s the fillers as much as it is the “chemical” in Synthroid. This is the 3rd time in 40 years of trying it with a change of doctors. Each time the memory goes, the headaches come and my balance goes off. The vestibular system is part of the head/brain and that’s where I have an injury. So, no more Synthroid for me. I used to take T3 only 5 times a day and was fine. I prefer to take something with T4 in it since even taking 50 mcg of Synthroid/T4, my level was the very bottom of the range. Without any T4, it’s nearly non-existent.
Christine Stolz
Thank you Michele for sharing your information. I’ve been on N-P Thyroid for around three years. About July, 2019, I noticed extremely loud ear ringing, loss of balance and memory functioning, headaches, pressure in the head and back of the neck. My symptoms are worse when I lay down so sleeping is very difficult without a sleep aide. Since July I’ve seen a doctor, a physician’s assistant, an ENT, three physical therapists, and a neurology nurse practitioner. I’ve had MRIs of the brain and neck with and without contrast, an X-ray of the neck, a hearing and sleep test, and electromyography and nerve conduction studies. No one and nothing has been able to help and my symptoms continue to worsen. I took myself off the N-P Thyroid on Christmas Eve 2019, but my symptoms have never gone away. To me some of the medicine smelled like fish.
Kay R.
Day before yesterday I stopped Synthroid and t3 for one day and felt better, not okay but better. You are describing my symptoms without all of the scans and Doctors. Last May I finished a 500 pill bottle of ERFA and opened and took a new dose of a 100 pill bottle. It was bought from a Canadian pharmacy …3 bottles. I went hyper for 2 days and backed off the dose and slowly tried to raise for about 6 weeks till I was on my former dose.. I was off and unwell and fell and hit my head , saw the doc a week later who took xrays . Tried Bovine felt awful ..nauseous off balance but not until Dec 2019 did not know what to call it …vertigo. Saw one chiropractor who was rude and said “it’s not your thyroid medicine” ( I started For the first time in my life synthetics last week of Oct)
Since then the vertigo is always there with metabolic problems, as in hot cold feels like walking in cement. If my husband holds my feet I can stand the way I feel, but my legs start to vibrate and that goes all over. It’s weird but we have been going through this for so long. All of your stuff..bad headaches neck pain and over the months occasional cough. Husband tested neg for covid twice…fingers crossed.
Pandemic for us and pig population. Yesterday I did what Michele talked about. I also had a 2016 Bottle of ERFA and took a grain. Took about an hour for me to go back to hell….where I am in today also. Took a small amount of t3 this afternoon, but I am vibrating hot right now in bed.
On paper my TSH a month ago on Synthroid and old erfa was within range free T’s looked good, but I have never recovered. Some days better than others , but not good.
Now, maybe Janie or someone can say whether our body’s have some kind of cellular memory and all thyroid meds are going to be a problem going forward. The afternoons are worse for me…probably high cortisol ….along with bad reactions to meds now. Feel like I was poisoned . Wish I had stayed off everything yesterday. All I can think of is to do that …which is hard, but maybe I need to clear the body. Zero meds for me for 5 days in the past year meant a TSH of 23 free 3 midrange and t4 baseline. My hair grew back. That was last year before trying bovine. Btw, I believe Synthroid keeps my heart stable ….that has been the only good thing besides numbers …oh and no problem with antibodies ….my new erfa did not smell bad but it is bad. I have sent all of this info to my doc who is okay, I hope….we are in Houston.
I have left out so many other symptoms…..sorry. I am very grateful for this page and all of the people who have spoken here. They are the reason for the recall of NP…it’s all about the money.
Michele
I’m so sorry that you two (above) are having such horrible symptoms. I’ve been through all the brain scans with and without contrast too. This situation is a nightmare. I am still taking the old expired in 2016 Armour with a small piece of Xylitol candy. I remembered that I had called the makers of Armour at the reformulation and they said they took out the dextrose and replaced it with microcrystalline cellulose. So, I’m adding back something “sweet” and so far it’s okay. I’m also taking 1/2 grain more than my “stable” dose of the past. Side effects are much better. I am happier too. I have a thyroid ultrasound scheduled for this week and go back to my NP the following week. I think it’s too soon to re-test for my dosage of Armour to see how the levels have changed, but I’ll ask anyway. This is so sad for us all as most of us were optimized before all this happened. I am trying to be positive and very grateful that I don’t have covid though! With Janie saying the new Armour is working for some, I think I will ask for that next week when I go in for the follow up on the ultrasound. I know that you should wait 6-8 weeks before re-testing FT3 and FT4, but if it’s just changing from Synthroid/Cytomel to Armour, do you still have to wait that long? Anyone know?
Patty of Fremont Ca.
I have been on this NP. for as long as it has been out. I love that it is a natural product. At the being, my doctor had to adjust my doses, with the new formula, I ONLY notice the smell of cat urine…. but I feel great on it. never had any side effects. I Just sorry for the other patients that are having problems.
Janie Bowthorpe
Patty, just a warning: we’ve had a few say they were doing great on what 99.9% aren’t doing great on. Thus, they eventually crash.
Lynn
Do you think that the new NP only affects certain people? I know three people that have been on Naturethroid since the change last year and they are fine – no adjustment in dose. Surely in a year they would have crashed. The Naturethroid and NP thyroid affected me within two weeks. What could cause them to last this long? I also went back and smelled my Armour (four different bottles – 2 each of 15 mg and 30 mg) from December and March and they all smell faintly of cat urine (stronger with higher dose). And the porcine powder compounds I have received in the last two months smell exactly like NP did after the change. I also smelled my Naturethroid from 7/19 and it has a strong chemical smell that I would guess is masking something. My older Naturethroid and the good NP have a faint smell but not like any of these. This has been going on for over a year for me now of feeling like crap except for the few weeks I was on NP (after Naturethroid went south) before the cat urine smell. Why can’t we figure out what went wrong with NP and Naturethroid in hopes of a fix instead of trying to get optimal of a NDT that might be bad (Armour) or synthetics which some can’t seem to tolerate? I think we are missing something?
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Lynn. The way I do Stop the Thyroid Madness is to be open to individuality. I also call this the “Gray Areas” of our experiences–even have a page about gray areas. But when it comes to Naturethroid, or NP, and etc, there’s a problem when someone says they are “fine.” We see a lot of people who say they are “fine”, and we believe them they feel fine….yet we notice their adrenals are kicking in big time with high cortisol awhile, fooling them about being “fine”. Some last longer than others with high cortisol, but it always ends up causing problems. I even have a doctor who thinks she’s “fine” on Naturethroid..and I kinda wince, wondering when it’s going to hit her. And like others, she’s not willing to consider that she may not be as fine as she thinks…:(
And then there’s the optimal vs non-optimal frees. We know we need to be optimal. But when someone’s frees are NOT optimal…here is where there is individuality. Some see non-optimal frees cause their hypo to come back with a vengeance pretty soon as you did (and often stressed adrenals). Others may take a year and more!! But go backwards they do.
You asked “Why can’t we figure out what went wrong with NP and Naturethroid in hopes of a fix instead of trying to get optimal of a NDT that might be bad (Armour) or synthetics which some can’t seem to tolerate?” For one, we can’t figure things out because there is SO much secrecy from pharmaceuticals as to where they get what they use. Acella finally stated “from Europe.” So WHERE in Europe? And how do they know that the porcine powder they are getting isn’t messed up (which our symptoms imply it IS). Then you have pharmaceuticals who proclaim “We changed nothing” when it’s CLEAR that changes occurred. yet they get away with saying “We changed nothing.” Sad. It does beckon the question “On whose side is the FDA in all this??”
Second, not sure what you mean that Armour “might be bad.” Right now and for awhile now (in spite of changes in the past), it’s working when people understand HOW to use it (which many don’t then wrongly claim Armour isn’t working).
Third, to the contrary, most people do just fine with the synthetics if they do BOTH T4 and T3. Those who say they don’t tolerate it are actually thinking only of their experience when on nothing but T4. Being on nothing but T4 has been a huge mistake and seems to have caused millions with problems. If they add T3 to it, and get the free T3 up there, it’s fine. Of course, there can be a very small percentage who react to fillers, but it’s literally a small percentage, even if real for them.
Lynn
Thanks Janie for explaining it to me. I’m just so frustrated because I have now been sick for a year and have tried just about everything. I can’t go above 1/2 grain of anything without various symptoms that change everyday but mostly joint pain and fatigue. I don’t even care about the fatigue anymore because I can’t remember what it is like to not feel it. It seems my body doesn’t like anything included anything I take to help my adrenals. My doctors don’t know what to do so they are testing for other things now. I’m wondering if it might be best for me to stop taking anything and see how I do since I can no longer tell what is causing what anymore. Either that or take 1 grain of something and hope the side effects calm down. I’m stuck.
Janie Bowthorpe
If you can afford it, consider doing a coaching call with me to help get things clearer. The one on one talking helps if it’s needed. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/coaching-call
Betty White
At first I had all kinds of trouble with NP when I got some that smelled like cat pee. I went back on armour and had problems. I asked the Doctor to put me back on NP late last year and so far I am doing very well. I have lost weight and have energy. Not sure what happen, but I hate the smell. For some it will work. I did have to go down to a lower dosage.
Janie Bowthorpe
Betty, be careful thinking it’s working. What we’re seeing a lot for several months is that individuals who think it’s working are actually noticing the effect of rising cortisol and a little extra adrenaline. It can disguise that it’s actually not working. Thus people head for a bad crash.
Betty
I thought that might happen after a few months, but it has been about 7 months. Some times the pills stink and that I hate, but so far I have been good.
Liz
Acella needs a wider recall! I finally asked pcp for a thyroid panel 3 weeks back; among other high T3 sx, palps, headaches–but low T4 sx, too: cold all the time, temp 96- 97 round the clock for weeks. (Endo’s here in the 1950’s–won’t rx “unscientific” porcine but PCP won’t do more than rx, so it is DIY medicine without the ability to order labs/ or meds for myself, as usual. btw, have been on NP Thyroid for 6 years, hypothyroid since 2002, and noticed new stink, too.) My free T3 was way high,much higher than ever before and free T4 bottom number of normal. But my batch is not recalled! I called Costco pharm; pharmacist had no idea about recall, said he looked online and saw nothing, had received nothing. I can’t tolerate synthetic T3–wicked palps/arrhythmias–but T3 low without it. No one believes me but it is clear my adrenal fx slumps seriously from time to time, perhaps in response to MCAD issues…or in response to too much T3? Could that be?
Sharon Davis
May 27 started refill of 60 am 90 pm 3 days later get a text from Walmart with a link about recall due to super potency.,I didn’t think it was mine that I just received. Pretty much ignored it but day 6 start having headache that continue still today also elevated b p not getting clear answers from endo now it’s day 2 of U.N. recalled med how soon should I feel better? Desperate!!
Janie Bowthorpe
Most people are leaving NP Thyroid behind, and moving to Armour or T4/T3, and getting their free T3 and free T4 optimal.
Melissa Davis
Me too! I was having pound headaches in top of my head and felt awful! I went from exercise daily to not being able to exert any energy without my head pounding!
Janis Tramel
I wonder about contacting Acella Pharmaceutical directly and sending them proof via medical records to support the damages I have suffered from taking this tainted medication. Is that just a naïve thought that they might decide to make this right?
Janie Bowthorpe
Based on what so many have stated, it may be naive. Patients have expressed that Acella is about nothing more than making money and hiding what is going on.
Rachael
There is a law firm in Fresno, CA pursuing legal action towards Acella. Check out https://wagnerjones.com/acella-pharmaceuticals-recall/ if you have samples of medication for testing or lab work from when you were on NP it might be worth giving them a call.
Kay
NP Thyroid : I also have had terrible problems with NP Thyroid and could not get the endocrinologist group, that I go to to, listen to my problems. Finally I had my GP help and he took me off of this medicine. I feel so much better and am back to my normal self after switching me to Synthroid. On Jun 8, 2020 I received a letter from my pharmacy about a voluntary recall by Acella Pharmaceuticals, LLC on 13 lots of NP Thyroid 30, 60, and 90mg. This is a quote directly from the letter. “The products are being recalled because these lots have been found to be super potent by the manufacture. The product may have up to 115.0% of the labeled amount of Liothyonine (T3).” I pray that non of you had the terrible symptoms that I was having and that you actually have an endocrinologist that knows and listens to you. You can verify the lots by going to acellapharma.com/news
Janie Bowthorpe
It would be a better thing to add T3 to that T4. Even a healthy thyroid gives us some direct T3. And though you feel better, you are risking all sorts of problems by forcing your body to live for conversion alone.
Lynn
What is the feedback on using compounded porcine? Is anyone having luck with that?
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s strangely mixed. Some say that their compounded had the “cat pee” smell that has been in NP Thyroid (the latter which has been making many patients sick). Others stated they were doing fine.
Lynn
I started using some and was still having symptoms so I even got some without any fillers thinking that the filler of microcrystalline might be my problem but no difference. The straight porcine smells like cat pee. The one with microcrystalline has a faint smell. Maybe the filler masks it? The porcine powder is also dark and I expected that the porcine with filler would be speckled but it is not. Maybe the clean it somehow? I guess this porcine is problematic because of the pee smell as opposed to it being the normal smell.
Janie Bowthorpe
The smell of cat pee exactly corresponds to when people started going downhill.
Janis Tramel
Walgreens Pharmacy told me if I received the recall letter, I had been given the tainted medication. Only those who received the recall letter were given the tainted medication.
Christine Stolz
Hi, Kay, could you tell me some of the “awful symptoms” that you had while on what may have been the superpotent NP Thyroid? I was on NP Thyroid and some, but not all, of my symptoms were and still are: memory loss, confusion, balance issues, headaches, severe ear ringing, pain and pressure around the entire head and back of the neck that are extreme when lying down thus difficulty sleeping. Here are some of the medical professionals I have seen because of my declining health since my symptoms began around July 2019: a doctor, a physician’s assistant, an ENT, three physical therapists, and a neurology nurse practitioner. I saw all of these medical professionals prior to receiving the Drug Recall information about the superpotent amount of Liothyronine. Also, I have had MRIs of my brain and neck with and without contrast, hearing and sleep study tests, an electromyography and nerve conduction study, and twice have had four steroid injections to the back of the lower head and neck areas. My symptoms continue and seem to be worsening. Prior to beginning NP Thyroid I was on Synthroid (levothyroxine) and developed a severe cough, which I had for years and went away after switching to NP Thyroid, but came immediately back when re-trying Levothyroxine. I have had the above mentioned issues for a year now even though I have been off NP Thyroid since December 24, 2019.
Dawn
Hi,
My pharmacy allowed me to switch out a recalled batch of NP for Armour (with my MD’s approval) and pay the difference. I was thrilled as I thought when I’m done with my good NP, I’ll go back to Armour.
I just tried a 30 mg pill and within minutes, I have ringing in my ears and a warmth in the middle of my back. I have Celiac and follow a very strict GF/Dairy/Egg free diet.
I read about Armour’s fillers before I took it and the only thing I could find was cornstarch as a possible allergen.
Anyone on Armour have these sensations? I am feeling defeated now, bc only after one small dose, I immediately reacted to it.
Thank you for any help.
Janie Bowthorpe
It might be that Armour is revealing a cortisol problem from having been on NP…https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
Dawn
Thank you, Janie. I had this same reaction when I originally swallowed a tainted NP pill. Armour looks the same grayish, speckled as the bad NP. I am so sad about this because it was my last hope. I cannot take synthetics. I am tired of being tired and angry of this every few years.
I will look into a cortisol test. Thanks very much.
Christine Stolz
Dawn, please note my reply to Kay. I am suffering greatly from extremely loud ear ringing since around July 2019. I, too, was on NP Thyroid. I listed many of the symptoms I developed before going off NP Thyroid on December 24, 2019 in my reply to Kay.
Sheila Sutton
I have no thyroid. And have been fighting other autoimmune problems for the past 7 yrs. That being said it is had to pin point problems when they raise their ugly head. But I have lately (past 3-4 mos.) had problems with fluid retention and body and muscle aches. My dr. thought it might be my BP meds. but stopped them and still have the problem. Then I got to thinking about my NP thyroid and if it might be the problem. And I’m really leaning to it being the problem. I did notice the change in taste ( cat pee smell ) and texture. But didn’t think to much of it at the time. I called my Dr. and spoke to his nurse and ask to be put on WP thyroid again. I had to quit taking it because they shut down their production for some time and had to go on something else and NP was it. Can’t take Armour or Synthroid . Has anyone else had these symptoms ?
Janie Bowthorpe
NP Thyroid has been reported by patients as causing such a myriad of problems, that yes it could be your problem. And Armour now works if you get your frees optimal! https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal Synthroid works if you add t3 to it and also get those frees optimal
Linda
Hi Janie & All,
I have a good 6 month supply left of my NP Thyroid, 120mg in the morning, 90mg in the afternoon. I just found out about the recall on NP Thyoid from my pharmacy. So, I did some investigating, and of course went to Stop the Thyroid Madness for information. Ugh… I made the switch from the failing and then disappearing Naturethroid to NP a couple of years ago. And now this. I have noticed that despite my constant exercising, my weight has crept up. But I am also 44.75 years old and ultimately, I am in very good physical shape for someone my age. I tend to over-exercise when I am stressed out. I bicycle a 1/2 hour every morning and I jog 20 minutes 4x/week and I do yoga and Pilates several times per week. But I am exhausted every night, much to my boyfriend’s chagrin. By 10pm, I am a total useless and often cranky zombie. I am back to about 2 weeks of relatively severe pms and my midsection, while toned because I do literally 400 sit-ups/day, has a layer of fat on it that maybe should not be there considering how much I exercise, I am generally depressed too much (but that’s just me I think and my psychological response to the current affairs isn’t helping). Anyways, after reading all of this bad press about NP Thyroid, I am wavering on the decision to switch to Armour. Honestly, the only thing stopping me from making the switch at this point is money. I have 6 months worth of NP Thyroid at home. My insurance only charges $30 per 3 month supply of NP Thyroid. If I make the switch to Armour, I will pay $210/3 month supply. I don’t make a lot of money, and I may lose my job within the year due to the pandemic. I feel really defeated, Big Pharma again continues to toy with my/our physical and mental well-being. Is it really worth it for me to make the switch to Armour from NP given the massive cost difference? I am willing to pay the extra money if Janie and anyone else feel it will help me to feel better. I suspect my boyfriend would love for me to make the change, as I’ve been more interested lately in snuggling with my cats than him for the past year (again, I have attributed this to my age, but now I’m thinking it’s another shoddy NTD product). =’-[ I welcome any and all thoughts. =]
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s probably cheaper to go with T4 and T3 and get those trees optimal.
BJ
Linda, try a online coupon from GoodRX where you can purchase a 3-month supply of Armour for around $82 -depending on strength – without using insurance. I’m on Medicare which will not cover NDT’s and my pharmacy allows me to use the GoodRx coupons instead of Medicare when I specify to them that I am paying out of pocket with the coupon instead of insurance. Are these NDTs being purposely sabotaged? Good luck!
Chris
30 MG NP Thyroid superpotent recalled batch put me in Afib and have been in it for a month now. Healthy runner up to this point, now on heart meds for arrhythmia and BP (Beta Blocker and a ‘black box warning” medication to slow the upper atrium of my heart. Failed cardioversion in hospital, now have to have ablation. I am averaging btwn 88 to 125 BPM on my heart rate and I have always had bradycardia (slow rate btwn 49 & 55 BPM) runner’s heart. My life is hell right now. I’m suing Acella. My quality of life right out the window.
Starr D.
So sorry you’re going through all this, and I really hope things get better
for you as soon as possible. Glad you are suing Acella, and I hope
you get big money from them, for all the harm they’ve done. I say this
as someone who’s been harmed by thyroid medicine changes in the
past…starting with Synthroid, long ago–but I never usually found out
what had caused the problem until it was too late to sue. These
companies have gotten away with wrecking a lot of people’s lives,
for a very long time. And it needs to stop.
I also was harmed by the latest NP failures, and if I hadn’t had so
much experience that I figured out something was up with my NP medicine–
and then comparing it with what others on this site were going through,
last August & September, when I was getting into big trouble–AND
if my thyroid doctor hadn’t worked with me real fast to reduce
dosage and change medicines–no doubt I would’ve ended up in
ER as well, or worse. I’m still not over all this, yet–maybe the best
I can do is get in on a class-action suit against NP, if there is one,
according to what one lawyer said. So, on behalf of all thyroid patients
like me who’ve had years of their lives destroyed by reckless,
uncaring thyroid drug companies– Sue Acella, Big-Time! Thanks!
Ryan
Can I ask what occurred with your situation and what temporary or permanent issues cropped up for you? I’m worried for myself as well and want to try and compare symptoms if possible.
Starr D.
Hi, Ryan. With this current NP mess, it’s really sad because it
was trying to help me better than some of the other medicines for
awhile–and then it failed me, like it did with so many others. I took it
for over a year before the following happened: Terrible headaches
where I could hardly hold my head up, and a lot of pain in the neck
area where my thyroid gland would be if I still had much of it that
functioned, anymore. Also made my eyes hurt a lot, my stomach,
and my ears. The headache and neck pain reminded me very much
of what I had when I was diagnosed with Grave’s Disease when
I was 11…(autoimmune Hyperthyroidism.) Who needs to relive
that, right? Also made my pulse go too fast and hard my last day
or two on it….it was 100 at the doctor’s–I could feel it go down
gradually as I discontinued the NP (and all thyroid medicine) for
a short time….if I’d stayed on it, I probably wouldn’t be here, now.
I’m told I probably don’t even have much thyroid gland left that
functions due to the radioactive-isotope drinks they gave me
back in 1975-76 to knock out a lot of my thyroid gland–so to
think that this medicine could trigger such a bad response in
whatever thyroid gland cells I have left in there–well, that’s
pretty astounding, to me. Funny thing is, I had similar neck pain
and bad headaches hit me when I was on WP thyroid towards
the end my run on it….soon they quit making it, at least for awhile. So,
maybe they were putting out an inferior product, too. Sure was for
me, anyway. Unfortunately, my body always seems to figure out
when a thyroid drug company’s been altering a formula or getting
inferior ingredients…or both! I’d be a zillionaire if I could’ve sued
for every time I’ve been burned by these companies.
The first time was the worst, though, as that’s what has really messed
me up since I was not quite 20 years old. In 1982-83, Synthroid
changed formula, its assaying method (how they tested it to make
sure it worked OK, I think), and possibly where they got their
ingredients from. No matter what dose I’d be on of the New Version,
it gave me breathing trouble that I still have till this day (gets better
and worse depending on what thyroid drug and amount I’m on,
but I still haven’t gotten rid of it, yet), and it would make me very
nervous, shaky, etc–even if my labs were OK. Messed up my
attention span and concentration levels, and also made me more
prone to getting a bit of chest pain on the left side–again, even if
my labs looked OK. I often had to take less thyroid medicine than
indicated by labs, just to survive. My current endocrinologist, though,
is good about working with me on different things that help to some
degree. Example–giving me 400 mg. of magnesium glycinate per
day, to try to help some of the hyperthyroid-type symptoms all these
meds give me, except Old Synthroid. It does help, to some degree.
He also checks my ferritin levels, and recommended to me some
iron supplements I’d never heard of before–but have been helpful,
to some degree. He actually does thyroid research, and he’s good at
diagnosing some thyroid conditions that other doctors miss. He also
checks the Vitamin D3 levels, and B-12….all things that can help you
do better, in general, with the thyroid meds. He keeps up on latest
things for thyroid patients, too.
That being said, I’m not sure how well I can get–even with his
expertise–but I just had an appointment with him and he raised
my dose of name-brand Armour a bit–and he’s willing to go slowly
on it with me, because I need to (I’ll be doing alternating doses of
1 3/4 grains and 2 grains, for a couple of months–we’ll go from there.)
The reasons I’m trying to stick with a natural thyroid medicine of
some sort, after all this, is because I was getting some bleeding
problems on the synthetics, and the natural ones seemed to
stop it–even the troubled ones like WP and NP, toward the end.
Also, the natural medicines seem to help heal some skin issues
I have from all this better than the synthetics, when the natural
ones are being made more correctly, that is. Right now, Armours
seems to be the best of the natural ones, from what I’ve experienced
and from what I’m reading from others. And that’s a big deal for me
to say that, because I’ve failed on Armours around five other times
during the past decades…so for me to give it any kind of compliment
right now is quite something. They must have someone different in
charge of it right now…it’s been bought and sold a few times over the
years, so sometimes that does make a difference–usually not in a
great way, but we’ll see. I’m still not done with working with Armours,
so I can’t give a final verdict on this current version of it. But for now,
it’s working better than other things I’ve been on lately. But, we’ll see…
Jay
How do your blood tests look? (how long after your last dose was the blood drawn?)
Have you had thyroid antibodies tests to check for hashimotos?
Starr D.
Hi, Jay. I just got my blood test results back and had a phone appt.
with my endocrinologist to go over them, this past Thursday. At the
time of the labs, I’d been on 1 and 3/4 grains Armour (name brand)
for 74 days…I got the labs drawn a little earlier than he wanted
because I was having some symptoms that seemed like the
thyroid was getting too low, to me–so he worked with me on that.
I never take any thyroid meds or supplements before the blood
tests are done…took the last dose around 6:00 pm or so, and
got the labs done around 8:00 am the next day.
My Free T4 was flagged as Low 0.90 ng/dL range–0.93 to 1.70
My Free T3 was in the lower range of “normal”
2.9 pg/mL range–2.5 to 4.3
My TSH was flagged as “Low,” but doctor wasn’t that upset
0.23 uIU/mL range-0.27–4.20
He was going more by my symptoms and the Free T4 and T3
levels when he said I could try a small increase of 1/4 grain
of Armours, every other day. If I can’t handle it, I’ll let him
know…I hope I can, and that it’ll help me. If not, we’ll have
to go from there. This doctor has tested me for Hashimoto’s
antibodies maybe a year ago, and said that’s not my problem.
Jay
How do you take your Armour? Do you swallow, chew, or dissolve under your tongue? The Armour pills are much harder than the good NP so I am chewing the Armour to make sure they digest.
Janie Bowthorpe
Any of the above work! 🙂
Starr D.
Hi, Jay. I cut the Armours in half with a pill-cutter, because
I have to divide out my medicine a bit or it hits me too strongly.
Maybe it’s good I do this, too, for I also notice the Armours pills
are pretty hard–maybe by cutting them, it helps release them a little
better. I just swallow it with a cup of water or so.
By the way, I couldn’t handle the increased amount of
alternating doses…started getting bad headaches and
nervousness. Doctor said to go back to 1 and 3/4 daily
of the Armours, and add in an extra quarter or so when
I can. Any increase I take will have to be very gradual,
I guess. Right now, I had to lower the dose for a few
days after my bad reaction last week. Hope to be back
on the 1 and 3/4, anyways, in the near future. And maybe
that little bit of an increase per week, a bit later on.
Janie Bowthorpe
Starr, you probably need to read this, as it’s you: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Elizabeth C
I’m so sorry you’ve had this much trouble from NP. I too have had a terrible year on a wild goose chase in and out of cardiologist and other doctors offices trying to figure out what the cause of my heart palpitations and many other symptoms were. I had hair loss, weight loss, tremors, insomnia, most disturbingly the heart palpitations and rapid heart rate. I tried getting treatment for hyper symptoms but my doctor didn’t test T3 and said my levels were likely acceptable. It’s been a nightmare. I too hope the company has ramifications for not following GMP or at least holding their porcine supplier to a higher standard with GMP. I still have heart palpitations despite being off of it for a few months. I wish you the best.
Janie Bowthorpe
Most common causes of heart palps: being underdosed, being on nothing but T4, having a cortisol problem due to the latter. Etc.
Elizabeth C
Thyroid is tricky! In my case it was from being on NP thyroid and too high of T3. My labs indicated hyper. It was a nightmare! I hope Acella is addressed appropriately for their lack of quality control on the porcine thyroid.
Starr D.
Sorry you’ve had such a hard time with the medicine, as well.
When I described what I’ve been through to David at the
Acella company a couple of weeks ago, he said, “Yikes!”
Then he went on to say that although he still believed
in his company’s product, if he were me, he’d “never
take it again.” No problem, there–I surely won’t!
Best to you, Elizabeth–I know what it’s like, going
through all this. Hope it gets better for you, soon.
Janie Bowthorpe
To “still believe in his company’s product” when it’s QUITE CLEAR that people have been going south on it speaks volumes…..
Starr D.
Yes, Janie, I was kind of amazed that he was still
cheer-leading for NP in any way, after all that’s gone on
But I guess I shouldn’t be surprised by anything, anymore.
At least he admitted he thought it stinks for me, though,
and to stay off it. Not much of a victory…but something.
P.S. I am reading that page you recommended about
people like me, having trouble with raising the doses.
Thank you for that….I am just a big thyroid mess today–
crying about my nice brother who passed on Mar. 31,
and trying to get back on as close to the correct amount
of the Armours as I can handle. Made it to 1 and 1/2 gr
for 3 days…it’s gone OK. Still under what I need, but
hoping to get close to it, soon. I swear, if I get rich, I need
to make a “Thyroid Home” for patients to stay when they’re
really having trouble—free of charge, and help with all aspects
of thyroid diagnosis and recovery. I can dream……..
Janie Bowthorpe
I am so sorry for your loss, Starr. 🙁 And I love your last thought….
Angela F
Chris: Don’t know if you’ll get this, but if you’ve pursued your suit a/o are a part of the Class Action, please let me know. I had the same paroxysmal A-fib diagnosis and also PACs as a result of the NP.
JRB
If it’s a choice between Nature Throid or NP Thyroid I’d pick NP after my experience with the two. I couldn’t feel the T3 in Nature Throid ,perhaps absorption issues, but in NP Thyroid within the hour after taking it I’d feel the T3 and my symptoms would subside, even when I was underdosed. In my experience I felt that T3 pretty darn good and I have the newer pills. I’m back on a synthetic combo now because I needed a slightly lower dose of T3 on 120mg of NP and of course you can’t do that. My thyroid still produces and converts T3 on its own in “normal” but not optimal levels so I feel like I’m a person that can still take majority of T4 and supp with smaller amounts of T3. Now I know all my horrible debilitating symptoms were due to Low T3.
Janie Bowthorpe
Time will tell if Acella’s NP is getting better. But I’m personally so disgusted by what I saw as a huge lack of integrity by Acella that I will do anything else but NP Thyroid. And frankly, we’re not seeing very much positive coming from patient reports even still about either NP or Nsturethroid. Those that are saying they still feel good on it are seeing an eventual bad crash with returned hypo and/or adrenal stress.
JRB
This is why I’ve gone back to synthetics after experimenting with NDT and it’s tough right now because my T3 is real low and it’s going to take weeks until the T4 starts working so I’m dosing daily with Cytomel to at least be functional. I’m not sure if I should stick with my usual 88mcg of T4 and add Cytomel on top of it or reduce my T4 to 75mcg and add a little more Cytomel. Anyone have any experiences with that or suggestions? On 88mcg of T4 only my T4 was anywhere from 1.6-1.8 and FT3 at 2.6. I haven’t tested the RT3 but I’d bet they’re high. I’ve been on supplements for a little over a month for low B12/folate, which was under 400, and some other low nutrients like iodine. Iron was 48% sat , ferretin 47, iron 133. 23andme said I did not have the variant for hemachromatosis. Haven’t had a saliva cortisol test. A morning blood cortisol at 8am was 13. I don’t know what that means. Ugh, even though I wasn’t optimal of NDT I was sleeping so much better. As soon as I get back on synthetics I’m waking up after maybe 6 hours of sleep and can’t get back to sleep but maybe that’s because I took all that T3 away. On sythetics I have to build my levels up to optimal. I was on 90mg on NP and getting 13mcg of T3 and now only dosing with 5mcg of cytomel on 88 mcg of T4.
Javdw
Book:
“Bottle of Lies”
by Kathryn Eban
Published 2019
Alarming investigative reporting on generic drugs made in China and India, and the trouble the US FDA has to control the getting worse problem.
Carol
Trust me, when the FDA says something is bad I
Immediately go out and get it because it MUST be working.
Selene Seltzer
From another page on this STTM website:
[by ss – FYI – In support of a refund request, you can ask your pharmacy for a Patient History Report showing:
Rx#, Store, Date, NDC, RPH, Medication, QuantityDispensed, Claim ref #, Days Supply, Retail Price, Prescriber, Amount Paid]
Here’s the latest from Acella:
Acella has confirmed that all recalled medication has been removed from pharmacies and all NP Thyroid in stock at pharmacies is current.
– If you would like to send your medication back or receive a refund from NP, they have contracted with Qualanax to facilitate the returns and refunds process. (Note that you do not need to return the medication but you are welcome to do so if you want.) To contact Qualanax, please note the following:
–- Before you call, please have the bottle of NP in front of you as well as a copy of your receipt from the pharmacy. (If you need a copy of the receipt, your pharmacy can scan and print a receipt from your current bottle when you pick up your refill).
–- Call their Customer Service line at 888-280-2042. The CSR will guide you through the process. If you are sending back the medication, they will send you a Recall Kit.
Kathryn Baylis
I’m crying “Uncle!” when it comes to NDT for the meantime. I’ve been through both the Naturethroid and NP Thyroid problems. Armour would be an alternative, except that it costs 5 times what NP Thyroid costs–-which itself was almost 5 times what Naturethroid cost me!
My concern is that, back when I developed hypothyroid problems, I was under the care of a TSH-only/Synthroid-loving endo. Synthroid put 70lbs on me in less than 3 months, made me feel arthritic, foggy-minded, headachy, and lethargic. When I asked my endo about NDT, she wouldn’t even consider it, and actually wanted to RAISE my dosage of Synthroid! I fired her and found a hormone specialist (from your recommended list) who put me on Naturethroid after running proper full tests–-which showed a nearly toxic level of T4 and almost zero T3, meaning I do NOT convert. On Naturethroid I immediately started feeling like myself again, and lost the weight slowly over about 3 years (yeah it sucks that it took 3 months to gain it, but 36 months to lose it, but it’s been gone and staying off for over a year now, thankfully). However, Naturethroid went south, so I switched to NP Thyroid, even though it was more expensive. Now NP Thyroid has also gone south, and the cheapest price I can find for Armour with my insurance–-and also on GoodRX–-is $145 for a 3 month supply of the strength I need!!! For context, NP Thyroid is about $45 and Naturethroid is about $13 for the same strength and number of pills. FYI; generic Cytomel (Liothyronine) costs a little more than my usual prescription for NP Thyroid, about $56, but would still be affordable for me–-brand name Cytomel costs a whopping $345 for the same amount and strength!!!
So, before I ask to go back to a synthetic, I need to know one thing. Since I do not convert T4, will I have to take a T4/T3 combo, or can I request to be put on T3 only? After having had such a horrible time with synthetic T4-only meds, which took so very long to undo, I just want to avoid once again ending up with an overabundance of unconverted T4.
I appreciate any advice you can give me before making the call to my hormone specialist.
Thanks!
Janie Bowthorpe
Do know that I was perhaps a LOUSY converter to T3 when I was on Synthroid alone. Granted, I never did the free T3 while on Synthroid, but I can assume that was the problem as I was MISERABLE all those 20 years on T4 alone, even after a raise. But when I moved to NDT, I got the same lab results that everyone got when optimal, including that midrange FT4 with an up there FT3. So you just may be fine on T4/T3. Just learn this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Kathryn Baylis
Thanks, Janie! I clicked the link and read the entry, and it was really helpful. The only thing to do now is call the doc and figure out equivalent dosage–-as long as I can get him on board with the change (if he refuses, then it’s back to square one finding another doctor who will–-sheesh! Hope I don’t have to).
Michele
Hi Kathryn, I go back farther than you with the rotten NDT scenarios…starting with Armour, then Erfa, then NatureThroid then NP and now I have given up completely. It also seems *to me* that the natural dessicated thyroid product is coming to us via Europe and they are supposedly getting it from China. The news is talking about all the pigs they are killing with the swine flu in China…and have been for over a year. I have no proof, but I have eyes to see it on the news and a brain to put it together…they are apparently “cleaning” the parts with chemicals (thus the chemical smell like cat pee??)….anyway, I am fed up with the nonsense. About 2 months ago I started with Synthroid (brand nameT4) and Cynomel (generic T3). I too never seem to convert well and if I raised NDT, I had RT3 issues. I stayed on the T4/T3 combo for about 6 weeks and started feeling poorly…just tired, headachy and not well. Doc couldn’t do labs until the end of June due to the virus. Last week I dropped my Synthroid and upped my T3. I am doing much better. I can’t wait for the blood test to see where I am on the synthetic combo. I think, like you have experienced in the past, we each have to do our own research and test and try things out. Synthroid gives me a headache, and also makes my mind not work for a memory…so I cut back on it. Don’t give up. You’ve been here before, and you will get optimal. Janie’s support and group are so wonderful! You are not alone.
Kathryn Baylis
Hi Michele! You know, one wonders if it’s the swine flu or the chemical wash that messes up the T3 in the pig thyroids. But Acella’s claim that the T3 is too high is BS, since the effect is exactly the opposite.
I finally got labs done (suspicions confirmed–-my T3 was so low it was almost nonexistent), and my doctor wrote me a scrip for 25mcg of liothyronine (generic Cytomel). Took me 3 months to convince him something was wrong, including sending him a copy of the recall notice from Acella. Don’t doctors also get notified if a medication is recalled, so they can stop prescribing it? I also hate the fact that he’s starting me so low, but I get that he wants to be sure I can tolerate the synthetic. He did only give me a month’s supply to start, so I hope he titrates the dose up next month. It’s been less than a week, and I feel somewhat better, but it doesn’t feel like it’s really done a lot to kickstart my metabolism yet. Fingers crossed the engine finally turns over and keeps running when he raises it next month.
The thing that really bugs the crap out of me the most with the bad NDTs is all the progress I lose, not to mention all the time lost. It just takes soooooo long to get through the process of realizing something’s wrong, researching to find out exactly what’s going on, then convincing my doctor there’s a problem necessitating a change in thyroid meds, and then waiting to slowly regain all the lost ground once he finally makes that change in meds.
Since I don’t convert T4 to T3, when I’m not taking meds containing T3, my levels totally tank and I have like zero metabolism. Every single time it happens it sets me back nearly a year! It can take me 6-8 months to slowly lose 30lbs, without starving myself, but only 3 months to gain back 20lbs of it, with zero change in eating amounts and exercise habits from when I was losing weight. Two months ago, I was less than 10lbs away from my goal weight–-nothing extreme, just the average for my height–-and now I’m nearly 30lbs away from that goal!
Same thing happened when Naturethroid went bad in 2018. I cannot have my weight yo-yoing like this every other year. It’s not healthy. I’m no spring chicken anymore, and that kind of strain can take a toll.
And it seems that the supposed professionals–-doctors and pharmaceutical companies–-just can’t seem to understand how unhealthy all the fallout from this is. You’d think Big (or Little) Pharma would jump on fixing it, if only to keep their products selling, and doctors not only go by lab work, which can be incomplete or the wrong type of tests (like the useless TSH), but also believe their patients when tell them about the adverse effects they’re experiencing, because part of the Hippocratic Oath states “I will remember that there is art to medicine as well as science, and that warmth, sympathy, and understanding may outweigh the surgeon’s knife or the chemist’s drug”.
Karen Cole
I have reached out to the manufacturers of NP and Nature-throid. I don’t even know where to begin with all the information I collected from them. But let me say this, in my opinion it is best at this point in time NOT to rely on only natural thyroid. I am now going to do a “cocktail” or “fail-safe” method. 1/2 synthetics, 1/2 natural. So if one gets recalled/doesn’t work, the body can rely on the other, and tweak it more at that given time. It is terrible, and sad, what has happened to the raw thyroid material that ALL natural thyroid makers have gone through. The supplier should be held accountable–(lawsuit), since the raw thyroid was not of the quality sold to the makers of Armour, NP and Naturethroid. But, shame on the manufacturers for not fully testing the products before shipping them out in 2018 and 2019. We were their guinea pigs. And those of us that had a total thyroidectomy,, suffered the worst. Only if we had died, would this issue be of greater importance to the World/FDA. I am a writer,(see “Silent Bark” in IMDb) and could not even pick up a pen these last few months whilst on naturethroid. (And on NP before that.2018-2019). I have gone back on a combo of Armour and Levothyroxine. Good luck everyone.
Janie Bowthorpe
Do know that you are reaching out to companies whose products now suck, and they act as if all is hunky dory in the name of continuing to take your $$…
And the worst thing to do is take any NDT with T4. NDT is already 80% T4 as it is, besides the fact that it’s T3 which changes lives, not T4.
And why hang onto a product that we know has changed for the worst. If you want to stay with NDT, Armour appears to be the only US-made brand that still works. All you need to do is raise Armour by itself until your frees are where they should be. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Lynn
Do we think that all the porcine is bad? Is it worth it if f I can get compounded porcine? Either alone in a capsule or with microcrystalline as a filler?
Janie Bowthorpe
The makers of Armour state they have a US source of pigs. And since currently, Armour has been the only one left that is working, it says that not all porcine is bad.
Lynn
I didn’t do well on Armour after trying it twice in the last 6 mos. hair loss and leg cramps. Only thing I haven’t tried yet is brand name synthroid and cytomel together (synthetic t4/t3 resulted in improvement in hair loss but also caused leg cramps and hair pulling scalp sensations).
Ryan
Started noticing weird symptoms recently that feel almost like tension headaches. Thought maybe I had pulled an inner neck muscle or was inadvertently putting myself under a lot of stress. Started having dizzy spells while laying down, and even a little bit while standing. Feet get cold but I don’t think they’re numb or tingling like thyroid type symptoms would indicate… at least in my history. Hands are sometimes cold too. Temp ranges from 96.6-98.2F Pretty normal for me, I’d say. Feels like I’m walking through a cloud sometimes, or like there’s a band wrapped around my head with tension and pressure at the base of my occipital bone and across my forehead, between my eyes, etc. Pain above right eye under the eyebrow and around the eye socket as well, eyes kinda feel dry. Been on NP thyroid for the extent of this whole ordeal but these symptoms are a bit new. The whole dizzy, lightheaded, slightly drunk feeling as well as pressure points on the face may not be involved with my thyroid and might be a tension headache or something, but it seems coincidental that it happens right as a recall comes in for at least one of my strengths (I’m on 1x15mg and 1x60mg a day).
Walmart (my pharmacist) sent me a text about the recall today, but I’ve felt like this for about 2 weeks, maybe slightly before my last refill. They told me however that their stock wasn’t affected which seems strange.
Janie Bowthorpe
The weird symptoms you are talking about are pertaining to what happened in 2019. The recall is about what happened in 2018, and it was hardly noticed by the majority. What was VERY noticed is what happened in 2019 and is still being noticed…
Ryan
Not denying that, just weird that it would happen now. Was doing ok after my thyroid adjusted for the gross piss smelling tablets. I just didn’t have much of a choice since I can’t do armour, synthetics, and naturethroid is never available.
Dawn
Hi Ryan,
I’m curious why you couldn’t take Armour. Can you please explain why? Thank you.
Ryan
When I took it, even at doses my doc thought were adequate, it’ll cause me to feel flushed constantly and occasionally break out in hives. Taking an antihistamine would stop this, so I’m allergic to an active ingredient in it.
Karen Cole
Naturethroid is being tested, again. There’s quality issues. I can attest to that. Got TSH tested last wednesday,(because of all the physical issues we all have experienced, are experiencing), it was 22!, Last week, I found 2 different strengths in my bottle! (1 1/2 grain AND 1 3/4 grain!. Pills marked N150 AND N175).I couldn’t believe it. Went back to pharmacy–they opened the master bottle, and, yep, MIXED doses in the bottle. I reported it to RCL Labs and CVS Pharmacist reported it to corporate CVS. RCL has opened an investigation to see if its the plant that caused this, or an employee at CVS. The weird thing is, my TSH should have been low because of this mixture! That shows NONE of the strengths seem to be working!!I If anyone reading this is taking Naturethroid, I suggest switching to Armour/synthetic combo, but also, CHECK THE MARKING ON YOUR PILLS. If you have mixed dosages, PLEASE let us know on this website, and also call RCL Labs. And if it turns out it was not just my bottle, we should call the FDA. I found the mixture in a bottle of 97.5 (1 1/2 g) naturethroid.
Kathleen
I just received my recall notice from Rite Aid about 2018. So, what is happening with the 2019 meds? Clearly, something is wrong with them too. Assuming my prescriptions have been filled with pills from 2019 not 2018 – For the last 1.5 months I have been feeling horrible, similar to Karen’s description and the side effects are getting worse and worse daily. Now all these odd symptoms are making sense. Also I have had an odd feeling in my throat below my thyroid – like it had a vice on it. I was starting to think I had COVID. AND now my TSH is 0.17. My doctor just prescribed a lower dose but I’m skeptical about taking it. What are the FDA and Acella doing? What should we be doing?
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, something has clearly been wrong with NP thyroid even since last summer, and especially beginning by fall of 2019. Yet here we are with the recall only for what was made in 2018 and early 2019? No recall of what smells like cat pee, what caused a return of hypo, what was burning when swallowing, what was burning stomachs and causing nausea?? Nope, whatever is going on to allow all the latter speaks volumes about Acella and/or the FDA.
Starr D.
Hi, Ryan. Just wanted to say that I got terrible headaches from the NP, so bad that
I could hardly hold my head up–it was just like I had when I was originally diagnosed
with Grave’s Disease (autoimmune hyperthyroidism) years ago…I really didn’t need
to relive that kind of thing! Also from the NP, I would get that my eyes hurt really bad,
would get ear aches, stomach aches, and my neck hurt really bad like where the
thyroid gland would be, if I even had much of one left that works (which I don’t.)
At least some of my NP is involved in the recall, although I told Acella (the drug’s maker)
that I was getting the same symptoms from all the pills from them I was taking (60 mg,
and 30 mg, for sure.) –they noted this down when I called them, they said. I filed out
an FDA Medwatch report on this, too. Just wanted you to know that it’s possible to
get symptoms like this from the NP….mine gradually got better as I switched to something
else, though I’m still not well like I should be from my thyroid trouble, in general.
Ryan
That’s unfortunate. Any idea why switching hasn’t helped you? Is it the meds, the dose? Have you had your levels checked recently to see if you’re within range?
Janie Bowthorpe
FYI: it’s not about just being “within range”. We have to fall in a certain part of those ranges. This explains with many different kinds of labs: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/lab-values
Selene Seltzer
please see my comment dated June 9 above and comment from Annomaly, dated June 3, 2020 on this page
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Vincent Jericho
Regarding the recall. I have some of the “pee-smelling stuff” from last summer I refused to take. Called Walmart, they said they did not keep a record of lot# I received. It was “from too long ago”. I CANNOT believe they do not have lot #. I would think legally they have to keep them. I would like to get my money back from the 3 months of wasted pills. Anybody know if these lot #’s being recalled extend back to last year or is it from this year only? Also has NP cleaned up their act?
Starr D.
Hi, Vincent. My brother and I got our NP thyroid from Sam’s Club, which
you probably know is owned by Walmart. They also told us they don’t have
the lot numbers for any of the thyroid….it seems like over there, you only
get lot numbers if your medicine comes in one of those sealed bottles
from the manufacturer that probably has the lot number right on it. If
your medicine comes in the usual orange bottles that they fill, it doesn’t
seem like Sam’s Club, anyway, keeps a record of the lot numbers–and I
guess WalMart, too. I don’t know if this is typical of many pharmacies,
or what. But it should be changed, if it is. I also would’ve thought that
legally, they should keep a record of such things. There is some information
about lot numbers on the NP Thyroid Website….you can try to call them, too,
at 1-800-541-4802…it starts with a recording saying, “If you’re calling about the
NP thyroid recall”….and then you choose whatever number they tell you to.
They were more interested & helpful when I called a few days ago then they
were, today….someone might be able to tell you if your pills were involved.
I have to say, they only said one of my doses was–the 30 mg. pills, but I told
them I got the same side-effects from the 60 mg, too. They said they made a
note of this. Good luck.
Selene Seltzer
For info on Acella recall please see comment from Annomaly, dated June 3, 2020 on this page
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Mary
I just received a text message from my pharmacist about the “urgent recall.” I also was on NP Thyroid for most of last year through March 2020, with horrible hypothyroid symptoms, to the point that I was almost always totally exhausted, skipped much looked forward to holiday events because I was too exhausted, etc. my medicine was changed 2 & 1/2 months ago & I’m gradually improving, but still totally exhausted at times, still some muscle/joint pain, altho much improved. Also gained a significant amount of weight last year, & have lost perhaps 2 or 3 lbs. back since changing medicine, but not nearly all that I gained. My labs showed worse levels also. So, I concur that it didn’t seem at all “too potent,” but not potent enough. Thank you for your updates. Hope everyone is well.
Janie Bowthorpe
NP Thyroid has sucked since last Summer, and definitely since last early Fall. Have reported on this often and in the blog posts.
Linda
Acella’s admission that their NP Thyroid tablets had 115% of the labeled amount of Liothyronine (T3), while a long time in coming, didn’t match the symptoms that I, along with multitudes of others, have reported, i.e., major HYPOthyroid symptoms. Logically, the increase in T3 should have caused HYPERthyroid symptoms, or so I thought! HYPOthyroid symptoms caused by too much T3 made absolutely no sense to me so I decided to research T3 side effects that would explain the worst hypo symptoms I’ve ever had.
The websites I checked listed the same, mostly well known HYPERthyroid symptoms, except for one. Mayo Foundation for Medical Education and Research, in addition to the normal list of symptoms, provided info on allergies, drug interactions, other medical problems, precautions, etc. that I didn’t find elsewhere. Specifically, under PRECAUTIONS, it says,
“THIS MEDICINE MAY CAUSE SEVERE HYPOTHYROIDISM, CALLED MYXEDEMA COMA, WHICH MAY BE LIFE-THREATENING AND REQUIRES IMMEDIATE MEDICAL ATTENTION. Check with your doctor right away if you have the following symptoms: weakness, confusion or non-responsiveness, feeling cold, low body temperature, swelling of the body, especially the face, tongue, and lower legs, or difficulty breathing.”
“. . . Check with your doctor right away if you notice any changes in your sugar levels.”
Although the majority of my symptoms were hypo (including some listed above), I did experience a few hyper symptoms which I attributed to a common heart rhythm problem (PSVT). I am not diabetic, but for the first time in my life I experienced what appeared to be severe reactive hypoglycemia. Theses companies that make this garbage is putting our lives in danger and someone needs to pay, especially since money is the only thing they understand! I’m done with this garbage/poison – I’ll get all future thyroid meds from a compounding pharmacy – and hope for the best! That is until some bureaucrat decides to screw that up too.
K Baylis
Just read the NP Thyroid recall by Acella. I resent being gaslighted. If there was too much T3 in recent batches, then why have I gained 10 lbs in 8 weeks–remaining as active and eating the same (normal, not excessive) amount as I did when I started taking NP Thyroid in the summer of 2019 and was finally losing weight?
Janie Bowthorpe
Yup, it’s a bit off, for sure, when NP has done nothing but make a huge body of people sick and hypo…as they have reported.
Mary
And labwork showed much increased tsh, low ft3, ft4, plus many worsened hypo symptoms: fatigue, weight gain, joint/muscle pain, etc., etc. So at least last year & early this year’s batches seemed not potent enough. There were shortages in previous years of nature thyroid where sometimes the pharmacies were completely out of the medication for periods of time.
K Baylis
Has anyone had Naturethroid and NP Thyroid pills from an old (good) batch and the new (bad) batches tested by an independent lab to see what exactly changed? Obviously we can’t trust the manufacturers to be truthful with us, so the only other alternative is an independent lab to tell us why the sudden loss of effectiveness. I’m tired of the roller coaster ride of finally feeling like myself again–-mentally alert, energetic, weight coming off–-then suddenly crashing when the formula is changed. Added to that is the sudden increase in cost of NDT as opposed to the synthetics, even with insurance or GoodRX. Generic levo is dirt cheap in comparison to the “reduced” price of every one of the NDTs–-and the full price is through the roof.
I’m not one who automatically jumps to the conspiracy conclusion, but this domino effect of NDT meds going bad almost sounds like the Synthroid and generic levothyroxine “Pharma Bros“ trying to increase sales of their pills, which do not work for a majority of thyroid patients, through some means or other, by totally discreditIng NDT meds which have worked beautifully for over a hundred years.
Sorry to vent, but I’m frustrated by two years of this unnecessary monkeying with thyroid meds. Naturethroid going south ruined my last year of grad school, and now NP Thyroid is doing the same for my post-grad job search. You cannot be sluggish and have brain fog when you’re writing your thesis or going on interviews (in person or on Zoom).
Laura
Thank you so much for all these information
My endocrino just prescribed me NP thyroid Last Friday because all the side effects I suffered from previous treatments.I had Graves for two years and few months later Hashimoto started to affect me. My antibodies are >600 and My Tsh went up to 8.5 recently. So my endocrino gave me Tirosint 25mg last February. I had strong headaches and neck pain so she gave me Porcine Thyroid 30 mg. I quickly felt great but 4weeks later I had severe pains around the stomach area and felt suddenly very tired. The next day, I had strong palpitations, lightheaded, strong fatigue, muscles weakness, hot then cold feelings, metallic tastes, shaking, tremors..I did blood test that did not reveal something wrong.Then My endocrino asked me to stop the porcine and to take Synthroid 50. I felt dizzy and completely tired.So i tried 25mcg but still have strong headaches and neck pain.Tired, I called another endocrino. She gave Levothyroxine 25mcg (1/2) but then changed because of gluten and the headaches, eye pains…she gave me Unithroid 25mcg and it was aweful.Mood changes, headache, very tired , water retention, lightheaded etc…so I stopped it and tried again Levo 25mcg.So My endocrino wanted me to try NP Thyroid.I refused and wait for her answer. Actually, I feel very exhausted even if my Labs seem great. In fact I read the previous infos regarding the adrenal distress and realized that I experienced all these symptoms. I actually take Active Adrenal with great hopes. In fact I already have the same two years ago and no doctors explained what I had.they did many exams (MRI, Xrays, bloodworks…) and went to ER. They wanted me to take antidepressants but I was absolutely not depressed. By surfing on the net, I suspected an Adrenal fatigue and bought Active Adrenal . But today I do not know what to do , I don’t want to take NP thyroid, Some of synthetic treatments give me strong headaches eye pains..maybe Armour? I am lost. Sorry for this long post.Thank you so much in advance
chris
I have eye pains too, over my right eye and I’ve been getting headaches for a few weeks now really badly (with they eye pain).
I just got the recall call today but I never thought about my eye pain with this.
thanks,
Janie Bowthorpe
NP Thyroid has sucked since last Summer, Chris. The recall is basically old news for those who figured out when it started to suck.
Ryan
I have eye pain over my right eye as well! I’m on 1x60mg 1x15mg NP right now. Have had weird blurred vision issues, or tension headaches. Feeling of being dizzy or lightheaded, like I’m mildly intoxicated. Started about two… two and a half weeks ago? I thought I injured my neck but there’s no pain. Then I got the recall text from my pharmacist and I’m wondering if it’s the meds doing it. I thought I was dying at one point due to all the crazy covid crap going on. Almost felt like a fever, but no thermometer showed me to have an elevated temp.
Janie Bowthorpe
The recall is about what happened in 2018, and hardly noticed by the vast majority. What you are experiencing is from what happened in 2019 and is STILL causing people problems….
Kristi
Hi. I have questions. I reported the NP Thyroid change in November of last year, twice, to Acella. Got the blow off of nothing changed except suppliers. I kept having terrible stomach issues, pain, burning, nausea, etc. so within the same week I reported my issues to Medwatch. I finally had to see my gastroenterologist which placed me on nexium (did not help) & agreed it was probably the medication since my stomach was fine before. My primary care is fantastic and put me on Tirosint to try and for some reason T4 drops my levels so fast that I end up borderline hyperthyroid & my skin gets super itchy/burns. She said it was probably too strong (30mg) & placed me back on Armour (30mg) which I had been on before. My functional medicine physician had made the switch from Armour to NP the previous year due to less fillers & I felt better on NP until the “supplier” change. Still struggling with stomach issues. So here we are with the NP recall due to 115% more T3 than normal. What kind of damage has this done to our bodies…heart, stomach, etc.? I’m frustrated that my stomach is still having issues from NP & it’s scary to know how badly people were overdosed on T3. Anyone know the long term damage it has done? I do not trust “Big Pharma” at all. I plan on letting my primary care know & go from there. At this point, I would love to no longer be on thyroid medication because I do not trust the pharmaceutical companies. It’s all about the money. Has anyone had any luck with the thyroid supplement that uses bovine from New Zealand? Why can’t Armour reformulate without all of the fillers? They have been around for many years & know many thyroid patients struggle with filler ingredients. Any suggestions/recommendations? Thanks in advance.
Karen
The FDA has recalled np thyroid. Just wanted to let you know.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi and thanks. Yes, reported it yesterday on the STTM Facebook page. You can see all the interesting comments, too. https://www.facebook.com/StoptheThyroidMadness/posts/10156907431202721?__xts__%5B0%5D=68.ARCpFGrZAJMiZ5zRHXgNiTS4JsHpHC8LtpJwxRjCxA_456gD_HGWuDCbD7r1ZIXiWQpJJGFhIYniQBB4-_uRgR4nLqe8tBF-jWYYbzvdTWzB8gJHUEdGfUKMVGx6uANqndxMuO32ActvELkwKr0NttOlkbk0Yb0W0a0lp6i7jqWFaP9-gMlR0LpTzhxEMG4mTun3i3rt4ZxnDCotLDdipAvH7Foi7eKzboSXqLbFl684ZRMJ_wHEvOsHqh3dagoleUFXZCYuOfecOmoMao16mmTYa41l95Ue9cn9YqoZ8gKXwvKX-NNt-6AnuG-ekqyzUJT3VPUhTKYK-Jl7&__tn__=-R
Ryan
So I’m curious. Where does that leave us with meds?
Janie Bowthorpe
Read this and scroll down: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Emma
Hmm… When, a couple of years ago, I reported getting very sick on NP Acella, I was told on this very same forum that it was not possible and that NP Acella was the superior NDT treatment. It really made me feel the same way I felt in so many endo offices being told that levothyroxine is the holy grail. Just having a little “told you so” moment here…
Janie Bowthorpe
Emma, are you normally this condescending and rude? First, when you got sick “a couple of years ago”, absolutely no one was reporting getting sick then. Acella was in fact a very superior NDT which had been changing lives…as was explained to you. That doesn’t mean you didn’t get sick, but again, not one single person was reporting getting sick then. What has gone on with NP lately only started to happen in Summer of 2019, but more so in the Fall of 2019 and to this day. So instead of your “told you so”, try to be a little more open-minded as to what may be going on now for many, not then.
Kay Porky
I received an email from Acella stating the problem with NP started in Fall of 2018, NOT 2019. So Emma reporting problems “a few years ago” IS correct. I was having problems, too, back in 2018, I just never “reported” it on this website before.
Janie Bowthorpe
The problem is that hardly anyone was having problems in 2018, even though you were. And another issue is that some people blame NP for problems before 2019, which were actually the result of NP revealing a cortisol problem, or the patient being underdosed. But the vast majority were having major problems in 2019 starting in the summer and especially by Fall.
Toni
I was having problems in 2018 I was in the hospital because of it and I reported this to Acella. They told me they never heard of such symptoms. It was confirmed by the hospital and my doctor it was from NP thyroid.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Toni. I believe you when you say you were having problems. But those kind of problems can also happen when someone is using NDT alongside a cortisol problem, i.e. the problems are revealing a cortisol issue.
Or, someone can have problems due to never having been truly optimal with their free T3 and free T4. That usually results in a backfire.
So we end up having to look for more consistent reports implying a product was itself bad. And that wasn’t there in 2018. But the consistency did start to appear around the summer of 2019, and then very strongly by the fall.
All in all, 2018 was being reported as a good year for NP by fellow patients as long as they didn’t have a cortisol issue, and were truly optimal. And doctors nor hospitals don’t tend the understand that either of these issues (a cortisol problem or not having optimal frees) can result in problems.
Beth T
Oh no! Recalls on some lots of NP Thyroid issued by the FDA on Friday, 5/22/20:
https://www.fda.gov/safety/recalls-market-withdrawals-safety-alerts/acella-pharmaceuticals-llc-issues-voluntary-nationwide-recall-certain-lots-np-thyroidr-thyroid?utm_campaign=NP%20Thyroid%20by%20Acella&utm_medium=email&utm_source=Eloqua
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Beth and thanks! It was posted yesterday on the STTM facebook page. You can see all the comments about it here: https://www.facebook.com/StoptheThyroidMadness/posts/10156907431202721?__xts__%5B0%5D=68.ARCpFGrZAJMiZ5zRHXgNiTS4JsHpHC8LtpJwxRjCxA_456gD_HGWuDCbD7r1ZIXiWQpJJGFhIYniQBB4-_uRgR4nLqe8tBF-jWYYbzvdTWzB8gJHUEdGfUKMVGx6uANqndxMuO32ActvELkwKr0NttOlkbk0Yb0W0a0lp6i7jqWFaP9-gMlR0LpTzhxEMG4mTun3i3rt4ZxnDCotLDdipAvH7Foi7eKzboSXqLbFl684ZRMJ_wHEvOsHqh3dagoleUFXZCYuOfecOmoMao16mmTYa41l95Ue9cn9YqoZ8gKXwvKX-NNt-6AnuG-ekqyzUJT3VPUhTKYK-Jl7&__tn__=-R
Carol
Acella has a recall on some of their NP lots but I don’t think it’s any of the lots that were posted on here. The reason is super potency of the T3. The expiration dates range from June 2020 through December 2020. This is the time when so many of us started having problems with it. It was posted on the FDA website today and, unfortunately, I couldn’t get the link to post.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. It was posted on the STTM Facebook page May 22nd. You can see it and all the comments here: https://www.facebook.com/StoptheThyroidMadness/posts/10156907431202721?__xts__%5B0%5D=68.ARCpFGrZAJMiZ5zRHXgNiTS4JsHpHC8LtpJwxRjCxA_456gD_HGWuDCbD7r1ZIXiWQpJJGFhIYniQBB4-_uRgR4nLqe8tBF-jWYYbzvdTWzB8gJHUEdGfUKMVGx6uANqndxMuO32ActvELkwKr0NttOlkbk0Yb0W0a0lp6i7jqWFaP9-gMlR0LpTzhxEMG4mTun3i3rt4ZxnDCotLDdipAvH7Foi7eKzboSXqLbFl684ZRMJ_wHEvOsHqh3dagoleUFXZCYuOfecOmoMao16mmTYa41l95Ue9cn9YqoZ8gKXwvKX-NNt-6AnuG-ekqyzUJT3VPUhTKYK-Jl7&__tn__=-R
SUSAN M HALL
I just got off of a tele-medicine call with Dr. Edelberg @ WholeHealth Chicago. I am going to switch from NP Thyroid to a T4/T3 combination of Synthroid & Cytomel. I’ve been up and down like a yoyo on various NDT’s i.e. Naturethroid and NP Thyroid and am extremely frustrated to say the least.
I had a total thyroidectomy in 2004. I’ve been a runner all of my life and currently it’s exhausting to even run .5 mile, notwithstanding all of the other symptoms like air hunger, hair loss, weight gain and muscle aches.
If you are looking for a functional medicine doctor, Dr. Edelberg does consultations and prescriptions via tele-medicine. I saw him in person in Chicago in January. I live in Pennsylvania and had gone thru six different doctors/endocrinologists before I found him. He mentioned the STTM website on his blog which is how I came to find him. Highly recommended.
Lynn
Would love to hear how you are doing on synthroid/cytomel. I have also been all over the place with thyroid medications since Naturethroid went south for me last July and then NP in September after a good month and then the refill with the bad smell and symptoms restarted, Armour in December and synthetic T3/T4 compounded. Synthroid/cytomel is the only combination I haven’t tried yet.
Janie Bowthorpe
Lynn, Armour works if you get optimal. Same with compounded synthetics. Are you not raising enough to get there? https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Lynn
I made an apt with a new Dr who thought that Naturethroid had some challenges when it came back in stock with potency but they have since worked it out. Has anyone else heard this?
Janie Bowthorpe
Naturethroid is not the same good NDT it used to be. Many are seeing a return of their hypo. Those that think they aren’t…are in for bad surprise…not opinion, but what we’re seeing. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Bob
Last time I used Armour I could never get is does right with either more of it or less. Always felt over medicated on Armour since it changed in 2014. Before that it worked great, moved to Nature Throid and when that went south moved to NP Thyroid and that went really bad in Dec. of 2019. Really sad to see how many suffer needlessly over something that has worked so well in the past.
Janie Bowthorpe
True, it’s horrible to see all these NDT’s go south. It’s also uncomfortable seeing many who “think” they are doing well on them (Naturethroid, NP, WP, etc) only to find out the hard way they are destined to see a return of hypo, if not stressed adrenals. I’m seeing this in my own current doctor. She’s not ready to believe it.
BUT…the current Armour is working well for patients again. So is T4 and T3. But for either, you have to understand the goal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal Staying with non-optimal frees, especially the free T3, sets you up for a crash, sooner or later. The individuality is when it goes south.
Susan M Hall
I’m currently on a combination dose of Synthroid 150 mcg and Cytomel 5 mcg three (3) times a day @ wake up, noon and bedtime. Cautiously optimistic. I will do labs around August 3, 2020 (5 weeks out) and report back results FT3, FT4 & RT3 & iron labs.
I also started a liquid iron supplement Floradix Floravital Iron and Herbs Liquid Extract Formula with B12.
I added Celtic Sea Salt 1/2 teaspoon in one cup of water in the morning & 1 teaspoon of ground milk thistle from organic milk thistle seeds that I ordered from nuts.com
As an aside I walked 76 miles in June or around 4 miles a day 4-5 times a week. Not running yet but I hope to start running again in a week or so once the new thyroid hormone changes kick in.
Janie Bowthorpe
Sounds like you are on a good road!
Do know that your ratio of Synthroid (T4) versus T3 is off. You should be on more T3 and less T4. For example, one grain of desiccated thyroid, which is a combination of T4 and T3 (and the lesser thyroid hormones) is 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcgs T3. So two grains of desiccated thyroid would be 76 mcgs T4 and 18 mcgs T3. 3 grains would be 114 mcg T4 and 27 mcg T3. You can see by the latter you’re on too much T4 and not enough T3. And it’s not being on enough T3 that is the biggest problem.
Granted, the purpose of T4, which is a storage hormone, is to convert to T3, the active hormone. But there are too many things in life that can block that conversion. So we need to have the right amount of/more direct T3 when those situations happen.
When taking the two synthetics, you may not get to those exact numbers. But you want to be as close as possible. You may have to firmly teach your doctor about this. They are so firmly trained about the use of nothing but T4, that they are a bit scared of T3 and too often don’t give enough.
And remember that your goal is to get optimal. It’s not just how you feel. You will feel good before your frees are optimal, but you still need to get them optimal. Don’t make the mistake so many make by stopping their raises when they feel good. Those feelgoods can eventually backfire unless you get those frees optimal. This explains: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
If the four needed iron labs proved you have non-optimal iron levels, read this page:https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/iron
Finally, milk thistle can slightly lower iron levels. That’s why we always take a little iron with it. But if you were taking that iron to raise inadequate iron levels, you might not want to be on the milk thistle right now. Or you can stay on the milk thistle if you have a reason to be on it (usually to treat stressed liver or help lower high rt3), and take the higher amount of iron as shown on the latter iron page.
Michele
Like others, I’ve been through the changes of Armour, Erfa, and now NP. I am done even though I wish I could go back to Armour, my level of trust with these companies is zero. I just got Rx’d Synthroid (brand name) and I have leftover Cynomel and am trying that and will re-test after 2 months. I don’t feel great on it, not like NDT and it will be interesting to see how it goes. I just got (with insurance at Walmart) 135 50mcg tablets of Synthoid for $184! You’ve got to be kidding. GoodRx and the other one on TV both were rejected with newly printed off coupons as of today. No good. Would have been $209 without insurance. I wish I could trust Armour, but someone said it’s even more expensive, and the fillers in the generics don’t work for me, nor the dyes. This is so sad.
Janet
Michele, you might want to give the Armour a try again. I didn’t tolerate it a few years ago but am doing well with it now. I had to increase it by 15 mg over my previous NP dose but numbers look good and I feel okay. I’ve been through all the different brands and combinations, too. I’m good with Synthroid allergy-wise, but not any of the synthetic T3s (I’m very allergic to calcium sulfate fillers). It’s amazing how your life can be turned upside with one small change.
Nancy F.
I was reading some other sites and it was mentioned about reporting to the FDA medwatch [you can get a form online], to report NP thyroid and how Acella stated there was no change in formula but people are getting sick and it now smells and tastes like cat pee. Would that help.
Nancy F.
Oops sorry I meant bovine thyroid from cows.
Nancy F.
I also have had reactions from the change with the NP thyroid. And I also called the company, I did reach someone and they did state that their supplier for porcine thyroid they were now getting from Europe, They were manufacturing it still in their plant in Georgia and nothing else was changed except where they get the thyroid. What do you think about using a thyroid that comes from iodine (cows). Has anybody tried that.
kurt
Guess im the oddball here (again). Im still using NP thyroid and feel good if I get enough sleep, (i’m a night owl). I get them in original bottles of 100/ 60mg pills from Target CVS. I take them sublingually as I have for years.There was some sort of “blip” in my symptoms around summer 2019, must have been one odd bottle. I’ve been on the same dose for 1.5 years. I am 100% gluten free, maybe thats the difference.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Kurt. Just beware. The percentage is extremely high as far as people not doing well on NP at all, whether gluten free or not. And it appears that some think they are doing well due to being fooled by the climb of cortisol and even adrenaline (due to the body being alarmed about the poor efficacy of NP). As a result, a major crash comes with stressed adrenals.
Starr D.
Has anyone filed a lawsuit against Acella for their NP thyroid with the European porcine?
I tried to look this up online, and I’m not finding anything. I had a really bad time with it in
August and September of 2019. I’m still not well, but Armours right now seems to work
better for me than my last NP batches. Man, that stuff was awful for some of us.
Beth
I am so disappointed to read this info on NT. I have been on cytomel and synthroid. My doctor just prescribed NT yesterday and I was so excited to try it. Is it even worth trying, or should I just continue on the cytomel/synthroid combination?
Janie Bowthorpe
Based on the high amount of patient reports, I wouldn’t and just get those frees optimal on the two synthetics. Lots of people are feeling great on them if they do. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
DelAnn
Is there a link to the posted lot numbers of reported bad NP pills that has been updated since September 2019? If so would you please post it. Thank you.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. Go to the STTM blog posts–there’s one right after this post and should be mentioned in the title.
Chris
So what should people who want to try NDT medcations do?
Janie Bowthorpe
Scroll down on this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Michelle
This news about NP thyroid is very disheartening. As many have stated, I had the same experience with Armour after fighting to find a doctor that would prescribe an ndt instead of awful Synthroid. Armour worked great until it suddenly didn’t. Switched to NP thyroid and got better for a while just to end up back where I started again- with relentless fatigue, weight gain, muscle aches, constipation, brain fog, and hair loss. A new endo dr insisted my symptoms are hyper instead of hypo and lowered my dose. Now I’m having scary heart palpitations, labored breathing, and dizziness. My endo’s response is to lower my dose more, which I know is not the answer. But what else is there since all of the other NDTs went south already? I don’t want to go back to synthroid and all of their mystery ever-changing fillers. I’ve tried a compounded form of T3 and T4 and ended up sick to my stomach. Maybe if enough of us lodge complaints, we can make something happen. I’ll join the effort and contact them tomorrow.
Ash
I had one of the stinky bottles mentioned earlier but refilled my script on 04/03/2020 and the pills do not smell anymore! Hopefully, this means they have made some adjustments for the better this time.
Janie Bowthorpe
Unfortunately, no. It means they have been trying to cover up the crap inside. Lots of patients still having the same problem. NP Thyroid is just not worth it anymore, say patients.
Irene
mine still stinks, I just got my refill last week.
Lynn
Thank you Janie fior all you are doing for everyone. I have been trying Armour with cytomel and can’t seem to make head way. Here are my latest labs on Armour 30:
T4 – 1.0 (.8-1.8)
T3 – 3.1 (2.3 – 4.2)
T3 reverse – 12 (8-25)
And I am also showing EBV antigen if that makes a difference.
When I try and raise, I get more joint pain, fatigue and hair loss. I understand I may have a cortisol problem from the bad naturethroid and then the bad NP but I don’t seem to be able to tolerate adrenal cortex or holy basil. I tried t3 only and couldn’t raise because it made me dizzy. So now I am back trying t3- 5 mcg/t4 19 mcg synthetic combo and I have a terrible headache, can barely see and my body feels like it’s weighed down. This has been going on for 9 months now and I’ve lost hope. I think my doctor is frustrated with me and thinks I am almost optimal so maybe it is EBV. I have been researching and trying to get myself out of this mess but I get nowhere. I was on NT 1 grain for 6 years without a problem and she can’t explain why I would now be closer to 1/2 grain as a curative dose. Can some people lose the ability to tolerate any medicine and if yes, what do they do? Would it hurt me to stop everything and see what happens? It can’t be worse than this.
Janie Bowthorpe
Did you test reactivated EBV? You can show EBV exposure in the past, but that doesn’t mean it’s activated now. So if you did the right one, what active EBV can do is raise that RT3. And yours is trending upwards. RT3 can also go up from inadequate iron or high cortisol.
We all have to do a saliva test to see exactly what is going on. Guessing doesn’t work. And that may be why you felt you didn’t do well on ACE, not because you don’t tolerate it, but you used it wrong, or needed something different. And only saliva testing will show what is wrong, thus what to treat.
Lynn
Thanks Janie! I have done two saliva tests thru ZRT. The last one being 1/26/20:
DHEA 1.6L
Morning 8.8
Noon 3.4
Evening 1.2
Night 1.5
The EBV was Early Antigen D result >150.00 H
My last iron test was 11/23/19:
Iron 130 ug
Transferrin saturation 43%
TIBC 301.ug
Ferritin 84 ng
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. You didn’t put ranges. Always need them. I’m guessing your morning is slightly low i.e not at the top area. Can’t tell about noon without the range. Is it high? Evening, which is afternoon (hate that they call it evening. lol) looks just a tad under midrangewhere it should be. Night looks high. Am I close?? If so, that is a seesaw pattern, meaning a stress pattern, and needs adaptogens like ashwaghanda, l-theanine, lemon balm etc three times a day to help even them out, and holy basil before bedtime for just a few weeks.
Iron was high. Were you on iron supps?
Lynn
Sorry about the ranges.
Morning 8.8 (3.7-9.5) was 7.6 on 9/22/19
Noon 3.4 (1.2 -3.0) was 1.8
Evening 1.2 (.6 – 1.9) was 1.2
Night 1.5 (.4 – 1.0) was 1.5
I did not feel while when I tried holy basil last year so want to avoid that one if possible.
I was not on iron supplements.
Janie Bowthorpe
L, H, L, H. Adaptogens 3 times a day.
One of what’s here one hour before bedtime: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ps Only for a few weeks.
Treat whatever is stressing you.
Kay Roberts
Dear Janie,
I ordered the adrenal test and the results for me as of yesterday….
DHEA low <1.0 2-23 age ….68
Morning low 6.5
Noon low 2.3
Evening high 3.1
Bed high 0.8
Same range value as Lynn’s
Last night ordered the ps and holy basil from amazon…coming Monday.
I have had vertigo for 4 solid months and so many of poor Lynn’s symptoms. Couldn’t raise or lower thyroid hormones.
Totally bed bound. Thank you so much for helping so many people!…the ability to test at home right now is invaluable.
Btw, I have late stage Lyme coinfections, as well….but my adrenals appear, for lack of some extensive testing….to be my problem. Hope the adaptogens help.
Again thank you. Kay
Ps to Lynn….I always have high antibodies to EBV ….also have HV6….taking high dose acyclovir. For decades. Watching reruns of the office to cheer me up…..also blogging office ladies. 😷
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Kay. Where results are low, we need cortisol to replace what’s not there, not adaptogens. We can’t get out of our hypothyroid state without the right amount of cortisol to assist in carrying thyroid hormones to the cells. Where results are high, then targeted adaptogens like Holy Basil etc. After we get out of our hypo state and get our frees optimal, we can start a wean off the cortisol and cortisol lowering adaptogens.
Amy the Anomaly
HELP!!! Here we go again! I have been deeply, adversely affected by the changes in Armour and Naturethroid over the past few years, and now it’s happening again with NP Thyroid. Got a new batch on March 12, 2020 and now two weeks later, all of my hypo symptoms have returned and I can barely walk! One of the most obvious places on my body that reveals a thyroid medication problem is my legs. My calf muscles lock up, have sharp pains running through them, and feel as though I have rigor mortis. There is a sense that the muscles have absolutely no elasticity and will tear if I use them. I can barely walk. This is unbearable and has stopped my life, yet again. I also have weight gain, severe bloating, insomnia, racing heart, hip, knee, and joint pain…the works! Can someone please suggest alternative medicine(s)? I know what works for one may not work for another, but I truly need suggestions. I don’t know what to even consider. I can’t live like this. I can’t believe this has happened AGAIN and the company behaves like nothing has changed. Obviously the outsourcing to Europe has changed some critical component(s) of NP, and the company won’t admit it. Please be specific with possible suggestions. I live in Maryland. Thank you!!
Janie Bowthorpe
Alternatives on this continually updated page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Jeni
So I commented back in the fall when I had a major crisis and figured out it was due to the Acella NP issue (I had been taking it for years and was doing pretty well on it). I had switched to Armour just to rule out the Acella NP and that’s how i figured it out. I decided the Armour was obviously better than the horrible things that were happening to me on the latest NP garbage, but I had many hypo symptoms happening. So I went to my dr and she agreed that after looking at my current bloodwork (below) I could switch to a synthetic combo T4/T3 and suggested I do a compounded. So that’s what I did. Here’s what it was on Armour:
TSH 1.09
FreeT4 .8 (.68-1.51)
FreeT3 2.4 (1.7-3.7)
A little over a month into the compounded synthetic and I was literally falling asleep at my teaching desk every day and could not get through the day without caffeine. It was bad. I also felt as if I was gaining a pound a day. I returned to my dr and she said lets do some blood work.
Well bloodwork came back and TSH lowered, FT4 is the same, and FT3 actually increased. Here are numbers on Compounded Synthetic T4/T3(below)
TSH .75
FreeT4 .8 (.68-1.51)
Free T3 3.5(1.7-3.7)
So why the heck did I feel like such crap? So tired, no energy and gaining weight if FT3 had increased?
She won’t increase it, just said the compounded synthetic must not be agreeing with me, so I could go back to Armour, wait a few weeks, recheck bloodwork then go from there.
Help-I just don’t know what to do ! Ugh..
Janie Bowthorpe
When you were on Armour, you were underdosed!!! So of course you still had symptoms of hypo.
And because of having been on the bad NP for a certain length of time, followed by being underdosed on Armour for another certain length of time, your compounded labs now reveal you are pooling that free T3 due to a cortisol problem.
Read about pooling here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/pooling
And read where you should have had those labs went on armour here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
But because you now have stressed adrenals, you’re going to have to correct that: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-imfo
Jeni
That’s what I figured…pooling because of stressed adrenals-thank you for confirming that. I’m not surprised that’s the issue..being on that NP and not sleeping or eating for months and having major anxiety and depression due to that horrible med I’m SURE stressed my adrenals to the max on top of being under dosed afterwards. Not going to be easy to deal with this when I can’t really get to the doctor or lab due to this pandemic and quarantine…ugh. I’m back on Armour, so obviously still under dosed, but probably need to stay that way until I can get my adrenals the help they need, correct? Then increase my dose?
My adrenals were tested a year ago and were in good shape (before the NP mess), do you think a high quality adrenal supplement will help during the time being until getting to a dr. and doing lab work etc. is a possibility? It could be weeks or months and I want to do something to be proactive and help give my adrenals some support. Thank you SO much for your help!
Janie Bowthorpe
You don’t treat adrenals from a test that’s a year old. Your adrenals can be very different now. We have to redo and only saliva: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/saliva-cortisol
Jeni
Completely agree.. but getting to my doctor to get evaluated and get a test ordered is not happening right now with all that is going on. Do you know of a company where I can order my own online and they will send me thekit and later the test results?
Otherwise I’m going to need to get on some herbal supplements to support my adrenals, because staying this way is just no good :(.
Jennifer Megge
Hi Janie, hoping you can help. Here are my lab tests from the past year. Back in October I had been doing great for years on Acella NP but some depression/anxiety amongst horrible other symptoms had started since the new batch, but my thyroid numbers were still not bad, I had been at my best weight ever for years and the least amount of thyroid symptoms. October is when I was suspecting maybe something was up with NP, and in late November had my dr switch me to Armour just to see. All my depression/anxiety craziness stopped, but my numbers tanked. Hypo symptoms of dry skin, weight gain, dry hair, tiredness , muscle aches began. So then went to a synthetic compounded combo for a bit. Symptoms continued and I was falling asleep at my desk, so she put me back on Armour. Just had my numbers checked again to see where to go from here. I do not feel good on Armour. I was waking up with zero energy. You helped me to see that it looks like pooling is happening so I ordered a test during this pandemic and just received my results. Cortisol is okay, but high in evening and night. Which goes along with major hunger at night too.
Any thoughts, where do I go from here? Trying to get to my doctor is a joke, and it is all telehealth right now. Could high evening/night cortisol be the reason for the weight I’m gaining and the pooling? I have not changed my eating and I am packing it on quickly, have little energy, don’t wake refreshed, and no libido. What the heck should I do from here? She is willing to put me on synthetic combo of t4/t3 like synthroid/cytomel next if need be.Thank you for your time. Here are all my lab results.
FT4 (.7-1.5) FT3 (1.7-3.7) TSH (.4-4.5)
Oct 2019 (NP Acella 90) 1.1 3.5 .29
Jan 2020 (Armour 90) .8 2.4 1.09
Mar 2020 (compounded .8 3.5 .75
synthetic combo T4/T3)
May 8 (back on Armour) .7 3.2 .6
ZRT CORTISOL RESULTS
DHEAS 10.1 (2-23)
Morning 6.0 (3.7-9.5)
Noon 2.2 (1.2-3.0)
Evening 2.0 (.6-1.9)
Night 1.0 (.4-1.0)
Jay
I will be switching from NP to Armour soon and am concerned…………..can I ask how much Armour you were taking per day?
Jeni
I’m taking 1 1/2 grains of Armour
Janie Bowthorpe
That is underdosing you. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
jjmegge2@gmail.com
But I can’t have my Armour raised (or go back to the synthetic compounded) until my adrenals are in better shape, correct?
Ugh-it’s like the chicken and the egg 🙁
Janie Bowthorpe
Correct. We have to have the right amount of cortisol to get optimal with our frees without problems.
Gail
Is anyone on compounded NDT? How are you doing? Something seems different with my last refill and I confirmed they are using a new lot of the thyroid USP powder. Just wondering if it’s me or if others are having problems with compounded now too.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes there have been some who have noticed that their compounded porcine powder went south…
Lynn
When will the bad porcine affect Armour? It must be using USP powder too.
Janie Bowthorpe
Armour is supposedly from US pigs. They appear to have a source. But time will tell…..
catherine
I am on compounded porcine NDT. Someone on this board had mentioned ractopamine fed to the pigs and it stuck with me as a possibility as it is the same substance used in meth amphetamines.I noticed with the last two batches that I wake up with a small amount of thick yellow concentrated phlegm in the back of my throat and the taste of it seems to coat my teeth. My thyroid antibodies were negative on my recent test but I suspect that my thyroid is under attack from the pills. I have had this happen in the past when on bad medication/Np thyroid. Dont know what to do as if I switch to synthetic my immune system will crash and leave me more vulnerable to the coronavirus. I am just recovering from the virus and have no sense of smell at this time. Just concerned as I am not sure if I am rotting my teeth away. This happened with NP thyroid as well and went away when I switched to compounded porcine NDT compounded with glycine. A lot of enamel stripped off when on NP thyroid.
Anyone else have this small amount of thick yellow phlegm in back of throat and strange taste when running their tongue over their front teeth?
Yemi
Thank you for this article! I’ve been on Acella since the spring of 2018. It worked great for me. I got pregnant March 2019 and was about 4 or 5 months pregnant when the shortage occurred and everything had been going well. Thankfully two different friends of mine who had also tried Acella had extra bottles of it and gave me their medication to see me through. When I finally received the new medication I started taking it the last 4 weeks of my pregnancy, two weeks into it my doctors saw my baby’s stomach had stopped growing and told me they needed to take her out early. There’s no way to prove this is because the medication changed but until I saw this article I couldn’t figure out why all of a sudden my baby had stopped growing. Thankfully even though she was born small and early she was healthy. I have a feeling because of my friends, I could continue the old medication long just enough to get me to that point. I can’t imagine what could have happened had I changed to the newer version earlier, perhaps things would have had a different ending. I’m grateful that it all turned out ok. I’m just sharing my experience here in case it can help anyone. Thank you Janie for your work!!!
Janie Bowthorpe
Whoa. I know it’s true that correlation doesn’t always imply causation, but that does make one wonder…. So glad your dear one turned out ok.
Mary
I’ve also had worsening hypo symptoms since being changed to np thyroid last year. Last week I was prescribed Cytomel & had nausea & vomiting. I was hopeful that it would help as even the 1st day felt a slight improvement in symptoms. Any suggestions on dealing with the nausea would be appreciated. Thank you
Janie Bowthorpe
Not sure why Cytomel would cause nausea and vomiting? Maybe it’s a lingering effect from how bad NP was for you, and others?
Mary
The pharmacist said he has heard of this happening at 1st until the body acclimates to actually having enough t3. He suggested asking for a prescription for Zofran, which my dr sent in today. I took 1/2 of a 5 mcg with the Zofran & did okay this afternoon. I read about the t3 pooling & think I may have had this previously (currently just low t3, but fairly certain I have a cortisol issue due to stress & early morning migraines) Do you know if rt3 just clears out on it’s own if the cortisol issue is resolved? Thank you so much for this wonderful website – it is helping me so much better understand the thyroid symptoms I’ve been living with, & gives me hope that perhaps I will one day be “optimal” too.
Mary
I read that there was an fda recall for a supplier of ndt in September 2018, & then an np thyroid recall in July 2019. My insurance stopped covering Armour around July 2019 & so I was changed to np Thyroid. I noticed extreme fatigue, muscle & joint aches, weight gain, etc. worsened late last summer but thought it was related to ongoing stress. Over the holidays I had a few infections & was so exhausted I stayed home from planned holiday outings. Finally last month a doctor ordered thyroid blood work & my numbers were a lot worse, so I was changed about a week & a half ago to other medicines. Thank you for posting about this so we know this is a possible factor
I don’t recall exact dates but recall there was a shortage of some of the other ndt’s in 2017/2018 because the pharmacies were sometimes out of the medications & I’d sometimes have to go a short time with no medicine.
Janie Bowthorpe
Never heard of a recall of NP Thyroid. But it’s lousy anyway now.
Jenny
I’m possibly a little late to this particular ‘party’ but reading comments feel less that I may be going mad at least ! I discovered NP around 1 1/2 to 2 years ago after ERFA no longer worked for me and doubled in price anyway….I’ve been doing so well, started running again, writing etc etc. Interestingly, they DID smell awful but still worked well….I felt great. Then I started a new batch that’d cost me hugely to import into the UK, but had to me previously been worth it and within around 4 or 5 days all my hypo symptoms returned including extreme menopausal flushing that’d been apparently helped previously. Annoyingly I have several bottles in reserve all bearing the same expiry dates and batch numbers so I am, as they say….scr***d. I am going to ask the pharmacy for a refund but doubt they will give it to me, but more importantly I am now very very worried about what to do next. I cant take synthetic stuff and dont like the look of most of the available NDT for the number of scary sounding excipients they contain and why I preferred firstly ERFA and then NP…. So I’m wondering if anyone can recommend anything that is currently still easing symptoms successfully. I’m at the beginning of the decline at the moment but not sure for how much longer I’ll be able to function atall. I would be very grateful for any advice, from anyone atall..I should add I never involve doctors and only observe my symptoms or absence of and energy levels and feeling of wellness or otherwise, as a determinant of what to take or not and how much….thankyou so much.
Shantel Brooks
I have been on the same ndt/cytomel dose for 5 years since getting optimal. I had to switch to NP early 2018 after the shortage with Naturethroid. Things were going well for 2018 labs. Oddly, when I had my labs pulled Dec 2019, my FT4 and FT3 had both dropped, which they had not done in over 5 years. I was not aware there had been an issue with NP Thyroid that started in the fall of 2019. I have a lot of health/pain issues so plenty to blame changes on beyond my thyroid. But i was shocked about my labs changing bc they literally have been the same the last 5 years. I do now wonder if it is bc of the NP change? Also, in 2014, I did not do great on Armour. Is there a chance I could do better on it now? I am only on 1 grain ndt and then T3 meds.
Janie Bowthorpe
NP has definitely changed for the worst. Patient experiences prove is now sucks. So everyone is moving over to Armour a working compounded NDT, or T4/T3, and getting optimal. But you need to be sure you get truly optimal on anything you change to. Too many fail to read, say they are optimal, and they aren’t. So it backfires. This: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Frank Moore
I noticed last year 2019 that the NP Thyroid had a strong chemical smell. My wife and I both take it and all the different strengths have the same smell. I upped mine to 120mg my wife takes 2 90’s and one 30 . We both feel hypo. This is very disturbing to us as not only does it affect us but we have been activists for NP Thyroid and told everyone that we meet that had thyroid problems how good it did for us. This should be criminal deception.
Janie Bowthorpe
I agree.
Jo W Nutt
Discontinuing my NP after return of Hypo symptoms and 15 lb weight gain since December 6, 2019. Trying to figure out whether to go on Synthetic T4/T3 or Armour. My two question are:
1. Has any one been able to lose the weight gained from bad NP by switching to synthetic T4/T3?
2, Have you been able to get rid of the hypo symptoms when optimized on the synthetic T4/T3?
Janie Bowthorpe
1. Yes, but helps to get optimal to do so.
2. Definitely
Sven
Hi I‘m new with NDT and my Batch from 2019 has NO smell. Is this a good or bad sign?
Thanks
Sven
Janie Bowthorpe
Need you to specify which brand.
Sven
Acella NP 😉
Janie Bowthorpe
It appears they are disguising the bad stuff inside. Not, not worth being on NP, say patients before you.
queen K
I have used NP thyroid by Acella for one full year -2019. My labs either came out on the lower end or on the higher end of normal range, never optimal. I decided on trying it after reading good reviews for Acella but something definitely went wrong with the medicine composition.
This year I have started taking Bovine Thyroid with brand name – Priority One’s Thyroid 65 (1 cap=65mg). I started with a low dosage and now have doubled the dose as required by my lab results. I am hoping to get my labs done again by the end of this month to see the difference. Has anyone tried this brand or any other Bovine brands after having tried porcine thyroid, please do share your experience.
Karen SF
Update on my prior message. I contacted CVS about the chemical smell from my 90-day supply of NP Thyroid. The rep let me speak to a Pharmacist who told me they can talked to Acella in Oct 2019 about the smell complaints but were told they have a new supplier. I explained that with the irregular smell of chemicals and not “pig” I would not ingest them. I also talked with David from Acella and received the same “company marketing speech” that everyone else received. However, we did have a 3-way conversation with CVS Pharmacist, myself, and David who agreed to send me a new 90day supply thru CVS which I am receiving today. I did explain that if it had the same chemical smell I would not take them.
I then called my Dr (who I’ve used for 10 yrs, always works with me, and specializes in Thyroid and uses NDT for patients.) She said she has had no patient issues using Nature-Throid and is getting me a 30day supply and in 4 wks I’ll get labs. I did explain that I heard that all NDT was not working, but agreed to try (smell) the Nature-throid product. Otherwise, she will write me a script for synthetic T4 & T3.
My question – is anyone doing well with Nature-throid? If not, what are your issues. are they the same as the NP Thyroid or different? Is is just weaker, not consistent, etc? Not sure whether to waste my time on it. I do trust my Dr but feedback from this group is definitely appreciated.
Janie Bowthorpe
We have yet to see one person on Naturethroid achieve optimal frees. It’s not been worth it.
Karen SF
Are they not getting optimal frees because they aren’t taking enough or something else?
Janie Bowthorpe
Something else. i.e. something is extremely wrong now.
TAI
I filled a prescription for thyroid NP on 11/12/2019 for 360 tablets; 0.5gr. I’ve been steadily taking 3 tabs a day ignoring horrendous cat pee smell and awful taste. I’ve had a return of hypothyroid symptoms as well as new heartburn, heart racing and overall feeling poor since this latest batch. I have labs due 3/6 and am looking forward to my results but after all the research I’ve just read, I am anticipating poor lab results due to Thyroid NP being contaminated or compromised.
Janie Bowthorpe
And as you have found out, not worth it to try it out. It’s terrible.
TAI
What would you recommend switching to? I would like to stay natural. Thanks.
Janie Bowthorpe
In this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Karen SF
I received a new 90 day supply of NP Thyroid 30mg size and they smell very chemically – not pig smell as my good batches have been. I take about 3grains per day and have been doing very well on NP Thyroid over the last year (was on WP Thyroid until their downfall.) After reading this blog, I am not willing to even try these tablets. My health is very important and I’m not willing to risk taking these. I did run across a website (https://sign.moveon.org/petitions/np-thyroid-by-acella) which offer to sign a petition to the CEO at Acella Labs – I signed it. Maybe all of us should sign and show our force in numbers. It the meantime, I’m planning to get my Dr to give me a script for T4 and cytomel that gives me the same T4/T3 as my current NP and tweak until I get optimal. I prefer NDT, but won’t go back until they fix this contaminated mess!
Janie Bowthorpe
Totally and completely understand your last sentence.
Jey
Hoping someone can help as I’m at a loss on where to go from here. I did wonderfully on WP thyroid + Cytomel until the shortage. Switched to NP (plus Cytomel) over a year ago and did fine on that too. I even thought I was doing okay on the newer, stinky version of NP. In October 2019, my doctor took me off Cytomel because I was having a heart arrhythmia. However, when I quit the Cytomel, I also began taking magnesium and my heart seems better. So, not sure if it actually was the Cytomel. Fast forward 4 months and I am alarmed at how thin my hair is looking, I’ve been completely unmotivated and depressed, feel somewhat of a brain fog in that I can’t seem to figure out what I’m supposed to be doing or if I do, can’t seem to actually do it (symptoms similar to the pooling I had a few years back). I was in denial about the NP but am beginning to really wonder if it IS the NP, or just the lack of Cytomel. I’m not sure exactly when the hair loss started. It seems like I have been trying to brush it a certain way to cover areas for longer than just these last 4 months, but even if that’s so, it is definitely much thinner now. As of October, when I was still on NP and Cytomel, my TSH was .002 (I am without a thyroid so this SHOULD be low), T4 at 1.0 and T3 at 6.5 BUT I had labs done after taking meds, so T3 was probably higher due to that. I can have my doctor order new labs with fasting, but I’m unsure whether to ask for Armour, Synthroid, or just my Cytomel back. The hair loss is really bothering me, but I know the lack of motivation needs to be fixed too. I was miserable on Synthroid-only for years, then had pooling issues with Armour, so not really sure what to do.
Janelle
What are pooling issues?
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/pooling
Starr D.
For those of you who are lost regarding what to take if the NP thyroid failed you (as it did me), you might give the real Armour a shot, even if you’ve been on it before and not done well. NP really started making me sicker last August through September, and I’ve pretty much been on just about everything over the years. In more recent years, though, the natural
meds did try to help me with some symptoms the synthetic thyroid drugs just could not help. I really wanted to stay on something natural if possible, so my endocrinologist and I talked it over, and agreed I should give Armour a try, even though I’ve had bad results with it about five different times since around 1987. Haven’t taken it for about ten years, though, so was just hoping it was made better this time.
Maybe it is. I’m not well by any means, yet, (I have a complicated case), but
I do think it’s trying to help me as well as NP did when it was better, and maybethe Armour is actually somewhat better than that (for me, anyway, at the moment.) There was an especially bad side-effect I used to get from Armour (seeing weird spots to the side of my visual field, even when my eyes were closed, sometimes.) I’ve not gotten that sort of thing, so far. I think Armour has a different owner than the last time I took it 10 years ago, and maybe it’s possible they’re doing a better job with it, and maybe getting better ingredients, etc. That’s one reason
I was sort of open to trying it again….a different owner can sometimes make a product better or worse…..I was hoping for “better.” Maybe it actually is, at least for some. We’re still not done adjusting my dose, so we’ll see.
Also want to add that the other times I was on Armour, I didn’t always have a
doctor who also tried to work with other things that help the thyroid, like iron,
Vitamin D3, magnesium, etc. My current endo does, so I’m sure that helps.
I don’t have much of my own thyroid gland left that works due to RAI for
Grave’s Disease (hyperthyroid) in the mid 1970s when I was eleven & twelve
years old. So, I’m really dependent on these thyroid drugs to work right.
I’m not where I need to be yet, but at least the Armour is going in the right
direction for now. Wanted to share in case this might help someone Starr D.
jay
How long have you been on Armour (this time)?
Also how much Armour are you taking per day?
I am going to be making the switch from NP to Armour soon and was wondering whether I might need a higher dose of Armour than what I was taking with the old NP to get to feeling good. (In other words was the old NP a little stronger than the new Armour?)
Janie Bowthorpe
Just in case, we favor starting on a slightly lower dose of Armour, wait a few weeks, the test the frees to see if you need to tweak to get optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Starr D.
Hi. I’ve been on Armour since mid-September, 2019 to present day. Janie
is right when she advises anyone to start on a lower dose than they might
eventually need. I think I started on 1 and 1/2 grains for awhile (1 grain or
60 mg, in the morning), the rest in the afternoon. We then raised it to
a little under 1 and 3/4 grains based on labs and my symptoms–keeping
the one grain in the AM and the rest in the afternoon (around 4 pm is when
my doctor advises taking the afternoon dose, although I don’t always
hit it at exactly that time. He says it works better, splitting it up like that.)
I just had a new thyroid appointment today…I have still a lot of obvious
low thyroid symptoms, and he said I could raise the dose to 1 and 3/4
grain of Armours daily, without even looking at the labs (they haven’t
come in yet because I was unable to get them a week earlier, like I was
supposed to.) 1 and 3/4 grain is the dose I took most often on NP thyroid
when it was working better and helping me better. But when NP started
making me sicker, I could barely take any of it for a few weeks, and then
I had to stop it, completely. Whenever I’ve had a bad experience on any
thyroid drug and change to another, I’ve learned the hard way that it’s
always better to start on some dose that’s lower than you may really need.
On me, it takes some time for the bad, old medicine to dump out, and
the new medicine to start working. For a few weeks on me when I’m
changing meds, it’s sort of like a battlefield going on–older drug is kinda
fighting with the newer drug, until the older one finally fizzles out (could
take a few weeks, on me). Then, the newer drug can have a chance to
build up and actually start to help (if it’s going to.) I would definitely NOT
go higher on Armour than NP…..go lower, if anything, just to make sure
it agrees with you ok. Like if you’re on 2 grains of NP, ask for 1 3/4 Armour,
or 1 1/2 armour, or alternate between the two doses. Just my thoughts
on this. Good luck with it, Jay. You’ve got a shot at it, I think, with the
Armour–at least how they’re making it, this time around. Starr D.
Beth
So I have been taking the new NPThyroid for about 2 weeks. I can already tell there is a problem. How long should I wait to get accurate labs?
Thank you.
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s always, always up to you, but there are simply too many reports of bad results from NP.
Alan
I have been taking the new NP for a few months, it seems to be working fine for me. I alternate doses, 95mg for two days, then 100 mg for one day, then 95mg for two days, etc. My TSH jumped up about three months ago to 2.98, I knew I was under dosed. My doctor raised my meds for three weeks and then I did blood work, my TSH had dropped down to the proper (suppressed) levels. All appears very good, and I feel good. I am holding my breath after reading all of these comments, I hope I continue to feel good, and I hope the new NP is stable.
Janie Bowthorpe
Alan, it’s not working. Too many reports from people that prove it. And the low amount you are taking has never made anyone optimal with their frees. It’s also never about the TSH. It’s common to think we are doing well on a bad med due to the rising cortisol and adrenaline it’s been causing. See this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
PeggyPillTaker
I feel like I should post this to help others….. My dose of NP thyroid is ____ mg. However, I always ask my doctor to write my script for the 15 mg tablets (1/4 grain) and I insist that my pharmacy give me the sealed bottles except what they can’t give me sealed. The manufacturer sealed bottles of 100 tablets. The opened bottle they give me in the amber colored prescription bottle is always speckled and when used (ingested) does not actually work too well. I open my sealed 100 tablets, add 3-4 desiccant packets to the opened bottle and that works fine for the month. I accidently lost almost a whole 100 tablet bottle (just got misplaced) found it again, opened, tried to use it, although far from expiry date, it did not work. Had hypo symptoms. All those tablets speckled too from air etc. Oh, with the 15 mg tablets, yes, I do take my tablets throughout the day at different times to equal my total dose of thyroid medication needed. Nothing wrong with that – don’t know if anyone else tries this. It works okay for me…..
Terry Jackson
I had a thyroidectomy about 10 years ago and took Armour for a number of years and then learned of NP Thyroid which was close to half the cost… so I started taking it. About a month ago I started feeling horrible and tired and went online and learned how NP Thyroid had changed their supplier and there may be issues with the new pills. My wife takes Armour so for the past three days I have taken that and I now feel great. The results of my Thyroid bloodwork came back today and my TSH was 75! Remember, I do not have a thyroid so I rely 100% on the pills. My creatinine was also high and I believe that is caused by the incorrect NP Thyroid. Having bad thyroid medication can be very scary stuff. I want to send my pills back to the manufacturer for a refund.
Mike R
This is interesting. Since December, I have been on a steady decline. Gained 15 pounds, felt tired, unmotivated. I chalked it up to winter in a northern climate. But, I finally had enough, I knew something wasn’t right. I made an appointment with my dr. to have my levels checked. Haven’t gotten the results back yet. But, I checked my prescription and noted that my scrip was filled in early December. Right when my symptoms started coming back…
That’s what prompted me to do a search on NP Thyroid changes and saw this article. What is someone supposed to do now? This was the one thing that seemed to give me results. I have a feeling that when my doctor gets back to me, my TSH levels will be high again. He already said that he will likely just increase my dosage. But, taking more of something that isn’t working doesn’t seem like a great solution.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Mike. You are right–taking more of what now sucks is not the solution.
Scroll down on this post to see solutions: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Thalia
WHEW! That explains it. I actually threw out one whole bottle cuz I thought SOMEHOW, SOME WAY my cat had peed on it! Gross tasting!!!!
Victoria N.
I was doing good on 2 1/2 grains NP Thyroid plus 100mcg levothyroxine to balance everything out. My Frees were good and I felt good. After the change my Frees have both dropped to 25% of the range. My doctor (a DO) won’t up the dose to get my Frees back to where they were before (I was under a different doctor in a different state, but then we moved 1800 miles). I guess I will try crushing/chewing the tablet to see if that helps. I try taking Vitamin C with my tablets to increase absorbtion, but I forget most of the time. I will also try taking my anti-depressant at night instead of with my thyroid pills.
christin poeschl
Hello,
I am writing you from Austria/Europe. I have Hashimoto, for the last 25 years (probably longer) and the only medication that works is natural thyroid. Ever since the reformulation of Armour I have been taking Erfa Thyroid (3 Gr.).
I was rather happy with this medication – as it is one of the few ones that get to Europe regularly – but I just opened a new box of 1 grain, 60 mg Lot 19F03, Exp: 06/2022 and the pills have a horrible taste, a rather chemical taste, which they never had. They smell entirely different compared to the older ones. It is a pungent stench but not porcine.
The appearance definitely changed as I compared two 60mg tablets from different lots with different expiry dates (different color and texture). The newer ones are whiter and the cover is much smoother, shinier, not as yellowish and does not have these speckles.
I made a picture that I am unable to attach here, but it looks exactly the same as the picture of one of your readers for the NP thyroid ( if you want I can send it via e-mail).
My question is if any of your readers reported changes on Erfa recently ( I could not find anything on your blog)?
This is all very strange and for years I have been thinking that users of natural dissicated thyroid are being deprived of any control. I wrote to Erfa and the response was the same as ever: nothing changed, just different raw material. I wonder if we all get the same pills just under different labels. The ERFA pills also lack any information on the ingredients, something that is impossible with Austrian medicine, all the ingredients need to be on the box or bottle.
Anyway, keep up your good work, your blog is like a democracy for thyroid patients all over the world!
All the best from Europe! Thank you!
Kind regards,
Christin
Jay
Have you tried the German Version of Natural Thyroid?
I have heard about it on this site and others for many years.
I have never seen any actual reviews on how it works but If you try it please let us know how it works for you.
christin poeschl
They all worked well – depending on the fillers the different pharmacies use – but as they use the same raw material as the American brands they will probably have the same problems. Most of these natural thyroid medications come in capsules, for ex. in combination with olive oil, so the smell is not noticeable and it will take time till people notice the changes. Some of these medications even use grounded Armour as raw material. As far as I could find out the raw material that most of the US. brands now use does not come from Europe – the pharmacists say there is no European business producing thyroid – but originally from South America, guess Brazil, are bought by European firms in Spain or Italy and then exported to the US under the label of European thyroid. If this holds true, then this would be the explanation why all the brands have the same problem. And it is also a fact that they all smell very much like cat urine and the chemical stench is just the coating. I took a new Erfa pill, washed the coating off and immediately the urine smell is there. the old ones do not smell the same. It is very difficult to get any information on the raw material, in the US or in Europe. This is also a kind of lobby and nobody wants educated patients. Only Ms. Bowthorpe and we, the patients!
Janie Bowthorpe
Christin, it’s compounded NDT that comes in capsules. Other brands are tablets.
Janie Bowthorpe
Sadly, the terrible stench has become common for most of the pharmaceuticals, which makes patients wonder what they are swallowing. And they have always stated “we changed nothing”, which patients find to be insincere and insulting. Plus, there’s been a widespread return of hypo on the now-stink pills.
Dina Ciccone
OK I’ve received a few phone calls and I just got this email I am off of work on Monday so I plan on calling. Please load this up with questions you want me to ask.
Hello,
Thank you for contacting Acella Pharmaceuticals, LLC. We would like to speak with you further regarding the issues you experienced while on Acella’s product. Please contact the Medical Information Department at (678) 581-4436 (Monday through Friday, 9:00am — 5:00pm EDT), to speak further regarding your experience.
.
Kind regards,
Medical Information Specialist
Janie Bowthorpe
Good luck. The same thing has been going on for months, and nothing has changed, other than seemingly coating the tablets to hide the awful smell (and thus the continued awful results from whatever is inside). Patients state they are still doing lousy on NP Thyroid..
Dina
I talked to them today and it was just them asking me a bunch of questions. At the end the guy asked if I would ship my pills back to them if they sent me packaging. I might stick a couple in there but I would like to hold onto them on the off chance someone needs them to figure out what’s actually going on with them.
Janie Bowthorpe
Nothing comes of it. Patients are feeling it’s a waste of time and fake concern.
rich
I too have noticed the negative change. Weight gain and tiredness requiring naps that have been gone for years.
I contacted Acella 2/6/20 and was told the vendor was changed from a USA pig supplier to a European supply.
On 2/11/20 a different department called and asked a series of questions. They are replacing the last 90 supply, bought 12/1/19, of the 60mg+60mg+30mg pills I take every day (150mg/day). They hope for my local CVS to fill the new order and take back the old product.
If CVS does not want the product, then Acella will send a mailer to me to have the product shipped back so they can analyze it.
JustMe
Rich, I have been following this since it started. I really hope they may listen, but what you’re describing is exactly what hundreds of others have done…and no response after the initial “we’ll replace it.” They’re appeasing a disgruntled patient base and lying. I don’t understand why, but it’s getting harder and harder to truly trust anyone to help. STTM is a great resource and if you haven’t, read all around the website, get the books and find their Facebook page. I don’t know where I would be without Janie and STTM. I’m not affiliated and I don’t know Ms. Bowthorpe personally, but I have seen her work tirelessly to be a patient advocate and help everyone. I follow some other places and people too, but STTM is by far my most heavily relied on source for information and understanding.
peggy
Ditto on what “JustMe” said.
Janie Bowthorpe
Just Me and Peggy, I deeply appreciate what you said. I’ve always valued having integrity in what I do, and supporting patients since I myself suffered so long. Thank you.
Tracy
I have been waiting since August for my replacement prescription!!!
Jason
I’ve been on 90 mg of NP Thyroid for several years now. My TSH was 2.22 back in January of last year. Had it retested in November and it had climbed to 3.21. Coincidence?
Janie Bowthorpe
If you are on the pre-changed NP, you’re simply underdosed. So it backfires. On a working NDT, we have to get optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Jill Walters
I have been taking NP thyroid for several years. I switched when Armour went south. I was taking 150 mg NP you until I had a medical event and it was discovered that I was way over-replacing. My dose was lowered to 120mg in July. Last week my doctor told me that my TSH was undetectable and lowered my dose to 97.5 mg and switched it to “Nature-throid” by accident because she’d never heard of NDT.
JoLene
I’m relatively new to this (again) after originally being prescribed NDT for out-of-whack thyroid lab values + severe hypo symptoms back in 2015. My doc had 1st prescribed Armour and then Naturethroid when I couldn’t get Armour Rx filled due to supply availability. I took the Rx for a year or so and felt better (at least I was not *as* horrifically fatigued + was finally able to have some activity and lose weight, etc). But foolishly, after about 9 months or so of taking the NDT Rx, I stopped taking, as I thought I’d gotten things fixed and could just coast. I know – absolutely foolish! I was able to manage somewhat but as of Oct 2019, some major stressful life events ultimately left me back in absolute exhaustion-mode + I gained 20 lbs in 3 months. I finally woke up and thought maybe I needed to go to my doc, and she started me on pellet bio-identical hormone replacement therapy — but she also suggested I have labs drawn to see where I was at with my thyroid levels. My TSH was 3.9, and my T3 & T4 numbers were all sub-optimal, so in addition to the BHRT, she suggested I start back up on thyroid Rx. So on Dec 2, I got the BHRT pellets (estradiol/testosterone) implanted, but was also prescribed NP Thyroid Rx at 15 mg. [I had advised my OBGYN that I wished to go with NDT Rx (vs synthetic) and she agreed. She started me out at 15 mg NP Thyroid but as I’d felt so much better when I was on 60 Naturethoid (similar dose in Armour) + I wanted to feel better ASAP vs. struggling along for weeks/months slowly going up from 15 mg to 30 mg etc. …. in January, I asked her if we could increase my dose, she agreed after doing a 2nd set of labs and increased me to 60 mg NP Thyroid.
But now after reading this blog and seeing that there are so many terrible reviews of patients’ hypo symptoms returning when being on NP Thyroid, I’m now not sure what to do ! FYI: I have both samples of 60 mg NP Thyroid as well as a 90 day filled Rx of NP Thyroid – and neither of them have the terrible cat pee/ ammonia odor that is described. Does that mean that I should feel safe in going ahead and taking the NP Thyroid ? Or should I ask my doc to switch me to Armour Rx? I know that will be harder to get (and I don’t believe my insurance covers Armour) but at this point, I don’t care [I’m willing to pay out of pocket if I have to!] just so I can be on the right Rx to help me feel better [vs. going for weeks and weeks and not seeing any change and/or feeling worse]. I know that ultimately we must watch our labs to ensure we are working towards getting to the “optimal” levels but as I’ve not yet noticed a difference in feeling any better (where my hypo symptoms have gotten any better), I don’t want to keep taking the NP Thyroid if it isn’t helping?
FYI: Despite taking the NP Thyroid since December 2, I don’t feel that I’m seeing any abatement of hypo symptoms, and what’s worse (I don’t know if it’s related or not) but I’m still gaining weight (despite doing my best to try to lessen caloric intake – but appetite still ramped up) and my fatigue symptoms aren’t better – PLUS I’m started to lose sleep due to restless leg syndrome symptoms!!! I told my doc aout this and she suggested taking magnesium supplements + a CALM drink powder or gummy. I am doing that now but it’s not helping hardly at all with the RLS symptoms at night.
HELP?
Janie, can you please advise?
And I want to thank you so much for all the time and research you dedicate to the STTM site and helping us get the information we need, as smart individuals who are trying to advocate on our own behalf to get the best quality of life we can get! I thank you so very much in advance!
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi JoLene. You are very welcome.
There are recent remarks by patients that Acella has been coating the NP to hide the smell. Yet hiding the smell, if it’s true, doesn’t change that NP went south for patients. So who knows. The only hope is that your pharmacy still has a strong stock of the pre-changed NP. And by the way, if they do, you are far from optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Dawn
Hi,
My doctor wrote a script for Low Dose Naltrexone for 0.5 mg. The compounding pharmacist said this dose is too low to receive any benefit. Is anyone taking this? What dose were you started at? Can you take this with NP (the old stuff)? Have you noticed hypo symptoms decreasing while taking LDN? Insurance doesn’t cover it, so this will be oop. Thank you for any insight.
Janie Bowthorpe
That can be a starting dose. But people raise and they find that either 3 mg does the trick or 4.5 mg–the latter is most common. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ldn
Jennifer
Just reading this today because I too am experiencing hypo symptoms with my NP Thyroid. I have chronic Lyme disease as well making my symptoms cross over. I am currently being treated with LDI amino acids, supplements, and LDN (low dose naltrexone). .5 is a beginning dose. My doctor has me on 4.5 now. I had to stop taking it at night because it was causing insomnia. I take it in the morning now. I was taking 240 mg of NP Thyroid and then after being hot in December, the heart palpitations and racing heart started in January. I even went to the ER because my doctor was on vacation and I had to rule out a heart attack. But now that I’ve read this post, I’m wondering if all the trouble I’m having isn’t from the NP. We dosed down to 90mg, then I started freezing and feeling awful, air starved…again,blah blah, now I’m on 165mg, still the same. Just sent an email to my doctor to see if he may consider putting me on Armour again to try and get relief. I don’t know why you may be on LDN, but I am happy with the results of 4.5.
Susanne Bengtsson
I am so grateful for all this information and do not expect a response to my questions as I can only imagine the time and energy it takes to keep this website running – and yet I will still ask 🙂
I’ve been on NP since 11/2018 – for a while taking 120 per day but since 7/2019 taking 90. I developed bacterial pnemonia fall of 2019 and then reactivated epstein barr 11/2019 – current symptoms are nausea, fatigue, tremors, insomnia, brainfog. My labs have been fairly consistently as follows TSH 0.040, FT4 0.88, FT3 2.92 however my Thyroid antibodies went from 1.3 in 3/2019 to 8.7 just recently (range 1-9). Liver enzymes ALT jumped from 35 in 7/2019 to 60 most recently. I just started Tirosint Levothyroxine 50 MCG and 5mcg Liothyronine (working slowly up to 15mcg).
Is this the correct dosage in your opinion and also can epstein barr cause elevated liver enzymes and thyroid antibodies??
Any thoughts would be deeply appreciated.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, it takes a lot of time and energy and this is all volunteer. Your labs show you are seriously underdosed: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal And it looks like you now have an adrenal problem (nausea, tremors, insomnia etc) from being so underdosed. To find out what seems obvious, patients order this: https://sttm.mymedlab.com/sttm-profiles/zrt-saliva-adrenal-4-sample–2 Read all about it here–promise you will read it all: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/saliva-cortisol
Susanne Bengtsson
Yes, I have had high cortisol 24/7 since I started testing through saliva 12 years ago however finally managed to get levels normal for the first time in September 2019 after trying phosphatidylserine. Now as I think back this is when my nausea, tremors and dizziness started. Is it possible that the sudden change in cortisol output affected the thyroid and caused these symptoms? But then how come the thyroid labs didn’t change? I am due to retest my cortisol to make sure it’s still holding and will also retest thyroid after having switched from NP thyroid to Levothyroxine 50 MCG and 15mcg Liothyronine. One last question if you have time – is it ok to take all thyroid meds together first thing in the morning or do you have to split them up? My functional doctor states it is less stressful on the adrenals when you split them in two. Thank you again.
Janie Bowthorpe
High cortisol pushes RT3 up, yes.
Together, then together again by early to mid afternoon.
Belle
Question for those switching from NDT to synthetic T4/T3: Is it necessary to replace the T1 and T2 that are found in the NDT? If so, how can that be replaced? Thanks in advance for any information anyone can provide on this.
Janie Bowthorpe
If on T4 and T3, there’s good reason to believe that the T3 will continue converting down to T2 and T1.
Mary
I had been taking Naturethroid for a few years before I couldn’t get it anymore this past September. The pharmacist switched me to Acella (Lot #M328G19-2). I did notice the small etc. that others are writing about but I felt okay. Now I couldn’t get Acella so they gave me Armour and my chiropractor said she hasn’t seen my body this depleted since I’ve been coming to her for the past few years. I guess I’ll go on synthetic T4 and T3. I don’t know why it has to be this way after doing so well for years on Naturethroid.
Karoline
How long, once stopping NP Thyroid, does it take to get the medicine out of your system? I feel AWEFUL on this stuff! I have crazy reflux, tight chest, upper back pain, fatigue, headache, bloating, crazy anxiety and hurt all over! I take 60 mg. Is it possible to not take meds and just improve levels through diet?
Lori
One grain is rather small, it might be possible with a herb and vitamin routine along with an organic diet free of soy and endocrine disrupting chemicals, you can always try it and see how you it works for you. Feel free to PM me if you would like a copy of my entire herb and vitamin routine geared towards thyroid. I am on medication however but my problem is severe and I’ve had it for along time so I developed a herb and vitamin routine to help me feel better.
Edie
I have been on NP for several years now, and my labs were always really good (I didn’t do so well on synthetics (Synthroid and Cytomel combo), Armour, or Nature-Throid). Last month, I got a bottle of the new NP, and while my hypo symptoms didn’t return, the taste was ABSOLUTELY awful, made me nauseous. This month, the smell and taste is not nearly as bad. It still doesn’t smell or taste nice, but not quite as disgusting. My symptoms are still at bay, so all is good there. I just wanted to report about the new batch that I have received, and the fact that things might be improving.
Janie Bowthorpe
There is suspicion they are trying to cover up the smell and taste. If that’s the case, the interior is still the same i.e. may still cause problems.
Edie
Well, this batch isn’t making me nauseous, so that is a plus. None of my symptoms have recurred, despite the last bottle tasting horrible. As long as I am feeling good, and am not getting nauseous, I will continue taking the NP.
Janet
Edie, do you have an expiration date or lot number from the new batch? I’m curious if it was manufactured after all our complaints.
Edie
Hi, sorry I hadn’t seen this earlier, but I have been crazy busy with tax season. I get my NP from CVS and I don’t see a lot number, but the expiration on my latest bottle is 3/2/21. They tell me that they special order my NP every time I order a refill (I live in a very rural area, and apparently I am the only one around here who takes it). I had some of the horribly stinky/nasty tasting ones, these still look the same as the bad ones, but don’t smell very bad, and I slightly chew mine when I take them, and they don’t really taste that bad. They don’t taste as good as they used to, back in the day, but also totally not horrible. Also, none of my symptoms have returned.
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s just a matter of time that you are doing to go very south. Absolutely no one has done well on NP, sooner or later, since it changed. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Edie
I am sorry about all of the people having issues. However, my symptoms have not returned since my first bottle of the new batch back in December. My endo (who prefers to treat with NDT) agrees that my latest labs are still great (I would post here, but I can’t find the copy of them right now), they were just as good as they were before the changes. I am still losing weight, and no return of fatigue or other symptoms. I chew mine up in the morning, chase with water, and am doing fine on them.
Janie Bowthorpe
Edie, just beware. It appears most are not doing fine, and the “feel goods” backfire with a return of hypo. Watch your frees, as no one has great labs anymore. Great labs have nothing to do with falling anywhere in that normal range. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Jeni Megge
I have recently switched from Acella NP to Armour because as I wrote here months ago, I felt absolutely horrible on NP-I got severely anxious and depressed and lost my appetite and could barely function. It all seemed to go away once I switched to Armour.
Sadly, on Armour I have many hypo symptoms and just do not feel my best (constant headaches, hair falling out more than ever, and some anxiety returning).
My Dr. offered switching to a synthetic which I am more than fine with at this point. I really don’t trust any of the NDT’s anymore.
Here are my options-I just want to get this right, any thoughts on which is better?
Here are the results of your recent blood work:
TSH (0.4-4.5) N current level is 1.09
Free T3 (1.7-3.7) N current level is 2.4
Free T4 (0.7-1.5) N current level is 0.8
N = Normal + = Abnormal
Your thyroid labs on the Armour are okay – a slight adjustment of the T4 would be optimal.
Using a T3 / T4 combo we’d have to compound it and use University Compounding Pharmacy in Troy.
The benefit would be a near exact match of what you would need.
According to their 2019 pricing sheet they charge about $45 for a one month supply but $96 for a 3 month which is quite a savings.
Your T3/T4 compound would be T3 15 mg / T4 65 mg
If we changed to a Synthroid product (T4) and used cytomel (liothyronine) (T3) we’d use Synthroid 150 mcg and Cytomel 5 mcg 2 in the am and 1 in the afternoon.
So one Synthroid per day and 3 cytomel per day.
Synthroid and cytomel DO come in generic form so it’s cheaper and I’d recommend staying with the same pharmacy for generic brand consistency.
Janie Bowthorpe
Jeni, if those were your labs on armour, your problem is that you were severely underdosed. Study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Jeni Megge
Ugh….
So I need my dose increased in order to fall in the top part of Free T3 and the midrange of Free T4?
Now just to figure out how to get her to agree to that since she apparently just follows traditional ranges.
Janet
Jeni, I’ve had to raise my Armour by dose by 40% to get it comparable to NP Thyroid, but it is working for me. We watch my body temperature and heart rate to help adjust so I don’t get hyper, but I’m feeling much better. I would love to do the Synthroid/Cytomel but I can’t tolerate the calcium sulfate in the name brand and generic T3s. I feel good as far as thyroid function, but get awful stomach pains from it. I may go to a compounded formula like yours since I could choose the fillers.
Emily Jane Smith
If the reformulated NP Thyroid does not work for you, is there any way you can be refunded either by the pharmacy or by Acella for the price of the medicine if you paid out of pocket?
Janie Bowthorpe
So far, it’s been rare for anyone to be refunded.
Emily Jane Smith
Oh, well! That is disappointing but, I guess, not really surprising. Thank you, Janie!
rich
I posted above 2/11/20. Acella is replacing my product and asked to the old batch to be returned
Amberc
Hello there, been following a while
Switched from synthetics to armor and felt good for two months or so, now having increased anxiety and hair falling out triple the amount than normal.
So I call the local compounding pharmacy which compounds t3/t4 ask them to tell me when the porcine powder they use was manufactured and what was in their compounding.
I also asked them if they can make armor and np compounded with a doctors conversion (of what I’m on) and prescription.
They flat out refused and were rude enough for me to almost cuss them. They won’t; call me back with the info, text me, email me, write it in a formal letter, write it on a scratch pad, send me a web link…. nothing. I asked them to do any option of these to communicate back to me what I’m asking of them!
A simple:
1. What porcine powder do you use and when was it manufactured?
2. What ingredients are in the compounds you make for thyroid meds/compounds?
They say I have to come in and they won’t help me on the phone and they can look at a bottle. They want me to look at the bottle they use for information. Which obviously the bottle will not include the information I’m asking. He’s telling me that is “the only information he can give me… is what is on the bottle”. That is crazy and untrue! There is lots of specific info he can give me about compounded products!
What in the world is happening here? I get compounded progesterone here and they have no problems shouting from the rooftops what they put in that compound.
I said: “I perceive your getting irritated with my questions and I want you to know, I’m just trying to make the right choices for my health and I want this information so I can keep myself well along side my doctors care. I want to ask you: are you not telling me because:
A. You don’t want to
B. You don’t know and don’t want to look it up
C. You know, but can’t tell me because you will get in trouble
Or
D. You know that it is a batch of porcine powder that has been reported is bad and is causing the return of symptoms in people that need thyroid supplementation and are willing to make and sell bad stuff because you don’t want to lose money”
And he was rude and got off the phone quickly with the understanding that my husband will be coming tonight to ask for the exact same information.
This is a pharmacist at medicine man compounding pharmacy in Hayden, Idaho on prairie ave
1.208.762.9355
Can you help me to see why he won’t give the info and what choices you would recommend from staff that won’t help you to know if their product is safe?
Help!
Thanks for all the research and work you do
Tricia O'Connell
Hi Gang,
I just got off the phone with a Pharmacist from Acella. He did admit that the supplier for the active ingredient was changed but could not comment on if (with all our negative results) they intend to change back or make any other adjustments. He documented my issues (return of Hashi symptoms, burning chest and throat, nausea, acid male cat pee smell and taste). He is contacting my Pharmacy to get refill info and may have me send back some tabs to Acella. So it’s probably all just PR and won’t go anywhere but I had my say. I told him how disgusting it is that after so many years Acella joined the moneygrubbers and discounted patient care and safety. I’m looking into changing to synthetics and truly dreading the process and expense. Hang in there folks! We are all in this together.
Janie Bowthorpe
It has never gone anywhere, and so far, patient expressions about Acella range from denial, gaslighting, disgusting, insulting and on and on.
Dina Ciccone
I switched to Armour Thyroid in December. I ended up going to the ER on New Year’s Day thinking I was having a heart attack because I was burping and I couldn’t breathe. The doctor at the ER thought I had GERD and maybe I do but I’ve never had it before. I got my results back from my thyroid results and my TSH was very low. I cut the dose in half ASAP and the GERD subsided. However, last week I believe I started having atrial fibrillation and I see a cardiologist next month. I started on WP until they stopped making it, then I went to NP and it was wonderful until it wasn’t and now on Armour I’m having all of these more severe issues. I am very upset and stressed over all of it.
Jay
How many grains of Armour were you taking per day before and after you cut your dose in half?
Dina Ciccone
I just did the switch from NP to armor so I was taking about 135 and that was too high so I went down to 90 and now I’m afraid to even take my medicine. I’ve been doing half of the 90 so 45 for the past few days
Janie Bowthorpe
Dina, what happened when you switched to Armour? Higher heartrate or palps? Anxiety? If so, it sounds like you may now have a cortisol problem, and would also need to check your iron level with all four iron labs. Do Discovery Step One here to see if you have a cortisol problem: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info Do all four iron labs. This page explains why someone has reactions: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/iron-and-cortisol It’s all correctable and you will then be able to raise and get out of your hypo state without problems once you correct them.
Janie Bowthorpe
Dina, it sounds like the Armour was revealing that you have either a cortisol or iron problem. Might want to study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/iron-and-cortisol It’s NORMAL for the TSH to go low with T3 in one’s treatment.
Dina Ciccone
My TSH was .094 and my free T4 was .8 she did not test T3.
Carmen
Im on nature thyroid and the gerd (belching like a college frat boy) that you described has been my life for years now. I thought I was crazy! I came on the site today to see about switching my Ndt only to find that they are all problematic now. Now I don’t know what to do.
Janie Bowthorpe
Armour has still been working for several patients. Same with synthetic T4 and synthetic T3. You just have to remember to get optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Ann
Hi All,
After 6 weeks being on Amour my results are as follows
Free t3-2.8 pg/ml
Free t4- 1.1ng/dl
Tsh- 0.01
My question is if my freet3 seems low would I just supplement with t3 or go up a dose in Amour? I switched over from NP at the same dosage and my t3 did go down from 3.1. Thanks
Janie Bowthorpe
Patients with informed doctors have always moved up by 1/2 grain every two weeks until in the 2-3 grain area, then they get labs done to see their progress. If not optimal yet, they continue raises while checking labs. Sometimes only 1/4 grain raises if getting close. optimal. We have to have the right amount of iron and cortisol to avoid problems when raising. It’s all in the updated revision STTM book. Get the book and refer. Ignore the part about NP Thyroid…that was before it went bad. https://laughinggrapepublishing.com/product/sttm/
Ann
Hi Janie,
Thanks for your response. I do have your book and have optimal iron and cortisol levels. Im just wondering if my t4 is where it should be and I’m low on t3 if I should just take the t3? I have noticed where other people are saying they are supplementing with straight t3 to get optimal on Amour. Currently I am on 2.50 grains of Amour. My doctor is pretty willing to do whatever I suggest to help me…I’m just not sure if its raising a 1/4 grain or just adding t3. Any help you could offer would be most appreciated.
Janie Bowthorpe
Compare your results to what it talked about on this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal It will help.
No, there are many who just raised Armour and got optimal. Right now, it’s the minority who felt the need to add T3.
Ann
Thank you. I just wasn’t sure if I added more t4 into the equation whether it would cause that to go higher too. You have been much help to me and many others. I can’t thank you enough.
Jay
How many grains of Armour do you take per day? How many hours after you took your last dose was your blood drawn?
Ann
JAY,
I wasn’t sure your question was directed to me and I didn’t want t be rude and not respond. I am currently on 2.5 grains and my blood was drawn 27 hours after my last dose of amour. Sorry if your question wasn’t directed to me:)
Karen
I just read an interesting review on np. She said after taking np it effected her liver function . After being back on nature throid for five weeks her levels are normal. As in a earlier post I just had an MRI because something showed up growing on my liver. I no you keep saying that nature throid is bad but it is working for some people. So this could explain why some people are having stomach issues. I had liver issues on thyro gold as did other people so there is a connection some how.I would not put np in my body ever again.she also said something about bacteria in np.
Janie Bowthorpe
What was the date of that review? Understand that we have yet to see any evidence that Naturethroid is now working. All we know is that when it came back in 2018, a huge body of people were reporting a major return of hypothyroid symptoms after going back on Naturethroid. That continued throughout all of 2019. We’ve also seen people say it’s working, but then they discover it never was and they were being fooled by the excess release of adrenaline and cortisol because it wasn’t working. And labs proved that it wasn’t working.
If the day comes that we see the evidence that Naturethroid is now working again, plus labs to prove it…and there are a good body of people reporting that it’s now working with labs to prove it, I will for sure report it.
Karen
The date was January 14
Janie Bowthorpe
Recent. But we still need much more feedback and proof, as there are people who say that, but their labs say otherwise.
Sally
I posted while ago echoing the same problems about the change in the pills, but the more I reviewed 2019, I determined it was changing even before the obvious change in appearance/smell. Hypo symptoms started showing up in the early summer – only to get drastically worse in the fall (with the arrival of the changed pills).
Go out and buy/checkout the book Bottle of Lies by Katherine Eban (details the fraud going on with generic drugs). I’m fairly certain something similar is going on here. After reading her book, I’m not getting my hopes up that FDA will come to the rescue.
I find it interesting that Acella keeps saying it’s coming from a European country, but never says which one. I’d have much more trust in something coming from Germany than somewhere like Ukraine.
Still trying to get things back to where they were – not much success at this point (sleeping is really a challenge). Tried a generic T4, but that gave me a nasty rash.
Trust no one and everybody lies…
Janie Bowthorpe
See alternatives that can work if you get optimal by scrolling down on this blog post: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Kelly
I have been on Armour for 3 years, and over the last year I have been in a Hashimoto’s flare. During this time I have gained over 25 lbs. I just changed from Armour to Nature throid. Should I go back to Armour?
Janie Bowthorpe
Definitely. Naturethroid went south. Get optimal on Armour: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Also get the patient-to-patient book Hashimoto’s:Taming the Beast to read all the ways patients got their antibodies down: https://laughinggrapepublishing.com/product/hashimotos/
Lauren Blowers
Two days on those simply HORRIBLE NP Thyroid pills (2 60mg per day), and my chin broke out in a rash not to mention the tingling sensation right after I took them!! Seriously. I actually begged my doctor to call in Armour. What kind of CRAP is Acella putting in those pills? Acella’s website claims that the pills are exactly the same, but they are using a new manufacturer overseas which adheres to FDA standards. Total BS!! I don’t know how sick I would have become had I continued usage!
Kate
I was placed on NP Thyroid about 3 weeks ago and I’ve notice an itch that started in my scalp and is now all over my body. It can be a tingling sensation as well. My doctor keeps telling me to take the medication, however, I feel as if I’m going crazy with this sensation. Benadryl helps stop it. Anyone else experience this?
Janie Bowthorpe
Since NP now sucks and leaves what appears to be practically everyone with hypothyroidism, itching can be a symptom. This is why people are leaving NP Thyroid and Acella in the dust.
Nicole
I’m wondering the same thing. I have old Nature Throid from when it was good in 2017 but I was told by the pharmacy and manufacturer that since I kept it in the refrigerator it may have lost potency
Janie Bowthorpe
It would only lose potency if it got wet or exposed to humidity…. If it was sealed, it may be fine.
Jennifer Riedel
I’m posting here to see if anyone shares the same symptoms I’ve been experiencing since switching from Nature-Throid to NP Thyroid to the “unchanged” NP Thyroid. I switched to NP Thyroid in 2018 when I couldn’t get my Nature-Throid refilled due to the shortage. No biggie – I took the NP Thyroid with no issues, I actually liked it better. In August of 2019, I refilled my prescription – the pills that normally were essentially odorless and tasteless (I used to chew them before I swallowed – but I can’t anymore), now had a horrible taste and smell about them. A few weeks after starting the new “unchanged” NP Thyroid pills, I feel hungover without having had anything to drink, I feel as if I have a pill stuck in my throat (I even had a swallowing X-ray done – neg results), I can’t take a deep breath, I have no energy, and I experience quite a bit of nausea. I’ve been banging my head against the wall trying to to figure out what is causing this. I never imagined it might have something to do with the “unchanged” NP Thyroid. Is it possible?? Has anyone else experienced any of these symptoms since the change – specifically, the shortness of breath? All labs have come back as normal.
Best Regards,
Jennifer
Janie Bowthorpe
There were batches of the visually unchanged NP last summer, before it clearly changed, that caused my own husband to see a return of his hypo. Turns out others reported the same.
Karen
Yes I had that shortness of breath and the other symptoms also. I have gone back to nature throid still don’t feel well. Np messed me up pretty bad.
Janie Bowthorpe
Wrong one to go back to. It went south as well, and so many who have tried it aren’t doing as well as they used to. Scroll down on this blog post to see alternatives: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Ann
Hi Janie,
I switched to Amour 5 weeks ago and am feeling better than when I was on NP. I will test numbers at the end of the week and work from there. My question is on the optimal iron levels you have listed. Do these numbers reflect being off iron for the stated 12 hours or after being off 5 days? I’m not sure there would be a big difference between the two but I am curious. Thanks for all you do!
Janie Bowthorpe
They reflect “close to” where people fall who don’t have an iron problem…what we kept seeing repeatedly in labs over the years.
Ann
Thank you….I understand that….I’m just wondering if the optimal numbers are after being off iron for 12 hours or for 5 days?
Rachel
What’s left in NDT? I luckily still have about a years supply of thiroyd but due to the swine fever outbreak have no idea when more will become available. My body isn’t able to use synthetic t4 and I only recently got these new ones that made me sick just trying to take them.
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s not about moving to T4-only when those run out. It’s about moving to T4 with T3..both..and maintaining optimal lab results from both of them. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Paulina
I started on NP in June and by November, I was barely functioning. Swelling in my hand and feet, due to the swelling it was difficult to walk, muscle soreness, fog, hair loss, weight gain (30lbs) this cause me sever hardship. Dosage 60 mcg with the 330 embossed on the pill. I did report this to the CDC. Two of my other friends experience the same issue.
Chrissy
I’m ready to make the switch from NP NDT to T3/T4 synthetics but not sure the best way to make the switch. Do I do it slowly over time or just take my NDT one day and then switch entirely to synthetics the next day? Thanks so much.
Janie Bowthorpe
One grain of NDT equals 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3. That should help based on what you were on. Yes, some are switching over in one day. But we also found it’s important to test the free T3 and free T4 within a few weeks to see if it was a good switch, or if tweaking up or down is needed.
Chrissy
Perfect, that’s what I’ll try. My doc and I had figured out the ratios we just couldn’t decide the best way to actually make the switch. Thanks for everything.
Eneida
Hi Janie, after 5 months of brain fog I was lucky to find out this blog saying there was something wrong with NP so now have been on 19 mcg of T4 and 9 mcg T3 roughly equivalent to 1 grain. I used to be on 2 1/2 grains of NP. My free t3 is only 2.7 and t4 1.1 and I still feel cold and brain fogged, but I’ve tried raising by the equivalent of a 1/4 grain and my heart speeds up at night to about 75 from 58 normal waking me up often. Should I just raise any way and will the heart beating fast go away in a few days? My cortisol is a bit low but but not too bad. My ferritin is 52. Thank you so much for any guidance you can provide. Eneida
Janie Bowthorpe
Eneida, one grain has 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3. Those amounts are just starting dosesfor someone just starting out with having T3 in their treatment.
And if you react badly when trying to raise, this page applies: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Karen
Ok just got a phone call from Acella months later inquiring about my problems after talking np. He said it was a follow up from FDA report I made. Wanted to know if I had any new health issues and I said yes I just had to have an MRI because they found something growing on my liver in a CT in the ER. I still am unable to eat without pain and reflux. Keep on reporting to the FDA I think something is happening but don’t know what. I told him I don’t think they are doing anything.so why bother . I still would like to know what caused me to be so sick months after stopping np.
Lynn
So sorry! I feel like I haven’t been the same since I took it and can’t seem to get back to normal. What are you taking now for your hypothyroidism?
Karen
I am back to using nature throid. Still having a hard time raising my dose.I cannot use synthetic t4 allergic to all of them.
Janie Bowthorpe
Naturethroid went south, Karen. We find it’s far better to go to T3-only if there is issue with fillers.
And what do you mean by allergic to T4? Overall, doesn’t exist as an allergy. May be fillers instead.
Lynn
Naturethroid is where my problems began. After taking it for 6 years with no problems I was switched to WP when it was on back order. When I was switched back to it in June I started having all sorts of problems and that’s how I ended up on NP. Right using Armour but not optimal yet. Going slow.
Janet
Did he say anything about whether they’re making changes? I’m sure for legal reasons they won’t admit to any fault in the product. I haven’t heard from them yet and I also filed a MedWatch report with the FDA. Hang on to your old bottle in case we can find a lab to do contaminant testing. I’ve put in a few inquiries.
Lynn
Hi Janie,
I know I am under dosed on Armour but am slowly increasing because I have been so sensitive to medication since the NDT debacle. It seems that I am losing hair the more I increase it. Shouldn’t that be getting better? That was my first symptom when Naturethroid went bad. My hair got softer and frizzy and started to fall out. I’m scared to increase more if it is the Armour causing it.
Janet
Lynn, because the hair loss occurs several weeks after the stress on the system, you may still be losing hair from the bad NP period. I kept losing some hair after I started Armour, but I also had some thyroid swelling. Like you I was concerned it might be the new medication but decided to keep with it for a while. The swelling went down (probably was a goiter from the NP and then weeks on Synthroid) and today I noticed new little hair sprouts all along my hairline. That was so exciting! In the past that’s always been the sign that I’m getting the correct mix of T4 and T3 and starting to stabilize.
Lynn
Thanks for your reply. The weird thing is that the bad Naturethroid really made it shed and two weeks after I started the good NP it slowed down significantly and then the month I started the urine NP it started to shed again. I stopped and tried a synthetic t4/t3 combo and a couple of week later it stopped completely and I had new growth but it gave me a bad headache so now trying Armour and no headache but the hair shredding is increasing with each new dose increase to get optimal. I feel more tired as well so worried that Armour may not be working for me or that to take enough for my labs to be optimal will make my hair loss worse?
Jennifer
Janie,
I am taking compounded thyroid and the last time I got it re-filled, the expiration date was only three months out. It had no odor whatsoever (not the characteristic “piggy” odor or anything). I had been given that same lot# before so I know the medication is getting older. Before, it had 5 or 6 months out before expiration and had the characteristic odor. What I’m wondering is if it is still potent enough to keep my thyroid at the same level or could I possibly start going hypo on it since it appears to be losing its strength? – (or I assume it’s losing its strength since it has become odorless).
Thank you. I don’t want to get messed up on it; it’s always a long ways back to normal.
Jennifer
Janie Bowthorpe
Our experiences say that it’s probably fine since porcine powder has a long lifespan. Maybe you can see what happens.
Michele
Janie, what is the life of NDT? I have some really old stuff that “expires in 2016” that I have been using. It’s the reformulated Erfa, but is better than the NP stuff, and then I also have Armour that was reformulated and it turns to “paste” sublingually, so don’t know if it’s any good or not…and I think the situation with that was they used talc instead of dextrose in the reformulation. Any thoughts? Thanks. Also (sorry for all the questions), how long does T3 last? I bought lots and have it in the freezer, but it’s really old, wrapped 2 times in foil and then ziplock baggies and then frozen…someone said to do that ages ago).
Janie Bowthorpe
NDT has a long life, apparently. But that was before they were all changed, so no telling about the changed ones.
Not sure which reformulated Armour you are mentioning. If it was 2009 or 2015, Armour became bad.
Michele
Thanks Janie. My Armour expired in 2016, that’s all it says on the bottle. The Cytomel and Cynomel are all in the freezer and since they are synthetic, I am hoping that if I were to need them, they will work okay.
Kay Hargis
Since my thyroidectomy in 2005, I have tried the synthetic and the various NDT replacement thyroid products. Palpitations have been the worse side effect of all of them, but some nausea and flu like symptoms have come in varying degree as well. But nothing like the miserable symptoms that came along with the NDT changes in late 2018 and all of 2019, apparently as a result of outsourcing the pig raising and processing to overseas sites. One really begins to lose heart when we see there is no hope for any other options. We who depend on these meds to stay alive despair that there seem to be no businessmen anywhere who have the integrity to care enough for their fellow human beings to produce high quality products in the USA where they know they can control the safety and quality of their product and thereby relieve the suffering of millions of others.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Kay. It is true that none of the NDT’s are the consistent and great NDT’s they used to be. But with what you described since 2005, it sounds like they are all revealing that you could have a cortisol and/or iron problem. Check this out: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/iron-and-cortisol
Also, can can’t stay on non-optimal doses too long or our hypo comes back with a vengeance. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
C DeBrun
Yes I’ve noticed a massive difference in the NP Thyroid since April-May and i regularly get my bloods checked which are all over the place. My TSH is currently .864 Free t3 2.6 Free t4 7.5 and cortisol is decreasing and is now at 51. If I encounter any kind of stress my throat closes up to the point where i really strain to talk. I cant sleep at night brcause I wake every twenty minutes. Lately I’ve been picking up any ailments such as flu etc but getting it really bad. Also the lympocytes in my bloods recently said 4.1. I feel awful and unfortunately my GP doesn’t seem to know what to do. I went to see a ‘specislist’ and he said my bloods were fine….and recommended LDN… can anyone help me?
Janie Bowthorpe
Your labs are super low. This is our goal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
But you have a cortisol problem (as revealed by your sleep issues especially, for one). But testing is about saliva,not blood. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/saliva-cortisol Then we treat the results. This is where you need to study Chapter 6 in the updated revision STTM book and also teach it to your doctor. It’s the one with a blueish background and a girl with her fists up.This one: https://laughinggrapepublishing.com/product/sttm/
C DeBrun
Yes I’ve really noticed a change in the NP thyroid since April and I’ve been getting bloods regularly. My TSH is .864 and free t3 is 2.6 and free t4 is 7.5 also my cortisol is continually dropping and I feel awful. My throat feels like there is a large lump in it and if I encounter any kind of stress it gets to the point where my voice weakens. I can’t get a full nights sleep because I wake every twenty minutes…..can anyone help as GP doesn’t seem to know and ‘apparent specialist’ reckons I need LDN.
Sue R
Lab results 7 weeks after switching from NP Thyroid, to Synthetic T4 (Levoxyl) and Synthetic T3 (Sigma Pharm). I had a total thyroidectomy in 2011. I take 4.5 mg LDN (low dose naltrexone) at bedtime along with my Thyroid meds. Hair loss has improved greatly, heart palpitations have stopped. One negative I have noticed is that I have a lump in the throat sensation since starting the synthetic, but not sure if it is the meds or due to tight neck muscles. I have always been in the low range of FT4, even when on NDT. I am thinking about increasing my T4 med slightly to see if I can get more optimal. The current dose is a 4 to 1 ratio. I do not have a cortisol issue. Overall I feel better than when I was on NP, but I don’t feel optimal yet.
TSH – 1.49
FT3 – 3.4
FT4 – .7
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Sue. You’re still very underdosed, thus still very hypothyroid. That’s why the lump in the throat, lots of time. See this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Sue R
Thank you Janie. I feel like I am underdosed, but not sure how I should adjust. I am currently taking 50mg Levoxyl and 12.5mg Cytomel (4 to 1 ratio). I am not getting compounded meds due to cost, so am limited to tablet dosages available. I was thinking of increasing to 75mg Levoxyl and 25 Cytomel (3 to 1 ratio), or 75 mg Levoxyl and 17.5 Cytomel (4.28 to 1 ratio). Do either of those choices sound like a reasonable change? With past experience I know I become hyper very easy with too much of a change.
Janie Bowthorpe
Raises would depend on one’s free T4 and free T3. We are always seeking optimal frees: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
If you have hyper-like symptoms when raising, that can be a sign of an adrenal problem, plus iron should be checked, too: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/iron-and-cortisol
Sue R
I am going to increase my dosage to 75mg Levoxyl and 17.5 Cytomel (Sigma Pharm), retest again in 6-8 weeks, and will post new labs. Thank you for the additional info on Iron and Adrenals. I will look into those if I have problems raising my dosage. I am so thankful for your site and all the great information you provide.
Lynn
Is a lump in the throat a symptom of hypothyroidism? What about acid reflux? It has just started for me n the last two weeks and I can’t figure out why.
Janie Bowthorpe
A nodule could be a sign of being still hypothyroid, as can acid reflux. This is our goal to not be still be hypo: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Nodules can also go with Hashimoto’s and a continued attack with high antibodies. The least common is thyroid cancer. But the first paragraph is more common.
Sue R
New labs after 7 weeks on new dosage of synthetic T4 & T3. Lump in throat sensation has resolved, in general feeling better. So glad I made the switch from NP Thyroid to synthetic. It feels good to know that I am on a stable medication that hopefully won’t change. Glad to be off the wild ride of NDT.
TSH: 1.12 – previous lab 1.49
FT4: .7 (range .6-1.1) – previous lab .7
FT3: 3.5 (range 2.5-3.9) – previous lab 3.4
Current dosage 50mg T4 (Levoxyl) plus 1 extra 50mg tab per week; 12.5mg T3 (Sigma Pharm generic)
Doctor increased T4 by 50mg/week (1 additional tab per week), kept T3 the same.
I will retest again in 4-6 months to make sure things stay stable. I only had to adjust the synthetic once to get to this point, so I’m pretty happy about that.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, others have felt the same way about T4 and T3. 🙂
Do you know that you aren’t optimal, thus it’s going to backfire eventually. We see this happen all the time. Check this out: https://stopthethyroidmaness.com/optimal
Sue R
I have looked at the optimal page a few times, and I see that I have low FT4. Reading that page, I think I may have an adrenal issue. Have you heard of anyone taking CBD Oil to help with adrenals, or Adaptogenic herbs? I know from experience that if I increase my T3 & T4 dosage again that I will have hyper symptoms. Do you think that Adrenals (cortisol) could be what’s causing the low FT4?
Janie Bowthorpe
We’ve learned for years that it’s important not to guess and order and do a saliva cortisol test. Otherwise you could be treating the wrong thing. https://sttm.mymedlab.com/sttm-profiles/zrt-saliva-adrenal-4-sample–2
CBD calms, but it won’t raise low cortisol enough, we’ve noted.
Do you have the handy Lab Values card yet? It’s what you can compare your results to: https://laughinggrapepublishing.com/product/lab-values-card/
Janet
Just got my labs back from several weeks on Armour.
Free T3 5.1
Free T4 0.78
TSH 0.703
That’s way better than my last tests on Synthroid alone. I still have some swelling of my thyroid gland but hopefully that will go down if numbers stay optimal.
Janie Bowthorpe
Those aren’t optimal. You are pooling. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/pooling
Janet
These have always been typical levels for me when I’m feeling good. We check cortisol, iron, etc and everything is in normal range. I have an immune deficiency that causes abnormal cytokines so it affects diurnal cortisol levels somewhat (high normal morning, low normal night), but nothing that needs treating. My doctor said if the swelling doesn’t go down I can get an ultrasound, but I’ve never had nodules, antibodies or even abnormal RT3 so he thinks it was a reaction to the weeks that I was on Synthroid alone and will go away.
Susan
Hi. Just wanted fo chime in. Ive been on armour for a few months and dont feel well. Im always so tired, yet cant sleep. No physical energy whatsoever. I just don’t feel good or positive yet im not depressed. I didnt do well on armour in the past either. I take hc, 20 mg. I do take ativan but have for years. In the past i never had this exhaustion. Ive also had bad heartburn since np and now armour. I never needed prilosec. I was at one point taking pepsin hcl and felt much better. I was wondering about compounded time released t3? I did ok on cytomel for a long time, then it felt like it hit me fast and was gone in like 2-3 hours. Im hesitant to go compounded t3 cause of the cost, cause of the pita to get to an optimal dose, simce i dont feel optimal now. I feel like im taking more than i should, more than i have in the past-90 mg armour(thats 1.5 grains), then 25 cytomel, then another 45 mg armour. Ive been doing this for 10 years now and in the beginning when i was really “on” it tracking temps, taking notes, my optimal was 2.25 grains-2.5 or equalivalent cytomel. I dont have the money for a pay out of pocket doc. I just think trying to get to optimal with compounding would be a lot of hassle and expense. How would they do it? If the dose was too high, could i cut the pill and adjust ? Im sick of this bs. Is anyone on compounded t3? Also the massive weight gain that will not budge. Is like to finally get optimal so i can finally wean hc!
Janie Bowthorpe
Susan, when we are tired on an NDT that is still working like Armour, it means we aren’t optimal. Study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Also, if you did a saliva cortisol test and your results were super low, 20 mg has never been enough of HC. It underdoses us. Thus the adrenals continue to be stressed. Read Chapter 6 in the updated revision STTM book. This one: https://laughinggrapepublishing.com/product/sttm/ It’s very important to learn from years of our successful experiences, both for you and to teach your doctor.
Lynn
I’m and on month two of armour and not sure if I am getting better. Not as tired as on NP but am pretty sure I am under dosed but going slow. Question about being underdosed. Since everyone has varying needs isn’t it possible for someone to be optimal at say 1 grain of Naturethroid which I took for years and feel fine? If I was underdosed did it take 4 years to burn out my adrenals? Also in regards to hair loss, mine started about three weeks after switching from WP back to Naturethroid in 6/19. Does that means the hair loss was due to the 5 months I was on WP (1/19-5/19) or the reformulated Naturethroid. I assumed it was the Naturethroid because at the same time as the hair loss I also developed joint pain, fatigue and brain fog pretty badly. Right now I am still tired, some hair loss and a little reflux which is new. Joint pain is gone but brain fog is still there but a little better.
Karen
Can anyone tell me if armour pills are speckled also. The last time I tried it I couldn’t breathe good.the nature throid are speckled but they say they are getting the powder from the us and Canada
Janet
Karen, they’re not speckled. I rinse the outer coating off and then you can see some darker spots once it’s wet, but nothing like the NP.
Lynn
I was just wishful thinking about if any of the NDT’s find there way back to their old formulas. How will we know? They have scared us so badly no one will want to try them. I’m still slowly working my way up to optimal on Armour. I know that I am having a little more hair fall than usual and have had reflux the last two days since I increased. My doctor said that your hair reflects what happened two to three months ago. Naturethroid is what started massive hair fall I believe and it started about three weeks after starting the new back in stock one. Anyone know if my doctor is right about hair fall timing?
Janie Bowthorpe
The problem might be that the old formula used pig powder that was quite better than what they are getting now. And no telling what other crap was put into NP Thyroid for whatever reason…but of course, secrecy and denial abounds.
Janet
Lynn, that’s called telogen effluvium when it’s related to some kind of stressful event or trauma to the body (and the bad tablets were definitely trauma for many of us). And the doctor is correct:
“Telogen effluvium is a common cause of temporary hair loss. It is characterized by an abrupt onset of hair shedding usually seen several months after a triggering event.”
This is a really good article about it. You’ll notice that iron deficiency will make it worse so like Janie always says, it’s really important to keep an eye on your iron status. I’ve had it happen several times and fortunately my hair always grows back to normal thickness after my health improves.
https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/321590.php
Janet
I’ve been on Armour alone now for a few weeks and seem to be fine with it. I wasn’t sure it was going to be as effective but the heating system was malfunctioning in our building this week and my apartment has been in the 60s which normally would do me in. My hands were a bit cold but my body temperature is staying normal. (When I am optimal my temperature is exactly 98.6 and when I had trouble with the bad NatureThroid and NP it dropped significantly.) So I’m taking that as a good sign. I also have been able to get back to my normal exercise routine and I can only do that when T3 is in a good range.
Renee
I have an observation that I wanted to share with everyone here. I have been taking 120mg of NP thyroid since 2018. I was taking one 120mg pill per day, but when I had to get a refill this month, the distributor sent LOT# G, with the speckled pills, to my pharmacy in the 120mg tablet. I said I didn’t want it, so my pharmacist called my doctor and got my prescription changed. I now take two 60mg pills per day. My big concern was that I didn’t want to take the speckled cat pee pills.
I kept about 6 of my old “good” 120mg tablets so I could compare them to the new 60mg tablets when I got them. I wanted to determine if they looked or smelled different to me.
Let me say this….the new 60mg tablets appear fine visually. I personally don’t see any speckles. BUT, they really smell like ammonia/cat pee and/or chemicals to me. I stuck my nose in my old bottle, with the old pills, and sniffed and then immediately stuck my nose in the new bottle and sniffed the new pills. I noticed a DISTINCT difference in smell. My old 120mg pills have the normal “piggy” smell to me. The new tablets smell nasty and chemically.
I have been taking the smelly new ones for over a week now, and I seem okay for the most part. My hair isn’t falling out. I AM gaining weight and I’m tired, but I will attribute that to the holidays since I ate stuff I shouldn’t eat, and the stress of the holidays often exhaust me. I will be doing a round of the HCG diet in January. If I don’t lose any weight on it, then I will know that there is a problem with my thyroid for sure.
I’m not having any bad reactions that I can definitively attribute to the smelly pills, but I will say that i have to hold my breath to take them. The smell of ammonia, or whatever it is, makes me want to gag. It’s so gross.
I didn’t get the lot number on my new 60mg tablets, but I can call my pharmacy and get it if anyone thinks it is important.
So yeah…there’s that. *sigh*
Janie Bowthorpe
You can lose weight with the HCG diet even while hypothyroid though. But you need to be very careful assuming you’re going to be okay on the new smelly tablets. They have caused several to see their adrenals become stressed, their iron go down, and all sorts of other problems. It’s up to you, but most have gotten to the point where they say it’s not worth it to try them.
By the way, most HCG for weight loss is super hard to get now. The FDA claimed they were not safe, even though many have successfully used them. Hope you find a good one somehow.
Renee
Hi Janie. thanks for your input! I get my HCG through my functional medicine doctor, who orders from a compounding pharmacy in Florida. I am hoping and praying it is just as good as it has always been before. Even with that said, I will be vigilant in listening to my body, and if I start feeling really poorly, I will go for blood work. I will not hesitate. I’m not going to mess around. I had a really awful experience after the WP debacle and I got really sick on Naturethroid. I don’t want to go back there again as it took me MONTHS to get sorted out again.
I’m just so terrified of synthroid. I was on it for years and my body slowly broke down to the point where I actually thought I might die. I HATE being tied to big Pharma for the rest of my life. Ugh.
Janie, thank you so much for this website. I come here every single day to read and to see the latest updates. This site keeps me informed and it keeps me sane. You have my eternal gratitude.
Janie Bowthorpe
You’re welcome! And do know that Synthroid as Synthroid is and was not the problem. The problem was being on Synthroid or any other T4 “all by itself” which was the problem. It is not a problem by adding synthetic T3 to synthetic T4 and getting optimal.
Laura
Thanks for all you do, Janie. In August, I became aware of the issues with NP, but kept the faith that Acella would fix these problems. In my experience, I definitely noticed a difference in NP since spring 2019, and I am concerned that it has caused my cortisol to lower again. Sounds like others are having the same issues, so if anyone is dealing with this successfully (or not), I would like to hear from you. I was diagnosed with Hashi’s about two years ago, and found out I had adrenal exhaustion because my free T3 was pooling when I raised NDT. I have been taking adrenal cortex since my diagnosis, and have had optimal frees for over a year. Everything was perfect, and I was feeling wonderful up until Spring 2019. I had my labs done in April 2019, and my free T3 was a little over the range, which was probably the first sign, then came sleep issues, aches, appetite, fatigue, etc. The next labs were scheduled for August. My doc had switched practices, 1.5 hours away. When I saw her in August for labs, unfortunately the nurse did not request the proper thyroid panel, so I had nothing to compare to April. My next labs were scheduled for March 2020. By December 2019, I was crashing at 3 in the afternoon, and could hardly keep my eyes open. I was then convinced that NP had to go, so last week, I decided to request a full thyroid panel and make the switch to Armour. Still waiting for the lab results, but happy to say that after 5 days on Armour, I am having a bit of improvement in fatigue, the aches have almost completely gone away, and sleep is much better. What kind of poison is Acella putting in NP!!?? I will NEVER go back to taking NP! As it turns out, Armour is much cheaper than NP with my insurance, so I am very happy about that, too. I’ve been taking my temps which are fluctuating from day to day with a difference of 0.4F. I feel like I should do another saliva test, to see exactly where I’m at, but scared to go off of adrenal cortex right now. So I guess I will just have to monitor my temps and wait until my next labs in March and see if Armour gets me back to optimal and my symptoms subside. What a scary disappointing mess!
housemaid
If anyone would like to leave a review of the new stinky NP thyroid pills on WebMD, please do so. It might at least save some people from wasting money and damaging their health by buying these bad pills. https://www.webmd.com/drugs/drugreview-154794-NP+Thyroid
Amy
I just spoke with fda . People need to fill at the medwatch report online on fdas website . If they get a lot of complaints Re NP thyroid , they will investigate .
Helen McKinley
I’m wondering if I’m having an allergic reaction to the new NP? My thyroid levels (although not optimal) haven’t changed significantly, but I’ve had a chronic cough, chest congestion and post-nasal issues for three months. I’ve been trying to figure out what’s up since I didn’t have a cold or flu and usually my allergies don’t cause these symptoms. I suddenly realized it started around the time or shortly after I started the new NP. I’m going to use some of my stash of good NDT to see if it clears up. Wondering now how long that will take and what I should ask my doctor to prescribe next….
Michele
Helen, I had the same symptoms several weeks after starting on the latest RX of NP thyroid. Mine didn’t look different and didn’t have spots like the photos, but they did smell strange and I took them anyway. When someone else commented on the chronic cough that would come out of nowhere I really took notice as I’d been having that. Went to my NP and she said I had post nasal drip and it was from something in my throat…I stopped the NP and went back to really old (expired 2016) Erfa and Armour and started taking those reformulated ones that I left behind in the cabinet. After 2 weeks the throat/cough stuff stopped, but now I’m tired all the time and my hair is falling out once again. Like others, I have no clue what to do next. I can’t take Synthroid, but do fine with Cytomel…although my FT4 is low even with NDT, and so I want to get that in my system…how?
Janie Bowthorpe
It may not be that you “can’t take Synthroid”. It’s more about that you “can’t take Synthroid without T3”. We need to take them together if we are going to switch.
Michele
Janie, thank you for the response. You are correct. The 2 endos I went to both tried me on Synthroid alone, which was a nightmare for me (nearly burned down my house!) I might try the Synthroid with the Cytomel after I finish up with my expired Erfa and see how that works. Boy will it be expensive (no insurance for either!) My hair is starting to fall out again and I’m really tired and fall asleep in the afternoons. Not my normal at all.
housemaid
I was checking out the price of Armour since it seems to be working for several people. I also checked out the price of NP just from curiosity, Late last summer I paid about $115 for a 90 day supply of stinky 2 grain tablets of NP at Walgreen’s with Good Rx. Now that same 90 tablets prescription is selling at Walgreen’s for $54.51 with Good Rx, and Walmart has it for only $38.21. Sounds like a fire sale. Acella is finding it hard to sell these rotten pills! The FDA, the pharmacies, and the manufacturers don’t care about us, but Acella (and RLC Labs) do care about making money. I hope they’ve discovered they can’t make money selling a bad product.
Jennifer
Janie,
I take 90MG of compounded porcine thyroid daily. (I was previously taking Acella’s NP Thyroid.) If I have to switch over to synthetic hormone, how much Synthroid and Cytomel should I take? I’m also seeing in these posts where many folks do better with the SygmaPharma Cytomel than others for some reason. When you first start on synthetic T3, do you start out slowly and build up to the dosage that feels right? And then test? Are there any at-home thyroid testing kits that are available and dependable?
I used to take Synthroid and there were times I would have panic-attack-like episodes and it would take a week for it to get out of my system. It was horrible! I don’t have that problem with the NDT, so I really hate to get back on the synthetic stuff.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. One grain is equal to 25 mcg T3 in effect. Yes, many do quite well on the Sigma Pharm version of T3. 90 mg compounded procine is quite small and you wouldn’t be optimal on that. So moving over the equivalent amount of T4 and T3 is probably workable, we would guess. This will be different than just being on Synthroid alone. You’ll have direct T3 in your treatment. Remember to get optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Jennifer
Thank you, Janie. Then it sounds like I would take 1 1/2 tablets of the 25 mcg Cytomel, correct? Can these be taken sublingually? I searched for generic brands of Cytomel. I came up with SigmaPharm, Mayne, Mylan, Sun Pharma (from overseas market), Greenstone, and King (the info for King was from April 2013). It seems the only one with microcrystalline cellulose and hypromellose was Mayne so I know I couldn’t take that one.
What about my dosage of Synthroid? Would I take 90mg Synthroid since I was taking 90mg Acella NP Thyroid – or would I cut it back because I’m getting the T3 of Cytomel? I’m confused about switching from one to the other.
Janie Bowthorpe
Jennifer, I made a mistake just referring to T3. I’m with my sons for the holidays and distracted. One grain of any version of NDT is equal to 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3. So by that, you can figure it out if you move to the two synthetics. And do remember that you’ll be underdosed, even if you initially feel better.
Lynn
Janie,
Because of adrenal stress I am moving slow with getting to my optimal dose of armour to avoid the weird headache I was getting with synthetic t3/t4. Can you move too slow and cause problems with being underdosed? I’m moving up after 30 days instead of two weeks.
Janie Bowthorpe
You need to treat the adrenal stress, not move up slow with Armour.
Karen
Can anyone on here tell me if they have added talc to nature throid. They say it would be in the paper insert that the pharmacy gets with the pills.I cannot take synthetic I am allergic. So I am going to try nature throid again I have no thyroid function because of rai.just hoping someone can clear this up.Just got done trying tirosint and synthroid bad reaction again. Thanks
Janie Bowthorpe
You really don’t want to go over to naturethroid. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/23/the-sad-saga-of-where-we-are-today-as-hypothyroid-patients/
Karen
Well I have to take something armour makes me wheez, I have read where other people went back to it after the bad np and are feeling better. Just wanted to know if they added talc.so if anyone knows please post I am pretty sick right now and can barely function.
Jennifer
Karen,
Have you tried compounded NDT?
Janet
I’m really sensitive to talc and several other fillers (especially calcium sulfate). So far I’m doing okay with Armour. I had severe reactions to the two generic T3 meds I tried. I have had some trouble with Armour’s formulation in the past but it seems to be a bit different now. I do rinse off the tablet to remove the coating before taking it sublingually. This is from the product insert:
“The inactive ingredients are calcium stearate, dextrose, microcrystalline cellulose, sodium starch glycolate and opadry white.”
Lynn
I started Armor a month ago and just did labs. They are getting slightly better than when I did the synthetic t3/t4 combo which was making the top of my head hurt. I am still not optimal but am going slow due to the weird reactions and sensitivity I have remaining from the Naturethroid/Np thyroid debacle of last summer.
Free t4 – 1.13 (.82-1.77)
Free t3 – 2.7 (2.0 – 4.4)
Rev t3 – 17.30 (9.2 – 24.1)
TSH 2.89 (.45 – 4.5)
My Armour still smells good.
Jackie
Just an update, folks. After I contacted Acella last weekend and left a message, I got a voicemail from David from Acella who asked me to send him an email documenting my experience. So it seems like they are taking this issue seriously. I’ve sent him and email and will report back what he says.
Janie Bowthorpe
Jackie, I think we all have to be careful assuming they are taking this seriously. Many many many have documented their experiences all while many more are innocently trying NP and report horrible reactions. This has been going on since summer even BEFORE the obvious changes.
Mimi McClurg
I talked to David from Acella over a month ago and I don’t believe they’ve done anything except change out my meds. These are a bit better. No smell and look and taste like old *Good* pills. I am still having issues from the *Tainted* pills making me sick, everyday gets a bit better. My labs were still off this week.
I am going to need to refill next week. I am worried wondering if anyone has found a better solution?
Janie Bowthorpe
People have gotten very unimpressed with their request to send them back. They feel fooled by Acella as stated in many groups.
Watch your frees. There were non-changed ones in the summer which were bringing back hypo, including fatigue in the late afternoon. My husband was one and there are others who reported it.
Di
OH NO!! I had finally made peace with a good compounded porcine powder from an AZ compounding pharmacy…and the latest batch is nothing more
than rotten NP–smell, taste, stomach pains, nausea, etc!!! It is definitely in the supply chain now, probably worldwide.
It is the porcine powder. (My filler is lactose. period.) What a nightmare. Been sick since August, and trying to keep
both my jobs and take care of my family—not to mention, just enjoy life again!
Karen
Di yes it is. Every time I see a new comment all I think is report this to the FDA so they will have no choice but to test this crap. I still have my bad pills just by chance they move forward I have a case but not enough official complaints came in to do anything.So instead of telling it only on here file an FDA complaint they need to be stopped from selling this bad porcine powder. I still cannot eat without pain three months after stopping np.
Di
I will do that right away.
Janet
I think we have all hesitated to file a complaint with the FDA in the past because we felt the remaining NDT manufacturers would be harassed. But there’s really no one left to protect except the manufacturers of Armour and that brand has been around so long I don’t think it’s in jeopardy.
I filed a MedWatch complaint (FDA’s program) several weeks ago and finally got something in the mail last week saying they had received my complaint. But there was no other contact or follow-up. I have a feeling they wait until they get several on the same product before investigating to be sure it wasn’t just a coincidence someone reacted.
So perhaps if enough of us do that they will collect some samples for testing. I’m not sure if we’ll ever see the results…that’s all usually handled internally. I’ve been checking out various pharmaceutical testing labs to see if any are affordable enough to check my two lots. I sure would like to know what made me so sick.
Catherine
That is alarming! The enamel on my front teeth wore off rapidly after starting NP thyroid in April due to low stomach acid from the bad pills starting in June. This is serious and causes me extreme emotional and psychological stress. I switched to compounded porcine powder cut with glycine 2 and a half months ago. I have been doing better.
I had resigned myself to paying $100 a month out of pocket for the compounded porcine powder. To hear that you got a bad batch is scary. I actually got a batch last month that I about to start that smelled slightly off. I asked the pharmacist about it and he swore that it was from the same batch as the month before. I am not sure if I believe him. I will provide updates.
Last thing for me to do is go to Tirosint and cytomel. This has been a tortuous experience with side effects that are life long.
Di
The compounding pharmacy says “Nothing has changed.”
And maybe their supplier really is the same one they were using.
This is going to be hard to trace.
Dana
I am on Naturethroid 65 and I can’t get out of bed. Exhausted, living on high doses of caffiene.
Bloodwork shows TSH normal, free T4 lower end, and T3 definitely low!
I don’t know what to change to. Hair thinning slightly and weight gain!
Was on T3 alone for about a year but would crash after 4 hrs and need more. After that tried synthroid but had horrible joint pains and couldn’t do it.
I eat a high fiber diet and green tea.
I prefer bioidentical if possible or whatever NDT will really work. My NP thyroid 60 before, were white tablets.
If I were to try a generic T4 and T3 together, which generic do you recommend that won’t cause joint pains? (The Rx plan that gave me generic Synthroid comes from CVS network supplier and I couldn’t bear it.)
Please help.
Gill
Hi I have been on NP Thyroid for approximately two years since there was the problem with the WP Thyroid. All has been really good until the last 3 or 4 months. I am now on my 2nd lot of NP thyroid and it is one of the batches which have been listed. I am now hypo again, feel drained and tired and have had a number of migraines in a short space of time.
Has anyone swapped over to WP thyroid now it is available again? If so, how are you feeling? I know Armour has had issues too but know that WP worked for me. I’ve seen my GP this morning in the UK and even if I went back onto thyroxine (which I’m loathed to do) she can’t prescribe the liothyronine as I don’t convert T4 to T3. Follow up blood test done this morning and waiting to hear back from my endocrinologist but know it won’t be good news.
Any light anyone an shed on changing tablets would be great.
Thanks
Gill
terry
My IFM DR switched me over to WP Thyroid back at the beginning of September and I started feeling better. The only dose available is 1 grain (i’m taking 2 atm). I’m not optimal though, still working on that. She actually just dropped my dose a few weeks back because my rt3 was up again. We’ll see how it goes. If my labs aren’t better the next time we check I’m asking for t4 and t3.
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s probably a good idea to switch to T4 and T3. Seeing a growing body of people doing awful on WP. And having RT3 is also about treating the cause.
Janie
Gill
Thank you for your replies. Just waiting to hear back from my endo with blood results ….don’t want to end up wasting more money on something that is making me ill. Just hope I can get the T3 too as GP’s can no longer prescribe it apparently. Good luck to all. Gill
Terry
Janine, I’m working with two IFM Drs. Slowly ‘peeling the onion’ we’re currently working on mold/mycotxins. We still haven’t been able to get my TgAb antibodies down or figure out what’s causing them to be super high.
Jackie
Since picking up my latest bottle of NP in October I’ve become a complete wreck. Unbearable fatigue like I’ve never felt before; wrenching, burning stomach pain; constant flu-like symptoms; and wonky labs. I checked my lot number and it appears to correspond with bad lots listed elsewhere on this site.
I’ll be switching to Armour this week.
This debacle has cost me over a thousand dollars as I’ve gone to several doctors and have had multiple tests, including an MRI, to find out what’s wrong with me. I wonder if there’s some sort of class action lawsuit that can by filed against Acella for this.
Karen
This sounds just like me I am scheduled for an MRI because they found a lump on my liver with a CT scan.I have not been able to recover from taking the np thyroid for four and half months at eight pills a day. I find it interesting about the post after you about the amimes . I looked it up and it said they use chlorine to sanitize the product which will give off an amonia odor. Bingo cat pee smell . If used in high concentration it is toxic. So I think they got bad glands and our using them. Like trying to clean rotten meat. As for a law suit against them not going anywhere. Not enough reports to the FDA to proceed. This I know for a fact my report went nowhere because people are not reporting the bad reaction to np.God help us who are physically sick from this.
R.C. Mandeville
Hi Janie,
I also noticed that my latest rx of NP Thyroid (120 mg, received October 2019) seemed to have a very different appearance, odor, and taste than previous rx’s. After taking it for a couple of weeks, I had digestive upset daily, heart palpitations, felt weepy and down (I’m a psychotherapist, so this surprised and concerned me as nothing had changed in my life to warrant this) and also started to have sudden acid reflux symptoms – severe. I have notified my MD and just picked up Armour and started that today. Crossing fingers I do okay on it.
The reason I am writing is that my partner is a Chemist in the pharmaceutical / drug discovery industry. I asked him to smell this latest rx of NP Thyroid. He sniffed it, and immediately said, “It smells like you have free amines in there.” He went on to say that “free amines are not good drug practice, and is indicative of *possible* compound decomposition; i.e., possibly indicative of protein decomposition from the pigs.”
I hadn’t noticed anyone else mentioning amines and possible protein decomposition here in your comments so thought I would add that into the mix. Thank you for all you do for us – I have learned much from your site here over the years and it has been very helpful.
Best,
R.C.
Jeni
This is exactly how I was feeling for the past couple months. Heart palpitations, insomnia, horrible anxiety and debilitating depression (I’ve never experienced this in my life). I was crying nonstop. I was put on Xanax and an antidepressant. On a whim, I decided to look into my thyroid med, and low and behold things started after I picked up my latest NP script. I switched back to Armour and within 24 hours I am myself again. No Xanax needed, sleeping through the night without palpitations waking me again. I cannot believe this. I almost went out on medical leave from teaching because I could barely get in the shower much less through a day with 30 nine-year olds, and here i am a week on Armour instead of NP and those symptoms are gone..this is bananas.
Ann
Hi Jeni,
I am happy you are feeling better! Did you use the same dosage of Armour that you were using on the NP? Thanks.
Jeni Megge
I am taking the same amount of Armour, yes. Years ago, I had switched from Armour to NP back when Armour was getting hard to find and they added fillers. I just went back to Armour because I didn’t know what else to do.
I don’t know if I am optimal yet-and am guessing I probably won’t be…but just getting that NP thyroid out of my system was what got me feeling better. Whatever they put in there WAS and IS making us VERY sick! Within 48 hours my nausea was gone and my appetite returned. I had been taking at least 2 Xanax a day (which I had NEVER had in my life), and I haven’t needed ONE since I stopped the NP. Within a week and a half I have also stopped the antidepressant (which again had never taken in all my years) and am perfectly myself again. I couldn’t get out of bed and could barely get in the shower or take care of my boys. Now I am right back to myself. I am sleeping through the night again and not waking with heart palpitations and anxiety. The more I think about it the more I am absolutely ENRAGED. As a teacher, I had people covering my class for me, thinking I was somehow having a nervous breakdown. I could have lost my job. This is not okay, and it scares me to think there are people that have no idea and are continuing to ingest this POISON. I keep thinking what could have happened to me had I continued to take this. I spent tons of money on therapy, doctors appointments, prescriptions, even thousands of dollars on a GeneSight test to find an antidepressant and anxiety medication that would work-All for NOTHING. Something needs to be done-they are making people EXTREMELY sick!!
RC Mandalay
Hi Jeni,
I had the same exact experience as you after switching to Armour. As mentioned in my original comment, above, I was experiencing anxiety, heart palpitations, weepiness, acid reflux, digestive upset / diarrhea daily, etc, on the last couple of batches of NP Thyroid but did not connect it with the NP Thyroid until checking in here on STTM.
As mentioned, my drug chemist boyfriend said that the NP Thyroid smelled like free amines (that’s the cat pee smell) suggesting something is very wrong with these NP Thyroid pills. After switching to Armour (which I have never taken before) I felt completely fine within two days. Able to sleep; heart rate went from 110-beats BPM to 65 BPM; no more digestive upset, acid reflux, anxiety, depression, or weepiness (thank goodness for that, given I’m a therapist – I also could have become unable to work had this continued were I to have remained on the NP Thyroid).
At this point, I feel strongly that something is very, very wrong with the NP Thyroid pills and they need to be recalled immediately. This needs to be taken very seriously. In the meantime, I’ll know in four weeks when I get my labs done how my levels are and if Armour will work for me – Of course, even if it does, we never know when we will have something happen that results in our being unable to take it and/or access it. I can’t take synthetics and I have no compounding rx available where I live. This is getting scary and I feel angry that we are put in this position. To have our concerns dismissed or to be viewed as ‘histrionic’ is unacceptable and simply victimizes us twice. Enough is enough.
Angie F.
Free amines…Could “ractopamine” be one? Beta adrenergic agonist used in beef, pork, and large fowl feed as a “pro-lean” and weight gain additive?
Teresa
Hello R.C., Thanks for telling us about this. I was researching something different and came across this brief description on a website devoted to probiotics: “When protein-rich foods are fermented, they can produce biogenic amines like antihistamine and tryptamine. Some studies suggest that these amines can affect your central nervous system and either increase or decrease blood flow, which can cause headaches or migraines.” Could the pig meat used in China be old or allowed to ferment? Headaches are one of the constellation of symptoms experienced by many NP users. Let’s dig around into this subject.
housemaid
Well, the FDA letter about the Sitchuan Friendly porcine powder said that the Chinese factory was not using good manufacturing practices and was unsanitary. I picture big vats of rotting pig thyroids in that factory. I only took one bad batch NP pill and would not take another. If I’d gotten rotten meat at the grocery I would have returned it and gotten my money back, but Acella is offering no refunds.
I am worried about Thyroid-S, Janie. I recently chewed one made July 2019 and it reminded me of the bad taste that the new NP has, only milder. I didn’t smell anything but had just opened the bottle. The bad NP didn’t smell at first but 3 months later it reeked. Is the Thailand thyroid powder from Thailand or China? My 2016 Nature-throid has no smell or taste. The WP I used to take only tasted sweet. Did Thyroid-S always have a somewhat unpleasant taste?
Janie Bowthorpe
As far as the taste, we have to be careful, as even some of the former good NP’s tasted different or “bad”. I have some old NP left, and it doesn’t taste great—I chewed it again to see. And that’s always been common. But with the changed NP, the taste is worse than bad. It’s horrific.
As far as Thyroid-S, I only rarely used it. I’ve always had plenty of the former good prescription NDTs. And when I did use Thyroid-S, I never chewed it to taste it.
I am frankly worried about being on any NDT. Even if Thyroid-S is working…and even if Armour is working for some (though not all), and even if compounding pharmacies still have a working source of thyroid powder via the PCCA…..the haunting question lingers all around us i.e. when are THEY going to change to the crap NDT we are seeing with so many and we only find out with a new bottle?
Something verrry fishy is going on…and no, people need to get away from stating it’s a conspiracy to get us all off NDT. There is no proof whatsoever. But something is very fishy with how porcine powder has changed for so many pharmaceuticals…and with NP, on top of CLEAR other changes—the smell, the taste, the burning, the nausea.
The FDA goes around reporting all the bad things going on with other medications…(For example, Metformin, especially outside the US, having a carcinogen in it.) So where is the FDA about all this TOTAL AND COMPLETE CRAP going on with the very NDT that once changed our lives??
Janet
I agree, I think it probably comes down to trying to save money on raw materials and increase the supply to meet the demand. First it happened with Nature-Throid last year and you’d think Acella would have learned from that debacle. But then they did the same thing. So we jump ship to find the next safe thing and then the demand goes up and it starts all over again.
People seem to think Europe as a supplier is better than China, but it all depends on the quality of the handling and processing. Russia, Ukraine, Croatia, Serbia, Turkey, Albania, etc are all European countries. We have no idea what kind of oversight there would be.
They know what suppliers and formulations worked well for us before the changes. If they would emulate those conditions then maybe we’d get back to decent meds again. What concerns me is that no one is required to provide proof of purity and lack of contamination or degradation.
Person
This is what’s been going on with me, too… oh, the heart palpitations! I’ve been on NP thyroid since 2012, and until recently, this medicine’s been great. In my mid thirties, have never had palpitations before, and suddenly with this new batch of NP I’m a wreck. What in the world have they done to the medicine…? Something is very different and wrong with this new batch.
Kendra Bauser
Update: Switched from the new NP Thyroid which I had been taking for a week to compounded thyroid in a sublingual form.
Three days on the compounded and I am feeling back to normal.
The first night I took the new NP I hardly slept and contiued to sleep badly while taking it. Digestion slowed down significantly. Adrenals totally malfunctioned and I felt adrenaline rushes constantly (I am also on Cortisol 20mg day). Other symptoms were very itchy skin, dry skin, foot tendon injury that wouldnt heal properly.
Three days on new compounded formula, slept normally on the third day. Felt great at the gym but maybe a little hyper. Didnt crash in the afternoon during the second day. Hunger is way back, digestion is much better. Skin feels better. Mood is more positive. Foot pain is gone as of today (3rd day) But I have been resting it.
I never took the new NP long enough to do labs but I was in really bad shape after a week. Ill get my labs done after a few weeks on this compounded formula. Getting it through Pavillion Pharmacy in Atlanta GA. The Pharmasist was very knowledgable about thyroid and takes it herself. She’s a body builder as well and she was very sympathetic and familiar with my (and other patients) situation.
Antoinette
Hi ive heard of compounded thyroid…but only in caps..you can get it made to take sublingually?im very interested in this what pharmacy does that?thanks
Amy Lynn
@Kendra are you doing compounded porcine, or synthetic t3 & t4 compounded? If porcine, do you know the source? (PCCA porcine is what I’m on from another local compounding pharmacy, but thinking of switching pharmacies because mine doesn’t appear to be accredited in any way.)
Kendra
It’s not the pcca porcine. And I’m back to feeling horribly. Migrane for two days. Fatigued. Seeing my doc tomorrow and may switch to armour even tho I did horribly on it before. Not fun
Amy
Thank you for the response, Kendra. I didn’t do well on reformulated Armour either, & probably won’t go with Pavilion for compounding for myself now based on your experience. I’m sorry you’re feeling bad again before the holidays, you’re right, not fun! Hope you find a good source/thyroid med combination that helps you feel better soon!
Kate
Hi Kendra,
I too have extremely itch skin since taking NP. Did yours stop right away one you got off the NP? When I google itching it keeps leading me to other issues (like lymphoma) and can’t seem to find much about itching and NP. However, none of this started till I got on NP Thyroid. Thanks!
Frankie Beckwith
And yet, I see no relevant information regarding WP, which also has changed. I was doing fine on it, but when my refill arrived the new pills are darker in color than previously and my TSH tripled! So what is going on with WP???
Janie Bowthorpe
Frankie, pharmaceuticals don’t admit problems or what is causing them.
Megan
Thanks for this. Noticed everything mentioned and have been feeling so much worse since at least Summer) which explains why. Switching to synthetic t3/t4 but am confused b/c I did the math of how much of the synthetics I would need, but doctor is givine me MUCH less saying that Cytomel and Tirosint are much stronger than the generic versions (ie i am currently on 150 t4 and 55 T3 with NP, but they are perscribing 50 t4, and 10 t3). Have you heard of this before? I’m worried to make the switch b/c this seems very low to me. Anyone have advice or heard of the same? Thank you!
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, in some cases, they can be better than generics version. BUT NOT ALWAYS! This is why everyone who switches needs to keep track of their labs and get optimal by them. And if they prove to be too low, you have to be FIRM with your doctor where your frees need to be to feel your best and maintain it! https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Janet
This is my first week using the combination of Synthroid and Armour. I didn’t tolerate any of the T3 products because of an allergic reaction to the calcium sulfate filler. Compounded is still an option but I will have to pay cash for it.
I haven’t used Armour in many years, but am doing fine with it. There’s just a very slight piggy taste like NP before the change. I scrape the very thin polymer coating off the tablet with a sharp knife (it’s called opadry white) and then it dissolves fine on my tongue. It doesn’t contain any sugar so it’s not sweet but no unpleasant taste.
My symptoms are under control, body temperature normal and I feel okay energy wise. The depression I had experienced on the newer NP lots is gone. I think there is a contaminant causing brain swelling. That happened to me once years ago with NatureThroid but only with one lot number. I reported it to the FDA and the lot numbers I got after that were okay (the bottle I had was apparently tested but I wasn’t given the results).
I’ll get my bloodwork redone in a couple of weeks and see where I’m at with the T3. When I was on Synthroid alone (which my doctor asked me to try) my muscles were so stiff I tore a lot of ligaments and tendons. I think that convinced him I needed the NDT as well.
Janie Bowthorpe
Did you try getting optimal on Armour alone?? Some say they have been able to. This is what I mean why optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal It’s important to get the free T3 optimal especially.
You have to be careful adding T4 to what is already 80% T4. Otherwise, RT3 can go up. So watch that.
Antoinette
Hi when you made the switch from np to armour..did you have to take more or same dosage?thanks
Janet
Antoinette, I’m completely on Armour now and am using the same dose as I was on for NP. So far I’m doing okay but the real test for me is how I feel when I’m exercising and it’s been too cold to really push that to see how my muscles are affected. I’ll be getting new labs soon and might be adding T3 like Janie suggested if those levels aren’t optimal.
fliss peck
Janie I need some advice if possible please.
I switched over from NP thyroid which was making me really ill to synthetics 4 weeks ago. I was on 4.5 NDT happily for years always optimal bloods. I had my bloods done last week so 3 weeks on T4 150mcg and t3 35mcg which you advised. im gutted as my bloods are awful worst ive ever had and im so tired all the time. hair still falling-out lost so much now nails breaking….
its UK reference so ive added the range;
FT3; 3.1 (3.1-6.8) so right at bottom and always used to be near the top. TSH: 0.02 (0.2-4.2)
FT4; 10.8 (12-22) so under range and always used to be near top.
so what do I do now? does this mean that synthetics aren’t going to work for me in case what do I do? or do they need more time? but the FT4 being under range must mean I need way more t4 is that right? if so how much? and the t3 is com ing from the conversion which looks like it isn’t happen ing is that right? so I need way more t3 and if so how much? should I just stop the t4 and do t3 only? although I know my dr won’t fund that he only agreed to a trial if I took t4 and t3…. please help me interpret these and advice how much more of each I should take and if you think they will start working soon? I see dr tomorrow so if you have time to comment today would be really helpful.. probably could persuade him to let me try armour which is one NDT I haven’t tried and many in the UK say it works if you crunch it? but feel I should give synthetics more time and increase if that’s what’s needed? the strange thing is that my basal body temp is always good now at 36.7-36.8 each morning and pulse and BP are perfect too…whats going on? I took my T4 24 hours before blood test and my last dose of t3 at 5pm then blood test next morn ing at 10am….was that ok? thanks . fliss
fliss peck
hi Janie did you see my results I posted ? I would really appreciate your advice and comments in reply to my questions as im so confused as to what’s going on and why my free t3 and t4 are so low. I am seeing dr today was hoping to take what you advise to him …I will wait for your reply
thanks
fliss
fliss peck
hi Janie ..you asked me to keep you posted when I had any results which I have done and I was wondering why you hadn’t replied to my post? I hope you’re ok …..please when you get a moment would you give me your valued advice as I am confused why values are so low and what to do , was it means as per questions in my post.
thanks
fliss
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi there Fliss. 🙂 Please know that in addition to running this by myself, I have my hands in many pies of my activism, not just here. I also have an active private life, too, just like anyone else. 🙂 Because of all that, I may be delayed in answering posts at times.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Fliss. When the frees aren’t where we need them to be, we just raise. I won’t be able to say how much as we are all learning together on this. You just have to keep track of your labs. Yes, what you did with labs was fine.
Alex
To all who still has energy to fight! As Acella claims that “…the Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient (API) is now sourced from an FDA-inspected facility in Europe”, but refuses to appoint the country and producer of the NDT powder, perhaps should we try to write there and ask whats going on:
https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/partners-networks/international-activities/bilateral-interactions-non-eu-regulators/united-states
S. Hack
Can someone please message me with a trusted place to get Thyroid-S? Anyone switched to that and doing good? I’m about out of my good NP and refuse to ingest anything that smells of cat pee (I have 60 of the bad tablets). I can’t switch to the synthetic’s due to allergic reactions. It give me panic attacks every time a company reformulates and about kills us and then we have to use all our energy searching for a replacement. We’ve run out of good NDT replacement’s now. I’m a pre 2009 Armour lover. Oh how I wish we could have the good stuff back.
Jeni
I have started having major anxiety and depression…crying spells. Doctor put me on Xanax and an antidepressant. I asked to have my thyroid labs checked since the only time in my life I have every experienced depressive feelings was 20 years ago when I first was diagnosed with hypothyroidism.
My labs all came back in the normal range, and I have not been able to figure out what in the heck happened to me in the past 2 months. I even started dealing with major insomnia which I have never experienced either.
Something told me to look up my thyroid medication and sure enough I found others reporting the same thing in the past 2 months! I ran and checked my bottle to see when I had it filled-August 27th-and the last 2 1/2 months have been complete hell filled with anxiety, constant tears, and depression. I am also extremely nauseous in the AM. I found an old pill compared to the new one and its exactly like your pictures above!
Now I just have to figure out what to do-what in the world do we change to??? I only ever took Armour before NP.
Janie Bowthorpe
Armour with T3 until optimal.
Or, T3 and T4 until optimal.
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Jeni
Janie..
Armour by itself…
Or do you mean Armour with added T3?
And when you say T3 and T4, are you referring to synthetic? I know our options are lessening….
Janie Bowthorpe
You can try armour by itself but work to get optimal if you can. Or you can try armour with T3 and work to get optimal. Or you can do the two synthetics and get optimal. 🙂
Kendra
Ugh, that may explain my horrible insomnia as well. I literally havent slept much since my first dose. I am having air hunger at they gym and itchy. I just got a script for pcca thyroid compounded into a sublingual tablet, Ill probably be starting today. Ill post my labs. Dont have any from the new NP because Ive only been on it for a week. My first symptoms with the cat pee ones were slow digestion and no hunger.
Janet
Jeni, I have never been treated for depression but late summer and fall started having severe depression for no obvious reason. When I got of NP it immediately went away. That really makes me think there is some sort of contaminant in the product cause brain inflammation.
Angie F.
Janet, that’s interesting. I did not have depression on the new NP. In fact, except for BP and cardiac (PACs and potentially paroxysmal A-fibbing) issues, I felt pretty good. I did have some nausea occasionally and the stuff did taste like a cross between rotten pineapple and cat pee. I’ve posted here several times that I believe (and I believe it even more given the ear ringing/ototoxic related comments) that we may be dealing with a contamination issue..Could be solvents a/o other meds involved, incidentally two of the things that Sichuan was called out for by the FDA. I don’t know if these meds contain raw product from Sichuan. Also, I’ve posted about the ractopamine issue (Feed additive in pork, beef, and large fowl). If interested, you can Google that as well.
I’ve managed to get my hands on a few of the old Naturethroid (not yet expired, but from a batch that I either didn’t have problems with, or didn’t notice that I did). I’m trying that for a couple of weeks to see how I do.
Right now, I’ve had to, to avoid the serious cardiac issues and very high BPs, cut back to about 1 1/8 gr of N-T. Can’t seem to raise beyond that on NP, N-T or Armour and not going to until I’ve gotten cortisol checked out (I’ve done iron and I’m now a bit on the low side again).
Jeni
Janet-
I switched to Armour, within a week I cannot believe how different I feel. I am back to myself-no need for Xanax, and am almost scaled off the antidepressant completely. This is unacceptable. I could barely get through a day, I literally lost the last two months of my life. My therapist wanted me out on medical, but as a teacher I would not have gotten paid. I am fuming mad. I had no appetite, couldn’t eat, couldn’t sleep. They even gave me a sleep medication-and that barely worked. Now I am right back to myself. This is NOT okay.
Jernye Swin-Dell
I did a search looking for answers about some of the problems I’ve been having and wondered if they were NP related. I’ve just up my dosage of NP thyroid for 30mg to about 45mg. I’ve been o30 mg for about 1 yr. I too have noticed that the NP smells really fishy for quite some time now. In the last 2 days since I’ve up the dosage to 45mg my skin is really itchy and very dry. Also for the last 30 days I’ve been dealing with continual bouts of pseudogout (gout in the knees) and in the heel and in the hip and perhaps Rheumatoid Arthritis. After I’ve read about 1/3 of the comments and wanted to ask has anyone else had flaris of any kind of arthritis and does your pea smell like a cat’s pea when a cat is ill? Oddly mine does and that’s never happened before and I don’t have any animals…I’m alergic to dogs and cats.
Selene
My experience is that when my thyroid meds are close to being optimal my adjustments from the DO (OMM = Osteopathic Manual Manipulation) hold and if not there’s a lot of joint pain and subluxations. Also skin very itchy +++.
ate
Hi Selene, did your itchiness stop once off the NP? I am going CRAZY with the itch. Only thing that calms it is Benadryl.
Angela F
I have had what may have been gout or gout-like symptoms in my elbow, particularly right. Also, right now, even on old N-T (Not NP), my urine smells really foul…I wouldn’t call it “cat pee” smell, just really like something isn’t right. I have had that before all these problems, though, and typically would happen at about the same time every month.
I also had some itchiness on/off with one of the post March 2019 fills of NP.
Kendra
I have recieved the cat pee NP thyroid as well. Only been on it for 4 days but looking for an alternative. Seeing my doc on monday but trying to formulate a plan in the meantime.
Synthetics are looking good even tho I tanked on synthroid years ago. I never tried it with t3 as well so may be my answer. Has anyone done well on synthetics? I guess they wont be on this forum if they are!! ha
How does the PCCA natural thyroid look? I may try a compound, and if i do the compound of PCCA natural, do I need to take more since I have to swallow it?
Thank you!
Janie Bowthorpe
PCCA is still providing a working porcine powder for compounders. Their source is different than what pharmaceuticals have even using, apparently.
Julie
Do you know where their porcine powder comes from? Is it a trustworthy source? Is there any type of bovine source thyroid med?
Selene
I spoke to my compounding pharmacist recently who has quality/consistency/future availability concerns about porcine powder for compounders…
Over 2 decades on NDT and did well, then all the issues reported below. Naturethroid> Westroid Pure> Naturethroid> Acella. Now working to find my way through compounded synthetic T4/T3. 1st labs were in range but not optimal – still felt off. Continual fine tuning. Will continue to report.
Kelly
I’m wondering if anyone here has been able to find a good source for compounded desiccated thyroid? I have tried both compounded synthetic t4/t3 (dont tolerate cytomel) and compounded desiccated thyroid and had horrific reactions to both, the last one landing me multiple trips to urgent care and then g ER. I called the compound pharmacy to see where they sourced their desiccated and they said PCCA, but did not have any info on where that comes from.
It seems the only options I have left are to try Armour (which I am very nervous to try), synthetic compounded time release t4/t3 or try to find another source of compounded desiccated of PCCA.
Any feedback much appreciated,
Janie Bowthorpe
Since you’ve reacted to either compounded or T4/T3, that can be more about what it’s revealing in you. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/iron-and-cortisol
Iva
I’ve been taking armor for years summer of 2017 all of a sudden they switched me to Acella The smell and the taste was horrendous. For me my hair started falling out which is never happened before I didn’t know why. And then I related it to Kaiser Pharmacy switching me from armour to Acella. I tried taking my bottles in and insisting that the pharmacy smells my pills but they wouldn’t do it. It was a dark time in my life. I wrote my doctor and told her look they gave me Acella formula 6 months ago and I’m losing my hair who knows what else is going wrong. So I need you to prescribe only Armour brand. She did and things got back to normal eventually. Then they started charging me an arm and a leg and I told them look I’ve tried your other stuff and I can’t use it so I did pay the bigger price. But eventually I change the tablet milligram and ended up getting it for $35 instead of $132. It’s a constant battle trying to get it for $35 sometimes I can sometimes I can’t
Kendra Bauser
Im thinking about Armour again even after It made me hypo before. How do you take the armour pill? chew? swallow? also do you need more medication to get an optimal result?
Janie Bowthorpe
Doesn’t matter how you take it. And some have needed to top if off with T3 to feel good again.
Rebecca
I have been taking Accella NP thyroid for approximately 5 years always 60mg and three a day.. Never had a problem. Sometime around May of this year I noticed a smell difference, then after dosing with my 3 pills I got nauseous, then later I got so sick I would throw up. I had always popped 3 pills under my tongue before I ate, now I have to take one pill at a time and make sure that I eat something beforehand, if I don’t then it’s back to upset stomach and throwing up. I really don’t know what to do but this has got to stop.
Rae Miller
I switched to Armour 60 mg twice a day about 3 weeks ago (same dose as I was on before), and have been doing fine; maybe even better than on NP Thyroid. No lab tests/results yet. I’ll wait to get labs until after the Thanksgiving holiday. So far, so good. I’m taking it sublingually, even though it doesn’t dissolve— it just turns into a paste, but at least it’s not chunky or smelly in any way.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Rae, Remember that most everyone will feel good on doses that aren’t yet optimal, thus it eventually backfires, we have noted for years. So it’s a good thing you are checking the free T3 and free T4 after the holidays. This page explains where you want to be to prevent an eventual backfire: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Rae Miller
My results from MedLab 11/29: T3 REVERSE 14 (8-25); T4FREE 1.0 (0.8-1.8) ng/dL; T3 FREE 3.1 (2.3-4.2) pg/mL. i can’t remember what calculation you do with the RT3… Do I need this test? I didn’t do a TSH because that’s always low.
This is with Armour only 60mg 2x day. What do you think so far? I’ve been using Armour instead of NP. Previous post Nov 10 has some previous labs. Thank you.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Rae. Your RT3 is moving up, which isn’t good, and your frees show you are underdosed. You’ll need to treat why the RT3 is going up: https://stopthethyroidmadnmess.com/reverse-t3 Otherwise, if you keep raising Armour to get optimal, your RT3 will continue going up and thus, worsening hypo.
Here’s what optimal means: https://stopthethyroidmadnmess.com/optimal
Michelle
Anyone else experience a burning (almost like reflux feeling) when taking the new NP sublingually? The taste on these new pills was the first clue something was wrong but I’ve been getting a burning pain in my throat too each time I take them. I haven’t experienced any other side effects yet since I had some good pills until just recently so am waiting to see what happens. I was on armour for years until they reformulated back in ’09 and then my numbers went all screwy so was switched to Erfa which was wonderful until ‘14 and then started getting hives when they reformulated. WP didn’t work for me (broke out my skin horribly and gave me stomach pains I think from the lactose?) NP has given me no problems and now to find out they screwed it up is so upsetting. I recently learned I was very deficient in iodine so began the iodine protocol (starting slowly). Has this improved anyone’s hypo symptoms to lessen the need for thyroid? I’m hoping it might so even with the change I can stay afloat. I’m allergic to synthetic thyroid (tried several brands of both t3 and t4 and they all cause me massive air hunger with difficulty breathing). I’m considering thyro-gold if there’s no other option!?!
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, many have experienced that burning with NP Thyroid—and it’s a symptom that Acella has so far avoided addressing (which patients find to be a concern). It’s one of many reasons patients are moving to other alternatives, like T4 and T3 and getting optimal.
Michelle
Thank you for responding and all the time you spend in researching, informing and helping patients! It’s sad that we now don’t have a single NDT that hasn’t been messed with. I really do wonder if the swine fever that has destroyed so much of the pig population is playing a role in the issues with NP. The news reports show is has spread well beyond China and is in areas of Europe. If it’s in Europe where NP is located I wonder if the “clean up” process is what is contaminating the porcine powder? I’m thinking of trying armour again (along with cellulase) or having it compounded but wondering if this is in fact a contamination issue with the porcine powder that the same issues could develop with other brands if they get the same supply? If I try armour again using cellulase do people take the cellulase enzyme at the same time? Can compounded be taken sublingually by opening the capsules (wondering the same with thyro-gold if I decide to not chance another porcine based option)? When I swallow it my hypo symptoms get way worse and my free Ts drop much lower so I have to take it sublingually.
Janie Bowthorpe
Armour is the only one that still may work. Others are adding T3 to it. Either way, get those frees optimal. Yes about pouring the contents of compounded under tongue. Might taste funky though unless they add a sweetener.
Janie Bowthorpe
I replied to this but not seeing it. So if I’m wrong and I did post, some of this will be a repeat.
Yes, it’s terribly sad. As I saw each of them tumble downward, I was at least glad that NP was still around being so excellent. But when even NP changed, and changed WORSE than all the others with its burning when swallowing, burning in the stomach, nausea, horrible smell, horrible taste…and the bad return of hypo in so many…it was now anger-producing. The icing on the cake has been how Acella has responded about it all…
Yes, I think it might be a great idea to take cellulase with Armour. Yes, compounded can be opened and poured into the mouth, but it might taste bad….
Michelle
Thank you! I think I’ll talk to my compounding pharmacy and see if they can do a compounded without a cellulose filler using NDT and if not then try the armour/cellulase combo. Wish I could take synthetic t3 to help my t3 but I’ve got an allergy to every synthetic I’ve tried (both t4 & t3 caused me to daily gasp for air- worst year of my life!). I hope something works!
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. Is is possible that you were gasping for air (sounds awfu!) on synthetics because you were underdosed? Air hunger is common for some when they take too little, which will make them even more hypo.
Michelle
I have experienced exercise induced asthma from my thyroid being low but this was very different. I had been on Armour for 3 years without any issues until I got Lyme (but didn’t know it was that at the time) and my thyroid went screwy. I was referred to a different endo who switched me to levo and within the first week I had 4 panic attacks and felt like I had someone sitting on my chest and couldn’t breathe. Tried another brand with the same experience and even though my numbers and other hypo symptoms were still bad on the armour I never had that before or after switching back. About a year later they tried adding some t3 to my armour because upping my dose just increases my reverse t3 and from the first small addition of only 2.5mcg the breathing issues started again. Gradually made my way up to 30mcg while remaining on the armour and even though my free t3 got to over 4 (I tend to hover around 2.3-2.6 normally) the air hunger got worse and worse and not a single one of my hypo symptoms improved. I had to gradually lower it to get off and once I was back to armour only the breathing issues disappeared. We couldn’t figure out a common denominator as far as fillers other than my body must just reject synthetic entirely. It was a terrible experience!
Janie Bowthorpe
If upping your dose increases RT3, you need to treat the cause. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/reverse-t3
If your free T3 goes up like that on a small amount, you need to see if you have cortisol issues, which is likely: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
Michelle
Thank you! Yes I have a couple different things contributing to the rT3 problem so it’s been tricky trying to control them all. Undiagnosed Lyme started everything (just thought I had an allergic reaction to some mosquito bites). Then very high estrogen causing extremely heavy periods that kills my iron (ferritin got down to 5 and iron serum to 18 before doctors stepped in). It’s been difficult trying to get my estrogen down/balanced but I’m continuing to try to work on that- unfortunately being hypo can also increase estrogen and since the two feed off each other that’s why this NP issue is so terrible! I can’t afford to get more hypo. My adrenals are also playing a role not only from the Lyme but also some personal stress I’m under currently so I just started taking ashwagandha to see if that can help calm my stress to more manageable levels. Hopefully one day I can get it all sorted- lots of trial and error but at least I know the sources now so that’s one battle down.
Nancy Jo Carter
Please help. My endocrinologist is totally clueless. Levothyroxin was not converting for me, so switched to NP thyroid 90mg ONCE A DAY. When I requested testing for free t4 and T3 along with reverse T3, they sent me 8 pigs telling me why I did not need these tests. Especially reverse T3! They have no concept of grains or twice daily dosing. They are dosing in a m just like when on levothyroxin. I am literally dying here. ME/ CFS. Bedbound, strange bumps over arms and legs, almost cyst like. Endocrinologist is also my PCP. Any help or advice appreciated. They are very dismissive and arrogant when questioned.
Renee
Hi Nancy Jo. I’m so sorry for what you are going through. I have definitely been right where you are. I can tell you my story and how I got the help I needed. Also, Janie has a page on this site about how to find a doctor to help you. I know it’s difficult to even think straight when you feel so bad, but check out the page where Janie gives you tips about how to find a good doctor. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/how-to-find-a-good-doc/
I also had issues converting the t4 in synthroid and had doctors that dismissed me, shamed me, upped my dosage and sent me into hyper mode giving me panic attacks and heart problems. On January 10, 2016, I woke up in the morning, opened my eyes, and my adrenaline immediately shot up to the point where I started screaming and thought I was going to die alone, right there in my bed. I called my dismissive doctor in hysterical tears, who told me to come in right away. She did an EKG and told me I was just having PVCs and prescribed 5 pills of xanax, patted me on my head and shooed me out of her office. I left feeling scared AND furious. I went home, got into bed, and started doing tons of research. Fear was a huge catalyst for me. I spent many many hours reading, researching and writing. I found Janie’s website and read everything. I found out that I was likely having an adrenal problem and probably a hormone imbalance. So, armed with a ton of information I started searching for a doctor. That wasn’t easy. I had one Naturopath tell me to just stop ALL my thyroid meds and all vitamins and supplements and soak in an epsom salts bath and just “breathe”. I went to a chiropractor, had acupuncture and every other sort of alternative treatment I could find, They were great, but none of them addressed my underlying problem. I finally found a nurse practitioner in my state who said she specialized in hormone imbalance and thyroid. I called her and made an appointment. I went to see her, sat across from her in her office and told her my story. She was the FIRST health practitioner who actually listened to me. She didn’t interrupt me, poo poo me, shame me or tell me to take epsom salt baths. She didn’t tell me to eat less and exercise more or drink more water. She didn’t tell me that PVCs and the mental and physical pain I had was just part of getting old and I should just accept it. She LISTENED to me, and at the end she told me that I was NOT crazy. She said it was clear to her that I was in real distress. She ordered the saliva adrenal sufficiency test, a hormone panel, the extensive thyroid panel and a bunch of other tests. I got my blood drawn and did the saliva test. Then one day her office called and asked me to come right away. I did. I got there and was sitting in the waiting room. I had my head down and she personally came out to greet me. She took me back to her office, sat me down and told me that I was very sick. My TSH was 95 (yep…95…not .95) and she said she was amazed that I was functioning at all. I also found out am homozygous for MTHFR C677T. I also have the Vitamin D genetic mutation. I ALSO found out that my body was making no progesterone, my estrogen with SKY HIGH, and I had almost no testosterone. She said my Vitamin D level was something like 20 when it should be much higher. I also found out that I had an adrenal sufficiency problem. My cortisol was high at night and low during the day. Everything was out of whack. The first thing she did was immediately put me on WP thyroid and 10,000 iu Vitamin D per day to start. About 20 minutes after I took my first dose of WP thyroid, that T3 hit my receptors and I FREAKED out. I called her screaming because my insides were zooming and I felt like my hair was on fire! I had no idea what was happening to me. She explained that I was getting NO T3 in the synthroid and the WP had t3 in it. She said it “woke up” those receptors and my body was just responding to it. LOL…so, she had me cut the pill into many tiny pieces to take throughout the day until my body could become accustomed to the T3. Within 2 weeks I had lost 12 pounds of fluid, the inflammation started going down in my body, my blood pressure came down, the adrenaline rushes stopped. Panic attacks eventually subsided. Once I was feeling a little better, she had me start on compounded natural progesterone and a low dose compounded topical testosterone cream to help with my hormonal imbalance, and I also started a methylated b-12 supplement and she had me go on the HCG diet, followed by a paleo type diet to help me lose more weight.. Over the span of 18 months, I lost over 60 pounds and went into remission. My body pain and all my symptoms went away. I felt better than I had in almost 2 decades. Then, unfortunately we all know what happened with WP thyroid and I ended up having to start all over again because I got really sick on Naturethroid. But, with NP, I am pretty much back to where I was with WP. I do have some problems with NP, but I can tolerate them pretty well. I haven’t been faced with having to take any of the speckled pills yet, so if and when that happens, I may have to reevaluate again.
Bottom line, my advice to you, while you’re lying in bed or on the couch, is to start with Janie’s website. Read everything. Take notes. Arm yourself with information. Write down questions that you have. We just have GOT to become our own advocates. That is one thing I have learned through this process. Then start looking in your area for functional medicine doctors. Look at the other options that Janie mentions. I found that traditional endocrinologists are not helpful when dealing with difficult thyroid cases. And many of them are just stubborn and won’t listen. I found for myself that I did best with a doctor who listens and allows me to be a part of my own healing process. I wish you all the best and I hope this helps a little. Janie is a wealth of knowledge. Take advantage of the information she has so graciously put together here for all of us. I know it helped me tremendously. All my best!
Tania
Hi All
On the new batch of NP….smell getting worse on opened bottles, anyone else notice that ?
I have added in 50 micrograms of Levothyroxine into my three grains of NP. I actually feel pretty good !!! I have had my TSH and T4 done , waiting for results. I will get a full panel done sone privately . But I wanted to say with the T4 added in, which mine was low, probably due to Cortisol, I am feeling back to virtually how I was feeling before the recipe change .
I will report back with what Labs I get . I bought the Cytomel, but I will carry on on the NP, with the added in Levo if I feel back to feeling good. I’m not sure I want to go the whole nine yards of Synthetics.
BP, pulse everything good.
Maybe it is not as potent ? But is it worth a full on over haul…I’m not too sure now /. AFTER I bought the Cytomel. Time will tell with Labs
Janet
Tania, I’m doing basically the same thing right now. I had about two weeks’ worth of older NP and after reacting to the generic Cytomel decided to use 1/2 dose Synthroid with 1/2 dose NP. I feel better than I have in ages. My Armour thyroid just came in so I’m going to do the same thing with that since my NP is running out. I’d like to try name brand Cytomel but it has the same filler ingredient (calcium sulfate) that I think I’m reacting to in the generics. For now if I can do half and half with synthetic and NDT I’ll be happy. I’ll get retested in a couple of weeks but I can definitely feel the difference.
Oddly adding the Synthroid has really helped me with brain symptoms, but if I take it by itself I get a lot of muscle pain because T3 is so important for muscle function and repair.
tania
Hi Janet
Thank you for the response. Can I ask were your lab results for T4 low on just the NDT ?
I have an unopened bottle of Cytomel sat here …cost me an arm and a leg to buy it and get it to the UK, but….I feel good on the NP, at 3 Grains with the top up of Levo at 50Micros. It is a hard call, but if you feel good, you are loath to change it all up completely.
Maybe, the NP will go back to how it was. But I have a lot of energy, my hair is good, no fluid retention. Brain fog??? Well…it’s always been a bit foggy. lol. Good luck in your journey. xx
Janie Bowthorpe
Tania, you most likely received a batch of the former NP.
Janet
Tania, my free T4 was always in the lower normal range on NDT even though TSH and T3 were optimal. It will be interesting to see if that changes with the Synthroid added (name brand). I do feel that the Synthroid really helped with brain symptoms, just not muscles. I have a muscle condition that requires optimal T3 or I get torn ligaments and tendons because my muscles seize up (it has to do with the sodium-potassium pump). So I kind of have a built-in test.
Janie Bowthorpe
If your free T4 was low in the range on NDT, that’s a sign you were underdosed. It’s never about the TSH being normal, by the way. It’s about this, as it’s t3 that changes our lives: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Lynn
I ended up testing iron myself at home and got these result that seem normal based on what I interpreted from your wonderful sttm book. Just want to double check!
iron 130 ug/dL. (30-160 ug/dL)
Transferrin Saturation 43% (14-50%)
TIBC 301.00 (220-430 ug/dL)
Ferritin 84.00 ng/mL (15-150 ng/mL)
I also am giving Armour a try.
Janie Bowthorpe
Look again: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/lab-values
Janet C.
Very interesting article. I’ve been taking Canadian desiccated thyroid by Erfa – the tablet is marked ECI 30. Since the spring of this year (2019), I’ve been feeling so much worse on this medication. I’ve been feeling extremely exhausted and sluggish and most worrisome of all is I now experience tinnitus after taking 1/2 pill. I was diagnosed as being in the beginning stages of meniere’s disease one week ago. My symptoms started at the end of April and I’m now wondering if the DT is to blame? I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism in the spring of 2018 and have been taking the Erfa desiccated thyroid for 1.5 years. Any suggestions? I’d like to wean myself off of this medication and see if my meniere’s symptoms subside. Has anyone else experienced tinnitus after taking this medication?
Angie F.
I’ve noticed a ringing in the ears also..on ALL of the current dessicateds…And accompanying rise in BPs (about 20 pts systolic, about 15 points diastolic)…
dorothy
I wish we could go back to the old desiccated thyroid days before all these reformulations started. I lost my hearing suddenly in 2009 when armour reformulated. My hearing rebounded on WP thyroid. My vestibular symptoms returned on NP thyroid (when WP thyroid stopped production) and I’ve now switched to compounded synthetic. I’ve not been on it long enough to know if it will stabilize the tinnitus, dizziness, sweating, and disequilibrium. I’ve had ringing for years off and on for years also, and BP is higher when more hypo. Meniere’s can resolve itself when the thyroid is adequately treated. Hang in there…these are tough symptoms to manage.
Beth Franke
(Janie: I have two LOT#’s filled 7/3/19) I’m quite alarmed reading these comments about tinnitis. I’ve noticed this over a long time, and never would have connected these two things. I’m sitting in a silent house, and can notice the subtle high-pitched ringing in both ears as I type this. Within the past week, I had a very odd thing happen in my right ear after I added air to a Select Comfort/Sleep Number mattress, activating the compressor pump under the bed. When I released the compressor pump, which makes a considerable noise at a certain frequency & put my head on the pillow, I had a very strange buzzing vibration & sound in the right inner ear which continued for a couple minutes intermittently. I have never achieved ‘optimal FT3’ in 5 years… never above a 3.1 FT3 and always been under-dosed in my opinion regardless of product over 5-6 years: Levo 25mcg > 50mcg > 75 mcg > Synthroid 75mcg > NatureThroid 48mcg (right when it was bad that is what Dr. put me on & it took me 1 yr. of fighting for dosage increases to find out on STTM about all the problems) > 60mcg > 75mcg > NP Thyroid 90 mg (got my FT3 to a 2.9 on Quest ranges taking a 60 + a 15 — these were before the “smelly pill change” in July & were flat & oblong shape 60’s & I think round 15’s) > added Iodoral 12.5mg for 4.5 mos (too long) at same time I > NP Thyroid 120mg for 7 weeks, then reduced to 90mg for 3 mos. before testing again: recent labs dropped FT3 from 2.8 (June 2019) to 2.5 (Nov 2019) (FT3 range 2.3-4.2) on 90mg dose NP (taking 3x 30mg “cat pee” pellets which I filled in July 2019 (NOTE: they dispensed in original bottles, and I still have 2 empty ones! Filled 7/3/19 Walgreens 30mg NP Thyroid -round thick “cat pee” pellets- Exp. 12/2020 LOT M329A19-2 S/N 893087036441 GTIN 00342192329010 ). (bottle 2: Exp. 11/2020 LOT M329M18-1 S/N 463471262223 GTIN 00342192329010. Now I’m off the Iodoral / i-Throid (my iodine count went from 48 to 359 (range 52-109), although I took one pill the night before the labs…. & going back on 120mcg NP Thyroid (4x 30mg “cat pee” pellets filled in Nov 2019 and I just happened to think to check in on the thyroid forums and found all this… so upsetting, but if not for this & AFandTC FB pages, I would not know!!!! (So, THANK YOU!!) LABS: (6/21/19 when on what I feel was ‘older’ NP Thyroid 60mg +15mg) TSH .60 (.40-4.5) FT4 .9 (.8-1.8) FT3 2.8 (2.3-4.2) RT3 12 (8-25) iodine 48 (52-109) //// (11/24/19) TSH .92 (.4-4.5) FT4 .9 (.8-1.8) FT3 2.5 (2.3-4.2) RT3 11(8-25) iodine 359 (52-109) – possible skewed results, but laying off Iodoral for a while! (It did help though; at 4 weeks I felt my energy increase – should have tested sooner. At 7 weeks I got heart palpitations, so I cut back on the NP Thyroid from 120 > 90 & palpitations resolved). Walgreens does not keep Lot# or other data, and they said Acella will report it to FDA if there is a problem/no patient recourse on meds unless there is a known issue (“none reported yet” -per pharmacist) but here are the dates of my NP fills: NP Thyroid 60mg (1/13/19) // NP Thyroid 15mg (1/13/19) // NP Thyroid 30mg (5/1/19), {7/3/19} {10/7/19} – changes are subtle, but I’ve recently felt sluggish/brain foggy/fatigue again. The tinnitus has been going on a long time though -many many months- I just did not connect it to the meds.// ( ) = okay { } = “cat pee” smell/taste My Walgreens Pharmacist said he would report what I gave him (per above 2 bottles).
Julie
My new refill was purchased Oct 17, 2019. The lot number is M331G19-5. I have felt horrible since starting! And it tastes/smells horrible. I currently have a terrible cough and feel very rough (I rarely rarely get sick and no one else in my family has this). I’m definitely switching!
Tonia
I have a cough as well and got sick almost immediately after starting my Oct 10th refill. Actually, I think I was already exposed to something while traveling and didn’t start my new bottle until I got back. Within a few days, I was experiencing symptoms of a cold. By that weekend, it was even worse. I didn’t start the new stuff until 10/23 and was sick by Monday, 10/25. This past Monday, I had my appointment with my hormone doc and told her what was going on. They switched me to WP Thyroid (my request, as I did well on it before the shortage), I started those pills on Wednesday, and by Thursday I was already feeling better. Brain fog was gone, and I could focus again.
Julie
That’s interesting that you had a cough too! When did that stop? I switched back to levoxyl only bc I don’t know what else to take! It’s been about 48hours and cough is still there but I’m feeling a little better.
Rachel
I just tried my new bottle and god the smell and taste!! Put them side by side and saw the broad mottled change. I just went through this last year with Naturethroid and I can’t metabolize the synthetics!! What am I going to do???? Also just went through this with klinopin being bought out and they claim it’s the same but everyone has return of symptoms
I also have vertigo and tinnitus!!
Janie Bowthorpe
1) T4 with T3 and getting optimal
2) Compounded NDT and getting optimal — they seem to have a good source of porcine powder
3) Armour and getting optimal, and if someone can’t get there on it, they add T3 to it and get optimal
4) T3-only, multi-dosed, and getting optimal
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Christine
I am taking the cat pee smelling NP thyroid now since early September and although they smell disgusting my most recent labs are consistent and have been great. No change in lab values and I still feel great.
Janie Bowthorpe
Post your lab results with ranges. That is not enough information.
And I think many of us would be worried as to what we’re swallowing if it smells or tastes that bad.
christine
FT3 3.9 (2.2 – 4.2), Ft 4 1.4 (0.8-1.8) , TSH 0.05 on 120 mg I am sorry if this is a positive comment.. i just thought it would help some to know not all is lost in some cases…and yes I know very well what I am swallowing !
Janie Bowthorpe
Why in the world would you apologize for a positive comment? lol.
But no, you really don’t know what you are swallowing. They seem to dodge explaining that. What is exactly causing the horrid taste? What is exactly causing the horrid smell? And you are swallowing it. On and on.
The bottom line is that for what appears to be the majority, the changed NP is not doing the job, besides causing problems for too many. And the second bottom line is that NDT’s used to not be like this.
Lynn
Glad for you! Are you taking any supplements that might be helping?
Lynn
I know that not everyone will go with this but my chiropractor did blind muscle testing with me on a bunch of medicines and supplements. The non smelly old NP was positive but the new smelly NP and strangely progesterone were not. The synthetic T3/T4 and synthroid were also positive for me.
Tania
Hi Christine
Thanks for your input, they are perfect labs !!
I have to say, My T4 on the NP has never been great, always low. So I have added in 50 Micrograms of Levo, and I am back to feeling great again. TBH, the taste does not bother me at all, so long as it works. Maybe we just have to stick with it ?? But if I had those Labs i wouldn’t change anything if I were you . x
Janie Bowthorpe
Do understand that we don’t know what we are swallowing with NP. It taste horrible, it smells horrible. NDT never, ever used to have either. And a large body are seeing a return of hypo. That alone is causing patients to avoid its
bcostigan
Interesting to see that posters values are doing great on NP Thyroid. I have a bit of a different tale…I’m in the early stages my hypothyroid. I started 1.5 grains of Armour in March. I wasn’t feeling relieve so I did blood work early October. Blood results from 1.5 grains of Armour in the AM on an empty stomach:
FT3 – 3.4 (2.3 – 4.2 pg/ml)
FT4 – 1.1 (0.8 – 1.8 ng/dl)
RT3 – 15 (8 – 25 ng/dl)
TSH – 0.90 (0.40 – 4.5 mIU/L)
The doc agreed to up my dose to 1.5 grains in the AM and 1 grain in the afternoon. This is where things get funky. They called in Armour to the pharmacy. There was a back order for Armour, so the pharmacy thought NP Thyroid was an equivalent fill, so they gave me that. I immediately read all this stuff here and had some pee smelling pills too…either way, I took 2.5 grains of NP for 2 months and felt no different. I just ran blood work – RT3 is pending, but here are the others on 2.5 grains of NP:
FT3 – 3.5 (2.3 – 4.2 pg/ml)
FT4 – 1.0 (0.8 – 1.8 ng/dl)
RT3 – Pending
TSH – 0.37 (0.40 – 4.5 mIU/L)
Unless my RT3 has shot way up, it appears the new NP Thyroid is way under-dosed…the other thing I find interesting is my TSH dropped quite a bit, but nothing else really improved.
I requested to have my script re-filled as Armour and the pharmacy obliged and didn’t even charge me for the re-fill.
I’m following this thread to see if there are improvements in NP since it is cheaper than Armour, it would be nice to have that option.
Janie Bowthorpe
So far, patient reports show nothing seems to have changed with the new, less effective NP Thyroid. And the path seems to be going the same direction that it has gone with the other, now less effective NDTs from other pharmaceuticals…a complete failure to acknowledge the high percentage of patients who have gone south on what used to do them well. NDT is simply not the quality and consistent product it used to be, and it appears that pharmaceuticals could care less, say patients.
Pam
I was doing well on the NP Thyroid until 3 month ago when i noticed the terrible smell.
I noticed every time I took the pill my stomach got so upset first I thought i had a stomach virus but soon I figured it out that it was related to the NP thyroid. My labs went down even increasing the dose did not help. I switched to Armour and my stomach pain went away already feeling better again.
Not sure what the did to the NP thyroid but whatever it is it made me feel awful
Kelly
I am wondering if anyone in this thread has found a good source of compounded desiccated thyroid? I just tried several batches of compounded desiccated and my health has never been worse, I don’t tolerate synthetic t3 and dont do well on t4 alone, I have no idea what to do. I tried my first dose of Armour today but am so scared to try anything because of how horribly ive been doing. I used to be on naturethroid before the recall and I was still sick (I have a lot of health issues) but was no where near as sick as I am now. Any feedback would be much appreciated.
Janie Bowthorpe
Since you’ve reacted to either compounded or T4/T3, that can be more about what it’s revealing in you. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/iron-and-cortisol
Catherine
I was previously on NP thyroid and got very sick from it. I switched to compounded pcca United States sources porcine powder with glycine for the last two and a half months on 3 and a half grains and have been doing ok. I just received a refill and the smell is very different. Normally there is little smell and it is slightly sweet. This time it smells slightly like cat litter. It is a fishy sort of rotten smell. I called the pharmacist and he denied getting a new batch of powder and said it was from the same batch as last time. I am not sure if I believe him.Has anyone else who made the switch to Compunded NDT powder experienced this? I am seriously thinking about switching to a Tirosint and Cytomel combination as I cannot live like this.
Janet
I think there is something that has changed in the extraction process for the raw materials. I left a message with Acella yesterday asking if they had done a full toxicology test to be sure there were no contaminants making us sick, but no one has responded.
I was doing well with name brand Synthroid and SigmaPharm generic Cytomel combination, but then started reacting to the filler in the Cytomel (calcium sulfate). My reactions got too severe to continue, so now we’re going to try half Synthroid and half Armour and see if I tolerate that. My husband uses Armour and it’s not too bad as far as the smell yet. But I am allergic to the opadry white which is a BPA based coating on the surface so I have to scrape it off with a knife. This is such a pain!
Tania
Hi
I’ve been adding Levothyoxine 50MCG’s to my three grains of NP now for a week, I still feel hypo, but not as much. Waiting to see my Doctor Tuesday, to let them know I want to go back on Levo, and I will be adding in T3 myself, as I doubt they will fund this on the NHS . Before I take the plunge back to the Levothyroxine nightmare , which was TSH of 6, a Free T4 of 27, Free T3 below the bottom of the range on 185MCG’s of Levo….and huge Thyroid dumps, and never feeling great tbh. I have heard a few people mention Thyroid-s on here recently from Thailand.
I’m thinking that would be a much easier route for me than the whole switch to synthetics again . Can anyone tell me if you are on Thyroid-s how you are doing on it ? Where you buy it from, if you do? And….did you switch from another NDT ? And did you have to up the dose ?
Thanks in advance
Janie Bowthorpe
Thyroid-S has worked well for years. Remember to understand optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Tania
Janie, thank you !!
I was put on Hydrocortisone by Dr Hertoghe years ago along with NDT and some other hormones.
I slowly swapped from Levo onto Erfra. I had very high T4…Well, you can imagine what happened with my first dose of Hydrocortisone !!!! HUGE Hyperthyroid reaction….I will remember it all my God given days !! Now, my Saliva Cortisol was low. I had a blood draw at AM at the doctors, and it was below the bottom of the range. They thought Addisons and did the short Synachtin test. said i had adrenal function. I think years of being Hypo Thyroid had exhausted my Adrenals . But I am very Autto immune so they said the Addisons would go with the Hashis and the Type 1 Diabetes , which I have had since childhood.
Dr Hertoghe’s bloods showed very low Cortisol, and he said I would be on Cortisol for the rest of my life . I spent a year on it…i did well at first, but I did start to feel over cooked on all of it. I gradually weaned myself off Prednisone as i thoight with fixing my Throid and giving my Adrenals a rest I would manage without it .
After reading your very good link. I realise that my labs on NDT, off prednisone, I always had the low T4, and the high T3, well, optimal T3. Maybe with being Hypo Thyroid for ten years, I got used to feeling suboptimal, and optimal I just felt too over cooked ??? I had very high Testosterone on the Prednisone, over the very top of the range for a woman .They said I had “sudo” polycystic ovary syndrome , with no cysts. I think it was making anti bodies to long acting insulin, and locking it up in my blood .
One thing that has always puzzled me that Hertoghe said, is….I had no antibodies to show Hashis, but he said that was because my body had already destroyed my Thyroid ?? But before treatment my TSH was only 7 , with bottom of the range T3 and T4…i was not well, but I was certainly not ill, ill. With a complete destruction of the Thyroid, would a TSH not be in big double figures ?
I think the Cortisol will be my problem once more Janie . i have had a very rapid and sudden weight loss again, since the change in NP… 8 KG in a few weeks . So not exactly a hypo symptoms, but when my adrenals crashed before, i lost huge amounts of weight .
I will do a saliva Cortisol, and decide from there whether to go the Levo/Cytomel route, or the Thyroid-S route . Maybe neither will be right until I address the underlying Adrenal problem, and maybe I do need to be on predisone for the rest of my life. Thank you so much for helping to piece stuff together . You are a very good person.
Mimi
I posted a couple of weeks ago regarding NP by Acella My pharmacist switched out for a newer version and it doesn’t smell as bad but I am not feeling any better. I have labs tomorrow so we will see. Can you tell me what meds everyone has had good results with if they have switched from NP???
It was working great for me before these tainted batches. Thanks
Jean
I switched to natural compound d and it’s working g well.
Jean
I switched to natural compound d and it’s working g well. I know I won’t feel good on synthetic, so this works better for me. I feel better than when I was on ACELLA np when it was good.
Di
I finally did that as well, Jean. After Naturethroid and Armour, with no luck in the
balancing act (since August!), I finally went to compounded porcine powder. Thanks to
a wonderful doctor who works with me. I had to say NO to the Avicel, and there are
plenty of other options for fillers. It seems to me what originally worked well 100 years
ago is still the best treatment. If only doctors would listen, and remember….
Mimi
What is natural compounded? How do I get that?
Kathleen S Fisher
I do believe this is a HUGE clue as to why (my pills have an ammonia/cat pee taste): https://abcnews.go.com/Health/smell-pork-genetic-component-study/story?id=16261564
Jenny T
Kathleen, that is very interesting. Do your NP pills work for you despite the smell? I also have a batch of the bad pills and have not tried them. I ordered Thyroid-S from Thailand instead, and they seem fine.
Tania
Hi Jenny T
That is interesting about the Thyroid-S from Thailand . I remember people being happy on that from years ago. Can you let me know how you carry on on them ? And where you bought them from ? a reliable source. Anyone else switched to Thyroid-S and had good results ????
fliss
HI Janie is it ok to start a new thread or should I go down to my original comments and write?
will try this way for now. so ive been on synthetic T4 and T3 for 10 days now. swopped straight over from old batch of NP I had found. I had been on 4.5 grains NP for years and optimal until problems. you suggested iu start at equivalent to 4 grains which was 150mcg t4 and 35mcg t3. all went ok for first few days , my t basal temp went from 36.4 to 36.6 then 36.7 which was great, my BP was perfect and pulse ranged between 65 and 80. then my afternoon temp started to be quite high 37.4 then 37.6 and pulse resting was around 100. I got terrible leg cramps which I always get when on too high a dose, also anxiety. so I stopped the t3 yesterday and just took the t4 as a test. no more pain leg cramps went although bp and pulse were ok temp was 37.3. I don t want to stop t3 so today I added back the t3 but at 30mcg. this morning basal temp was perfect ay 36.7 as were BP and pulse. afternoon temp is; 37.3 so lower, and bp 132/81 pulse; 81 which is where they normally are …my question is should I also lower the t4? and why do you think I got the cramps and high afternoon temps when all others were ok? I dont understand how long it takes for t4 to start to convert to t3…is it maybe already doing so and therefore the t3 dose became too high for my body? was I right to lower it? im not so worried. about high afternoon temp if all others are ok its just the painful cramps and anxiety I cant bear and tell me im on too high a dose. will it eventually level out and is this normal in early days of switching? I have bloods in 2 weeks time and apt with DR to discuss im going to print off your optimal levels page for him. I suppose I won’t know till then whether im optimal on whatever dose im on? or will it maybe take another test 3 weeks after that to be sure? please let me know if you think im doing the right thing , am on correct dose for now or if you think I need to lower the t4 and if so what to? I suppose my main way of knowing apart form temperature pulse etc is if those leg cramps and anxiety come back, then I would need to lower the t3 to 25mcg and maybe lower the t4?…but I dont understand why im needing less synthetic than NDT? will my body eventually need more and is it the t4 or t3 dose that’s the problem or both? what does happen to the t4 as it converts to t3 does it disappear so you only have t3? then do we all have to lower direct t3? im slightly confused as only ever been on NDT and got used to it…assumed it just gave right amount of t4 and t3 as all in one tablet..its difficult to balance taking the 2 separately and understanding the process… I look forward to your helpful advice as always.
fliss
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Fliss. When changing to the two synthetics from the changed NDTs, we all have to keep an eye our frees to tweak either way. And you wouldn’t have to worry about conversion time to T3 as you went on less T4/T3 than you used to be on with on 4 1/2 grains. Your T4 conversion to T3 would drop a lot in just a week as would T3.
And I would personally get back on T3 after being off a few days, but a little less. It has a short half life and goes down fairly quickly if you get off. Then we would get those labs done after a week on the T3 and see what’s going on. Then we think again after another few weeks in the tweaking goal.
And we’re all in this learning curve!!! We’ll learn together. 🙂
Janie Bowthorpe
By the way, if you were on a changed NDT that was negatively affecting you, it may have also negatively stressed your adrenals. This page will give clues: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
fliss peck
thanks for this helpful advice Janie. yes im back on the t3 only stopped for one day. I was on 35 mcg but today I changed down to 30mcg do you think that’s ok? its equivalent to almost 3.5 grains NDT and I was on 4.5 grains but started as you suggested at 4 grain equivalent.
so is the 150mcg t4 ok to stay the same ? that’s equivalent to 4 grains NDT so im on 4 grains t4 and 3.5 grains t3. do I need to worry about high afternoon temps or just if I get the cramps? I have adrenal insufficiency and have been on 30mg HC daily for 6 years now. I had to increase it to 35mg while negative NDT issues but seem ok back on 30 now. do you think that’s ok or should I be raising it slightly?
Janie Bowthorpe
Labs will tell the most for you. And the right amount that’s not too high or low will help remove the high afternoon temp. Not sure about the cramps.
fliss peck
ok thanks Janie so shall I just stay on 30mcg t3 (EQ: 3.5 grains NDT) and 150mcg t4 (EQ: 4 grains NDT) or shall I adjust the T4 down as I have the t3? my bloods cant be done for 2 more weeks so just wanting to know what to do during that time… I always used to get cramps when I tried to raise my NDT too much.. so for me its always a sign im too high, obviously with NDT its simple just adjust down a bit but when on t4 and t3 im still unsure if I should lower the t4 as well as t3. although staying off the t3 and just being on the t4 yesterday got rid of cramps….
Janie Bowthorpe
I wish I knew! Trust your gut.
Lynn
I have been having challenges with t3/t4 synthetic compound as well. I feel better when I don’t take it but after a couple of days my hair loss starts – that seems to be my first symptom of hypo. When I do take it, even at half dose, I get a headache on the crow of my head, feel disconnected from my body and fatigue. I’m wondering if ndt’s are not as potent? I understand that the ndt could have revealed a cortisol problem but does that mean you only feel the cortisol problem when on medication? My cortisol is low all day and high before bed. I tried holy basil before bed and felt horrible in the morning. Trying liquid zinc before bed and that seems to help with sleep. I have adrenal cortex but feel to wired when on t3/t4 to take it. My dose is only 1 grain.
Kim
I say we keep the bad pills, and start a go fund me account and all contribute to it. Then, once enough funds are raised, send the pills to a lab for independent testing, that way we ALL will know the truth as to EXACTLY what are in these pills that is making us sick. There is power in numbers, and if there is toxic ingredients we can take legal action.
Janie Bowthorpe
That process is in the works.
Deb
I have the changed NP pills, would love to know what happened. I’m concerned that they are doing us damage. Please keep us posted! Thank you!
Tania
Hi Fliss
I was always under the understanding that T3 from synthetics was more potent than T3 from NDT. I will be doing the same as you as soon as my Cytomel arrives. I will be on 120 mcg of levo Thyroxine and either 25, or 30 mcg split daily of Cytomel . do you split your daily dose of synthetic T3 ? Maybe you need to do this ? You could be converting a lot of the T4 in the afternoon, maybe when deiodinases are more active with you ? We are all very different . Did you used to split your NDT dose? and if so into how many ?
It’s all very scary changing when we have been so steady for so long, as the hyper symptoms are not nice. I think if I were you, and it’s only guess work until you get labs as you really get into this. I would cut down on the T4 slightly, as it may be pooling . I used to get pooling with Levo Thyroxine , and the huge thyroid dumps . i have had none of these on the NDT’s I have been on .
Anyway, keep us updated and informed. Good luck.
Lynn
How do you know if t3 or t4 is pooling? Synthetic t3/t4 has been a challenge for me. For the first two weeks I felt much better after the Naturethroid/NP debacle and then it plateaued and my doctor raised it and that resulted in headaches and sleep problems plus feeling “heavy” is the best way to describe it but not weight wise. So my doctor dropped it back down and I still feel that way on days I take it but better on days I don’t. If it was an iron or cortisol problem wouldn’t I feel it all the time? If I go a few days without taking it my eyes get puffy and my hair starts to shed. I feel stuck. My guess is the Naturethroid, that I was put back on in June 19, was like a sugar pill. The the NP I had in Sept 19 was the old NP and was working. The NP refill in Oct 19 was the smelly version and things went bad again and now I am messed up. Maybe the synthetic is too strong or wrong ratio? Can I take 2013 Naturethroid to at least get back to normal for a few weeks? Armour? Not sure what to do but I have been feeling crappy for 6 months except for the first two weeks on good NP and the first two weeks on synthetic t3/t4.
Janie Bowthorpe
Lynn, pooling only refers to the Free T3 going high due to a cortisol problem. But the Free T3 can look high if you do labs after taking T3. We don’t take T3 before labs
But by what you are describing, the raises are revealing a cortisol problem. So you need to order a saliva cortisol test, not blood. This page explains plus has a link to a cortisol test you can order: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/saliva-cortisol
Lynn
I did take a cortisol test about a month ago and it should lows all day and high right before bed. Can I feel these lows and highs? I feel the opposite – highs all day and low at night. Could the thyroid medicine affect whether I feel it or not? Should I take the adrenal cortex even when I feel more hyper? I guess I’m trying to figure out if my dose is not correct or the synthetic isn’t agreeing with me – can that interfere with the adrenals or can you treat them separately? I would hate to be treating an adrenal problem that is caused by thyroid medicine and not what the medicine revealed if that makes sense.
fliss peck
Hi Tania
thanks for this…yes I split my T3..ive now gone down to 20mcg a day to see if that helps .split 10mcg 8am , 5mcg m midday and 5mcg 4pm…is that what you will do? ive already taken my Levo today but will try and split 50mcg tablet which is tiny, in half and go down to 125mcg tomorrow. what does pooling mean? I was so happy on NDT, yes I split 3 times a day….so sad about all these problems.. good luck too, I will let you know if lower Levo does and lower t3 dose helps ..I had such bad c ramps Saturday night was in agony couldnt sleep so took no t3 yesterday and was fine just on the Levo so was thinking its the t3 I cant handle or the t3 dose? every time I take it now I get these horrendous cramps , every time I just take Levo im fine,
fliss
fliss peck
Janie I had horrendous cramps again Saturday night after restarting g t3 at 30mcg. stopped it again yesterday and just took Levo…felt fine.. am trying again today just taking 20mcg t3 …is that too low? was planning to split 10. at 8am, 5 at midday and 5 at 4pm or should I just split twice a day and take another 10 around 4pm ? any idea why this is happening when I take the t3? im so worried I won’t be able to be on t3 and just have to be on Levo..I was fine on NDT for 10 years except when the problems with ERFA and then Np started..wish I could go back to NDT…why could I handle 4.5 grains of NDT but dont seem to be Abel to handle t3? 20mcg t3 is equivalent to just over 2 grains so way too low for me really…maybe my body needs to start low and get used to it? also this morning my basal temp was 36.3 the lowest its ever been…wheras yesterday it was perfect t at 36.7..whats going on? my afternoon temp is now around 37.3 whether im taking the t3 that day or just the Levo, and my BP and p[ulse are good every day…im so confused.. ive noticed my morning temp is low the day after I’ve just taken Levo..and its normal on day after ive taken t3…but as I say so far any dose of t3 is giving me unbearable leg cramps and no sleep…just hope I can handle the 20mcg today..
fliss
Janie Bowthorpe
Your potassium and magnesium may be too low, which can cause cramps.
fliss peck
but it only ever happens when I take the synthetic t3 and disappears when I cut it out for a day and take just t4… and as I say used to happen when I tried to raise my NDT too high, then went away when I lowered….its definitely connected to either the dose or timing or something else t3 related and I take good strength magnesium powder, use magnesium spray and potassium powder and all are ok whine I get tested……
is just taking 20mcg t3 today enough ?
should I just split twice a day instead of 3 ?
should I lower my t4 dose too and ion so how much , im on 150mcg equivalent to 4 grains NDT, so t3 20mcg is equivalent to 2 grains NDT
fliss
fliss peck
hi Janie just to let you know I dropped down to 20mcg t3, 3 days ago, taking 10 at 8am and 10 at 4pm. thankfully this seems to have worked, no more cramps my body can take this dose. still with 150mcg t4.
im going to add in another 5mcg t3 =25mcg in total tomorrow at the 8am dose and see if im ok with that and if so just slowly increase if possible to 35mcg that I should be on. then blood tests in 10 days time.
Tonia
I ran out of my last 90 day supply of NP Thyroid last month, and since the new (more) nasty tasting, smelling, etc. batch was picked up, my symptoms have begun to return. It’s definitely a thing. Before going to NP Thyroid last year (I think it was last year…shortly after the WP and NatureThroid shortages), I was doing very well on WP. Now that the 1 grain is available again in the WP, I think I’m going to give it a try again. I have a Dr appt on Monday and will ask to switch then. Hopefully, the doc won’t give me any issues.
On a different note, I just read the article about “Seronegative Hashimoto’s: aka negative antibodies” and wanted to add something…my particular form of Hashimoto’s is negative for antibodies, but it also was not found via an US. The only reason I was finally DX with Hashimoto’s was because my very thorough doc at the time finally did a fine needle aspiration (“FNA” aka biopsy), which came back saying it was consistent with Hashimoto’s. According to an article I read a while back, apparently, FNA is the gold-standard for DX’ing Hashimoto’s…while all the other tests can confirm it, the only thing that can rule it out is an FNA/biopsy.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. It may be more like this: the majority of Seronegative Hashimoto’s can be discerned via an ultrasound, but there can be a small body that need an FNA like you did. Glad you finally got your diagnosis to help you proceed.
We have yet to see anyone get optimal on WP since all these changes. Do if you do go that route, it might be better to add T3 to it and get your free T3 optimal.
edison
So I’ve been back on Armour for about 2 months now, switched from NP. I seem to be doing ok. It’s crazy that Armour literally costs 4x the amount that NP did, though. Ugh.
In case it hasn’t already been posted, the Acella site seems to have more info on it, but it’s still not really explaining why the pills are nastier smelling/tasting, other than their primary ingredient is coming from Europe.
https://npthyroid.com/product-updates/
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, there’s a lot being avoided.
Ellen weir
Question: what if my labs are okay, but I feel sick taking the NP? I’m comparing labs from last 8 years. If the NP is bad, could my labs look okay? If my labs look okay, then why do I feel totally hypo? And my cortisol looks good comparatively.
Janie Bowthorpe
NP has changed so drastically that you need to listen to how you feel, in spite of the labs. It’s why so many are moving over to T4 and T3 and getting optimal. Or Thyroid-S is an option from Thailand. Another is compounded NDT. Compounders have a different source of their porcine powder that is still working.
Ana
I’ve been taking Armour since September and thought you might be interested in my experience with it. I had been optimal on 135 mg. of NP Thyroid and decided to try 150 mg. of Armour. It’s been working really well for me. I finally went in for lab tests. Here are my results with the reference ranges (taken on Mon., Nov. 11):
Free T3: 4.3 (2 – 4.4)
Free T4: 1.5 (.9 – 1.8)
TSH: 0
My free T3 and Free T4 are slightly higher than they’ve been on 135 mg of NP Thyroid, and my TSH is slightly lower. I feel a bit better when my T4 is lower so am going to try 135 mg. of Armour to see how that goes. My main complaint is that I can’t get it to work sublingually. It dissolves under my tongue, but I don’t feel as if I’m absorbing much. I’ve been chewing it, then swallowing with a large glass of water. That’s been effective. The price is also absurdly high.
Abbott/AbbVie acquired Allergan (including Forest Labs/Armour) last spring, and it bothers me that they now seem to have an NDT monopoly. Based on my experience, they are getting very good porcine thyroid powder. This certainly raises more questions. I’m also concerned about the fact that Armour is now owned by the manufacturer of Synthroid. I’m wondering what the consequences of that might be.
housemaid
I got an email from Acella today. They sent an ad with recipes and a couple of articles on hypothyroidism! No mention of the huge problems with their product, of course. First time I have ever gotten anything like that from them. Maybe their business is slowing down? I know I am not going to be buying another refill for NP as long as it remains bad.
I also saw a Nov. 11th update by RLC Labs, but they still are producing WP in just the 1 grain size. I loved the old WP. It was the only one that made me lose weight. I wouldn’t trust WP right now, though, since it seems all the NDT manufacturers (and probably the compounders) have used the same tainted porcine thyroid powder.
Wyline
I got that email too. I only signed on to hopefully receive some kind of acknowledgement that their meds had changed and were compromised, they were sorry for the problems etc. Instead it’s just business as usual. Very frustrating!
Janie Bowthorpe
You said it exactly as it. Sad and frustrating indeed.
Sally
Everyone posting here needs to fill out an adverse reaction event to the FDA (https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/medwatch/index.cfm). Download the Consumer/Patient form (Form 3500B – right hand side of web page) and explain what happened to you. Unfortunately, their online reporting isn’t working – so the form needs to be mailed or faxed.
They aren’t as quick to pull medications as they once were, but if enough people report the problem – they have to pay attention. You can’t just complain to the company – sometimes you need to call the “police”.
And if anyone knows an investigative journalist…
Angie F.
Have done so…and let me also add that a report or complaint with the CPSC (Consumer Products Safety Commission) should also be done…And please make sure to sign both the petitions to RLC and Acella at MoveOn.org.
Kathleen S Fisher
I just picked up my refill of NP Thyroid a week ago, and immediately noticed the nasty taste and smell…..reminds me of skunk. So far I have nothing to report on my numbers changing, but will be on the lookout for that! What a disappointment to be reading all of this….Also, to the comment above: the CPSC does not handle pharma complaints.
Angie F.
Yes..a cross between rotten pineapple and skunk was a closer description than “cat pee” to me. With regard to the CPSC comment. I was referred to CPSC by the drug safety testing lab I contacted (they only do commercial testing) about the problems we’ve all experienced. CPSC absolutely DID review my complaint and respond..It may be they forward the comment onto FDA (who I’ve received no comment from at all) but won’t hurt a bit to complain to both agencies. The more noise made, the better…
Mimi
Update :
Just got off the phone with David at Acella. He said they have made a change to their source for the porcine and took my lot number. Then he asked for my pharmacy number He is calling my pharmacist to let her know he is sending out overnight a new bottle from a different Lot Number and then is having Acella’s Medical Affairs Department call me to document my reactions and get further information. I hope this information helps Here is the number to Acella : tel:678.325.5189
Janie Bowthorpe
And as usual, that fails to mention there are other changes, such as a horrific smell, such as the removal of sweetness, such as a tablet we can’t let dissolve well anymore, such as a horrendous taste–all mentioned by many patients.
Do know that they have sent out tablets before, and they have all continued to cause problems, report patients.
Ellen weir
Hi I have pills that look like old pills, taste a little sweeter for the last couple of months, but I have all negative symptoms of hypo, and biting in stomach and headache, total fatigue. On hc also
Janie Bowthorpe
…which is what I keep warning people about …..
Ellen weir
Hi yes I just wanted to point out that the pills can be bad without the smell. Without the splotches, and be the same size as before. These also dissolve in my mouth but are sweeter than months ago. I think I’ve been going hypo for about a year. Yup they won
Tania
Ellen
Mine are much sweeter too . The batches I bought a;; have a much sweeter taste . They seem drier and bigger too, but I don’t get the cay pee smell that much, but having aid that, I have had a bottle open a good few weeks now, and the taste is changing bit. But it was the sweetness of them that first alerted me to a change, then the texture, then feeling Cr@p !
Janet
I took my two “cat pee” bottles and set them out with the lid tipped so some air could get to the tablets. After a couple of days the smell was gone, but when I put one in my mouth I immediately started gagging. So it makes me wonder if they’re airing out the tablets before packaging to get rid of some of the smell since that’s what people were complaining about. That would get rid of the volatile compounds but could still leave impurities causing a problem.
I would like to see a full toxicology analysis done on the tablets to see if there is any contaminant that could be harmful. Look how long people used Zantac before it was finally noticed that the ranitidine could be contaminated. Maybe we can start a campaign to raise money to test a few bottles. Eurofins in the US can do impurities testing.
Mimi
I picked up a refill from Walgreens Palm Desert on 11/07/19. I thought I was coming down with the flu until I realized my symptoms would appear about an hour after taking NP Thyroid 1 grain. It has gotten worse everyday since including dizziness and weepiness I called the pharmacist and she gave me the lot number it matched one listed on your site. I am calling Acella next. What is a Comparable alternative ? Any advice would be greatly appreciated Thank you for this site
Wyline
Like most here I was successfully on Nature Throid until the crash and then even better NP Thyroid until present. The recent comments about how great some are doing on the synthetics makes me think that Big Pharma has succeeded in eliminating the competition of any natural desiccated choices.
Tania
I have been on a similar journey and absolutely agree with you . I am a Type 1 Diabetic, who started out on Porcine Insulin. Then Big Pharma stepped into the socialist trojan Horse , metered out health care !! And we really started PAYING . They brought out synthetic “human” insulin first…there was nothing human about it .
This was when Type 1’s really started to realise dead in the bed syndrome was real. Hypos were horrendous on it, and I and many others started living half lives , as big pharma invented more and more long acting synthetic insulins…mainly to take care of the flourishing Type 2 market looking back in hindsight , that is where the real money lays for them . So Type 1’s had to be carried along on this gravy train, getting more and more ill.
There is now one tiny independent drug company in the UK actually that produces Porcine Insulin for those who make vicious anti bodies to the synthetics ….and tbh, I bet that has gone now . Money trumps health every time !!! And keeping us ill is big business for them, treating all the bolt ons.
Tin Hat firmly on !!
Renee
Hi Wyline, I was literally thinking that same thought as I drove to work this morning. I thought, “well, big pharma finally did it. Now everyone is going to be forced to go to synthetic, which is exactly what they want”. I, personally, do NOT want to do synthroid again. I know now that I can add T3 to it, but the last time I was on Synthroid, I felt like it was slowly killing me. And, every doctor I complained to just told me I was getting older and should expect body pain and joint pain and weight gain and hair loss and feeling tired and foggy brain, blah blah blah. I was given antidepressants and synthetic b-12 shots (which I should have never been given because I am homozygous for MTHFR C677T) and told to drink more water, eat more veggies and exercise more. I had doctors just increase my synthroid dose which sent me into hyper mode and I was plagued with PVCs and full blown panic attacks and adrenaline rushes that actually made me scream in fright. Doctor said PVCs are normal and harmless at my age and I just need to lower my stress levels. I was told to do yoga and meditation for the panic attacks. I was sent to psychotherapy. One therapist even told me to go to church and pray. It was only through studying this site, doing my own research and becoming my own advocate, did I FINALLY find the ABSOLUTE AMAZING nurse practitioner who listened to me and helped me. She ran the right thyroid tests, had me do the saliva adrenal sufficiency test, and got me on WP and the right supplements. She saved my life. At the end of 18 months, I was in remission, all body and joint pain gone, weight went down, inflammation came down and I had energy that I never had before. My antibodies came down and I became optimal. Switching to NP was a little more difficult, but I am doing okay on it. Thankfully I have a pharmacist who works with me and has kept the bad batches away from me so far. But, what happens when the good batches are gone and we are only stuck with the speckled smelly batches? I’m afraid to risk it, but I also DREAD going back to Synthroid. Just the thought alone makes me panicky. But, I really feel that this was big pharma’s goal all along. They want EVERYONE on their product. This is so depressing. And now, when people start doing poorly again on Synthroid, doctors will once again pull out the antidepressants and the dance will start all over again. What a racket. Seriously.
Sue R
I am making the switch from NP Thyroid to synthetic starting tomorrow – Levoxyl and Sigma Pharm generic Cytomel. My last fill of NP Thyroid in October had less smell, but the smell is getting stronger over time. I’ve gone through the pain like everyone else – WP Thyroid to Naturethroid to NP Thyroid, all with their problems, which have caused my labs to be good and then bad. I’m tired of the game. I will have labs 6-8 weeks after the switch and will report back on how it is going. Fingers crossed this is the last time I have to switch brands! I am so thankful that my PCP was on board with this change and didn’t try to push T4 only. I am also grateful for Janie @ STTM who provides such valuable information and insight to all of us.
Tessa Osborne
Just had a new supply of ERFA thyroid and which I have been on since 2011, and for the first time it smells funny and the tablets taste disgusting and, as I usually chew the tablets before swallowing, the taste really lingers. I’ve only just started taking them so haven’t noticed any change in symptoms yet. Last night I swallowed them whole as I couldn’t face the taste and the oily lingering flavour. Has anyone else noticed/reported this with ERFA . Its clearly been happening a while with NP.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. Did they for sure send you Erfa tablets and not NP Thyroid tablets? Because yes, what you are describing is exactly what is going on with NP. There are photos of each brand’s tablet on the net.
marianne conlin
On Np Thyroid 90mg, last Rx had a terrible smell and gave me a headache after 1 dose. I have switched back to Armour. Reported my experience to pharmacy and drug co.
Janie Bowthorpe
Since Armour changed as well in its own way, some doing far better on it by adding T3 to it and seeking to be optimal with their frees.
Di
Just for some hope: I was struggling with Armour for about a month here–and amazingly,
my body seems to have adjusted. Will let you know the labs in about a month more.
It works differently from the REAL Armour (pre-2009), in that it seems to build up
slowly, and doesn’t give an immediate relief of hypo symptoms. With the REAL Armour, I used to feel better
about 20 minutes after ingesting.
I chew it at 4 a.m. on an empty stomach. A little bit of T3 would make me feel normal again, though. THANK YOU
JANIE!! What would we do without you.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, please keep us informed. And yes, some are adding T3 to the changed Armour and doing a lot better!
Angie F.
Many patient complaints similar to yours at ERFA Canada Facebook page. This problem, across the board, appears to originate with the raw material. https://www.facebook.com/erfacanada2012/
Janie Bowthorpe
Which is a scary thought as to what is in the current porcine powder causing so many problems….
Tessa Osborne
Thank you for that Angie. I have left a comment on their page too – I did not know it existed.
Angie F.
Yes..it is scary. I did well on one or another of these meds with only brief blips or problems for over 20 years. Now I’m trying to figure out a potential cardiac (PACs and possible other) arrythmia issue. It’s a huge mess..I keep thinking of potential ways to get a meaningful response out of these manufacturers…report them, class action suit (which would require disclosure), inviting the CEOs to a social media “webinar” or conference for the purpose of answering our questions. Not sure what to do…but I think if we fail to organize and continue to just issue individual complaints and responses, we’ll likely not get much more of a response than we’ve gotten thus far.
Sandie
I had tachycardia in May and started reducing my NP Thyroid from 120mg down to 90mg. Then I was still having palpitations and read here about the change and I had noticed the stink. Sooo frustrating to finally have my thyroid issues addressed a few years ago with NatureThroid and all of these changes. I kept reducing the NP until stopping at 75mg which seemed to halt the palpitations and I felt good. My labs were perfect – best they have ever been! I picked up my refill the other day a 60mg and 15mg and guess what? NO SMELL at all! So now I wonder if i will plummet into hypothyroid coma in a week or two?
Sandie
As an update. I continued with 75mg of NP and had tachycardia again the other day. I’ve now stopped NP. I’m awaiting a new prescription from my Dr for Armour as she said she had seen more stability with Armour. I suspect I will be completely hypo in another day or two (it’s been 2 days with no thyroid med).
Jacque
How many hours should I not eat before and after my second dose of T3? I am also going to synthetic T4 and T3 from NP Thyroid. Thank you!
Janie Bowthorpe
You can eat with T3. It’s mostly calcium, iron, and estrogen….or even high fiber, that you want to avoid at the same time. So you could eat eggs, fruit, veggies, for example.
Rae Miller
Picked up a partial order of NP Thyroid 60 at CVS (I take 2 per day), Bedford IN USA. Cat urine smell and taste. They don’t dissolve under the tongue– hard chunky pieces. After swallowing, the awful taste lingers in my throat and exudes into my breath when exhaling. Submitted lot number and exp date on the other thread here. I’m thinking of getting Armour instead; at least they aren’t disgusting. I have had to substitute one NP and one Armour per day for the past 3 weeks anyway, because of the difficulty in refilling my Rx locally. But this has always been a problem. The pharmacies never order it in a timely manner, even if I call early—so I always run out. I don’t know yet if I’ll have a bad effect from taking part Armour/all Armour. I don’t have much choice here of doctors who would be willing or knowledgeable to go with synthetic T4 and T3, so I’ll just hope for the best. This sucks!
Janie Bowthorpe
We’ve not seen people get optimal on Armour alone so far. And optimal has to do with what’s on they page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal So you can try, and if not, it’s successfully to add T3 to Armour.
Rae Miller
My Oct labs didn’t test T3 Free. My May labs TSH (low .02 mcU/mL) T3 Free SerPlQN 4.5 pg/mL (1.5 -3.5 pg/mL), T4 Free Direct SerPl QN .7 ng/dL (.6 – 1.5 ng/dL) – (Oct labs this was .9 ng/dL). I feel OK energy wise but usually have afternoon sleepiness. I haven’t had access to DirectLabs for RT3 testing since I moved. Hashi’s, Sjogren’s since 2007. I have paroxysmal aFib once a month and sometimes more if my thyroid/ electrolyte levels are out of balance.
Janie Bowthorpe
In May, your free T3 was pooling, and thus pointing to a cortisol problem. That leads to hypothyroidism since T3 can’t get to your cells well when it’s just pooling. Read this first: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/pooling
Then do what’s on this page to see if you have a cortisol problem still: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
And you’ll need the updated revision STTM book for the best patient-to-patient info on adrenal problems and treatment: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/updated-revision-sttm-book
Rae Miller
I have done a ZRT saliva test 4 point years ago, but it is extremely difficult because I have Sjogren’s and very little saliva. I remember reading somewhere that there is a new test that doesn’t require so much saliva. Do you have the info on that? Thanks
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, there are saliva cortisol tests where you chew on a cotton swab until it’s saturated. I don’t recall the maker’s name but believe s doctor can prescribe it.
Tania
Hi All
Right Day ten on the new batch of bigger, super sweet NP Thyroid, after 6 happy years of brilliant, optimal labs, great BMI, and feeling good. i have a heart condition, pure FH which has led to CAD . Heart and lipids have been optimal too . and I’m Type 1 Diabetic. Great BS control.
I’ve had ten days on the new batch and I now feel horrendous. Nauseous, migraine type headache, freezing, back to sleeping all night with electric blanket on full. Rapid weight LOSS….which is weird . Some adrenalin symptoms , which were a blast from the past …and TIRED !!!
So, i have just been online and ordered Cytomel from the US. I have some Levothyroxine in. I was on 3 grains of NP, split into two doses. I have worked out my dose of Levothyroxine daily to be 120mcg…and 25 mcg of Cytomel, to match my dose of NP which i was optimal on. Now the big gun questions !!!!
I feel crap now. I have a lowish/mid range T4 on NP anyway, totally suppressed TSH, and a near top of the range T3. Can I take the 120 MCG of Levothyroxine straightaway? Shall I take it tomorrow? I am a poor converter.
Should I carry on taking the NP until the Cytomel comes from the US, which will take around ten days ? Should I carry on taking the crap NP along with the Levothyroxine, or may i over do things ?
Is there a protocol to transition from NDT to synthetic T4 and T3 ? As it had to be done gradually the other way around . Or can I just take the equivalent dose of Synthetic T3 to that I have taken on NDT from the day it arrives?
With having significant CAD, i don’t want to start any heart problems. I am in the UK, so have no Doctor to guide me with this, but to be honest I have been used to dealing with all this on my own for years now . Though i did have Dr Thierry Hertoghe all those years ago transition me originally onto Erfra, gradually. Since then I have changed doses etc on my own, and done my own blood work .
I feel so lousy, i am tempted to at least start topping up with the Levothyroxine I have here, until the Cytomel arrives .
Please, any advice.
Janie Bowthorpe
If T4 is low, might not hurt to top a little with Levo in my mind. Hope it all keeps you going until that cytomel arrives. It’s just too bad that a once excellent NDT has changed so badly.
Tania
Thank you Janie
I’m starting to wonder if there is some Globalist conspiracy theory with all this . Why ??? Why ruin every avenue of treatment for so many of us who don’t convert the T4 to T3 endogenously . This morning I could hardly open my hands …they used to do tests for Capel Tunnel, Frozen Shoulder……all of these things went on NDT . So when I start to go Hypo, it makes my hands seize up over night. I think it’s fluid I accumulate. I slept through for 14 hours and could not get up !!
I have a very physical job, i don’t know how I’ll cope ….anyway. Sorry for ranting I know many others are suffering too.
So when the Cytomel comes I can switch straight over to those doses ? I will split the Cytomel into two doses . i used to take my full dose of Levo Thyroxine at 6 am to help my adrenals ….and no food.
Do I have to leave a space between taking Cytomel and eating like with NDT ?
Thanks for all your help people. x
Janie Bowthorpe
If you are going to straight T3, we general do it three times a day, approximately four hours apart due to it’s short half life. You can even add a very small amount at bedtime.
If you are also on T4 for one dose, then twice a day for the T3.
Find your right amount: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
tania
I’ll be doing the Levo and T3 combo. so I’ll split the T3 dose, I’ll do bloods and see how i am. Trouble is in the UK now they only test TSH…No T4 or T3. But they always used to test my T4 at the lad because of my suppressed TSH on NDT. That used to blow their minds, thinking they had a Hyperhyroid patient, and then my T4 used to come back low/normal range. lol
Janie Bowthorpe
You may have to self-order your FT3.
Di
Has anyone had experience with Woodland Hills Pharmacy compounded NDT?
Janie Bowthorpe
Patients seem to report positively about Woodland Hills since they compound desiccated thyroid powder.
Di
Thank you, Janie….for everything!
Janie Bowthorpe
You are welcome. 🙂
Janet
Just wanted to encourage those of you who are nervous about making the change to synthetic. I’m on 50 mcg name brand Synthroid and 5 mcg SigmaPharm generic Cytomel morning and afternoon (I was taking 1 1/4 grain NP Thyroid). The Mayne generic T3 was awful for me but I’m doing really well on this combination.
I was able to ride my bike almost 15 miles today with no heart issues and good muscle endurance. That’s pretty amazing…in fact better than I was doing on the NP. Because I had done well on Thyrolar years ago I knew that a combination of synthetics would probably work, but finding the fillers I tolerated was a bit challenging. It’s hard to accept that likely our future options for NDT are going to be very limited, but I guess in a way I’m relieved to have made the switch just so I don’t have to go through this again and again when they mess with the manufacturing. I feel like every time there’s a black hole in my life until I get stabilized.
Janie Bowthorpe
That’s wonderful, Janet!! Really happy for you and glad you posted this.
For others reading this, the small amount of T3 that Janet is taking wouldn’t do the trick for the vast majority. You might feel better at first, but it would backfire. So we dose to get optimal. Read this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Janet
Janie, I should have said 10 mcg total for the T3 (5 mcg twice a day). That’s getting pretty close to the 4:1 ratio.
I’ve been trying a little Thyro Gold for a bit extra natural thyroid, but my body really doesn’t like it for some reason.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Janet. You don’t go by the 4:1 ratio. You go by getting your free’s optimal when on thyroid meds, we’ve learned for years now. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
If your body doesn’t react well to thyrogold, see if it’s revealing that you have a cortisol problem: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Angie F.
Janet..can you refresh my currently very hypo memory with regard to what your cardiac issues were? Thank you.
Janet
Angie, I have what is considered a progressive lung disease called Pulmonary Hypertension. The arteries in the lungs become constricted and sometimes scarred, in my case from a viral infection years ago. Because there is so much back pressure on the heart it eventually causes heart failure. Both hypo and hyperthyroid states are considered serious risk factors for worsening, so I have to be very careful to maintain the right dose.
Ryan
So you’re on 100mcgs of Synthroid, and 10mcgs of cytomel currently split into two doses? How pricing vs NP’s?
Janet
Ryan, my insurance is covering it for now so I’m not sure how much more it would cost. I do seem to be starting to react to the fillers in the SigmaPharm T3. That’s not unusual for me to develop an allergy to things like the other ingredients (in this case calcium sulfate dihydrate, corn starch, gelatin, magnesium stearate and mannitol), but I was hoping I’d be okay with it. So far still good with the name brand Synthroid ingredients. I may have to try the name brand Cytomel or get it compounded without any fillers and that won’t be covered by insurance.
starsweet
Thanks so much for this information Janet! I am wondering whether you are taking both the Synthroid and liothyronine sublingually or just orally?
Diane
I am on 270 NP in a split dose. So far, so good.
If I change to Armour, how much T3 should I ask my doctor to add?
Thank you!!!
Janie Bowthorpe
One 270 of NP, where are your frees? That will help first.
Diane
Hmmm… I don’t know. It’s been awhile since I was tested. Will have to circle back with you once I find out. Thanks!
Teresa
I was reading Mara’s list of ingredients in her digestive aid and noted that Ammonium Chloride is present. I wonder whether that could be the cause of the cat pee smell in NP’s disastrous pills. In checking the uses of Ammonium chloride, I came across this side effects list from rx list.com:
“Rash, EEG abnormalities, Seizures, Mental confusion, Irritability, Drowsiness, Ammonia Toxicity symptoms (sweating, altered breathing, slow heart rate, irregular heartbeats, and coma), Calcium-deficient leading to tetany,
Low blood potassium (hypokalemia), High chloride levels in the blood (hyperchloremia), Abdominal pain, Nausea/vomiting, Hyperventilation, Encephalopathy” Apparently it’s also used in cattle feed. Included in smelling salts because of the strong ammonia odor it emits, although some sources state that it’s odorless. Can’t determine why it would be used as an excipient in either Mara’s pills or the NP Thyroid pills. Of course these side effects might be caused by any number of other agents, but
It would be useful to know whether Mara’s digestive pills have had Ammonium Chloride in them before this new batch….
Mara
I just got off the phone with Standard Process. They are going to test the batch that my digestive enzymes came from They say that the oder of Zypan changes from batch to batch and people often describe it as “foul”. The representative did tell me that the formula has changed. What was interested about that is the way the formula changed: they removed the lactose and substituted cellulose. However, I can’t imagine that the cellulose would be responsible for the cat pee odor. So perhaps it is the Ammonium Chloride. But my older bottle which does not smell like cat pee, also has ammonium chloride. The mystery continues…
Teresa
Thanks Mara! It’s probably not the Ammonium Chloride…it’s interesting that your bottle of digestive aid exhibits the familiar smell after a removal of lactose and substitution with MCC…I can’t imagine either that it would be responsible for the smell, unless it’s subject to interaction or decay.
Karen
When i looked up class two solvents amoniom chloride was listed in manufacturing of medicine. There is another comment on here about the FDA finding this as a violation in this plant making ndt. Very caustic agent.
Jan P.
Hi Janie,
I take the 90 + 15 of the NP to equal 105mg daily. I Normally get 3 months worth, but this last August they had trouble getting the 90mg, so they gave me 60mg +30mg. I do have a few of the 90 left from May. My Doc also tried bumping me up to the 120mg in April, but I couldn’t tolerate it, so I do have about 20 days worth of that. In inspection of all these, I found that the 60mg is as described as being darker, and I let my husband do the unbiased smell test, he says it smells like cat pee as well.
My question is, how do I find the lot numbers on all of these? Do I contact the pharmacy?
My history is long and I really can’t compare like for like with others on this blog. I’ve been dealing with hypoactive Thyroid for 30 years now and went through hell of Synthroid and Levothyroxine, switched to Armour by a Jewish Doctor 😉about 24 years ago and was doing fantastic until the Armour change. Ended up with a different doctor, I finally found your website and was following everything closely. Went through having replacement compounded, where I sweared it was poisoning me. In 2014 had to change to an Endocrinologist and she was agreeable after a couple of weeks to let me try NP Thyroid, I went back and forth between Westhyroid and NP as the Pharmacist had problems getting it. So here’s the rub! 2016 I was diagnosed with Acute Myeloid Leukemia, and went through the hell of that. Went to Bone Marrow Transplant in March of 2017, however I’m now left with Graft vs Host Disease. Some of the side effects of the Thyroid being off mimic GvHD. I’ve been on some pretty rough stuff between the chemo and the anti rejection medicines. While going through all the treatments, I’ve fought to stay on the same dose of NP Thyroid. They’ve had me on Prednisone amongst other drugs. In the last year I’ve gained weight and have not been able to take it off. The Oncologist thinks that my metabolism has been permanently changed. My Endocrinologist talked me into adding 13 mg of Tirosint in August with hopes that the weight would come off. Hasn’t happened! I’ve had some issues that are mimicking menopause, but had a hysterectomy 16 years ago and been on .025 Estradiol ever since. My labs are all coming back good, so now I’m wondering if this has to do with the change in the NP, or truly my metabolism changes.
Let me know how I can get the lot numbers and if I can help in anyway.
Best,
Jan
Janie Bowthorpe
It could very well be because NP went greatly downhill from what it used to be, report many patients.
Also, it’s practically impossible to be optimal one only 105 mg, even when NP used to be a better product. And now, NP appears to be greatly compromised, report patients. This is why so many are now switching to synthetic T4 with synthetic T3 to avoid the NDT mess, and making sure they get optimal. One gal switched to Armour, but added in T3, got both her frees optimal, and seems well. Read what optimal really is here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Jan P.
Read your post on being optimal, thank you! I’ve been fine on the 105mg for years. I have always needed only small doses of any medications that I’ve taken, so I’m not concerned with not getting enough. When I do get bumped up the feeling of being overdosed is to overwhelming and I come down pretty quick. After going through all the cancer and GvHD, I would rather feel just ok, than overdosed. For me at this point it’s a matter of quality of life! If I’m home not being able to control my feelings or heart rate, and feeling ultimately like I’m hitting a wall at periods of time in the day; than I’m not living the life that was graciously extended due to the bone marrow transplant. I except I will never get into the box everyone wants me in.
My question to you is: do you want the lot numbers from my NP, and if so, how do I get it.
Thank you,
Jan
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi there. It sounds like you need to be doing what’s on this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
Oh and we’ve got a many lot numbers doing. So no need. 🙂
Ann
Hi Janie,
I am wondering if you have ever seen antibodies go down on Synthetic t4/t3 combo? The reason I ask is I recently went in to my doctor to switch after this whole issue with NP. My antibodies had recently started going down on NP after being steady for over a year. My doctor said she hated to switch at this point because she has never seen antibodies come down while on synthetic t4/t3 combo. I have been at this for over 3 years and just really confused as to where to turn at this point. I don’t want to give up the gains I’ve made but don’t want to be putting poison in my body either. Thanks so much for your help.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, it’s the T3 that seems to play a role and antibodies coming down in some people.
Lynn
So, the synthetic t3/t4 doesn’t seem to be doing me any favors. I have stopped and started a couple of times now and once I get to day 2 I get a headache on the top of my head, fatigue, feel warm with no fever and very sad. Also feels like someone is sitting on my chest. Not sure what to do now. Maybe stop taking everything? I haven’t felt good since Naturethroid failed me in June 2019. Had a couple of good weeks – once starting with the decent Np and once starting the t3/t4.
Janie Bowthorpe
Lynn, you need to order and do a 24 hour cortisol savila test. Your symptoms may be because of a cortisol problem which raising will reveal. https://sttm.mymedlab.com/sttm-profiles/zrt-saliva-adrenal-4-sample–2
Angie F.
Lynn…the sadness and heavy, draggy chest feeling for me correlate with a high RT3..Every time…
Susan
I’ve decided to go back to Synthroid and Cytomel until Acella works their problems out. Is there a reference I can share with my doc re: raw materials coming from China? Also, Can you please point me to information on converting my NDT dose?
My pharmacist says 95 mg. NDT=158 mcg. Synthroid but I’d like to know how much Cytomel. Thank you!
Janie Bowthorpe
Your pharmacist’s comment is why we’ve learned to take what pharmacists say with a grain of salt, if even a grain. What you start on, or close to, is what you were on with NP. One grain equals 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3, so by that, you can figure out an equivalency with both T4 and T3. After a few weeks, do the frees. This is your goal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Susan Hannum
I’ve decided to go back to Synthroid and Cytomel until Acella works their problems out. Is there a reference I can share with my doc re: raw materials coming from China? Also, Can you please point me to information on converting my NDT dose?
My pharmacist says 95 mg. NDT=158 mcg. Synthroid but I’d like to know how much Cytomel. Thank you!
Mara
I take a digestive aid made by Standard Process called Zypan. It contains hcl, bovine pancreas Cytosol extract, pepsin, ammonium chloride, bovine spleen and ovine spleen. I just opened a new bottle and this bottle has the SAME cat pee smell as my most recent NP thyroid refill!! I have no idea if this has anything to do with what is going on with NP, but Zypan has NEVER smelled like this!
Angie F.
Another reminder to sign the petition to Acella’s CEO, Harold Deas, at MoveOn.org. Here’s the link: https://petitions.moveon.org/sign/np-thyroid-by-acella/?source=search
Ryan
I just realized that after I talked to Steve at Acella around a month ago, I never received the fetch bottle they were supposed to send me in order to test my failing pills. I guess that line was another shot of bs to help sooth the burn they’ve dealt us. I guess Steve can cozy up with the notion that if we all jump ship, he’s out of a job.
joseph
does lithium carb. and seroquel affect thyroid conversion?
Janet
I’ve only seen this conversion chart in one place online…it may be something Acella provided to healthcare professionals. I started with a lower comparable dose of Synthroid just because it’s better to undershoot at first if you have any cardiac issues. It doesn’t give T3 so you have to use the 4:1 ratio to approximate the dose for that. But it might be useful as a guideline.
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/vvYKgmaFdNY5IbwBDnHTnVHoplRpb_s2Kesu6lfbTxZlO_cfigtUzrrG1bpjRjMeBghrCfaezJiT7c5172D930nVmV3NcvZArJYRuZ4LlFoXxi00LzDjse6e1RNd6l_6_y_YVIBj
Janet
Update on switch to synthetic T4/T3:
I’ve been on the name brand Synthroid and generic T3 for two weeks now. My doctor felt it was too early to see any changes, but I politely disagreed so he let me do the testing. Free T4 was 1.02 which is pretty normal for me. Free T3 was 4.4 (usually about 5). But TSH had climbed 3 points which I had suspected because my thyroid gland was swelling and my resting heart rate had dropped to the 40s along with a lower body temperature. So my body is definitely feeling the change. NDT is about a 4:1 ratio of T4 to T3, but I started with a 15:1 ratio to show my doctor the T3 really is necessary (75 mcg T4 and 5 mcg T3 in a split dose). I’m going to increase T3 now to get it closer to the NDT ratio and we’ll retest in a couple of weeks. Because of a muscle disease I have which is affected by low thyroid, an endocrinologist I saw several years ago said to keep TSH in the .5 range, so that’s my goal for now.
I’m so thankful I have a doctor who is willing to work with me and responds immediately to messages on the portal. He will make any adjustments needed to make me feel better even if it kind of goes against traditional protocols. I wish the same for all of you!
Sue R
Has anyone tried the brand Levo-T for synthetic T4? Synthroid is way too expensive in my area to consider. I would add generic (Sigma Pharm) brand Cytomel with this for the T3.
Janie Bowthorpe
It would be fine as long as you also are using T3. Remember to get optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Ryan
Just updating, almost completed my month dosage. I have bad days and really bad days. The non-stinky pills eventually became stinky, so obviously there’s some sort of decay. Guess I’m gonna have to jump back to naturthroid or jump ship to something else. For those taking Cytomel and Synthroid simultaneously, is this a cheaper option than our NDT choices?
Janie Bowthorpe
FYI: hardly anyone is doing well on Naturethroid. It changed that badly. Taking T3 with T4 can work if you get optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Tania Cully
I meant my nightmare with Erfra, and Armour…I’m on Acella now. Sorry brain fog already lol
Tania Cully
I am in the UK and have been taking NP Thyroid for five years . buying it from a great source in the USA. I changed from Acella when that went down hill, after hypo symptoms returned . I am on 3 grains of NP split into two does and was OPTIMAL. I have had great labs, near the top T3…mid range T4….sometime low to mid range. And suppressed TSH. But i have felt great on NP. Never had to think about my Thyroid for years. Roll on last week when I got the new batch . Bearing in mind I have taken this for years. I tasted it …SO, so SWEET !!! Tablet looks a bit bigger . But the taste was SO different. Alarm bells went off. I opened another new bottle out of the three I bought, they tasted the same out of that bottle too. I have today googled a change in taste in NP Thyroid and was GUTTED to read this, as I went down this road of misery with Armour and Acella . Oh God…Not NP too. !!! I may just go the synthetic route if my GP will prescribe it, but I cannot imagine life without T3 now . Can I buy synthetic T3 from somewhere ?? I think this new batch will send me down. I will report back . But the taste change must be for a reason.
fliss
tania i am in UK too and had same nightmare as you with Erfa did so well for 5 years never felt so good then that changed and switched to NP now cant use that, I got really ill on last batch couldn’t take….. I am going to be trying synthetics for first time later this week . I managed to get GP to prescribe t3 by doing a hand written prescription for a brand that is £100 for 100 , 20mcg tablets as opposed top £250 for 28 tablets that came up on his screen! that’s how they stop `GP’s prescribing t3 they make it too expensive. the brand is THYBON HENNINGS ….you can get it from chemist 4 u its on the thyroid uk website under pharmacies. I am going to take it with a ~T4 brand called `ACTIVA and see if hopefully I will be ok….theres not much left to try and im really hypo now. good luck and let me know if you manage to get GP to prescribe and how it goes . if he won’t you may be able to get him to do a p[rivate prescription for them, they are definitely the cheapest t3 ive found anywhere..but others here may know more ..im just looking at UK market.. I will post on here once started and done bloods.
fliss
Tania
Hi Fliss
Thank you so much for getting back in touch with me . A life line. i have been on the New batch of NP for two weeks now. I know this may sound daft, but the first thing for me to notice that goes, before I start the journey of hell to hypo is my hair goes flat and chewy!!! It hasn’t started to come out as of yet, but I have not had this for years . I have coasted along happily for years on the NP and obviously when everything is working well, you stop looking for any problems. Labs good, and felt great . Your information has been so helpful. If you would be happy to share emails, or have a chat about this I would certainly appreciate your help . Of course, I’m happy to chat on here . I will have to start this journey ….again….from scratch . So sorry you have too, but what you have written is a great help and starting point . xxxxx
fliss peck
HI Tania im so glad my info helped you…have you started t3/ t4 yet? itv so how’s it going? ive been on 9t almost 2 weeks and have had some problems which ive documented on here cant seem to cope with too much t3 for now so only on equivalent to 2 grains instead of 4. hoping to raise it slowly. I dont check my emails that much and often have weeks off as find it too stressful but can chat on here…let me know how you are . take care . xxx
Vernon Miller
Started taking the new formulation of NP Thyroid on October 20, by October 28 hypo symptoms were returning. Now Nov 4, symptoms are worse. Blood work scheduled for tomorrow. No lot number or expiration date available.
Tania Cully
Good luck with the bloods!! I will be very interested in results.
Vernon
Blood test came back unchanged. So it is something else in the tablet making me sick. My doctor gave me a 2 week supply of the old formulation. Almost immediately I started feeling better. Checking into an online pharmacy that tests every batch they sell. My local pharmacy told me they had no way of telling me what batch number my last prescription came from. Done with them.
Dina L Ciccone
I need to get on something, anything stat… they ran out of WP, now NP is literally harming me. How to do I switch to synthetic without losing weeks or months of my life? I need advice on what to do so when I call my Dr. she will know what to order for me.
Janie Bowthorpe
One grain of NDT is 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3. So whatever you were on can be figured out accordingly. For example, 2 grains if 76 mcg T4 and 18 mcg T3, etc. Then after a few weeks of whatever you were on, redo labs and tweak as needed until optimal.
Dina Ciccone
I started on Armour yesterday. I took 135 mg which is what I was on with NP. Last night I had a hard time breathing as I was going to sleep so I am going to reduce the dose today. Has anyone heard from Acella to see exactly what they did? I am 100% annoyed (as are we all) about having to start all over again.
Janie Bowthorpe
The replies from Acella are still the same…that they get their porcine powder from Europe. No mention of what is burning people’s throats. No mention of what is making some nauseous. No mention of why the terrible smell. No mention of why the sweetness was removed. No mention of why the horrid taste that so many comment on. No mention of why so many see their hypothyroid symptoms come back. No followup on all those pills they ask people to send back. No explanation why they think that sending some people a new bottle of the same crap pills are going to help. On and on and on….
Janet H.
Hello! My NP experience is a sad and disappointing one as well. I was optimal for about the past 6 months finally after starting NP a year ago. I was finally getting out and enjoying life. I got the smelly batch about a month ago but wonder if NP was taking a nose dive before that because my numbers were already dropping on my bloodwork a few weeks prior to noticing a difference in the pills. When I tasted them the first thing I did was check this site (thank you STTM!!) and braced myself for a return in symptoms. With my numbers already declining, sure enough within about 3 days I became a weepy mess for about 4-5 days. I was able to switch to Armour and within a day was feeling better, however I’m back to living in the couch again when I’m not working. I hope to be able to get back to feeling energetic again. I’m so disappointed in NP thyroid for taking chances with others health and singlehandedly forcing me back into a hole that took so long for me to dig my way out of 🙁
Janie Bowthorpe
You said it very well about NP and Acella, Janet.
Janet H.
Thank you Janie! Something else I forgot to mention is that I had 2 strange symptoms over the last couple months that I never guessed came from NP thyroid but have disappeared since switching. One was dizziness when I bent over to pick something up. My head would spin for a second when I stood back up. The other was waking up in the morning feeling like dust had gotten into my lungs, I felt like I had to cough it out and assumed it was because of the weather or dirty air filters. One week off of NP and realizing both symptoms are gone. Could be coincidence but seems very odd!
Rita W
Janet, I’m experiencing the same dizziness. I don’t know what is causing it. Now I’ll add NP Thyroid to the list of possibilities.
Thanks for sharing this.
Janet
Since several have asked, this is the conversion chart I’m using, not the ones that you would use going from synthetic to natural.
https://www.rxlist.com/thyrolar-drug.htm
I started taking Thyrolar back when Armour changed their formulation. It was synthetic T4/T3 and worked great for me for many years until it was discontinued. On this chart, Thyrolar 1 would be the same as 1 grain of NatureThroid or NP Thyroid, so you can calculate the equivalent for your dose. Maybe showing that to your doctors would help.
Sue R
Jamie, could you provide some insight on converting from NP Thyroid to Synthetic T4 & T3? When NP Thyroid was good, I was taking a total of 75mcg (60 plus 15). Amount of T4 in 75 mcg is 47.5, and amount of T3 in 75 mcg is 11.25 So the closest to that in Synthetic would be a 50 mcg Synthroid and 1/2 of 25 mcg tablet (12.5 mcg) of Cytomel. Would that be a good starting point?
Janie Bowthorpe
I’m on my phone and can’t get to my calculator, but if you took into account that one grain has 38 mg T4 and 9 mcg T3, them compared that to what you were on…you may be close enough to the approximate amount of T4 and T3. It will take doing the frees every few weeks and getting optimal.
Lynn
Is there any benefit for using a compounded t3/t4 vs synthroid and Cytomel? I am doing the compounded route and am having a challenge with a headache on the top of my head, hair pulled sensation and feet tingling once they raised me to the equivalent of 1.5 in NP from 1. I took a couple of days and those symptoms went away and yesterday tried again with lower dose and they were back again. I miss the old NDT’s.
Janie Bowthorpe
We’re with you about missing the old NDT.
Do you know what the filler is they used?
Lynn
They are using microcrystalline cellulose.
Di
Janie, do you know if MCC or Avicel can cause these headaches? Since the NP fiasco, I was
given Naturethroid and then Armour. They both produce awful headaches as Lynn describes, about
an hour or so after ingesting. I cannot even drive, they are so bad.
Janie Bowthorpe
That must be awful for you. Naturethroid is far from the great product it used to be, so I’m never surprised about problems. Armour can be better for some if T3 is added and one gets optimal. So not sure why they would do that to you. Why not move to T4 and T3 and get optimal?
Lynn
Janie – what do you think about the filler in my synthetic compound t3/t4? it is microcrystalline cellulose.
Janie Bowthorpe
The cellulose can bind the thyroid hormones a bit. Just tell you compounder that for refills, you want acidophilus or olive oil, for example, rather than cellulose.
Janet
I’m doing really well on the brand name Synthroid and SigmaPharm generic Cytomel. What a relief…I was concerned that my holidays were going to be wrecked trying to adjust doses.
Something that has been very unexpected is that I am sleeping so soundly. I can fall asleep easily even lying down to take a nap. It’s not fatigue…my energy level overall is much better. But it’s a deep, restful sleep that I haven’t had in many months. This really makes me wonder about some sort of neurotoxin in the new source material Acella is using. I think it’s deceptive that our labs may look normal and yet something is obviously interfering with thyroid utilization.
Sue R
Janet, when you switched to Synthroid and Sigma Pharm Cytomel, did you just match the amount of T3 and T4 that you were taking of NP for the conversion?
Janet
Sue, my prescription is for the equivalents on the conversion charts. However I took Thyrolar (liotrix) for many years and did fine, so I decided to start with that equivalent for the T4 and just a little lower on T3 and I’ll adjust that upward as needed according to tests. I’m getting a little bit of thyroid swelling today, so I’ll get my tests on Monday and make the first adjustment based on that. I feel fine, but don’t want to get a goiter. I’m just amazed at how much difference there is in the mental symptoms after switching…that’s why I think something was affecting my central nervous system.
Angie F.
I agree, Janet. One person mentioned ractopamine a feed additive to promote leanness in hogs/pigs for consumption as a possibility, and there were potential contamination issues with Sichuan Friendly. I haven’t made the switch to synthetics as yet and am unfortunately having to undergo a cardio workup Monday, but look forward to trying.
Teresa Palmer
Angie, forgive me if you described your cardiac symptoms before, but are you having PVC’s or SVT? I wish you the very best on Monday.
Angie F.
Hey Teresa…no problem. Until the cardio workup, all is pure speculation of course except for the definite PAC’s on the monitor at the hospital in the ER. The ER doc thought perhaps also paroxysmal A-Fib, but as yet that’s unconfirmed. Since you’ve missed what I’ve posted before, I’ll add that what brought me to the ER was palps, high HR and soaring BP (I’m a low BP person)..but EKG was normal (they consider PACs “normal”) and BP stabilized to high for me (135 over something) in the ER without meds. I began having problems simultaneously with an NP batch that I picked up in March from my local pharmacy. On/off from that time on..Palps and high HR got bad mid-summer, then improved briefly, then back again. My labs taken at my normal am time were a little lower than they had been…But ER labs one day after showed me with VERY high FT3, low-normal T4..like I’d been getting a quick T3 “dump” that didn’t stay with me. We shall see. Thank you for the best wishes. I’m doing okay..not great..but, with a nod to Jill Clayburgh, “semi-tough”. :):):).
Christine M Birkett
Once again this website has saved me. I was certain I was going insane. NP was a lifesaver when Armour changed their formula. I have been struggling for months with return of symptoms including severe depression (depression was never an issue pre-thyroid), hair loss, sleeplessness, itching skin, forgetfulness & the worst FOG BRAIN ever. My job is complicated and very stressful this is so frustrating. Don’t they understand how much these changes impact our lives?
Thank you for posting the updates. Thank you for your website. You guys saved my life.
Terri
I just took a dose from a new batch of armor….omg tastes like cat pee! I put a search in and came across this info. Thank you!!! The new tabs are grainy looking. Now to keep reading as to what to do…..
Janie Bowthorpe
Some pharmacies switch out different brands, such as switching Armour to NP. Are you sure you got Armour? Is it possible you got NP Thyroid? It’s happened to others and it’s irritating to only find out when you get home/
Renee
Oh boy! I can attest to that Janie. When WP originally went on back order, my pharmacy substituted naturethroid and didn’t inform me. I never looked at the bottle and never even noticed that I was taking a different pill. About a month later I was super sick. That’s when I happened to look at the bottle and learned that it wasn’t WP that I had been taking for the last month. I then had to call my doctor, get blood work done and switch to NP. It literally took me months to get back to almost where I was with the WP. Now I always verify before I leave the pharmacy. Lesson learned the hard way.
Kay R
Janie, people are complaining on ERFA FB about new ERFA …..change in color and smell. I won’t run out of old stock for a year, along with my T4 synthetic. They say they get porcine from Europe as well. I was looking to change to NP when I saw all of the posts. Thanks for being an advocate for all of us.
Janie Bowthorpe
Glad you found out about NP. And yes, Erfa hasn’t been the same for a few years, sadly.
Terri
Im’ sorry. No, I had NP and had to have my doc change it to Armor. There went 3 months of NP down the drain and not even sure if Armor is working these days. I just know i’ve been feeling like hell. Visual changes, exhaustion, the whole nine yards on the previous 3 months of NP…if I hadn’t smelled and tasted the new one, I’ve been so foggy I wouldn’t have thought of it being the culprit…..
Janie Bowthorpe
You might try adding T3 to Armour, but keep track of your free T3 and free T4.
BarbN
I just read the the NP Thyroid website FAQS several times…very tricky and deceitful wording.
-One question asks about their quality control process and if anything changed with the update.
They say they continue to use the same exacting quality control process and rigorous testing that they always have to ensure delivery of the appropriate amount of T4 and T3…
Then they continue to say that every batch released to the market must meet the same quality and testing standards whether it was produced using ingredients from their former supplier or their current one — and that will never change.
Whaaaaat?????? So it seems they are telling us not to worry because they test the final product whether it was made with either the old or new sourced API…are they kidding? What we the consumer are concerned about in addition to the T3 and T4 is any difference in what is in the new API compared with the old…of course it is different or it wouldn’t taste different…
-Another FAQ is really tricky in that it asks if their new European supplier sources thyroid API from China or India?
Then they answer saying no, the API is manufactured in Europe using porcine thyroid glands sourced entirely from European countries.
What they imply is that they are no longer using any API from China or India but they are only telling us about their new API supplier…leaving out that they are still using the API from the old supplier also…
-Another FAQ asks why the new looking pills taste different…they then avoid answering the question by stating that the product shouldn’t be chewed…how could pills taste different without being made with different ingredients?????
I think we need to request Acella add a few questions to their FAQS such as:
1. Are you still using material sourced from your old supplier? Where was the old supplier material sourced from?
2. What are the exacting standards for your API that you claim to meet? Measuring T3 and T4 only? What else are you measuring to ensure the API hasn’t been contaminated, changed, cut with another material, etc?
3. Is the manufacturer testing the batches that are produced? Do you or a 3rd party test the final product to ensure the product meets specifications or do you rely solely on the manufacturer who has an inherent conflict of interest if specs aren’t met?
4. Was any of the product being sold now manufactured by Izeen Pharma or another manufacturer using the API material sourced from Sichuan Friendly?
I’m sure I could come up with a lot more that might actually give us some actual information…I’m going to see if I can send these questions to Acella and get any substantive response…I’ll post again if I get any response
Also found Acella in a lawsuit with Izeen Pharma (the same manufacturer that made the lots that Westminster voluntarily recalled) on docketbird.com
Federal Court Cases Civil Cases Northern District of Georgia 2018 2018-cv-00000 through 2018-cv-00499 Acella Pharmaceuticals, LLC v. Izeen Pharma, Inc.
This just seems to get worse as more information is uncovered…
Elle
Great digg, BarbN!
Angie F.
Interesting…I’ll look at today. One of the things that concerns me, and not just with Acella, is the Sichuan cross-contamination possibility from Class II solvents AND other medications…So..it’s pointedly NOT ENOUGH for Acella to test for T4 and T3 levels which we already know (potency variation also a possibility given Sichuan’s lack of GMP), and which are substantiated by labs, are inconsistent. Encourage everybody to do their FDA Medwatch reporting AND also to report to Consumer Product Safety Commission…Report an unsafe product form can be found at this link. Let’s make some noise…https://www.saferproducts.gov/CPSRMSPublic/Incidents/ReportIncident.aspx
Kellie
My dr put me on NP thyroid back in July. My levels were normal..but DR was helping me with symptoms of hypo. I had a complete hysterectomy 4 years ago and was hoping for some relief. I was advised not to take HRT..this was my only hope. My symptoms since then…(had no idea it was the meds, until I researched)
Bloated..headaches…burning pain in my stomach…3 times my lip swelled..(since Sept & October refill) itchy scalp…exhaustion…feel like my entire body is tingling.
I actually tested this out. I stopped for two days and started back yesterday. Woke up this morning with dark circles under my eyes and hives on my face.
Went to urgent care and currently waiting for meds…prednisone, zantac, benadryl and levothyroxine. (will wait till I speak with my endo before I take another thyroid med) If anyone out there has switched to Levo…please let me know.
Janie Bowthorpe
Oh Kellie, this is not, not, not about switching to just T4-only!! https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/t4-only-meds-dont-work Please understand that Endo’s are THE worst doctors to use for the correct hypothyroid care.
Switch to BOTH T4 and T3, and get optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
And to become informed, get the updated revision Stop the Thyroid Madness book. You HAVE to be informed to counter the bad information that comes from Endo’s and other doctors. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/updated-revison-sttm-book
Kellie
Thank you! I’m not going to fill the prescription.
Janet
An update on my quest for a replacement…
I’m doing really well with the name brand Synthroid…no reaction to the fillers. I’m not using the full conversion dose that I’ve seen on charts, but rather the dose I used when I was on Thyrolar which was 75 mcg. I want to use the least amount needed to maintain optimal levels and will adjust as we check free T4.
The T3 was proving to be more of a challenge. I started with the Mayne brand generic Cytomel. I had a mild reaction to the first dose and took it two more times, each time getting a worse reaction including throat swelling. I talked to the pharmacy and they said their other option was SigmaPharm’s brand so they ordered that for me. My insurance declined payment and told the pharmacist they needed me to confirm I’d had a reaction. I spent 1/2 hour on the phone going over it and then they said my doctor had to call instead. This was on a Friday afternoon. I called back and said I was taping the conversation, and if I experienced heart failure over the weekend because they refused to approve the switch then I made sure my family knew they had denied coverage. They changed their tune and overrode the declined submission.
So I’ve now tried the SigmaPharm T3 and seem to be fine with it. It’s great to have readily available options that hopefully won’t change over time. I have more energy and clearer thinking than I’ve had in months. It makes me wonder if even before the litter box tablets there were changes in the formulation altering the effectiveness.
Janie Bowthorpe
Glad you found out about the magic of having direct T3 in your treatment!
Angie F.
Thanks so much for posting…Gives me hope for T4/T3 therapy for myself and perhaps a brand, besides Cytomel, with which to start. Kudos on the insurance company a$$-kicking…so tired of their crap on top of all the other crap patients have to deal with. It’s as if they want us to pay huge premiums, co-pays, and deductibles…for, wait for it, n-o-t-h-i-n-g. Great work if you can get it.
Janet
Angie, the name brand Synthroid works great sublingually. The Mayne T3 tasted very metallic, didn’t split well and was not good sublingually. The SigmaPharm brand is completely different…tastes fine and splits cleanly even though it’s not scored.
Angie F.
Janet…How did you convert? As closely as possible to mcgs of T4/T3 you were getting in porcine or other method? Thanks.
Janet
Angie, I am using Thyrolar’s old chart (it’s no longer manufactured). It was an ideal ratio for me back when I took it. I think the conversion charts for natural vs synthetic are maybe a little too high on the synthetic side. The assumption is that natural is more bioavailable, but that was not true for me. Thyrolar 1 on the chart would be equivalent to 1 grain NDT, etc.
https://www.rxlist.com/thyrolar-drug.htm
Karen
Hi Janet had you tried synthroid before. I had used it many years ago but started having reaction to it. Not doing well on tirosint sol. I need to take Something my Dr won’t prescribe t3. Just asking if you you had bad reaction to it previous. Thanks
Patricia
My email to Acella today:
To Whom It May Concern …
I spoke with Steve twice back in August 2019 about taking a huge turn for the worse after a refill I picked up on 7/22/19. Within 3 days of taking this refill I knew there was something terribly wrong with NP Thyroid. I have been thru this before with Armour, ERFA, WP Thyroid & now NP. When I spoke to Steve, he stated someone would call me back about replacing my refills but no calls were ever received??? I saw my doctor on Thursday 10/24/19 & my blood levels are thru the roof compared to 6 months ago. Current dosage was 75mg x 5 & 90mg x 2 for an average of approx. 80mg a day. Although I have not been optimal, I was getting close & felt really good for several months, up to the end of July. Then I started on the new refill & all my symptoms came back with a vengeance.
My doctor decided to renew my NP (what other choice do we have now other than synthetic?) but increase the dosage to 90mg for now. I picked up my refill at Sam’s Club in Glendora, CA today & what I got was 12 tan pills (like the old, good pills) & 18 grey pills that smell like cat pee. I asked the pharmacist to see the original bottle & the Lot # & Exp Date are M331G19-1 & 12/2020 according to the actual NP bottle but my script label says the exp date is 02/21? I showed him the difference in pills & asked if they combined lots into one bottle? Unfortunately, he is only 1 day a week at this pharmacy & I will have to go back on Monday to talk with the head pharmacist. According to your Prescribing info “NP Thyroid tablets are light tan, round tablets, debossed on one side with “AP” and a 3-digit code on the other side.” NP Thyroid tablets are NOT GREY. In the pictures below, you can clearly see the 12 on the bottom are “Light Tan” & the 18 on top are grey. 1st pic taken indoors, 2nd pic taken outside in the sunlight.
In prior “Prescribing Information” documents you listed Maltodextrin as one of the Inactive ingredients but the current revision 0719-01 on your website has this ingredient removed? Sounds like a formula change to me, but what do I know? In your product update you state NP should be swallow not chewed. However under “Pharmacokinetics — Animal studies have shown that T4 is only partially absorbed from the gastrointestinal tract. The degree of absorption is dependent on the vehicle used for its administration and by the character of the intestinal contents, the intestinal flora, including plasma protein, and soluble dietary factors, all of which bind thyroid and thereby make it unavailable for diffusion. Only 41 percent is absorbed when given in a gelatin capsule as opposed to a 74 percent absorption when given with an albumin carrier. Depending on other factors, absorption has varied from 48 to 79 percent of the administered dose. Fasting increases absorption. Malabsorption syndromes, as well as dietary factors, (children’s soybean formula, concomitant use of anionic exchange resins such as cholestyramine) cause excessive fecal loss. T3 is almost totally absorbed, 95 percent in 4 hours.” It is common known fact that 90% of patients with Hypothyroidism and/or Hashimotos also have gut issues, therefor it is most practical for us to take NDT’s sublingually (not necessarily chewed, I don’t chew, I sublingual under my tongue).
Over 1100 comments regarding the ineffectiveness of NP Thyroid today. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/08/22/uh-oh-np-thyroid/#respond
I realize this email will fall on deaf ears as it has with all the other NDT manufacturers over the years but I feel better, sort of …
Starr D.
I know what you mean about having been through this with different
thyroid manufacturers over the years–for me, it’s been with both synthetic
and natural thyroid. Complaining after getting ill when they change it,
but getting nowhere. Just wanted to say that my last batches of NP
were also gotten from Sam’s Club (Long Beach, CA), and they also
seemed “mixed” to me. Some pills seemed good & helpful, and some
were horrible and made me sicker soon after taking them. No weird
odor on mine, though–just a lot of the pills were fatter than they’d
been, previously. The 60 mg (one grain) ones seemed more mixed with
good & bad pills than the 30 mg. ones. The 30 mg. ones just seemed
BAD and really got to me after I’d taken a few weeks worth.
housemaid
I agree with those who think there is a whole lot of Sichuan Friendly porcine powder floating around and for some reason only Westminster recalled their pills. Were they more honest or did they just get caught? They have not yet returned to making NDT. I think RLC Labs, Acella, & others used their Sichuan Friendly powder, either knowingly or because it was not labeled. I think that the “European” source Acella claims they are sourcing from is an eastern European middleman. I think Acella knows exactly what is wrong but is not going to admit it and lose money.
Most likely any pharmacy that compounds NDT is going to be using the same Sichuan Friendly powder until it is all sold. I was sorry to hear that someone called about Thyroid-S and was told the porcine powder used in it is likely from China. I had hoped it was from Thailand.
Here is something interesting that I found: https://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb=y&IndexArea=product_en&CatId=&SearchText=porcine+thyroid+powder Porcine thyroid powder for sale, all from China, but not Sichuan Friendly unless they changed their name.
Angie F.
Yes…I posted about this a few days ago and I’m glad we’re all starting to pay attention. In all of the shared negative experience (and I’ve had issues with ALL meds (Naturethroid, Armour, and especially NP since spring of this year, perhaps even prior), this certainly sticks out like a sore thumb.
In my post below, I posted a link to the FDA Alert on Sichuan which stops short of any mandatory action to companies potentially utilizing the powder (Sept 2018). Westminster issued their VOLUNTARY recall prior to the FDA Alert..so it looks to me as if Westminster may have had adverse reporting, connected the dots and did their due diligence to protect patients. However, any company potentially using Sichuan’s API would have gotten a March 2018 “Import Alert”, including Westminster. And also would have received the FDA Alert.
The following is a link to the FDA letter on June 22, 2018 to Sichuan which discusses several major points that they felt had failed to have been addressed from an audit in October of 2017; note Sichuan was placed on “Import Alert” in March of 2018. (1) Solvent contamination..(2) Failure to adequately document cleaning and maintenance of equipment (3) Failure to demonstrate or correct cross-contamination of solvents a/o API carryover from solvents or other drugs (4)Failure to document or demonstrate stability of API [e.g.,potency] (5) Failure to demonstrate, document or prove “shelf life” of API (6) Failure to demonstrate that computer systems could not be tampered with to “change results” on testing. The FDA recommended that Sichuan obtain a consultant to figure all this out, which seems to signal that the FDA officials involved sensed some level of incompetency and ineptitude. Yet, the FDA did not issue any mandatory recall direction nor put the kebash on import until and unless Sichuan got their problems worked out.
Link to FDA Letter to Sichuan..https://www.fda.gov/inspections-compliance-enforcement-and-criminal-investigations/warning-letters/sichuan-friendly-pharmaceutical-co-ltd-546990-06222018
LInk to FDA Alert https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safety-and-availability/fda-alerts-drug-makers-recall-porcine-thyroid-api-sichuan-friendly-pharmaceutical-co-limited-china
Just let me say again that I appear to have retained from all this a potentially PERMANENT cardiac arrhythmia issue. I am in the midst of figuring all that out as well as what thyroid replacement meds I will be able to take in future. Unbelievable.
Angie F.
Also…here’s an article from an on-line publication called “Fierce Pharma” regarding Sichuan. I plan on summarizing the key details of what might be potential outfall from the issue and giving them to the reporter in question. Goes without saying that STTM contacting this reporter, as a thyroid patient advocate on this matter, might carry more weight than an individual report. https://www.fiercepharma.com/manufacturing/chinese-api-maker-sichuan-friendly-pharmaceutical-chastised-by-fda-warning-letter
Angie F.
Link to the FDA Industry Guide Document that includes solvent classification an description…https://www.fda.gov/media/71736/download
Janie Bowthorpe
I can’t make your link work on my phone so I’ll have to try on my laptop.
Angie F.
Here’s another by same reporter…coming from an environmental lab background, I understand better than most what the “ghost peaks” and large differentials on organic analysis mean..we can private inbox or you can even phone me, Janie..if still a problem linking with phone, just Google “Fierce Pharma” and Sichuan…You’ll get 2 hits on the matter…https://www.fiercepharma.com/manufacturing/thyroid-meds-ingredient-from-banned-chinese-plant-recalled-nationally
Janie Bowthorpe
I found it and I’m contacting him. I have so far contacted many others, with no interest. But sometimes finding the right reporter means you have to contact many. So so hang tight with me in my quest.
Angie F.
I plan on contacting him as well and I found a couple of other reports on the issue whose reporters I’ll hit. Additionally, a consumer product safety testing lab referred me to the Consumer Product Safety Commission and strongly encouraged me to contact…which I and we all and perhaps STTM as well, should about this issue…https://www.cpsc.gov/
Angie F.
I did contact Mr. Palmer and submitted a detailed report to CPSC as well. Please let me know, Janie, how you get on. I did let him know that he would likely be hearing from you.
Janie Bowthorpe
I will let you know. It’s not an easy task to get the attention we need. But for each and every time I seek that attention, I have nope.
Mara Miles
I just picked up my refill for NP Thyroid. I had printed out the list of the “bad” batches and the expiration dates. The pharmacist was open to talking with me. We looked at my “good” pills and then looked at the last batch I had received which had the strong cat pee order. She smelled them and was quite surprised. She looked through her NP supplies and found a bottle that was not on the list (although it did have one of the expiration dates on it). It did not smell badly. I took it home and my husband and I tasted it. The cat pee essence was definitely there but very low odor. I have decided to go onto compounded synthetic T3/T4. My husband is still deciding if he wants to try the new NP batch. We see his doctor in December and he can ask then about doing synthetic T4/T3 if he decides to try that.
Michele Nelson
Where Can I find the list of bad batches? I’ve been scrolling through and can’t seem to locate it????
Christa
What is the best way to find where to order Thiroyd or Thyroid-S? The few websites I found Thiroyd was sold out. My husband was on this about 5 years ago (I have a bottle still, will it be bad if it is that old? Could I still use?) and did okay. He is currently on WP and is doing horrible now. Has been doing great but is now starting to crash – he says it feels like he is taking sugar pills. He reacted horribly on NP previously, but prior to WP going out of production he did wonderful on it. I am at a loss, I don’t want the midnight trips to the ER again….
Scott
I heard Janie on the Primal Blueprint pod on Monday 21 Oct, and finally got around to looking at the STTM site today. After reading this article, WOW JUST WOW. I started to feel off in June, and have been progressively getting worse and worse since. I have gone over the symptoms and had labs with my prescribing doctor, and have had other tests/blood work done to rule out other problems, but nothing else has come back as positive.
Me = diagnosed with non Hashimoto’s hypothyroid in 12/2016. I am on my 2nd doctor for this, and am currently taking T3 20 mcg AM, Acella NDT 1-1/2 gr AM, T3 15 mcg PM, and Acella NDT 1 gr PM.
I can’t remember exactly when the smell changed, but it was definitely over the summer. I noticed the pills looked different too; although I never thought to take pics or measure them. I get a weird feeling in my stomach. I have so many symptoms since summer it would take forever to list, but the Cliffs Notes version is that I feel as if I have the worst hypo symptoms you could ever imagine combined with the feeling of being poisoned + a hangover like feel 24/7 even though I don’t drink alcohol. Plus I get up multiple times throughout the night and can sleep for half the day and still feel terrible.
The strange thing though is that my lab values for FT3, FT4, RT3, etc… really haven’t changed that much since the summer; it’s just the symptoms that got worse and worse over time.
My next appointment is on Tuesday; I will print out and bring this article and see if he will agree to take me off of NDT for the time being and either use another med or compounding pharmacy for the NDT in addition to the generic cytomel I am already taking.
I will try to read all of the comments on here. It is really hard to focus if anyone has any thoughts or has gone through similar I would be grateful for your feedback.
Teresa
Greetings all,
I think that I may have some insight into what may be happening. My husband and I had been receiving compounded NDT since 2009 and doing very well. In January of 2018, our bottles of caps sported a helpful label stating that although the product looked different, it was the same medication. I questioned the pharmacist, who had no other info for me. These caps had powder that was markedly grainier and dark, with large black flecks in it. The smell and taste (taken sublingually) was what I imagine it might be like to chew on cow or pig innards. The product though was much much stronger, and we had to reduce our dosages slightly. Then late in 2018 our compounder told us that he could no longer obtain the raw thyroid powder needed to fill our prescriptions. It turns out that the manufacturer of the raw powder was Sichuan Friendly. We switched to NP and have been doing well on it. And then I opened my new bottle. Friends, it appears to be the SAME stuff that the Chinese firm was shipping out! Same smell, same taste. The odd thing is that this med is much much weaker. I think that two things might be occurring at once. They’ve sourced some of the Chinese powder (perhaps without realizing) but they have also added a very strong filler that has rendered the med completely ineffective for those who cannot assimilate fillers. Sichuan had been using faulty formulas to calculate their dosages, and I think that they had an adulterated product on their hands. How much of this re-labeled product has gone out into the marketplace we can’t know. I am quite ill with palpitations. If any know a mail order pharmacy that compounds NDT and ships to VA, please let me know. Contacted Woodland Hills and was told they can’t ship to us in VA. I wish you all wellness and a resolution to this crisis, but beyond that, let’s fight for our health.
Janie Bowthorpe
That is incredibly interesting, Teresa.
BarbN
Teresa,
All that you have put together is really interesting…I have suspected for some time now that there is still some if not a really large amount of the Sichuan Friendly porcine powder still circulating and being used in pills that are being manufactured now and/or pills that were manufactured and never recalled from other companies. While scouring the internet and FDA website I found a Warning Letter by pure luck and chance that was sent to a contract manufacturer, Izeen Pharma. This warning letter to Izeen Pharma lists several lot numbers that were recalled by Westminster and gives detailed information of the violations that were found. Very eye opening to say the least. Not sure if Izeen Pharma is still a contract manufacturer for other NDT brands. The letter is on the FDA website: Izeen Pharma Inc, MARCS-CMS 565311 – MAY 16, 2019
Janie,
Do you know if Acella actually manufactures the NP Thyroid? Most of the Acella labels say “Manufactured for: Acella Pharmaceuticals LLC” which makes it seem that Acella may not manufacture the pills but contracts this out and the Acella label is applied after they are bottled. This might explain why it is so difficult and time consuming (and probably expensive due to manpower and time required) for Acella to actually find and correct issues that the contractors are having with the raw material, quality control, manufacturing consistency, etc. And more importantly, why they really don’t want to acknowledge any problems and provide any answers.
It is really concerning that it is so difficult to find out what violations are related to the NDT we are taking and ultimately what is being done about it if anything. Was Westminster the only one that issued a Recall for the the bad lots…how many more contractors/manufacturers received the Sichuan Friendly API and knowingly or unknowingly used it in the NDT being dispensed today? From their website it doesn’t seem that Westminster supplies NDT anymore.
The timeline is really concerning considering a large majority of us probably refill every month or 3 months…
-October 23 to 27, 2017 FDA inspected Sichuan Friendly facility (Sichuan Friendly responded to violations on Nov 17, 2017)
-March 22, 2018 FDA placed Sichuan Friendly on Import Alert
-June 22, 2018 Warning Letter 320-18-59 sent to Sichuan Friendly
-Aug 8, 2018 Westminster Issues Voluntary Nationwide Recall of Levothyroxine and Liothyronine (Thyroid Tablets, USP) Due to Risk of Adulteration
It took over 9 months after the Sichuan Friendly facility was inspected for the Recall to be issued by Westminster…(and this was a voluntary recall which I guess means many others did not volunteer to recall their NDTs?)
It took about 5 months for Sichuan Friendly to be put on import alert after the inspection so I guess the unacceptable API continued to be supplied to the NDT manufacturers during those months????
I saw my doctor yesterday and made the decision to start taking synthetic T3 and synthetic T4 this morning and hope to be able to optimize using them. I am frightened by the consistent lack of transparency about what is really happening to these once wonderful NDTs and so upset that these companies continue to discount our concerns, symptoms, and ultimately our lives.
Sorry for the super long comment…I am still in shock about how absolutely unbelievable all this is.
Janie Bowthorpe
Your sentence towards the end starting with “I am frightened…” hit it right on the nail. It’s been nothing but secrecy, lack of transparency, gaslighting, discounting, minimizing…
Lynn
I thought I read that the recall was due to bad practices. Was it actually proven to be bad?
Sharon
Teresa, I spoke to Murray Ave Apothecary here in Pittsburgh PA on Friday. I am switching to compounded Desiccated thyroid. My original plan was to go with compounded synthetics instead. The pharmacist told me they have Dessicated thyroid powder and they send it out to a lab for additional testing. I’m going to try and hope for the best. You could call them and see if they ship to Va. I trust the owner Susan Merenstein she is also a pharmacist. They are also a PCCA pharmacy. Since NP’s debacle I’ve been very ill due to not refilling my script after reading about it here. I’ve been using thyro gold 300mg for 4 weeks now and my levels really plummeted. My doctor said I’m not getting anything. I have just increased it to 450 mg as per the owner I need something for now till I get my compounded meds. Hope this helps,
Teresa
Sharon,
Thanks so much for the info on Murray Ave. I’ll contact them on Monday. I hope that you’re able to bring your levels to optimal as quickly as is safe. BarbN, thanks for the most helpful timeline and the info about the letter to Izeen Pharma. I feel as though we’re putting together a clearer picture of events. Someone mentioned this much earlier in the thread, but the African Pig Fever has decimated perhaps 5 million pigs in China, who are the world’s largest consumers of pork. US is a distant second. This occurrence will likely have long term effects on the availability of raw porcine powder worldwide.
Regarding the T3/T4 synthetic combination, does anyone have any knowledge of the lack of T1/T2 with respect to T1’s effect on the electrical charge of the brain? I found one source that indicated that the absence of T1 could lead to ALS. Alarming—but I haven’t been able to verify. If anyone has found info on this, would love to see. Janie, many many thanks.
Rita
I wanted to update my older comment. I went back to Naturethroid after tasting the new NP. At 1.5 grains my T3 was low, so I was raised to 2 grains. Now I feel horrible 2 months in. My pulse and heart rate are higher and I feel nervous, stimulated like I am on coffee, and can’t sleep well. I had 2 panic attacks where I had afib for several hours. I have never had this issue before. I haven’t got my labs back, but I dropped my dose to 1 grain right now and will ask to be changed.
Should I try Armour or just start on synthetics? i am so tired of this. I haven’t been optimal for almost 2 years thanks to Nature-throid. But this hyper feeling is the worst. I actually felt better hypo, other than my hair falling out…
Angela Frye
Rita, I am so with you on your comments. I started feeling “hyper” on an NP dose that was the same as I have been taking for about 5 years now, in July. Have had palps, high BPs, an ER visit and problems ever since. I went back to Armour for a few days…still problems…trying some old Naturethroid right now…still feeling overmedicated. Something is just not right. I’m in the midst of investigating problems from my end…cardiac workup..autoimmune flare evaluation, RBC magnesium and potassium levels, and if all that proves okay, iron and cortisol checks. I did have a VERY high end FT3 about 2 hours post med (never happened before), but a lowish FT3 the day before and both times LN FT4…Almost as if I’m getting nothing but a quick hit of T3 after meds and then nothing. I’ve put up two petitions at MoveOn to both RLC and Acella, so I’m not sitting on my hands about involving myself in a solution, but resolving this problem will take the entire dessicated thyroid pt. community. Please let us know if you get to any reasonable findings or solutions.
Starr D.
Angela, have you tried mentioning something about your petition on
Facebook pages like Hypothyroid Mom and Thyroid Sexy? Those
are two of the better ones, I think (of course, Janie’s STTM is GREAT),
but I didn’t know if you’d like to message them about maybe posting about
your latest petition (the one with 69 signatures)….or? You did a really
good job with this petition, and I’d like to see it get even more names on it.
Angela Frye
Starr…please feel free to share and circulate the link to BOTH petitions anywhere you frequent. And that goes for everybody. I can’t be everywhere and resolving this nightmare requires community effort.
Jenny T
Rita, have you checked your cortisol levels? Your symptoms sound like cortisol levels that are off. I’m on hydrocortisone for low cortisol, and when I tried raising NDT from 1.5 grains to 2 grains, I got similar symptoms. So now I’ve had my aldosterone tested, and may need to take Florinef as well so I can handle raising my NDT. Janie says if you can’t tolerate a raise to 2 grains or above, you need to check your cortisol and/or iron levels.
Rita
Jenny T, you have a great point.
So I went in and talked about my labs with my doctor, they are perfect on 2 grains. High T3, midrange T4, 24 hrs since I took the last dose. Never looked better. All my hypo symptoms are gone. Hair staying in my head, no more weight gain or tiredness, regular periods and a little lighter, etc.
I talked to my doctor about my concerns of recent raising blood pressure, fast pulse, nervousness, not sleeping as well, panic attacks, etc and she thinks I am having bad anxieties, and I think she might be right. After reading all of the negative things on Naturethroid here and on other sites, it made me convinced that I was having issues from Naturethroid. Every little pain/feeling I immediately assumed was caused by my 0.5 grain raise in Naturethroid. I was 100% convinced I was hyper. I have struggled with anxieties at times over my life, and we had some stressful events the last month, so it might make sense that I am just stressing myself out. Anxiety and hyper symptoms are very similar. But my lab numbers say I am not anywhere near hyper…
I will research the cortisol. That would make sense. She also suggested taking a low dose beta blocker for a while until I get calmed down. I hate taking prescription meds (I only take Naturethroid and I am 50) , but I broke down and took one last night and felt so much better today. Lower pulse, healthy blood pressure, not stressed, more relaxed. I even slept better. Basically like my old self on Naturethroid 2 years ago.
She was willing to change me to any thyroid I want, but pointed out my numbers are excellent and I have a history of anxiety. I sometimes felt this way when I was hypo… Stupid anxiety disorder.
So it was either change thyroid (which can have a huge adjustment time) or take a beta blocker for a while and work on reducing stress. Both methods aren’t perfect, but since my numbers are great and I have had a history of being nervous, this way makes sense for me.
My iron is fine, just need to check my cortisol. But I already feel 95% better one day on a low dose beta blocker.
I do know that people are more likely to post negative reviews on drugs rather than positive. My doctor has many patients on Naturethroid that she claims are doing great. My mom has been on T4 only for decades and has perfect numbers and feels good. So there is hope for all of us. Just need to find out if Naturethroid is giving me problems or I am just a nervous wreck making myself sick. 😂
Janie Bowthorpe
Naturethroid has been giving a lot of people problems since last year. We have definitely not seen anyone who is really doing great. They may feel better, but they certainly aren’t optimal. and they appear to have problems that they don’t realize are because of the naturethroid. And it’s destined to backfire eventually.
Rita
I know, I am worried about taking Naturethroid. But my labs are excellent. My doctor will change me to synthetic T4, test me, then add T3 as needed. But I hate to change when I already have perfect labs. And I have felt anxious before even when hypo, I have an anxiety disorder. I am just beyond frustrated right now… She already has switched me to NP then back to Naturethroid when NP went south, so she thinks it is all in my head.
Janie Bowthorpe
That sounds nuts for your doctor to just switch you to just T4, then test. it sounds like your doctor is refusing to believe that T4 only is the wrong way to go. We already know that forcing the body to live for conversion alone is ridiculous. You need to be switched to both T4 and T3 then test. Fight for yourself.
Rita
Update: So I stopped taking the beta blocker after 3 days, I started getting depressed! But I have been taking the AdrenaVive supplement my doctor gave me and I am feeling better. Apparently my adrenals are wack. No wonder my anxiety was sky high. So feeling more calm, sleeping better, and still on 2 grains Naturethroid. Pulse my normal high pulse (80-90) and blood pressure good. I am also exercising, meditating, and trying to reduce my stress. I have energy and am starting to feel like my old healthy self!
Janie Bowthorpe
Glad you are feeling better! Though AdrenaVive won’t work for low cortisol (years of experiences on that since it’s only adaptogens), it can work for someone with stress and rising cortisol with its ashwagandha and other adaptogens.
P.S. Naturethroid just isn’t what it used to be and has caused a lot of problems. Just an FYI. See if you can get optimal on it: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal No one has been able to, but it may be worth trying as long as you don’t get worse by raising.
Angela Frye
Also…has anybody thought to contact Westminster, the company that DID issue the voluntary recall after the Sichuan Pharma issue? They might be able to shed some light on the subject. I read at least one post on this blog thread that had previously gotten their meds compounded from Women’s Int’l who told them they had no raw product available and didn’t know when they would. My question is, that if that is the case, who does? Forest/Allergan? And what is being put into the meds we’re currently being given? Synthetics? My labs look almost as if I’m only getting T3…and it’s dumping and then clearing out of my system rapidly…with high Free T3 one day post med and lowish Free T3 prior on the same dose as I’ve been taking for years now which has my levels usually pretty good (recent problems experienced aside).
Angela Frye
And to this same end, back in 2018 we discovered that ALI was no longer manufacturing (synthesizing) porcine powder. Who is? An internet search for same brought up PCCA in Houston, Texas. A professional compounding company…Link here…https://www.pccarx.com/products/THYROID-USP-POWDER-(PORCINE)/30-1467/APIS-EXCIPIENTS
Sharon
Can anyone please help. I’m going to try compounded synthetics t3 and t4. I started Thyro gold 4 weeks ago got labs back today and my levels have plummeted. I feel blooming awful! I would love to keep increasing this but just can’t afford to be feeling this bad. I’ve only ever tried
over 25 yrs ago when first diagnosed and had life
threatening reaction. So, is there any specific brand of synthetics that the compounding pharmacy needs to use? I really don’t know much about them. Also, beginning to realize I’ve probably never been optimal in all these years. Thanks to Janie I’m really pushing for this now. No wonder my hair never grew back and I’ve never been able to lose all the weight I’ve gained no matter how hard I’ve tried. I really would appreciate any feedback on this.
Eneida
Hi Sharon, I was taking NP thyroid and feeling pretty bad, gaining weight, brain fog etc. I decided to do compounded T4 and T3 as Janie suggested and I feel so much better, you can’t imagine. Have only been taking it for a couple of weeks but it’s already made a huge difference, I take T4 38mcg and T3 9mcg 2 times per day. Hope this helps, Eneida
Sharon
Thanks Eneida! Do you take synthetics now? Do you mind me asking what fillers they use? And, what pharmacy? I’m going to see doctor today who is willing to work with me on whatever I would like to try.
Angela Frye
Reminder to everybody to sign the petition regarding NP Thyroid by Acella…Also, for some reason, MoveOn has removed the “deliver to” name which is, for everybody’s edification, “Harold Deas -CEO”…Let’s keep up the pressure. Please circulate and share widely. I’ve just come from the hairdresser’s where I was told that I had some hairloss also in addition to my hyPER issues and problems. Great..just great. Petition link. STTM, I’d like to renew my request to share the petition on your social media pages as a thread. Both the RLC and the NP petitions. https://petitions.moveon.org/sign/np-thyroid-by-acella/?source=search
edison carter
Had been getting my NP Thyroid, which was working better than any other NDT formula I’ve had for years! (120’s) from Express Scripts through the mail, for about a year+. After I got the bottle in August 2019, I thought maybe it had spoiled in transit due to summer heat here in TX, so I had them resend me another bottle. Same deal. So I went to Costco to check it out there. It was only slightly less bad. I decided to switch back to Armour, but after a few weeks I can already tell it is not as good at the same dose of previously excellent NP Thyroid. Argg.
I called Acella and spoke to customer service there; they did not mention anything different than what is posted on the Acella website regarding the formulation.
De
I have been taking 90mg of NP Thyroid for over a year but the past month or so (with receipt of my three month refill), I’ve been dealing with extreme fatigue again. Now I know why! Has anyone switched to another natural desiccated thyroid and had good results? I’m not going to keep taking NP if it has clearly been reformulated and no longer working for me.
Janie Bowthorpe
De, that’s also a paltry amount that was destined to backfire like this, even if the changed NP would do it, too. 🙁
De
Janie,
So you’re saying that the dosage is too low? I’ve been fighting with my endo to keep me on the desiccated thyroid (I don’t want to go to synthetic) and although I’ve asked her to increase my dosage, she won’t due to my blood work (which I think she is relying too heavily on and not interpreting correctly).
Di
Same problem with Naturethroid/Armour. I am thinking of stopping the medicine
altogether for a few days, and suffering, to get a lower TSH reading–so the dr.
will prescribe more! Desperate.
De
Di,
I can empathize. I did the same thing a year ago. Pathetic we have to alter our meds so we can ‘play the game’ with our doctors. I actually ordered some OTC desiccated (bovine) thyroid to supplement with my NP Thyroid. Started with 25mg/day on Monday (taken with my NP) and will see how I feel in a couple weeks. Fingers crossed.
Janet
I just got an unopened replacement bottle sent directly from Acella to my pharmacy because of reactions to my most recent prescription. It was just as bad and I actually got an anaphylactic reaction this time. I’m definitely filing a report with the FDA. I talked to Steve at Acella and he said he only takes down the adverse event reporting and doesn’t know anything about current status of testing, supplier, etc.
I’m starting to go into panic mode now. I’ve never done well on any synthetic except Thyrolar and it’s not in stock. I don’t tolerate Armour, NatureThroid or Erfa. I was fine with NP until I got a prescription filled in September. If I don’t get at least 1 grain a day (my script is for 2) I will get heart failure quickly. Labs were fine before, now low free T4 (TSH is always low because of pituitary damage so we don’t use that – doctor didn’t order T3 this time). All iron parameters look good.
Can anyone suggest a dye-free synthetic they have tolerated? I’m thinking about asking for Synthroid 50 mcg tablets but they are crazy expensive since my insurance won’t cover.
Since everyone seems to agree on the cat urine smell and taste, I’m wondering if there new supplier is using ammonia in the extraction process that is not being removed in the final product.
Karen
Janet you could try tirosint sol
It is a liquid version of levothyroxine
But if you’re insurance doesn’t cover it very expensive.
Terry
With the Tirosint their website has coupons to lower the price. Also, Good RX gets the price lower as well.
Starr D.
Janet, just wanted to say if you do try Tirosint as Karen
suggested (it came it soft gelcaps when I took it), you might want
to take a little less than your normally do, and take it in two servings
at least (two gelcaps or more to make your daily dose) and spread
it out during the day–morning, afternoon—because Tirosint can
hit people more strongly because of the liquidy gelcap form–it’s
supposedly absorbed more quickly. When I started it, it helped
with some symptoms the other drugs weren’t helping with, but I
had to get off it after a few years because it seemed to give me
some new symptoms I couldn’t deal with. Everyone is different,
so read some current reviews on it, if you can (I’ve been off it for
about four years) Web MD or wherever might have some more
current opinions on it. Lowest dose it came in was 13 mcg, then 25
and 50, etc. Split it up into at least two doses–that’s your best shot,
if you’re sensitive….and start a bit lower than your normal final dose.
Or take the white 50 mcg. of whatever brand to make your dose–I’ve
gone that route in the past, too (not sure how much it helped, though.)
Janie Bowthorpe
But try to have T3 with it.
Janet
Thanks! My insurance wouldn’t cover it, so we’re starting with Synthroid (name brand) and generic Cytomel (Paddock brand). If that doesn’t seem to be working I’ll look into that.
Janet
Found out the generic Cytomel they ordered was made by Mayne. I had a mild reaction the first day I tried it and a much more severe reaction the second day. So they said they’d get in a bottle from SigmaPharm and see if I tolerate that one better.
The good news is that I’m doing really well on the name brand Synthroid. I feel so much better already, both physically and mentally. Lots more energy and clear thinking after several weeks of depression and fatigue on the new “litter box” NP Thyroid batch.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes some people do better on T4 only than others. But a body is never meant to be forced to live on conversion alone from T4 to T3. There’s too many issues which can negatively affect that conversion. Far better to have some direct T3 in your treatment and get optimal.
Angela Frye
I’ve put up a petition to the CEO of Acella asking him to respond to our questions and concerns. Please sign, share, and otherwise circulate. https://petitions.moveon.org/sign/np-thyroid-by-acella
Allyson Williams
Thanks Angela. Signed!
Starr D.
Just signed it, and left a big, long comment–couldn’t help myself, sorry!
I’ve been through too many of these thyroid drug changes over the years,
and they have messed up my health so badly. I really hope you can
get something going with this. Good luck.
Jennifer M
I signed the petition! I took this new formulation for 6 days and my hypo symptoms came back. I also started getting bad anxiety attacks by day 6. I called my doctor and luckily she had a couple months worth of samples that she sent me. Working on figuring out a plan after these pills are gone.
Angela Frye
Thanks to all for signing. Please don’t just sign. Share and circulate and encourage as many signatures as possible. Starr, I read your long comment. Please don’t apologize. Heartbreaking experience for you..And for all of us.
Angela Frye
Below comment was posted to this week’s blog also, so 2nd time posting to ensure visibility. If not allowed, please feel free to delete… I did occasionally, if I remember correctly, have palps (as did another person responding to your “new WP” blog) on NP…Did not have on the good N-T..So at that point, don’t think it was adrenals. However, with the roller coaster ride that dessicated has been since the Naturethroid debacle, and an inordinate amount of personal stress, adrenals may well be a factor now.
Unlike most of the people reporting feeling hyPO..I’ve felt hyPER.. First order of business is a cardio workup. One thing that I do want to bring to attention, though, is the FDA drugmaker alert on Sichuan Friendly API. Westminster voluntarily recalled their product, but according to the FDA alert, “However, FDA confirmed Sichuan Friendly’s thyroid API remains in the U.S. supply chain. This API and the drug products made from it, present a safety risk to patients. Sichuan Friendly API may be repackaged and/or relabeled before it is further distributed, and not all of the repackaged/relabeled API identifies Sichuan Friendly as the original API manufacturer. Therefore, manufacturers and compounders who make levothyroxine and liothyronine drug products should contact their API supplier to verify the actual manufacturer of the thyroid API they received before using it. Sichuan Friendly’s products may be labeled as “Thyroid Powder” or “Thyroid Powder USP.”
Here’s the link to the entire alert…https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safety-and-availability/fda-alerts-drug-makers-recall-porcine-thyroid-api-sichuan-friendly-pharmaceutical-co-limited-china
If I read the alert correctly…the FDA alerted and advised manufacturers but did not force their hand on a recall, which Westminster voluntarily did. So..we don’t know where or in what meds this particular API ended up. Or what the response of the individual manufacturers was, IF they utilized API from this source, again with the exception of Westminster, who appeared to care enough about their patients to issue a recall. And, interestingly enough have not, at least as far as I know, put product back out on the market leading me to wonder whether there is even another API source.
Trying to open the actual Import Alert, also link to follow, but the link is not responsiv Important note, only actually published 10/17, over a year after the initial alert to manufacturers. https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/cms_ia/importalert_189.html
Sharon
I have been reading about the outbreak of African swine fever killing millions of pigs in China and other countries. There is a story on The Compounder pharmacists website about this too and how it might affect the difficulty in obtaining the raw porcine. I’m also wondering about the effect this has had on obtaining the raw porcine material for NDT. Also, the ash content some are talking about. These pigs are being burned. So makes me think maybe it’s contaminated some of the raw porcine. Just a thought!
Maria
This post is about the burning esophagus. I too had to switch from Naturethroid after the changes last year and went to Armour instead of NP. Doing well on 2.5 grains until this week I picked up a refill and within one day my esophagus and chest are burning. The pills look the same as my last Armour and still name brand with the Armour logo but slightly more shiny and hard.I’m seeing these postings about NP causing a burn and I’m wondering if anyone else is also having it on Armour and do they get their raw ingredients from the sameness source and if so I’m really worried.
Anna
I also have that burning, and really fear I have long-term damage, and frankly quite scared. I TOOK the pills all September and a few days in Oct, they switched me back to Nature-throid, and basically, IT is no better! Just did labs, but still need to have T3 and 4 done, I think something is clearly wrong with the pills now
Laura
I am also have burning but it’s in my stomach. This just started after I got my refill of NP!
Karen
Laura I have been off np since September 8 and still have burning and pain in my stomach throat and intestines.Their was an interesting story on the news this morning. They found a new enterovirus in the feces of pigs in China they said effects the DNA they don’t know how it attaches itself to the host and will be studying to find out more. I think all thyroid powder is contaminated right now read the post above about her reaction to armour this is not good.
Ashen
I have the labs to prove that NP is no longer working, but it is still working better than Naturthroid did. In July 2019, I got labs that said my Free T3 was 2.9 pg/mL, and my free T4 was 1.05 pg/mL. I was feeling good and my hair was thickening up from the Naturthroid disaster. Then I got a new bottle of NP thyroid in August 2019. I definitely noticed the terrible smell and taste. My hair started thinning a bit again in September, but I hadn’t put things together yet. My new labs from October 2019 show a huge difference. My Free T3 dropped down to 2.3 and my T4 dropped to 0.92. This sucks! I don’t know if I should try Westminster, Armour, or up my dose. The bad taste makes me want to switch.
Russ
Sadly, My recent tests are about the same.
TSH was .12. Now 2.48
FT3 was 3.3. Now 3.1
FT4 stayed the same at .8
TPO Antibodies rose from 802 to 837. They were 1,239 when I was diagnosed. Spoke with my Dr. about going on LDN to try and bring them down.
And gained 6lbs in 2 months.
I started noticing hypo symptoms about a week after my new prescription but didn’t realize so many were having a problem until I read it here.
My Dr. started me on a bio-identical T4/T3 med today. I hope this nagging muscle ache in the middle of my back isn’t already a side effect.
Janie Bowthorpe
You’ll do very well on the two synthetics, but it’s very important to get optimal, which you weren’t and aren’t. See this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Russ
No, defititely not optimal. And sadly, even though my new Doctor practices integrative medicine, and is willing to prescribe other meds, she is showing signs of using the TSH as the gold standard.
If anybody near Orange County or LA County has found a good Doctor, please give their name and location.
Beth
Just taking thyroid hormone replacement might not be enough. I was diagnosed with Hashimoto’s 20 years ago and have always been on Armour and recently NP. It was not until I was diagnosed with celiac disease (anemia was my only symptom) and treated with a GF diet that my thyroid nodules and enlargement resolved. You can have more than one autoimmune disorder. Unless you treat them all, just taking thyroid replacement helps, but it is not enough.
By the way, Type 1 diabetes (which you can develop at any age and celiac disease) are the two autoimmune disorders most commonly related to celiac disease (they share the same gene types).
Easy to get tested for celiac disease. Simple blood test. I urge everyone to get tested before going gluten free because all celiac testing required you to be on a full gluten diet. Celiacs can be asymptomatic and it is systemic affecting fertility, the brain, joints, bones, etc.
Janie Bowthorpe
Correct, just taking the right thyroid hormones is one of many strategies those with Hashi’s and other autoimmune issues need to do, including avoiding gluten.
There’s also now a good patient-to-patient Hashi’s book called Hashimoto’s: Taming the Beast with a great deal of good information, including a chapter on 96 short testimonies of what patients are doing to get antibodies down for Hashi’s, for one. There is also info on what autoimmune diseases can combine. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/hashimotos-taming-the-beast
Ann
When starting on synthetics like Synthroid my current script would be for 100mcg. and 25mcg. of cytomel. I understand to multi dose the cytomel but would I ask my doctor to split up the dose of the Synthroid? Thanks for your help.
Janie Bowthorpe
You can cut them or ask for smaller amount pills.
Janet
Ann, I just got my new prescriptions for the synthetic T4 and T3. I checked with a lot of people first to see which seems to be the least allergenic brands, and they all agreed the 50 mcg Synthroid with no dye is the best. So I’m taking two a day plus two to three spread out doses of 5 mcg of a generic Cytomel which also does not have any dyes. I reacted just a little to the Cytomel but hopefully will tolerate it. I did fine with the Synthroid. I was concerned the name brand Synthroid wouldn’t be covered by my insurance, but my copay was only $2. Same for the generic Cytomel.
I’m so fortunate to have a doctor and pharmacist who will work with me but it sure gets scary when you have to change something so essential to our health as thyroid replacement. I have standing orders for free T4 and T3 to make sure I’m getting proper doses. I did great with Thyrolar years ago so I’m hoping this will work.
Janie Bowthorpe
If you react to the T3, time to do this page://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
Wyline
I switched to NP thyroid after I had the same terrible problems as everyone else this past summer when I refilled my NatureThroid. I didn’t realize how bad I was doing until I read about others similar symptoms and connected the dots. The switch to NP has been great for me – until I ran across this thread and immediately tried to get a new batch. The lot marked M that I was able to sniff reeked of cat pee and my pharmacist agreed with me. He is able to do compounding but told me that it will be very expensive. Fortunately he had various amounts and strengths of non-contaminated lots so I was able to combine and purchase enough to get me through early next year. I’m hoping things will be better after that but if you read the above article things look pretty grim to me.
Kelly
I switched to a compounding pharmacy after the NP smelled and tasted awful (cat pee). I showed them the old NP and the new smelly ones and they could smell the difference. They get their thyroid powder from PCCA. They filled my order with a new batch of thyroid powder and it ALSO smelled like cat pee. They had an older thyroid jar of powder and compared them and they look and smell different. They let me take pictures of them with their chemical analysis. The old and new batch have a very different color and smell. The new batch has lactose and twice as much ash. I would like to send pictures to you but I don’t know how.
Janie Bowthorpe
Wait, the “compounded” thyroid powder smelled like cat pee??
Karen
Omg why is there ash in this at all. I also tried compounded this spring and reacted bad tried three fillers same reaction after hundreds of dollars said can’t do it. Was told they get thier stuff from pccp also.google the toxic effects of ash to humans this has alot of symptoms people are getting. You and this pharmacy need to report these findings to the FDA. I will never trust ndt again.never mind the smell just finding the ash and lactose is very alarming in itself. I am still so sick and said many times I feel like am being poisoned. Ash contains many heavy metals. What f nightmare.
Catherine
I am not following. What is Ash? Thanks.
Ryan
Soot, burnt/expressed carbon. It’s garbage filler. Could explain the gray discolorations in the pills.
Patricia
I had a feeling this was an issue. No one knows whats in this new “Thyroid USP” which all the manufacturers are using now to make NDT’s. Obviously, it’s not just freeze dried pig glandular. https://www.pccarx.com/products/THYROID-USP-POWDER-(PORCINE)/30-1467/APIS-EXCIPIENTS
Patricia
Kelly, Can you post the pictures on the STTM Facebook page?
Janie Bowthorpe
Is Kelly allows me, I’m going to start a brand new blog post about this and will include the pictures.
Karen
Janie don’t you find this very concerning to know they found these ingredients in the porcine powder nothing should be in it but dried pig gland. Never mind twice the amount of ash or lactose. That pharmacist should know this and is mandated to report these findings. And to answer the person who said what is ash? Well it is either wood ash or coal ash. Both toxic to humans. I think this has been going on for a while. I would encourage her to report it instead of blogging because nothing is going get done just talking about it.
Janie Bowthorpe
I find it disgusting that all American NDT’s are not the excellent products they used to be.
Patricia
Janie …
I Watched your videos from end of August. Just wondering how YOU are feeling? Have you run out of the old formula NP? Have you figured out what you are going to do now? I have tried Thyrovanz & Thyrogold but not having much luck. Tried going back to NP but it just makes me so sick. Getting blood tests in the AM & then seeing the doctor next week. I found an old supply of NP last night & took one & feel a tiny bit better today, only 6 pills though. Looks like we are in for a long rough road ahead. I hope you are doing well …
PS: Someone posted on one of the Thyroid groups the strengths of T4 & T3 in Thyro-Gold – She said she called them & they gave her this info. The 300 mg pill = 100mcg T4 & 25mcg T3. So the 150mg would be half. Looks like the 300mg would be close to 150mg of NP or 2.5grs?
Lorie
I’m thrilled to hear later batches are improving. I’ll have to talk with my pharmacist. Still dealing with the skin rash and a few other minor hypo symptoms. Had a crazy thought, it might be what the pigs are getting fed causing reactions in people. I’m allergic mainly to wheat, dairy, and nightshade. If the pigs eat a lot of potatoes that would explain my rash, increasing edema, headaches, etc. Seems like those with thyroid issues also have food issues with wheat, corn, nightshades, basically inflammatories coming through from the pigs to us. Any way to test how much solanine is ending up in the pills?
Jenny T
Regarding Nutrameds desiccated thyroid, the tablets come in 130mg. Would these compare to the same amount of ThyroGold desiccated thyroid? I know the ThyroGold comes in 150mg and 300mg, and the 150mg size is equivalent to one grain of prescription desiccated thyroid (according to ThyroGold website). I know it is thought that the Nutrameds is weaker, but I don’t understand why, given that they are both dried thyroid gland, with some additives.
Has anyone ever compared the efficacy of both of them, and what do you think?
I am thinking about replacing my NP Thyroid due to the current issues. I have ordered Thyroid-S from Thailand, but it won’t be here for a month. I don’t want to renew my script for NP because I’m not even sure it works well, even though I have gotten “good” batches of it. So I’ll need a replacement while waiting for Thyroid-S to arrive. I already have a bottle of the Nutrameds desiccated thyroid. Thanks for any insight.
Janie Bowthorpe
Nutri-meds has always been a little weaker, so you end up needing more. No matter what you switch to just keep track of your free T3 and free T4 and get optimal.
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Elle
Do I need a script to purchase Thyroid-S, and is it OK to name reliable purveyors of Thyroid-S? Where does everybody buy it?
Janie Bowthorpe
No script. And no, we can’t post purveyors of Thyroid-S, as there’s nothing more that the FDA wants but to close them down. It’s happened before.
Elle
Thanks, Janie. I thought that may be the case. What an awful conundrum for those of us without a thyroid. In my dreams I would love to see thousands of Thyroid Patients storm Capitol Hill and demand 1) steady supply of meds that keep us alive, and 2) an investigation into why this isn’t happening.
Karen
Has anyone considered a possible mold contaminated extract? Because I remember back in July saying these pills have a mildue taste to them.Believe me I know about mold highly allergic to many strains.
Ryan
Started a fresh batch of 60mg tablets this morning coupled with my current 15mg tablet from the original fill as a trade in for the stinky cat pee pills that weren’t working for me. After having swallowed my dose this morning, within 5 minutes, I was already feeling better. I was juiced with energy seemingly and got up to start my day at 7am instead of my alarm time at 8am. Absolutely not groggy, nor am I feeling lethargic, no headaches (thyroid migraine-type) and the only remaining effect is a slight numbness or tingle in my middle, ring and pinky finger on both hands. Feet are a little cold, but I’m not getting that flushing feeling like I have a fever or anything at all. Brain fog appears to be gone.
I don’t want to cash my chips in on the new supply, but I definitely feel a little better, if not back to somewhat normalcy. If that changes, I’ll reply to this.
Janie Bowthorpe
Those are the mysteries we have to figure out i.e. did you get an old batch or have they made some changes secretly.
Ryan
Doesn’t appear to be an older batch, as there’s speckles or discoloration. The smell and taste are definitely gone and I certainly “feel better” but I wouldn’t claim it to be near as good as I was on the old stuff.
Janie Bowthorpe
Once these pharmaceuticals make changes, so far none of them have been as consistently good as they used to be… it’s sad.
Ryan
As promised, I’m following up with the end of the day. Most of today was pretty good. Still some tingling in the finger tips and toes, but the hypo-headaches that I normally feel on the back of my head and neck, towards the top of my head are mostly gone. So some symptoms persist but are much less nagging than the dosage before, and I assume my body might be trying to get back into optimal range so this might be part of that. As I stated before, it was a trial getting off of naturethroid and getting onto NP, so some of these symptoms are very familiar. I’m hoping things improve from here, but I still feel a little run down toward the middle to end of the day. Hoping my experiences help, might be worth trying to swap out your stinky meds for ones that don’t stink. My pharmacist called me today and seemed heavily invested in my well-being and how I was doing today after starting the new fill. She agreed that there might be some soft hurdles to get back into adjustment, and it probably didn’t help that I was throwing additional dosages into my day with the stinky fill to try and balance myself out. Keeping my fingers crossed for myself and the rest of you. Hopefully there’s some light at the end of this crappy tunnel.
Di
This is hopeful; anyone else get a “good” refill? I am suffering on Naturethroid!
Ryan
As an update, symptoms come and go throughout the day. Mostly grogginess, tingling or numb/cold fingers and feet, occasional ocular headache, or back of neck which is a thyroid related migraine. I feel better than I was last week, still, but definitely not 100%. Someone posted that they were trying to get compounded thyroid powder but found out the new batch had more ash and lactose in it. Lactose inhibits thyroid absorption, which seems like a stupid move when you consider the purpose of these pills, unless they want their patients on higher doses to get their required thyroid hormone, thus generating a higher revenue due to the slight increase in price when adjusting dose. Seems farfetched, but pharma is so sketchy these days.
Di
I think you have hit the nail on the head! More fillers, weaker product means we spend more $ to get the same amount of pure medicine. Cheaper fillers or cheaper methods of production may account for the poor quality (and in my case, allergic reaction) to the new NP. It seems to be that way with everything! Clothes at the stores now are paper thin. Bacon (as just an example) used to be 16 oz., now 12 oz. packages for same price or higher. Everything is cheaper, smaller, thinner, and costs more. ‘nuf said.
Angela Frye
Yes, I do think there were problems with NP prior to July/August. I began to notice issues with a tachycardia incident while gardening toward the end of March and I’d noticed not so much fatigue in the latter part of the day, but a puny/blah apathetic feeling. I’d like to take the opportunity also to point out, that for one reason or another, certain fills seemed to coincide with higher RT3 on same or even lower dose. My single biggest complaint with NP, though, has been erratic BP and HR. I’d like to take the opportunity to repost here at the blog two comments that I have up at STTM’s Facebook page below.
The hospital monitor Wed night during below described incident showed both PACs and PVCs in my case, with high BP (I’ve NEVER had…always lowish to low). I could feel these and doc/husband could see them on the monitor immediately after I felt. (PVCs reported by a former Naturethroid or WP user in response to a blog post about RLC problems, also with NP that resulted in a trip by him to the ER. Scary stuff. My posts below:
STTM/Janie…I had a little trip to the emergency room Wednesday night on this med; with soaring BPs , erratic HR, and chest pain. . I’m waiting on some labs from Tuesday morning to report my findings more fully and I see my primary on Wednesday to discuss what happened and strategy going forward.
Also..I’ve noticed that NP has stopped me and perhaps others from commenting on their Facebook page. In addition, many of the comments of concern have been hidden or outrightly removed. IMHO, that is not representative of a company that wants to do anything but damage control.
So, I did finally get my labs back. I also had labs at the hospital (would have been about 2-3 hours after my PM dose). Tuesday labs; TSH .023L (.45-4.5), FT3 3.1 (2.0-4.4), FT4 .94 (.82-1.77):RT3 14.6 (9.2-24.1) so, look “normal”, if suboptimal w/ high RT3, but bear with me. Hospital labs; TSH.03L (no range given), FT3 4.7H! (2.3-3.9), FT4 .7 (.6-1.1). Would expect that different labs, esp at different times would be slightly different, but here is what it almost looks like to me…Like there is “uneven” distribution of hormone amongst pills a/o batches a/o added T3 which is very quickly in and out of the system. Irony is except for the soaring BPs and palps, I felt reasonably good. Sleep good except waking a little early. No to little edema, but easy weight gain/harder to keep off. . A comment on the STTM blog on this issue pointed to ractopamine as a potential feed additive contaminant. While I think it’s a little early to latch onto that as an explanation, my symptoms certainly seem (feeling hyper while LN) to fit. Not sure what I’m going to do. I have some Naturethroid fills from one of RLC’s mail-order pharmacies that I didn’t do well on either. I’ve gone back to some older Armour fills at a slightly lower dose until I see my PCP tomorrow and palps have lessened, but not disappeared. Think I’m going to ask for ‘scripts for both Armour and T4/T3 combo. I share everyone’s frustration, to say the least. Did well on Armour before change..Then BEST on ERFA before change..Then reasonably well on Naturethroid before change. Then just okay on NP, and now the current debacle. I DO plan to file FDA complaints, but wondering if a direct confrontation from the thyroid community with our leader:Janie, Mary, Elaine and a few hand-picked patients might be in order. Have included a ractopamine Wikipedia treatise link for those interested. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ractopamine
Amy
I was sick on NP from Feb & Apr of this year. I still have some of the pills and they reek. My RT3 went up on the NP as well and then came down again when I switched back to Nature-throid. Other than feeling really ill like I had a severe flu, tired, upset stomach I started getting debilitating headaches and severe leg edema. All of it went away when I stopped the NP – both times. I tried it 2x.
Lori
Angela, don’t you think your free T3 was probably high because you were at 2-3 hours post dose? T3 spikes in the blood and is hard to ‘measure’ unlike the more stable t4. Not saying you don’t need t3 but maybe you need to reduce it or spread it out more. Sorry about the hospital visit 🙁
Angie F.
Lori, I have considered that the hospital Free T3 measure was post evening med. However, post med measurements in the past have NEVER been that high (upper end of hospital range was 3.9, mine was 4.7). Somehow or another, I’m getting a T3 “dump” a/o something else in the NP that’s causing the BP and HR spikes and palps, and perhaps also contributing to the high RT3. Am wondering if the active ingredient has changed a/o is unevenly distributed. I have switched back to Armour on a lower dose (1 1/2 grain as opposed to 1 3/4-2 grain) and will talk to my doc about what to do in today’s appointment.
Erica
I just started taking a new batch from express scripts. It doesn’t smell as bad as the previous batch from this summer(90 day supply). This batch taste a little sweet. I noticed the last batch smelling stronger, but just thought it was different pigs?! I’m also pregnant and have had to up my dose, so I didn’t realize people were having issues until I started this new batch. I was curious about the obvious change and searched the internet to see what was going on.
Jenny T
I am wondering if the new formulations of NP Thyroid contain thyroid glands from dead pigs that died due to the African Swine Flu that is wiping out herds of pigs in Asia, and now in Australia too. I wouldn’t doubt if unscrupulous herd owners are selling body parts from sick animals.
Beth
On NP Thyroid’s Facebook Page they posted on September 26th that they had in fact had a product update. They now get the active ingredient from Europe. https://npthyroid.com/product-updates/?fbclid=IwAR1XfdewX0Z3U7fuinKFMfomIQYiQgJXWxwyw6cgR9n-kyMTwMtnckgELQw
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, a lot of people saw that. But that’s not admitting other clear changes. Specks, horrid smell, different taste, and a slow of bad symptoms reporting by many.
Amy
I am glad to see this is coming out! I suffered on NP and was told it couldn’t be the NP. I experienced severe edema and it literally made me sick and caused debilitating headaches. Basically I was going hypo but the upset stomach was new. My labs supported how I was feeling. I was optimal before and after NP.
I tried NP Acella 2x (2019 Feb & May) to confirm it was cause of my symptoms.
Kris
Did you report this? What are you taking now?
Amy
I reported to Acella 2x and they never responded. My doc was concerned especially after I took a break and tried a 2nd time with a different batch of NP but same result and it comes on quick. I stuck it out on the second round for 6 weeks and I got increasingly sick, the edema was getting scary.
I had an old stash of Nature-throid which I restarted. I have since filled a new script for Nature-throid and I’m doing fine. My labs improved (Free’s & RT3). Notably I suffered a round of hair loss and the timing seems likely it was during my NP trial(s). It was frustrating as I kept telling folks even here that something is wrong with the NP so I’m glad to see this has come out so if someone has an issue they know it may be the NP.
I still have some of the NP pills and they reek. I am not expecting odor less meds but these smell bad, something isn’t right with them.
Janie Bowthorpe
I think many would agree with you that something’s not right. The STTM Facebook page also did a post about burning in the esophagus and burning in the stomach after swallowing these pills for some.
Kelia
Janie, have you seen anyone produce labs to prove they’ve gotten optimal on something like Thyro-Gold? If faced with a choice of using the Thyro-Gold (or similar) or synthetic T3 & T4, which would be your first choice?
Christina K
Yeah I was trying WP thyroid out for a while back in March 2019, and April too. That was reformulated too, quite a while ago. I didn’t do well with it at all, so I thought I’d try NP again. Well, first off, I tried out a compounded NDT which seemed okay, but my muscular pain was amplified on it, so I asked for NP again. The doctor gave me some free samples, and they were good. My new script of NP was filled last month, and it’s HORRID. It tastes like gasoline fumes, or bug spray. Disgusting. My hands are swollen, itchy, and I’m really tired too, and my throat hurts, my stomach gets upset more too. What a nightmare. I’ve been through old Armour, Erfa, NatureThroid, and now this. VERY upset.
Sharon Hagen
I was frightened to refill my NPThyroid 120 mg. but could not get into see my doctor before I was going to run out. I did check with the pharmacist (at Costco) to make sure that what they had to give me was not from the batch numbers that have already been noted as bad and they said not. The pharmacist also checked and said he didn’t think the tablets had a strong smell so I…having no other option anyway….went ahead and ordered. I opened the sealed manufacturer’s bottle of 100 at the counter and there was no noticeable smell, smelled the same as my previous order filled last July. I still had a few pills from my previous order and when I compared the pills from the old and the new bottles there was no discernable difference in size, colour, or texture, no flecks in the new pills. I decided to keep the old pills and took the new pill that night. It dissolved under my tongue with no particular bad taste though it did very faintly have what others have described as an “insecticide” taste. It was so faint that it could have been my imagination, since I was afraid I would have the same experience as others with the new pills and might have been imagining it. I’ve been taking the new pills for a week now and haven’t noticed a difference in how I feel but I guess I’ll have new labs in 6 weeks and then I’ll know….or sooner if I start to have symptoms again. Is it possible that all our patient complaints have swayed Acella to fix what they broke ? Has anyone else made a recent purchase and had OK results ? I will post the batch number if someone can tell me where it’s found.
Jeri
Would you mind posting the batch number and exp date of your (hopefully) good new tablets?? I live in UK and get my prescription from the States. I am terrified of being sent the bad ones!!
Ryan
The lot number and expiration date will appear on the pharmacist fill-order bottle. If that’s what you have, it’ll start with an M and likely a 3xxxx-x number.
Erin
Hi Sharon, I just picked up a new 120 and 30 mg. They don’t have as strong of a smell and they still taste bad, though not quite as bad as they did before (not gag inducing anyway). Though I wonder if I have somehow become accustomed to the terrible taste? My pharmacist would’t help with batch numbers, so I’m unable to help with that. I’m not having hypo symptoms, though I am having the same strange head pain I had before I knew I had Hashimoto’s and before being treated with NDT. Now it’s back. It sounds strange, but my scalp hurts, almost like my hair hurts. I don’t know if anyone else has had this kind of pain. I’ve always thought it was connected to my thyroid or some kind of hormonal issue. I’m thinking of switching to Armour just to see if it helps with this pain.
Valency
I just picked up a new batch this weekend and the horrid smell is gone. I’m reallly hoping that they’ve fixed it.
Janie Bowthorpe
We’re hoping with you. Keep an eye on your symptoms, as my own husband was on the “normal”, non-changed tablets and his hypothyroidism came back on the same amount that he had soared on for a few years. That happened around mid-or-later summer.
Julie
Oh my gosh! I had the exact same experience as your husband over the summer! Ive been on NP Thyroid successfully for a year or more. Afternoon fatigue crept in and all get-er-done motivation was gone! Didn’t occur to me (because I was back in that fog) that it was my meds until end of summer because I have been stable for so long. Doctor switched me to tirosint with added T3 and I am back going again, however still trying to get optimal. I lost my whole summer and as a homeschooling mom that really SUCKS!
Janie Bowthorpe
Yup, he went through the exact same thing…on the NP tablets that looked and smelled the same BEFORE the obvious changes with specks, etc. So something was going on then….
Ryan
My pharmacist replaced my 60mg tabs today for a non-smelly version of them. The color blotches appear to still be there, but there’s no questionable smell anymore. I start them tomorrow, but to be fair, I’ve noticed a slight decrease in hypo symptoms since being on these stinky pills. Not sure if the body is getting used to it and processing them better or what. Pharmacist told me she literally had a phone call complaining of the same issues as I did right after I asked for mine to be swapped out.
fliss
also my labs were optimal in April 2019 and in sept 2019 they were much lower below range. have muscular aches and pains and constipastion too so same as many on here. really scared about the future now desperate to find a solution.
ps. Janie my first post seems to have disappeared have I down something wrong? wanted to add this to it. can I get it back or do I have to re write? sorry]
Janie Bowthorpe
I have only recently discovered that some comments were going into spam.
Fliss
Thanks Janie do you have any advice for me? I’m thinking maybe I should try and persuade gp to give me t3 and t4 but I know t3 costs loads here in uk and they don’t like to give it scared he may give me t4 alone which I reacted badly to years ago. Really want another ndt brand but confused as to which ones work still? Do you know of anyone here in the Uk ? Are you aware of the differences between problems in USA and Europe or are we all having same problem ?
Janie Bowthorpe
All I can say is that none of the prescription US NDTS are the consistently good products they used to be. That observation comes from many of us who have been on NDT a long time and know what they used to be, and also saw all the changes.
Can you make the NDT’s today work? We’re still not sure. Armour, even with its changes, is the only one we wonder about, but we have yet to see someone get optimal on it. And being optimal is important.
So your choices are taking T4 and T3 and getting optimal. Or ordering the Thai brand thyroid-s, or the over-the-counter brands like thyro gold or thyrovanz…or just be on T3. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Fliss
Thanks Janie I don’t think we have over the counter thyro good in the Uk. I will look into thyroid s is it easy to find ? And is it still working ? Or will try to get dr to try me on t4 and t3 . Do I just convert the t4 and t3 in 4.5 grains of np thyroid that I take into t4 and t3 and start stop np one day start t4/t3 next day ? Is taking t3 alone better than mixing t4 abc t3? I know it would cost more as t3 is very expensive here.
Janie Bowthorpe
You send off for it. Check out natural thyroid solutions. com Or just T4 with T3 and getting optimal. One grain of NP is equal to 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3 for conversion purposes. Taking just T3 is fine, too, but you’ll have nothing converting to T3 for you in the background.
fliss
thanks for the info Janie. are we sure thyroid S works as ive looked to up and can afford it I think, its cheaper than thyro gold. which is best? do they Bothe work well? are they both similar in strength to Np thyroid? I was on 4.5 grains of NP so would i take 4.5 grains of thyroid s or is it stronger or weaker? it only seems to come in 60mg tabs so that’s 1 grain am I correct? so I would have to take 4 tabs a day = 4 grains then cut tablet in a half to get half a grain..is that possible?
Janie Bowthorpe
Patients have been happy with either, honestly. Thyroid-S may be similar to prescription brands, but no matter what, we’ve learned to always retest our free T3 and free T4 after a few weeks of using a different med or supplement. Yes, 60 mg is one grain. A pill cutter can help, if needed.
Yesi
I emailed Thyroid S , they stated that thier porcine was more than likely from China, is this worrisome?
fliss
I cant keep taking the NP as feel really bad. is it safe to stay off thyroid medication when your thyroid is destroyed? if so how long for as I cant see. my dr for 3 weeks..will I be ok without for that long? i plan to ask if he can. try me on t4 and t3. I have found some old WP thyroid, they are out of date end; may 2019. no idea when i got them as date of prescription not on it, maybe 2017. they are brown and hard and dont smell like other NDTs..is this ok or do you think they are off? I could try them and see..but just bit worried . was WP ok in 2017 ? are they sublingual? ive never taken a non sublingual NDT…do you have to take away from food? can you crush and chew?
Janie Bowthorpe
No, it will not be a good idea to be off that long. You can just switch to the wp as they last a long time. And you don’t have to do them sublingual. You can just swallow them too or chew them. Being able to do NDT sublingually was just a bonus (which Acella also ruined as reported by patients)
fliuss
thanks Janie that’s helpful i will try old WP from tomorrow. they dont have the same smell as Erfa and Np and are dark brown is that how they should be? also is it worth, if they help, asking dr to try me on new WP…are people doing well on them or have they changed too? would you always recommend NDT over t4 and t3 together?
Janie Bowthorpe
Not anymore would I recommend NDT over T4/T3. Understand that I’ve been around NDT for 17 years, and there are others who have been around NDT a long time, too. And we’ve all seen how they are not the consistently good and effective NDT’s they used to be at all.
Now we still have some people saying they feel fine on them, yet they don’t produce labs to prove they are fine. Fine is only when your frees are optimal, which used to be easy to do: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal Otherwise, that fine will eventually backfire!! So just saying one is fine on them doesn’t give confidence in recommending them to others.
I do like the OTC natural thyroid supplements like Thyrogold, et al. Can someone get optimal? Maybe. Even adding T3 to them would be fine.
fliss
thanks for your insight Janie I really appreciate it. I have been optimal, my labs were always right on point on Erfa and then. again on NP until April 2019. I tried the WP thyroid and feel absolutely awful, nauseous.. aches and pains , felt better yesterday when I didn’t take anything. both those are making me ill. I think I need to try and get dr to try me on t4 and t3. I was on. 4.5 grains so how much t4 would I take and how much t3 if so? and do I just start on the equivalent to 4.5 grains or have to work up to it? I currently split does 3 times a day…does one do that with t4/t3 combo? I am also on HC 30mg split 3 times a day for past 6 years now under too much stress to come off.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Fliss. One grain equals 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3. Yes, might want to continue splitting, morning and early afternoon.
fliss
so if im on 4.5 grains ndt and switch to synthetics I should take 170 mcg t4 and 40mcg t3 split across the day. would I dose 3 times a day as I do now or just 2 times a day? so twice a day would be 85mcg t4 and 20mcg t3 morning and afternoon? how many hours apart? or 3 times a day its more complicated maths ..not sure what size they both come in? do I go straight onto this dose of 170 and 40 or do I have to raise slowly?
Janie Bowthorpe
Twice a day works, like morning and early afternoon. We don’t have to be hung up on a certain amount of hours. I would personally just go to the equivalent of 4 grains and retest in 3-4 weeks.
fliss
thanks Janie have I got my maths right am I converting the correct way? 4 grains would mean 75mcg t4 twice a day and 18mcg t3 twice a day. I dont know what sizes they come in, not sure how I will get 18mcg of t3 as I think it comes in 20mcg so would it be ok to do 20 mcg t3 a day and 75mcg t4? if dr agrees to a trial I will do as suggested and post what happens. I went through all my bottles of NP thyroid and discovered some old ones from last year and 2017. I compared the colour , look and smell and the old ones are definitely more yellow in colour and no specks and smell better. I have about enough for a month so to keep me going until I see dr I am am starting on those today. I will post how I feel am hoping they will get me out of hypo state I am in, then hopefully try t4/t3.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. I’m not where I can do the math, but just multiply 38 x 4 to get the T4 amount, and 9 x 4 to get the T3 amount.
fliss
thanks Janie. one question; im. having bloods done before I see dr as he wants a baseline. ive never been clear as to whether I take my NDT that morning . I have bloods at 1pm and take NDT at 8am. otherwise I worry that last dose day before ate 2pm there won’t be any t3 left in my system by 1pm the next day and will give false low? also if/when I switch to t4/t3 what does one do re bloods and last dose before ? I always have bloods around 1pm as that’s how surgery does it. also if dr won’t prescribe t4/t3 I will have to try thyroid s as seems no other options left> does that one work well , how strong is it compared to NP? do we know its sourced safely?
Janie Bowthorpe
Take your thyroid meds as normal one day, then do labs the next morning before taking meds.
You just try to switch to an amount of T4 and T3 that is somewhat equivalent to what you’ve been on with NDT. One grain of NDT is equal to 38 MCG of T4 and 9 mcgs of T3. Then in a few weeks, we redo the free T3, free T4 and rt3, and tweak as needed until optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
fliss
thanks Janie so it doesn’t matter if there’s been 24 hours between having taken any meds and blood test? how can there be any t3 left in my system? is this the same advise if on synthetics?
and is thyroid s a good substitute for NP if I cant get synthetics?
Janie Bowthorpe
This is about taking T3-containing meds twice a day like NDT or 3 times a day like T3. That way, it’s not 24 hours.
fliss
I cant get my bloods done till the afternoon at my surgery that’s what was worrying me. what I will do is take either not or t4/43 afternoon dose later than normal day before bloods , something like 6pm.would that be ok with a 1pm blood test following day? if we are on t4/t3 is it best to take 3 times a day?
fliss
hi Janie I managed to persuade my GP to prescribe t4 and t3 to try. im just waiting for them to be delivered tomorrow so will start Thursday. as you suggested even though I was on 4.5 grains NP when optimal I will start at equivalent to 4 grains which is about 150 msg t4 and 35mcg t3.
just to be clear can you let me know im correct: I take my NDT ( old bottle of NP that I luckily found ) tomorrow as normal 3 x a day. ( I split it 2 grains 8am, 1.5 grains 12.30 and 1 grain 5pm. ) then the following day I can switch straight over to t4 and t3 and stop NDT?
I want to continue to take t3 split 3 times a day as my body is used to getting the t3 in NDT at those times. I will keep to same time scale and do 15mcg t3 8am, then 10mcg 12.30 and 10mcg 5pm. ( the tablets are 20mcg so I will have to quarter them , hoping I can) but do I need to split t4 or can I just take it all 150mcg at 8am? also should I raise it all slightly to equivalent of 4.5 grains NDT ive been used to and if so when? I am booked in for bloods in 4 weeks then seeing GP to asses. I will post my results but i presume it may take more than 4 weeks to be optimal?
do we have to take synthetics before food and if so how long before? is that t3 and t4 if so? do we avoid certain supplements if so what and how long between? im used to sublingual so never worried about food or supplements …
I will post how I do on synthetics and really hope they work for me. is anyone else on here switching to t4 and t3 ? would be great to know how you are going if so?
thanks for all your help and advice . fliss
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. You really don’t need to take NDT more than twice a day, such as taking it morning and early-to mid afternoon, by the way. But since NP has now been so problematic, and you need to switch to T4 and T3, you could also try just twice a day as mentioned. The T4 will be converting to some T3 for you.
Since it’s close to what you were taking, you might be able to recheck your labs in 2-3 weeks or so.
No, many take with food, but they avoid iron, calcium (like milk products) and estrogen at the same time. Some even drink with coffee and cream and are fine. But it’s up to you. 🙂
flkss
thanks for answering my questions Janie… but do I also need to split the t4 twice a day? or can I take the 150mcg of t4 just once a day at 8am?
when would you suggest I try to raise to equivalent of 4.5 grains from 4 grains you suggest I start on? and why do you suggest that is it to see how I go by starting lower or are synthetics stronger?
I presume its ok to just swop one day from NDT to synthetics the next day?
and does it take longer than 4 weeks to see optimal blood results ? sorry to keep checking I just want to be sure im doing it right
fliss
posting again as no reply: hi Janie but do I also need to split the t4 twice a day? or can I take the 150mcg of t4 just once a day at 8am?
when would you suggest I try to raise to equivalent of 4.5 grains from 4 grains you suggest I start on or do I wait till bloods and then raise the extra equivalent to half a grain?
why do you suggest that I start on equivalent to 4 grains when ive been on 4.5 grains for years is it to see how I go at first by starting lower or are synthetics stronger?
I presume its ok to just swop one day from NDT to synthetics the next day?
and does it take longer than 4 weeks to see optimal blood results ? sorry to keep checking I just want to be sure im doing it right
Janie Bowthorpe
Moving to the T4/T3 equivalent of 4 grains is just to be safe, then test in a few weeks to see if you need to tweak and how much. Yes, a one day swap.
fliss
is anyone on here in the UK having this problem? I am in UK and starting having hypo symptoms and hair falling out nails cracking put on weight didn’t know why until I saw this. was doing great on ERFA for years until that changed swopped to NP did well until a few months ago. don’t know what to do as in uk I don’t think we can get compounded NDT? I am one of the lucky ones whose GP prescribes for me so I don’t pay as am unable to work and cant afford it. any suggestions on what to do as going to GP in a few weeks to ask him to prescribe something else and show him this? should I ask him to prescribe armour and crush it? if so do you crush in your teeth or before you put in mouth? or try t3 and t4. I take 4.5 grains NP have tried going up to 5 but temp is up at 37.3 and feel awful..should I lower until I get a replacement? thanks for any suggestions .
Waveylines
Feel for you Fliss. An on nhs script for np too. So far I seem to be still getting the original tablet & have felt fine. Ive been optimally dosed for 10years on ndt apart form the blips for Armour, Erfa changing knocking me sideways..lol.
For once am at a loss of ehat to do….lol.
fliss
hi waveylines I am the same as you really happy on Erfa till change and then np till recently. its a nightmare working out what to do. what are you currently taking? im at a loss too as feel better when not taking any NDT now but know I will go downhill quickly . im going to see if ~GP will prescribe t4 and t3. what are you going to do? are you in the uk?
fliss
waveylines can you tell me the date you got the ones you’re doing fine on and the batch number and exp date please? so I can compare to mine
thanks
Tina
I knew it had to be the new NP when I started having flu symptoms, muscle aches, nausea, stomach ache, breaking out into hives and feeling foggy/depressed. I was perfectly fine until taking the new disgusting NP. It’s scary the effect the new formula was having on me.
Thankfully, I have a couple months supply left of the good formulation to take until I figure out what to do next.
My question is this… If I wanted to get back on synthetics how would I go about doing that? Would I take my last NP dose and the very next day start on the synthetics? Or would I need to wait a day or two before starting them?
My other question is how long does it take to start feeling somewhat normal on synthetics?
I ask because in the past I have tried getting back on synthroid and I felt very ill with severe anxiety and depression and sinking feeling in my stomach.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. Yes, we move to the equivalent amount of both synthetics. The way to figure that out is by this formula: one grain equals 38 mcg of T4 and 9 mcg of T3. So if one is on two grains right now (which is rarely optimal), they would move to double of each. Etc. Just remember to do labs along the way get optimal: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Tina
Thank you so much for your reply, I really appreciate it. I have so much respect for you and what you do for the thyroid community! Your knowledge on this topic is truly invaluable.
May I ask what your preferred treatment is now that NDT has become completely unreliable? Would synthetic t4/t3 be your first go to, or Thyro-gold? Is Armour any good at this point?
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Tina. I’m still pondering. Have my husband on Thyroid-S and he’s doing so much better on it. I might even go that route as I don’t have issues with fillers. Or I’ll do Thyrogold, or T4/T3. I could even add T3 to Thyrogold. Lots of options to ponder as I use my formerly good NP up. As far as Armour, it’s the only one we wonder about. But again, seem to see too many having problems getting up to optimal. It’s a hard call honestly about Armour.
Tina
Ok I see. Where do you get thyroid-s from? As far as thyrogold goes how would you dose that?
Janie Bowthorpe
Oh and remember: this is not about just being on T4. We always do better on both T4 and T3…then getting optimal.
Darlene
It was so difficult getting Naturethroid that I switched to NP Thyroid last year. I didn’t notice a change in how I felt, although it was an awfully stressful year so would I have been able to tell if it was that anyway. The last refill I got had that awful smell but the one I picked up today does not seem as bad. The pills say 330.
Ryan
Do the pills look discolored, or are they a solid color?
Darlene
Reply from Acella:
Good afternoon Darlene,
Thank you for contacting us! As you know with a natural product such as NP Thyroid, there will be slight variations from batch to batch. We did change API suppliers so that we can ensure that all of our consumers who rely on our product, are able to receive it. Even changing suppliers, we continue to use the same exacting quality control process and rigorous testing that we always have so that we can ensure the product delivers the appropriate amount of T3 and T4. We have received feedback from some patients, on the smell, and again being that the product is a natural product there will be slight variations.
I hope this helps!
Thank you!!!
Quality Assurance Specialist
Janie Bowthorpe
Uhhhh, for their pills to now smell like cat piss could never be called “slight”.
Ryan
I was thriving off NP thyroid 1x 15MG 1x 60MG daily, and was able to skip a day between doses without feeling like garbage. I can’t even avoid feeling like garbage on the day I dose. I do recall feeling this way when I converted from Naturethroid to NP Thyroid against my will, but I have little hopes for the same outcome. I also spoke to Steve from Acella after I left a complaint through their website, and while his demeanor was polite, his questions and directness were cold and calculated. I’m sure he’s doing several of these calls a day but wouldn’t admit to that being the case. In any event, I gave him my info, and he wants to collect some of the pills for testing purposes, which sucks since I don’t even like stomaching the idea of dropping one of these suckers in the sink by mistake to avoid shelling out $37 for a full refill. Literally more expensive than viagra at this point. My 15MG tabs appear to be the old version, oblong shape, no speckles or blotches, no fishy or rancid smell, and I’m not feeling entirely like I’m without my dosage. I’m hoping Naturethroid magically jumps back to life here so I can go back on my single dose 81.25MG and stop with this circus act going on in the NDT world.
Janie Bowthorpe
So far, RLC seems to be doing the same thing Erfa did after their pills went south…nothing.
Ryan
I guess we’ll have to wait and see. Naturethroid is almost back in full swing according to their site and even with the introduction to their reformulated pill during their amateur-pharmaceutical-meltdown, I did ok. I switched to NP purely because it was a crapshoot whether I’d be able to get NT at any given refill, but I did enjoy the reduced cost (at the time) and the ability to skip a day somehow while on NP. Hoping they change things back or fix whatever mistake(s) they’ve created here. Not being a backed FDA drug means they can sink or swim, and there’s nothing they can fallback on if their customer base picks up and moves elsewhere. Speaking of the FDA, they e-mailed me back saying NP is out of their control since they aren’t approved by the FDA. So their hands are tied.
Here’s their reply:
Thank you for writing to the Division of Drug Information in the FDA’s Center for Drug Evaluation and Research (CDER).
We are so sorry to learn of your experience, and we appreciate that you chose to share your concerns with us.
It is important to note that NP Thyroid does not appear to be an FDA-approved drug. To see the marketing status of a drug product, visit http://labels.fda.gov, search for the product and view the Marketing Category in the last column to the right.
Since 1962, drugs marketed in the United States have been required to demonstrate both safety and efficacy in order to be legally marketed. Don’t assume a drug is FDA-approved because your doctor prescribed it or your pharmacist dispensed it. Many unapproved drugs are marketed illegally without brand names and have been available for many years, so health care professionals and patients assume they are approved drugs. This is not correct. FDA-approved drugs have been evaluated and approved while unapproved drugs have not been reviewed nor approved so neither their safety nor their effectiveness can be assured.
At any time, a company may choose to submit an application to the FDA for the review and possible approval of NP Thyroid. The FDA can only approve those products for which applications are submitted demonstrating that a product is safe and effective for its intended use.
To learn more visit the page Unapproved Drugs Initiative and/or view our Unapproved Drugs Video.
Despite the information provided above, we recommend that you report your experience with NP Thyroid through the MedWatch program, a voluntary system of reporting to FDA any product problems and/or adverse effects. You may fill out the MedWatch form online or download a form and follow the instructions on page 4 to send it to us.
Your report, along with others, is an important element in our continued surveillance of the effects human healthcare products. Thank you for making us aware of your situation.
Janie Bowthorpe
And THAT is what has been so concerning about reporting it to the FDA. But…with all of them now having gone south, what choice do we have but to report what has happened to Acella….
Stephi
Hello 👋
I take NP Thyroid since 5 years and order it here from Germany. I was always very satisfied with it and felt very good.
Now I got my blood results and the first time my ft3 is very high 7,8 (2,0-4,4)
ft4 is normal 1,36 (0,9-1,8)
So what can I do now ?
Wait or lower it directly ?
Janie Bowthorpe
That may be about your adrenals. Read this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/pooling
FT4 is ok. It shouldn’t go higher than 1.4ish, by the way, with that range.
Teri
You cannot should blindly guess 1.4 FT4 is acceptable when we know T4 always has the risk of converting into RT3 if it doesn’t convert to T3. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE trst your Reverse T3 BEFORE you accept ANY T4 level # to acceptable. Many of us got very very sick accepting FT4 in midrange. This is an individual disease and NO # if T4 is acceptable across the board. Do yourself and your body the favor of testing RT3!!
Janie Bowthorpe
Teri, STTM is now about 17 years of repeated patient experiences, observations, and wisdom. And on NDT or T4/T3, no one gets into trouble if FT4 is no higher than 1.4 with a range that stops at 1.7. So why would someone see RT3 to up?? Not because of 1.4 or less. It’s because of low iron, high cortisol or inflammation. And it’s also why we stress to test RT3 and treat the cause. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/reverse-t3
Lorie
I’ve had a rash/hives, that tends to happen when I eat wheat, for the last couple weeks or so. I haven’t changed my diet or added a new food. Wondering if it’s coming from the NP thyroid pills.
Ronnie
I just spoke with Steve from Acella. After an email to the company on their website, his response was very prompt. He’s a nice guy and I know it’s not his fault but, I got the same answers as everyone else. They want a few of my pills for testing and, “any/all request for a replacement will be met by the same new batches being distributed now. All they did was change manufacturer’s.” Also, I went to my local Walmart pharmacist with my new batch and all he had left was a few of the newer ones that he gave me for free to see if I found a difference. He said that unless there is a recall the best he could offer me was a refund on Walmart’s pledge of purchase satisfaction. As of starting my new batch of one 90 and one 15 per day (approximately 5 days ago), I am now fully symptomatic again. It’s so heartbreaking because I was just this year optimized on NP. I am in pain now. With no thyroid due to radio-iodine I am left with few choices. Having to start all over again in the search to even feel halfway normal is cruel and unjust. All for greed and profit. It’s truly disgusting the way our world has turned out.
Carlos
Perhaps I missed something but this is the first time I’ve seen Acella mention changing manufactures not just the source of pig powder.
Ryan
Willing to bet they switched manufacturers entirely, and not just a key ingredient and something is being added as filler that throws off the mix, or the supply is being cut by more filler than it should be without Acella knowing. This is what happens when you chase profits and start minimalizing quality by going with the cheapest option, not the most trusted. This reeks of the Naturethroid debacle where they suddenly had to drop production altogether because their ingredients were “unavailable” or they had to bring their facilities up to code or whatever awful excuse they threw at us for 2 years while we suffered and begged for answers.
housemaid
On that link to Valisure that I gave below, I just noticed something. If you scroll down, you get this information which explains why they may have found no problem with NP thyroid so far. This also answers Janie’s question about what they are testing for. It says “Current test: active ingredient, dose, & dissolution. Coming soon: allergens, microbial, & heavy metals/toxins. Can’t reasonably test: unknown or rare impurities, efficacy & side effects.”
So, unfortunately, it seems that it would do no good to send them NP pills now. Not until they have the “coming soon” tests of microbials, which I believe NP has. I guess we just have to quit buying NDT until this bad stuff is all used up and hope they don’t buy porcine powder from the same source again.
Janie, I am wondering what happened to Westminster Pharmaceuticals which voluntarily recalled all their NDT pills. Did they go bankrupt? Did they ever start producing NDT again? Seems like they would be less likely to ever put out bad pills again as they had to recall almost all their stock.
Janie Bowthorpe
Westminster was using a source of pig thyroid powder from China. The facility in China was inspected by the FDA, and the FDA found they failed good manufacturing practice (GMP). So Westminster had to stop using them and thus, no more NDT pills from them.
Mara
When I took samples of the “good” pills and the cat piss pills to the pharmacist at Walmart, he refused to smell them and acted like I was crazy. I take 90mg with 15mg of NP. The last batch of 15 were OK. I asked if I could see one of the 15s he had in stock. He brought me one but would not let me hold it–I could only look at it from a distance and, of course, I could not tell anything that far away. Does anyone know if the 15mg has been affect by the change? I am thinking of going to T3/T4 synthetic. Where can I find out information about what to ask for. I had a bad reaction to levoxyl years ago. thanks!
Ryan
I found that my 15MG pills appear to be the good old batch, but my 60MG main fill was mailed out from my usual pharmacy and filled by a “Central Fill” location c/o Wal-Mart. The 60MG pills are the culprits I believe, since the 15MGs appear to be functioning normally to some degree, if not fully.
Connie Hull
I ordered my two months’ supply of NP thyroid. OMG…it now tastes and smells like CAT PEE. Disgusting. I will be calling my Naturopath and complaining to her. I also made a complaint a few days ago to Acella, haven’t heard a thing. Typical, I guess. Have been dealing with indigestion, something I don’t normally experience. Don’t know if this is related or not. Will be taking or possibly switching to using MORE Biotics Research GTA-Forte II GREED seems to win over customer quality and service, nowadays.
Mara
How do you know how much of the MORE Biotics Research GTA-Forte II to take?
housemaid
OK, we are going to get nowhere as long as we have no proof that anything is wrong with the current stinky NP thyroid pills. A million patients could complain and nobody will do anything without a laboratory analysis of the pills. They will just continue to blame internet hysteria. The only way I know to get this done is for somebody to get their next NP refill at this pharmacy which tests every batch of pills they sell. Since they won’t do the analysis unless you order from them, please somebody get your prescription transferred to this mail order pharmacy so they will check out the pills. They are probably more expensive, so you could just get a 30-day prescription.
Walgreens is not going to test these pills and neither is any other chain or private pharmacy but this one. They are the ones that found carcinogens in Zantac and now countries all over the world are pulling it from their shelves. I beg somebody to order their NP pills from Valisure if only to be sure you don’t get the stinky ones that will make you sick. When you order, please tell them to check for bacteria. https://www.valisure.com/analysis/#analysis-services
Karen
House maid I asked them yesterday if they are having any issues with np thyroid and she said no so I find this very odd. But maybe if someone does use them and says please check them for bacteria or a chemical that shouldn’t be in it. I for one will not put another np in .my body.
Sue
I just talked to someone at Valisure. They will test NP Thyroid, regardless of where it was purchased. The cost to test is $40. https://www.valisure.com/analysis/#analysis-services
Janie Bowthorpe
Just an FYI: be prepared that just because they will “test” it doesn’t mean they will test for the right things or the right way…and for only $40. Be prepared that you just might get the same hoopla that all is well…in spite of the myriad of problems such a huge body of patients have been experiencing on NP Thyroid. I hope I’m wrong, but be prepared….
Lynn
Would it help if we asked them to test an old NP and a new NP? I have one old NP left that is a 15 mg and about 10 stinky NP’s that are 60 mg. Would it matter if there are different strength? I’m willing to pay to find out what happened.
Janie Bowthorpe
They seem to only test what you order from them via your prescription.
I’m just not confident that they will know WHAT to test. There are many possible factors here.
Karen
Sue I called valisure me Monday morning and she told me they will not test pills unless it is a prescription that they dispense from thier mail order pharmacy. and I agree with Janie for 40$ that doesn’t sound like a good testing . But could be wrong.Best of luck.we really need an answer
Yesi
Housemaid,
Have you transferred your prescription to them and had it checked yet, what were the findings?
housemaid
Yesi, I bought 3 months worth of NP from Walgreens in August and it was all the bad stinky stuff. So I’ve used up the money I have for thyroid meds for awhile. I am not ordering any more NP, maybe ever, but I want to know what exactly is wrong because I suspect all of the NDT today is being made with bad porcine powder from Sichuan Friendly of China. I wonder how far in advance the manufacturers purchase the powder and when this bad stuff might run out.
For the time being I am using a Jan. 2016 bottle of Nature-throid that I found in the back of my closet. It is working great even though expired. No bad smell or taste. Back then a year’s supply was cheap!
Janie Bowthorpe
Nothing is being admitted by Acella as to why so many of their customers have gone south on their changed pills.
The noticeable changes are as follows:
1. A highly stinky smell to the tablets which patients are comparing to cat piss or kitty litter. It has been suggested this horrid smell is due to whatever is used to remove the tablets from the molds. We don’t know for sure.
2. A horrible taste to the tablets, and the removal of a sweetness.
3. Tiny specks in the pills. These specs have also been observed in other prescription brands/pills which seem to be less effective.
4. Different shade of color, which can be due to different batches of pig powder, but who knows.
5. Slightly larger pills, which is stated due to a different pill mold.
6. What what appears to be a large body of patients who have seen a miserable return of their hypothyroid symptoms. There are also some patients who reported burning down their throat, burning in their stomach, certain allergic-like symptoms, etc. As more patients are redoing their thyroid Labs on the changed NP thyroid, we are seeing reports of a higher TSH and a lower free t3, and for some a higher RT3.
Renee
Hi everyone,
So, I just wanted to share this story with you all. I had the most POSITIVE experience with my pharmacist last week. I called my pharmacy last Wednesday and spoke to the pharmacist and told him what was going on with Acella NP. I told him I was due for a refill, but that I had some serious concerns. I gave him the list of lot numbers that have been reported as possibly problematic, and I mentioned to him that it seemed like most of the issues were coming from lot # G and E. He said he had some pills on hand with lot #K, but not enough to fill my prescription. He said he would call the distributor. On Friday, my pharmacist called me back to tell me that the distributor sent a bottle with Lot #G. I asked him over the phone if he would be willing to open the bottle and inspect the pills. He agreed and kept me on the phone while he opened the pills. He looked and told me that they were speckled and that they had a smell of cat urine. I asked him if he could grab the pills he had on the shelf (lot #K) and compare them to the speckled ones. He did, and he told me that the speckled ones looked slightly bigger. He said the ones on the shelf were smaller and had no speckles. At that point, I told him that I am afraid to take the speckled ones as patients have reported problems with them. He said he was going to call the distributor back and order different dosages so he can put together a refill for me of good pills. I told him I don’t care how many pills I have to take a day….I just care that they are not from a bad batch of pills. He said now that he knows what he’s looking for, he will inspect the pills before he fills the prescription. I am so grateful for this pharmacist. He is really top-notch and actually cares about people! I will let you know what he ends up getting.
Janie Bowthorpe
That is very cool that you found a caring pharmacist!!
Rita
Renee, in what city is your amazing pharmacist? Is he at an independent pharmacy, or a chain?
Renee
Hi Rita,
I’m in Connecticut. It’s an independent pharmacy, which is likely why he is more willing to listen to me. Before I transferred to my current pharmacy, I had to use my local Rite-Aid, and it was awful. They were disrespectful, dismissive, and ignorant. And now that Rite-Aid is no longer. They closed their doors, never to return.
Shauna
I went two weeks without mine because my doctor kept ignoring the refill request and telling me they sent it.
Had the normal symptoms of not being on it for first week and a half.
Finally got it refilled, and I at once noticed the size was off and that it smelled like cat piss to me.
I checked the bottle with the old one and nothing at all was different.
I took it for 2 days, and for those two days my symptoms where twice as bad than when I’d been without it.
I had a migraine lasting 24 hours and when it finally started letting up I took the second pill and yah it came back again. Not fun when I had to work through it both days.
I decided not to take it on the 3rd day and felt fine again. So far I’m not taking mine, but I know it’s not a good long term solution.
I do still have the old bottle but sadly no pills left in it, however it still smells like the old medication did. (Like fish food flakes)
I took it back to the pharmacy, telling them somethings wrong with it, and they checked the labels on the bottle and the one on the computer and hand it back. “Nope it’s the same.”
I know it’s the same! There’s something wrong with it! It looks bigger than before, it smells like piss, and it’s making me sick!
Goes back to talk to someone else, comes back.
“It’s the same prescription, I don’t know what else I can do.”
Just smell the stuff! I brought both bottles, I can’t take that.
Back once more opens new bottle in back, “oh I see what you mean, it smells off, but you’ll have to come back tomorrow, our managers in, we don’t know what to do.”
Well at least it’s something.
How do recalls happen when pharmacists just check the label and say nothings wrong with it just continue taking it?
Just Me
Report your reaction to the FDA. That’s how recalls happen. Unfortunately Acella is ignoring people. I had to report chemical burns from NP. The more reports to FDA, the more Acella has to respond and address this.
Karen
Thank you for saying report this to the FDA. I was told they are not seeing many reports on this. People are saying my pharmacist is reporting it and other people have filed one well where the hell are they going then if they actually filed it. I am really upset because they cannot justify sending some to pick up my bad pills to check them.They don’t have enough complaints. So I have been hurt by this medicine and filed proper complaint for what big fat nothing.so for everyone looking for an answer what could make you sick.you blew it through hoping accella will give you your answer. Just sit around and complain amongst each other and that will fix it. So I call bull . This is not just about you this is hurting alot of people myself personally believe in helping others even complete strangers because it is the right thing to do.
housemaid
Karen, you could send your pills to Valisure, the online pharmacy which runs tests on every prescription medicine batch that they sell. They will also do tests on pills that you send in from another pharmacy, but there is a fee for that. Because of Valisure testing Zantac and finding carcinogens in the pills, now countries all over the world are banning Zantac. However, the FDA did not ban Zantac but said it was OK.
The FDA has also failed to remove the “”–sartan” class of blood pressure medicines even though over the last year they have recalled batches of it repeatedly. It should be noted that all batches of the –sartan drugs have the carcinogens in them, but the FDA is only recalling batches that go over a certain high limit. Remember that the FDA gets most of their money from the drug companies and they really don’t care about you. But recently, Valisure found a fourth carcinogen in valsartan so maybe now the publicity will finally result in the FDA doing something about the -sartan drugs.
Of course, there is always the chance that the FDA will solve the problem of tainted ineffective NDT by declaring the whole class of drugs illegal. They have said many times that NDT is not FDA approved.
I think Valisure could be the answer for us if someone will send them their bad pills and note that contamination with bacteria is suspected. I would do it myself but I don’t know how much money they would charge if the pills weren’t bought from them. I have enough of the good old Nature-throid to last me many months so I won’t be buying any NDT from them. https://www.valisure.com/how-it-works/
Karen
Thanks for the info called valisure today. They will not test pills unless it is sold through them.you made other good points also just very sick and discouraged right now
Janie Bowthorpe
Just an FYI: be prepared that just because they will “test” it doesn’t mean they will test for the right things or the right way…and for only $40. Be prepared that you just might get the same hoopla that all is well…in spite of the myriad of problems such a huge body of patients have been experiencing on NP Thyroid. I hope I’m wrong, but be prepared….
Just Me
Karen, we’re all upset about this. The way to get anything recalled involuntarily is to report it to the FDA. I do care about chemical burns inside my body. I don’t want to die because of a thyroid medication. None of us do. People have been reporting what has been happening to them. You can’t blame the patients. I hope you feel better soon.
Karen
Just me I am not blaming the patient I know how hard it is to deal with this disease when it goes south.I am sitting here right now with a tsh of 55 and bottomed out frees. What I am saying is that they are not getting reports at the FDA I was told this from someone handling my complaint. You can’t come on here and say how bad this is and expect to get an answer what is wrong with this medicine.Janie can’t fix this she helps alot helping people get the best treatment they can. But this is not the place to get our answer what is in these bad pills. Only the FDA can do this for us. He even said that is what you pay me to do. And yes your tax dollars pay them so use what you pay the government to do. I just get scared this is going to kill someone or do permanent dammage. I wish everyone the best through this ordeal.
Kim Clarke
(Kim, I found this in spam. So just now approved it.)
In August I picked up my refill of 90 mg of NP and immediately when i put it in my mouth I could taste the difference. I spit it out, tried another. Went to my pharmacy and asked them to smell it, they refused looking at me like I was crazy. Finally a tech allowed me to pour water on it for her to smell and the best description is cat urine. I called Acela right away and left a message. Went to another pharmacy to have them fill the script for me. There was a back order. She smelled the script wet and she agreed with the smell but advised me to continue to take. The back order came in upon refill time and now I have been on the new formula for a month 1/2 and so upset. Hair falling out more, weight game heart palpitations and tingling and numbing body. I was on Armour until their change and on NO for about 3 years and felt great until recently. I am going to have to ask for synthetic t3 t4 combo because this stuff about the pigs and chemicals are scary. I will be calling my dr. Monday. I am just so upset. And ofcourse no call back since last month from Acella
Kim
In August I picked up my refill of 90 mg of NP and immediately when i put it in my mouth I could taste the difference. I spit it out, tried another. Went to my pharmacy and asked them to smell it, they refused looking at me like I was crazy. Finally a tech allowed me to pour water on it for her to smell and the best description is cat urine. I called Acela right away and left a message. Went to another pharmacy to have them fill the script for me. There was a back order. She smelled the script wet and she agreed with the smell but advised me to continue to take. The back order came in upon refill time and now I have been on the new formula for a month 1/2 and so upset. Hair falling out more, weight game heart palpitations and tingling and numbing body. I was on Armour until their change and on NO for about 3 years and felt great until recently. I am going to have to ask for synthetic t3 t4 combo because this stuff about the pigs and chemicals are scary. I will be calling my dr. Monday. I am just so upset. And ofcourse no call back since last month from Acella
Kathy
Why isnt everyone filing complaints w fda???its the only way to get these people investigated. Are they really feeding their pigs chemicals and hormones? Omg I am so afraid I dont think my new pills look like either one of the above pictures. They do not smell like cat pee just maybe a icky animal smell. But there is an aftertaste I cannot describe. If noone report this and files complaints w FDA nothing is gonna change!
Yesi
Anyone here using compounded synthetic T3/T4 with good results, if so where are you getting it from and cost?
Sue H.
I too am pissed, I am a victim of all the reformulations that started with Armour in 2009 and followed with every darn NDT that I switched to. I just found out on October 1st about the reformulation. This is just criminal. I’ve been on NP Thyroid since September 2018 when my stock pile of the good Nature-Throid ran out. I’ve been doing okay on it, not as good as I was with Nature-Throid, but doing alright. Last week I picked up a new 3 month prescription on NP Thyroid I am set to start it tomorrow when I run out of my last batch. Thank God it is the old formula. I called my pharmacy today and told them I wanted to fill my last remaining 3 month prescription, I did so in hopes of getting more of the good stuff. My husband picked it up for me and when he brought it home I checked my pills, the bottle consisted of a little more than half of the good formula and the rest being the new stuff. I went to the pharmacy and asked to be sure if they indeed mixed and old bottle with a new bottle, the answer was yes. I told them what was going on and the pharmacist said she noticed they were different. I agree, they smell like cat urine. The pills I get are 90’s, I also have a script for 15’s so I can add when I feel I need a higher dose, they were out of those so, they ordered some, they are certain that their supplier will still have the good batches. I hope so because I’m going to buy them all. Right now I have a 4.5 month supply. I hope and pray they figure it out by then because NP was my last resort. I took some pretty clear pictures if anyone would like to see them. Or if allowed I will post them on here. We are all in this together and I hope we get good answers and Acella get’s their shit together.
marianne conlin
I recently refilled my NP Thyroid 90mg, there is an awful odor and taste to the pills. Since taking the pills I have been sick with migraine and flu like symptoms.
Karen
You have asked if it has effected the frees. Well it has mine bad. My new ft3 on September 24 is now only 1 yes you are reading it right. Ft4 is only 0.4 tsh is 44. It was like I was taking nothing.i was not optimal but the ft3 fell from 2.4 on a dose increase in four weeks. To say I don’t feel good is an understatement! I am now using tirosint sol I cannot take synthetic t3 at all. So this scary to wonder if I can get my t3 up into safe range at this point. I am beyond angry how this drug has hurt me. My stomach is so bad I am in pain everyday. I wish everyone the best of luck. I am not done fighting to get an answer to what was in this crap that could hurt so many.
Janie Bowthorpe
What do you mean that because you are taking Tirosint, you can’t take T3? You can take T3 with T4 and should.
Sue
I sent Acella a message through their Contact Us portal on their website a couple of days ago. Much to my surprise, today I received a call from an Acella Medical Info Technician as a follow up. He asked me quite a few questions regarding the smell, lab result info, and my symptoms from the last refill I got in July. He asked permission to contact my Pharmacy so they could obtain the lot number, and also asked if I would be willing to send in my stinky pills so they could evaluate them. I agreed to both. He also asked if I would like a replacement for the stinky script, which of course I said yes. The technician said they would send the replacement script to my pharmacy and then my pharmacy would contact me. Someone from Customer Service is supposed to contact me to arrange sending my stinky script back to them. I asked if he could tell me which country in Europe the porcine is being sourced from, and he said he would escalate the question to see if he could get an answer for me. I also asked if they have resolved their issues, and all he could say was that they are not admitting any problems, but are acknowledging that their source changed to Europe. I was happy that they actually reached out to me and appear to be looking into the issues everyone is having with the latest batches of NP Thyroid. Keeping my fingers crossed they can get this problem straightened out for everyone!
Di
Sue, good luck, but they have called many of us with the same questions and promises.
It is all rehearsed.
Only time will tell if the company is really looking into the problem.
Just Me
Sue, I’m not surprised at all. It seems they’re running scared because so many of us have had to report physical injury from NP to the FDA. Be cautious. Many have reported almost exactly what you have been told and they sent the same bad pills. I truly hope you receive a good batch, but I don’t trust them anymore.
Angela Frye
Also want to point out that NC Hog farms suffered pretty heavy losses in livestock after both Hurricane Matthew and Florence.
Sue
My last refill of NP Thyroid smelled awful also. Just had my labs done, and sure enough my TSH is creeping up, T3 went down slightly and T4 stayed about the same. Also having hair loss and heart palpitations. I checked with a compounding pharmacy and asked where they source their porcine from. I was told that they believed all compounding pharmacies can only get porcine from the wholesaler PCCA for product coming into the US. They believe the porcine is coming from China through PCCA. So I am steering clear of compounds because I don’t want porcine from China. I am going to try to increase my dosage of NP Thyroid and retest in about 8 weeks to see how it works. I too had been on WP Thyroid before it became unavailable and had good results with it. Then changed to NatureThroid, and went hypo, and have been on NP Thyroid doing just fine until my last refill in July.
Tracy Long
I posted previously about having recently switched to Amour when I tried to pick up my NP prescription and it was noticeably different. I am wondering now about investigating compounding pharmacies in my area. Can anyone help me know what questions I need to be asking when I call? Do I just ask them if they use NDT in their compounds? I am just thinking my doctor will be slow to increase my amour if I need it after switching, and if I can get the dosage I need compounded maybe that will save me in the long run. Suggestions are welcome.
Zhanna Tarjeft
I inquired with the local compounding pharmacy (Gilbert, AZ) and the pricing is generally around $75/90-day supply for an equivalent of 120 mg NP Thyroid. I did take before Armour instead of Nature Throid when that went bad and in my case, it was enough. In comparison, Armour without insurance costs $120-140/90 days. 🙁
Tammra
Can you share the compounding pharmacy in Gilbert Az?
Ronda
WITH good insurance, that is the same price for a 90 day supply for me. My pharmacist said it’s because Armour is the “Name brand” and insurance wants me to use generic. Is that true?
Janie Bowthorpe
For some, but not all insurance companies.
Karen
Angela here is something to look up. The pigs are fed feed with a drug in it called ractopamine. I read a few studies online about this.very scary because one of the side effects is major cardiac issues only the USA allows this drug other countries have banned it’s use amazingly one is China. So if you look it up lots of info online. Because you are what you eat. So it would make sense it would be great in the thyroid gland also. I know after reading about I was scared and angry.just trying to make sense of this nightmare and find some answers.Be sure to read the human study using this drug.oh one of things I found very interesting was the side effect found in the pigs was it caused peptic ulcers. Low an behold burning stomaches complaints from people including myself believe me I had ten ulcers at one time and this feels just like it.and thank you Janie for letting us vent on here.
Angela Frye
Karen, I did look at this…thanks for making me aware. A couple of the adverse affects listed were exactly what I was experiencing…The cardiac/BP symptoms were exactly what I was experiencing, including some palps..only difference was I was getting about 2 hours after administration…Also, the behavioral changes listed were VERY similar to what I called “feeling at loose ends”…the Wiki article describes it as “restlessness, apprehension, and anxiety”…https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ractopamine#Adverse_effects
Angela Frye
…I’ll include our concerns regarding ractopamine with my FDA complaints, if form allows…In the meantime, it looks as if we need to do a petition to the FDA specifically regarding the use of this additive…Also, I did manage to find this letter from a Consumer Advocate group to the FDA on ractopamine. https://advocacy.consumerreports.org/research/cu-letter-to-fda-to-revoke-approval-for-use-of-ractopamine-in-pork/
Angela Frye
Also found this article from “Salon”..which mentions, among other things ractopamine’s propensity to collect in organs…Interesting that Smithfield, purchased by a Chinese company was going ractopamine free…likely that farms they owned were impacted by both hurricanes (Southeastern VA/North Carolina). https://www.salon.com/2013/11/01/is_this_meats_most_dangerous_additive_partner/
Ronda
How do you know that the ratopamine Is added to Porcine powder? Are you saying it is added only in the US? If that is true would that mean that the new Europe source for NP is not permitted to add it bc other countries besides the US including China do not allow it? If that is true then wouldn’t the new WP porcine powder from Europe not contain it? Sorry, just a little confused about this drug in our medicine.
Angela Frye
Ronda..Nobody has suggested that ractopamine is “added to porcine powder”. Ractopamine is a feed additive that is used to promote “lean pork” that is allowed by several hog/pork producing countries, including the U.S., so it may be reasonable to suspect that it’s a contaminant of porcine thyroid powder…We have no idea, without input from these same manufacturers whether or not the dessicating or manufacturing process removes the potential ractopamine. To get a list of countries that allow it as an additive, you can do a Google search. Also use the links Karen and I provided to read more about ractopamine.
Karen
Angela here is something to look up. The pigs are fed feed with a drug in it called ractopamine. I read a few studies online about this.very scary because one of the side effects is major cardiac issues only the USA allows this drug other countries have banned it’s use amazingly one is China. So if you look it up lots of info online. Because you are what you eat. So it would make sense it would be great in the thyroid gland also. I know after reading about I was scared and angry.just trying to make sense of this nightmare and find some answers.Be sure to read the human study using this drug.oh one of things I found very interesting was the side effect found in the pigs was it caused peptic ulcers. Low an behold burning stomaches complaints from people including myself believe me I had ten ulcers at one time and this feels just like it.and thank you Janie for letting us vent on here.
Catherine
I experienced severe enamel loss on my front teeth when on NP thyroid over the course of the summer. I would run my tongue over my front teeth and taste a sharp acidic taste. I originally took the pills sublingually and then changed to orally swallowing them in July out of fear but it made no difference.
I switched to compounded NDT powder 2 weeks ago. The sharp acidic sweet taste is gone when I run my tongue over my teeth. I hope the process has stopped but I am left with permanent damage which has affected the quality of my life. I am distraught.
I had not had heartburn symptoms and so had not caught on. The only thing I can surmise is that my stomach acid was extremely low. Has anyone else experienced this?
DelAnn
Yes, as soon as I saw Accella post the sourcing from Europe and FDA inspection, All kinds of questions went thru my mind too. Of the many countries in Europe, which one is the sourcing from? Where and what is the name of the facility that is actually processing, raw pig thyroid into desiccated powder? I did wonder about the FDA inspected “facility”, which lead me also to the Europe MRA thru research. The European Union, is kinda their FDA and, quote: “The Mutual Recognition Agreement (MRA) between FDA and European Union allows drug inspectors to rely upon information from drug inspections conducted within each other’s borders.” unquote. Generally speaking, If I understand it correctly, in layman’s terms that’s kinda like “ok, I’ll take ya word for it” when their product reaches our U.S pharmaceutical company here in the U.S as being a good passed inspection product, and vice a versa. Which reminds me of the recent China thyroid pill recall mess. It’s also very concerning to me, if you have little children on these crappy new batches along with the elderly, they may not be able to communicate properly their side effects, the smell and taste, other than to be fussy and refuse to take it because “it stinks and tastes horrible”, and when parents, or caregivers insist, and the symptoms arise again of hypo, and possibly becoming really sick, sick from whatever is wrong with these new pills, they end up taking them to the doctors with aliments they may not recognize as hypo thyroid related because, “well, they been taking their thyroid medication”. and then all kinds of unnecessary testing and money being spent. Kinda like Accella is ignoring the smell, taste, and returning symptoms complaints by saying, Just swallow it! I do think this needs to be reported to the FDA for the safety and sake of ours and others health.
I tell ya, we are all arm chair speculators, but at least when our lives are at stake we tend to be pro active in finding answers, possible solutions, and stimulate the minds to research as much as possible, since the pharmaceutical companies won’t tell us anything. And THANK YOU JANIE for giving us a form where we can vent, support, emphasize and share with others our dilemmas, thoughts, pains, and hypothyroid problems! Yes Janie, we have to “Stop the thyroid madness”!
Karen
Great comment Delann because bacteria can really mess up your stomach as it has mine.I took eight tabs a day to get my dose and each time I increased it got worse my levels are really hypo worse than before np. AS for the FDA I have filed a complaint and they are very concerned because of my symptoms I had after talkingthe pills. But what really concerns me is people on here being told to not trust the FDA and to hide thier source of where they obtain the ndt . Bill at the FDA said they are not getting many reports filed which is crazy seeing how many people are becoming sick. You don’t need a petition to file just file one for your self and the more they get the better this very serious what has happened.I for one will not just sit back and go on these forms and just talk and not take action. Promoting not filing a complaint is dangerous to a persons health. Bottom line thier be is something very wrong with this medication.
Angela Frye
So, like so many here, I am at wit and rope’s end when it comes to dessicated thyroid replacement. In the interests of keeping my comment germaine to this post, I’ll just simply comment on my NP experiences since late March 2019. Prior to that time I’d done “okay” on NP (since the RLC debacle) noticing that my RT3 tended to be a bit higher on NP, but to be fair had a reactivated mono infection during that time also. At the end of March on a new fill, I, while working in the yard, had a “palpitation” incident. HR climbed into the 160’s and 170’s…That was the beginning of my problems with NP and I’ve found that the NP batches since that time have ranged to okay to problematic, with me experiencing elevated or erratic HR with some batches. ..(.Same with Naturethroid…some fills have been fine..some sub-par…some too strong.) Now, interestingly enough, TODAY as I went to see whether there were new posts or comments on old posts on NP’s Facebook page, just as with RLC, I have been prohibited/blocked from comments, apparently by NP (no option exists for me to comment or reply). A company that blocks comments (and believe me when I tell you, I was late to the party when it came to realizing negative NP experiences) is not interested in communicating with its patient base and is engaged in “damage control”, IMHO. Also..it is very concerning to me that there are a number of people reporting cardiac symptoms on their NP fills and as far as I’m concerned, that crosses the proverbial Rubicon when it comes to FDA reporting. NP first, as did RLC, claimed that they had made “no formula changes’ to their medication. As I have said SO many times (and as was borne out in this instance), “no formula change” does not equate to “NO CHANGE” and here is the direct quote from their “NP Thyroid Product Updates” link…”We recently changed suppliers of the active ingredient in NP Thyroid® in order to meet the increasing demand of patients who rely on our product. This has resulted in slight cosmetic changes to the appearance and size of the tablets, but it is important for patients to know that our formulation has not changed. The only difference is that the Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient (API) is now sourced from an FDA-inspected facility in Europe instead of our former supplier in the U.S.” … My questions are as follows: When was this change made? Why was it made? Why were patients not informed? Where/who is this supplier? What is the actual current active ingredient? Porcine? Bovine? Synthetic T3/T4? As of late 2017, and perhaps coincidental to this entire debacle, the current Administration’s FDA now does NOT inspect many EU facilities, but recognizes their ability to inspect themselves under something called “Mutual Recognition Agreement”. In my mind, there are countries whose regulatory protocols and inspection processes are trustworthy and those that I would most definitely question…IOW, there’s a vast difference in Germany and the Netherlands and Belarus or Slovakia, for example. (I’ve provided a link to the “Mutual Recognition Agreement” found at FDA.gov). I have to say I had not planned (I was the author of the moveon.org petition to RLC) to also petition Acella, but now, with their removal of my ability to comment on their Facebook page, I most definitely will…And I also have to say that it is preposterous to me that a company who has made such a significant change has chalked all this up to, according to Karen also commenting here, some sort of social media “hysteria”. I mean, really…they’re perfectly aware they made a significant change, do they honestly believe that the patient experiences subsequent to that change are merely coincidental? Ridiculous. Finally, I think it’s time, since it is painfully obvious that these companies are less than interested in hearing from many of us, much less owning up to, addressing, and correcting the problems, that we report our concerns to the FDA. Not sure we have any other option..and some of the experiences reported here have gone way beyond the inconvenient and troublesome to potentially dangerous.
Starr D.
Hi, Angela. Sorry to hear about your NP palpitations–just
wanted to say that from my last NP refills in July, it seems
like some of the pills of the 1 GR and 1/2 grain really hit
me too hard–gave me heart-pounding, and higher pulse
than I should’ve had at my Dr’s visit in early September.
(blood pressure was OK, but my pulse didn’t feel like it
came back to normal until I stayed off all the NP for a
couple of days.) Currently, I’ve been on nothing for a
few days as I try to get more of the NP out of my system.
Talked it over with my doctor–he thought I should give
Armour one last shot (because the natural meds have
helped me with some excessive bleeding problems
and giving me more helpful ferritin readings), but if
that doesn’t work, it’s back to synthetics. It really was
weird that some of the pills in my last bottles of NP
were helpful, but others seemed like I’d end up in
the Emergency Room if I kept taking them. Best to
you, and I will probably report this to the FDA in the
near future….I’m an old customer of theirs, having
reported in various changed versions of Synthroid
and Levoxyl over the years–I’m sure they’ll be SO
happy to hear from me, once again!
Dawn
(I just found this in Spam. Sorry about that. I’ve found a few this past week.)
http://chng.it/WtFqQ8CVLp
Janie,
I started a petition on Change.org. I hope this link works. Please post it, so everyone can sign. I hope I was articulate with my writing. I am suffering due to not having my accurate thyroid dosage. Thanks for all you do!!! Please know, you are truly appreciated and we are all truly grateful for all of your hard work for us!
Loren
Maybe get a petition going then report the rancid smell and taste to FDA to get them to look into this and to make sure there is NO deaths as a result of these fillers.
Betty
Any suggestions on what to take ? Just started taking the new NP and can not stand it. Was on it for over two years and feeling great, not now.
DelAnn
Well, Well, Well, Looks like Accella, due to so many complaints, finally had to admit they did “change” something, Their SUPPLIER. With a change in the source of the pig extract it does open up a new thought process of what has happened to the “new NP pills”. Let’s consider the 4 main complaints of these new pills. They are a different size, color, horrible odor, and hypo symptoms are returning. Recognizing all of those variations, I believe the “REAL PROBLEM” lies with the smell , and potency. To me this is strong indication that this newly sourced pig powder from “European sources” has been rendered “inactive” somewhere in the processes of traveling down the road from the live pig, to the bottle the pharmacist hands you. Bacteria causes stink. Ever put a tomato on the counter, after a few days and as it went bad it produced a smell to warn you “I’m rotten, throw me out”. That smell is bacteria growing. If you could first get past the Stink of that tomato, Would you still eat it and get sick, and expect to get the nutritional value it’s intended for in the first place? A neglected cat urine filled litter box soon emits a strong ammonia smell. Most complaints say this “new NP” smells like a litter box/ Cat-P… Just Like that rotten tomato, Cat-P ammonia smell is a result of bacteria growth, and bacteria growth can happen to an animal sourced raw product too. One of the most important issues to investigate in rendering a product inactive is to look at the source from all angles, including now from a new European supplier. Fluctuating temperature, moisture, heat, time setting in warehouses and travel times all of which can all affect the active ingredients, along with of course, knowing First, how, when , where and who processed the pork extract. Within days hours, days, or weeks, the pork can be compromised in a number of ways and lose its potency. For those reporting “It feels like I’m taking nothing”, Your probably right, at this point, you are taking nothing with these “new NP” pills in the way of receiving active T4/T3. To summarize: In my opinion, it would make sense that the smell in the “new NP pills” is coming from bacteria growth in the desiccated pig powder and that bacteria is making the ingredients in- active. I don’t care how many abbreviations , API, GMP, FDA, that Accella puts in front of statements. Bottom line is, Accella, If you start your processing with a bacteria inactive pig extract powder, it’s gonna come out a Stinky inactive product in the end! Plain and simple. And, all indications are that that is exactly what is happening. I suggest Accella needs to do some heavy investigating concerning this new supplier, especially if all these bad batches have been produced since switching to it. To the supplier, Where are they buying their porcine powder, how it’s being processed and what are their storage, handling, and warehouse conditions as it sits for shipment that could be allowing for a pungent bacterial growth smell in turn rendering the active ingredients inactive leaving all us thyroid patients sick. Based on what I have just written about, I believe all batches should be recalled at once, and the “pig” source/supplier and all the variables I’ve mentioned be investigated!
housemaid
DelAnn, I went to Acella’s website and saw their Q&A. They do admit to getting their porcine powder from a new source in Europe which they claim is FDA inspected. I wonder if they mean Eurasia as in China and Sichuan Friendly Pharmaceuticals! The FDA recalled that Chinese porcine powder last year but admitted that it was not all labeled Sichuan Friendly. So it could have been sold to some supplier in Europe and resold to the American NDT companies. But none of the companies like Acella and RLC Labs are admitting that anything could possibly be wrong.
The smell in my bottle was not noticeable when I first got it. It sat for a month and now stinks to high heavens. That means the bacteria are continuing to multiply in the bottle. Their website says that people have reported a different taste, but that it is not meant to be chewed and should just be swallowed! They act like the taste is just a minor normal variation instead of strong enough to gag you.
I will never take another pill from Acella. You are right; it is the same as eating rotten food. It is bound to make you sick sooner or later. But Acella says if you get sick while taking their medication, go see your doctor. Yeah, rack up big bills for doctor visits and blood tests and have your doctor tell you to take Synthroid instead. If anybody does go back to their doctor after getting sick on NP, please take your bottle of pills with you and let your doctor smell it.
DelAnn
Hi housemaid:…… Accella statement: “We recently changed suppliers of the active ingredient in NP Thyroid® in order to meet the increasing demand of patients who rely on our product.” What is interesting to me is “increasing demands”. Sometimes, that can mean acquiring a material at a cheaper price, with compromised quality. Is the raw material from EU supplier cheaper? Just my speculation, but With increasing demands, I doubt they will go to a high priced source. And what happened with the US supplier anyway? At least the NP Pills from previous years had no to little complaints. I’ve learned thru the years, that pharmaceutical manufacturing companies seldom will tell the tales of their operations. All we can do is speculate as to what they are doing… Yes, I would agree that your bottle that sat for month and now stinks is bacterial growth putting out the stench… Those little microbe’s are just having a party multiplying. I’ll tell ya this, If something stinks so bad that I can’t stand the smell, I’m NOT gonna swallow it! Especially just to cover up the in your face smell of it as though it doesn’t exist. A slight difference in smell is just that, “slight”. This is over the top…This is bacteria smell! The arrogance of the statement to go see your doctor if the medication makes you sick is total Company IRRESPONSIBILITY. And yes, everyone that does go to the doctor from being sick on their new pill should send the bill straight to Accella!
Betty
Mine does not stink.
Betty
On their website they are telling why the pills are different. They say that their are only cosmetic changes and the main ingredient is being bought from Europe. I would like to know what the cosmetic changes are.
Lynn
Aren’t ingredients from Europe usually better? Could this be what is going on with Naturethroid as well? Have more people been complaining about NP and that forced them to fess up?
Just Me
Lynn, no. Not when it’s literally burning the alimentary canal, causing a return of severe hypo and people being physically harmed. “Europe” can be a vague statement which hides where the actives come from. They may just be a warehouse and porcine thyroid is coming from other countries. It’s a cop out. Acella has been caught and I suspect they think issuing the “Europe” statement is to appease. It doesn’t. They aren’t being honest.
Judy
(Judy, this went into spam. Just found it. Yes, a lot have seen the below. It fails to cover many topics.)
Did you see this on the NP website https://npthyroid.com/product-updates/
(and based on what people are saying, obviously the sourcing of the active ingredient makes a difference, though the companies can’t seem to realize that, and they kept people guessing about the medication changes until they posted the update on their website):
We recently changed suppliers of the active ingredient in NP Thyroid® in order to meet the increasing demand of patients who rely on our product. This has resulted in slight cosmetic changes to the appearance and size of the tablets, but it is important for patients to know that our formulation has not changed. The only difference is that the Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient (API) is now sourced from an FDA-inspected facility in Europe instead of our former supplier in the U.S.
We continue to use the same exacting quality control process and rigorous testing that we always have to ensure NP Thyroid® delivers the appropriate amount of T4 and T3 (the active ingredients that help patients manage their hypothyroidism and associated symptoms).
Every batch of NP Thyroid® released to the market must meet the same quality and testing standards whether it was produced using ingredients from our former supplier or our current one — and that will never change.
We are proud that thousands of patients choose NP Thyroid® for their personal wellness and we are dedicated to ensuring they have access to the high-quality and cost-effective medicine they need and expect.
We want all patients dealing with hypothyroidism and associated symptoms to find the best medicine for them. Patients, medical professionals and other stakeholders can contact us with questions or comments at info@acellapharma.com or 1-800-541-4802.
Answers to Questions We’re Hearing
Why do the NP Thyroid® tablets look different?
We recently changed suppliers of the active ingredient in NP Thyroid® in order to meet the increasing demand of patients who rely on our product to help manage their hypothyroidism and associated symptoms. As a result, patients may notice slight cosmetic changes in the appearance and size of the tablets.
Did you change the drug?
No, our formulation has not changed. The only difference is that the Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient (API) is now sourced from an FDA-inspected facility in Europe instead of our former supplier in the U.S.
Why did you change the source of the ingredients?
Patients are at the center of everything we do. And we changed our sourcing in order to ensure patients who rely on NP Thyroid® for their personal wellness have access to the high-quality and cost-effective medicine they need.
Are you still manufacturing NP Thyroid® in the U.S.?
Yes, we are. The only difference is that the Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient (API) is now sourced from an FDA-inspected facility in Europe instead of our former supplier in the U.S.
Tell us about your quality control process. Has anything changed with the update?
No, we continue to use the same exacting quality control process and rigorous testing that we always have to ensure NP Thyroid® delivers the appropriate amount of T4 and T3 (the active ingredients that help patients manage their hypothyroidism and associated symptoms).
Every batch of NP Thyroid® released to the market must meet the same quality and testing standards whether it was produced using ingredients from our former supplier or our current one — and that will never change.
I’ve heard the pills taste differently too.
The pills are meant to be swallowed, not chewed. We highly encourage everyone to abide by the prescribing instructions on the label.
What should I do if I don’t feel well or experience negative physical symptoms?
You should contact your medical professional.
We want all patients dealing with hypothyroidism and associated symptoms to find the best medicine for them. Patients, medical professionals and other stakeholders can contact us with questions or comments at info@acellapharma.com or 1-800-541-4802.
Where can I get more information?
Please visit http://www.npthyroid.com, contact us at info@acellapharma.com or call 1-800-541-4802.
Dawn
What if we start a Change.org petition? This might draw attention to journalists, reporters, any one who would be able to help spread the word of this disaster. Just a thought. I am sick about this, sick that I have to worry about my health, my family, my job, my sanity…Something has to give.
Janie Bowthorpe
Go for it. And more are starting to report what is going on with NP Thyroid to the FDA: https://www.fda.gov/safety/reporting-serious-problems-fda/how-consumers-can-report-adverse-event-or-serious-problem-fda
Cindy
NP just posted something on their facebook page about the change. They say that the source of supply is now Europe instead of the US. They claim nothing else changed and they still have the same rigourous testing blah blah blah.
Beverly
I’ve taken NP for 3 years now. I’ve stabilized and become “optimal” entirely due to this medication. But that being said…. since August of this year I’ve noticed the old hypo thing has returned. Hair thinning, belly bloat, etc. I flipped over to STTM to check in and wasn’t surprised to see the discussion on this product. I can’t believe that all this work to stay healthy has the skids….just because of this medication and product change. But it’s true. The tabs are visibly different, I feel bad, and that is the fact. What now….
Terri Dyke
In Jan 2019 I changed over to an integrative, functional medicine doctor, hoping (and praying) to get some answers. So after paying over $500 on a very expensive consultation and a few labs, I was prescribed NP Thyroid and a prescription weight loss pill. I’ll admit I initially felt some marked improvements on the NP thyroid. But I did not tolerate the phentermine due to anxiety and heart flutters.
Anyway…I actually started feeling better on the NP and continued to improve until around June-July. Something was WRONG! Talk about confused and DEPRESSED! All the symptoms, weight gain, fatigue, sinusitis, achy joints, mood swings…you name it! They all returned! I didn’t bother going back to the functional medicine doc for fear he’d charge me a lot more money, and only raise my dosage, or even worse, say it was my imagination and offer anti depressants…
Ann
Hi All,
Just received my new blood work after being on the bad NP (didn’t realize until I read this post). On Old: tsh .03, t4 (1.2ng/dl), t3 (3.4pg/ml). Since being on the new: tsh .01, t3 has dropped to 3.1 and t4 remained the same @1.2. Interestingly my thyroid antibodies have started to drop after being steady for over a year at 500ish. I can’t say I felt great on the old formulation. I have suffered with a lot of anxiety that I never had before starting NP. New formulation at this level has just bought a few more of my symptoms back. Hope this helps.
Marilyn
Personally, I see this as a message from big Pharma and insurance companies..as if
to say ” We told you to buy our Synthetic, maybe now you’ll listen!
Alex
I am as well sure that you are right, Marilyn!
Michelle Kaplan
I thought I was crazy. I noticed it too, but now it’s been a few weeks and I get mine at Costco…but I’ll try and call.
Betty
I hate talking to some pharmacists. Just got off the phone from optumx and trying to get the lot number. She started to ask me questions and I told her. When I told her about the pills, how they looked and the bigger size, she said as long as the numbers are the same they are the same. The manufactuer has not changed them. I told her I have been on thyroid pills for over 30 years and yes they do change them without telling people.
Karen
Ok new labs drawn on September 24. Tsh 45 ft4 .5 ft3 not resulted yet. It is like I wasn’t taking anything. This on a dose increase 120mg.so for those asking it it is effecting the frees yes it is my last free t3 went from 2.3 to 1.4 on my last labs so I am sure my results from September 24 are not going to be good.
Donna Allgaier-Lamberti
I have not noticed any visual changes in my WP Thyroid pills but I have had some alarming changes physically My goiter is back (after being 100% gone. I have had two nodules but have been stabilized now for several years.) And my weight went up about 10 lbs for no other reason that I can find, same eating (Autoimmune Protocol), same exercise patterns, etc. My emotions, I am watching now….
DelAnn
For what it’s worth, In researching machinery in the Pharmaceutical industry, I Thought this might shed some light on just one aspect of these “new NP” pills concerning the discoloration. quote: “One of the most common causes of dark spots in tablets is a result of a contaminant, typically a tooling lubricant such as oil or grease, being transferred to the powder. Formulation can become overworked during standard operation of a rotary tablet press, resulting in dark specs within tablets. Punch tip to die bore clearance can also play a role in the appearance of dark spots on or within a tablet. If an existing tooling set begins to produce tablets with discolored specks over time, there is a chance the tooling has experienced significant wear to the punch tips and/or die bore. This wear allows particles to migrate in-between the tip and die bore and become scorched due to the friction generated by punch movement, Burned material from within the bore or from a punch tip can flake off during manufacturing and find its way into the formulation prior to final tablet compression.” unquote… To me this indicates a Quality Control problem. Isn’t it thought provoking that Accella just placed an ad position opening for Quality Control Manager at the end of August and all the bad batches started showing up a few months before that posting with brown specks, and other problems? In my opinion, it sounds as though someone in Accella’s Quality Control department was falling asleep at the wheel for several months from not following the guidelines from GMP on machine “cleaning and maintenance”, that is, IF indeed the brown specks are actually coming from bad machine practices. Accella also has an opening ad placement for “Document Control and software administrator” which could indicate, to me anyway, they may be having some “issues” in their company with not only documenting aspects of machinery problems but other operational problems as well. Quoted from another pharmaceutical guidelines article which stated, “It is obvious that Without adequate evaluation and proper perspective, the consequences may include destruction of entire lots of product, potential product recalls, loss of public confidence / damaged brand image, and possibly litigation.” … I think this is where Accella could be headed. Humm, I wonder, when was the last time their company machines and operations were inspected? I also wonder when was the last time that company was inspected in order to see if they are meeting all the GMP guidelines for the pharmaceutical industry considering how these latest batches of pills for months are not working out!
Katrina
Very clever DelAnn! The same problem occurred when the Canadian thyroid became ineffective after moving their plant from Belgium to Spain. Spots, taste, etc. I think you may be on to something.
DelAnn
Yes, Katrina, I remember well, the Erfa mess. Once they moved their facility everything went downhill. I got along well on the Erfa and hated it when that happened. And now sourcing from Europe begs some answers to a couple questions concerning this current problem. Accella’s statement: “The only difference is that the Active Pharmaceutical Ingredient (API) is now sourced from an FDA-inspected facility in Europe instead of our former supplier in the U.S.” My question is, Which “country” in Europe are you sourcing the API from? , Accella also says ” It is now sourced from an FDA- inspected facility in Europe.” My question is: Is that our U.S FDA inspectors that inspect the API at the facility or is Accella relying solely on the Europe Union inspectors doing the inspections?
Ana
Great information. That’s a very plausible explanation for what happened. That might help everyone who’s experienced burning sensations throughout their digestive tracks to figure out what they’ve been exposed to. Thanks for posting it!
I’ve also wondered if the Quality Control Manager quit because she was being pressured to compromise standards in Acella’s quest to expand operations.
Acella’s also clearly terrified of being sued. That in itself is evidence they knew they had done something wrong. The statement posted on August 30 was probably written by their lawyer, and everyone in the company was then coached to repeat that there is no change. To admit their pills are tainted, that they were negligent, would make them liable. They no doubt thought they were being smart, but it was a huge miscalculation. It just served to alienate all their now former NP Thyroid users.
Dawn
Thank you for this valuable insight, DelAnn. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that now Acella has these job openings after producing tainted pills. I wonder if there’s a way to find out if they cleared this issue up. Thanks again for posting this!
DelAnn
Ya know Dawn, The company will throw out explanations to us the consumer in hopes something sticks that will make sense and satisfy us as explanation of a bad product, like the standard statement of ” nothing’s changed”, then with being continually hammered by complaints, throw little tid bid of information to finally admitting the change of sourcing from Europe. On the other side of the equation are us the consumers’ throwing out our “speculations , ideas, and possibilities” as to what might be happening and hoping something in the information will stick And, will stick enough to cause a plausible reason/possibility that the company may take into consideration to explore. That’s all we can do if we are not chemical engineers, pharmacy manufactures, learned in the workings of pharmaceutical practices and operations. It’s sad actually that we are in the position we are in now with another desiccated thyroid product that is not working. We are all in this together, the Company and us the consumer. I have no thyroid gland. I have to replace the thyroid hormones in my body to live. When these type situations like with Accella’s product fail me after working so well, yes, I go into a panic mode of what could be the problem, and offer up what I hope is intelligent opinions and avenues of research possibilities to explore.
DelAnn
Ya know Dawn, The company will throw out explanations to us the consumer in hopes something sticks that will make sense and satisfy us as explanation of a bad product, like the standard statement of ” nothing’s changed”, then with being continually hammered by complaints, throw little tid bid of information to finally admitting the change of sourcing from Europe. On the other side of the equation are us the consumers’ throwing out our “speculations , ideas, and possibilities” as to what might be happening and hoping something in the information will stick And, will stick enough to cause a plausible reason/possibility that the company may take into consideration to explore. That’s all we can do if we are not chemical engineers, pharmacy manufactures, learned in the workings of pharmaceutical practices and operations. It’s sad actually that we are in the position we are in now with another desiccated thyroid product that is not working. We are all in this together, the Company and us the consumer. I have no thyroid gland. I have to replace the thyroid hormones in my body to live. When these type situations like with Accella’s product fail me after working so well, yes, I go into a panic mode of what could be the problem, and offer up what I hope are intelligent opinions and avenues of research possibilities to explore.
Debbie T.
Janie, I would love to hear how people are doing on WP Thyroid, especially those with Hashi’s like me. That’s my only other option if I don’t go back to straight t3. I’ve been taking thyroid meds since 1993. And I was wrong–I *thought* I previously tried WP but my records show otherwise.
Debbie T.
Sorry for so many posts, Janie. Saw your blog post about WP Thyroid and think I’ll skip that route. 🙁
Do you think most do better on straight t3 or a combo t4/t3? I’ve done both and need to look at past logs & labs.
Thanks!!!
Katie
Hi Debbie
Please can you explain about WP as I can’t see the posts you are referring to and have just ordered WP as a replacement for NP. Did I do the wrong thing?
Thanks
Debbie T.
Hi Katie–sorry for not replying sooner. I checked back in my journals and saw I was on WP Thyroid + Unithroid several years ago and did terrible on it. Low temps, weight gain, other issues. My GP grudgingly has prescribed T3-only (again) and I’m finishing up my good NP tablets while waiting for my Greenstone brand generic T3 to come in.
Susan
Why are you getting greenstone vs Pfizer? I have celiac and take Pfizer. Also take np. My recent batch smells of cat piss. I went back
And smelled a coupe of bottles of a few pills I have left and they all
Smell gross. But not strong cat pee like the batch I just picked up. My endo dumped me when I asked for a raise and told him
The tsh is always suppressed when taking t3. He said I was hypo though I keep gaining weight. I was started on np from
Naturethroid in June 2018 when there was a shortage and I’ve gained 70 lbs. I’ve also had rotator cuff surgery. But I hurt like I’ve never hurt which I
Think is hypo now that I’m
Reading. So what thyroid meds do I take and ask for? I was not good on straight cytomel-hits me fast, lasts two
Hours. Then I’m tired. Is that one from
New Zealand the same as say, np or naturethyrpid? I need to know what to ask for or else they will just give me only synthroid.!
Susan
Why are you getting greenstone vs Pfizer? I have celiac and take Pfizer. I had called Pfizer and they told me it wa gluten free but I read it isn’t? I Also take np. My recent batch smells of cat piss. I went back And smelled a coupe of bottles of a few pills I have left and they all Smell gross. But not strong cat pee like the batch I just picked up. My endo dumped me when I asked for a raise and told him
The tsh is always suppressed when taking t3. He said I was HYPER necqusw myntsh is very suppressed(135 mg
Np and 25 cytomel-labs are not optimal) though I keep gaining weight. I was switched to np from Naturethroid in June 2018 when there was a shortage and I’ve gained 70 lbs. I’ve also had rotator cuff surgery. But I hurt like I’ve never hurt before which I Think is hypo now that I’m
Reading. So what thyroid meds do I take and ask for? I was not good on straight cytomel-hits me fast, lasts two
Hours. Then I’m tired. Is that one from
New Zealand the same as say, np or naturethroid? I need to know what to ask for or else they will just give me only synthroid!
I’ve also had severe pain under my ribs and even had an x Ray. I never needed Prilosec or Zantac since I quit coffee in 2011. Now I couldn’t survive without them, it does feel like my Whole body is burning up and a bad sore Throat Too. I have done the whole pepsin hcl protocol to
Increase my stomach acid so I hate like heck having to take the prolisec and Zantac. I tried to edit my previous post but it wouldn’t load.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes.
Debbie T.
Just want to alert people to my recent experience. If you compare brand new Cytomel made by Pfizer and generic liothyronine made by Greenstone which is a Pfizer company, BOTH have the same fillers: calcium sulfate, corn starch, gelatin, stearic acid, sucrose and talc. I contacted Greenstone today at 1-855-222-8588 and used their Pharmacy Locator Service. Someone called back later today and gave me names of local pharmacies willing to order the Greenstone liothyronine, and the names of the people she spoke with. She said she would call back in a few days to see how everything when. What good customer service!! Looking forward to putting this latest NDT debacle behind me.
Debbie T.
Sorry for typos above!! I meant “brand NAME Cytomel” and “call back in a few days to see how everything WENT.” 😉
Starr D.
Debbie, thank you for the info about Greenstone. It might help
my brother, in the future. He’s on synthetic T4 and T3 (both generics),
and his T3 is made by SigmaPharm. The jury is still out on how
effective it is. I tried really hard to get Patient Assistance from Pfizer
or anywhere for him to try the real Cytomel, but I had no luck with this.
Actually, Pfizer has NO patient assistance program for Cytomel, although
they do for some of their other drugs. And Cytomel can be expensive if you
need to take a few pills each day of it.
Although our thyroid doctor wrote a “Do Not Substitute” prescription for Cytomel
for my brother, they just won’t cover it without a big fight. Doctor says he didn’t
feel name-brand to generic on synthetic T3 makes much difference, but you
never know–if this Greenstone stuff is basically Cytomel, this information could
be helpful to many people, like my brother, who isn’t doing that great and could
use a lot of improvement. (so could I, but I can’t tolerate Cytomel). Thanks, again.
Tracy
Just wanted to say that when I started on T3 only the pharmacy gave me the sygmapharma brand and I could tell the difference and starting feeling a bit better. On my refill they gave me Maine pharma or something like that and I could no longer take it sublingually, I started feeling awful like I wasn’t taking anything. I told my pharmacist this but they said it was the “preferred” brand of my insurance and would not get me what was working. I switched my script to a new pharmacy who has no problems getting me the sygmapharma brand and I’m doing better again. Still not optimal and looking like I will need to add an NDT to my T3 to get where I need to. I really hate feeling like a human experiment
Sharon Hagen
Starr D., I’ve been taking the SigmaPharm generic T3 for a year, ever since Pfitzer stopped manufacturing Cytomel which I was buying from Canada as it is so much cheaper and they also give you a sealed manufacturer’s bottle of 100 pills instead of 90 from an open container. I have been on Cytomel since 2009 and every time a generic was substituted without my knowledge by a pharmacy, my levels fell on the same dose and I had a return of symptoms, so I was appalled at having to go on a generic again. I chose the SigmaPharm because I’m sensitive to fillers and don’t break down forms of cellulose and the SigmaPharm fillers were the closest to the brand that I could find. I almost immediately started feeling unwell and when I had labs, my levels had noticeably fallen. I increased my T3 dose (it is well known that the FDA allows generics to be up to 15% less potent than the brand and still be called “bioequivalent,” which is a crock just to begin with) but it didn’t seem to help and my hair started falling out in handfuls ! I’d run my fingers through my hair and actual HANKS of it would come out in my hands and massive amounts came out in the shower when I washed my hair. I also developed an itchy rash in addition to feeling sluggish and mildly depressed, gained more weight, and my skin became so dry it was painful no matter how much lotion I applied. I had already had to change from the old WP + Cytomel (on which I, for the first time, experienced an almost complete return to the way I used to feel before developing hypo, this during the 15 years I have been trying to find the right medications ) and had been switched to NP + Cytomel already and gained weight back on NP that I had lost on WP, with a return of edema and a bloated abdomen and wasn’t feeling as well at all…so having to change to a generic T3 (and then gain MORE weight and feel even worse) was really upsetting. I had reserved a couple of month’s worth of Cytomel as a reserve, subbing in the SigmaPharm instead, but a couple of weeks ago I was so wretched that I went back on the Cytomel exclusively and after about a week, suddenly felt really better ! And, noticing that my stomach seemed flatter, I weighed myself, which I don’t usually do, and found I’d lost 10 lbs. I’m so glad that Pfitzer has started manufacturing 25 mcg Cytomel again, so I just ordered some from my Canadian pharmacy and they have it in stock. But gee, now I guess I’ll get to be screwed up all over again by NPThyroid by Acella. I think it’s criminal. Anyway, you might go on the PharmacyChecker website and compare prices for your brother. My insurance upped the generic T3 into the highest tier anyway and made it expensive too, so I’d rather buy the brand, especially since it costs me about the same for a year’s supply from Canada (where it’s actually manufactured) that it costs for a 3 month supply here, and I also get 40 more pills in a year for that price too.
Starr D.
Hi, Sharon Hagen, and thank you so much for taking time
to tell me about your SigmaPharm and Cytomel experiences.
I didn’t see this until today (Oct. 2), as my brother has had a
couple of really bad days–and I always wonder how much the
SigmaPharm has to do with it, and if he’d do better with Cytomel
plus the Sandoz T4 he’s on. So, it really helps to hear what you’ve
gone through. To be fair to SigmaPharm, it does seem to help him
here and there, and he’s only completed six weeks on an increased
dose of it–so, maybe things will get better for him. He needs a LOT
of improvement, though, and my gut instinct is that it’d be a good
thing for him to try the real Cytomel, if things don’t get a lot better.
So, we’ll see. He needs to lose a lot of abdomen weight and get
more energy than he has–so when you wrote that your stomach got
flatter and you just felt a lot better with the real Cytomel, that really
means something to me—especially because you noticed a true
difference in about a week. I know we all might not all respond the
same to medications, but still, what you’ve said is something for me
to remember and use in trying to help my brother. Our money situation
is super-tight right now regarding buying the meds–but one of my
brother’s doctors said she’d try to work with the endocrinologist at
the County medical center we go to and get my brother the real Cytomel,
if he doesn’t make much progress. So, that’s good to know, I really
thank you for sharing what you’ve been through. About NP–it’s been
a mess for me in the last couple of months, especially, although it did
try to help me in some ways before my last July refills. I hope they
learn to make replacement thyroid glands, soon, because I’d love to
have one instead of dealing with these stupid, undependable drugs!
Beverly
I filled a Greenstone generic for 5mcg script this month. I’m not impressed with the product at all. King generic was the best but it’s obviously awol at this point. I haven’t called around to see if anyone is still stocking the King product or if it’s even available.
Starr D.
Thanks, Beverly, for writing about your Greenstone generic experience.
Because of what you’ve said, I will try to fight for my brother to get
the real Cytomel if he doesn’t do well enough with SigmaPharm’s
generic T-3. He’s got serious Hashimoto’s and liver problems, and
he needs the best we can get, not just a so-so or inferior product.
I know we can all respond differently to drugs, but your Greenstone
experience really caught my attention, so I thank you for sharing it.
Rosemary Dandaro
I was on Naturetroid for almost 3 years, it never did too much for me, but the last 6 months I was taking it (from December 2018- June 1019) was horrible. My hair was getting so thin and falling so much that I was considering getting a wig. I found a review on Google about the product and many people were complaining about the same problems I was having, the worsening on their hypothyroid symptoms and the hair falling. My doctor suggested that I changed the medication to WP thyroid, and I am glad I did. the symptoms were almost gone now and my hair stopped falling, I hope it will help with the weight and restore my hair as it was before. Hashimoto sucks!
Betty
How long have you been on WP? I was on armour, but cost too much and it caused me to have panic attacks. I tried the naturethroid and was doing great til they changed it. Now on NP. I am still on the old pills, but will be changing to the new ones in a few weeks that I got last month. Not sure if I want to try them.
Terry
My Dr just switched me to WP Thyroid. When did you switch and how long before you noticed a difference?
Janie Bowthorpe
Remember that you can notice a difference and not yet be optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Brad
I have been on t4 for a little over a year. Haven’t felt well the entire time and just recently found this site. I am wanting to switch to NDT, but after seeing this and all the problems with other brands I am unsure what to try. Any suggestion would be welcome. I very much want to feel somewhat normal again.
Debbie T.
Brad, I’ve tried almost everything. You might do well adding some t3 to your t4–I did that for quite awhile and I think Janie has mentioned that as an option.
Right now I’m trying to find a pharmacy within 50 miles of me who sells generic t3 made by Greenstone Ltd. which is a company owned by Pfizer (makers of Cytomel brand). Otherwise I’ll go with generic made by Sigmapharma. I think I’m done with NP.
Good luck!
Beverly
I don’t know if it’s acceptable to name the pharmacy in our comments but there is a big box retailer that carries Greenstone.
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s okay to name it.
Beverly
Walmart pharmacy has dumped the King generic (which always worked well for me) and is using Greenstone. Call your local WM .
Sharon Hagen
Beverly, Pfizer bought King Pharmaceuticals last year and then shut down production on Cytomel, which was manufactured by King as well. I wonder if they simply changed the name to that of their generic subsidiary ?
Ronda
I noticed that for my body the Signa T3 was much less potent than the Mayne T3. Both are generic brands.
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s so weird about Mayne. Some report doing horrible on it and well on Sigma. lol.
Tracy
I went to pick up my prescription yesterday and it smelled awful and the pills were noticeably different, larger and speckled. After everything I read I didn’t feel comfortable taking them home. My pharmacist was able to substitute Amour. I didn’t remember seeing anything posted by people about Amour. I have been on NP since spring of 2018 when I couldn’t get my dose in Naturthroid anymore. Is Amour okay? Should I be concerned about the same issues? Also, is it an even swap or should I be looking at adjusting my dose? I am really nervous about all of this after all of the devastating effects I read. Thanks for your help!
Just Me
Tracy, I have switched to Armour. I chew it a little to break up the fillers and make it easier to digest. I also had to adjust my dose up. I am noticing that it seems to be doing fine. Not like it used to be, but it does work. For reference, I have no thyroid at all and have to take thyroid hormone replacement meds to live.
Janie Bowthorpe
This is potentially good news with so many who did awful after Armour changed. Let us know how it continues for you and if you are able to get optimal on it with the frees. The latter is important, Just Me.
I also appreciate that you wrote “not like it used to be”. There is an occasional someone who thinks it’s bogus that anything changed.
housemaid
Just Me, Is your Armour free of speckles, cat urine odor and horrible taste? What month did you purchase the bottle you are now using? How long have you been on it? I have used Nature-throid, WP, Erfa, and NP in the past, but never Armour. If my stash of January 2016 Nature-throid does not work out, I would try at least a one month supply of Armour unless I hear bad reports about it. I just started the old Nature-throid today but am not sure how well it will work. Of course, it is way past expiration date so I may have to adjust dose upward.
Just Me
Janie, I most certainly will!
housemaid, Armour doesn’t have the issues of ammonia smell or strange specks. It’s not as sweet as it used to be and has the classic “sweaty gym sock” pig smell, but much fainter (possible coating and MCC). I have gone through them all as well. I can tell you beyond a doubt it’s not like it used to be and I had to adjust my dose up significantly. Chewing helps break up the pills and there’s no taste. Just a powdery glob. The cost of Armour has skyrocketed and I pay out of pocket. My next refill is around 800.00. If you can, Tirosint is a filler free T4 only that you can try WITH T3.
housemaid
Just Me: Glad to hear Armour doesn’t have the ammonia problem. But where in the world are you getting your prescription filled? Have you tried Good Rx? A 90 day supply of the 3 grain size is about $112. Even if you bought a year’s supply, at a time, it should be about half what you are paying. Are you in the US? I pay out of pocket, too.
ana
I’ve been on Armour for the past 2 weeks and agree with everything that Just Me describes. I took Armour from 2004 to 2015, and it has most definitely changed but seems to be doing something. I feel better on it now than I did in 2015 when I had to switch to Naturethroid, then NP Thyroid. I had been optimal on 135 mg. of NP Thyroid and am now on 150 mg. of Armour. It’s too early to know for certain, but I expect I will need to go to a higher dose. I paid $150 for a two-month supply.
Just Me
ana, I had to increase past 6 grains. Cost is rising significantly because everyone is switching back to Armour. It’s not perfect and my recommendation for anyone who is switching would be to consider Tirosint/Synthroid with Cytomel/T3.
Ana
Just Me, that’s discouraging info re Armour. I spoke to my doctor about trying Tirosint with Cytomel, and she said that her patients who were previously doing well on Tirosint have been having a return of symptoms and bad labs since last summer. I checked for patient reviews on various sites, and some patients are reporting the same thing there. It really makes me wonder what’s going on. By the way, the manufacturer of Synthroid, AbbVie/Abbott now also owns Armour. They acquired Allergan last June.
Ana
It’s getting hard to ignore Acella’s contempt for NP Thyroid patients. We contacted them in a good faith effort to alert them to alarming problems we were experiencing on NP Thyroid over the past few months. They responded with an official statement, posted on August 30, that trivializes our reports of serious symptoms. A few days ago we learned from Karen that Acella employees are viewing this as an instance of hysteria whipped up on social media and that they are laughing at our emails. They were clearly mocking us and not appreciating our sharp wit.
This goes beyond being an offensive display of misogyny; our health, our lives are being harmed by Acella’s negligence.
Yes, we thyroid patients have turned to social media, because the medical community, the pharmaceutical companies and the FDA have all failed us. We’ve been dismissed, discarded, discredited, ridiculed and left to fend for ourselves. Hence the success of STTM. Acella’s condescending, negligent behavior is just one more instance of what thyroid patients have been forced to deal with for years. I for one am done with Acella and NP Thyroid. Enough.
Rosemary Dandaro
Ana, you said it all. I agree with you.
housemaid
The new NP pills smell and taste very strongly like a neglected cat litter box. This is not some “minor variation” because it’s pig. There must be ammonia in these pills. The odor in my pills has gotten stronger as they sat for a month before I took the first one today. I will not take another one. One symptom of ammonia ingestion is burning of the throat and stomach. That is one of the major symptoms that people have been mentioning, besides return of hypo symptoms. The ammonia in these pills needs to be tested because ammonia can build up to a lethal level in the body. I have been on NDT for 10 years and taken several different brands, but I never smelled or tasted anything like this before. I am saving my bottle for the class action lawsuit if it is found that the porcine thyroid powder has been contaminated in some way.
Di
That is an interesting observation! I was thinking iodine of some kind,
since the allergic reaction I had was almost identical to my reaction to
CT scan contrast dye, which is iodine, It is the ONLY thing I am allergic to, besides a little hay
fever.
DeeCan
That’s interesting. One of my biggest complaints with new ERFA is a burning of my throat, esophagus and stomach. Just one of the complaints, though.
Janie Bowthorpe
Another mystery when someone experiences that after the changes.
Shalane M Asher
I agree with that. I have been on 2 tablets (90) daily. I would like to sue. After taking Synthroid for 45 years I’ve noticed pain in my liver, after a liver biopsy i realized it damaged my liver. I went on NP Thyroid. What a huge waste.
Robyn
What about compounding? Is that an option? I’m on NP Thyroid and tired and packing on weight.
Debbie T.
Well, after much thought I am thinking of explaining to my GP what’s going on with NP Thyroid and telling her I want to go back to T3 only. I absolutely cannot go through this mess again so I am NOT continuing with NP after I run out of my “good” pills. Question: Brand Cytomel made by Pfizer isn’t covered at all by my insurance and the GoodRx price for 90 days is a whopping $872 which is not in my budget. Generic liothyronine is $133 for 90 days. Have patients done okay with generic? That’s what I was on previously before switching to NP. 🙁 My GP won’t be happy but it’s MY HEALTH. I will also contact Tammy Lowe to see what she’d recommend for dosing with Thyro-gold if T3 option falls through.
THANK YOU JANIE FOR ALL YOUR EFFORT AND INSIGHT!!
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, even generic can work if you work to get optimal. One T3 that has a lot of negative comments is Mayne, by the way.
Debbie T.
Thanks Janie. I don’t see Mayne on GoodRx, only: Mylan, Sigmapharm, Paddock, and Greenstone. Interestingly, the Greenstone tablets look IDENTICAL to Cytomel by Pfizer. Hmmmmm…..
Debbie T.
Janie–I googled Greenstone, and the top banner says “A Pfizer Company” — woohoo! Will check local pharmacies tomorrow to see who carries that brand. I believe it’s the off-brand generic of Cytomel. 🙂
Yesi
I heard you can get a prescription sent Canadian pharmacies, and that the brand name is well priced. Going to look into it.
connie
YES! It smells just like cat pee now! EWWWWW!
CHarlotte
I just picked up my new script of NP last week. At first it didn’t smell any different than the old NP or taste any different. But as the week has gone on it now has started to smell very bad and tastes terrible. As it dissolves under my tongue…there is a slimy brown residue that is left in my mouth once the tablet dissolves completely. It’s almost like wet cardboard. I don’t feel any different yet…only time will tell if my numbers change. But I have been optimized on Armour and now NP since 2009…and I’m very worried that if I do start having more symptoms that I won’t be able to find anything that will work. Does anyone know anything about Thyrovanz? This will be my next go to.
Karen
Matt I want to say I was one of the first to contact accella. I had many conversations with Steve and David and their medical team. What you say about being precise in what you say is correct I gave them lab results symptoms and so forth.That was over a month ago but all they kept saying is nothing changed. Well here is my own experience. I knew something was different so I got replacement pills on August 8 started them and see on August 13 ended up in the er stomach pain and nauseous high blood pressure high heart rate was erratic while on the monitor.Ekg showed pvc never had that in my life.so they couldn’t find anything sent me home.so I contacted accella again sent new batch of pills started them on September 6 by the second day I was vomiting and was experiencing allergic reaction . And yes it did effect my frees bad even on a dose increase.Two weeks off these and I am still having burning stomach like when you have ulcers. So something is in these pills that shouldn’t be.
Karen
Ok new labs after being on replacement pills in August. Tsh 45.43. up from l7.82 ft3 1.2 down from 2.3 ft4 0.5 also down. This was on dose increase for four weeks. I know I was not optimal but it should have not gotten worse.so this tells me without a doubt something is wrong with the pills this has been going on since June.This has burned my stomach so bad it is like when I had ulcers I really wish I had stopped back in June when the pain started.as someone else commented what damage has this caused that we don’t know how to fix. I know not everyone will react like this but many are complaining about burning and stomach problems. So just a heads up if you start feeling bad as I have don’t ignore it this is hypo hell and then some.
housemaid
Back in August I got a 3 month supply of NP in the 2 grain size. I didn’t smell anything unusual and the pill was not pinkish but white. I thought I had the good pills, but no. I took one this morning and it tasted bad. I always chew them up about 6 AM. I eat breakfast at 8 AM and the taste was still in my mouth 2 hours later. I cut one in half and smelled it. Yep, just like cat pee! I am so disappointed and refuse to take another one because I think there is something toxic in it. What a waste of money. They ought to offer refunds.
I went searching in the back of my bathroom closet and found a forgotten bottle of Nature-throid from January 2016! That is before it went bad, isn’t it? It is totally tasteless. Do you think they would still be effective, or should I increase the dose a bit? I have enough to last eleven months unless I have to increase the dose. I had quit Nature-throid for NP because NT didn’t seem to be working as well and I attributed that to no longer being able to digest the filler. I will grind it up and add what? Sugar? Does that help?
Rita
I also went back to Naturethroid. I am increasing my dose and will have tests done on a few weeks. I chew them up and swallow them, they taste fine. I have been on them almost a month and my hair isn’t falling out anymore! So at this point I will see if increasing the dose and chewing the pills will work. Synthetic sounds like a lot of work…
Janie Bowthorpe
We’ll hope for you. When it came back, it sure was awful for a lot of people and continued to be awful.
Di
My doc. just put me on NT, too. I take it early in the morning, and chew til there is no more gritty stuff–maybe 20 minutes!
Keep it all under my tongue, with a little bit of stevia/erythritol that comes in packets at most stores. Then I don’t eat for
an hour or two.
Will test levels in about 3 weeks, and keep fingers crossed!
(I knew people who had been on the old Armour for 30 or 40 years, with NO changes or problems. Those were the good ol’ days.)
Ann
Janie,
I am curious…why aren’t you recommending WP Thyroid? I understand the tanking of naturethroid but on your website you say WP seems to be ok. I know they have a shortage of strengths but it looks as though you can order in the 1 grain. I am new to all this as well…if you go to synthetics what would you recommend for that (Synthroid, levo)? Thanks for all you do!
Janie Bowthorpe
Because we have never seen one person show their labs and being optimal.
matt
Has anyone affected felt better by increasing the dose?
matt
For those contacting Acella, thanks. Try your best to keep this technical and professional. If you get emotional, yes, they might laugh at you. Stay in control. If you have thyroid lab tests that are now difference, tell them. Example: Saying” I feel like sh/t and this stinky stuff sucks” will not be helpful.
matt
If would helpfull if people feeling bad on this NP posted or mentioned any changes in their latest FT3 and FT4 test (!!!) TSH is mostly worthless, cant do just that. Maybe its as simple as increasing a little. (?!) I went thru all the changes in 2009, all of them. My lesson learned; try best not freak out, your body takes time to adjust to any change which sucks.
This has been going on a while, i’m supersized there are no answers here yet. Back in 09, everyone instantly knew what happened to the other brands as FDA made them ALL change fillers to not fall apart in the shake test. The new filler made absorbion issues. All brand but NP was not invented yet. Two brands dissapeared that year too..Major and Time Caps, both were great.RIP
Matt
This is interesting. I have newer bottle of 60mg NP from target/cvs. I also have some remain of an old bottle last spring. Did not examine the new pills till just now. The new bottle pills look like these photos in this thread, I compared to the old ones. Old ones have sweet spell, new ones different but not as bad as some here suggest. I never take new batch’s with out mixing with the old batch, I always have my own backstock. With my mixed batch, I feel mostly the same, been taking this for a month – but mixed old with new. Ill pay more attention as to if they work sublingual or not- I take the second dose sublingual in the afternoon. Morning at waking, I just swallow the pill, no food in teeth yet.
Lynn
I’m wondering what the recovery will be like for those of us who have been on the bad stuff. Between the bad Naturethroid (June 2019-July 2019) and the bad NP (September 2019- I think the NP I took in August was the good stuff). I just started a synthetic t3/t4 and if it is good the hope is I will feel better but is there damage to my system (adrenals etc.) from the bad stuff? If it was just useless that would be different than if it had damaging properties and we need to figure out how to heal that.
Linda Pontnack
I have been on N P for about a year. I have been doing great until I picked up my prescription in September 2019. I tastes like cat pee and makes me want to throw up every time I take it. I called the pharmacy and they say that nothing has changed. I don’ t know what to do.
Janie Bowthorpe
Call Acella and tell them you are reacting VERY badly to the changed tablets and want them to send the former tablets to your pharmacy.
Jen
The more hypo I get, the more paranoid I get. I’m to the point where I’m wondering if this is all just a big set up from the FDA/Big Pharma to force people away from NDT and back to the synthetic crap.
Nancy Montville
Yes, I have been miserable recently but never connected it to the thyroid. I have noticed the strong odor and my tablets read 331. My label reads Thyroid NP, not NP Thyroid and it does show Acella.
I have all the symptoms listed in your email except migraines. I had been prescribed natural thyroid by holistic doctors for the past 10 years, all 4 brands, but am now seeing a traditional geriatric physician who relies on TSH only and would prefer that I be on synthetic thyroid, so I cannot complain to her.
I look forward to any suggestions on trying another brand. My psychiatrist ordered an rx from a different pharmacy (had been Walgreens, changed to to Osco) but I ended up with the same pill.
Cathy
I have moved on to compounded NDT one week ago after suffering from NP thyroid. My pharmacist compounded it with glycine but I have been suffering dry mouth at night and insomnia worse than usual.
My pharmacist wanted to compound the porcine powder with cellulose, which I declined. He did not seem enthusiastic about compounding with dextrose either. Can anyone recommend a filler?
Someone had mentioned Vitamin C. Acidophilus was mentioned but that is an active component so not so sure. Any thoughts?
Thanks,
Cathy
Janie Bowthorpe
Vitamin c is popular. Olive oil has been, too.
Cathy
Thanks Janie! I am new to compounding but this is my last shot before going to synthetic as expensive as it is. Is there a type of vitamin c powder that is more clean that I could ask for or does it not matter which one they use? Thanks.
Janie Bowthorpe
It would be a vitamin c carried by the compounder. I would ask them. 🙂
Sharon Hagen
Woodland Hills Pharmacy in the Los Angeles area (which does mailorder) sent me an email saying they can compound with brown rice powder, since I cannot break down cellulose, and that they source their dessicated pig thyroid here in the US. It’s expensive though, $150 for a 3 month supply. When I had a substitute for WP compounded at a different pharmacy when WP stopped being made, the pharmacist used cellulose and I almost immediately felt horrible. I had labs done and my FT4 and FT3 levels had fallen dramatically on what was supposed to be an equivalent dose. I was so angry, since I had told him not to use cellulose in any form. He said he “forgot.” I don’t patronize them anymore, for anything.
Robert T
First let me say I feel pretty bad and have felt this way for a long time.
The Most recent days I felt pretty good were two years ago when I was on Naturethyroid but we know what happen there.
Anyway, I have both kinds (maybe 3) of the NP Thyroid being discussed
I mixed my last prescription with my next batch with out thinking so consequently I have been taking both kinds.
Just a few days ago I separated the pills best I could and I gotta tell you, I think I feel better when I take the new stuff. It has only been a couple of days but some of my worst issues are less when I take the new stuff.
Anybody else think this way?
I will try to report on this later
Janie Bowthorpe
Describe what you mean by the new stuff. Are the pills super stinky? Do they taste incredibly awful? Are there specks in the pill? These represent the new change pills and we have found absolutely no one that is doing well on them.
Lynn
I have to tell you that I wonder if there is a smell difference between men and women. All of the women that I have had smell the new NP thinks it smells really bad and all the men think the old NP smells worse. Is that possible? By all I mean about 4 of each sex, not a huge sampling but not many people are game for this.
Robert T
They are described as with the photo above:
Former NP Thyroid tablet on left. Changed NP tablet on right.
And to tell the truth, I think the yellow ones taste and smell worse.
I may be wrong because I am assuming that since I have far more “new” ones that they are the “new” ones. I will know more in a few days when I get the next prescription.
Karen
Jamie also in my phone calls they are laughing at emails they are getting.so with these conversations I felt I had to report this to the FDA.I respect what you do for so many people to educate us and take control of our treatment.But in this case I felt maybe they can help us find out what is wrong and hope they correct the problem and everyone will get the good medicine that we had before.I remember the mess with levoxyl and they told us it was a plastic smell and stopped production for months.Well I searched for recalls this week on levo low and behold the FDA had a recall list and levoxyl was on it . FDA findings were suboptimal pills listed for many strength pills for the years 2013-2014. So that tells you the company lied about what was going on.I use this as an example of what we are told.and levoxyl is back on the market.again thank you so much for what you do.
Janie Bowthorpe
The person at Acela outright said they are “laughing” at emails?
Betty
Is anyone doing well on the new NP or have they found a way to make the new pills work for them?
Karen
Yes Janie those words straight from the horses mouth won’t say the name because I think that this blog is being read by the them.
Janie Bowthorpe
It doesn’t matter if you say a name but will leave it up to you. But if this is what employees of Acella said to you, it is disgusting.
Karen
Janiee it was David that I spoke with when he said some of the emails are funny.
David
Some of them probably are funny, perhaps by design. Some people prefer to transmit info via humor. (And are often misunderstood by others who don’t think/communicate that way.) At least he didn’t say they were ALL funny! In any case, I do hope they get this mess straightened out. My last batch reeks to high heaven but they don’t appear to be new ones. I’m about halfway through my 90 day supply, so we’ll see when refill time comes.
Connie B
I’m not having a problem with NP. I noticed a difference if they were dispensed in a regular pharmacy bottle. They seem to be affected by humidity and break down and start to smell really bad and fishy. I only take them if they were in a sealed original bottle from Acella. I don’t know if that could be the problem for everyone else but I’m not having a problem.
Lynn
What to take now!?! Since the Naturethroid went bad for me in June 2019 and I was switched to NP on August 1 which at least stopped the hair loss and improved things until I got the stinky pills on September 1st and now feel terrible and I think the hair loss is starting again. My doctor prescribed a compounded 73/t4 which I started this morning and I felt ok until about noon. Does that mean this is a bad medicine for me or could it be an adjustment? Is there an NDT that is safe to take at this point? This is kind of scary…
Janie Bowthorpe
Adjustment, probably. Remember that you need to go by the free’s and get optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
It seems that most all the prescription NDT’s have gone south, meaning they are not what they used to be.
Judy
The fee depends on the test you select. It’s best to call them. You can tell them what your situation is and they will tell you what test to select. Once you do that. You can order them online. You would need to register. Once test are order, they send you a kit to send the pills. Call them speak to a customer service representative. They are very helpful. I transferred my prescription last week. It’s takes a bit longer. Because of their analysis of all medication they fill. They accept some insurance very limited. I paid by credit card I will from now on have my prescription filled by them. I don’t care if I have to pay for them. I would feel a lot safer doing so.
Cherry
I was unaware of issues with NP Thyroid when I picked up a new prescription at the end of August. When I opened the bottle I was hit with a definite odor of very strong cat urine! I called the pharmacy right away and they said to bring it back. I went to the STTM website to see if you had any news on this…wow!! I immediately contacted Acella by phone and after explaining the issue was transferred to a customer service voice mail. I left all of my information and then went to their website and emailed them. I received a confirmation that my email was received, but have heard nothing back by phone or email. Although this I the first time in four years that my NP Thyroid has had the awful odor, I have had an increase in my symptoms for some time. I quit my part time job in February because of the severity of my symptoms. The pharmacy said they were going to contact Acella with the lot number (I didn’t have the original bottle). Thanks for all you do to keep us informed!
Kristine
I just picked up my np thyroid 120 mg and they dont smell like anything really a slight smell of idk what but they dont look like those pictures posted above not like either one so I am very confused did they change how they make them AGAIN? And yes it’s the same pills they have same codes on them.
Janie Bowthorpe
That can mean the pharmacy still has a supply of the former tablets.
Betty
Mine is the same way. The smell is like the old ones, but very light. The pills are larger than my old ones and alittle speckle. I got mine from Optum rx in the mail
Judy
You can send the pills to Valisure. For a fee they will analyze them for you. The cost depends on the test you select You would need to register online. You can also call customer service and speak to someone, that will help you select the test. You can also transfer your prescription by calling them. If you have a NP thyroid prescription that is due for a refill. When you transfer to them and they will check the pills before mailing them to you. You get a certificate with a breakdown of what they check for. They do this with all prescription ordered by them. And yes, they do have thyroid medication. They can order for you. I checked and they do order NPThyroid This would be a good way of having the pills analyzed without having to pay a fee. It’s included with every prescription they fill for you. Check their website.
Lynn
Any idea what the fee is to send something to them and have it analyzed?
Krissy
How much is it?
Jim
Interesting find….thank you.I signed up and intend to have my next refill through them. I would love to see a comparison between an older NP Rx and one of the “bad” batches.
Jen
Has anyone seen this? https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safety-and-availability/fda-alerts-drug-makers-recall-porcine-thyroid-api-sichuan-friendly-pharmaceutical-co-limited-china
I’m so confused by all of this…. 🙁
Lynn
Doesn’t this seem like it could the reason for all the NDT’s tanking?
Jen
The more hypo I get, the more paranoid I get. I’m to the point where I’m wondering if this is all just a big set up from the FDA/Big Pharma to force people away from NDT and back to the synthetic crap.
Karen
Ok in our search for what is wrong with all ndt.I found this the pigs are fed ractopamine.to make them grow fast Google the effects it has it is pretty scary.it is band in many countries but not the USA.i for one after reading the this will eat pork.on side effect that caught my attention was burning of the throat and stomach and heart problems. Read what it does to pigs is horrible.
Alex
Karen, as long as the porcine powder came from Chine or India there were no problems with NDTS. Since the source of porcine powder comes from USA we all have the great problems with NDTS. I also have seen the documentations about pigs living and growing in USA… and even that made me scared. I wish the pigs that give up theirs thyroid for us Don’t come from USA.
Julie
I picked up my 90 day supply of NP the other day and it’s the “new” version, unfortunately. Looks and smells different, is larger and has the speckles. I called Ancella and spoke w/David who says they are viewing all complaints but insists nothing has changed. I told him obviously something is different otherwise there wouldn’t be a noticeable change in look, smell, taste and efficacy. He’s going to send me an envelope to send some in. I asked if they don’t have enough of the samples as I’ve read others have sent them in, too. I did see on Ancella’s site that they are getting increased calls, so I see that as a positive thing. Must be A LOT of them for them to post on their site, even though it still reads they didn’t change anything. I went to Walgreens to see if they had old batch and they don’t. The pharm let me look at what they have. He also said it’s very difficult for them to get their hands on any. So are they still not able to fill demand? And, if yes, does that mean they are lowering their standards in order to fill the orders? The comment above re the ractopamine scares me a lot. Are we certain that the animals used for these meds are given that hormone? How do we know? I’ll go to synthetic if they are using that chemical/hormone in the NP. David said the pigs are sourced from Europe and South America. That’s all he knew. I’m going to call him back with the ractopamine name, as I didn’t have it when I called him. This whole ordeal makes my stomach ache w/anxiety.
Sarie
New Labs on NP Thyroid:
I’ve been on the new NP for 3 weeks now and have been optimal a little over a year. I seemed to be one of few that wasn’t feeling any symptoms returning, etc. I feel best with my T3 slightly over range, and my Naturopath is good with that 💗 Both sets of lab results are on 5.5 grains NP Thyroid, but 2 grains of the old (good) batch, 3.5 grains new. I’m not sure what to do at this point as I feel as I always have being optimal, and so far labs are stable, although they did drop very slightly 🤔 I tanked miserably and immediately back on the new Nature Throid (4 grains) with tanked Frees and a TSH of 80, and was extremely sick. I’m going to recheck labs again in a few weeks.
I understand that I’m not taking 100% of the new batch. But when I need 5.5 grains, I’m technically only getting 2 grains of the old, good NP. Based on my past and horrible experience with Nature Throid, I would think that only getting 2 grains of the old NP that I would still feel very sick and see symptoms return. And I would think labs would drop much more significantly with taking the 3.5 grains of the new batch that many are not doing well with. I’m monitoring myself very closely. I’m due to pick up my 2 grain prescription soon so I will be fully on the new batches. I did have a full week out of the 3 that I did use my 1 grain tablets to take 5.5 grains of the new batch. I pray that answers become clear very soon for peace of mind and the well being of all of us.
September 2019
Free T3 — 4.2 (2.2 — 3.9)
Free T4 — 1.2 (.6 — 1.6)
TSH — <0.01
Reverse T3 (pending)
June 2019
Free T3 — 4.4 (2.2 — 3.9)
Free T4 — 1.3 (.6 — 1.6)
TSH — <0.01
Reverse T3 — 9 (10-24)
Janie Bowthorpe
Just understand that you will eventually only be able to get the changed awful tablets. 🙁
Sarie
Hi Janie,
Thank you 💗 Yes I’m certain my next 2 grain refill will be the changed tablets so at that point I’ll be on 5.5 grains of the new NP. After how quickly and terribly I tanked on the new Nature Throid, I guess I expected to see a more significant drop in labs/symptoms, even with taking 2 grains of the old NP as part of my 5.5 grain dose. I’m considering going to synthetic T4/T3, but my options due to cost would likely be Levo and Lio and it just scares me (even at optimal doses) that it won’t work for me. I’m probably being overly paranoid, but I was so, so sick for too many years of my life. And after getting optimal and getting my life back on NP…there’s just a lot of fear and emotion in making a change 🙁
Karen
Well I am done being afraid of reporting this to the FDA.I called this morning and filed a report because this has done something really bad to my body.They are getting reports on np and are taking this very seriously because of the symptoms we are having.please file a report if this has made you sick. Something is very wrong with this medication . This is my life and many others that Don’t know how this could cause long term health issues.The side effects are still with me two weeks after stopping np.
Sharon
I live in Pittsburgh, PA. I went to Walmart last week to pick up my 90 day supply of NP (120mg and 15mg), and asked the pharmacist if I could smell and look at them before purchasing. I took my old NP tablets with me to compare. The new NP smelled like cat urine, very pungent and they didn’t look the same as the old ones I had with me. The pharmacist even smelled them and said they were different. He thanked me for letting him know and suggested I try and find ones like the old NP by calling other pharmacies to see if they would let me smell and check them before buying. I too like everyone else here have been through the whole debacle of changing tablets through the years and am sick of it. I read about thyrogold on your website and emailed Tammy Lowe who was very kind in letting me know how to switch and how much to take. Janie I thank you from the bottom of my heart for all you do for us. I wouldn’t have known about this if not for you. I am going to try the new supplement and begin to take my health into my own hands for once in my life as I have had enough of the way we are treated by pharma and doctors who don’t care! I feel empowered to be trying the thyro gold so I don’t need to keep relying on doctors as much and drug companies that would put your life in danger for a profit. I really hope it works, if not, I’ll never stop trying till I get there. Janie you are amazing!!!!! Thank you!
Alex
Karen, it was not a good idea to call FDA. You should have read the comments from Janie regarding FDA from September. 13 und September. 20. I unterstand it’s about our health. But what do you think FDA will do? They shut down the Acella’s production of NDT for ever. If each of us calls and writes Acella then I’m sure Acella would take a closer look on what happened to their NDT. A compliant to the FDA maybe take the last chance for Acella to correct its mistakes.
Karen
Alex I did contact accella had many phone conversation spoke to the medical Dept, even given a case #. Sent pills back.But they are still claiming nothing is wrong and in one conversation was told people are feeding off other comments and called it social media Hysteria.so I did the right thing to have this looked into.Me and many others are very ill from this medication. So it is not alright to sell inferior medication.
Janie Bowthorpe
Karen, are those the exact words that someone from Acella said to you??? That this was about “social media hysteria”??????? If so, that is total crap that they would say that when SO many patients are now doing awful.
Karen H.
Has anyone had their stinky, speckled NP analyzed to see if there is less T3 and/or T4 than the required amount? Or if there is some sort of contaminant in the product? It would seem that starting there would at least give us some necessary information. You would think Acella would be doing this to get to the bottom of the problem and I know that several people on this site have said they sent their defective pills back to Acella. How much time do they need to get us all an answer?
Dawn
Karen,
I brought the tainted pills to a compounding pharmacy. The pharmacist told me the only way to get a true answer is to use a machine that breaks down the pill, but it costs 5 million dollars. He wasn’t kidding when he said this. Other than that, he stated there was no way to measure what was in the pills. Maybe someone else has a different answer. It was defeating to hear this, at the least.
Dee
I heated 5 separate tablets, held with pincers over a gas flame. Here is what I observed, using a geologist’s hand lens: The tablet immediately develops shiny bubbles; the speckles are the first to burn; the cat litter smell intensifies until the center of the tablet is reached. There seems to be a definite coating, because when heated a little and broken open, the tablets show a white-ish outer shell, and the inside is like wet beach sand or brown sugar. Very shiny, although I don’t see crystals.
When powdered and not heated, I observed a few strange fibers, like tiny threads.
Anyone have a microscope? We have a local university with a chemistry lab. Maybe it can be further evaluated.
Jennifer Steinert
I’m having the same issues as all of you. Had been taking Naturethroid and just switched yesterday to NP Thyroid after I noticed all my hypo symptoms returning.. Had the worst night I can remember in a long time last night….stomach pain, migraines, cold sweats, etc. I guess I’ll go back to Nature throid for now until I can come up with a better solution. My question is, have these NDTs ALWAYS used calcium as a filler? I noticed recently on the bottle of Naturethroid that one of the ingredients in calcium. However they state this on their website: “Calcium supplements, iron products, or antacids must be taken four hours apart.” Does this make sense?!?
Janie Bowthorpe
It doesn’t. And Naturethroid went south, too. 🙁
Lynn
Janie,
Is it strange that we have a wide variety of symptoms due to NP? Is it because the pill is useless or it has something nasty in it that we are reacting to? I developed fatigue, joint pain and muscle burning, tinnitus, brain fog and hair loss after beginning Naturethroid and after starting NP the hair loss stopped but everything has gotten worse. Maybe I had a good batch of NP and then a bad batch?But other people have migraines, stomach pains, etc. Should we all have the same symptoms? How long should it take for the symptoms to get better if we find something else that works? It is scary to try something new that could go south too.
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s definitely a guess, but does seem like something nasty is in NP now that people react to either similarly or differently.
Jen
Received this as part of a response from RLC Labs, the makers of Naturethroid, when I asked about formulation changes, and specifically about the calcium:
“No changes have been made and every batch of medication we manufacture goes through rigorous testing to not only meet but exceed United States Pharmacopeia requirements for potency and consistency. We understand your concern, though, and are happy to verify your medication’s potency by providing a Certificate of Analysis. We cannot send them to patients, but if a health care provider like your physician or pharmacist can reach out with your specific lot number, we will take it from there. Please advise that a request for a Certificate of Analysis must come from a health care professional and must include a lot number.”
“Regarding your question about calcium, the source for the calcium on the label is dicalcium phosphate, not lactose monohyrdate. It is present in Nature-Thyroid, but not WP Thyroid. Calcium may block thyroid absorption, but usually in large amounts ~200mg or more. The quantity in dicalcium phosphate is well under 50 mg per tablet and has not been found to affect thyroid absorption as per physician reports.”
The rest of the message is just a long winded method of again saying, “Nothing is changed, it must just be you.” *Sigh* Perhaps these companies really don’t know of changes in the manufacturing of their products, which makes me think the problem is with the source of the glands themselves.
Nicole
Was on NT for several years and doing great until I started feeling lousy end of last year and had the labs to show it. Then I switched to NP this Spring and started feeling great again (with the labs improving also). For the last month I’ve been feeling lousy (like I have narcolepsy), and labs have gone downhill. So my plan is to try Synthroid and liothyronine together. After asking several friends, those that are on Synthroid seem to be doing well and have been for many years (even one who has no thyroid due to cancer). I am concerned about synthetic because when on Levoxyl many years ago my Reverse T3 was near 300 and had to bring it down with 20 mcg daily T3 (although Free T3 showed over the acceptable range). I guess I had conversion problems due to 1 MTHFR mutation from 1 parent. It’s been such a roller coaster. So sad we have to deal with all these inconsistencies and zero accountability from pharma! They will learn by losing our business and profits!
I am also following the advice of no gluten and 200 mcg selenium (via 2 brazil nuts a day). She recommends no dairy too but baby steps here…and the more I cut out sugar and minimize caffeine the better I feel (probably from adrenals). I should probably also start taking magnesium again but I’ve been sleeping so much I didn’t think I needed it!
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, you should be concerned about being on just T4. There are simply too many life issues which can cause problems with the conversion, as well as push high RT3.
Rachel Smith
Hello Everyone,
I cannot tolerate the latest batch of NP thyroid. Just one tablet caused me to have weird reactions. Blurred vision, headaches, and more. So I am trying Raw Thyroid, by Source Naturals, which is a very clean bovine product.
On the label it says
Raw tissue concentrates are made from toxin-free lyophilized glands from animals grazed on rangelands known to be free of pesticides, growth hormones, antibiotics, or chemical additives. This natural product is made without sugar, starch, preservatives, or artificial colors or flavorings, or genetically modified organisms. It contains no yeast, no soy, no milk derivatives, no wheat, and is gluten free.
It also says it is a synergistic complex made of thyroid tissue, adrenal tissue, pituitary tissue, sinus tissue, spleen tissue, maltodextrin. (from tapioca), American ginseng.
Other ingredients: Capsule (gelatin) magnesium stearate (vegetable source), kelp, and flogard.
I realize that it is bovine, instead of porcine, however, a more synergistic approach, seems to work for me better in other areas. Has anyone else tried Raw Thyroid? I had thyroid cancer 9 years ago, with no thyroid left, I am having to take a lot to make up the difference, but I would with any OTC supplement. Right now I am taking 8 capsules a day, which seems like an awful lot, but I’m not sure if that’s just trying to make up for the fact that my numbers were so out of whack. Even on my previous bottle of NP thyroid, which I purchased in June, it was like there was something wrong with that bottle too. I was struggling to take the right amounts and my numbers have really been messed up. I’ve only been taking this for just over a week. So I really can’t say how well it’s working, except I do feel better. I am going to be checking my lab work in two weeks and see how my numbers look. I didn’t see this in any of the possibilities under the over-the-counter list. I went through that list and didn’t feel any more comfortable with anything I saw there. The pharmaceutical types of thyroid replacement are not an option at all. I’m Allergic to the 21st Century, so I have to be very careful about even minut amounts of chemicals or additives, that I don’t do well with, but compounding pharmacies are way out of my price range. One of the nutritionists here in Flagstaff, Arizona, said that several of the people he sees highly recommend Raw Thyroid, but he is not certain if they are just supporting a weak thyroid or not.
Any thoughts?
Yesi
Hi,
I also live in Az. Ive been doing research on compounding pharmacies. I did some price comparisons and talked to pharmacists at each. If my numbers are all out of whack when I get my bloodwork beginning of Oct,I’m going to ask my dr. to prescribe compounded T3/T4 from Skips Pharmacy in Florida . I already get my LDN from them and their price is very reasonable compared to many other compounding pharmacies. Under$ 65, even less depending on dosage, and price only jumps $10 per month. For myself I’m going to ask for a comparable of NP Thyroid 150, and a 60 or 90 day fill.f that’s doable for you.
housemaid
Rachel, here are my thoughts about Raw Thyroid: since you have no thyroid, it would be dangerous for you to just take a bunch of that product. It includes things you don’t need/want like spleen, adrenal, pituitary, sinus tissues! I am surprised they allow that to be sold. For one thing the pituitary and sinuses are very close to the brain and with the danger, however slight, of mad cow disease, that is just too close for comfort. You have no idea how much thyroid is in this mix. If you want to try bovine thyroid, consider something like Thyrogold. You shouldn’t have to take 8 capsules of that. You’d have to do a search to find out how much Thyrogold equals the amount of NDT you were taking before. But I really think you ought to stick to pharmaceutical products because without a thyroid, you are in dire need of thyroid meds. Not NP, but maybe Armour or synthetics because it is a matter of life & death for people with no thyroid.
Janie Bowthorpe
Housemaid, not all raw thyroid is mixed with other organs. The bottom line is to read the ingredients list carefully.
housemaid
Janie, I was talking about the product Raw Thyroid by Source Naturals, capitalized, not “raw thyroid” in general. This product does have all those extra tissues and is the one that Rachel is taking 8 a day of. I am concerned that this is a dangerous thing tor be taking since it is likely to not have enough thyroid activity for someone like Rachel who has no thyroid gland.
housemaid
Janie, I was talking about the product Raw Thyroid by Source Naturals, capitalized, not “raw thyroid” in general. This product does have all those extra tissues and is the one that Rachel is taking 8 a day of. I am concerned that this is a dangerous thing tor her to be taking since it is likely to not have enough thyroid activity for someone like Rachel who has no thyroid gland.
Janie Bowthorpe
Thank u for clarifying. It may not be dangerous but wouldn’t be ideal when it’s not straight thyroid.
Rachel Smith
Hi Housemaid,
I had stumbled across a site about mad cow disease, not long before I read your post. I did not want to alarm people unnecessarily, so I did not mention it out here, but I know I need to take precautions. You are correct when you say that it is a matter of life and death for people who have no thyroid. I truly do appreciate your concerns. That’s one of the reasons why I’m out here asking questions. Unfortunately, Armour and synthetics are out for me. Synthetic T3 and T4, even at optimal numbers, with everything else okay, had me literally crippled with pain. Even with massive doses of pharmaceutical pain killers, which I now thankfully do not need it all, I was barely able to walk. I spent a of time in a walker or wheelchair. I will not go back to that life. It was not a life. I thought if I included a copy of the email that I just sent to Thyrogold, it would help you to understand the rest.
Hi Tammy,
I was on NP Thyroid, by Acella, and cannot take the latest batch. It is not just The Wretched taste, I actually had some bad physical reactions to just one tablet. Evidently, I’m not alone. According to many of the people, who follow the Stop The Thyroid Madness site, there are some issues going on there.
I am one of those people who are Allergic to the 21st Century! 🙂 I have found that even minoot quantities of materials, that I might be reactive to, can have devastating results. Armour has too many ingredients in it, that would cause reactions. I was on Naturethroid, before I was on NP thyroid, and did poorly when they made changes. So I am, again, looking for an alternative. I am currently taking an over-the-counter supplement called Raw Thyroid by Source Naturals which may be helping, but I have to take a lot of it, because I have no thyroid. I am concerned that all of the extra hormonal tissues it contains, are not something I need in large doses. Another concern is that the label does not say it’s strictly from New Zealand or Australia, which have very high standards of animal husbandry. I am not certain that it ever did, because I don’t have my old label, but I have been reminded about the issues, with those tissues, that are close to the brain in cattle. I saw your statement about the mad cow disease, which is why you get your products strictly from New Zealand, and that helped me think this might be a good option for me. I know it’s rare to contract that, but I seem to be one of those people that get in line when there’s something unusual going on! Most compounding pharmacies are not even trying to get the USP Thyroid powder anymore, because they’re having so much trouble with availability. Even if they do, the cost is extremely prohibitive.
I have been looking through your site, and I like what I see so far. However, I do have a question. Can you please tell me how the bovine thyroid is harvested? I need to know whether it is Lyophilized or if you use low heat? If you use low heat how much does that affect the product?
I would also like to know what you would suggest as a replacement level of your product? I was taking 1 1/2 of the 90 mg, or about two and a quarter grams, of the NP Thyroid.
I cannot tell you how much I appreciate all of the information that you have on your site, especially in your question and answer section. I look forward to hearing from you!
Lord Bless You,
Rachel
Rachel Smith
Hi Yesi,
It sounds like you’re a lot like me, doing a lot of research. I did call Skip’s Pharmacy in Deerfield Beach Florida and spoke with the pharmacist. Andrea. For me to get the synthetic T3 and T4 would only be about $41 a month. But the synthetic T3 and T4 actually had me, literally, crippled with joint pain. I will not go back to that. Unfortunately, to get the natural desiccated thyroid or USP thyroid Powder made up, is far more expensive. She said it cost them $1,000 for a hundred grams. They’re having a hard time finding it, so they’re just not dealing with it anymore. For me 180 mg x 30 days would be 5.4 grams which would be over $100 a month. Which is fairly typical of what I’m finding at compounding pharmacies who actually do use the USP thyroid powder.
But thank you so much for taking the time to respond. It means a lot to me! 🙂
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Rachel. Be aware that you could have been crippled by the synthetics because you were on too low a dose and not optimal. But hope you find the NDT compounded.
Rachel Smith
Hi Janie, I know that is true for most people, however, my numbers actually were optimal. I was on T3 and T4. I was following your site faithfully, and doing all of the at-home testing. I mentioned earlier that I am one of those people who are Allergic to the 21st Century. Some people call it, Multiple Chemical Sensitivities, others call it, Environmental Illness, especially if they are also sensitive to electromagnetic fields, as I am. But I really don’t care for either one of those terms.
I tell people that I am Allergic to the 21st Century because it makes people smile! 🙂 Which opens a door for understanding. However, I have found that even minoot quantities of the wrong types of chemicals can be devastating for me. Literally, within a day or two, after I switched to the naturally desiccated Naturethroid, the horrifying joint pain went away, and I was able to wean myself off of all of the nasty pharmaceutical pain pills they had me on. I will not go back to that life!
But I want to thank you again, for your care and your concern, and for the fact that you have this place, for those of us who are having these kinds of challenges, to gather and work them out together!
You are an amazing woman!
Janie Bowthorpe
Referring to the 21st Century makes sense.
Rachel Smith
Hi Janie, I just wanted to let you know that I am going to be taking Thyrogold. I just got off of a conversation with Tammy and I really like what she’s told me about their product. I will check back in a few weeks and let you know how my world is doing! 🙂
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, please let me and us know. It’s been around a long time. I especially want to know what amount got your free’s to optimal, if you get there.
Yesi
Hi Rachel,
So sorry you sufferred so much with joint pain. Some thoughts on the compounded T3/T4; when compounding could that possibly take care of the filler allergy issue? From what I understand Skips only uses 3 ingredients ; T3,T4 and 1 filler of your choice. I also called Woodland Pharmacy in Ca, they do still have access to dessicated thyroid from Canada and Texas; for 135 mg for 30 days would run $80, 60 days $110, 90 days $150, and they said they can ship to Az. For filler they use Microcrystalline cellulose or brown rice flour, lactose or glycerine if any of those work for you. I am hesitant to order dessicated, because of the heat issue here where I live.
Dessicated is heat sensitive, but Flagstaff is much cooler than Yuma.
On another note, I too had horrible joint pain for a while. It felt like electric shocks in my hands and feet. I was able to find a dr who listened and was willing to prescribe Low Dose Naltrexone, and that has helped me tremendously, as well as bring my antibodies way, way down. I get mine from Skips in Florida at 4.5 mg.
Jeanne
Yes I, I take LDN nightly too, 4.5 mg. I feel it is a good immune system booster to help prevent a return of cancer.
DeeCan (I used to be Dee, but someone else is Dee now too)
Rachel, I’m also allergic to the 21st Century. I’m not really on any ndt right now because the only one I could get was ERFA since I’m in Canada. That went South back in 2015/16. Sorry everyone is having problems in the US with their brands too now, but I’m actually relieved that it is more a widespread problem and I’m not alone. Just extremely hypothyroid and unwell, but not alone. 🙁
Dee
I’ll switch to Di if you like! There are just so many Dianes in my town!
DeeCan
No Dee, that’s ok. I’ll keep using DeeCan. Thanks though. I’m a Diane too 🙂 I’ve thought for years now, since all of the companies say ‘nothing has changed’, that it has to have something to do with the pigs 🙁 and either what they are fed or medications they are being given. Anyway, that’s my two cents. One more cent: Or a complete conspiracy to get us off ndt.
Vincent Jericho
For a man of 59 I remain quite athletic. Diagnosed with Graves when 35. Radiated Thyroid. Been a fight since then. Was on Naturethroid…switched to NP about year ago. DOING GREAT!!! Then the stinky pills. Mine smelled and tasted like paint thinner. At first ok but over about 6-weeks crashed. Fortunately I have a reserve of old NP which I am back on and doing well. I called my Pharmacist and at her suggestion filed complaint with FDA. Had I known then what I know now I NEVER would have let them kill my thyroid. For me internet arrived about 5-years too late…
Liz Luber
I, too, have been experiencing regression in various ways since the change in formulation…. I’m wondering – although it’s more expensive, is Armour the equivalent to the old formulation that we all loved and felt good on? Money aside, is it as simple as switching to the Armour brand to achieve the positive results we’d been having on the old formulation of NP Thyroid?
I’d truly be grateful for thoughts on this – I’m struggling to accept the fact that my symptoms are returning…
Janie Bowthorpe
All the NDTs changed from the good products they used to be.
Dee
I spoke to 3 pharmacists yesterday, and also a relative who does drug testing for a large pharm. co., about how to break down microcrystalline cellulose. They have no answer. One of the pharmacists actually took out the drug info insert for Armour, and read it for me, where it states the MCC is added to INCREASE absorption! I am going to try mortar and pestle. THis is all heartbreaking.
Lynn
I tried chewing my NP tablet and felt worse all day. Was definitely a bad move on my part.
Janie Bowthorpe
The changed tablet that is thicker, way stinkier, tastes awful?
Lynn
Sorry, just saw this. It tasted very bad but it would have been worth it to feel better.
Dee
I was thinking of Naturethroid or Armour, which are the NDTs my doctor is
going to switch me to. They have MCC.
Janie Bowthorpe
Understand that Naturethroid went terribly south as well. Patients who got back on it when it came back out in mid- 2018 had a terrible return of hypothyroidism.
Yesi
If we decide to go to synthetic T3 T4 , can we and how do we obtain T1 and T2, or do we just have to go without ?
Kim
I was taking Np Thyroid 60 mg tablets 3 times daily and liothyronine 25 mg twice a day.. my dr changed my meds to liothyronine 25 mg 4 times a day and dropped the np and I feel like death way worse then before I ever started medicine.. I just emailed my dr and she changed med to armour 3times a day and liothyronine 3 times a day and I pray this helps me.. At this point I feel like I’m trapped in a 90 year old body!!
Sarie
New Labs on NP Thyroid:
I’ve been on the new NP for 3 weeks now and have been optimal a little over a year. I seemed to be one of few that wasn’t feeling any symptoms returning, etc. I feel best with my T3 slightly over range, and my Naturopath is good with that 💗 Both sets of lab results are on 5.5 grains NP Thyroid, but 2 grains of the old (good) batch, 3.5 grains new. I’m not sure what to do at this point as I feel as I always have being optimal, and so far labs are stable, although they did drop very slightly 🤔 I tanked miserably and immediately back on the new Nature Throid (4 grains) with tanked Frees and a TSH of 80, and was extremely sick. I’m going to recheck labs again in a few weeks.
I understand that I’m not taking 100% of the new batch. But when I need 5.5 grains, I’m technically only getting 2 grains of the old, good NP. Based on my past and horrible experience with Nature Throid, I would think that only getting 2 grains of the old NP that I would still feel very sick and see symptoms return. And I would think labs would drop much more significantly with taking the 3.5 grains of the new batch that many are not doing well with. I’m monitoring myself very closely. I’m due to pick up my 2 grain prescription soon so I will be fully on the new batches. I did have a full week out of the 3 that I did use my 1 grain tablets to take 5.5 grains of the new batch. I pray that answers become clear very soon for peace of mind and the well being of all of us.
September 2019
Free T3 – 4.2 (2.2 – 3.9)
Free T4 – 1.2 (.6 – 1.6)
TSH – <0.01
Reverse T3 (pending)
June 2019
Free T3 – 4.4 (2.2 – 3.9)
Free T4 – 1.3 (.6 – 1.6)
TSH – <0.01
Reverse T3 – 9 (10-24)
Karishma
There has been a discontinuation of Thiroyd (By Greater Pharma, Thailand) as told by several pharmacies in Thiland as well as supplier websites. It seems the last batch number is 1500058 with an expiry date of 06 Feb 2022. Anyone has any official word from the Pharmacy?
Has anyone tried and recommend any other formulation after Thiroyd?
Thanks.
housemaid
Karishma, this is very suspicious that even foreign sources of NDT are drying up at the same time all the US NDT stops working. I have heard of another foreign product called Thyroid S. I have never bought it, but I think it has a lot of fillers. If I hear that Thyroid S is no longer being made, I am going to believe this is a conspiracy!
Karishma
Seems that way! My husband even said the big pharma are not really liking it and are somehow doing this. Or it may even be a raw material problem. I have used Thyroid-S and it just didn’t work for me. I did cross check with many suppliers and even had my husband’s friend check up in pharmacy shops in Thailand. Greater Pharma has stopped supplying. Of course, now the last batch bottles are being sold at double the price by whoever has stock of it :(.
Tabby
For those of you who’ve decided to not take NP for the time being, what are you doing instead? Janie, what are you using?
Janie Bowthorpe
I am still on the former better NP. When I run out, I am playing with different things, like both synthetics (and being optimal) or some NDT supplements like Thyrogold, etc and adding T3 if needed (to be optimal).
Tabby
Someone else has mentioned compounding the NDT with as few fillers as possible. How do you feel about that? Also, have you heard of the 15mg pills being affected?
Janie Bowthorpe
Try doing a search in this blog post and comments for 15mg. Might show it.
Not all compounded pharmacies have NDT powder. They will compound the two synthetics. Very few have the powder.
Russ
For those of us who may have to go the compounded synthetic route, how do we get optimal?
By tweaking the ratios of the T3 and T4 until the frees are mid-range and upper mid range? Regardless of TSH ?
Janie Bowthorpe
That’s the problem with compounded….
Paula
Janie, can you please explain why that’s the problem with compounded? I have never heard of tweaking the ratios of T3 & T4 in NDTs or synthetics. How would that be possible? Or by getting two different synthetic prescriptions – one for T3 and another for T4?
I was thinking of requesting my doctor for a compounded T4/T3 prescription that would be a match to NP Thyroid 1/2 grain so I can multi-dose and increase my dosage gradually according to what my DATS and blood work show.
Is there a better/different way to get optimal?
Dawn
Tabby,
I take the 15 mg. and yes, they are affected. I get my medicine through Express Scripts. They sent out my 90 day supply in August with the bad pills. I called them and told them I don’t feel safe taking them, and they sent me a replacement bottle, unfortunately the same. I’m sure it came from the same stock. I believe all doses of NP have been tainted.
Lynn
My doctor is aware of the NP problem. She was going to switch me to Naturethroid which is what started this mess for me back in June 2019 (I have since switched doctors because my previous doctor gave me a hassle about switching to NP and said the symptoms must be due to low estrogen and not Naturethroid going bad). My new doctor has been wonderful and is now going to prescribe a compound t3/t4 but I didn’t think to ask if it would be made with NDT powder. I guess I will find out tomorrow from my pharmacist. I think someone mentioned this before that maybe the NDT powder is the problem since Naturethroid went bad and now NP. Although I don’t remember the Naturethroid smelling bad. A friend’s doctor told her she thinks that some of the NDT medicines are coming from China on ships and that storage could be an issue resulting in contamination?
Janie – do we think that Armour is ok?
Janie Bowthorpe
It was the first that patients complained seeing their hypothyroidism come back. And there were definite visible changes to the tablet as well.
The problem with saying it’s working is that many patients feel good before they are optimal. And they don’t realize that’s going to backfire. So we don’t know yet. We just know that it changed enough that so many patients left it.
Kristie
Acella called me back tonight, basically just taking a med report on my adverse reaction to the NP thyroid. I told him the pharmacist reported it as well. They said that Acella is concerned about their customers and plans to make this right. Oooookay… will see 🤷ðŸ»â€â™€ï¸
Erin Erickson
I switched to NP after the Naturethroid shortages and I did great. I often felt hyper on Naturethroid and I felt pretty dang good on NP and no more hair fall. My labs from six months ago looked good, my free t3 & 4 were at an optimal level. My tsh is always very low (my Doctor seems to focus more on that). I used to take NP 120 with 2 15 mg. I changed to 30 mg (take 5)..then I got the smelly batch and at first thought my allergies were the cause of the bad taste. Now I’m feeling hyper and anxious and can’t sleep. For the last couple of days, I’ve been taking four instead of the 5 30 mg NP and feel a little better (and less like a hummingbird on speed). I had labs drawn last Friday and have a Dr appointment on Wednesday..I know they’re not going to look good. I talked to a pharmacist and she suggested I wait for my labs before changing meds. The pharmacist said that she is on Armour (though not entirely happy with it) and she never liked NP. My Doctor is not totally on the NDT bandwagon, and I’m afraid he will want me to take synthetic. I don’t know what to do, what to try. Not sure I can afford Armour. I took Armour about five years ago for a short time and liked it – I remember it lifted my brain fog, an amazing feeling. Just want to feel good again! Best to everyone here in their search..
Starr D.
Hi, Erin. That’s interesting you’re having trouble with the 30 mg. NP pill,
because that’s the ones I may be having trouble with, too–giving me
hyperthyroid-type symptoms, while still getting a lot of low thyroid ones,
too. I was using 1 and 1/2 per day of the 30 mg. for about 3 months–
got a new batch in late July, and they smell OK but may be too strong,
in some ways. (I also took a 1 Grain NP, in the morning.)
Had an endo appointment earlier this month, and labs a couple of
weeks before that. Was doing sort of OK until the night before
my appointment, when I took my last dose of the 1/2 grains…
hit me real hard–headache, neck ache where the thyroid would
be if I had much gland left (but I don’t have much due to RAI
for Grave’s Disease, years ago), stomach ache, and ear-ache.
Barely felt good enough for Dr’s appointment the next day–
blood pressure was OK, but my pulse was 100 and it wouldn’t
come down until I went off all NP for a couple of days. Doctor
said maybe the morning pill was OK, but maybe something
was up with the afternoon ones (the 1/2 grains.) He said to
keep taking the morning NP pills I still have, and maybe take
Armour in the afternoon (he wrote a different prescription for this.)
I’m still using up what I’ve got (found some old 1/4 grain NPs from
January, which aren’t expired.) And frankly, it’s a mess, because
now that I’ve had that bad episode a couple of weeks ago, I seem
extra sensitive to this medicine in general, now, and I know it’ll be
that way for awhile, because I’ve been through this before with
other thyroid drugs. My labs looked OK according to the Doctor,
and he felt there was no reason I should’ve gotten the symptoms
I did…well, it’s either my own weird system acting up in general to
thyroid medicine, or the NP pills themselves causing trouble.
But I’ve quit taking the 1/2 grains, just in case they’re the problem.
And for now, I’ve had to reduce my dose as I figure out what I can handle.
I hope I won’t have to go back on synthetic drugs as I haven’t done
well with them for years, but it’s an option I may have to revisit.
The doctor is willing to work with me on whatever way I need to go.
Janie, thanks so much for this site! The ability to compare notes with
others, and all the info you provide, is just so useful and important!
Janie Bowthorpe
You’re welcome. Now you can see why I stuck with patient experiences and wisdom all these years. 🙂
Erin Erickson
Hi Starr, I’m wondering if the 30 mg pills are too strong. I cut back about 15 mg and have been feeling a lot better. I’m not having hypo symptoms with the icky pills, just the feeling of being over medicated. I’m also having a tightening feeling around my neck – I’m due for an ultrasound (I had a partial thyroidectomy 5 years ago). My Dr gave me a new script for NP so that I can look for a pharmacy that has any of the old batch. I may move on to Armour if that doesn’t work out. I have Hashimoto’s, so I’m not sure if that’s what is causing the hyper symptoms or the NP. Good luck in your search!
Here’s my labs after taking the gross NP:
tsh: 0.01 (0.4-4.5)
total T4: 9.0 (4.8-10.4)
Total T3: 123 (7.6-181)
Free T4: 1.0 (0.8-1.8)
Free T3: 3.2 (2.3-4.2)
(it’s all my Dr tested)
Janie Bowthorpe
Your frees are very non-optimal. So what you are feeling could be because your body is alarmed and releasing excess adrenaline. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Erin Erickson
Hi Janie,
Where should my frees be? Is the free T3 too low? Thanks so much for letting me know!
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
housemaid
Some people seem to be under the impression that the FDA is their friend. No, the FDA is the friend of Big Pharma only. You may be unaware that common blood pressure drugs ending in “-sartan” have been found to be tainted with a carcinogenic substance called NDMA. There have been multiple recalls of various batches of these drugs over the last year. However, most pharmacies don’t really keep track of what batch numbers they dispense when it comes to these high volume drugs, so many people with bad batches are not being notified. And the truth is that the FDA is allowing a certain amount of carcinogen in all these “-sartan” blood pressure drugs, so a person thinks their batch is OK when it really isn’t. https://www.peoplespharmacy.com/articles/popular-heartburn-drug-zantac-ranitidine-tainted-with-a-carcinogen
The online pharmacy mentioned in the above article (called Valisure) tests every batch of drugs they sell for impurities. Valisure has found this same NDMA carcinogen in Zantac as high as 3 million ng. FDA says this is fine. I’ve never heard of this pharmacy before, so I don’t know if they sell NDT or if just anyone with a prescription could send it in to Valisure. But I looked at their website and they have a page where people can send in information about bad batches of drugs they have gotten. Maybe they would be interested in testing some of these bad NP pills. From what I have read on here, I fear these new NP thyroid pills are not just ineffective but possibly dangerous. They seem to be causing some toxic like effects such as burning when swallowing and nausea. Acella’s website says there are just minor variations in appearance, taste, and smell of NP thyroid and claim they test every batch, but I don’t feel reassured. Here is the webpage for the Valisure Pharmacy where they ask people to report a bad batch experience: https://www.valisure.com/report-bad-meds/ I assume that the bad drug did not have to come from their pharmacy, but not sure about this.
Karen
I went to that site and filled out the contact info for np thyroid. I will see if they can test this I don’t know.i have sent pills back to accella to be checked but am not hopeful.But this stuff has burnt my stomach so bad I am in horrible pain.
Ana
I was just looking at Acella’s site and noticed that they have a job opening for a “Quality Control Manager”. The opening was posted on August 23, 2019. This makes me wonder if they fired the last one over the NP Thyroid debacle. That’s the first indication I’ve seen that they know there was a serious problem and that they’re working to resolve it. The position still seems to be open.
And thank you, Janie, for creating this invaluable resource. STTM helped me to get optimal treatment over the years and during these past few months has been the best forum for patients to share their experiences, insights and strategies for dealing with the NP Thyroid problems. Thanks so much!
Dee
Double thanks to Janie! From your research, I was able to
have almost 15 healthy, happy years!
Janie Bowthorpe
I’m so glad, Ana!
Anne
Forget my hopeful comment below about how we have to specify Acella as manufacturer and make sure we don’t get AvKare as manufacturer. I just got back from Walgreens and they showed me it was Acella and they are the new pills.
Sabrina Schön
Let’s trust demonstrable facts, not rumors.
And remember this was/is an excellent product for so many of us.
So if Acella seriously tries to clarify this, then we should have some patience to get our good product back.
In the meantime it will be difficult for many to find an alternative.
Some of us changed already, like I did, because I had no choice – well knowing, with all the realistic fears and facing the facts, reading all the helpful things here on STTM (thank you so much Janie).
And what can you say after taking a new medication not even a full week? Nothing.
And in 2 weeks? Not so much more.
May be in 6 weeks.
Maybe Acella has solved the problem by then.
May be, may be, may be.
ACELLA !! WE ARE WAITING FOR FACTS !!
Anne
Sabrina, can you share with us what you are using instead and whether it is good?
Sabrina Schön
Anne, yes, in about 5 weeks I’ll be able to tell you my experience.
Lynn
Can you tell us what you are using now and then let us know in 5 weeks if it helped?
Sabrina Schön
For the moment I try synthetic T4 and a little amount of compounding pharmacy (T3) with that.
If that works I’ll carry on with this, if not, I will change again.
(And, like Janie says, trying to stay optimal)
I’m living in Europe.
Terry
I received a text from Walgreen’s that my script for NP Thyroid is ready for pickup. I called and the batch is on the bad list. Do I ask for a different refill? And if so, what do I ask for? I know I’m not feeling the greatest but thought it was the gut/mold issue I’ve been trying to resolve.
Dee
The pharmacist at my local Walgreens just told me today that Acella is not shipping anymore
NP Thyroid to them. Is this nationwide?
Terry
That’s interesting. I wonder if my Walgreen’s might get a call from them not to dispense the NP Thyroid.
Christa
I went to fill my husband’s new script for WP again (he used to be optimal on this and loved it until they stopped producing and switched to NP – which he hated from the start) and not only did they say WP is not shipping/back ordered (this was CVS), but she also told me that he could no longer get the NP as it was noted in the computer that it is no longer shipping/unavailable. I was able to find WP at another pharmacy for the time being…..and even though many note it went downhill, he did better on WP. Sigh. So frustrating.
Karen
Ok new labs drawn on September 13 after increased dose of np. Tsh 45.43 ft4 .5 ft3 not in yet.That is on two grains numbers are alot higher on increased dose. Not to mention horrible side effects on np.i am going to say something is wrong with all porcine powder because I did bad on compounded also.so I am going to try tirosint sol to see if I do better. Just to add my tsh on September 10 was 0.84 my Dr said something is really wrong here and wanted rechecked big fluctuations here.Hope this helps people that are not doing well on np.
Janie Bowthorpe
Karen, learn from years and years of patient experiences. Forcing the body to live for conversion alone has backfired for millions over the years. At least consider adding T3 to that T4 and getting optimal.
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Melissa
I just received an email from Express Scripts that they are unable to fill my script for NP Thyroid!! What do I do??? I cannot take Synthroid and Cytomel, I tried that once and a lost two weeks of my life, I was in such a fog and had such horrible headaches.
Janie Bowthorpe
You probably did so bad on the two synthetics because you weren’t optimal. Check out this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Yesi
I recived a call today from David at Accella. He promised to send new 120s and 30s to my pharmacy to replace the bad batch I have now. He said someone else would call me tommorow and that I would get package in mail to send back bad batch. It sounds like everyone else’s experience, so we will see if they follow through, and investigate as promised. Any one been on compounded T3/T4, with good results?
Dee
Steven promised to send the same here, and nothing happened.
Amy Lynn
Same story here! Multiple phone calls to Dave at Acella and a 25+minute conversation with that Steve guy in Massachusetts almost 2 weeks ago telling him everything, and I’ve got nothing…no replacement pills nor envelope to send them back. Just going to take the pills I have & hope for the best, that they got enough complaints now to fully look into it/change it back! Tried Armour as a replacement, and that was a $60 disaster. Tirosint (the best T4) out of reach for me right now monthly cost-wise
Anne
what happened with Armour?? Did it not work for you?
Amy Lynn
Anne yes, Armour did not work for me. Felt so tired/sick the one day I managed to take it. I’m on a decent dose too (3 1/2 grains.) Not only that, but I believe I also had an allergic reaction to something in the fillers, maybe? My face immediately swelled up, then my face/neck/chest got all red an hour after taking. After that a few hours later, my skin started itching all over. Not fun! I’m only allergic to sulfa drugs, that I know of. My mom and my sister take Armour seemingly without issue, but it’s not for me & my body apparently!
Valency
An update: I picked up my newest bottle and I now have the speckled pills (which smell like a littler box and taste horribel!) mixed in with the whiter, non-odorous, harder pills. I spoke with people at Acella and they are sending me an envelope to send back samples for the FDA. Let’s keep sharing as much info as we have.
Catherine
Hi. Did anyone actually receive the return envelope in the mail to mail in the replacement medication from Acella?
I never did. And that was after many calls to Acella and filing a report with the pharmacist at Acella. They told me they would ship replacement pills to my pharmacy and mail me replacement pills to my pharmacy. My pharmacist also spoke with them.
I have received nothing promised and this happened back in June with the 90 MG pills of NP thyroid. At the time, I thought it was just a bad batch but now I see it was far more than that.
After that incident I would not touch the 90 mg pills. I had my doctor order all 30 mg pills and so I took 5 a day. The experience on 90 mg pills was too severe. Looking back I should of stopped taking NP then.
I am allergic to Armour and so I moved to expensive compounded porcine/NDT powder compounded with Gycine last week. This is my last shot at NDT as I wont touch Naturethroid with all the bad reviews or WP as it is too new after the changes made.
I had half my thyroid removed due to Papillary cancer. I flare from levels that are off caused new swollen lymph nodes to appear back in June. That is not acceptable for people like us who are struggling.
Ginger
I started calling Acella and left several vmails on the CS line. My last one was less than charming and I stated that I would continue to leave messages until someone called me back so I could place a complaint about tainted medication. I received a callback from a gentleman named Steven, who identified himself as one of Acella’s pharmacists. He took a detailed (but not personally invasive) report from me that took approximately 30 minutes. I advised him of color, smells and taste of the “bad” pills and the symptoms I had. He was very kind. Once we’d finished, he asked if I would be willing to send them the affected meds for analyzing. I have a new script en route from my pharmacy and told him if the new batch is also bad, I’ll reach back out and we’ll discuss me sending them some. I asked him what Acella planned to do about this as I had read multiple reports similar to mine. He said that Acella is “aware of the reports of issues with NP Thyroid on social media” and have put up a notice about that on their website but they are standing firm that nothing has changed in the manufacturing or ingredients of NP Thyroid. Okey dokey. I hung with him and followed Acella’s posted instructions to contact the FDA to place a complaint about tainted medications. Just waiting for the paperwork to come.
I have about a month of good meds left, then I don’t know what I’ll do.
Be well everyone,
Ginger
Janie Bowthorpe
They “stand firm” that nothing has changed yet patients are experiencing horrible symptoms…another example of gaslighting.
Ginger
I particularly enjoyed the part about “they are aware of social media.” Well, that’s a load off my mind. We’ll all just go back to being sick as hell, you guys just keep up with your web-surfing. It never changes, does it?
Dee
Janie, I don’t think any of us should have mentioned the size, color, or smell; unfortunately, that is what they
hung on to. My second call to Steven only emphasized the horrible allergic reactions I am having.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes they have hung onto those three. But they also knew/read/heard about the reports of worsening hypo from many of you!
Janie Bowthorpe
And I should have added: the fact that the changed tablets smell worse than ANY NDT has ever smelled in the last 17 years, plus the patient descriptions of a horrible taste to the point of making some nauseated…underscores that many things are quite wrong on top of the massive amount of patient-described symptoms of a return of hypothyroidism in terrible ways.
Ginger
A little update from me- I called Express Scripts (as previously stated) and told them what had happened. The pharmacists sent me a replacement bottle of each of the 2 dosages I take. They were both the same foul smelling bad ones. I now have 4 huge bottles of stuff I can’t take. Taking what little of the good pills I have. My dr called in a script for Armour I haven’t started yet (hey now, that’s expensive) and I’m just waiting to see what happens with Acella.
Tracey
Hi Guys,
I recently changed to tirosint + cytomel after being forced to leave Nature Throid and now NP. I am starting to hear more and more that Tirosint has also changed manufacturers – and is no longer working for people. Has anyone had this experience with Tirosint no longer working for them? Any info on this is appreciated. Thank you!
Yesi
I’m thinking of asking my dr to prescribe a compounded t3/t4 , comparable to the dosage of NP Thyroid I was on. Has anyone done this? Any suggestions on reputable compounding pharmacies? What type of accreditation to look for? I dont have a compounding pharmacy anywhere close to me, going to have to find one willing to mail.
Lynn
I talked to my pharmacist today and the odd thing is that when smelling the new NP thyroid (which I think is horrendous) vs. the old NP – my husband son and the two male pharmacist’s think the new one smells better than the old and my daughter and I think the reverse. They are willing to compound a t3/t4 for me. Maybe that is the way to go?
Lynn
Another question – do we think that NP is basically a sugar pill or a pill with something that doesn’t agree with our bodies? Wondering if I am better off being hypo than with the burning, aching, ringing and extreme fatigue.
Anne
Have you guys seen this? GoodRX NP thyroid images?
https://www.goodrx.com/np-thyroid/images
They say this one manufactured by Acella loks like this
and this one manufactured by AvKare looks like this
And they are clearly different. The one that I have that I am scared to use looks like the one manufactured by AvKAre
Are they a generic version? It looks like we should just ask for the ones made by Acella.
Anne
Just adding to this…I called Walgreens to tell them I only want my prescription from Acella not any other company and they just emailed me to tell me it is out of stock so it is delayed. So clearly these batches are not from Acella.
Anne
and also there seem sto be other manufacturers of NP according to this
https://www.findacode.com/ndc/drugs/NP_THYROID_60
NDC Trade Name Labeler Name
42192-0330 NP Thyroid 60 Acella Pharmaceuticals, LLC
42291-0643 NP Thyroid 60 AvKARE, Inc.
71335-0414 NP Thyroid 60 Bryant Ranch Prepack
45865-0566 NP Thyroid 60 medsource pharmaceuticals
51655-0132 NP THYROID 60 Northwind Pharmaceuticals, LLC
68788-7032 NP Thyroid 60 Preferred Pharmaceuticals Inc.
53002-1029 NP Thyroid 60 RPK Pharmaceuticals, Inc.
Yesi
I called my pharmacy and, they confirmed that my speckled, grey, stinky pills were indeed from Accella.
Hadassah
Now that NP Thyroid is not working well . What is everyone that was dosing with NP switching to ? My pharmacist said he can not get NatureThroid . Armour is prohibitive .
Rita
I went back to Naturethroid a couple of weeks ago. I am chewing up the pills before swallowing and will get tested in 6 weeks. So far I feel ok, more energy but still some hair loss. But I have read that the hair loss won’t instantly get fixed. I am also sleeping great and no anxiety. Maybe the key to taking Naturethroid is chewing it up? Supposedly works with Armour…
Michelle Sarchiapone
I had a old 3 month supply of WP thyroid I switched to. When I run out, if the NP mystery has not been solved, I will try a compounded med.
Melanee Ables
I’ve been on NP for several years and have always been happy with it. I was underdosed but happy overall. 🙂 I also noticed the last prescription had a foul smell and taste. So much so that I double checked the pills and felt concerned taking them. I’m on 120 mg/day. My pharmacy only carries the 30 mg pills so I take 4 . Even on that high-ish dose my labs were not optimal so my dr added Synthroid (name brand only). I think that is why I am doing well even with the change of NP. Optimal FT3 and FT4 for the first time ever.. and I’ve been on meds since 2012. All of that is to say.. sometimes synthetic is okay! I’m a huge on natural products but even my dr said some of his patients aren’t doing well on NDT alone and thrive once he adds Synthroid.
Yesi
Melanee,
What dosage of synthroid did he prescribe?
120 NP Thyroid + how much Synthroid?
I’m also on 120 NP.
Melanee Ables
sorry I just saw this! I am on 50 mcg Synthroid T, Th, Sat, and Sunday and 100 mcg on MWF. I just received my first labs back after this change and I am finally in optimal ranges.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Melanee. Very few on just T4 are optimal. Optimal is about a free T3 at the top of the range and a free T4 midrange. Both.
Debbie M
I was originally on nature troid and doing well. I switched to np thyroid due to weird test results and shortage. Was on it for 4 months but too much hair coming out so decided to switch back to nature troid. Picked script up from pharmacy and checked pills when I got home they were darker with specks. Just like your description of NP thyroid. I had some left over nature troid pills from previous script and they were white with no specks. This is so frustrating! Don’t know if I should take them or take back and show pharmacy.
Janie Bowthorpe
You were clearly underdosing yourself on the former good NP. It’s an excellent product if one gets optimal on it. Optimal puts the free T3 at the top area of the range with a midrange FT4. Both.
But if one gets the changed NP, and even the changed Naturethroid, there are consistent problems, sadly.
Deanna
I am on NP Thyroid and have been for about 2 years. But in the last few months I have had the following problems: Extremely itchy skin, red rash, profoundly tired, head aches, heavy chest and heart palpitations off and on.
My lab results are: TSH: .82 (.40 – 4.50 mlU/L) Free T3: 4.1 (2.3 – 4.2 pg/ml) Free T4: 0.8 (0.8 – 1.8 ng/dL)
The NP I have at this time does not have the spots on them and not a strong smell.
Deanna
To further explain my last post: I am on 120 milligrams of NP Thyroid. My endocrinologist now says, “see this is why I do not like to prescribe NDT as it is not standardized and I worry about your heart and bones”. She will prescribe NDT but is nervous about it. It is my understanding from what I read here and other places is that NDT is standardized, and is the same amount of T3 and T4 in every pill; is this correct. What does it mean when my TSH is so low and T3 is up so high. Can anyone tell me if they have experience and think that my numbers would be considered optimal. I have felt good on this amount as I said up till a few months ago. Thank you
Janie Bowthorpe
NDT has always been like any medication out there–an ALLOWED and low percentage of variation between batches. But that is not changed that we have soared on it.
And his comment totally ignores that the US Pharmacopeia does have a standard for the thyroid powder.
As far as your low TSH, THAT.IS.PERFECTLY.NORMAL on NDT or even T3. Doctors stupidly freak out about that, claiming bone loss and heart problems…yet we have constantly seen patients report IMPROVED bone density and IMPROVED heart function because of the direct T3.
As far as your high FT3, that is where we are SUPPOSED to have it when optimal, along with a midrange FT4. Both. So if your FT3 is high with a low FT4, that is probably pooling of the T3 due to a cortisol problem that needs discovery and treatment. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/pooling
And this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
We HAVE to stand firm against doctors who go by the TSH, who think we will have bone loss or heart problems, who don’t understand that it’s inadequate iron or a cortisol problem that causes issue when raising towards optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Finally EVER SINGLE BRAND of NDT has been ruined. Every single brand. NDT used to work far better, was consistent, didn’t cause problems like it does now. So now we have the fight to be LOUD that we want to know WHAT IS GOING ON.
Debbie M
I was originally on nature troid and doing well. Switched to np thyroid because of weird test results and shortage. Was on it for about 4 months. Lots of hair coming out so decided to go back to nauture troid. Picked up script yesterday. When I got home looked at pills and they are darker with specks just like the np thyroid you describe. They have no smell though. I had some nature thyroid pills left over from a previous script and compared them to the new ones and they are white with no specks. So frustrated. Scared to use them.
Karen
Ok this gets strange.new labs after six weeks on new doses of 120mg.only have tsh results today. Tsh 0.84 last tsh on July 31 17 lowest I have had for years.does not explain sideffects on these new pills.was taking 105mg with tsh of 17 my stomach is so inflamed I can hardly eat and my skin burns and wierd rashes.these pills do not seem consistent.will wait to see the rest of my lab results.but I have stopped np because I feel so bad even with one 15mg tablet.
Sabrina Schön
In the StopThyroidMadness-facebook is a comment from “Rachel Librach Nisenson”, which says, that David Margolis from Acella told her on the phone, that “..the source of the thyroids are from Europe and North America..”.
So “from Europe” seems new.
I’m from Europe and I’m sure, that we have NO producers of desiccated porcine thyroids.
As far as I know, there are 2 companies in Europe, one in Italy, the other in Spain, that are buying desiccated thyroids from South America, testing them and sell them again.
Additives in desiccated thyroid like lactose, salt, sugar (and may be more?) are allowed according to USP – without need to be listed.
So may be this change in source changes a lot?
Jennifer
Someone asked if Armour had changed their lower strength tablets back to their old formula. I was hopeful so I called and asked Allergan (Forest Pharmaceuticals) and they said no, that all of their strengths still have the MCC. …Which leads me to wonder why manufacturers of NDT even put microcrystalline cellulose in their tablets when so many of us can’t take them after that. Does this cheap filler save them so much money that they can afford to lose hundreds of customers? I also looked up Avicel which is the trade name for this cheap wood pulp filler that is added to some drugs, supplements, and foods. What I found is that Avicel is usually imported from China and may contain Propylene Glycol, Talc,Wood Pulp, Grass, Newspaper, Lead, White food dye, Calcium and other “binders, undisclosed”. That makes it hard for me to believe that these companies are very concerned about putting out a bad pill. Is it all about the money?
Starr D.
I never understand why some companies are OK with cutting corners on ingredients, etc, when they’re making
at least some patients sick in the process. I’ve had this talk many times with different thyroid drug companies,
when they’ve changed their formulations (usually changing the “inactive” ingredients, which can affect how you use
and absorb the pills.) I told one guy at Synthroid a long time ago, “Look, I’d gladly pay for the older, better version
made before 1982-83, if I could be well again,” He said, “Well, unfortunately, most patients don’t feel that way.”
He made it sound like their company just felt it was better to be cheap than to put out a better product. And that’s
the way it seems a LOT of these thyroid drug companies operate. And the Food & Drug Administration basically
has let them get away with it. I can’t say what the new FDA head would say about any of this, though, as I’ve not
tried to contact them (yet) about any of this–though I might in the future, even about why in general they don’t
make sure we have really good, reliable thyroid drugs we can count on, whether they’re natural or synthetic.
In the past, higher-ups in the Endocrine dept. at the FDA have made it sound to me like they have “no power”
to do anything to correct problem thyroid drugs that are causing some patients harm. That’s wrong. If I feel
better soon (as I’m currently having problems with NP–not sure if it’s my dose or their medicine), I may look
into contacting the FDA again about the safety of ALL our thyroid drugs, especially when they are changed in
in some way. P.S. I also got extra-sick years ago when Levoxyl added microcrystalline cellulose and
croscarmellose sodium to their their ingredients instead of some things like potato starch and lactose,
and when Armour added microcrystalline cellulose instead of some more simple, basic “inactive” ingredient
to its pills. It shouldn’t have to be this hard to be a thyroid patient, who’s just trying to have some decent health!
Amy Lynn
Wouldn’t surprise me honestly if they used bottom of the barrel fillers! Just tried Armour for the first time ever yesterday (it was $60 for the same 2 dosages that I’m on with NP, only a month’s supply, and that’s with with insurance) and within an hour I broke out in a red, sunburn-like rash on my face, neck, & chest. Also my skin started to itch everywhere. My mom and my sister take it with no problems, they say. Hmm. No more Armour for me though, can’t take it!
Leslie
At the end of August with a threat of a hurricane looming over my state, I was frantically calling my pharmacy to see if the batch of my thyroid np was bad. It tasted and smelled like mold! I felt vindicated hearing the pharmacist gag over the phone after smelling the bottles. He put in a new order and encouraged me to contact the company to which I did. I left a voicemail and still have not heard from anyone.
I have picked up a new prescription and to only have the same problem again! I wish I had seen this update before calling the pharmacist :/
Lynn
I read the above suggestion about someone making the changed Armour work by crushing them. I just chewed up my “new” NP. How would crushing it or chewing it help it to work better? Thanks!
Angela Schuster
I recently picked up a refill of my NP Thyroid and immediately noticed a difference in the “taste” of the tablet, almost chemical like? I even went back to look at the RX Bottle to make sure I did t accidentally take a different RX I keep in the same cabinet but use occasionally. I confirm that I did not do this and that I was taking the NP thyroid pills. I thought it seemed odd but haven’t noticed many changes if any to how I feel physically. I’m concerned though, after reading this post and seeing the comments from others in the group. I was having a hard time getting nature through aid due to shortages so switch to NP about a year ago. I go in for labs next week so I’ll be curious to see if anything has changed in the 3 or so weeks I will have been on this seemingly new formulation.
Jean
I am very suspicious as to why every company making the pills are all changing them. It is not s common practice to change medication way back. Today, however, these pills have changed numerous times! Now every company makes a bad pill. Are the people working at making the pills aware? I would like to know what is really behind all of this. I know big pharma got Trump to change the absorption product. I think big pharma is behind all of this. Are all 4 companies ignorant to something? I’m sure they wouldn’t want to sell a bad product.
Janie Bowthorpe
Your last sentence is correct.
Pat Boatman
Why am I not able to ask questions on your Facebook page? I am getting pretty desperatefir some help since I have a idiot dr
Janie Bowthorpe
Not sure, Pat. Maybe a Facebook glitch.
Kelly
You can ask questions on the FB group:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/AdrenalFatigueandThyroidCare/
Sabrina Schön
What do you think about getting the drugs testet by an independent laboratory?
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s being explored.
Jeanne
What about Valisure? They test every generic for contamination before filling a prescription! Your doc can order a prescription from them via EMR too. I am considering using them before my next NP Thyroid refill….
Paige
The way you described is not what I just received my NP. It tastes like candy! So I assumed my package was older version. So what are you guys are going to do about it? If they companies won’t listen to us? How we can survive it? Most of us won’t go on chemical medication like Levo or synthryoid.
Janie Bowthorpe
It can actually be workable to be on synthetic T4 with synthetic T3 and getting optimal. Optimal puts the free T4 mid-range and the free T3 at the top of the range.
Paula
I have terrible side effects (mostly pain) with synthetics (T3 and T4) so that is not an option for me. Any other suggestions at this time?
Janie Bowthorpe
Paula, that can mean you weren’t optimal at all. Study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Rachel Smith
Hi Paula, just so you know, I also had extreme pain when I was taking the synthetic medications. I have problems with just about every synthetic medication that I have tried. I believe that the fillers they use in the synthetic T4 and T3 caused inflammatory problems for me. My numbers were at optimal, but the joint pain was, literally, crippling. When I switched to Naturethroid years ago, that horrifying crippling joint pain was gone. I did very well on that until all of the problems with nature throid and I switched to NP thyroid and I did very well on that until recently. Now I’m looking at getting a over-the-counter supplement because I don’t know how else to make this work.
Janie, I hope the Lord blesses you in extraordinary ways for continuing to maintain this site and help all of us get through these challenging times! Thank you!
Janie Bowthorpe
Your last comment is very kind, Rachel. Thank u. I could use any blessing I can get.
Anne
what abot the other Ts and Calcitonin which helps prevent osteoperosis?
Janie Bowthorpe
Well, we can hope conversion to them will happen. And there are ways to buy just T2, I’ve noticed. But we have no experiences with it in order to guide.
AP
I have the same experience… lightly sweet and I had to dose down from the same amount I was taking of thailand thiroyd because the acella is stronger to me. I live very rural and most people are on synthetic. I wonder if my pharmacy just doesn’t go through the pills as fast. Who else is rural vs city and having good vs bad experiences?
Karen
I just got off the phone with my pharmacist.she said this needs to be reported to the FDA. Because if accella does not recall this bad pills.This would push them to address this sooner.The more people who will report the quicker it will be resolved.we cannot sit back in fear about ndt being pulled and allow them to sell this crap and deny anything is changed.
Karen
I just got off the phone with my pharmacist.she said this needs to be reported to the FDA. Because if accella does not recall this bad pills.This would push them to address this sooner.The more people who will report the quicker it will be resolved.we cannot sit back in fear about ndt being pulled and allow them to sell this crap and deny anything is changed.
Trudy
Hi I wrote a few says ago asking if the same thing could be happening with the tablets from Thailand’, I take a product called Thiroyd which has always worked well till my batch last year which produced Tinitus in me but thought maybe it was a coincidence but have just started a new batch and the tinitus is even worse. Also very bad head, had to sleep sitting up last night but can’t be sure it’s from the tablets. Is anyone else having the same experience with these tablets. The armour tablets didn’t suit me at all. Don’t know what to do. I live in Ireland so don’t know where to turn. Many thanks, just reading your blogs makes me feel I am not going mad.
Valency
Trudy, after a new endo switched me to Armour in January, I developed severe tinnitus and with a throbbing/pulse in my head. I was finally able to switch back to NP and was doing much better until the last few weeks. They changed something and not the tinnitus is creeping back in, along with the throbbing head — especially bad in the morning when I wake up and take my initial dose. I never had tinnitus before taking Armour. Interesting note about the possible source being Thailand. I’m calling the manufacturer today (Acella) and I’ll see what they say.
Trudy
Thanks for confirming what I thought, I would say different tablets have the same base source. Have discovered I have a kidney infection and gastritis so am feeling a little better now on treatment and the tinnitus has eased a little.
Dawn
So now I’m confused. The specked pills are bad with the horrible smell, and now there’s another new pill out there that’s white but has no smell and is just as bad? Thanks for clarification.
Amy Lynn
Dawn to answer your question, yes (at least, that was my experience.) The whiter pills that hardly smell (along with the speckled, smelly ones) are no good! Side effects/reactions galore. Again my experience, but maybe in time more people will chime in. Only good ones I’ve taken were the smooth, yellowish-colored ones with the normal ndt smell. I’ve been on NP for over a year now (about when the WP/naturethroid shortage started.)
Ana
I also had a very bad reaction to the white, odorless tablets. The symptoms I had (headache, inability to think clearly, difficulty focusing my eyes, stiff muscles, water retention, and a strange feeling in the back of my throat) were exactly what I experienced on synthetic t4/t3. I suspect that AvKARE (a repackager/distributor, not a manufacturer), working on behalf of Acella, subcontracted to a number of manufacturers to produce NP Thyroid. They probably went with the lowest bidders. My guess is that an unscrupulous manufacturer couldn’t obtain enough porcine thyroid powder and substituted synthetic t4 in some batches. I agree that getting the pills analyzed by an independent lab would be a good idea. I do wonder if that type of analysis would be able to determine whether the t4/t3 in the porcine pills was deactivated or not. By the way, there have been some recent problems with synthetic t4 drugs too. Patients have reported that Tirosint is no longer effective.
Valency
This is good intel — the pills I’m having the bad reaction to are white, hard, and have no odor at all. I’ve got a call scheduled with Acella this afternoon.
Dee
Valency, How did the call go?
Karen
Janiee she is right about the new pills.I got my new pills four days ago from accella they are light colored and no smell.after Taking them I also got the same symptoms and a few more.i know when I am having an allergic reaction and this was bad.i called and left a message again with David and told him something is definitely different in the pills.here is the lot#M327B193 exp date 1/2021.
Amy Lynn
Important update, and maybe this discovery can help.
I gave up on Acella ever sending me new pills and decided to go back to my pharmacy yesterday, and boy am I glad I did. Pharmacist on duty was super helpful. I showed her all the pills I had, she listened to all of my concerns (even showed her this post) and she then proceeded to open up 3 new, sealed bottles. She poured them out, and we both took a look. First bottle of 90’s were all smelly/speckled, no surprise there. 2nd bottle of 90’s were mixed; speckled/smelly in with the normal/yellowish smooth ndt-smelling pills. 3rd bottle were the 120’s (I take 2 different doses a day) and this one was the most shocking. 3 different looking pills inside! The yellow, normal ones, the speckled/bad ones, and different white, shiny, non-ndt smelling ones. Seriously they smelled like nothing! Not sure what this all means, but I don’t trust this company now. There’s just too much variation going on between pills in the same bottle. She said she could not in good faith sell the speckled ones, as she thought they smelled compromised/rancid, too. Going to try Armour and/or 2 synthetics until all this gets resolved.
Janie Bowthorpe
I want to copy and paste what you said was in one bottle, as that’s VERY strange and concerning:
3 different looking pills inside! The yellow, normal ones, the speckled/bad ones, and different white, shiny, non-ndt smelling ones. Seriously they smelled like nothing!
Amy Lynn
Stop the thyroid madness yup, true story! I took the new white, virtually no smell 90mg NP this afternoon, and I’m not happy to have to report that I’m experiencing dizziness, dry mouth, vision problems (blurry/seeing spots & my pupils are so tiny even in low light it’s weird) flushing & redness on my cheeks/face. Done nothing else different and I take no other meds or substances. Not good!
Karen
Do you have the lot# because my replacement pills are light colored and no smell. I also had the same symptoms plus a few more.i knewni was having an allergic reaction.
Amy Lynn
Karen yes, I posted them in the lot numbers on Janie’s blog.
Karen
Janie, New Lot #. M33OE193. Tastes horrible, symptoms returned like aching hands and feet fatigue, no patience.
Walgreens, Monona WI
Janie Bowthorpe
Can you post this on the new Part 2 blog post? It’s the one for lot numbers.
Val
I cannot tell you how horrified I am to have found that I was correct, and there has been a change to my NP thyroid tablets. I thought I was nuts! The pills are noticeably harder — which no longer makes them ideal sublingually. Unfortunately, the horrible side affect of loud ringing in my ears that I experienced on Armour has now been duplicated with the NP. I’m guessing it is an additive that I am reacting to, something that hardens the tablet. Can we lobby them to change it back to what it was before? It was the only NDT that really worked for me. 🙁
Catherine
Hi. It looks like some are reporting the pharmacy expiration date. I just wanted to comment that the lot and expiry number are on the original Acella bottle from the manufacturer that the pharmacy dispenses from. They usually come in 100 pill bottles. Note: the expiry number is not the one year expiration written by the pharmacy. You would need either the original 100 pill bottle or try to get the pharmacist to look it up. If they have a good computer system and are organized, then they should have that information.
Hadassah
I’m on the fence now with my NP refill .I’m due for a refill and my pharmacist told me that he has the 15mg NP it has no smell nor any specs and is all white as usual . That lot # was posted here that it’s not good. Is it possible that some even with the same lot # can be good ? Should I take the risk ????
Janie Bowthorpe
We are learning together. And somehow, it does appear that a lot number can be shared with either the former umchanged tablets and the changed tablet. So the best thing to do is go to the pharmacy and look for specks on the tablets. Specks seem to go with the changed tablets that have caused a lot of reported problems.
P.S. As far as smell, all NDT smells. But the changed tablets, which seem to go along with a serious return of hypo and even worse symptoms (nausea, burning in stomach, to name a few) seems to have a quite pungent smell.
Jennifer
I always get a sealed bottle of 100 NP Thyroid from Walgreens. On 4/26/19, I got a lot# M331A19-2 for 90MG Tablets, expiration date of 12/2020. At first I had some burning on my tongue when I took it sublingually. However, the pills looked and smelled normal. I was finally able to take them without problems. (I would like to note though that Acella now included a Serial#, GPIN#, and a bar code as well as their usual info of Lot# and Expiration Date on the bottle.) I asked Acella about this and they said they were updating their packaging for better tracking.
I had my script refilled on 7/17/19. This time I got a bottle of 100 that expired on 10/2020 (2 months earlier than the bottle I had previously bought 3 months before). It also had the updated packaging including the Serial#, GPIN#, and bar code. I’m wondering why Acella suddenly updated their tracking abilities right before the horrible pills came out. I’m also wondering why my 12/2020 pills seemed okay and the older 10/2020 pills smell like cat urine and look differently. Does this mean they may have manufactured some decent pills since the bad 10/2020 batches?
By the way, the best I can read it, it looks like my 10/2020 pills have a Lot# of M331B19-1.
I complained to Acella 2 or 3 weeks ago. They said they’d get back to me concerning my case# but I haven’t heard anything. I haven’t called Walgreens. Maybe I should.
Christine
Thank you for posting about this. I think that I have been affected. I was taking 60mg NP Thyroid with TSH 1.8 and low upper range FT3 and FT4 and feeling good for about 1 year. Labs and doctor visit in May 2019. Feeling good, continue the course. Refilled my NP Thyroid on 6/4/19 and after about a month I started to feel bad. Thought it was temporary and kept going. Emailed my doctor about 1 month later saying that I was feeling bad (headaches, fatigue, weakness, constipation, irregular periods, depressions, etc) for the past month and would like my thyroid checked. She agreed and my TSH was 4.38…highest I have ever been. I have since changed to Tirosint because I was suspecting that NP Thyroid may be raising my antibodies so this gave me the nudge to try something else. I kept thinking it was something that I was doing wrong but reading your post helped me to realize that perhaps it was out of my control. My pharmacy told me that they do not have the lot number for my batch 🙁
Sabrina Schön
May be another Faktor X #7 ?
The Producers have to treat the dessicated porcine Thyroids with a sort of desinfection/virucide as they found out, that the (new) sources are contaminated with whatever (african swine pest)??
And what they say would be right “nothing obvius changed”.
And it would explain every single reaction the patients report.
Lisa
But it shouldn’t change the size of the tablet.
marny
Hmmm…. if this were trye, an added chemical I would imagine eould affect clumping, and may have to add something to counteract it, making them dif shape? I wouldn’t put a pesticide past them.
Waveeylines
Oh nooooo! So shocked to discover its now happening to NP!! What is going on? If theyve changed the fillers than thats me cooked as am sensitive. Am in the uk and our pharmacsots dont have the facilities to compound their own. I will not go back on levo and T3 it wasnt great and ndt was miles better. Cant believe its being suggested!!!
Didnt armour change their lower strength tablets back to their old formula? Or was that a myth? I was fine on armour till they added cellulose in…..lol. Same with Erfa…..sigh….
I dont think its a conspiracy as isnt Erfa made in Canada…….well spain now to be precise!!
Now WP is back what is that like? I was on WP before they stopped production…
Carol
I had previously posted that I got the NP 60’s that smelled like cat urine and were grayish colored. I went to a different pharmacy on Monday and was able to fill a 30 day rx with what appeared to be the good pills because they looked normal. They do have a strong taste and smell which has gotten stronger each day but not like cat urine and the texture is different. I am now getting random red itchy spots on my body and my nose, eyes and arms itch like crazy. My face is getting numb spots and my adrenals are surging which I haven’t had in years. This afternoon I took one of my good ones and had no itching, numbness or adrenal surges.
Thy Roid
I’ve been trying to source a compounded version of NDT and finally found a pharmacy who can do this. The pharmacist told me that this porcine thyroid powder has been “unavailable for a long time and is only just now back on the market…”, which is interesting and I thought I would share this fact with the rest of you.
What do you make of that? Can’t be the FDA thing with the Chinese supplier can it? This pharmacist told me they were getting their powder from Houston TX (doesn’t mean it’s not Chinese but possibly reduces the chances a bit).
Thy Roid
Follow up: I had a chance to discuss this issue in a later telephone call with the pharmacist. I was told that last year a shipment of NDT powder from China was initially approved or passed inspection. This powder made its way through several wholesalers in the US who likewise somehow approved this powder and sold it. This is the same powder that all commercial NDT pill makers use as well as some of the pharmacies that do compounding. Eventually the FDA discovered issues and cited the Chinese facility and that powder was withdrawn (as well as WP Thyroid tablets), which has already been discussed here.
This pharmacist suspects that some of that powder made it into pills that were released to pharmacies and eventually sold to patients. Someone mentioned that the expiration period is typically two years and that the expiration dates noted in our work are largely 2020 dates. So pills manufactured in 2018 might just now be getting to us (or perhaps being dumped on us due to the shortage in new NDT powder?), and those pills might have contained the withdrawn powder.
One possible explanation…
Lynne
I am concerned about the change as well–
I am especially concerned about sources in China as there is not the same quality control there as in the US.
Dee
Another theory, from a medical friend, suggests that a great deal of the porcine powder was supplied by Puerto Rico.
The hurricane a while back wiped that source out completely. So it is getting more difficult.
Janie Bowthorpe
No pharmaceutical that makes NDT was using Puerto Rico. It’s a rumor.
Lorraine S.
yall trippin my NP thyroid been smellin like cat piss for a whole year now
my most recent pickup actually smelled not terrible but i concur it does not seem to dissolve sublingually as easy
Jean N
Has anyone actually received replacement pills from Acella? I was told they were sending a new bottle to my pharmacy, but nothing yet.
Amy
Jean N. Nope! And I was promised the same thing…new pills, either at the pharmacy or my door. Probably for a cost, saw a few say they got charged upon receipt. Even answered a bunch of questions from their “health department” (Billerica, Massachusetts phone #) Got a script for Armour, and if that doesn’t work adding in thyrovanz or switching to 2 synthetics, as I’m pretty much done dealing w/this company. They are denying anything has even changed, it’s absurd, nature/WP fiasco 2.0!
Judy Feyen
My husband has been taking Acella NP thyroid 120 mg for about 9 month now and has had better #s then when he was on Naturethroid. He initially did well on Naturethroid until they changed, then his TSH shot up to 8. He just refilled his NP script and they are larger and have specks, so I assume they are the new batch. Our pharmacy fills their own bottles and I dont see a batch #. We are going on a 1 month vacation so I don’t know what to do at this point. He has kidney issues as well as high BP. When his thyroid meds are working his kidney function is better and so is his BP ( he does take BP meds too). Have those who have been chewing them found them to be more effective. I guess I could call his Dr and relay my concern, but the Dr. seem to be the last ones to realize there a problem. Plus I wouldn’t know which NDT to ask them to switch him to. Has anyone had luck with Armour lately?
Cincolo
I’ve been chewing mine for the last 6-7 days and am feeling much better.
Janet Daish
I have been chewing my tabs for over a year. They do work better for me
Jenny
I have been on Armour for the last 2 months and am doing really poorly- symptoms all over the place: Hypo and hyper… can’t get up in the morning, weird rashes on hands and scalp. Depressed and anxious. Heart tightness… constipation and then the runs…each pill seems different… I am probably going to have to go on synthetic…I don’t know of any other choices? Was on the natural pig thyroid for 9 years…. Armour, Naturethyroid, Np and now Armour again – nothing seems to work… I don’t know what choices I have left?
OM
Lots more reports about problems with NP on Drugs.com. Seems the only thing all of the NDT thyroid hormone drugs made in USA have in common is the USP porcine thyroid. Also noted that some compounding pharmacies can no longer get the USP thyroid hormone for compounding. Some had used thyroid from China prior to this. Wish we could have the USP thyroid hormone that is used in all of the NDT drugs analyzed!
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s being explored…
Janie Bowthorpe
The sad part of what’s on drugs.com is that it’s loaded with people who were underdosed or had an iron or adrenal problem…and don’t get that it’s NOT the NDT that’s the problem..it’s what it’s revealing from any of the latter.
But now, we have a truly lousy NDT with “NP Thyroid” by Acella–it’s now changed and sucks, all while Acella says they changed nothing and only focus on the size, smell, etc. So when you read what someone says, you also have to note if they mention the horrid smell, the awful taste, the large size tablet, specks. Those tablets represent a change to what’s inside—a now VERY bad product causing a massive return of hypothyroidism, as well as nausea, repulsion, burning when they swallow, etc.
Hadassah
Janie I would love to know which NDT do you recommend now after the NP fiasco ? Are you thinking about synthetic T3 also ? If yes which one would you recommend ?
It’s crying shame what is being done with our thyroid meds that worked so well for us .
Janie Bowthorpe
I stopped recommending them. Just not seeing enough strong and consistent positive results since every single one of them has changed and not giving the quality results they used to. It’s irritating. But there are some individuals who feel they are doing well on compounded ndt or Armour. Hardly any doing well on the others. So I just leave it up to you. Also, being OPTIMAL on T4 and T3 could be good, too.
Hadassah
Thank you Janie . I guess going with synthetic T3 and T4 is the only option we have now I guess this is what they wanted us to do from get go . What a shame .
Karen SFerguson
I understand why you don’t recommend them, but can you tell us which thyroid med you take? If I have to switch to another NDT (I’ve tried Armour, Naturetroid, straight T3, WP Thyroid and now on NP Thyroid) it would be nice to know what meds work for others.
Janie Bowthorpe
I’m still on the former-working NP Thyroid.
Laurie
I talked to my pharmacy today about NP Thyroid. The person I talked to said she was not aware of any problems with NP and that there have not been any recalls. She seemed surprised. I let her know that I had hypothyroid symptoms and that the pill did not seem like what I had been taking. The smell and taste were different and it tasted toxic. My lot number for the new batch of 90 that I have is M327B19-1
Suzette
Hello,
I have been in NPThyroid for several years but just picked up a new 3 month script only to find they taste like iodine has been added… a LOT of it. I too, wrote Acella only to be told they haven’t changed their formula. I haven’t yet gotten the Lot# for you but I will. However, I wanted to mention something that may help explain why these companies are changing their formulas. Actually, there are two reasons that I believe this is happening. You may think I’m a conspiracy nut when you read the second one. The first reason is to make the tablets longer acting. Many of us began having trouble with Armour not working. Then we found out they changed or added a filler: some form of cellulose. Cellulose is a fiber and is being used to slow down the absorption of the thyroid hormones in the medication apparently to make it more like a time-release product. This works for some people, but for others its a disaster. I guess some people cannot break the cellulose down enough (I’m one of those people) to get the thyroid so its like taking your thyroid med with food. The other reason is the conspiracy one. I believe that all these manufacturers aren’t just waking up one day and deciding to fix something that’s not broken thereby losing revenue because so many people stop buying their drug. It doesn’t make sense does it? So, what would make them all do this? Well, we know the FDA and many medical establishment people do not like NDT. They SAY its because of one thing or another but they cannot prove synthetics don’t also have some of these issues, if they even exist. So then why don’t they like NDT? Simply because its a natural product. Look at what they have been doing to the natural supplement industry for the last 10-20 years. They do not want us taking naturals. So, do I believe they are “leaning” on manufacturers of NDT? You bet I do. They know if they just suddenly pull them off the market the uproar would be huge. But if people decided themselves that NDT was no good, or didn’t work for one reason or another, they would be forced to go to synthetics. As an aside, Hillary Clinton takes NDT, I believe its Armour. Wonder if she’s having problems.
Anyway, that’s my two cents. I am very concerned about the iodine taste/smell because women who are past menopause should be careful taking iron as it can raise their risk of heart attacks. At least that’s what I was told years ago. Maybe that has changed but since I’m past that age and have no thyroid, I am wondering what to do. I have only been on this new bottle for about a week so I don’t know if I will have any problems but the fact that it tastes so strongly like iodone has me very concerned.
Jean Dillon
Suzette.. what does the Iodine you smell have to do with the iron you say post menopausal women shouldn’t take? Is one of those words a type?
Lisa
If cellulose has been added, would it work to take a digestive enzyme targeting that cellulose (a cellulase enzyme) to mitigate it?
Janie Bowthorpe
Why not try it!
Suzy
My labs were bad with my older batch of NP. The new prescription is different but I’ve been doing better. Maybe just a bad batch.
Emily
In response to your e-mail:
1. How do you know that you are reporting on the CHANGED NP Thyroid tablets?
My new tablets are thicker, speckled and smell like ammonia (cat urine)
2. Comment with the lot number for the bottle of what are clearly CHANGED NP Thyroid tablets
Lot #M328S19-1
3. Comment with the expiration date for what are clearly CHANGED NP Thyroid Tablets.
Bottle says EXP 07/30/19, but I think that’s a typo as it was filled on 07/30/19
4. State the city, state, country, and name of store/website where you got the changed tablet
Kailua-Kona, HI, USA, Walmart
Janie Bowthorpe
Emily, you posted this on the wrong blog post. Post it here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Melanie and David R Schrand
Hi there, I have been taking np thyroid for a couple of months and although I am still not feeling well, something is wrong because all my symptoms are worse and I was at least stable before. I don’t know if it is the Np thyroid or the fact that I lowered it and added in T3 to lower my RT3. I don’t see a batch number only rx numbers, but they were filled in July 2019. Do you think it will be better to go on the synthetics then?
ELISSA JUNG (CUPCAKE)
THIS IS NOT A COMMENT BUT A MEDICAL TRAVELOGUE. IN THE SPRING OF 2015 THERE WAS A NOTICE ON DRUGS.COM OF A ‘LABEL CHANGE’ FOR SYNTHROID AND ARMOUR. ‘LABEL CHANGES’ ARE NOT EXPLAINED NOR IS THERE ANY EXPLANATION GIVEN.I RENEWED MY SYNTHROID AND WITHIN 3 DAYS MY NORMAL BLOOD PRESSURE OF 120ISH SHOT TO 210 OVER 110. MY HEART WAS RACING, I HAD DIFFICULTY STANDING AND GENERALLY FELT HALF DEAD. STOPPED THE MED, WAITED TWO WEEKS, PRESSURE CAME DOWN, STARTED MEDS AGAIN…SAME REACTION AND STOP MEDS. IT TOOK ME A GOOD YEAR TO FIND THE CULPIRT(S). THERE WERE TWO ADDITIONS ADDED TO THE INATE LIST..ACACIA FOR PILL WHITNESS AND LACTOS FOR SWEETENER. ACACIS IS A SHRUB, IN THE SAME FAMILY AS ‘RAGWEED’. LACTOS COMES FROM DAIRY. I AM VERY ALLERGIC TO RAGWEED AND DAIRY…THEREFORE THE SEVEAR REACTION. WHAT ELSE IN THIS UNLISTED INATE ADDITIONS COULD EFFECT MY THYROID SISTERS? WAS A SUPPLIER CHANGED? WAS THE CLEANING OF THE PILL MAKING MACHINE NOT RINSED OFF? WAS THE PACKING MATERIAL INFERIOR? WAS THE NATURAL THYROID HORMONE TAKEN FROM A SUMMER ANIMAL? OR A WINTER ANIMAL. ROBUST/STRONGER IN SUMMER,WEAKER IN WINTER? MY SYSTEM WAS NOW TOTALY OUT OF WACK, PRESSURE WAS ALL OVER, FROM HI TO LOW WITHIN 2 HRS. STILL FELT LIKE DEATH WARMED OVER. WORKED WITH DAVID AT ACILIA, WHO WAS VERY HELPFUL BUT I COULDN’T EVEN HANDLE HIS LOWEST DOSE MED. HEART WOULD POUND, I WOULD GET THE SHAKES, COLD BEYOND BELIEF, AND FATIGUED AS LAST WEEKS OVER COOKED NOODLE. IT WAS AT THIS JUNCTURE I DECIDED TO BECOME MY OWN DR. I USED MYSELF AS MY Petri dish AND BEGAN TO RESEARCH WITH WITH A VENGEANCE. RATHER THAN ACCEPT THE INTERNETS ARTICLES I BEGAN TO READ THE PHASE ONE/TWO TESTS REFERRED TO AT THE BOTTOM OF THE PAGE. MANY TIMES THEY WOULD ADD ODD THINGS THEY SAW, NOT VETTED. HERE ARE SOME… HYPO CLIENTS SEEM TO HAVE MORE ALLERGIES THAN OTHERS. HYPO CLIENTS TEND TO GO GREY YOUNGER AND HAVE A HIGHER SEX DRIVE.(I CAN VETT THIS ONE). A SMALL SEGMENT OF CLIENTS WERE UNABLE TO CONVERT T4 TO T3 AND ADDING T3 SEEMED TO HELP. IT HAD ME BOUNCING OFF THE WALLS, IN DESPERATION I STOPPED ALL MEDS. SOME HOW I BEGAN TO FEEL BETTER BUT WAS STILL SUFFERING WITH THE AFTERNOON SLUMP. TO MAKE SURE I WAS HYDRATED I WOULD HAVE 5 OZ OF COLD WATER, A GOOD SPLASH OF LEMON JUICE AND A SHAKER OF SEA SALT. SOMEHOW THIS WAS A BIG BOOSTER TO MY FATIGUE, BUT I DIDN’T KNOW WHY. IT WAS CHEAP, HAD NO REACTIONS AND WAS PLEASANT TO TAKE SO I CONTINUED, BUT STILL WONDERING HOW COME IT WORKED. ONE DAY I WAS READING RECIPES AND THERE WAS A FOOT NOTE ABOUT SEA SALT THAT IT HAD THE TENDENCY TO ‘OPEN UP CELL WALLS’ TO ALLOW NUTRIENTS TO PASS THRU. THAT’S WHY MY CITRUS/SEA SALT DRINK WORKED. FLUSHED WITH SUCESS I DECIDED TO ATTACK MY ERRATIC BLOOD PRESSURE. SINCE I AM ALLERGIC TO SO MANY THINGS THAT IS WERE I STARTED. I FINIALLY GOT DOWN TO MY SUPPLEMENTS. I STOPPED ALL AND BINGO MY PRESSURE WENT BACK TO THE OLD 120ISH. IT WASEN’T THE VIT. IT WAS THE “PILL”!!! NOT THE CAPSULE. BESIDES THE WELL KNOWN ALLERGIES…WHEAT/GLUTON, DAIRY, EGGS,RAGWEED, PEANUTS LOOK TO THE TYPE OF CONTAINER YOUR MEDS COME IN. THE INATE FILLERS IN PILLS, TABLET COULD BE DOING YOU HARM…CHECK IT OUT.
HAPPY RESEARCHING
Niko
Have you ever been checked for Mast Cell Activation Disorder?
Jeanne
Niko, most docs have never heard of MCAS. Both my daughter and my mom have it, and I was the one to diagnose it! Not a doc, but a 25 year RN Clinical Nutritionist.
For any one wanting to know more, there is an excellent book by the MD who put all the puzzle pieces together and coined the term “Mast cell activation syndrome”.
“Never Bet Against Occam” by Dr. Lawrence B. Afrin MD. Available on Amazon.
Debbie Kimbrell
Has anybody considered the possibility that the manufacturers are telling the truth, and didn’t change anything? Perhaps the problem is that the composition of the source of the active ingredient (or maybe even an inactive ingredient?) has changed? I ask this because so many NDTs are problems now.
Taking both NP Thyroid 120 and NP 30, my last refills were 4/26/2019. A month later, I was very, very ill with many symptoms I had never had before. Thinking I was overactive, I began decreasing, with no improvement, until I was only on NP 30. After seeing the picture of the changed NP tablets, I realized my NP 120 tablets were not changed — but the NP 30, the only tablets I was currently taking, were speckled, which explained why my symptoms had not disappeared. And now I had a TSH of 13 (where for many years it had been 0.1) !
I am no longer taking any NP Thyroid.
Jim
Just noticed this update from Acella ( https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/08/22/uh-oh-np-thyroid/#respond ):
NP Thyroid® Product Update
8/30/2019 Product Update : Providing updates and feedback about your questions related to NP Thyroid® is important. Our customer service has reported an increase in calls and emails related to the odor or taste of NP Thyroid®. We are also aware that there are some comments about this on social media sites. At Acella Pharmaceuticals, our priority has always been, and will continue to be, to provide our customers with quality, consistent and cost-effective products. Our API is sourced from FDA inspected facilities, and we manufacture NP Thyroid® in the USA to USP standards following cGMP practices. As a result of the upheaval in the desiccated thyroid market in the past few years, we have had to upgrade and expand our production capabilities to keep up with increasing demand for NP Thyroid®. We do not use any API material sourced directly or indirectly from China or India. Rest assured that our formulation, specifications and exacting quality standards for NP Thyroid® have remained consistent. NP Thyroid® is a product derived from natural sources, and you may notice the odor, taste and shade of our tablets may vary slightly from batch to batch. It is important to note, however, that we test each batch of NP Thyroid® to ensure that the finished product is within the USP (United States Pharmacopeia) specifications for T4 and T3. We have found no indication that slight variations in odor, color or size of the tablets affect their content, quality or consistency.
If you have any questions or concerns with NP Thyroid®, please contact us at info@acellapharma.com or (800) 541-4802. Moreover, if you experience a change in your thyroid related symptoms at any time, you should contact your licensed healthcare provider.
Cincolo
Funny how every time they say they need to update their production facility, the product seems to get screwed.
Ellen
PU. I stopped taking NP Thyroid after my symptoms got the best of me. Aches, dry eyes, fatigue. When I called Acella, they said, “batches can be different but the standards are the same.” I told them to raise the bar. Their new “batch” smells horrible, tastes even worse, has a different size and look, and makes me feel worse than ever. How can that be acceptable?
sam
sorry am too tired to read it all but i recommend thyrogold . its from organic pasture raised cows isntead of factory farmed GMO fed poor pigs
. it works too.
also eating all orgnaic [ grown in real soil [ not hydroponic, hydropinc does not ahve the nutrients that soil organic does plus does nohting for the environmnet ] relaly helps for good health and curing digestion problems .
hope this helps wiht people having problems with the pharmaceuticals.
am s till tired but at least feel much better than wiht the horrible synthroid
Cincolo
I’ve been chewing my tablets the past 5 days and am actually feeling better. Contrary to what others are saying, my tablets are extremely sweet (with the porcine taste only if it’s stuck in my teeth). I drink extra water afterwards though to wash the taste out of my mouth. Mine don’t taste anything like they smell. I’m actually surprised they are so sweet. Naturethroid and Armour were never that sweet when I chewed them (after they were modified). I’m taking 60 mg and 30 mg tablets daily. Anyone else noticing they are doing better after chewing them?
Wendy Benton
I had commented a few days back about my problems with the new Acella. I callled the company and they called me back and were very nice, asked a whole lot of questions and are going to get a sample of my pills. After I got off the phone with Steve, I poured out my pills and compared them to an old one. Could not really see much but then I took a closer look and noticed that only some of the new pills were a shade darker colored. I put a lighter one under my tongue and it was fine then a darker one and the taste was horrible and I spit it out. I have a call back to him to let him know.
Ann Rankin
Hi Janie, To be on the safe side I personally will not consume any of the new tablets that are making people sick. It’s one thing to have the pills cause return of hypo symptoms. It’s another thing entirely when people are saying it is making them gag, become nauseated, have stomach pains, and burning tongue plus more! Why are some continuing to take a chance with their health and safety by taking them?
Janie Bowthorpe
We agree.
Laura Beckwith
Not sure what to do, my ND changed my dosage from 60mg of NP Thyroid to 30mg of NP, 5mcg of liothyronine, the 30mg is the one with the change. I have been taking since the Labor day weekend, besides the already known changes, I chew my NP thyroid, and it’s foul tasting, and I feel like gagging. I think my stomach slightly feels a bit different after taking it as well. The taste/aftertaste stays in my mouth so pewtred.
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Amyiable
I called Acella, left a voice message in David’s message box explaining the problem with the new script for NP Thyroid as having little if any thyroid hormone in the 1-grain tablets. I gave him the lot number (Lot #M330C194) I received from Express Scripts. I stated my phone number in case he would want to speak with me. I explained that I had to switch to a different thyroid medication brand.
Janie Bowthorpe
Please post that log number here: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Catherine
I just picked up an older batch of a sealed bottle of 100 pills of 30 mg from Rite-Aid thinking that I temporarily avoid the problems that have been emerging. The expiry date was 10/2020.
I was horrified when i opened it and saw darker grayish tan pills. I opted to partially fill with a newer batch expiring 02/2021. So my hunch that the newer pills are a problem is not accurate.
Could we create a list that everyone can update with batch numbers and expiry dates? Maybe we can figure out the problem that way.
Hadassah
Thank You .That would be a Great Idea . Many of us would benefit from this . Knowing what dates and lots are working well . We are revisiting the Naturethroid fiasco once again with NP Thyroid .
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Hadassah
WOW !!!! This is a GREAT SERVICE for us all . My new refill has a Lot # M327E19-1. Is this Lot # good . I would Please love to know if anyone can Please let me know . I’m holding off till I hear back from you guys . I need to refill my NP scripts I’m low on them.
Thank You So Much In Advance .
Trudy Boccaccio
Hi, this is very interesting, I am taking Thyroid from Thailand, would this be true about these also as I am not good at the moment, thanks
Janie Bowthorpe
Probably not.
Kim
Hi, I saw the video you posted the other day on fb and as many of us, share the same feelings.
I’ve been wanting to know if you had filed a report to the FDA, spoken to a lawyer, have the pills tested at an independant lab to see the ingredients change. I ask because these are things I am planning to do but was curious ifthere was a class action suit already happening. I am upset that after 5 years and learning so much, I am not allowed to have the option of natural treatment. Tired of doctors claiming NDT doesn’t work because it’s inconsistant when it’s clear that’s the manufacturers. What can we do, how can we all get involved and stopthis madness and companies getting away with stuff. These NDT are prescribed because they are regulated, someone is not doing their job and we are paying for it!
Melannie
Hi, i so admire your courage and gumption to do all these things with the fda and the lawyers!
But it may be worth reconsidering. First of all the fda and the medical community does not support NDT or prescribing NDT for thyroid disease. Second, NDT is not considered a real medicine by the FDA because it is so old it was never tested by the FDA and it was also never grandfathered in to be given status as a recognized medicine. So these two things combined make it very risky to contact the FDA and put NDT in their line of sight. We run the risk of them saying that the drugs are unsafe, unregulated and thus should no longer be produced or prescribed which is already what mainstream medicine is saying about NDT.
In addition given that current prescribing guidelines recommend against NDT and that the drug lobbies, whose best interest is served by patent available synthetics (NDT can’t be patented), have major connections to the FDA in very profound ways, the FDA would have every reason to use this as an excuse to shut down NDT prescription and production.
So in my opinion your courage and motivation are so wonderful, but it may be better to NOT to contact the FDA and instead work directly with the manufacturers to resolve this problem. Especially since Acella is interested and wants people to report about lot numbers that are causing symptoms. It means they are beginning to listen. So maybe let’s see what they can do 🙂 what do you think? – melannie
Just Me
Melannie, NDT was, in fact, grandfathered into the FDA. While they have not *approved* NDT, they do regulate and monitor it.
Janie Bowthorpe
Please provide proof that NDT was grandfathered in. We need it if this is so. If there is no documentation to back this up, I do want to remove your comment so as not to provide wrong info.
I do remember a few months ago someone providing something, but sadly, I was in the midst of writing two books and very preoccupied.
Kim
When doing some research last week, I also found that NDT was grandfathered into the FDA.
I looked in my search history. This is what I found:
“FDA-Approved?
Because DTE was developed before the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) existed, its legality as a prescription medication was grandfathered in. While it’s regulated by the FDA, it has never gone through the application process that was required of new drugs introduced to the market after the FDA was founded. This means that it’s not FDA-approved.”
Source: https://www.verywellhealth.com/armour-thyroid-for-hypothyroidism-3233291
Janie Bowthorpe
Unfortunately, a lot of articles and people make the mistake in calling it FDA approved.
And that article is bad. For example: “There are slightly varying amounts of T4 and T3 in DTE, making them a less precise treatment option and potentially creating more difficulty in finding the correct dosage.” That is typical bs. For YEARS now, we have never had difficulty finding the correct dosage.
And this: “Animals have different balances of hormones than humans. DTE contains a 4:1 ratio of T4 to T3; humans have a ratio of 14:1. This can translate into high T3 levels in people taking DTE.” Total bs. We have never, ever had an issue with the fact that pigs have more T3 than T3.
Or this: “Because T3 is about four times stronger than T4, there’s concern that taking DTE or a synthetic combination of T4/T3 (levothyroxine and liothyronine) can temporarily result in thyrotoxicosis two to four hours after taking it.” The third bs. Years of our experiences have never found that the rise in T3 after taking NDT results in thyrotoxicosis.
Once upon a time, someone with a huge and false bias stated idiotic things like this, and those comments get passed down to promote similar huge and false bias.
Kim
I understand your point of view but it has been unsafe what RLC labs and Acella have done. Please correct me if I am wrong, but they are prescribed because they were going to be regulated. If not they would be sold OTC. Where is the quality control? No one noticed the color, smell and size are different? They should be held to the same standards, isn’t that the only way we can have NDT safe on a long term basis and more companies aboard, if they regulate the companies better so no one gets away with this? Like Mylan with the Epipen, it opened a whole new market and many companies jumped in to provide new epinephrine auto injectors and even nasal spray and a pill that goes dissolves under the tongue.
I have already asked a friend I have in the pharmacy industry for independent labs that will test one from an old batch and the new one to see what is the difference. Once I receive a contact, I’ll have them tested. I recall Ms. Janie expressing her upset as all of us. I just want to be proactive and provide real solutions with real results. Many patients are still going to Naturethroid starting good finishing bad. And its been a year! I already struggle with so many other things in my life. I don’t think worrying if my pills this month will be a good or bad batch. It’s not fair for those who want to be productive in society. What other things can we do? Acella can’t be our only option. Never put all your eggs in one basket.
Catherine
Hi. It would be helpful if everyone experiencing a problem could post the expiration dates of the bad batches received. That way, we can pinpoint approximately when the problem occured. Maybe that will help others.
Cincolo
I’ve been chewing my tablets the past 5 days and am actually feeling better. Contrary to what others are saying, my tablets are extremely sweet (with the porcine after taste). Mine don’t taste anything like they smell. I’m taking 60 mg and 30 mg tablets daily.
Laura Chrostowski
Wow! I have Hashimoto’s and take NP Thyroid 30 mg tablets- 3 in a.m. and 2 in p.m., totaling 150mg/day. Prior to June, I was feeling fabulous! My April 2019 labs were optimal (FT3 176, range 71-180, and FT4 127, range 0.82-1.77), which they have been for over a year now after treating adrenal exhaustion. (Thank you, Janie! You saved my life!! Your books are my bibles! If not for you, my hashi’s and adrenal exhaustion would have gone undiagnosed for another 10 years, and I would have been 300 pounds by now!)
I have noticed the smell of NP is a little bit stronger than usuaI. In June, I began to notice lower energy, and now, September, I get so tired in the afternoon that my eyes are closing, and I just don’t have energy. Weight loss has slowed, I’m feeling more hungry, and it seems I have developed a sensitivity to sun. I get red blotches on my face around my eyes when outdoors, and I’m always covered with hat, sunscreen, and sun glasses. I have been feeling so poorly, that I asked to be tested for Lupus; my ANA test was negative. It’s a relief to know that NP Thyroid is likely causing my symptoms, but I am so very disappointed in Acella. Before STTM, they were nobody, and they can become nobody again because we do have choices!
I just had my labs done again on 8/29, but unfortunately, the tests have different names with different ranges, and I can’t interpret the differences: Thyroxine (T4) 7.8, range 4.5-12.0; Free Thyroxine Index 2.1, range 1.2-4.9; T3 Uptake 27, range 24-39. I don’t understand Thyroxine Index or T3 Uptake. So, if anyone can interpret these numbers and compare them to my optimal in April, that will tell how the new meds have affected my labs. My doctor has moved to a different practice, and apparently the tests are different. When I asked the doctor, I was told that the Thyroxine (T4) is actually Free T4, and the T3 Uptake of 27 was equal to FT3 of 170, which I don’t get, and couldn’t even interpret via google. Many thanks!
Peace
Janie Bowthorpe
FYI: save your money. We don’t need total T4 (Thyroxine T4), Free Thyroxine Index, T3 Uptake. All we need is free T3 and free T4.
No, just a “Thyroxine (T4)” is a total, not a free T4. No, T3 uptake is not free T3.
Karen SFerguson
I also take the 30mg NP at 150mg/day (3 at 6am and 2 at 3pm.) I really have not noticed any difference in the small or taste – I take them sublinqually. However, I am having major hypo symptoms, fatigue, hair loss and can’t figure out what is going on with me. After reading this thread I’ve put a call into my doctor to ask for thyroid labs. I had been on 3 grains but reduced down to 2.5 grains about 8 mos ago and was feeling fine. I’ve been on NDT for 10 years and it took me a few doctors and 2 years to feel human again and don’t want to go through it again. Life is too short, especially at age 70.
I had been taking WP thyroid until the shortage and started taking the NP Thyroid. I’d go back to WP Thyroid, if anyone can tell me that it is working well after their comeback.
This site is a life saver and I own two of the Madness books and considering getting their updated one. I stayed up late last night reading this entire thread and found it extremely helpful. I’ve not had any trouble getting my NP Thyroid and I get a 90 day supply via CVS mail order – as required by my insurance. The 30mg NP Thyroid tablets are very small – maybe an 1/8 inch in diameter – so not easy to determine changes without a magnifying glass.
I hope to get labs next week and will update this information then. Again, I really prefer the WP Thyroid since it has few fillers – please someone post if the new WP Thyroid is working for them.
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s worth it to get the updated one. There were important updates needed.
Karen SFerguson
Janie, as you suggested, I went to purchase the new edition of the Madness book (cover with raised fists) but it has the same ISBN number as my last book Revised Edition 2012. Shouldn’t this new edition have a different isbn number? How do I know I’m getting most current edition of the book?
Janie Bowthorpe
The ISBN is the same because it’s the same book…but has a lot of revisions throughout. You’ll know you are getting the current edition by the cover. See https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/updated-revision-sttm-book
Sarah
Hi, I’ll chime in here with my experience. First, I am immensely grateful I found this thread because this explains a lot for me. I actually just started NP thyroid back in June this year. I had a hard time finding a pharmacy that carried it, but luckily I found one that had it in stock–likely with the old formulation. When I refilled it 6 weeks later from a different pharmacy I guess I got the newer formulation. After the initial first 6 weeks on the old formulation of NP, my TSH improved to 2.9 (it was at 3.9 previously). I’m only taking 1/4 grain (15 mg /day) btw. Now fast forward to August. My hair is falling out like crazy, my period is SO out of whack and my TSH has increased to to 4.8 (higher than it was before starting this med). I obviously believe what people are saying here about the formulation change. I know I’ll be coming off this one. I’m very disappointed in the pharmaceutical industry in general. What is a reputable med at this point?
Hadassah
Can you please tell me what are the dates on the NP Thyroid bottles that have problems with so I can be on the lookout to make sure I don’t get them ? I’m due to get a refill and I don’t want to get stuck with thyroid meds that have problems . I would like not to revisit the hypo issues . If I can get the old ones with the good batch and dates still that have no problems I would love to see if I can still get them .
Thank you in advance .
sam
i take thyrogold in case you want to try
Rachel
The only fact a company looks at is their bottom line. As a consumer, the only action is to not buy their product which will immediately affect their bottom line.
Unfortunately I just had a refill for 3 months but plan to send them back and cancel the refill from Express Scripts due end of October.
If everyone boycotts NP Thyroid ( if its not working, it should not be too much of an issue), maybe then they will listen).
Janie Bowthorpe
Correct, the power that patients hold against this sanity of changes, gaslighting, and denials is to stop giving them your money.
Christianne Pereira Giesbrecht Chaves
Rachel this is a good idea, however it is still not good for us who have to find another options and we know changing meds is a pain and also takes time to reach the optimal. We are really in a hard moment. It looks like some synthetic “entity” is trying to push all us to synthetic only.
Ana
Acella’s patronizing statement reveals a lot about the way they view the patients who depend on NP Thyroid to stay alive and have a decent quality of life. Their dismissal of patients’ reports on the changes in recent NPT batches as some sort of mass hysteria over a trivial variation in shade, odor and taste does not bode well for us. Do they think we’re going to fall for their paternalistic reassurances that nothing has changed? The fact is that recent batches of NPT have been substandard. The changes in taste and smell go beyond the expected variability, but by far the most critical change is that the active ingredients have been rendered inactive. We thyroid patients know this.
If Acella continues to dismiss our reports, they’ll never try to figure out what’s causing this change. I think we need to keep contacting Acella and clearly emphasize that the main problem is that something has inactivated the thyroid hormones. Request that they please investigate and determine what’s going wrong. It’s not an exaggeration to say that, for many of us, our lives depend on it. We’re running out of treatment options.
Janie Bowthorpe
Excellent response, Ana.
Dee
Yes, excellent! And I am one whose life (and my family’s) DOES
depend on it! As Janie knows, I even tried drying my own pig thyroid
(from local butcher), but couldn’t find the chemical which takes the
fat out! If I could locate that, add dextrose…well, I am desperate! 🙂
Victoria
Here’s Acella’s NP update on their website from 2 days ago which passes the buck and doesn’t fix the problem, imagine that!…
“NP Thyroid® Product Update 8/30/2019: Providing updates and feedback about your questions related to NP Thyroid® is important. Our customer service has reported an increase in calls and emails related to the odor or taste of NP Thyroid®. We are also aware that there are some comments about this on social media sites. At Acella Pharmaceuticals, our priority has always been, and will continue to be, to provide our customers with quality, consistent and cost-effective products. Our API is sourced from FDA inspected facilities, and we manufacture NP Thyroid® in the USA to USP standards following cGMP practices. As a result of the upheaval in the desiccated thyroid market in the past few years, we have had to upgrade and expand our production capabilities to keep up with increasing demand for NP Thyroid®. We do not use any API material sourced directly or indirectly from China or India. Rest assured that our formulation, specifications and exacting quality standards for NP Thyroid® have remained consistent. NP Thyroid® is a product derived from natural sources, and you may notice the odor, taste and shade of our tablets may vary slightly from batch to batch. It is important to note, however, that we test each batch of NP Thyroid® to ensure that the finished product is within the USP (United States Pharmacopeia) specifications for T4 and T3. We have found no indication that slight variations in odor, color or size of the tablets affect their content, quality or consistency. If you have any questions or concerns with NP Thyroid®, please contact us at info@acellapharma.com or (800) 541-4802. Moreover, if you experience a change in your thyroid related symptoms at any time, you should contact your licensed healthcare provider.”
Janie Bowthorpe
What is very noticeable is the emphasis that the calls are about odor and taste, and mention of size, with NOTHING about all the miserable ways the changed tablets are making people miserable and feeling sick…as evidenced by all the comments here..as well in massively in thyroid groups.
Ally
Empty words from the manufacturer. Symptoms are awful. Taking causes a gag reflex. It’s not easy to get in quickly to see a dr who is in demand; getting new lab results takes time. I contacted the manufacturer last week … the response was no response. Shameful business practice
Janie Bowthorpe
A very good point that it’s not easy getting in quickly, getting new lab results.
Victoria
Janie exactly! That’s what I meant by… passing the buck/ignoring the problem/political/greed/BS/at our expense
Victoria
Allow me to add my rant to this nightmare. I’ve been taking NP 90 mg desiccated thyroid for a year and doing well and I chew it before swallowing. I’ve taken 2 days of my latest prescription and it tastes awful like corn chips or dirty feet smell AND the diameter is smaller! WTH? So I contacted my Walmart pharmacy and they just acted like I was crazy because I chew it instead of swallowing AND they dismissed my concern because the letters and numbers are correct on the pill. Someone posted about Woodland Hills compounding pharmacy so I just emailed them hoping to switch to a compounded version which would be better anyway because there are no nasty fillers and because I’m running out of options! I’ve tried them all, I used to take Thyrogold and did well on it but I discovered last year they suddenly changed their fillers without telling anyone by adding coconut oil which I am highly allergic to! I can’t wait another day for Acella to figure this out and start having debilitating hypo symptoms return like people are posting here, I don’t know where else to turn, I’ve been dealing with this demonic political deception between pharmaceutical companies and their synthetic crap vs “natural” companies and their lies, hidden fillers, foreign manufacturers and shortages at our expense for 15 years and the “madness” never stops!! Who knows if compounding pharmacies are even on the up and up or taking kickbacks from somebody as well but here’s an article from Woodland Hills compounding pharmacy’s website on this subject Good luck everyone, I’m so “sick” of this crap, literally sick of it! https://www.woodlandhillspharmacy.com/acella-np-thyroid/
Stacey
That is exactly how I feel!! I have been trying to get NP filled for several weeks. It seems the major suppliers are not stocking NDT meds. I am soooo tired of struggling to get NDT. Switching to synthetic t4 & T3 and I’ll see what happens.
Jeff Garland
In addition to taste and smell, one can no longer take the pill sub-lingual; that is, it doesn’t dissolve in your mouth. That’s what I liked about it most. I’m giving up on the NDT and switching to synthetic. Too much BS.
Janie Bowthorpe
As long as you use BOTH synthetic T4 with synthetic T3, and work to be optimal, you can be fine. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Rachel
This is very disheartening news! I had to switch from Naturethroid to NP thyroid because of all the trouble they were having. I just tried to fill a new prescription and I was told it was on back order which made me suspicious so I came out here to find out what was going on. I know that I still have the old ones from the size shape and color, but I only have a few left. Unfortunately I am allergic to any pharmaceutical synthetic medications like Synthroid. I had horrible joint pain the whole time that I was taking the Synthroid and Cytomel as soon as I switch to a naturally desiccated thyroid medication that horrible joint pain went away. Has anyone tried the compounding pharmacies approach? Are there any other alternatives? I am currently taking one and a half of the 90 mg NP thyroid tablets. How many grains would I need to get from the compounding pharmacy to have an accurate switch over?
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, as long as you get optimal even on compounded, it can work. But also know it’s cheaper to dose yourself with the two synthetics. Either way. Study this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Rachel
Thank you so much for the information Janie I will look at that page, but I will not go back to synthetic medications. I am one of those people who is Allergic to the 21st Century. Most people call it multiple chemical sensitivities or environmental illness, but I don’t like either one of those terms. They’re too depressing! 🙂 I know a compounding pharmacy would be frightfully expensive so I am looking into getting an over the counter Thyroid supplement should be an interesting time! Please know that I am praying for everyone out here who is going through this process. Thank you again and take care!
Rachel
I also wanted to ask about thyroid glandular supplement options? I was looking at the Allergy Research supplements and they are frozen, then dried which is very good way to handle thyroid tissue. Do you know if anybody else has tried them? I do not have a thyroid, I had thyroid cancer in 2010. I need to get some idea about how much I should take as well. If anybody has any information, or if there’s some place online that I could look to get a better handle on that? Please let me know.
I know that one of the things that would be a blessing is that I would be able to take a little bit every few hours during the day, which would be much more like my original thyroid process. If anybody has any information I would truly appreciate it.
Just Me
Rachel, you may do well with Tirosint. I can’t take Synthroid either. Tirosint is a synthetic t4 only with no and/or less fillers. You can add Cytomel or a time released synthetic T3.
Janie Bowthorpe
You could try it, but it contains an awful lot of cellulose, which blocks some of the thyroid hormones. Not too swift on their part. As far as how much, we just watch our free T3 and free T4 and get optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Lyn Newton
I was on Synthroid for 27 years and for 27 years I had all the hypo symptoms but my labs looked good so the docs wouldn’t do a thing. I did not know I had any other option during that time. Since then I have been on several different NDTs; Naturethroid, Armour, WP and now NP. I had an integrative doc talk me into trying Tirosint. Besides being expensive, I felt TERRIBLE ON IT. I have MTHFR genetic mutations and cannot convert synthetic. Synthetic is NOT an option for me!
Janie Bowthorpe
You might do okay on tirosint if you also add in 3 and then get both your free T4 and free T3 optimal.
Stacey
I hope they fix the problem with NP however there is also the problem of getting it filled!! Every Pharmacy I have checked with can’t get it. I’ve tried local, mail order etc with no luck. This constant problem with NDT meds is just wearing me out!! My doctor is very open to my requests but I don’t even know what to ask for. Are there a lot of problems getting refills also??
Just Me
It’s possible if you tried in the last few days, Acella voluntarily recalled the recent batches which weren’t working. We can hope. Personally, I’m going to Armour.
Emily
Just Me, I haven’t heard about a recall yet. Can you please provide additional information? Thanks!
Just Me
Emily, I have no information. I made a suggestion. Sorry I wasn’t more clear. Like, maybe the reason people can’t get NP is a possible recall?
Stacey
I have been trying to get NP filled for several weeks. It seems the major suppliers are not stocking NDT meds. I am soooo tired of struggling to get NDT. Switching to synthetic t4 & T3 and I’ll see what happens.
A Wright
YES!! It is maddening trying to get filled. I usually have to get partially filled until they get more in, which of course costs more money. Ridiculous. I don’t even know what “normal” is anymore.
Stephanie
This is all frustrating. I have hoshimotos and was put on armour for low t3 and barely within range t4 low end also. Anyway the armour did not give me anymore energy after being on it for about two months up to a full gram. My t3 went high and tsh was super low, t4 was within range. I started having all kinds of itching and rashes, swelling, and overall I’ll feeling. I was going to ask to try another type of natural thyroid as I was wondering about gluten and corn in armour. What do you suggest I request?
Janie Bowthorpe
Stephanie, by gram, did you mean grain? If so, you wouldn’t have done well as you were underdosing yourself. One grain is simply a starting dose from which we raise in search of our optimal dose. But if your free T3 went high, that’s called pooling and was not revealing an adrenal problem, possibly from being underdosed. Study this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Dee
Acella customer service actually called me and spoke with me for
about 20 minutes! They are going to ask Walgreens for some of the
last lot number to test it.
That is amazing, since Forest Pharm. never seemed to care,
when Armour was reformulated in 2009!
Keeping fingers crossed.
Janie Bowthorpe
Thyroid patients everywhere hope that Acella will do the mature, caring and right thing and FIX what is now ruined.
Melinda Scifres
I haven’t felt the same since I switched from Armour Thyroid to NP Thyroid and I’m wondering if it because the fillers and made of corn? I’m allergic to corn and then all the
Corn is GMO. I feel better when I forget to take my thyroid pill. Less swelling, inflammation and pain it seems. Anyone else experiencing this?
Janie Bowthorpe
Melinda, yes, if you have issues with corn, guess it’s a possibility for you. Or you are underdosed. Underdosing ourselves always backfires and causes problem.
Christianne
I am really lost with all that!!!! I am having a hard time try to reach the optimal but it is taking ages. I’ve trusted the endocrinologist last year and it was definitely not good (TSH narrow minded, just accept TSH as lower as 0.5), I have an appointment with her on the 17th and probably will be the last one once my TSH was 0.02 in July 18th, Free T3 2.6 and Free T4 1.51, Reverse T3 19.3. I wont care about TSH anymore and tomorrow I will have another results coming up. I can post here for suggestions.
Now I am on Tirosint 100mcg, NP Thyroid 45 mg (just increase from 30 mg, on Aug 26th after the blood work) and Cytomel 2.5 in PM. I know that probably is not enough T3, hair NEVER stops falling!!! I had fatigue and need a nap almost every day this last week, I also had my period last week. I know Janie told me once to decrease the Tirosint, but now???? I don’t know what to do anymore. Switch to Armour? Increase the Cytomel? Both? I wouldn’t like to stay only on synthetics. I still have NP Thyroid for a while, I didn’t see any difference. This week I will receive a new refill from NP thyroid 30mg. I will check and post here how are the pills.
Any thoughts?
Janie Bowthorpe
Christianne, we always have to lower T4 when RT3 is high, otherwise we get worse. Second, we nave to treat the cause. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/reverse-t3 And it’s hard to comment without knowing your free T3.
Christianne
Janie thank you for your quick answer.
Here are the last lab results that I just received today after this post, it was done in August 26th.
TSH -0.02 Free T4 – 1.25 Free T3 – 2.3 Reverse T3 – 15.9 TPO – 49 (has been decreasing)
Iron – 47 Ferritin – 77 TIBC – 246 Iron Sat -19% UIBC – 199 Iodine Serum – 47.5 Iodine Urine – 99.7.
This is the blood work I have posted above from July18th
TSH – 0.02 Free T3 – 2.6 Free T4 – 1.51 Reverse T3 -19.3.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. Always go to this page to help you understand your results: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/lab-values 🙂
CHRISTIANNE
Hi,
I’ve been to the link. My T3 is low, I feel that and by the math the Reverse T3 is not good. I also saw iron, I just not sure about iodine.
Thank you
Rima
PS, Reporting this to the FDA will just fuel their fire. They want to do away with all “natural meds” and this will just make them clamp down on naturopathic medicine all the more harshly.
I suggest we keep reporting to Acella (David said that lot numbers are VERY IMPORTANT).
Let’s support them in fact finding and in keeping us supplied with good, reliable thyroid medication!
Rima
Acella update!
I just got off the phone with David Margulis at Acella. He is most appreciative of my detailed emails and we spoke for almost 13 minutes. We are working out a plan to get this “bad” prescription, lot number M330E10-1, back to him for analysis.
I gave him the link to this blog and he will read what we are saying. He is very familiar with Stop the Thyroid Madness and wants to know what we all are reporting.
Dawn
Rima,
Can you share the number? I’ve called numerous times, only to receive a voicemail. I have emailed also, with no response from Acella. Thank you.
Emily
Dawn, David’s direct line is 678-325-5306. You will may still reach voicemail, but I left a message and he did return my call.
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Kim
Has anyone contacted or filed a complaint with the FDA?
Janie Bowthorpe
Unless something has changed, NDT is considered an unapproved drug. So complaining about it to the FDA comes across risky. We could be wrong, but worry about it.
Janie Bowthorpe
So the power comes in expressing extreme disappointment to Acella, and stop buying it. They are surely going to lose a lot of income, which seems like the most powerful way to send a message to them that they need to go beyond just saying they changed nothing and look deeper into this. Something definitely changed and horribly so.
Ellen weir
Thank you. Just found some older NP pills and they are different in size and smell. The date on bottle says 5/26/19, but I just got refill in last couple of weeks. Went through all changes and screwed ups in last 30 years. What do you think of Woodland Hills compounding that claims no synthetics. I’m hypo again and on HC . Tried synthroid.bad. I’ll make calls Tuesday to damn Acella
Dawn Kaplan
So on Acella’s NP Thyroid web page, at the bottom is written, “To report suspected adverse reactions, contact the FDA at (then the phone number and website of the FDA is listed). Not to be paranoid, but is this a set-up? This is crazy!
Andrea
Okay, just got my latest labs back, and my head is spinning. TSH is – wait for it – .04L (reference range 0.40-4.50 mIU/L). Say what????!!!! I was .13L in July on same dose of NP (90 mg/day). But it gets better (she says sarcastically)….and more confusing….! My Free T4 is 0.9 (reference range 0.8-1.8 ng/dL, and my Free T3 is 3.5 (reference range 2.3-4.2 pg/mL). My head is spinning right now. How can I be hypo with such a low TSH? And yes, something’s wrong with NP, for sure…
In the meantime, for some reason the report had not included the Reverse T3, so I have just requested that from the lab. Don’t know if that will help to figure this out though. Anybody…..?
Just Me
Andrea, look around STTM. You will learn that TSH means absolutely nothing when on NDT. It’s a pituitary hormone, not a thyroid hormone. That being said, everyone who has taken NP recently is tanking which means that there is definitely something wrong. I hope this gets straightened out ASAP.
Tracey
I have had the same exact experience Andrea. TSH going down on the same dose of NP, but feel the worst I have felt in a very long time. My NP after recent refill literally makes me feel like I am ingesting poison and rotting from the inside out. Found some old (and expired) NP in my closet. Been on this 2 days and feel like a completely different person. It has to be something in the fillers. It truly is bizarre.
Rima
Good morning to you all!
I had an interesting experience at Walgreen’s yesterday: I took my “new” bottle of 60mg NP, 8/22 from Walmart (distributed by McKesson), lot M330E19-1, to the Walgreen’s pharmacist. We compared those tabs to some of what I had left from my previous bottle, and to a fresh bottle lot M330C19-6 (dist. by Amerisource). My old script & the Walgreen’s product looked and smelled the same, quite different in color, from the Walmart product. The pharmacist said so immediately without my prompting! I bought a few from Walgreen’s and tested that this morning by chewing as normal. It tasted the same as the old ones.
So far, I have not heard back from my phone calls or emails to Acella. My next attempt will be to offer to send the script from Walmart/McKesson to Acella so they can see the difference. Will report back here.
Just Me
It’s not just Walmart. It seems to be every batch of NP.
Here’s my batches from my pharmacy (not Walmart)
60 mg Lot # M330G19-4
30 mg Lot # M329E19-3
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Amyiable
Please add me to the count of those having problems with NP Thyroid. This became noticeable with most recent script from Express Scripts. The 2 grain tablets were not available so the new script is for 1 grain tablets. I felt bad after just a few days, so flipped to an older batch and felt better. I’m back on the new batch and can see things are very wrong so I went to your STTM website. I sleep 8 plus hrs and have trouble staying awake during the day. How can I keep a job with this? In addition to heavy fatigue, and brain fog, I have depression without cause. Wanting to eat all the time. Also allergy like symptoms in throat. I do not see specks in the new tablets and can’t comment on smell or taste, but something is very wrong, I am not in a normal state at all. Thank you Janie, thank you! I’m going to email my doctor and ask for a switch Nature-throid.
Linda
I am new to NP Thyroid. Had a partial thyroidectomy in 2004, and was prescribed Levoxyl 100mcg. Was happy with Levoxyl until husband went on active duty and Tricare would only give Synthroid. Felt so sick on Synthroid, for the first time in my adult life thought I needed to call 911. Returned to Levoxyl when it came back. In the mean time noticed symptoms, thinning hair, sore joints, irritibility, etc. Now back on Tricare and was told no longer would be allowed to fill at pharmacy on post, would need to use Express Scripts. Since the cost to me was the same for Levoxyl and NP decided to ask to try natural. The first thing I noticed about my pills, was prescriged 90mg, is the terrible smell, thought this might be normal, first bottle. Commented to my daughter several times how awful they smelled and wondered if I smelled with summer heat. Had labs on 8/26, my tsh is 0.14, Free T4 0.8. Dr. reduced my dosage to 1 Gr. Received this from Express Scripts today. My first fill, 90MG had the normal tan color and smelled terrible. New fill, 60MG are a light tan color, smaller than 90MG and have what I would consider a normal smell, have to put your nose to top of bottle to smell anything and it is in no way offensive. The first fill 90MG could be smelled across the room. Like I said I had not idea this wasn’t normal, I expected some smell being they come from pigs.
Susie
I am trailing off on another theory or concerning issue with the production of NDTs. Last September (I think) Smithfield Farms the largest pork producing farm in the US was bought by a Chinese firm. The hogs are still raised in the US but the processing is done in China and then sent back to the US. Maybe the standards are not as stringent and then the glands are too long in transit diminishing quality and effectiveness. If we can confirm that all our sources come directly from US processing plant, then we can breathe easier on that theory, but in the meantime it is something to investigate.
Susie
ok, with a little investigation, Smithfield Foods was sold to a Chinese company back in 2013, but it appears this company processes here in the US? so if that’s the case that’s a better scenario. But sitll yet. if they are a source for NDT production, then is the quality and handling the same?
Maria
My pharmacy switched me from Armour to NP Thyroid (without notice) and at first I was upset. Did some research and thought I’d give it a go and was happy that the cost was less since my insurance won’t pay for it. Got a refill in July and only started taking it recently and OMG it’s VILE. Seriously disgusting. I take 90 mg cut in half once a day and chew it and haven’t had an issue tolerating it or the taste. But now? I can barely gag it down…and just what the heck am I putting in my body? I’ve only been on this reformulation for a few days but I am worried. My pharmacist didn’t know anything about a change though she said if there were one, they would be required to notify customers, and no such notification was sent to them from Acella. Why is this even allowed?
Angela
Ok now I’m completely freaked out. I was on Naturethroid a few years and couldn’t find it and my levels went crazy. Finally researched and changed to NP. I’ve only been on it about 2.5 months and not optimal yet but now I’m so afraid of what this might mean. Please please tell me there is a viable reason for this 🙁
Janie Bowthorpe
Zero viable reason.
Dawn Kaplan
I did my own experiment. I took the new pills this morning (90 mg with a 15 mg), crushed them and sprinkled dextrose on top. Immediately I had ringing in my ears, heart palps started a few minutes after, feeling like my back was on fire. About a half hour later, bloat, large tongue, brain fog, muscle aches.
I called a compounding pharmacy near me, talked to the pharmacist, he said to bring in the old and new pills. I went and he spent about 20 minutes with me. He definitely said the size, smell and color were different.
His thoughts: Acella changed the filler ingredients. Possibly removing the dextrose and/or mineral oil and using a less expensive additive, making the pill less compactible, changing the color, size and smell.
He also said he has not been able to get porcine powder for over two years, so could not make the compounded version even.
Now almost 4 hours after I took my morning dose, ringing in ears subsided, have muscle aches, fatigue. Brain fog gone, feel okay, not great.
Janie Bowthorpe
Wow, Dawn, you are quite the trooper for trying that experiment. Hope you get back to normal soon! Something is clearly wrong.
Dawn
Haha! Thanks Janie. I figured I have the nightmare pills, why not do it myself? Took my old pill for the afternoon. Have teen-agers at home for the long week-end. I need to be able to function. I can’t believe we’re back here with this nonsense.
Christina
I’m having issues as well. My 30 mg taste foul. They definitely are off. I’m feeling very run down. The pharmacist didn’t even know there was a change.
jacqueline collins hullar
Janie, To be as scientific about this as possible, what do you recommend we all do to verify what is happening? I am about to start my first “new/bad” batch of NP Thyroid. I have blood work from last month (almost optimal) based on being on the old version of NP (And Cytomel) on the same doses for over 6 months. ***How long should I take the new version of NP Thyroid (without changing anything else I attacking) and then re-test? I am a member of Adrenal Fatigue and Thyroid care and also their Experiment group on FB, so I will post about this there, with my before and after test results.
Janie Bowthorpe
The negative symptoms going on with the changed NP are already verified by the widespread reports. We have no report of anyone doing well on them.
Angie
I am on Armour as I can’t get NatureThroid here anymore. It’s been on back order because the manufacturer is in Puerto Rico and apparently their facility was damaged in a hurricane. That was over a year ago and I still can’t get NatureThroid. My latest batch of Armour does taste and smell pretty bad. I didn’t think much about it until I saw this because all meds smell and taste bad to me. I’ll ask my pharmacy who the manufacturer is. Now I’m wondering if I shouldn’t try a combo of something like levothyroxine and cytomel. Also, lately I’ve been wondering how the pigs are raised and killed. If they aren’t being humanely treated, I don’t know that I’d want to use Armour anyway. But that’s another issue for another day.
Janie Bowthorpe
It is supposedly false, repeatedly spread by rumor, that they had a manufacturing facility in Puerto Rico.
Also, all NDT has a smell. And some are worse than others. But the smell for the changed NP is far worse.
Yes, the combo can be a good idea. Just make sure to get optimal. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Diana
I got the new NP, and it smells and looks different. Scared to try it after the nightmare I went through with NatureThroid. One by one, they all go bad. Either they’re all getting their raw materials from the same place, and the source went bad, or there’s something shady going on. We need an investigative journalist or someone who can get answers.
Claudia
Any chemists and/or pharmacists out there? Some of you still have the old (smaller and non-stinky) pills AND the new (bigger and smellier) ones? How would one go about having the two looked at and compared?
I too noticed the new (bigger and much smellier) pills when I got my new bottle mailed to me the end of May. The ones before were just fine. Unfortunately I was in the middle of packing for our vacation and I used up all of my old (good) pills. Once back from vacation I started the new batch. Since then my T4 has been flagged low (???) and I’m feeling super hypo, just like all those years ago, when I first started out with symptoms. Thyroid and neck area ache, and so tired! I was perfect before and now back to my “mystery illness”!!!??? I got the lot# from my mail order pharmacy and have left 2 voicemails and one email for Acella. Will keep you posted!
Dawn Kaplan
I was the one that posted about crushing the medication and adding Dextrose (dextrose transports the medication quickly into the bloodstream). I am wondering if anyone who has the reformulated pills have tried this? I have about two months left of the old pills so I have not. Just curious, as this little trick worked for me for many years when Armour reformulated years ago. Thanks to anyone who has tried this and responds.
Lo Vetta Bosworth
Not sure where to put this. I just watched a copy of your video about NP Thyroid. Thank you for all you do. I’m trying to help you, as you requested. I take NP Thyroid by Acella. My current prescription is from May, so currently good, but worried as I just got a new prescription from Dr I haven’t filled yet. 😱
I saw a post on TPO60 that sounded like a possible answer to the X, but I can’t believe you haven’t seen this already. I’m sure you’re too busy to read as many posts on different thyroid sites as I do, so with the possibility of being redundant I’ll share it here. Emily?? Posted the following last week.
Regarding the changes to NP, someone mentioned this in one of the threads so I thought it might be worth bringing to the forefront. According to GoodRx, some NP is being manufactured by AvKARE (see attached screenshot). I wonder if the new smelly batches were made by AvKARE and not Acella? Also, as someone else has mentioned, it appears that Acella’s website no longer states that NP is made in the USA. I just checked the prescription insert and its says “Manufactured for” (not by) Acella, so I wonder where it’s being made?
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, I am horribly busy, but I did see that! And someone did report it to a guy at Acella.
AvKare is often used by pharms to produce their specified products.
Ana
AvKARE is a repackager not a manufacturer of pharmaceuticals. If you google them, you can pull up some legal troubles they’ve had. The VA used them for a time to supply generic drugs but stopped after visiting their facilities and finding them to have unacceptable practices. This raises questions about what company AvKARE subcontracted to manufacture the NP Thyroid. I also think there has been some change in the way the porcine thyroid powder is being processed. Naturethroid, WP Thyroid and now NP Thyroid have all had a similar diminishment in potency. That could at least partially account for the change in taste and smell and explain why RLC Labs and Acella have both insisted that they haven’t changed the formula.
Kriss
Well, that’s not good news about WP. My kiddo was on it until the shortage and then we switched to NP. We noticed he was doing well around January 2019, so we went on the Keto diet and he lost 50 lbs, BUT he’s back to his old habits of being hungry, has gained 10 lbs, feeling like crap and he noticed the NP pills stinking more than the normal smell and tasting horrible. I checked last week with a compounding pharmacy that I use, and they have WP back on their shelves, but now I’m wondering if that will make a difference. Should I try and go back to WP for my kid’s sake?
Janie Bowthorpe
We really are not getting strong feedback to know if WP is good still.
Kriss
Thank you…I’ve read the above posts. I have him try to chew them with a sweetner.
Abby
I’ve spoken with both customer service and the pharmacist at Acella about a week and a half ago). They are supposed to be working with my pharmacy to send me a new script and take the old one back for investigation but so far no new script. I left David in customer service a message today asking when I would get my new script but no return call.
I had a little over a weeks worth of extra 1 grain and I have felt so much better. Sadly I go back to the nasty 2 grain tomorrow. I even filled a new script and it’s the same:(
Michelle Sarchiapone
My lot # is N329E19-1. Refilled on Aug 20th….though I think the previous batch was also not effective even though it didnt have the same weird taste as my symptoms returned around then (end of July early August). New batch tastes horrible. In comparision I had a few days worth of 15mg tablets left over from Feb 2019 that as soon as I took them, I felt back to my old self. That bottle was clearly marked Acella with a NDC # of 42192-327-01? That medication had no taste or smell. The July/early August refill had a strong piggy smell, and the latest refill tastes like insecticide.
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Meaghan
I, too, switched to NP about 8 months ago due to the Nature Throid crisis. I can’t explain it but I immediately felt horrible once switching to NT. I could tell immediately that something was off with my recent batch of NP. I was feeling not perfect but good enough. One day on the new NP and I had some dizziness and extreme anxiety rev up. Now I am extremely sensitive and aware of my body, and probably slightly hypo yet, hence the almost immediate reaction. I think it just absorbs differently somehow. I Contacted Acella and they asked for my pharmacy to get the lot #. Never heard back from them.
My plan is to use up the good NP I have and switch to Armour. The “bad” nature throid time for me was absolutely debilitating. Don’t wanna do that again.
Big sigh. Not sure what to do about this but it put me into a complete tizzy and panic. “Not again!” I was just starting to be able to handle working again. Ugh!!!
So yes, just another one to confirm that the new NP is not the same.
Alex
Acella says: We do not use any API material sourced directly or indirectly from China or India“.
All NDT did work… as long as API material was sourced from China or India…
I have 5 bottles of NP: 2x 1/2 grain, 1x 1grain, 2x 2grain. The only one has LOT M330K17-3. The other bottles have no LOT numbers. I only could find the Rev. numbers inside the paper Lift here“. I don’t know if this numbers are important.
Hadassah
I would love to know if on the NP Thyroid label bottle it says Alpharetta GA 30005 is this the genuine good one ??? I would like to know what to be on the look out for please .
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Terry
Product Updates & Availability
NP Thyroid® Product Update
8/30/2019 Product Update : Providing updates and feedback about your questions related to NP Thyroid® is important. Our customer service has reported an increase in calls and emails related to the odor or taste of NP Thyroid®. We are also aware that there are some comments about this on social media sites. At Acella Pharmaceuticals, our priority has always been, and will continue to be, to provide our customers with quality, consistent and cost-effective products. Our API is sourced from FDA inspected facilities, and we manufacture NP Thyroid® in the USA to USP standards following cGMP practices. As a result of the upheaval in the desiccated thyroid market in the past few years, we have had to upgrade and expand our production capabilities to keep up with increasing demand for NP Thyroid®. We do not use any API material sourced directly or indirectly from China or India. Rest assured that our formulation, specifications and exacting quality standards for NP Thyroid® have remained consistent. NP Thyroid® is a product derived from natural sources, and you may notice the odor, taste and shade of our tablets may vary slightly from batch to batch. It is important to note, however, that we test each batch of NP Thyroid® to ensure that the finished product is within the USP (United States Pharmacopeia) specifications for T4 and T3. We have found no indication that slight variations in odor, color or size of the tablets affect their content, quality or consistency.
If you have any questions or concerns with NP Thyroid®, please contact us at info@acellapharma.com or (800) 541-4802. Moreover, if you experience a change in your thyroid related symptoms at any time, you should contact your licensed healthcare provider.
Janie Bowthorpe
If that is the only answer they are going to give in the face of the large variety of negative results by patients, it appears they will only continue to lose customers based on what people are saying.
Rita
I am sure their levels of T3/T4 are tested and are within range. If they are lying about this they could be up for huge class-action lawsuits.
But do they test them for effectiveness after changes with fillers/binders? I notice they did not say anything about that. So what if they test the thyroid levels in a lab, are they testing them in human subjects? Are these new stinky hard pills dissolving completely in our stomachs? Maybe the thyroid is there but it isn’t getting metabolized in our bodies properly because of fillers/binders/too compressed pills. Maybe we are just pooping them out!
I noticed since I started chewing up my Nature-throid I feel slightly hyper. Faster pulse, a little lightheaded; both of which indicate I am getting more T3 in my system.
I still think in all these newly reformulated NDT it is all about binders/fillers and we are just not digesting them properly.
Janie Bowthorpe
It is a suspicious aspect of all the changes…the binders and fillers.
Kim
I just saw this blog post, and it dawned on me that the refill that I picked up earlier this month looks and smells differently. It smells like urine as someone else mentioned. The taste is awful as well. I find it hard to believe nothing has changed?! My 60mg pills look differently and smell differently. That smell is the same as NT when I was taking it. It is the normal smell for the natural thyroid.
Has anyone received more facts from Acella?
The lot number for the pills I have is M328A19-3 but she didn’t sound too confident about this.
I left them a message this morning.
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Rachel
My prescription of 60mg matches up M330E 19-2
Dawn Kaplan
I have lot # M331E19-2 (90 mgs)
M331E19-3 (90 mgs)
M327E19-1 (15 mgs)
I called Acella and received a vm. This is frustrating. Do these lot numbers match up with anyone else’s?
Rachel
My”bad “ batch of 90 matches M331E19-3 and I have left messages for Acela customer service with no response either…and I am so furious because I just went through the Naturethroid fiasco just under ago
Rachel
My batch of “bad “ 90 matches to M331E19-3..I am afraid to take it I have 2 weeks left of the old batch and then what should I do? What are you doing? synthetic T3 and T4? So furious just went through the Naturethroid fiasco less than a yr ago
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Bev Smith
So are you saying that synthetic T4/T3 is now a better option than upping the dose of either NP Thyroid or Naturethroid?
Alex
No way to return to synthetics!!! Never ever!!! We all here want to have the NTDs that does work how it did work for years !!
Rita
I personally am upping my dose of Nature-throid and chewing up the pills before swallowing before I try synthetics. But if that doesn’t work then I have no choice. I think everyone probably could try upping their doses before giving up on NDT, you will know in 1-2 months if is helping. I am still convinced it is a binder/filler issue since all the reformulations don’t dissolve as easily.
I will say that since I upped Nature-throid from 1.5 to 2 grains and started chewing the pills I already feel better. It has been a week. More energy, hair loss slowing, sleeping well, losing a little weight. Will get bloodwork in 6 weeks to see how I am doing.
Janie Bowthorpe
Glad you let us know that chewing the pills has helped.
Renae
I can’t find Nature Thyroid in KC MO??
Janie Bowthorpe
Please keep us informed, Rita.
Rita
I will let you know my labs. Just need to be patient and let my body adjust to the changed dosage. If only it were as simple as chewing up pills! But at least Nature-throid doesn’t taste like insecticide like the new NP,
Rima
I just spoke with my pharmacist at Walmart who gave me the lot # M330E19-1 for my latest prescription ACE 60 mg dated 8/22/2019. (from the distributor McKesson in Georgia). The tablets taste awful!!!! I still have a few from the script dated 6/01/2019 so have been taking those, but only have 6 days left. I’ve been on this med for several years, and although I know that I am not optimal, I am way better than before!!!!
I am dealing with scleroderma, so much going in my body.
I have left several messages on the customer service line at Acella, sent a comment via the contact page and now just left a message with David Margulis, but no response yet. He did tell my pharmacist today that there have been no changes made in the formulation. I wonder if what has come on the market is a pirated version? There was quite a problem finding NPearlier this year, so maybe someone stepped in to fill the void.
Carol
I got the same lot from Walmart and mine are bad also.
Wendy Benton
I have been taking Acella for quite a few years, I had RAI done on my thyroid in 2006(worst mistake of my life.). Through a mix-up between my pharmacy and my doctor’s office I got a three month supply at the end of July and another three month a week and a half ago.
I broke a rib just over a week ago and of course had lots of pain, very hard to sleep or lay down. I had to go in to the doctor or they would not renew my thyroid prescription so I asked about my rib, I did not do an X-ray because we have no insurance. Two nights ago I was in terrible pain extremely ill feeling. I woke up about 1 am and felt like an elephant on my chest, my right breast area hurt and my throat area felt as if I swallowed something that stuck in there. I thought it was all related to my fractured rib. I had terrible diarrhea and vomited in the night. Now I believe all these other problems are related to the Acella. It has never, ever tasted this bad, I have always put it under my tongue and it would desolve. Now, to put it under the tongue leaves a horrible after taste that even water will not get rid of. My pharmacy is suppose to call me about the lot numbers and I will call in to the company but I have now paid for two prescriptions of 6 months total and went into the doctor again and had an X-ray because I thought there was some worse problem with my broken rib. This is going to be very expensive and we have no insurance. Very frustrating. I might also add that when I was checked at the doctors, everything seemed fine but my heart was racing and she(the doctor) attributed it to my pain from the rib.
Alex
Wendy Benton, what you describe:” …I felt like an elephant on my chest, my right breast area hurt and my throat area felt as if I swallowed something that stuck in there…” I have every time after taking NP Thyroid. That is such an awful pain that I can nothing do and nothing thing… only lie in bed… That’s such an awful pain that I thought already I have the breast cancer at a very late stage… This pain starts in my left breast and spreads in all my upper abdomen. First I couldn’t believe it coms from NP. But if I didn’t take NP for one or two days then I didn’t have this pain…. This is so tragic what happens to us all…
Wendy Benton
Alex, I am sorry t hear that. I do not understand what is in the pills that would cause this to happen?
DeeCan
So after reading many of the comments, this is Deja vu all over again. Happened with ERFA in 2015. And I figure it will be the same conclusion in this conversation. No one will know, or find out, EXACTLY what is going on or what happened with our NDT. Just sign me, Extremely Hypothyroid With ZERO Hope. I guess people with Hashimoto’s/hypothyroidism are just expected to crawl through life until we die. Sorry so pessimistic.
Terri
Was stable on both Armour and Naturethroid for about 5 years (have no thyroid due to Graves Disease RAI)… I alternated both products over the years, as both were effective. However got terribly hypo in May 2019 when I started a new bottle of Armour 97.5mg. Have been on a new bottle of Armour at a slightly higher dose and its still not working, even though the batch numbers must be different lots. Switching to Synthroid for now and will work with my integrative doctor to get re-stabilized. Hopefully the manufacturers will get back on track with proper quality control so we can have our preferred medicines back! Just sharing that Armour still isn’t working for me.
Janie Bowthorpe
FYI: no one is going to do well on only 97.5mg. That is underdosing. We have to be optimal, which puts the free T3 at the top part of the range and free T4 midrange.
Terri
Thanks Janie– for years at 97.5 my TSH was in the 2.5 range and the other numbers were OK and I felt good. I really appreciate all that you do and thank you so much!
Catherine
I started NP thyroid April 2019. I am new to NDT. However, I suffered greatly when increased from 30 mg pills to 60 mg pills in June. I suffered an entire weekend in bed with chills and muscle fatigue. I also broke a toe. My entire body went down. I could barely function and could not even force myself. (Which is what I usually do)
I knew it was a bad batch immediately as I once suffered the same on Synthroid several years ago when getting a bad batch. I contacted Acella and put in a complaint. They never got back to me afterwards or replaced the bad batch.
However, I will not go near the 60 mg pills since that day. I had my doctor prescribe all my pills as 30g pills for 90 days and have since then increased from 2 grains to 3 grains. However, I soon start a new batch of 30’s and so who knows.
Maybe the change started with the 60’s? I wont touch them as i was far sicker than I have ever been even when not medicated at all. I know when my thyroid goes down and that is exactly what happened on the 60 mg pills.
This news is very discouraging as I have suffered greatly and worked hard to get to the 3 grain dose I am on now. I have half a thyroid due to thyroid cancer and am a single mother of two small children who works full time. I must function whether I like it or not. I am allergic to Armour and levothyroxine and suffered horrible joint pain and damaged knees on Synthroid and so where do I go from here?
Janie Bowthorpe
Next potential step: T4/T3 and geting optimal, or the over the counter natural thyroid supplements like Thyrogold and etc and getting optimal. They are both seemingly working well for patients if optimal.
Marianne
I was optimal and in complete remission in October 2018, on Naturethroid (32.5 tabs x 4 daily)…I wanted to see if i could feel even better, so i stopped that and tried thyroid gold beginning jan 8, 2019. First the pills are too big and i found one was not enough but two sent me hyper for sure… But worse, my follow up labs showed I had moved just barely out of remission! Was it the added iodine? IDK. WP became available, but I had already upset the apple cart and my TPO antibodies have continued to rise.
karen l ivey
Found a dr to prescribe ndt, I chose np thyroid. I am no where near optimal and we are raising. I was on day 6 of a an increase feeling better and then it felt like i had hit a brick wall. Heart rate starts dropping, constipated again fatigue is returning, in a matter of days I could feel it. I messaged the dr and said something is the matter and I dont know what. Then I saw the facebook post about np thyroid. I had gotten my prescription a week early and mixed the bottles, sure enough i still had 5 old tablets left.
Tracy
I just talked with Steve. He informed me that he is not aware of any formula changes. However, he said that he couldn’t confirm that there were no formula changes. 🤔 My last refill was half good half bad. My new refill is all bad. Smells like cat piss! It is also has more shine, is thicker and lighter in color. It also takes much longer to dissolve under my tongue. My personal belief is that there was a formulation change. Ugh!!!!
Emily
Tracy, do you have a phone number for Steve?
tracy
(678) 581-4436 Steve
Lynn
I had taken Naturethroid for years without issue starting at 1/4 grain and increasing to one grain. January 2019 thru May 2019 I was switched to WP without being told or noticing. In June 2019 they said they got Naturethroid back and could switch me back so I did. Mid June I started losing a huge amount of hair, fatigue, joint pain and itchy. My gyno was insisting it was low estrogen until I read about the problems with Naturethroid and got her to switch me to NP if I agreed to take estrogen. After two weeks, the hair loss stopped and at the month mark my labs were better but my estrogen is lower than before. I assumed that all was good because of the hair but now the fatigue is getting worse as is the joint pain which led me to research NP and discover it is bad now too. My first month of NP was 4 x 15 mg and latest is 1 x 60 mg. Comparing the two, the 60 mg smells horrible. Maybe I got a good then bad batch. Could my hair loss have stopped but the other symptoms gotten worse including burning feeling in muscles? I was thinking that maybe something else is wrong with me. This is like a puzzle. Since I am barely functioning I am going to try the two days I have left of the old. I also have Naturethroid from 2013. Would I really screw myself up taking that? It has been so nice to have my remaining hair staying on my head that I don’t know what to do.
Emily
Thank you, Debby, for keeping us apprised of your conversations with Acella. I have contacted them twice via their website and have left a message at the number Janie has posted. I have not heard back from them yet I so will try the number that you provided for David. I’m not as concerned about color changes, but the larger size and strong ammonia smell (if you have a cat litter box in your home, you’ll recognize the smell) of the new batch has me very concerned about the strength and purity of the new tablets. The last time I encountered med problems (with Mylan’s generic synthetic T4) and got no response from the manufacturer, I reported the problem to the FDA and was surprised at how quickly a Mylan representative contacted me. We may have to do the same with NP if we don’t get satisfaction from Acella.
Anby
The FDA was notified. It’s the policy that when a patient reports issues.
Becky
I just got off the phone with Steve at Acella. I had filled out their contact form last night – and they actually called me. He was very concerned, spent a long time with me and took down a very thorough description of my situation. He’s going to call Walgreens for my lot number and also sending me an envelope to send them some of the new pills to test. He assured me they have not changed the formula or processing method but they’re trying to get to the bottom of this. I’m guessing maybe it’s an issue with the source? I got a mix of the old and new pills in my last 90 day refill. I immediately noticed a difference in color and taste, but the pharmacist assured me it was the same medicine. After a couple weeks of taking a mixture of the two, I noticed worsening hypo symptoms – and it just so happened that I had bloodwork at that time. My TSH went from 0.4 to 1.9 and my free T3 was down to 0.8 – below normal. With just two weeks of a mixture of the old and new pills. When I realized what was going on, I divided out the pills so I’m just taking the old ones now and already feel better after just 3 days. My problem is I absolutely cannot take synthetic – it’s not a matter of preference – I ended up in the ER back in the winter when a new endo insisted I try synthetic. I had done fine on Armour for 15 years until the new formulation – which is why I switched to NP about 3 years ago. Now I don’t know what I’ll do if they can’t get the NP right. Thanks everyone for your stories. I was relieved to know it wasn’t just me. Although not relieved to find out it’s worse than just one bad batch. I encourage you to contact Acella. If they know how many people are affected, hopefully they’ll figure out a resolution.
Emily
Debby, did Steve give you his contact phone number or an e-mail address to contact him directly? I contacted them several days ago through both the Acella and NP Thyroid websites and have yet to hear from anyone. 🙁
Connie Marie
I spoke with David from Acella. His number is (678)-467-5415.
Kim
Becky,
I see that you say you cannot use synthetic, have you tried Tironsint? If so what were your symptoms? I tried Tirosint and have had no issues with it, but the other synthetics make me sick too.
Janie Bowthorpe
But…even tho Tirosint works better than the other T4’s, it appears, it is still problematic to force the body to live for conversion to T3 alone. We all seem to need direct T3, which is also how a healthy thyroid behaves–producing some direct T3.
Becky
Kim,
Actually, yes, I tried Tirosint. In fact, I was doing fair on a levo/cytomel combo for about a month when I tried Tirosint which triggered the reaction. Itching and extreme anxiety, insomnia, fever, hyper symptoms. After that, I couldn’t even tolerate the smallest dose of levo in any form, including synthroid brand. A compounding pharmacist told me a lot of people do better on compounded t4/t3 because it doesn’t have the fillers. So I may cautiously try that if I have to. And may give Armour another try. I have appt with new Dr next week so I’m hoping she has suggestions. I feel like I might have adrenal and Rt3 issues that need to be addressed too.
Debbie T.
back again. well, David called back to say that AvKare repackages in smaller quantities, that ONLY Acella manufactures NP and that……”nothing has changed.” 🤔 He also said if anyone has questions to call, so here is his direct phone #: 678-325-5306
Debbie T.
okay folks…..so I just got a call back from David Margulis, Sr. Manager of Customer Service. I told him about the two different images on the GoodRx website and that one of them states it is “manufactured by AvKARE, Inc.”. He seemed very concerned and baffled, and that Acella was the ONLY manufacturer of NP. He said he would look into it and call me back. I also mentioned that I belong to several thyroid support groups and there has been a lot of discussion about new Rx fills looking/tasting/smelling/working differently, and I’d appreciate any information he can send my way. I will update again when I hear from him. Stay tuned…..
housemaid
I am confused because when I look at the Good Rx website, I see photos of the front and back of the NP thyroid pills and they look the same as usual. I also see nothing about it being manufactured by AvKARE. Maybe Good Rx uses different photos for different parts of the country? My recent 3 month refill of NP was a good batch. I don’t think I would just take more of a batch that smells like cat piss, hoping that might make it work. It could be adulterated and dangerous for all I know.
Cincolo
If they only repackage, why would their pills look different? https://www.goodrx.com/np%20thyroid/images However, looking at the AvKare website, NP or thyroid medication isn’t mentioned at all in their catalog. https://www.avkare.com/products/pharma
Tammy
Acella has a contact us link on their corporate web page. I suggest everyone unhappy with the new formula use it. They need to hear from us.Quote from their mission statement
We are committed to developing, manufacturing, and distributing products that meet the highest quality standards through compliance with all applicable regulatory requirements.
Ha
kim
been on Np thyroid for 2 years take 120mg x2 plus 60 so 300 total needed refill about 2 months ago was told 120 was on backorder so they would give me 90×4 plus 1- 30. mind you my labs were great finally and I was losing some pounds I took the pills as usual and the taste was horrible I almost threw up tasted like hoe cat pee smells if that makes sense well since then I have been so fatigue I bareley make it threw the day and my pain is all back weight gain and losing hair so I guess I may need to try something
Janie Bowthorpe
Almost sounds as if there is no thyroid in the tablet! Or it’s being royally blocked.
Victoria Connolly
My 60 mg tabs, filled yesterday are different than ones filled in June. Contrary to what others are saying the old ones did smell, the new ones shockingly have no odor. The new ones are greyer, mor mottled and larger than the old supply.I have just become optimal in past couple months. So worried now.
Cincolo
I never put 2 and 2 together. I assumed my starting to nod off at 9 p.m. was just because I needed to increase my dose. I did increase my dose, but even then I’m still more fatigued than usual. I now believe my 6-8 lb weight gain the last 2 months is also from this. This is different than what Armour and Naturethroid changed. I was on both of those and saw the same signs-pills were harder with less porcine smell. These new pills have a really strong smell, and I think they actually dissolve faster. Maybe they changed a filler or took one out all together…. Regardless, I wish there was a law preventing them from changing medications without publishing exactly what they modify. This was the last option for many of us that have done well on NDT (since Armour and Naturethroid changed their formulas and many of us didn’t do well on the new formulas).
Betty White
I don’t understand the above article that says acella is looking into the lot numbers that are not working for some. Since all the new ones look the same shouldn’t all of them not work?
Janie Bowthorpe
The amount of new “batches” out there may have different lot numbers. We don’t have all the answers, but at least they are willing to look into the batches/lot numbers that represent the changed tablets.
Judy
Hi. I just called Acella pharmaceutical. Left message gave them the lot number for my refill I just picked up this morning at cvs
Honestly. Someone mentioned it smells like a litter box That is the truth. Smells like dry urine And the taste still a bit sweet. But horrible I hope that giving them the lot numbers. They can get to the bottom of what’s going on
Thanks to
Lisa
I chew my NDT tablet so I have not noticed any change in my symptoms. I noticed earlier this year they had a more porkier smell but they till still tasted sweet when I chewed them. They smell really bad now but they don’t taste bad when I chew them and like I said above my symptoms have not worsened.
Renee
I was a loyal WP thyroid patient, but switched to NP thyroid after WP became unavailable. I tried Naturethroid before I went over to NP, but I got really sick on it. It took a lot of fiddling with the NP dosage and making dietary changes and getting LOTS of blood work, but I finally found a good dosage at 120 mg. I’ve been doing great for many months! But, the last ten days or so I’ve noticed a lot of fatigue that I didn’t have before. I find myself yawning in the middle of the day and I never do that. Now I’ve also noticed that old feeling I used to get in my arms. One of my weird symptoms is that my upper arms get so tired that I have to rest them in the middle of blow drying my hair. My eyes are super dry and I NEVER had that problem before. I also find that I am having anxiety again. The kind that hits me out of nowhere and for no reason. I got a new bottle of NP a few weeks ago. My pharmacist told me that they couldn’t get the 120 mg tablets, so they substituted with 60 mg tablets. So I take two pills instead of just the one. My pills have always had a bad odor so I cannot attest to the change in smell. They smell just as bad to me now as they always did. But, after reading all these comments, I guess it’s time to call the doctor yet once again for blood work yet once again so I can mess with the dosage yet once again. I SO wish I could get off this ride. It depresses the h*ll out of me to know that I am tethered to thyroid meds for the rest of my life. I hate being at the mercy of these companies.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. It is very common to start feeling good on to low doses of NDT. But it eventually backfires, as the total dose is not enough for one’s daily needs over time.
I’m saying this because it’s very uncommon for two grains to be enough. That’s why it was very important to have watched the free T3 and free T4 and have gotten optimal. An optimal dose turns out to be enough for one’s daily needs, so it doesn’t backfire.
Ally
Agree, Renee! I am also tired of chasing down Rx when primary pharm is out of stock and now this latest batch is making me physically ill (gag to get down, needed a 2 hour afternoon nap, headache, nausea, diarrhea, and heaving sweating episode). I am currently researching holistic protocols to see if I can find a way to heal the Hashimoto/hypothy – many day “not possible” but cells are continually rebuilding. I am currently considering 3 diff protocols; I want off this insane ride.
Janie Bowthorpe
That is horribly profound that after taking the latest batch, you needed a 2 hour afternoon nap, had a headache, nausea, diarrhea, and heaving sweating episode. That is simply BIZARRE.
Judy
Ally, when the big recall happened almost a year ago, I concluded the same, that I just have to heal so that I don’t need medication anymore. What protocols have you found that could be healing? It’s very very scary to think that we are dependent on a medication for the rest of our lives and that the medication’s availability is highly unpredictable. The stress of all that is enough to make anyone very sick, so the stress of just trying to get the meds is making us sicker, which is really insane, since the medication is supposed to be helping! Like you said, the cells are always rebuilding. Our bodies are always trying to achieve balance.
Renee
Hi Everyone,
I just called my pharmacy. They refilled my NP thyroid script a few weeks ago. As I stated above in my previous comment, they were unable to provide me with the 120 mg pill, so they had to give me 60 mg, meaning I have to take two of them instead of one.
They gave me a 90 day refill. I asked for the lot number. I was told that they used FOUR different lot numbers and mixed them all together in one bottle. I asked if they could tell me how many of each lot # I was given and they said they could not.
In one bottle, I was given lot # M330L18-1, #M330B19-2, #M330C19-5 and #M330C19-3. He assured me this is a common practice to mix several or many lot numbers together. Does anyone have any or all of these lot numbers too, and if so, is anyone having issues?
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Stephanie Gundrum
Sooo……I thought I was being paranoid or just a complainer. Just made a move from Illinois to Texas in June and got my refill in May (120 mg in the a.m. NP). I too thought they tasted and smelled weird and seemed fatter. I was not optimal before, but definitely feel like I just can’t get going. I just chalked it up to the huge move and getting acclimated. I could basically sleep at any time of the day, except late evening- figures, my hair has gotten more brittle and just can not get motivated to get on my good routine of healthy nutrition again.
Guess I will be making a call. But now I need to find a new doctor in Texas to work with me.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yep, not being optimal means there is going to be a return of hypothyroid symptoms. But…we are now pretty sure we are seeing even worse hypothyroid symptoms for those on NP and who weren’t optimal. i.e. worse hypothyroid symptoms on top of the ones that were destined to come back anyway.
Stephanie Gundrum
I am considering ordering Thyro-Gold again. I was using it a few years ago and it helped symptoms but was hard to get the dosage just right.
Laralee
Where in Texas? I know a good doctor in San Antonio.
Rita
I have a question. So all of our NDT have been reformulated now apparently, and all don’t seem to be as effective.
Has anyone seen any real numbers on whether taking higher doses and crushing the pills of the newer versions has worked? Maybe people expect their old dose to work so rather than raise it they just switch? Or they have doctors who won’t raise the dose because they only look at TSH and not the frees, so they blame the pills?
Could this be as simple as just too many fillers/bad fillers and increasing doses, crushing pills would be the fix?
I ask this because both the old Nature-thyroid and NP were easily dissolved under the tongue and both the new version aren’t.
I am testing my theory with Nature-throid, will report my results in two months. Increased dose, crushing the pills. Keeping my fingers crossed, but several days in I feel great.
Deanna Walden
After months of going from pharmacy to pharmacy searching for my Np, I was delighted when CVS called and said they got it in last month. I started them and the taste reminds me of what cat pee must taste like!! After a few weeks I began being tired and having body aches, did not relate this to the NP because I recently had surgery. After I read this it all made sense. I have read about Throvanz? It is made from cows and doesn’t need a prescription has anyone had any luck with this?
Delaena Ganske
I am not on NP but was on Armour and when it changed, my symptoms came back full on. Then I switched to Naturethyroid and still fee ok but haven’t checked recently. What is the alternative if all of our options go bad?? Will we be forced to go to Synthroid or equivalent?
Thanks for the notice on this
Janie Bowthorpe
Alternatives are right in the blog post.
Cincolo.
You could also try a compounded pharmacy. Certain Walgreens even do compounded. https://www.walgreens.com/topic/faq/questionandanswer.jsp?questionTierId=700008&faqId=1200068
Martin Loiselle
Walgreens may compound but I am not familiar with any that are stocking NDT right now. It’s possible but not likely.
Russ
I would like to know if anybody reading these posts has actually tried a synthetic compounded T4/T3 formulation.
If so, how did it work for you?
My new Dr. told me that they can custom formulate the T4/T3 ratios to achieve optimal results, but for now I’m still on NP.
What do you think?
Cincolo
Do you belong to any Hashimoto’s/hypthyroid Facebook groups? You will likely get some responses there if no one responds here. I know of an admin in one of the groups who does compounded with excellent results.
Rachel
Have been on NP Thyroid for years after the debacle with Armour and then Erfa. After switching Endos ( the last 2 wanted to downgrade me from 90 as my TSH was too low but tried 75 for 2 months just to prove a point to them and felt absolutely terrible. Now with new fabulous Endo I am on 60mg twice a day and am optimal. Just received 3 months supply from Express Scripts but they are definitely different from previous tablets in smell and taste. They don’t dissolve easily when I sublingual and they don’t have the same sweet taste ( believe it or not I just assume that my pig pills have a stinky smell and taste and I don’t mind- it is after all a pig pill :).They are bigger and grey in colour and the LOT number is M330E192 and have AP on one side and 330 on the other
I don’t want to even experiment with this new lot as have just started to feel SO much better on higher dose and remember how much I struggled under the Armour change.. Express Scripts suggested going to local pharmacy to see if they can override the prescription and give me a new order for 30 days but they can’t guarantee its not from the same LOT.
Will try this and see if a new order might be like the old ones otherwise I will have to raid my piggy bank and fork out for compounded NDT.
Does this LOT number resonate with anyone who is currently struggling on the newer NP?
.
Cincolo
I can’t find my lot number on my medication from Sam’s Club. There is no expiration date on my bottle either. Goodrx says: Bottles and vials-Drug bottles will often have the lot number printed next to the expiration date, either by the barcode (1) or underneath the dosing instructions (2).
Cincolo
Sam’s Club says they don’t keep a record of the lot numbers! What if there was a recall??? I wonder if this pharmacist knew what she was talking about.
Andrea
Just picked up new prescription NP Thyroid. Can’t tell by looking at tabs, may need magnifying glass for that. But the smell is definitely bad, definitely noticeable. I won’t start these new ones until next week. Having labs done this week however, and meeting with doctor on September 11th to discuss all this. Will continue to update.
Lily Richardson
I really don’t know where to turn. I am in the process of changing doctors. Had 1st Appointment with the new doctor 2 weeks ago. He raised my dose of NP thyroid (from 30mg+15mg) to ONE 60mg pill of NP thyroid. (plus Cytomel) I had a very sickening reaction after just 3 days of taking the new NP 60mg pills, and have been sick in bed with flu-like symptoms for over 5 days. I had not dumped my old doctor yet, so have gone back to taking the 30mg + 15 mg. dose and have added another 15mg pill of NP thyroid (until it runs out, since I am now double dosing the 15mg pill.) Long story short — the new doctor mentioned his wife takes WP Thyroid – “because of less fillers.” I am wondering if I should ask him to prescribe WP for me now? I started on Synthroid perhaps 10 years ago, then had good luck with Armour, then it was not available, so have been on NP Thyroid for perhaps 4 years or so. Now this has happened. Where can I find info about the status of WP Thyroid? (And if it has had problems like the others?) I think that is perhaps the direction I should try to go. I have really been sick with flu-like symptoms and am really afraid to take any more NP Thyroid 60mg. pills. I cannot believe the NDT drug makers screw around with the ingredients. You just know if this was happening with a heart medication, it would make it on the evening news.
Ellen
Since taking the new smelly NP pills, my feet ache so much, my fatigue is heightened, my eyes are dry, and I feel out of it most of the day. Nothing else has changed. With a new smell and new look, it is quite obvious they screwed this pill up. I will report the batch number to Acella and will stop taking it.
Tammy
I take NP Thyroid twice a day, 90 in am, 60 in early afternoon. Both were refilled at the same and both smell and taste horrible.
I haven’t noticed any changes yet, I’m due for labs in a few weeks. Fingers crossed.
Sad they changed but glad it wasn’t just my imagination.
Jeanette
I was switched to NP thyroid when it was impossible to get WP Thyroid anymore last fall. It has been a downhill slide since then and worse with each refill. Fatigue, always cold, hair shedding alot and a 15 lb weight gain. My labs aren’t terrible but not optimal. I also take T3 because I had an issue with high RT3. Feel relieved to learn this may be an issue with the product. Armour stopped working for me when they did their reformulation. So I actually may ask for synthroid.
Janie Bowthorpe
Instead of just “asking for Synthroid”, ask for BOTH T4 and T3 as separate medications. And Tirosint may be a better T4 than Synthroid to add to T3.
Ann
I checked into getting Tirosint but it is extremely expensive. I even checked with goodrx. Outrageous Price! So synthroid and cytomel may be the cheapest.
Janie Bowthorpe
Lots of people have noticed that. Sad. Synthroid or other versions will be fine.
Donna
So if I was taking 120 NP just started in May 2019 how would that convert to synthetic T4 T3. I think my first 30 tabs were good ones but the next were the the spotted stinky ones. Would rather get a head of these before the damage starts.
Jeanette
Donna I need to know this information also since I take 120 mg of NP. What would the conversion be with T4 and T3 meds.
Janie Bowthorpe
One grain is 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3.
Cincolo
1 grain NDT contains 38mcg T4 and 9mcg T3. Doubling that would be 76mcg T4 (or 75 for measurement consistency) and 18mcg T3 (you could do 15 or 20 again for measurement consistency). https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/armour-vs-other-brands/
Laurie
I switched from Synthroid to NatureThroid because I wanted something natural and not synthetic. My labs became wonky and all of my hypo symptoms returned. So, I took the dive and switched to a compounded version. I feel 100% better now and will never go back to anything else. My advise is to find a trustworthy compounding pharmacy. Yes, it is much more expensive, but know that your dr can precisely tweak your script as your body needs in order to stay optimal! There is nothing more important than your health!
Janie Bowthorpe
Most compounding pharmacies are simply compounding the two synthetics, by the way.
Cincolo
Well that’s good to know! I assumed they’d add the other NDT components also. I will confirm with the pharmacy I’m looking into to see if they do this. If not, it’s likely cheaper to just buy the 2 synthetics.
Martin Loiselle
Our pharmacy does not add the synthetics. We use only natural desiccated thyroid. We would not be able to provide the two synthetics combined if we received a prescription for natural desiccated thyroid – we would only provide what is on the prescription. I am glad you are feeling better, Laurie!
Judy
Martin, how are you able to get NDT? My pharmacy of many years has been unable to get NDT since the recall happened almost a year ago. I wish I knew of a compounding pharmacy to use. Do you use any fillers?
Cincolo
Martin, can you give us your pharmacy name? I guess it would only be beneficial if they did mail order though.
TD
@Judy, @Cincolo:
His name has a hyperlink, if you click it goes to https://www.woodlandhillspharmacy.com/ which is in CA.
I went there and found a blog post from a few days ago that answers your question, @Judy. It is “USP Thyroid” – that’s the same ingredient that all of the manufacturers use for NDT. They just use different formulations of inactive ingredients, which can effect how it is absorbed, etc.
I have no affiliation with woodlandhills pharmacy or Martin, but here is the post I’m referencing: https://www.woodlandhillspharmacy.com/acella-np-thyroid/
Hope that helps. I’m just as frustrated as everyone…
Gin
I was on nature throid for a few years and felt great and then slowly started to get hypo symptoms. Then switched to NP over a year ago but it started giving me heart palpitations for almost a year even with different dosages. Tried to get on WP but can’t find in stock so I am back to nature throid. Ugh
Terry
Mine smell like cat pee
Have been having trouble breathing since starting new refill of 90
Janie Bowthorpe
90 mg wouldn’t have been optimal at all. It underdoses everyone. But if the tablets are messed up, it won’t help to raise them, we think. It’s better to go to both synthetic T4 and synthetic T4 and get optimal.
Terry
I was taking 105 (90 +15) the old pills but after 10 weeks I started having really high pulse and blood pressure. So went down to 90 and it all went away. It scared the hell out of me.
I have done really good on 90 it’s been about 5 weeks now my ft3 on the 105 was 3.0
So I should just keep increasing and keep have horrible pulse and blood pressure to get to the upper ft3 ?
Janie Bowthorpe
If you had all that on the old and good pill, which we know works great compared to the new one, you may have just gotten that high pulse and BP from staying on too low a dose too long. We don’t stay on those lower doses much longer than two weeks without raising. We then slow down in the 2-3 grain area to see how close we are to optimal…or not.
Samantha
I DONT FEEL CRAZY! I kept asking around and around about changes in NP and no one said they saw a change. I noticed a change when I picked up my batch back in early May. I told my doctor all of the sudden something changed. My heart palps we’re back. My body wasn’t tolerating the medication like I was. It was almost IMMEDIATE. I was 9 months TT and before that was doing fairly well on it!! Then boom, I even bought 2 more bottles and the same thing. I didn’t have the reaction on the newly formulated WP (which isn’t great) the doctor said it must be my body not needing t3 anymore. Needless to say it’s been a hellish 4 months being put back on synthetics. Now I’ll tell my doctor and try armour! Wish I trusted my gut!! I knew something had changed.
Jeanne
I have not had a thyroid since 1998… I was on Armour for years with no problems, then ERFA until their issues, then Naturethroid – no problems, felt great, just couldn’t get it. I switched to NP in May of this year.. first month fine. Second refill and a month and a half later.. I am terribly unwell. I was hospitalized for another issue and was thinking I was feeling bad from that. NOT — after reading here about Acella, as as test I took Naturethroid today… NO PROBLEMS OR FEELING TERRIBLE. The only way I can describe what it was doing to me was how I felt when years ago I tried synthyroid — extremely fatigued to the point of non-functioning, like I was being “force fed” something terrible, or poisoned. I am guess I am hypo and/or my body isn’t converting it. Have full thyroid panel done Thurs so I’ll see where I am, but even if my numbers are okay… my body DOESN’T like NP. I am on 2.5 grains (divided dose) per day.
Fortunately I have the lot #’s. But now I am in a quandry as to WHAT am I going to take. 🙁
Dawn Kaplan
I just received my replacement rx from Express Scripts. It’s identical to the pills they sent me for my last refill. This is aggravating.
Rae
Switched to NP Acella in May based on some positive reviews from this site and elsewhere, and immediately felt horrible. Tired + weird feeling, which lead to anxiety and basically a return of debilitating fatigue.
After two weeks of that terribleness I switched to Armor, have to pay out of pocket, but I will never take NP again. Horrible.
Jenell
I was finally feeling better, being active, but since I got my refill I’m literally feeling, extremely fatigued again, and depressed.
Mr Anybody
I was on Naturethroid two years ago this month and felt good.
Then came the shortage and I landed on NP, things have gone down hill since.
I haven’t worked in a year and it’s very difficult for me to walk now.
Janie Bowthorpe
Mr, that sounds more like you’ve been underdosing yourself if this has been going on a year.
Michelle Sarchiapone
Anyone have any suggestions on how to get the old formulation of NP?? Could I call pharmacies??
Janeen
I switched from Naturethroid to NP when it became scarce. I have never had an issue on NP nor seen a change in the pill itself. Had it always smelled? Yep! I take 2 grains in the morning and 3 in the afternoon. It almost seems like going back to synthetic, even though I hate the thought, is going to happen eventually. I wonder if there is a doc out there that will prescribe me 45mgs if T3 without having a tantrum. 😂
Robyn
My Dr switched me to NP in early May and raised my dose, and I have not felt any better at all. I am fatigued all the time. My dr chalked it up to not sleeping well.
I was not optimal beforehand, but wa a looking forward to feeling better on this recommended NDT
Bonnie Rasmussen
Hello Janie,
I am very concerned about the changes made to NP. Nature did the same thing and I got so hypo it took forever to recover from that. I read the 5 options you posted on this page. Would option 6 be to take a compounded natural desiccated tablet? I have never been to a compounding pharmacy. Are compounded pharmacies also experiencing shortages? If compounded medications have less fillers then would this be a good option? Does it matter which compounded pharmacy I use?
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s possible if they actually have a source of NDT powder (many don’t) and if it’s a good source…
Martin Loiselle
Our compounding pharmacy has NDT powder in stock and we rarely run out. We provide it in capsules with one filler and no other additives. It does need to have one filler but we have options and can even look into alternative fillers sometimes at the request of the patient.
Linda Dorcely
I am on 65mg Nature-throid. I felt great for the longest time. Wondering why I started feeling like crap 6 to 8 months ago. I started researching online and thru sites like this found out I am not the only one. Just thought I would write a post for anyone else who may be searching for answers. You are not the only one. Apparently, Nature-throid has changed their formula. My achy body has returned, by 4:30pm I am dead tired, I feel anxious or neurotic at times, and unusually warm. Typically, I am the one that is cold but now it seems I’m hotter than everyone else. I am going to ask my doctor to switch me to synthetics until whatever is going on with NDTs settles down.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Linda. The problem is that at first, nearly anyone is going to feel good on a too-low dose of NDT. 65 mg is definitely too low. It’s simply a starting dose. But eventually, being too low, which is suppressing more than replacing, backfires. You are most likely experiencing that backfire with a return of hypo, not just that it’s changed. But switching to synthetic T4 with synthetic T3 is a good thing. BUT this time, get optimal!! Optimal puts the free T3 at the top part of the range, and free T4 midrange. Both.
And you probably need to test your four iron labs. As low as you’ve been, there’s a chance they might be at inadequate levels due to still being hypothyroid. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/iron
Also consider doing what’s on this page, since adrenals become stressed from being too low, as well: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info
Rita
Linda, have you tried raising your dose of Nature-throid? I was also happily on 65 mg for over 10 years (crazy,right?) and since Jan 2017 had problems. I finally got a doctor who ignores TSH and pays attention to free T4,T3 and started raising my dose. I had just switched to NP for 3 months since I read here it was better, but now am back on Naturethroid. Trying 130 mg (2 grains) now. Will see how my bloodwork is in 2 months. The pills are hard so I am chewing them up before swallowing them. I also get labs 24 hrs after taking my pill, another change. If my numbers don’t get better on 2-3 grains I will try Armour. But so expensive!
Has anyone had success with Naturethroid after the reformulation by both raising their dose and chewing the pills? The original Naturethroid was softer and dissolved easily. Maybe if it is chewed up it will
work better as reported about Armour? Worth a shot since NP is suspect now.
I just can’t take the new NP, it smells and tastes toxic.
Cincolo
Two years ago when Naturethroid changed their formula, I tried chewing the pills for a couple weeks to see if there was any improvement. It did not make any difference for me.
Renee
My doctor switched me to NP thyroid about 6 months ago. I had been taking Nature Throid previously. I felt so much better after starting NP. I was finally starting to lose a little weight and I had energy for the first time in a long time. He prescribes a 60 day supply for me. My first bottle of it was amazing! I had even forgotten how crappy I had been feeling until I picked up my refill. The smell was horrendous! But, I just figured that maybe I just wasn’t used to the smell of this brand. After I started taking my new refill I immediately began feeling like crap again. Literally every symptom I had ever experienced came right back. It took me a little while to suspect that it was Np. I didn’t understand how I could have been feeling so good and then going to feeling like I was going to die! During this time I started searching online and on Facebook to see of anyone else was experiencing this and I couldn’t find anything. This would have been sometime around may/june I believe. I will say that once I finished that bottle and started another new refill I did get better again. Hopefully it was just a bad batch and not a permanent change to the medication!
Dee
Renee, I also experienced my bad batch in about May or June–you have given me hope that perhaps the next refill will be back to normal. I am so glad you are feeling better on the new refill! I really like this company, and hope they have not permanently changed the formula.
Hadassah
I too am very hopeful that it’s just a hiccup . I love NP Thyroid It works so well for me and for many others . I feel very confident that Janie who doses with NP thyroid too will help us through this .
Thank You Janie For All The Hard Work You Do For Us Behind The Scenes And Forefront .
Janie Your One Amazing Lady …
Janie Bowthorpe
Thank u Hadassah.
Jamie
On August 1, I switched from Synthroid (50mcg) to NP Thyroid (1 grain). I am also taking 75mcg Liothyronine. By August 7, I started feeling fatigued. By August 12, all of my old hypo symptoms had returned: fatigue, weakness, anxiety, confusion and severe heart palpitations. Since August 1, I’ve gained between 5-10 pounds and my hair is falling out again. I stopped the NP Thyroid and restarted Synthroid, and am hoping get relief soon. I feel for everyone affected by this.
Thy Roid
This is exactly what has been happening to me. I’m back on Levo+T3 but everything is reduced per my doctor. Still not feeling great… I hope you do better.
Janie Bowthorpe
You need a better doctor…
Thy Roid
I know it.
I found one doctor somewhat nearby in the recommended list but he’s an endo also and doesn’t come with much in the way of testimonials. Do you think I would be better off working virtually with Dr. Bouc? I don’t even know what that means.
Nicole
I just left a message for Acella with my batch number. I switched to NP from NT this Spring and felt so much better as also indicated in my labs. I picked up my new 90 day supply on 8/8 and have been suffering from extreme fatigue, headaches, heart palpitations and now a case of plantar fascitis. I got my labs yesterday and my TSH went up 2 points! So there’s definitely something up here. Although I haven’t noticed any change in the smell or appearance. They always had a pungent taste to me compared to NT
Jamie
Hope you start feeling better soon!
Sarah
Oh no! I just switched to NP Thyroid after my health deteriorated on Naturethroid. NP made me feel alive again. I still have a decent number of 330 tablets left but I’m SO SICK OF THIS.
I have a good compounding pharmacy that can do compounded NDT (though expensive). Is this a viable alternative, or are their sources compromised too?
Martin Loiselle
No, our pharmacy has NDT in stock and we make it in capsules. The sources of NDT are not really compromised – we usually are able to obtain it even when manufacturers are experiencing shortages.
Janie Bowthorpe
Martin, after having so many pharmaceuticals (I know you are a pharmacy) state that they “changed nothing”, how can patients trust that your NDT source is “not really compromised”? That doesn’t sound too promising. What would help is to hear from patients who outright use nothing but your product and have optimal results on it and which has lasted and not gone away. Too may patients say they feel good, but they are underdosed, and it’s doomed to backfire. Others say they feel good, and it’s more about the excess adrenaline from being underdosed.
What will be INTERESTING about this is…
1) if it’s truly not “compromised”
2) if only ONE filler is there
3) if I get to hear from real live people who USE your compounded product and produce the free T3 result and free T4 results, not just “say” they are going “great”
4)…then that “might” imply it’s the fillers and binders in the prescription brands that are the biggest problem.
Christi
I picked up my new Rx of NP 7/13/19. I take 60mg every morning. My numbers up to that point had been optimal. About 2 weeks after starting the new batch my hair started falling out at an insanely high rate. Like wads full after showering and I could feel it falling out throughout the day.
I started to notice that I was getting the jitters but I’m so new to the world of thyroid meds that I was looking for other things that could be causing it. The jitters have only continued to get worse, but I’ve also had extreme exhaustion, extreme muscle fatigue, strangely no appetite, sensitivity to heat ( which is not normal for me at all ), my vision seems to have gotten much worse in a quick amount of time, along with nausea and a few other symptoms. I actually felt so bad yesterday morning that I drove myself to the ER thinking there was something more wrong. They ran blood work and my TSH came back really low which I’m told means I’m over medicated.
But I’m consistently taking the same dose every day so that just proves that there is an issue with this batch in my opinion. I’ve been taking NP since the end of March and haven’t had any issues with pooling so I don’t know why that would start now?
Last Monday I stopped taking NP after reading some comments on a Facebook group about the batch that had gone out. I guess unfortunately there hasn’t been enough time for it to get out of my system as I lay here in bed at 7:43 AM with no intentions of getting up anytime soon…
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Rickey
I am on 180 mg of NP Thyroid daily. Have been on it for a couple of years. It works great for me. Dr. has lowered my dose a couple times. I just had labs. TSH <.01; Free T4 1.4; Free T3 9.1 He will probably lower my dose down a little when I see him Wednesday. I haven't noticed any of the changes (smell, size, etc.) in my meds. I get them mail order from Optum RX. I did receive an email today from them saying that they are unable to fulfill my order because the medication is out of stock. Looks like I will have to find it elsewhere or change to something else. Too bad, cause it was working for me.
Rima
Thank you for this!!! I just picked up my new prescription and took my first pill this morning at 6:30, in my sleepy state, I chewed it like always and YUCK!!!! I couldn’t even get rid of the taste by drinking water.
Before reading your email, I had already left a message at the Acella customer service line. Will report what they say. I wonder if they are getting this new stuff from China?
Cincolo
Oh I hope not! I wouldn’t trust any food related items from China; they don’t have the highest standards. Plus with our tariffs now, they would probably like to stick it to us any way they can.
Donna Frank
I went to a functional dr last January and she started me on Naturethroid. Not what I wanted but she insisted. It didn’t work so I insisted NP by Acella and she agreed. Back in July I knew something was wrong and complained to her about fatigue and heart palpitations. She said no it’s not your thyroid it’s your Adrenals. Hmmm. I didn’t agree but she’s stubborn about her decisions. Probably because she’s usually correct. But I know this isn’t working and here’s what I think. I think the powers that be want us all on Levothyroxin or synthetic drugs because maybe they get more money that way. There’s a conspiracy here somewhere it’s just too obvious. Feeling awful and getting really cranky with this constant fight for thyroid wellness.
Janie Bowthorpe
Donna, of course a maker of T4 might want us on T4 for the money, but that doesn’t mean they have the power or means to stranglehold all the pharmaceutical makers of NDT. It’s much more likely that something else is afoot.
Bonnie Medd
I’m beginning to think the same thing as Donna. This is all too coincidental. First Armour, then Naturethroid (which landed me in the hospital) and now NP. If it’s not that, then the only other thought is that there is no one left at the top of any drug companies anymore that are committed to the health of patients above the need to pad their bottom lines and own wallets. I’m so damned frustrated.
Janie Bowthorpe
I strongly and logically doubt that it’s a conspiracy to push us towards T4 causing all this. It might even be from ridiculous updates towards pharmaceuticals by the FDA. I and those who work closest with me in this fight have been saying the latter among ourselves.
I am far more disgusted with pharmaceutical secrecy.
Hadassah
I agree with you Janie . Please Keep the Fight Going Strong . We must Not Allow this to happen to us .
Sam
I think this is about raw thyroid supplier. They are all getting it from the same company. Too coincidental
housemaid
Janie, in 2012 Abbott Laboratories, owner of Synthroid, was fined $1.5 billion for illegally promoting their drug Depakote. They have bribed people in the past, so I would not rule it out. It is highly suspicious that CVS Pharmacies has refused to sell NDT and now all the manufacturers of NDT are having trouble making an effective thyroid pill. The late Dr. Lowe said this in a published paper in 2006, talking about endocrinologists and their opposition to NDT: “The specialty’s obstinacy may be sustained by financial incentives from corporations that profit from the practice of T4 replacement therapy.”
(From “Four 2003 Studies of Thyroid Hormone Replacement Therapies: Logical Analysis and Ethical Implication”) I really miss Dr. Lowe’s knowledge and efforts to help people with our disease!
Plus you’ve got the FDA working with the big drug companies. Lots of room for corruption there to make NDT less effective and force people toward Synthroid.
housemaid
Correction: I don’t have any knowledge of Abbott bribing anybody. It was another company named Alere that they were acquiring which was under investigation for bribery.
Janie Bowthorpe
I don’t have an definitive answer, but your post is very good one….
Susie
Housemaid, Interesting, I live in the south, I went to CVS pharmacy to fill NP by Acella and they told me they couldn’t get it! I went a couple blocks down to another pharmacy and they said no problem we will order it for you ,we don’t have it in stock, it was there the next day, it was from the Georgia facility. So, for some reason CVS wouldn’t provide NP to their customers.
Amanda
Uh oh – We also need to talk about Thiroyd NDT. I have been taking these for several years but my latest batch 1500057 is different. The soft coating is now hard and has a chalky taste and the tablets seem to be totally ineffective. There is also a shortage of suppliers and they have been told that because ingredients were imported from China who has increased prices, Greater Pharma won’t be making them anymore! I have written to Greater Pharma but they haven’t replied to a not very great me! I am very worried now and don’t know which NDT to use. I don’t want to go back to the hell of levothyroxine…
Janie Bowthorpe
Amanda, look at the light green box in the blog post. No one has to go back to just T4.
William
In regard to Amanda’s concern specific to “Thiroyd”. I received batch lot # 1500058 and it is in my opinion inert/containing NO T3/T4. (felt terrific on Nature-Throid).
Debbie T.
Janie, I was trying to post a screenshot from the GoodRx site that confuses me: two different looking 60mg tablets of NP; the ones on the left say manufactured by AvKARE https://www.grxstatic.com/d4fuqqd5l3dbz/products/DrugItem_20949.JPG
are darker with flecks, and the ones on the right say manufactured by Acella
https://www.grxstatic.com/d4fuqqd5l3dbz/products/DrugItem_26458.JPG
and are lighter.
Do you think the AvKARE tablets could be the problem? I am going to request my next fill from Walmart be with the Acella tablets. I will also contact Acella tomorrow and inquire about the AvKARE ones.
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s a potentially good question worth exploring. AvKare “manufactures, markets and/or distributes more than 189 drugs in the U.S.” https://www.drugs.com/manufacturer/avkare-inc-428.html
Jeff
I have just called in a refill to Rite Aid in New Hampshire for 180 – 60mg tablets for $32.66(Good RX)
the best price in a long time. But I had the pharmacist check and the tabs have “AP” on one side and
“330” on the other. When I get the pills tomorrow should I expect a color change?
Thanks –Jeff B.
Debbie T.
I believe the # on the pills correlates to the dosage, i.e. 330 = 60mg, 331 = 90mg.
Cincolo
I noticed the difference with just the smell alone. Both my 60 mg and 30 mg pills have the stronger smell. The color is also slightly different with the flecks. I even started refrigerating them because I thought the heat was making them smell that way.
Debbie T.
I and 63 years old and have Hashimoto’s. I feel like I’ve been on almost every brand of thyroid–Synthroid, Armour, compounded, Erfa, Tirosint, NP, Cytomel, generic T3-only, WP, and now NP. I take four 60mg tablets a day. Last labs in March 2019 were: Free T4 1.43 (0.82 – 1.77), Free T3 4.2 (2.0 – 4.4); temps were good; I felt pretty good although weight was coming off VERY s-l-o-w-l-y. My last fill was mid-July. I just returned from visiting family out west, and couldn’t understand why my “jet lag” persisted for days; every afternoon I “hit the wall” in my energy level. Then I read about NP possibly changing and wondering it that is a factor in my lethargy. Went thru this years ago when Armour was reformulated. UGH. Am really considering trying Thyro-Gold–would love to hear from anyone who has used it successfully. I’ll post on the FB page.
Thanks, Janie, for all your efforts and getting this information out there.
Janie Bowthorpe
There are many good experiences with Thyrogold.:)
Debby M
I just ordered ThyroGold. I just received my thyroid labs, and I’ve tanked since my last refill of the stinky NP 4 months ago. My labs changed dramatically with this new NP formula. I’ve been on ALL the NDT’s and I’m sick of the changes, and also having to convince my doctor to raise or lower my dose, so I’m taking my health into my own hands and self sourcing my NDT. I hope the ThyroGold works for me, as I am at my wits end!
Janie Bowthorpe
Just remember to get optimal on it. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Eliza
I’d be curious to see how you do on Thyro-Gold. I just ordered some myself, after being on Armour for years and recently having hypothyroid symptoms return, along with lower labs.
Janie Bowthorpe
Remember that when you switch to natural thyroid supplements, you still have to watch your labs and get optimal to feel better. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/optimal
Michelle Sarchiapone
NP is no longer working for me.
I was stable on Naturethroid for years and years until early 2018 when I noticed my TSH was suddenly unusually lower then it had been previously. Like VERY LOW. I am recovering from exposure to black mold so it was very hard to tell at that point if medication was the issue or my CIRS. Plus I have a pituitary issue…so my ND glossed over the change. But it seemed thyroid related as I couldnt get my hair to stop falling out which is always a major symptom for me that my labs are low (and they were) and at that point, I was fairly well recovered from the mold exposure. Fast forward to the end of 2018 and NT ran out…which in a way I was glad….simply because I had had questions about the efficacy for the whole year prior. I switched to NP thyroid fairly effortlessly in Feb or March? It didnt really slow down the hair loss completely but enough. My last labs were much better then the previous year with NT, but only a mild improvement (definitley not as good as the labs prior to 2018 on NT) My TSH was lower weirdly, but my free T-3 was towards the top of the range, and my T4 was just a smidge over the low line. That said I was feeling great so I didnt mess with it. Then a few weeks ago after a refill I woke up one morning with a major sore throat. My thyroid was clearly tanking. And thats when I started to feel terrible. Fatigue, numbness and swelling in legs and feet, dizziness, light sensitivity…on and on. I began to raise my dose. I got another refill (because of the raise) and the smell and taste are 100% different. Instead of tasting like pork, it has a weird fruity smell?? and weird taste of fillers. Within a few days of taking that script I felt like I was a zombie despite the jump in amount. I had a couple days of the old formulation laying around and took it this morning and immediately felt alive again. I feel so overwhelmed as clearly none of these NDT’s can be trusted anymore. I have no idea what to do!
Michelle Sarchiapone
A little additional info: In 2018 when on the iffy NT, I could not lose weight to save my life. Which for me, is highly unusual. I am extremely active. As soon as I switched to NP I lost 10 pounds. In the last couple weeks I have seen some weight creep and bloating.
I suspect there is a issue with the pork source which is why ALL the NDT is now less then optimal. Might try thyro-gold. Love to hear others experiences!!
Sam
I believe this is the case. The raw thyroid is being outsourced and common to all brands.
Corey
Has anyone reported being able to optimize again on any NDT? Is it simply a question of finding a high enough dose again, or are patients moving to more T3?
Janie Bowthorpe
Many, many, many of us have optimized on NDT. We have worked to find our optimal dose which puts the free T3 towards the top part of the range, and the free T4 midrange. Both. But we have to have optimal iron and cortisol, too, to get there without problems.
BUT…with so many NDT’s now having gone south, it’s not a bad thing to get optimal on T4 and T3. Some even feel that Armour has worked. Or the OTC versions.
Janie Bowthorpe
There are some who say they are doing well on the changed and way more expensive Armour. But we need to see their free’s to see if they are optimal, because you will feel better on NDT even on non-optimal doses, but it eventually backfires if one isn’t optimal. We see the latter scenario all the time.
Thy Roid
Today I decided to eliminate the NP entirely and switch to Levo + T3. Despite reduced doses (several reductions) in both NP and T3 I really haven’t felt hypo until today which makes me think I’m either getting way too much from NP, which is at odd with what is reported here, or I’m reacting to something else.
How long does it take for a reduction to result in hypo? I want to know if what I’m feeling today is directly the substitution of Levo for NP or if it’s just the cumulative reductions this week finally catching up with me.
Either way I’m done with NP and possibly NDT altogether. I feel like I’ve been poisoned.
Janie Bowthorpe
Because of the T4 in NDT, of course you felt fine for a while. It can still be converting for up to a week. But in your next-to-last paragraph, you only mentioned Levo. You are going to also be on direct T3, right?
Thy Roid
Sorry… it’s complicated.
Previously doing well at 30mg NP + 25mg T3 (15 in the am, 10 in the afternoon).
Reduced to 15mg NP + 25mg T3 when I started feeling funny about 10 days ago.
Reduced to 15mg NP + 15mg T3 (morning only) beginning Friday.
Eliminated NP today took 12.5mg Levo + 15mg T3.
Now I feel pretty down. Heart palps reduced but not gone yet. But I really felt no reduction symptoms at all until today.
Janie Bowthorpe
Maybe you went the wrong way with the T3….
Thy Roid
Funny you say that… it does seem that the T3 relieves my symptoms rather than making them worse. I was wondering about that.
Question for you: are heart palps always or usually a function of too much thyroid hormone (e.g., hyperthyroidism) or are they also possible or even frequent for people that are suddenly hypo?
My doctor seems convinced that this is hyper not hypo causing these problems and he points to my typically low TSH as the evidence for this (0.085 last month). He has been willing to treat me by what works as long as we didn’t end up here, but now… here we are.
Janie Bowthorpe
Bingo.
And heart palps are common with being underdosed, as you may have done to yourself. They can also be common with an adrenal problem.
NO about the TSH. He’s clueless but at least he will still treat you.
Kaci
This is happening to me, as well. I’m ok with the change and would be ok with having to have dose adjusted. I just wish the Pharmacies were aware of (or care) how these affect us. My new pills read 330 but are grey and taste like what a dirty litter box smells like. I’ve set them aside and stopped taking them. After reading the responses, I’m wondering if my batch is somehow spoiled (grey color and bad taste) and not related to the new batch.
Donna
I have 30mg and 60mg. My 60’s were all procured from Rite aid pharmacy (in NY state and actually one is a walgreens pharmacy in a rite aid store)….3 batches of them (330’s) and none are discolored and none smell nastier than they should. That said, I am fatigued (partly may be due to not enough sleep and I am now optimized). My labs coming early September will tell me…. I also store anything more than a months supply in the freezer and only take out MAYBE 1/2 months supply at a go. AND when i stay in florida, my pharmacist put in a desiccant.
Janie Bowthorpe
The number 330 imply you have the former good tablets still.
Hayden Murray
I was just about to switch to NP, but guess i won’t now! A lot of people here talking about thyro-gold, think I’ll give that a try.
Does anyone know if it an also be taken sublingual? Just as it’s bovine. Also, how many mcg of t3/t4 are in 300mcg of thyrogold?
Thank you!
Julie
I just was totally optimal. My dr said I should frame my bloodwork. He then refilled my np thyroid and I noticed it looked and smelled different and at first I thought the pharmacy had substituted another brand. I then saw it was np on the bottle so I compared the pills thinking maybe they put the wrong ones in the bottle. Sure enough they were stamped the same but looked, smelled, and split differently. I have switched around from wp to nature to np. I feel like some of my symptoms are back too. My feet are swollen and couldn’t fit into my strappy sandals the other night.
Dee
I was on Armour for 10 years and was optimal until it was reformulated. Went through 2 years of misery, until I
found NP by Acella, and have been optimal for 8 years! Now sick again. I thought the last Rx of
pills had been exposed to humidity or something, since they are VERY bad smelling and tasting.
Now I can barely make it through the mornings, even on 1/2 pot of coffee, and all the old low thyroid
symptoms are returning. WHY do these companies have to mess with the formulations when people
are doing well? Does it have to do with cheaper production or something (money is usually the culprit).
THANK YOU JANIE for solving this mystery.
JC rosE
I tried the NP to see if would feel better…they were so stinky and i never had that issue with nature throid. First i had terrible dry eyes to the point i went to the eye dr, i changed back to nature throid and the eye problems went away. I still have not the energy i used to have , have plantar fascitis on one foot, and have hair loss for several years now that may be unrelated…on 2.5 g once daily. IT IS ODD THAT ALL THE NEW ”’variations” HAVE SPECS IN THE TABLETS….what are these specs in all the new pills….what is that….that should be our question…we all see that….in common….the NP smelled like dead fish or sour raw pork meat or bacon left out too long….The NT has no smell but pills are smaller, appear harder, and BOTH HAVE DARK SPECS……..is that a new additive…. DID BIG PHARMA OR THE FDA make them make changes to turn people away from ndt med back to synthroid . DID the bad pig scare overseas make a shortage so we have more fillers and less hormone, how is it EVEN POSSIBLE…that TWO COMPETITORS have DARK specs if it is not ORDERED CHANGE UP by fda???
Janie Bowthorpe
“Big Pharma” is just a term to describe all the pharmaceuticals collectively. They wouldn’t shoot themselves in the foot when their goal is to make money. But your question about the FDA’s role in this has been talked about privately and what part they might play in this disaster. And your comment about the dark specks is also a big question.
Dawn Kaplan
I called Express Scripts today and spoke to a pharmacist about the new batch of pills I received last week. She put me on hold for a long while, came back and said she could find nothing from Acella about any change in the medication. She said the smell could be from being oxidized while being in transit from the heat. She is sending out a new rx for me. I asked for the lot number and will compare if the new pills I receive are the same and/or from the same batch. I don’t know if this will prove anything. Mostly for my own curiosity.
I am sick over this! Not only am I in the throes of menopause, but now having to have the stress of this.
Liza
I had horrible problems on NP thyroid. Before NP and now Im on levothyroxine.
On NP, all my labs showed TSH through the roof, and no help with T4,T3 whatsoever. My labs before were close to optimal, my Dr. just wanted to see if this meds would be better for me. Nope!
On top of that Ive got lichen planus all over my body, that non of the steroids creams could help. I stopped taking it as soon as I got my lab tests and went back Levothyroxine and started LDN. LDN was the only thing that healed my awful lichen planus outbreak.
Janie Bowthorpe
Sounds like you were severely underdosed on the former NP tablets.
But in the meantime, might want to listen to the wisdom of patients and consider adding in direct T3 to that T4.
Kathleen
Please tell me about adding T3 and T4. Is this something I ask my dr to call in? I know nothing about this. Tia
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s an alternative, yes. If someone was optimal on NDT (free T3 at the top of the range; free T4 midrange. Both), they ask for the equivalent in T4 and T3. You figure out the equivalence by understanding this: one grain of NDT is equal to 38 mcg 4 and 9 mcg T3.
If NDT was not optimal, you can still go to the equivalent dose with the two synthetics, but we will need to raise to be optimal.
Rita
I found something interesting. On the GoodRX app, if you look up NP 60 it shows two photos, one of the old one, one of the new one. They are very different looking. I don’t think it shows photos for 2 pills of any of the other doses. But my 128 is definitely new (and disgusting). Weird, I just noticed the first photo of the NP 60 says manufactured by AvKare. That is the new pill, speckles and rough. What in the world? Is it a typo?
I wasn’t optimal on Naturethroid (after the change) and then read that NP was better here, and decided to try to get optimal on NP with the higher doses, what unfortunate timing. My NP 128 pills taste like poison, how insecticides smell. I have been taking NDT for over 15 years, no pill has ever tasted like that.
I think I might just try a higher dose of Naturethroid rather than risk taking higher doses of this new NP. I have taken many pills/supplements and never had one that tasted like insecticide. What filler could taste so horrid? I just don’t trust it and don’t feel comfortable taking it for any length of time. There is something seriously wrong with it. I chewed it and the horrid taste was throughout the pill. I don’t want to ingest that every day.
If larger doses of Naturethroid don’t work, I will try Armour, and if that doesn’t work, synthetic T3,4. Honestly, I am about ready to give up on NDT, very frustrating and sad…
I also emailed NP and I am going to return my NP 128 to Walmart due to its disgusting smell/taste and talk to their pharmacist. If we all contact the company and return the pills, maybe something can get done?
Janie Bowthorpe
From drugs.com: “AvKare, Inc. manufactures, markets and/or distributes more than 189 drugs in the United States.” i.e. they do it for other companies.
GregS
My wife no longer has a Thyroid….same story I read here often….nodules…might be cancer…remove it…removed it….checked it, no cancer…
She’s on Levo. Seems to do ok….no symptoms….so she thinks. Yet she diets and diets and can’t lose weight, has extremely dry skin, and I have to remove a huge gob of hair from the shower drain every two weeks……luckily she has a lot of hair, no tiredness symptom yet. Yet I’m afraid this might be a time bomb, she isn’t aware of.
Now I’m hearing about this latest panic about the porcine natural thyroid medicines again…..the choices are shrinking…
On the other hand the Chinese connection may need to go away for your sakes…..if you think they care about Americans you are mistaken.
What about the other non-Chinese sources of natural Thyroid? Especially, what about Tammy (Lowe) Carter’s bovine Thyro-Gold? I bought a bottle of her most potent pills for my wife to try…….but she won’t. Want’s a “MD doctor” to prescribe it, etc. (Good luck with finding one that will in this area) She might listen to you guys…….
Janie Bowthorpe
That is sad about your dear wife. She doesn’t understand that what her doctor is giving her has caused problems for millions over the years.
Judith W.
On NP Thyroid; I take 180 mg. or 3 grains every morning. Just started a new prescription July 1; gained 10 lbs. in 2 weeks.
On 1 side of the pill is AP and the other is 331.
Thoughts on #331?
STTM!!!
Thank you!
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s the changed tablet number, say many.
Shannon
I was wondering why my NP Thyroid tasted so bad. I usually let it start dissolving under my tongue while I get my other meds ready but just cannot do it with my 90mg tablets. They are horrible tasting. So far it seems like everyone is experiencing this with the pill with #331 on it. That is not true in my case. My 60mg pill refilled in mid July is #331 which seems fine. My 90 mg pill refilled in mid July has #330. That is the one I think is bad.
Andrea
Interesting!! I have that same pill with markings and literally gained 10lbs in a week!!! While tracking food and exercising every day!! Could it be!?!? I am tempted to just go to tirosint or levo and t3. Who has time for this nonsense!?!?
Sam
I’m on 90 and they are rancid. Awful tasting and I feel awful sore and tired.
My appetite is much harder to control.
Shayda
I just tried the new one I had picked up from the pharmacy and you are right. they are not as sweet and definitely taste different. Definitely NOT the same formula.
I have emailed NP Thyroid for an explanation and let them know I am considering switching to another brand.
Incidentally my local Walgreens tried to switch me to Armour without telling me. I only knew because the price was so high when I was checking out…
Thanks so much for keeping us updated!!!
Diana
My pills have the AP on one side and the number is 331. The bottle says NP THYROID 90 MG. Generic for ARMOUR. Mfg. Acell. So what am I taking? Any clue?
Janie Bowthorpe
People are saying that the changed tablets do have 331 on them. But you’ll know by noticing a far stinkier smell, and a very bad taste, which is what others are saying about their changed tablets.
Diana
My pills were changed a few months ago. I was taking the Levo /lio and feeling pretty good, made a fuss when they changed but was told these are the same thing. I have been feeling really bad but just assumed it was my age. My doctor does not do the right tests so I have no idea of any of my levels. I also have Afib and thought the heart palpitations were just that, never suspected my Thyroid. Going to try to get my Dr. to do some more tests. Are there any good supplements to help with problems? I was diagnosed when I was 16 and I just turned 73.
Emily
My changed tablets have 328 written on them (120mg). I’ve sent a message to Acella at https://npthyroid.com/contact/ to ask about the changes.
Judith W.
Oh, yes Janie…the smell is terrible! Especially difficult since I haven’t eaten meat in 35 years!
Called my pharmacist at Walgreens and of course they have nothing to say.
Janie Bowthorpe
Wow, if you haven’t eaten meat in 35 years, I can certainly understand why it would be terrible for you!!
Judith W.
Yes, Janie…nauseating!
Thank you for keeping us informed!
Sherry Forslund
My, impacted, 120mg has 328 on it and my 30mg has 329 on it and the bottle has more “powder” on the inside than the previous bottle after 90 days
BarbN
I began taking NP last fall after struggling terribly to optimize my Naturethroid dosage after the changes. Finally, I switched to 180mg NP and started feeling better and felt good until probably May this year. I started noticing I would have no appetite when I should be hungry, tiredness was creeping in, brain fog, and bloated feeling on and off.
Sometime in June or July I’m sure I started taking the new pills because suddenly in late July and August I was gaining weight, very winded when exercising, having joint pain, recently had headaches (some were similar to a migraine and I normally never have headaches), and the weirdest symptom was tired eyes with pain like my eyeballs were hurting toward the end of the day…I was initially thinking maybe allergies…I just wasn’t sure what was causing all this but didn’t rule out that it might be the NP…then I received Janie’s blog email and it all became clear.
Due to my struggles with Naturethroid I decided to stop taking the NP the next day on 8/23. I replaced it with 300 mg Thyro-Gold that I had on hand from my desperation last year…it was unbelievable but the eye tiredness and pain were gone and the joint aches…I even feel more clear headed.
I also am curious if anyone has had a refill that includes the old and new pills? I took some photos and even asked my husband and kids to confirm what I was seeing…there are 3 old pills and the rest are new pills in my latest refill from 8/7…there is definitely something going on. I need to review my bloodwork over the last 6 months and will post the history…
It seems like these issues are not getting better with the NDTs so I plan to try the otc products and optimize using bloodwork…so bummed…
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, there are some who have reported a mix from their pharmacy. It may be why there have been great photos of both lately to show the differences.
Barbara Arendall
I am curious if you don’t mind.. why did you stop the Thyro-Gold? I am taking Throvanz and doing well so far.
Good luck.. hope you continue to feel okay.
another Barb!
BarbN
I don’t mind at all. I stopped the Thyroid-gold only because my doctor agreed to switch me to the NP…I had no problems with it. I unfortunately only took it for a short time… I have also ordered some of the Thyrovanz and plan to try it. It is encouraging to hear you are doing well with it. Thanks for sharing!
Tina
I just refilled my NP prescription this past Tuesday. It has AP on one side and 329 on the other. No weird smells, just normal. I take 3, 30mg a day. Maybe the bigger doses are what’s changed.
Cincolo
I’m on 1 grain and 30 mg tablets. I noticed the smell on both of them now.
Jeni
@Barbara Arendall–how much Thyrovanz do you take? Where you previously taking NDT? If so, which ones/dose?
Rita
I recently switched from Naturethroid to NP because of hair loss, weight gain, and anemia. I started taking 90 mg of NP and after 2 months was not optimal, so I was just switched to 120.
The 90 mg pills were from
Walgreens and didn’t smell bad and tasted sweet. The 120 pills are from Walmart and look different, smell chemically, and taste literally like pesticide. No comparison between the two.
This same thing happened to Naturethroid. The pills used to be sweet and easily dissolved and then tasted different and were harder. And then stopped working for me.
I noticed on the NP website that they released the 120 in July 2019. Maybe the suppliers changed the fillers?
My main problem is whether I should even try to take this for two months and then do testing knowing what I know now. The taste is very concerning, like poison, not pig. I have never had a pill or supplement taste like this. And I could try to find the older pills, but if they are changing all of them as it sounds like from above, why mess with getting optimal and then not being able to find the old pills?
I can’t believe this. I have been on Armour, Naturethroid, and NP. I was optimal for years on 60 Naturethroid until they closed down.
I am clueless what to do now because I worry I will be a bald blimp in 2 months. Maybe I should try larger doses on Naturethroid as my doctor initially suggested? At least Naturethroid doesn’t taste like roach spray.
I have been on NDT thyroid for over 15 years and I am finally agreeing with people who say you can’t trust this product. These “change in formula” issues started with Armour. Something is happening and these companies are lying to us.
Janie Bowthorpe
The problem is that Pharmaceuticals are secretive to the point of being insulting to informed patients. The next steps are up to each individual:
1) Raise the changed NP tablets and see if it helps. Doing the frees would be a good thing. Working with your doctor will doing this. Etc.
2) Crush the tablets before swallowing. One gal said she made the changed Armour tablets work this way. A sweetener could be added by the individual to tolerate what is being described as a horrid taste
3) Move to Armour
4) Move to synthetic T3 with synthetic T4 (one grain of NP was 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3)
5) Move to over-the-counter NDT “supplements”
Rita
Thanks Janie! I might try this new disgusting pill for a few weeks since it is higher than my last dose and see how I feel. I crunched up the one this morning in my teeth, so will continue. So disgusting tasting! If this doesn’t work I might consider moving to Armour, even though it is so much more expensive. Thank you for your advice.
I am beyond frustrated! Hate testing out this new NP… Maybe I will be lucky, but probably not.
Janie Bowthorpe
We’re all going to hope.
Judy
I asked the man I spoke with at Acella this week where their raw material comes from. He wouldn’t answer that question. I was just wondering whether it comes from China or from the same source where other NDTs get their raw material.
Also it still doesn’t make sense why places like Women’s International can’t get raw material but companies like Acella can. Couldn’t WIP get it from the same source?
I’ve had it with all the mystery, secrecy, deception, and lack of transparency that are ultimately badly damaging many, many people’s (mostly women’s) health and lives. And then that affects the lives of all those people’s families in a trickle-down domino effect.
Those pharma companies and their associates are obviously not in it for any type of benevolent reason. They obviously don’t care about us. All they care about is money and their own interests. That’s sick (no pun intended), unethical, immoral, inhumane, and lacking in conscience.
Janie Bowthorpe
Your last two paragraphs definitely represent how many of us are feeling….you said it well. May I include those two paragraphs in the actual blog post?
Peggy Shinkle
Have been on Armour Thyroid for 5 yrs. Current internist keeps changing dosage to try to fix BP and angina. Have been Eu-Thyriod for 25 yrs due to thyroid toxicity. New modules appearing. Need to get a handle on BP and angina, but so far, no luck! Any experience on getting Internists, Endocrinologist, and Cardiologist to work TOGETHER?
Kathleen
Which Thyrovanz do you recommend?
Janie Bowthorpe
Thyrovanz is one OTC version. Thyrogold is another. The latter has been around longer if that makes any difference.
Sherry Forslund
After seeing a couple of posts I contacted my pharmacy as a received a new batch and starting it last week. I didn’t notice symptomss but the taste made me gag and with my dose yesterday I separately took the 120 and 30 to figure out which was off so I called Optum RX and asked for a replacement bottle be sent for the 120. For that to happen I had to talk to a pharmacist who basically said that color and taste variations are “known” with these types of products and even the manufacturer and medically it was just fine and I needed to take my medication. She would not listen to me at all that there was an issue with this batch, I ended up having to call back, complain and talk to a diff pharmacist who is sending a replacement but I am genuinely concerned about what will arrive. I did contact acella (NP Throid) via a Facebook to report the issue as well and no one had responded.
housemaid
I got a 3 month supply of the NP 120 mg tablets from a Walgreen’s in NC on 8-21-19. Had to wait several days to get the order in as usual, but they are the same good NP tablets I have been taking and doing well on. I am afraid now I will get the bad NP after 3 more months. I have been through this with Nature-throid and WP thyroid before and hate to see this happening yet again.
I wonder if the recall of bad batches of the porcine thyroid from Sichuan Friendly Pharmaceuticals in China a year ago has anything to do with Nature-throid and now NP changing. The FDA alert said that the porcine thyroid had certain batches that were “inconsistent quality”. They said that the lots may not be labeled with the name “Sichuan” but may just say “Thyroid Powder”. The FDA then made this ominous statement: “FDA also recommends that patients discuss FDA-approved hypothyroidism treatment options with their doctors, as combination levothyroxine and liothyronine products are not FDA-approved.” Well, we know what that means–Synthroid.
Thy Roid
This is really interesting. The timing would explain the sudden shortage of Naturethroid last year and might also explain the inconsistency in the products that we are all evidently experiencing.
The thing is, I won’t feed commercial dog food to my dog because I don’t trust the manufacturers to avoid ingredients from shady Chinese producers (who poisoned and killed thousands of pets here), so why would I trust the same Chinese pork producers for my medication?
We need more transparency in the pharma industry so we can make more informed decisions about what we buy and take.
Steve
Not sure if this is true but I heard that much of the porcine used to be harvested in Puerto Rico. After the hurricane devastated the island the manufacturers have had to look for other sources.
Janie Bowthorpe
They deny it strong about Puerto Rico. So who knows.
Janie Bowthorpe
They deny it strongly about Puerto Rico. So who knows.
Lynn
I’m blown away that I saw this post today because just last night I was wondering why I was struggling with major palpitations. I usually take 135 mg NP Thyroid in the morning (1 + 1/2 90s) and 90 mg at bedtime. I have no thyroid and my Primary doc is giving me a hard time about my dose (previously prescribed by a Functional doc I no longer see) so had cut down to 1 90 2x/day for a week prior to labs I’m getting next week. I was diagnosed with AFib in January and the palpitations I’m feeling are not that. They are typical hypo palps and now I know why! I just picked up a new refill of 90s last week. I will raise my dose tomorrow and see if the palps disappear. Joints are aching more also and I’ve been “down” last few days too. SO glad I was this post. But what a bummer.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, please let us know if raising the changed NP tablets helps. Who knows how many raises it will take. This is completely nuts what’s going on. And don’t forget to do your frees.
Janie Bowthorpe
Also should have added that it might help to crush them before swallowing.
Deana Newcomb
Yes, it smells bad. But worse, I have been half-dead (sleepy) since my new script. Maybe make it through a work day–but come home and go to sleep for 1-2 hours. Also, exercise was debilitating rather than helpful.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yup, there is SO much proof now from people like you that this changed tablets are totally messed up. Thank you for posting.
CO
15 months after total thyroidectomy and I’m feeling pretty good on 2 grains np and 75 mcg cytomel. And now this. Sigh. I heard the horror stories with naturethroid.
I have a good stash of the old np tablets, so I should be able to prove I’m optimal with a few more months of the old stuff. Then maybe things will be clearer with what’s going on.
Elaine
So which brands are good then? Thanks
Janie Bowthorpe
The million dollar question. First, we can always try chewing up the NP and see, plus testing our frees.
Paula Wertheim
My husband and I have been using “Thyroid-S” and a cheaper but equally effective product called “Thiroyd” – both from Greater Pharma Manufacturing Co. Ltd , Thailand. After three years , we have nothing but praise for the quality, availability and PRICE of these excellent products. For less than $80 USD you get 1000 tablets per bottle!
Btw, we live in Israel. First, we tried Armour , then NT from Canad. The price of both became so ridiculous we were forced to take a chance on the Thailandi products. No regrets!
Dawn Kaplan
Hi All,
I remember when Armour changed the formula about 10 years ago. I would crush the pill and sprinkle Dextrose on top, then swallow it down with water. It worked. I did this for years and continued to do well on Armour until Forest Labs sold it and the price sky rocketed. I switched to NP and did well on this as well. I have about two months left of the pills of the old formula, and my new rx is their new version. There clearly is a difference.
Is anybody that has the new formula willing to try this and see if there’s a difference? I would buy the NOW pure dextrose. It worked beautifully.
Thank you in advance, and thank you Janie for posting this! I don’t participate much, but am a loyal reader!
Janie Bowthorpe
Glad you shared your experience of crushing and that it work. Who knows. It might with the changed NP Tablets.
donna cason
Why would crushing it work if there is not enough active ingredients in it? I take sublingually.
Janie Bowthorpe
Because it’s the hope that the problem is about fillers and/or the way the tablet has been compacted. We won’t know until it’s tried.
Janie Bowthorpe
This may be a duplicate response by me. Can’t see my former response. There is no proof that there is not enough active ingredients causing all these problems. It could also be the fillers–the question becomes why is the changed tablet thicker than the former very-workable tablets? We don’t know when it’s claimed that “nothing has changed”, which strikes patients as total BS.
Anna Akopyan
My Free T3 is down to 2.4 from 3.1 and free T4 at 1.0. I have never taken desiccated, just herbal such as Gaia thyroid support but never made a difference. I’m now considering getting on desiccated but afraid of what’s to come especially considering all the Pharma changes. Also, I take seriphos for my adrenals. I recently did an iron transfusion so now my iron is super high…will the super high iron impact the desiccated? My functional medicine doc said it shouldn’t but I have a bad feeling. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!
Janie Bowthorpe
Super high iron from methylation issues actually means low iron, so the low iron can push RT3 up.
Judy
Can anyone tell me how the new NP thyroid taste I had a script filled in June. And they smell the same and still taste sweet. Just wondering do they still have a sweet taste and what kind of smell. Do they have now Thanks
Janie Bowthorpe
Everyone is saying the taste is quite bad, smell is quite bad.
Susie
This change is unacceptable. I have been on Armour for over a year now. I have not been optimal on this medication, although it has been much better than the Synthroid generic I was on after a subtotal thyroidectomy. I once switched to NP by Acella and the swelling in my legs went away and the inflammation in my body was noticeably better, although I had terrible bouts of depression. I now suspect that I was on too low a dosage. I was searching this forum for information on NP Thyroid in hopes of trying it again. Now I’m very reluctant to switch. I suspect either the company had tried to cut corners or there is an effort from the FDA or big pharma to eliminate the rise of NDTs. I think it is questionable how endos an other doctors act like NDTs are terrible meds. They were wonderful meds until the FDA and pharma companies ruined them. Why is the question. What is the gain behind eliminating the high demand for these life changing drugs? It’s certainly not for the well being of suffering thyroid patients.
Anna-Maria Nicolov
I’m so glad to hear that it isn’t just me!! I was feeling 110% on WP in 2017-2018! I had just discovered WP after 14 years on synthroid. And then, in August 2018, WP was not being made temporarily and my doctor put me on Naturthroid, which caused major breathing problems … and going back on WP once it was available caused the same breathing problems, though to a lesser degree. I was on a high dose at 4.5grains WP … in order not to experience broncho spasms, I have had to come down to 1.5 grains. And even at that, I sometimes feel awful and I need to use an inhaler everyday.
Bonnie Medd
I’m SOOO curious about this!! I’ve told at least three different docs that I believe my breathing issues (asthma) is DIRECTLY correlated with my thyroid levels. Every one of them has told me there is absolutely no correlation. I KNOW I only have asthma when my thyroid levels are whacked. But of course, I don’t have eight years of medical school to know my own body, they do? Bah!
Laura
I had asthma for 17 years. At the start I thought it was thyroid and was poo-pooed. Finally found a doctor who diagnosed hypo. Within less than 2 months on armour my asthma disappeared. I too notice tight lungs when my thyroid is wobbling, probably thanks to the changed naturthroid.
LiLi
Dears,
I have been on NatureThroid since 1999
Began with 1 x 32.5 mg and moved up to 4×32.5 mg in the winter, 3x 32.5 mg in the summer, over the years. Now, I am at 2×62.5 mg in the summer.
I moved and the local pharmacy switched me to NP for a similar dose
I went downhill fast on the NP which, yes, does, smell and taste horrible – fatigue was the worst part
I went to another pharmacy and got NatureThroid – and am feeling better now.
Doing tests soon, to see how things are going, as I was feeling tired on the NatureThroid before getting switched to NP.
Wishing You all, all the best,
LiLi
Bonnie Medd
Sigh. This really sucks. I just received my dose of 120mg through CVS Caremark. It indeed is a different pill. I have no thyroid. I did horribly on Synthroid. I NEED this as well as so many people. Why can’t we trust our drugs? Especially our drugs that are supposed to be natural! I’m about to do something a bit extreme and get off the prescription rollercoaster altogether. I ended up in the hospital with Naturthroid after they “didn’t change anything”. I previously had a great experience for years with it.
Janie Bowthorpe
We can always trying raising it and see. But probably a good idea to do the frees with it, then raise, then a few weeks later, then labs again. And anyone can change to synthetic T4 with synthetic T3 until this ridiculous mess is hopefully straightened out.
Carolyn
Hi Janie,
So concerned just like everyone else. This has me holding my breath. I know I cannot function if I do not have thyroid meds that work. I currently take 2 grains NP. I’m unsure how that converts if I were to try synthetic T4 with synthetic T3. How do we figure out the conversion for that?
Janie Bowthorpe
One grain of NDT is equal to 38 mcg of T4 and 9 mcg of T3.
Pat Boatman
Do we stay in the optimal as we age? My Dr is trying to tell me staying optimal is shortening my life
Janie Bowthorpe
Oh good grief about your doc. No, our lives have not been shortened.
Pat Boatman
Time for a new Dr. I’ll be calling around first thing Monday
Martin
Has anyone switched to compounded desiccated thyroid as an alternative? Our compounding pharmacy has been getting calls regarding thyroid manufacturers changing their formulations. Some of them are switching to compounded thyroid because we always have a supply and the dosing is consistent. We don’t have any manufacturing process that needs to be altered and don’t use additives, binders, colorings, etc. What are everyone’s thoughts on compounded thyroid vs. manufactured thyroid?
Thy Roid
That’s my next step.
Susie
Martin, I have not taken a compounded formula, although I have considered it lately. Is the cost normally high to have thyroid meds compounded? I would pay a little more for something that works as long as it’s reasonable. Do you have any stats on how patients do on these compounded meds? I think for many of us, it’s worth looking into.
Martin
Yes, the cost is higher than a commercially available product. Patients generally have responded well. We try to target the exact dosage you were taking with your previous medication as closely as possible based on the information from the manufacturer. Unfortunately no stats are available at this time but there is really no difference in the active ingredient.
Carolyn
I’d like to check this option out. How do we find a good compounding pharmacy?
Janie Bowthorpe
Call around where you live, for one.
Carolyn
Thanks for your answers Janie. I’m going to get my alternate plans in place. will not go down without a FIGHT for my health.
Janie Bowthorpe
Good. That’s the way we all have to be if we want to be well.
Martin
Yes, you can call around in your area. Do a Google search for compounding pharmacies near you. Some pharmacies like ours will ship out-of-state as well. We ship to 26 states but are located in California.
Suzanne
My labs came back bad. My T3 is too high, T4 in basement, TSH back over 3.5. I’ve had some issues focusing, tiredness, hair loss, and all the usual reformulation symptoms. I too have gone from Armour, ERFA, WP, and now NP is bad. I’m not sure what to do. Increased dose did not help.
Deb
This is what happened to me this summer on Naturethroid.
Jen
This is exactly what happened to me! High FT3, low FT4, but low TSH and normal rT3. I take one grain of NP and 56mcg if Cytomel.
I’ve been losing handfuls of hair, my depression has come back, and I can’t seem to get my body temp regulated. I have no idea what to change at this point.
Janie Bowthorpe
Jen and all, a high FT3 can be pooling, which means it’s revealing a cortisol problem. So doing a saliva test is important, we’ve found repeatedly, to see exactly how the cortisol is messed up, thus what to treat: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/saliva-cortisol
The 2nd common cause we’ve seen is being on too much T3, which is worth exploring, too.
Jen
Janie, I was optimal up until July, when I noticed the weird smell in my refill. I have lost about 30 pounds over the last 6 months (intentionally) so I think that might have caused my high FT3, but I can’t explain the drop in FT4.
Thy Roid
Check this out. Been on 30mg NP + 25mg of T3 for months. Doing great. Decided to try to reduce the NP to 15mg and at that point I got a refill of both 30 and 15mg NPs. That’s when the trouble started. Trouble breathing, everything began to hurt. Switched back to 30mg to try to straighten out but then massive heart palps began (so bad they wake me up). Then I read that the NP might be bad. I have gone through this with Armour and Naturethroid before so I’m not unfamiliar with this, but this set of symptoms is totally new to me. In the past reformulations would make me feel hypo, but this… this is different and worse. I don’t know what to do… reduced to 15 again today to try to get rid of the palpitations.
Janie Bowthorpe
You probably need to read this: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Thy Roid
Would NDT sensitivity just appear out of the blue like this? I’ve been on one form or another for years and have done reasonably well (except when drug reformulations or supplies required me to change medication). And I was doing better than ever on NP thyroid until this new batch.
Janie Bowthorpe
Doubt it. It seems strongly related to the changed tablets.
Sondra
Im wondering if there is a Conversion table to go from NDT to synthetic t3 and r4. This if all else fails.
Janie Bowthorpe
One grain NDT is equal to 38 mcg T3 and 9 mcg T4. So using that will help with the conversion.
Pat Boatman
Would my tongue swelling and having ridges been a sign of under dosing? I’m on 2 grains of NP thyroid and 67 yrs old. Thus has been goung in for 3 weeks now
Janie Bowthorpe
It has for some per their reports. But…2 grains is usually underdosing the majority, even if for a minority it may not be. Thus, hypo symptoms will come back. We all have to be optimal, which puts the free T3 at the top part of the range and free T4 midrange. Both. And we have to have good iron and cortisol to get there without problems. So for the time being, we can’t prove that your issues are from the changed tablets…
We are wondering though if those who are underdosed will feel even worse on the changed tablet. i.e. a less effective tablet on top of hypo symptoms from being underdosed.
Get the frees tested!
Katie
This makes perfect sense to me now!! I currently take 120 of NP and have been struggling most of the summer with the return of symptoms! My hair is falling out again and one day I had accidentally left the pill bottle open on the counter and was trying to find the “rotten” smell….I finally realized it was actually coming from the open bottle of NP!! It was SO gross smelling! I hold my breath when I open it now! I also struggled with NatureThroid and couldn’t find it anywhere anymore which is why I asked to switch to NP Thyroid. I think the first bottle was the old one and I felt great but then got a refill and things have tanked!! Ugh!!! I live in the Kansas City area!
Janie Bowthorpe
One thing though….though there can always be exceptions, 2 grains is usually underdosing the majority. Thus, hypo symptoms will come back. We all have to be optimal, which puts the free T3 at the top part of the range and free T4 midrange. Both. And we have to have good iron and cortisol to get there without problems. So for the time being, we can’t prove that your issues are from the changed tablets…
Now we are wondering if those who are underdosed will feel worse on the changed tablet, since if it’s not as effective, it will make an underdosed person even worse…
Get the frees tests!
Alison
This doesn’t help your cause because I was put on a lower dose before getting new nature throid pill (could this be an issue all on it’s own because I see a lot of this) but I, like you said I got my hypo back. I was so excited my levels were going up. I also felt better not on them like I was taking too much. But there are other factors involved in my story. The point is I started feeling very shaky on the new stuff. My doctor thinks I’m reacting to a filler but I don’t usually have allergies besides gluten, never tested just by symptoms. I’m now on armor just started and praying for getting better. My main issue is anxiety but I also have low progesterone and adrenal and possibly estrogen but I’m not sure on the estrogen. Doing labs soon. Any suggestions on what all to test for? My doctor is schooled in the natural thyroid but I’m not sure if he tests enough. I used to see one of the Drs that wrote the stop the thyroid madness book but he followed the medical medium and it got to the point I didn’t feel comfortable with that. But he got me mostly feeling better but whether it was me or him we never addressed adrenal or progesterone.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. Use this page to see if you have an adrenal issue causing that anxiety: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info Not to discount problems people are reporting on the changed NP, but adrenal issues are a very common cause of anxiety, shakiness, etc.
Sara B
I was optimal for the first time in 4 years. I have felt terrible, run down, and tired since my last refill. I fall asleep often. I think I need to go have labs done to see where I stand. I have pictures of the old and new together, if anyone needs them. They are clearly different.
Janie Bowthorpe
Darn it. Your experience does seem to validate what some people are saying about the changed tablets. Please keep us informed. Might want to post the former labs on the former tablets, and the new labs on the changed tablets. That will be huge info!!
Jan
Thank you for this post. All of my reoccurring symptoms make sense now. I have been on Naturethroid, then NP and just recently back to Naturethroid. I noticed the bad smell of NP in the spring. I began to experience low energy, easy weight gain, and joint pain. So, I’m back on Naturethroid, only to learn the formula has changed! I have no idea if my levels are optimal because my doctor only goes by the TSH and my symptoms.
Janie Bowthorpe
Sadly, Naturethroid hasn’t been working well either by the reports of many people the past year. As far as your levels, you will either need a better doctor who will do the right tests, or order your own. There are self-order facilities listed on this page: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/recommended-labwork They email you the paperwork to take to a draw facility.
Sondra
I started my new batch of NP thyroid about three days ago. The taste is disgusting! I can tell I am having hypo symptom starting. My first symptom is dry eyes. I have been optimized for several years. I have been through this nightmare several times, like most people. What do you know about thyro-gold. Could that be a option.
Janie Bowthorpe
Then you are another good example that there just may be something wrong with the new batch of NP. Yes about Thyrogold. People have overall been pleased.
Krista
I’m thankful to be reading this blog! Back in July I did a refill of my NP thyroid. Immediately I noticed a difference in odor and appearance, even worse, within days I noticed a change in hypo symptoms. Absolutely crushed to be dealing with another formula change.
Janie Bowthorpe
To have noticed a worsening in hypo symptoms just days after being on the new batch is a strong concern. We are hoping that raising the new batch will resolve the clear problematic nature of the new batch.
Andrea
I had half my thyroid removed 3 yrs ago due to nodules that tested as “suspicious” (turned out to be benign). Became hypo immediately, despite reassurance from surgeon beforehand that half thyroid could most likely take over and perform as whole thyroid (I believed him…). The battle to become informed, then find the right doc and medicine then began. NDT, and in particular NP Thyroid, is the only thing that’s ever relieved my symptoms. In April, at 90mg (symptoms relieved) I was at TSH .11, FT4 mid range, FT3 above mid range, RT3 mid range. I felt good, and TSH was low, so doc kept it at 90mg until numbers and/or symptoms changed. In July, I tested TSH .13, FT4 bottom range, FT3 lower range (doc forgot to include RT3). Doc told me to add 15mg, but I was confused because I had also tested high for some antibodies that suggested I had or did have some kind of infection, and combined with the fact that I had had a knee surgery that I was having trouble recovering from, I thought all that could have been what threw my numbers off. So, I figured I would take care of myself a little better, and retest in 4-6 weeks to see what happened. I admit that I did not want to add take the extra 15mg unless it was necessary because – despite hearing on websites like STTM that low TSH is okay – every doc I’ve had (functional, holistic, traditional) seems to worry about that, and it did make me nervous. Hearing this about NDT now has my head spinning however, and although I have not noticed a difference in appearance or taste (I swallow them), I am anxious to see what my next results are. I will have labs done next week, and meet with doc when results come back. This is good info to be armed with before all that happens. This doc is a functional doc, happy to prescribe NDT, and usually pretty well informed about current issues around it (NDT). I’ll report back what I find out.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. You may still have the former batch of NP tablets, which is a good thing. i.e. the pharmacy you use is still carrying them before they run out.
donna cason
There is a good chance you needed more than the 15mg.
Robert
Janie, would it be possible for you to get the two versions of the NP Thyroid analyzed for their full contents to actually see if there is a difference? I can see that there is a difference between the pills that I have been taking and those that my wife has been taking, as you have illustrated, even though they are supposed to be the same. And she has not been feeling good. If the cost of doing that would be a problem we would be willing to contribute to a fund to do so. Some kind of an investigation is needed, especially since Medicare reportedly will no longer pay for the NDTs.
Janie Bowthorpe
It’s very expensive to do that. And you have find specialized labs to do it. Hopefully someone can do it.
Donna Cason
Is this only happening with 60, 90, and 120mg? I do have a stash of 30mg AND just had labs done last week so I will know if anything has tanked and could switch to the 30mg for 6 weeks.
Janie Bowthorpe
We don’t know yet if it’s going to be limited to certain strengths or not.
Dedee
I’m new to thyroid meds. diagnosed with Hashimotos and nodules. I actually feel “activity” – odd sensations in my neck at times – along with other symptoms that align with hypothyroidism. I was prescribed 15mg of NP Thyroid by Acella. It does have an odd odor and taste but I know no different — and I wake up to take it early so that I can drink coffee 30 minutes later. I had only taken Levothyroxine for a short time after being diagnosed with Hashimotos before I requested the NP Thyroid thanks to this site and group. I still get afternoon sleepiness – often taking a cat nap right after dinner because I can’t keep my eyes open.
Please steer me to information that explains what my readings need to be so I am considered “optimal.” I have very high Microsomal TPO Antibodies at 495. I can’t even find both T3 and T4 readings on these blood test reports – (I doubt they are measured!) I have had one parathyroid adenoma removed and my calcium remains around 10.5. I don’t understand where I’m supposed to be regarding thyroid readings and how often I should get the blood tests – and exactly which tests – just T3 and T4?
Sorry I’m such a neophyte – I’ve just had doctors that are clueless or deny there’s a problem when I’ve described the symptoms. My current doctor who did give me a rx is being cautious, I believe. I can order my own labs through Sonora Quest. Will you please help guide me? I don’t know what direction to go. Thank you.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. You do know that 15 mcg of NDT is paltry, right? We always start on one grain (60 mg), then we move up by 1/2 grain every two weeks, slowing down in the 2-3 grain area to retest our free T3 and free T4. Yes, afternoon sleepiness is our sure sign of still being hypo.
No apology needed being new to all this. You might want to get the companion books: the 2019 udpated revision of Stop the Thyroid Madness and Hashimoto’s: Taming the Beast. Here’s good info about them: https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/05/30/two-new-books/
Dedee
Paltry – YES, I don’t think it’s doing anything and I feel like my thyroid is disintegrating within me! Very odd sensations and no one seems to understand or perhaps, really care?Some doctors think I’m nuts – they don’t say it, but the way they placate me makes it very clear. From what I’ve read on your site, people feel some improvement when they get the right dose and they reach the “optimal” levels of T3 and T4. I remain hopeful as I work through all of the information. This new development with the NP has me a bit concerned – as it took some convincing to get the NDT rather than Levothyroxine. I don’t want the dr. to say there are too many problems and just try to switch me back to Levo.
I’m ordering STTM and HTTB now. (did I get the acronyms correct? ;)) I’ll start reading and share information with my doctor to convince her I need to take a higher dose and get tested regularly.
I’m grateful for you and the members of this community. Thank you. 🙂
Janie Bowthorpe
Ha. Yes, the STTM book updated revision. And the Hashimoto’s: Taming the Beast book.
Issa
Please also say how you are taking the NP tablet, ie, sublingual, swallow whole, crush. I remember that one problem with Armour was with a new pill making company that had harder ‘packing’ equipment. The new pills were so hard they weren’t dissolving completely as they went through the body. Hence, the hypo experience. Armour was saying, correctly, that they had not changed the formula. It took them awhile to figure out what was wrong because the pills looked and tested the same. The pictures seem to show that one of those pills could be packed harder. These pills are expensive, I will try crushing them to see if they work better if I get any of them. So far mine are the same. BTW I ‘chew’ mine a little to break them up and then let them dissolve under my tongue.
Also, are these problems being reported with all the strengths? I’m hoping it’s a manufacturing problem because I really love my NP!
Janie Bowthorpe
Let us know what chewing the changed tablets does for you after you redo the frees. I know you said you are still currently on the former tablets.
We haven’t figured out yet if the change happened to all the different strengths.
Donna
I think we need to prepare a form letter/petition and disseminate it to our local politicians, demanding that we not be forced to use Synthroid and that they investigate why all these changes and whatever are being made to NDT meds that have been reputable in the past and seem to be being sabotaged.
Dedee
You raise a valid concern, Donna. Big Pharma may not want the NDT on the market competing with their own products. Even a quick scan of internet sites discussing Levothyroxine raises doubts about the efficacy of generics, which plays right into this same suspicion about the influence of Big Pharma on the FDA and policymakers.
https://www.verywellhealth.com/levothyroxine-brand-name-vs-generic-versions-1124055
Janie Bowthorpe
Found this in spam and approved.
housemaid
Donna, I agree it seems like there is some sort of sabotage going on, especially since CVS started refusing to sell natural dessicated thyroid. However, politicians are in the pocket of Big Pharma. They will always look out for those who give them money and not you, the consumer. It is best not to talk to the FDA or politicians about NDT not working or they will be quick to ban it and make everybody take Synthroid.
Andrea no
I have been on ERFA since the last time. Big pharma messed with Armour. It’s currently unavailable. Wonder what’s going on now.
My doctor switched me to Armour which I could not take due to the fillers. New formulation. New company.
I was switched to NP thyroid about three weeks ago. I had to take a larger dose at the end of ERFA and now on NP. This raises questions aftet reading this. I was on the same dose of ETFA for many years. Now larger dose on both meds. Egad!
Leora Hyman
So terrible .I was feeling better on Naturthroid and my hair was better. Then it went south. I’m now on synthetic T3 and T4. Still a process….
Janie Bowthorpe
A process is a good way to describe all this. Yet, even on the two synthetics, we have to get optimal to prevent hypo symptoms from returning. Optimal puts the free T3 towards the top part of the range and the free T4 midrange. Both. And we have to have good cortisol and iron to get there without problems.
Heidi Salerno
I filled 120mg and 30mg and they smell awful. I’m not optimal so I can’t comment on that. But the smell has been causing an aversion to them.
Brittney
I can’t believe this! I’ve felt awful most of my life and just have been optimal and healing my adrenals in the last several months. I hate being reliant on these drug companies. If they are just changing our medication without a care as to how it affects their customers, that is just evil.
janice
Is there any particular pharmacy that still has the old stock or version of NP Thyroid. Is it certain milligrams? My 30 mg taste differnt but my 15 mg. ones taste ok. Anyone else experience the same. Was wondering why I felt so terrible. Thought I was in a flare from my lupus. So damn fatigued again and lots of hairloss.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi Janice. It’s really about local pharmacies. So where one chain might have it where you live, another might not. You’d need to call around.
Make sure your fatigue and hair loss isn’t from being underdosed. We have to separate those who are underdosed from those who are optimal yet still went downhill on the new tablets. Optimal puts the free T3 at the top of the range and free T4 midrange. Both.
AnaG
Wow this is just in time
I too noticed a smell in my last refill oh NP Thyroid abd after morethst 15 years on NDT I decided to switch to synthetic just this week. I was not feeling well, i a mi in a deep fog and my weight is stuck at the top of my range. I feel bloated and uncomfortable.
Not sure if my choice of genetic synthetic is the best but will give it a try for a week or so. My body reacts pretty quickly…
So grateful for your blog
Janie Bowthorpe
Just make SURE you are optimal no matter what you are on. Over the years, we have noticed that hypo symptoms will eventually come back due to not being optimal. In other words, we have to be on a dose that is meeting our daily needs over and over. Non optimal doses eventually backfire. Optimal puts the free T3 towards the top part of the range with a midrange T4–both. And we have to have good iron and cortisol to get there without problems.
Betty
The Doctor told me to reduce my np because I was taking too much. I was on 120 and 15. I still have a bottle of the 120 left and I was sent a new bottle of 120. I just now went and look. You are so right. They have a weak smell to me. I have not taken any since I still have about 75 of the old ones left. I hate this. I was on armour for years and changed to nature throid. I was doing great on it and than they changed it. I went on np about two years ago and felt great and now I may start getting worse again. Why can’t they just leave a good thing alone. Thanks for telling us.
Janie Bowthorpe
If you doctor told you to reduce, he was doing that because of the low TSH. And there is nothing harmful about our low TSH on NDT. It’s about the frees, not the TSH. Thus, this doctor will keep you sick. Read https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/tsh-why-its-useless
Betty
I know, but it is hard to find a Doc in my area that will give me this type of drug. They all want to put me on synthroid. I am going to be changing Doctors in a few months though. I have had too many problems with this one. I do know that him telling me to reduce my meds is right this time. I seem to be more hyper than hypo with this dosage.
Janie Bowthorpe
If you are hyper, find out why. Raising in the presence of an adrenal problem can make you feel hyper. i.e. it’s what the NDT or T3 is revealing. https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me
Joy Rainwater
I don’t know if I ever got to optimal on NP Thyroid. I take a 120 mg dose, when I go to refill my prescription, the pharmacy says it’s on back order. I have been taking 2 60 mg tablets. I did notice more of a smell. I live in Athens, TX
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, it’s very rare to be optimal on only two grains/120 mg.
Jessica
This is so frustrating. Was doing well on 60mg for two years (don’t have recent labs but dose and symptoms haven’t changed) and then got the nasty tasting ones two weeks ago… now exhausted, hair falling out in gobs, stomach issues.
I’m going to call Acella again tomorrow.
Janie Bowthorpe
Good luck. Their response is similar–nothing has changed.
Mary Tartaro
intense itching with no rash over the last 8 weeks..wondering if it’s related to new formulation. anyone else?
Pilan Butts
Janie,
Re 2018 recall
Maybe they are trying to get rid of last years batch at a lower price and pharmacies are selling it.
https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safety-and-availability/fda-alerts-drug-makers-recall-porcine-thyroid-api-sichuan-friendly-pharmaceutical-co-limited-china
Pat Boatman
So what are you suggesting we do if those that aren’t optimal now that has been optimal in the past? The state I’m in has very few options for us. Endocrinologist are clueless. I’ve been to 6 and they go by blood work and tsh. Forget symptoms. Idiots
Pat Boatman
So what are you suggesting we do if those that aren’t optimal now that has been optimal in the past? Mississippi has very little options for us. Endocrinologist are clueless. I’ve been to 6 and they go by blood work and tsh. Forget symptoms. Idiots
Janie Bowthorpe
The next step seems to be to check the frees, then raise if not optimal. And let us know. We can just hope that it’s now far weaker and raising is needed. Sad, though.
Linda Schneider
I switched to compounded Armour after they changed it several years ago and I had been sick for a year and a half. I feel so bad for all of you…I just wonder, it seems to me that lying about the ingredients in something we injest, isnt that against the law? Like say, what if you have allergies to rice and they change and add that as a filler, wouldn’t it be against the law to lie about it? I mean, it could kill someone that was allergic to rice. I wonder if they are using the same ingredients but making the dosage different…? How is this even legal…?
Traci
I concur. Picked up my 90mg NP refill over 2 weeks ago (I take 2 twice a day and have been optimal for 6 months). I gagged when I took the first tablet. Appearance was different and I knew something was off. Left a message for Acella’s Quality Department but never received a response. Trying to decide whether I’m going to have to switch. My hypo symptoms have returned and my hair is falling out. I KNOW they are a different formulation
Jennifer
What are our options if NP is now bad? There’s nothing left to chose from. Do we have to go back to synthetic? This is so horrible.
Janie Bowthorpe
Honestly, things are suspicious, but we have to separate those who were optimal before getting on the changed tablets, and those who weren’t. Those who weren’t optimal will not be strong indications that something is wrong. Because by being underdosed, it always backfires with a return of hypo.
But if someone WAS optimal before starting on the changed tablets, and still report a decline, that is very suspicious. We need to see more.
Pat Boatman
I live in Mississippi . I’m 67. Have had a renal embolism 3 yrs ago and lost a kidney. I see a internal medicine Dr. My free t4 and free t3 are below optimal. And this Dr says he’s trying to help me live longer.ugh. But I haven’t felt that bad inb2 grains of NP a day so just left it at that. But have been feeling symptomatic lately and complaining. He just ordered my sex hormones level . I’ve picked up 10 pounds this yr and can’t seem to loose it no matter what.
I have noticed I feel no different if. Take 3 grains instead of 2. That has surprised me. .now I’m wondering if it’s. A weaker dosage per grain?
Janie Bowthorpe
If you have been underdosed, we can’t blame the changed tablets. It’s normal to feel good at first even when underdosed. But it will eventually cause a return of hypo symptoms if underdosed.
Judy
Yes, I got a refill of 2 grain and 1/2 grain tablets a few days ago. I immediately noticed that the color and smell are different in both bottles. It smells like a completely different product. (I took side-by-side photos of previous and current refills, and I can send those to you, Janie, if you tell me where to send them. In those photos it’s very very obvious that the pills look completely different from each other. The previous refill looks yellowish, whereas the new looks slightly pinkish gray and speckled.) The taste is also different.
So on Monday I called Acella, and the person I spoke with said they hadn’t changed the formula and that there can be differences in color and smell from lot to lot. I was very glad to see you discussing this today, Janie. Where have people been talking about this? FB or Yahoo groups? The Walgreens pharmacist also wasn’t aware of any changes or differences. UGH.
The Walgreens pharmacist also made a comment about the med being from pigs, and the way she said it was rather rude. Other pharamacists have talked to me that way too. They act like ti’s so weird or gross, maybe implying that whoever takes a medication like that must be weird. What choice do we have? It’s a medication we have to take to be alive and functioning normally. For many people, nothing works anywhere near as well as NDT. I think if those people who act like it’s weird were in a similar position, they would take porcine thyroid too, if it’s a choice between being alive and functioning and other alternatives.
Also I’ve changed meds 5 times (synthetic T4/T3, WP, NP, synthetic T3 plus various thyroid nutritional supplements) since Women’s International compounded was recalled almost a year ago. Nothing works for me as well as compounded did, for many years, although NP has worked about the best (in addition to several thyroid nutritional supplements) of anything I’ve tried since the recall. When NP wasn’t working that great for me earlier this year, my dr said, based on symptoms and labs, that maybe I wasn’t converting T4 to T3. So he prescribed T3 in addition to NP, but I quickly had various side effects. So I had to stop taking that. After that I started taking the various nutritional supplements that are helping.
I called Women’s International yesterday to check on status, and they still can’t get raw material and have no idea when they will be able to get it. They also express little compassion or concern. Very sad since compounded had worked great for me since the Naturethroid sudden shortage happened in 2009.
It’s all very discouraging. If NP goes haywire and that stops working for me, I don’t have any other options, since I’ve already tried just about everything else and it hasn’t worked. Or what alternatives do people have, if NP stops working? What’s the latest info on WP? Is that working for people?
By the way, Janie, did you say that toxic mold exposure caused you to have thyroid problems in the first place? If so, how did you figure that out, and was the damage permanent, or is it possible to reverse the damage such as through detoxing and repairing?
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, I did finally realize that my exposure to mold (master bedroom closet would get mold on my shoes constantly) probably caused my hypo. If I had known that then, maybe I could have reversed it. Not sure. Mold is very damaging. And I’ve been on thyroid meds so long now that my thyroid has probably shrunk to nothing.
Judy
I think mold contributed to causing hypo for me too, or maybe it was the only cause. Was living in a moldy place when diagnosed hypo. A dr told me that I have mycotoxins (mold toxins) in my liver and that’s affecting my thyroid. That’s logical, if for example mycotoxins in the liver are affecting the T4 to T3 conversion. I’ve been hearing lately of more and more people who say mold exposure caused them to have hypo. The thyroid is so sensitive to so many things. Yes it seems that if hypo is caught early, it’s easier to reverse it, from what I’ve learned. But it’s still possible to be helped even later too.
Hadassah
Janie this is Very Concerning to all of us on NDT . I was on T4 only and was having so many issues . I started with NatureThroid and it worked great for me till RLC reformulated . Even with all their denials . Who do they think they are fooling ? I switched to NP and it worked well . Janie I know that you mentioned that you dose with NP and that your very happy with it . I now wonder what are your thoughts about NP ? And what is the next NDT that we can trust to feel well with . Unfortunately we are running out of NDT . And the very few that are still around are not reliable .
Janie Bowthorpe
I am still using the former NP. So I personally haven’t experienced a problem. But we need to separate those who were NOT optimal before getting on the changed tablets, from those who WERE optimal before getting on the changed tablets and who saw a return of hypo afterwards. It’s the latter which will be a great concern.
Judy
Janie, everyone who takes NP needs to look at and smell their tablets to see if they’ve noticed a change in the medication. Is there a way to do a survey of people who take NP to be able to really get some definitive info and sort all this out? And ask questions like:
when did you start taking NP thyroid? what was your dosage?
what is your current dosage, and when did you start taking that dosage?
per your labs and symptoms, were you optimal on NP, and if so, when and for how long?
have you noticed a change in the smell, appearance, or taste of NP?
if so, when did you notice a change (what was the date of NP refill)?
have you noticed an increase in hypo symptoms while taking NP, and if so, when, and how did the timing of symptom increase match up with change in appearance, smell, taste of NP?
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, we just may need to get more detailed info.
Hadassah
Janie I’m also still on the old batch myself . But I worry when I run out of it what then ??? What I don’t understand is if so many are on NDT and are doing so well with it why are they playing around with our NDT ??? Where lies the problem ??? And Why ??? I’m sure it’s a Huge Money maker for the companies at our expense . If we stop buying they can all close shop . I’m wondering why would they risk it ??? And who is out to gain from all this ???
Janie Bowthorpe
Your questions are good ones. It’s just crazy about these changes. And the secrecy as to why the changes, and denying changes, is a bit off-putting to our experiences and intelligence.
Deanna
I am also taking NP Thyroid and now feeling extremely tired. What is a better brand to take?
Janie Bowthorpe
Deanna, have you possibly been underdosed? If your free T3 wasn’t at the top part of the range with a midrange free T4, you were underdosed. And being underdosed always backfires with a return of hypo symptoms sooner or later.
Kristine
I’m hoping that they’re just slightly weak, as I’m not feeling horrible on NP. I did notice the change in taste. It’s nasty but I’m able to do sublingual still. I thought my food cravings and weight gain was stress or my lack of control. Now I wonder if it’s something else.
I take a relatively low dose, just 75mg. We’re trying to resolve the inflammation and high rT3. No antibodies. I’ll try increasing a little to see if that brings me back to where I was a few months ago.
Janie Bowthorpe
OK, thank you for saying you are on 75 mg. Practically anyone on just 75 mcg is underdosed, so hypo symptoms will creep up.
Sharen
Yes, sad to say I am experiencing the same thing with regards to being optimal and feeling great. I have been on natural thyroid since thyroid removed in 2001 so I have been through all the changes. Now all symptoms back with labs not optimal at all. It does remind me of the debacle with armour where I became terribly ill until I found out they had changed and then went on Naturethroid. Switched to NP Thyroid when Naturethroid not available. Labs were optimal and I felt great until after I picked up my new RX I began feeling tired again. Digestive issues. Brain fog. Anxiety. Depression. Hair falling out. I said to myself that this seemed like when Armour was changed. I looked on your website and tried to find information if they had changed their formula but found nothing. As I thought my latest labs showed NP certainly not working at all for me. May be for some people. Quite discouraging. I may have to order from Thailand and do my own labs as my holistic doctor will not allow that. You can order without RX. Thanks for the update.
Peggy
Oh my gosh! I’ve been trying to figure out why I’m back to feeling like crap! I had noticed the horrible smell and taste, but never put it all together. This is just shy of devastating. Trying to feel normal has become a full time job!
Janie Bowthorpe
Peggy, were you doing great for a long time before you started on the new tablets? Were you OPTIMAL before starting on the new tablets (free T3 towards the top; free T4 midrange–both)??
Peggy
No, I wasn’t optimal yet, but was getting there, then I could tell something had changed with the smell, taste, and feeling extra fatigued and painful.
Janie Bowthorpe
That’s good enough proof. There was no reason for you to feel extra fatigued and painful upon starting the changed tablets. We are totally convinced they are messed up.
Terrie Radachowsky
I just had to WAIT for Walmart to refill my NDT.
When I received the script, I thought they had given me the wrong prescription.
It smells, tastes wrong and makes my stomach
Yucky. So I goggled to see if there was a reformulation and found nothing.
I have been on the rollercoaster of reformulations for over 12 years now, Armour, Erfa, ….now NDT. Although, i have been optimal for a long time with dedication and monitoring.
I haven’t noticed symptoms yet but now I know that something is up and why.
As for the companies denying the changes, who can even guess. The FDA is understaffed, staffed with campaign workers and a mess.
I now wonder where can I go from here?
What other options are there?
It should be this hard to keep a person’s health .
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, it’s a bit of nightmare to find a product that has been masterfully changing lives, only to see this mess with so many NDTs. The number one question is WHY. And WHAT has been going on. The secrecy is insulting.
Pilan Butts
Im thinking nefarious reasons. There is to much going on and multiple brands involved. Maybe to many people are doing well and big pharma put the squeeze on fda made them change the way its made that would alter its great performance. Levo probably suffering from ndt being so successful. Just a wild guess.
Dee
That’s my wild guess too.
Barb Collins
I got my NP Thyroid refill a week ago, I took it back to the pharmacy because I thought they had given me the wrong med. Nope they told me it was the same as I had been getting. My problem is I am very sensitive to the fillers that they use. I had been taking WP Thyroid and was doing great, then I had to switch to Naturethroid and my levels tanked. I then went to NP Thyroid and was feeling great for the first time this year. I haven’t even taken this new one for a week and I feel terrible. It definitely has been changed. I absolutely cannot do Armour. I guess I will go back to WP Thyroid. Does anybody know if it WP is any good since it has come back?
Marty Gerace
With all these changes just wanted to say that after a year of not being able to get NDT powder (which I had compounded for many years). I was finally able to find it in PA, where they are compounding in one drop olive oil. I am hoping this will help. Have been on synthetic compounded, doubled my dose and my TSH came back 69.7. Not good. Bad indigestion, back pain, exhausted, awake at 4am, anxious, depressed. Hope this works. Fearful it may disappear again if it does work.
Nicole
So that explains everything. I gained all of the weight back from when I first lost it after being treated in the first place. And my antibodies are the highest they have been since initial diagnosis even with NDT, which usually keeps things in check. I also had dialed back the dose with my provider because we are doing root cause digging, but I feel dreadful. Now I know why. I had even switched back from Armour because I felt so good on NP last time.
Yvonne
Yes, meeeee tooooo! I do not have a thyroid but I was optimal on NP Thyroid until my last prescription of 90mg (2 per day). When I went for labs last week my free T3 was bottomed out and my T4(total) and free T4 were also at the way bottom of normal range, yet my TSH is suppressed (whatever!). I was VERY confused but it all makes sense now…hair falling out, feeling confused/loopy, feeling extra tired. My doctor is switching me to branded Synthroid and Cytomel. I hope I feel better — is there any brand of NDT that is still good?
Jill
I was on NP and doing ok this year. Approximately 2 months ago I felt strangely tired & odd, & the last rx from Walgreens smelled absolutely rancid… really gross and alarming. ( Despite it being a pork product, the smell was NOT normal). I got my dr to switch me to Nature-throid, because I *thought* Nature-thyroid was more reliable (?!), and because my other dr wanted me to have narcolepsy testing…. because I am beyond sleepy. I realize, of course, that is likely a thyroid issue. So, anyway, I’m unable to function. My local dr has no real knowledge of thyroid issues..he still does TSH testing, sheesh. My brainfog is glaringly obvious and I feel stuck..have put on at least 15 lb overall, am lethargic, hair thinning, puffy face…feel just awful! If it hadn’t been for the email I received from here, I would still be in self-blame mode, wondering if I had some sort of virus! I am not sure what to do now. Is Naturethroid useless, too, now? I order mine from a pharmacy in California… it wasn’t easy to find. Thank you for this information, I really appreciate it. But I really don’t know what to do next. Thanks!
Janie Bowthorpe
Synthetic T4 with synthetic T3 if raising doesn’t help. Raising is always an optimal to see what happens while watching the free T3 and free T4.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, there have been many many reports that Naturethroid went south, too. And like the other pharms, they deny changing anything.
Patients on the changed NP can always try raising and see what happens, watching the frees. Otherwise, synthetic T4 with synthetic T3.
Dawn Volz
Janie I spoke to someone regarding Naturethroid when things changed. They told me that due to cost they switched to a different supplier of desiccated product. I told them many were finding it inferior. I was told recently that it is now impossible to find in pharmacy. I wonder if they will go back to old supplier? They said the product had become very costly that is reason for the change in supplier.
Janie Bowthorpe
i.e. the cost of the good supply would have lowered their profit. Sad, because if they had stuck with a known good supply and thus product, patients wouldn’t have left them behind in the dust…which has surely lowered their profit anyway.
Bonnie Rasmussen
Hello I live in Houston Texas!I just picked up my NP thyroid Monday and it looks and smells exactly the same as it always has. I switched to NP thyroid about a year ago after Nature throid went south. Where are y’all getting these pills from??? What’s your location and/or which pharmacies are these bad pills coming from? I got my labs done on July 5th and they were the best I’ve ever had. TSH 1.04, t4 3.3 t3 uptake percentage 35% and free thyroxine 1.2. I hope this is just a bad batch of NP circulating and not a permanent change. I just can’t go through that again.
Bonnie Rasmussen
🤦â€â™€ï¸Oh no I spoke too soon. I picked up my new np dose Monday and my 120mg look the same but my 60mg are totally different, smell, taste even the way they dissolve under my tongue is different (I take 180mg a day, my job is extremely active). I have been having some stomachs issues over the past couple days. I just feel gassy, bloated. My stomachs is very sensitive I do not eat grains, gluten, dairy, soy, eggs or nuts because I can not tolerate them so I have been confused by my stomachs pain because my diet is exactly the same as it has been. What we do now? Am I just supposed to wait until I’m hypo???? What are my options??? How do I get get a compounded medication? Do I need to ask my endo for a different script?? Is compounded more consistent???
Janie Bowthorpe
If raising doesn’t help and watching the frees, synthetic T4 with synthetic T3.
Janie Bowthorpe
We hope so too that it’s a bad batch circulating around. This is nuts.
Alex
Janie, would be this not useful if everyone who feels bad on new“ NP would post here the batch number? I wrote already last year, that one bottle of NP stinks and has a bad taste… Since then taking NP I was getting so bad so that I thought I will die. However I was for many years so happy with NP. I was on 3,5 grain. First I thought I am underdosed so I increased and increased my dose. I felt more and more worser… really seriously ill….What happens to all NDT? What should we do now?
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. Yes, maybe they will see this and post the batch number. I can add it to the post.
So far, we don’t know yet if the changed NP tablets won’t work if we raise. So some could do labs while on it, then try raising, then do labs again after a few weeks, then report back.
Pat Boatman
I live in Mississippi and use Kroger. Think I’m going to call around to see where a few other pharmacies order from. Will switch if they get from a different company
donna cason
Talk was going on about this for several months now…correct? Do we have an approximate time that this started or is that hard to figure out. I have 60mg and just picked up more…the smell is no worse than normal to me (and I have had some nasty smelling NDT….which I still took). The appearance is normal and not ragged. I am optimized now but I am tired but that could be because I don’t sleep well (3am wake ups). But maybe it is from the NP? What to try next?
Janie Bowthorpe
Comments were trickling in around early summer, but nothing like they are now.
You may have picked up the former stock of 60 mg NP. Yes, your feeling tired could because of waking up, and waking up could be because of adrenals.
Donna Cason
But I am on HC and have been for 11 months so that should not be…just started weaning.
Janie Bowthorpe
Probably not a good idea to wean if on the changed tablets, since the latter have been causing a return of hypo symptoms in those who were optimal before they got on the changed tablet.
Liz
I almost posted the other day asking if I’m the only one that’s noticed a change since I received my last refill. I take 4 60 mg tabs a day, no thyroid, treated iron and adrenals and finally was doing good and steadily weight was coming off. I have been taking my last refill for about a month now, and when I first opened it noticed the horrid smell, tasted different too. Anyway, the last couple of weeks I’ve felt really fatigued, low energy, hungry all the time, weight creeping back up and bloated. I use express scripts pharmacy to fill my meds. My 11 year old son also takes NP 60mg plus 30mg tabs daily (completely underdosed and still terribly hypo but that’s another story). His refill was delivered today so will see what it’s like when we open it.
Janie Bowthorpe
Now YOU are what we need to hear about. You seemed to have been quite optimal, yet on the changed tablets, bam…you have gone downhill. That seems to be a strong indication that something is quite wrong with the changed NP tablets being wonky. May I add your paragraph to the blog post??
Liz
Yes, you are welcome to post my comment.
Janie Bowthorpe
I just put it in the blog post with a blue background. Thank u.
Peter Goodwin
Sounds very much like a class action suit in the making.
Jeni
I noticed they smelled and looked different – so much so that I double checked the rx description on the bottle. The taste was unbearable. I’ve been taking sublinguilly for years and suddenly must swallow them whole. The last two weeks (since I refilled my rx of 60mg pills), I have been going downhill with many symptoms returning. I have been fine for 2 years on this dose, so it seems odd that I tanked so fast.
Janie Bowthorpe
And you are a strong example of how bad this is since you have been well for 2 years on the former tablets….
Amber McCullough
I can not believe that we are once again dealing with this issue. Changed from naturethroid to NP and was ecstatic in the beginning. In the last month, with my new script I have been feeling that tired to the core feeling again. My hair has been falling out as well. My daughter who is also on 2 grains is constantly napping. It never dawned on me that they could have reformulated, but definitely seems so. I also have been extremely brain fogged too. I pray we find a thyroid med that doesn’t change and can give us our lives back.
Janie Bowthorpe
FYI: 2 grains may be underdosing your daughter. It has for the majority. She needs to check her free’s. Optimal posts the free T3 towards the top part of the range and free T4 midrange. Both.
Rose Helia
I have been taking Naturthroid for years now. Since the Erfa product went bad. I wish I had never switched myself to NDT. I was find on levothyroxine. I only switched because I lived with a woman who subscribe to newsletters from Dr Whittaker. He insisted that NDT was better. So I switched for NO REASON. I was NOT having problems. Now, I cannot go back. And NDT is a regular headache. When Naturthroid became unavailable, I thought I was going to get it from a Walmart pharmacy when Walgreens couldn’t get it. Turned out what I had gotten was Armor, even though they CALLED it Naturthroid. It cost me 15 lbs. and some serious mood swings before I realized I was NOT taking Naturthroid. I called my endo and she told me I needed to order Naturthroid through mail order. That has helped. But it is 4 times more expensive this way. Sometime, I might try a slow switch back to levothyroxine. It worked before. And it just seems like a matter of time before Naturthroid gets messed up. You say it is already messed up. But I did not notice it failing on me… ????
Janie Bowthorpe
Honestly, Rose, most people on Levo, even those who think they are doing well, either aren’t and don’t recognize the symptoms of a poor treatment, or see a decline sooner or later. There is simply too much that can cause problems with T4 converting to T3. We need direct T3.
Roberta
I recently changed from Armour to NP thyroid. Feeling horrible, all symptoms back, gained 5kg in just one month. That explains everything!!!!!
Gala
I was thinking of switching from armour because I feel hypo I’ve taken amour for 9 yrs 180mgs but I hear so many bad things about all of the ndt from time to time scary because we depend on NDT to feel normal where to turn now..??
Nicole
15 lbs in 3 months. It’s dreadful. And my antibodies are through the roof… even on NDT. Ugh!!!!!
Janie Bowthorpe
Were you optimal all this time on NP? Optimal puts the free T3 towards the top part of the range and free T4 midrange. Both. We need to separate those who weren’t optimal (which causes a return of hypo) with those who were optimal (and are seeing problems).
Kari
My NP was increased to 90 in April, I felt amazing within 10 days! My last rx I picked up on 8-5-19 I noticed a color changed and have been exhausted the last 10-14 days. I cannot get enough sleep, achy, and depressed feeling.
Janie Bowthorpe
There is a possibility that you are simply experiencing the effects of being underdosed. Underdosing always backfires. Most of us when optimal are far higher than 90 mg. The way to get optimal is test the free’s we have found. Optimal puts the free T3 towards the top of the range and free T4 midrange. Both.
Now my above comment doesn’t take away that others are seeing problems that weren’t there before!! So you may have a double whammy.
Kari
7-30-19 labs
Free T4 .98 w/ range of .70-1.48
Free T3 3.49 w/ range of 1.71-3.71
This is when I felt great. Will try to get labs in the next couple days to see where they are now.
Janie Bowthorpe
Yes, we will always feel great before we get optimal. But it eventually backfires. Your FT4 is lower than it would be when optimal, implying you were underdosed and it was converting like mad to the free T3 you did have. Will be curious where you are today.
Virginia
Erfa Thyroid has changed as well. Used to be yellow, beige colour and tasteless. This month I started feeling terrible again (hypo) and then noticed the tasted was super sweet. I take capsules as my medication is compounded. I pulled the capsules apart and low and behold the powder is no longer yellow beige, it is bright fuschia pink!! Been dealing with this nonsense for 10 years +.
Janie Bowthorpe
Wow, that’s odd.
Dee
Been dealing with it since about 2014 or 15 when ERFA took a nose dive too.
Sandy Budzik
Thought my latest batch looked different but smell and taste seemed right. Mine say AP and 331 not 330 which would tell me something is a bit different!! Am not optimal so hard to say if is effecting me but have really been needing a nap almost every day and I am not a napper. Where do we go from here–what other options do we have????
Janie Bowthorpe
So the naps have occurred since you got on the changed tablets?
I’m just hoping like heck they are simply weaker and we can raise and get the same previous effect.
Janie Bowthorpe
I would personally try raising and see what happens. Watch labs.
Martha Stalcup
The tablet with AP 331 imprint is 90mg, while the tab with AP 330 is 60mg – so there’s that difference!
Dee
I was doing great on old ERFA but when they changed it to new ERFA that was one of my symptoms. I would take one and basically just want to go to bed and pass out almost. Just one of the symptoms!
Kate
After being undertreated because of the new Naturethroid, I switched to NP and began feeling much better. Then I got a stinky batch of NP 120 at the end of May, and assumed it was stinky pigs or summer heat during shipping and didnt even worry about it. In July, I started feeling quite drained and had anxiety issues which I attributed to summer heat and busyness. Just had labs drawn and I am low on everything except TSH. Very frustrated.
Janie Bowthorpe
Oh gosh. That sure does seem to point to the changed NP. Ugh.
Deb Quinn
Maybe big pharma has something to do with it. Nothing surprises me anymore.
Janie Bowthorpe
Well, “big pharma” just means all the pharmaceuticals collectively. And it doesn’t fit that they would shoot themselves in the foot by ruining a product that makes them money. But the FDA is a whole other ballgame here that may be the problem. But who knows. The most frustrating aspect of all this is that we are treated like children who should never, ever know the truth as to what is going on. It’s condescending and irritating.
Laura Beckwith
Not sure what to do, my ND changed my dosage from 60mg of NP Thyroid to 30mg of NP, 5mcg of liothyronine, I have been taking since the Labor day weekend, besides the already known changes, I chew my NP thyroid, and it’s foul tasting, and I feel like gagging. I think my stomach slightly feels a bit different after taking it as well. The taste/aftertaste stays in my mouth so pewtred.
Janie Bowthorpe
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/2019/09/04/part-2-lot-numbers-or-expiration-dates/
Nadine
I’ve had a stiff neck for 3 weeks but I thought it was because of a massage I got. The last time this happened was in 2015 with WP. I hope this is just a bad batch of 120mg NP. UGH!
Janie Bowthorpe
Ugh is right, expecially when Acella is saying they made no change. So frustrating.
Nancy
They may not have made a change but perhaps the ingredients from companies they use changed….they need to investigate that…pronto…anyone call and ask them that
question?
Janie Bowthorpe
They completely deny any changes….as did Erfa, as did RLC.
Patricia Brannon
I picked up my recent refills & started the new 60mg on 7/27. Within 3-4 days I felt horrible & for that week I was like WTH happened? Then I remembered my new script & how this is exactly how I felt when WP, ERFA & Armour changed their formula or manufacturing process even though they all denied any changes. I was taking 75mg (60mg & 15mg). I was actually feeling really good for the 1st time in a long time as I was also supplementing my 75mg a day with 25mg of a non prescription NDT & taking my vitamins on a regular basis. 2 steps forward 10 steps backwards. NP Was the last holdout for the changes the USP has been making to the way porcine desiccated Thyroid is processed. I have always said this goes way back to 2009 when there was a huge swine flu outbreak & I personally believe the USP/FDA decided to step in on NDT’s which were grandfathered into the Pharmacological system since the early 1900’s.
Janie Bowthorpe
Hi. Do you know something I don’t? i.e. this: “…changes the USP has been making to the way porcine desiccated Thyroid is processed.” Have you read that somewhere?
Patricia Brannon
Janie, Yes back in 2017 when RLC Labs went short on WP & Natur-Throid I did a ton of research & found some interesting info on the UPS’s website. I will have to search again, as I don’t remember exactly what it was 2 years later & having issues with severe brain fog with NP right now! I don’t know if you noticed all the prescribing info documents like the one found on NP Thyroids website say “(Thyroid Tablets, USP)” which was not there before, if I remember correctly. Unfortunately I don’t have an older copy of the prescribing info page to compare it to.
Ok so if you look back at your page on “Thyroid Medications (NDT, T3, etc)” ingredients it shows 4 inactive ingredients. If you look at the new prescribing info sheet from Acellas website there are now only 3, with Maltodextrin removed. Steve from Acella specifically told me in a phone conversation last week that he was not aware of any formula changes. Ya, right!
Angie F.
Here’s my experience with my last refill (I have a new refill that I have yet to pick up). Felt hyPER for a month or so with a higher T3, and a bit lower T4 on a lowered dose. Could have been temporarily pooling due to life stress..did not notice any change in taste, smell or tablet consistency or texture. Both batches say AP on one side and 327 on the other (15 mg football shaped tablets) However had noticed toward the END of the fill, my usual suspect list of hyPO symptoms. Very low HR, constipation, edema, very tired in evening, hard to wake up, a frozen shoulder episode and more. Also some itchy eczema. Will report again on new batch after I pick it up.
Michelle
I was in the process of switching from T3 only to NP. I felt great as I took the 30mg pills. No smell, no taste and I was feeling so much better than on T3 alone. My dose got high enough to switch to the 60 mg pills and I instantly noticed a difference in smell and taste. So much so I couldn’t put the pill under my tongue so I am swallowing the CR dose on an empty stomach. I have started feeling all of my symptoms come back again. I have gained weight, my pin has increased greatly, the tiredness has returned and the brain fog is much worse. I thought maybe it was just me until I started seeing other people ask about it. I was definitely not at my optimal dose yet but was continuing to raise without any weird effects.
Janie Bowthorpe
Shoot. This is so tragic.
Erica
My 120 pills smell so bad. I have felt worse and symptoms are back again.
Janie Bowthorpe
Really sorry to read that. It’s just too bad that a GOOD NDT may have also gone south. Sure hoping that by raising these changed tablets, patients get better.
Kara
My last three prescriptions have had a strong odor. I take the 60mg tablets. The past few weeks, I have been feeling drained. Coincidence? Ugh
Janie Bowthorpe
Ugh is right!! Dang.
Colette
This is in response to someone wanting to order from Thailand. I’ve been receiving desiccated thyroid for the last six of years that way. However United States Postal Service has put a stop to shipping parcels. Early July/late June those of us ordering that way were informed about this interference and the likelihood it would be a long time before it could resume. And only then a product called Thiroyd. Also the pharmaceutical company that made thyroid-S has stopped producing. And TR made by T-Man
pharmaceutical stopped producing. I’ve found a Dr who uses a compounding pharmacy, although her services are expensive. we’ll see how that goes.
Robert Thompson Thompson
The problem is not just the medicine or in this case, the hormone. It is a lack of understanding of the proper diagnosis and treatment of Hypothyroidism that rampantly persists.
My lecture on “Hypothyroidism Types 1-6” is available from Ozone Masters Conference 2/2019. Chapter 5 of “The Calcium Lie 2” discusses the diagnosis and treatment of Types 1-5, my book lecture U-tube or Calciumlie.com, click on book lecture, wherein this lecture, I discuss Type 6 Hypothyroidism, also.
These six types of Hypothyroidism are measurable, reproducible, and observable forms of the Hypothyroid illness. Each of the six types has similar consequences, symptoms, and pathologies associated with the failure to make a correct diagnosis and from the continued belief in incorrect treatment based on unreliable TSH levels. These six types of hypothyroidism are going completely unrecognized due to the inability of practitioners to recognize the basic symptoms of hypothyroidism and due to a false reliance on the TSH blood test that has been proven unreliable in over 13 scientific studies and counting.
I repeat, “The TSH test is completely unreliable for the diagnosis or management of hypothyroidism. The test may only be useful if abnormal in a patient not currently on any therapy.”
In other words, a “normal” TSH test below 2.0 is unreliable. In patients with a TSH test level above 2.0, 30% will have Thyroid Autoimmune disease (not a normal finding) beginning or present and contributing in most cases to clinical Hypothyroidism, Type 3. Below a TSH level of 0.4 in a patient not on therapy, there is cause for further studies due to the possibility of hyperthyroidism.
Being told that a patient has “iatrogenic” hyperthyroidism due to TSH levels below 0.4 on thyroid therapy is also “unreliable” and incorrect science in most cases. Published studies have shown no side effects and healthy hormone levels in over 80% of patients with suppressed unreliable TSH levels in on correct therapy based on blood levels and ratios. There should be shame on those who rely on a TSH test. Shameful ignorance!
Blood testing must be done in the AM before the medication is taken. This AM blood sample will more accurately reflect the levels of the thyroid hormone coming out of the cells where it works to upregulate Mitochondrial energy production. The Total T3 and Reverse T3 levels and their ratio are all that is needed after the initial TSH study for follow up along with the Basal Body Temperatures and antibody levels when indicated. The Free T3 test is required in pregnancy along with the Reverse T3. The Free T3 is over 200% more expensive than the Total T3 and often confuses the issue, except in pregnancy.
New standards of care in the treatment of Hypothyroidism must be adopted for progress in human health care to be possible. The benefits of T3 Thyroid hormone to overall health cannot be overstated. The continued ignorance and practice of status quo by physicians responsible for these decisions must no longer be accepted. There is too much at risk for the current poor level of care to continue.
By merely relying on the status quo when medical information is exploding is not OK. Ignoring existing published research is also inexcusable. We must find a way to apply published clinical data that is reliable based on excellent standards of care that do not exist in the current medical arena due to opposition to change, adoption of the status quo, and most of all due to drug mentality paralysis of thinking and chosen or willful ignorance.
I don’t want the guy flying my airplane, arriving at the wrong destination over 90% of the time.
Current medical care misses the diagnosis of over 90% of all Hypothyroidism. This condition is now PANDEMIC mostly due to failure to do proper testing and the failure to recognize or properly test for intracellular Calcium excess and severe intracellular potassium deficiency, i.e., the cause of Type 2 Hypothyroidism (or Thyroid hormone resistance, the most common form of the illness, as is accurately described in Chapter 5 of “The Calcium Lie 2.”)
The benefit of T3 is 192x better than a Statin Drug in preventing heart disease. There are so many more statistics about the benefit of T3 thyroid hormone to our health that it is difficult to understand the level of ignorance that is needed to persist in using the current inadequate therapies.
The total lack of awareness of the goodness of T3 containing Thyroid replacement is extraordinary, considering currently published knowledge.
The reality is that we should consider T3 and NDT medication containing T3 a “vitamin.” After all, we call D a vitamin, and it is a hormone.
I will not belabor the foundation of the next book after “The Vitamin C Lie,” expected 2020 copyright.
Not only, Copper, but T3 and C molecules are also needed and many other minerals and cofactors are needed, many of which are found in the C molecule.
Blessings,
Dr. Robert Thompson,
Co-Author, The Calcium Lie 2, etc.
Amanda
Dr. Thompson,
I was wondering if you could share citation information regarding the 13 studies you refer to. I have a good understanding of what you have described thanks to my doctor, and yet would like to be more knowledgeable about the research when discussing this with others, as knowing some of this has allowed me to help other people, but knowing more on the research side would help me do so better.
Thank you,
Amanda